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Smurrf

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg345950#msg345950
« Reply #48 on: June 04, 2011, 05:05:48 pm »

Offline agentflare

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg346381#msg346381
« Reply #49 on: June 05, 2011, 01:17:18 pm »
I wanna see what you guys think about: Flare|Firework (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27209.0.html)
Is this a submission?

Yes.

Offline Essence

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg346780#msg346780
« Reply #50 on: June 06, 2011, 02:30:31 pm »
If something happens and you think it deserves my attention, feel free to PM me. Other than that, I'm probably here if you want to shoot the breeze.

Offline ddevans96

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg347166#msg347166
« Reply #51 on: June 07, 2011, 01:10:33 am »
Suibmitting Wheel of Fate | Roulette of Destiny (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27271.0.html).
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Offline The_Mormegil

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg347886#msg347886
« Reply #52 on: June 08, 2011, 11:37:15 am »
Last submission: Gift of Thetis | Gift of Oceanus (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27336.new.html#new)
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Offline OldTreesTopic starter

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg349370#msg349370
« Reply #53 on: June 11, 2011, 02:39:21 am »
Time is up. Current submissions will be voted on in the Idea Factory Project thread.
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Offline artimies7

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg352084#msg352084
« Reply #54 on: June 16, 2011, 02:42:06 am »
Swarm | Swarm (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27640.new.html#new)
Basic Life card that I thought of while spamming Cockatrices with Mitosis.


Edit: Dang, too late. Crud!
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Offline OldTreesTopic starter

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg353082#msg353082
« Reply #55 on: June 18, 2011, 07:41:52 am »
Round 2 contestants
(Element) Amulet | (Element) Talisman (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,14304)
Lotus | Lotus (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,26904)
[Element] Pool | [Element] Font (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,25253)
Invigor | Invigorate (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,26918)
Quantum Locket | Quantum Locket (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,25665)
Primal Quantum | Primal Quantum (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,26935)
Refractor | Refractor (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27139)
Jewel | Jewel (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27009)
Magpie | Magpie (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27216)
Gift of Thetis | Gift of Oceanus (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27336)

Each contestant needs to answer the following question as we research and score the cards.

Immolation enabled a completely new genre(Immorush, Immobow) of deck type to form.
What currently nonviable or impossible genre would your card enable?
Describe how it does so and critique the impact of that genre on ETG.
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
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Offline The_Mormegil

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg353102#msg353102
« Reply #56 on: June 18, 2011, 08:28:12 am »
[Element] Pool | [Element] Font:
This quantum generator would represent an increase of stall type decks, as it has a huge advantage as time goes on. It also helps a lot against denial decks. Its impact on the game would be to increase exponentially bolt stall type decks, unfortunately, but ultimately increase the effectiveness of every stall deck, as quanta management on the long run would be a true advantage. Fractal decks would be rampant, and I believe we could see some weird novadecks and immodecks using these cards to get out expensive cards faster, especially in War. The one thing I regret is bolt stalls, but I tried to offer a mechanic that grants a quantum advantage to stalls, and I believe I managed to do that.

Gift of Thetis | Gift of Oceanus:
It is a SNova / Immo type of quantum generator that greatly enhances monowater rush and allows for some good rushy duos. I expect this to allow the same variety of decks nova and immolation granted. The mark quanta part means you can reliably use only mark and this in an almost "mono water" deck to power cheap off-element cards (Adrenacrawlers, for instance, or ThunderFlayer Control). The monowater capacities are debatably a good thing, as increase rush type decks was never my intended goal, but I believe the cost / benefit ratio hardly puts Monowater Rush on par with SNova and Immo rushes. Immorush would still be the best for pure ttw, while monowater rush would be far more reliable thanks to greater hp creatures and SNova would be more versatile (and still faster I think) thanks to different cards from different elements.
EDIT: oh, almost forgot... this makes Trident a valuable weapon, doesn't it?
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Offline ZephyrPhantom

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg353214#msg353214
« Reply #57 on: June 18, 2011, 04:13:57 pm »
Quantum Locket | Quantum Locket (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,25665)

With Quantum Locket, I intend to see an increase in viable trio and quartert decks, as it is a simple card that performs the role of 'quantum fixing', which allows you to control the quantum you gain to play cards (useful in multi-element decks since they currently have to rely on an unwieldly combination of pillars and pendulums, which makes it more difficult to get the quantum desired.)

Enhanced decktypes-
Trios and Quartets - Quantum fixing allows much more control over deck, and encourages many varieties of such decks due to the increased flexibility of Quantum Lockets being added in.

New X-element Rainbows - While not as effective, quantum lockets can be switched to a certain element you prefer rather than adding in quantum pillars, so we may see the rise of different kinds of element rainbows (For example, a  :gravity rainbow deck that focuses on boosting creatures like Forest Spirit and Lycanthropies with the quantum provides by Nova, and then using Acceleration to speed up damage for the opponent.).

Favored deck genres-
Control - Switching between quantum pools needed to play the necessary cards to lockdown the opponent.

Stall - If you already have pillars handling one of your quantum requirements (say 3 time towers to power your Eternity), you can switch the the lockets you have in play to power your other elements (e.g. switch Lockets to :light to play Sanctuaries faster).

Sample Deck :
Code: [Select]
778 778 778 778 778 77f 77f 77g 77g 77g 77g 77g 77g 7q0 7q0 7q0 7q0 7q0 7q0 7q0 7q0 7q0 7qc 7qc 7qc 7qc qqq qqq qqq qqq
(The code qqq represents a Quantum Locket.)

The strategy here is variable - you would want to have your lockets focus on either :earth or :time early on depending on whether you got more Graboids or Pharoahs in your opening hand. After you swarm the fields with Scarabs and play a Pulverizer, you can switch the lockets to :gravity to get a source of PC and CC which would normally be inaccessible in this duo or you would have to carefully splash Gravity Towers/Pendulums in without disrupting the deck balance.

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg353233#msg353233
« Reply #58 on: June 18, 2011, 04:40:08 pm »
Magpie | Magpie (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,27216)

Currently, there exists no way to get rid of unneeded cards in your hand.  Nightmare, of course, can be an extreme measure of this, but decks designed to either attack or defend on multiple fronts can bog down.  If the deck they're facing isn't cooperating, such as by not having any creatures out in a deck with AMs or Rains of Fire, then you can be faced with having a hand full of garbage.  Why should you just wait until you can discard them normally when you can trash what you don't need and get something out of the deal?

As far as actual implementation, I don't see this so much in smaller decks.  I do, however, see it used in large rainbow decks, either with the normal Time trio of Sundial, Precog and E.Hourglass, or more offensively with multiple Mindgates.  Draw to your heart's content, dump what you don't need, and use it to fuel the cards you draw that you can use.  I could also see people putting, say, multiple Miracles or other similar high-cost cards in their deck along with this, to make them all a somewhat more versatile version of (and stack with) Nova/Supernova. 

How would decks like these change EtG? If nothing else, they'd be introduce a new form of quickness to larger decks, which is somewhat missing.  30 card decks are fine and all, but if you want to attack or counter multiple threats, you need a bigger deck.  Who wouldn't want to play more cards if they could?

Offline coinich

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Re: Quantum Generators Challenge [Hosted by the Idea Factory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=26873.msg353260#msg353260
« Reply #59 on: June 18, 2011, 05:09:44 pm »
(Element) Amulet|(Element) Talisman (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,14304.0.html)

"Immolation enabled a completely new genre(Immorush, Immobow) of deck type to form.
What currently nonviable or impossible genre would your card enable?
Describe how it does so and critique the impact of that genre on ETG."

My Amulet and Talisman series were never developed with the idea of actually creating entire new genres of decks; they aren't nearly as revolutionary as Immolation in that regard.  Amulets and Talismans were developed to stabilize and diversify the mono, duo, and trio range of decks, which I've always felt were largely weaker in today's metagame.  Decks within this range often attempt to utilize combinations that rainbows don't often attempt, such as Dive/Blessing combinations, or Momentum and Dune Scorpion decks.  These combinations, depending on the individual cards are often difficult to setup in time and even worse to balance quanta and card-wise.

I designed the Amulets and Talismans to take advantage of this fact.  For example, I'd like to point out my Nightstalker v3 deck below:
Hover over cards for details, click for permalink
Deck import code : [Select]
5uq 5uq 710 710 710 710 710 713 713 713 713 713 713 715 715 71e 71e 71e 71e 71e 71e 72i 72i 72i 72i 72i 7t9 7t9 7ta 7ta 7tb 7tb 8pt


I have to resort to using Pendulums to pull of my lopsided quanta combination.  Talismans would work effectively here, allowing me to get enough quanta to easily play a Nightfall or Eclipse and the Vampire Dagger.  In place of the Pendulums, I could place some Talismans and some Bone Towers, allowing me to streamline my :death quanta while not sacrificing :darkness quanta.  It optimizes my duo deck nicely.

Other duo style decks it could influence would be a Steam Machine deck.  5x Steam Machine, 6x Amulet, 3x Ice Shield, 4x Freeze, 12x Water Pillar, and a Water Mark could make for a mean deck as well.

Amulets and Talismans would also allow for more flexible trios by freeing the third element from operating off of the mark.  In my experience, I've found that Pendulums aligned with the mark produce more quanta of that mark.  Using a third element off of the mark makes Pendulums largely useless and the other combinations clunkier.  Amulets and Talismans would allow the 3rd element to be used at need, freeing the mark for Pendulum and Pillar use by the other primary and secondary elements.

Lastly, Mono decks would be assisted by this as well.  An Overdrive/Massive Dragon deck could stand to benefit with its expensive cards.  An Elite Otyugh would be put into play faster with a combination of Towers and Talismans, permitting a creature lock earlier.  Mono decks can gain some needed speed, especially against decks like vNG or Grabbix which feature Immolation as a method of nearly outspeeding every other deck in today's metagame.

One of my biggest fears with these cards however is boosting the rush deck too much, which is why Amulets and Talismans are currently limited 6 to a deck, as well as having a timer mechanic on them.  This is to ensure that any rush deck that uses them cannot rely on these cards for their sole quanta production; a single Discord or other disruption would harm them more.  That being said, the timer, and even the amount of quanta produced are not set in stone, especially with concerns to balance.

If there were radical new archetypes to be built however, I suspect they would be in the quad deck range, or perhaps in decks that rely on abilities with limited activations.

EDIT:  I thought of an entirely new deck archetype with this.  Platinum Talismans, Leaf Dragons, Mitosis, and Jade Dragons.  It would empower an entire new dragon rush type deck while at the same time giving a strong boost to other pump decks such as Firestalls and Siphon decks.

 

anything
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