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Offline WerdbootyTopic starter

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Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg271943#msg271943
« on: February 16, 2011, 05:40:57 pm »
*card updated 02/17/11

NAME:
Paper Crane
ELEMENT:
Entropy
COST:
1 :entropy
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
1|1
TEXT:
Paper Crane's HP is always 1.
NAME:
Noshi Crane
ELEMENT:
Entropy
COST:
1 :entropy
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
1|1
TEXT:
Paper Crane's HP is always 1.
Each turn :entropy is generated.
ART:
Original Image (http://www.sxc.hu/browse.phtml?f=view&id=734177) by clix.
Image License (http://www.sxc.hu/help/7_2)
Images altered to some degree by Werdbooty.
IDEA:
Werdbooty, in response to the current CCC competition (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,17219.msg289109#msg289109).
NOTES:
Passive Skills: Airborne
Designed with a few things in mind:
    Gives Entropy its own quantum-generating critter (see Ash Eater & Photon).Works well in mono-entropy.
    How to deal with it: Freeze, Petrify, Devour, etc...Card is still very much open to interpretation. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
BACKGROUND:
"Noshi" are a kind of ceremonial origami, attached to small gifts to express good wishes. In this case, the Noshi takes the form of a crane, and the small gift is an extra :entropy each turn.
SERIES:
Quote from: The Communal Card Creation team
The Communal Card Creation team congratulates Paper Crane | Noshi Crane (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21280.msg290501.html) on winning the CCC's "Vanilla/Semi Vanilla" competition. It is a quality example of potential Semivanilla card. We feel that this card would be an improvement to Elements the Game. If you liked this card you may like the other winners Invisible Stalker | Invisible Stalker (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21399.msg292362.html), Lizardman | Lizardman (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21211.0.html) and Garden Spider | Garden Recluse (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21189.0.html) as well.

(http://imageplay.net/view/m7Gbd141815/Paper_Crane) (http://imageplay.net/view/m7Gbd141817/Noshi_Crane)
"A kind of synthesis, but with some elements that perhaps you wouldn't have expected in advance. I always like that when that happens, when something comes that is more than the sum of the parts." —Evan Parker

Offline OldTrees

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg272327#msg272327
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2011, 01:52:33 am »
This card seems overcomplicated.
It is a 1|1 for 2 :entropy that has the effect "Do not stat buff me" (upgraded it has Generate :entropy)
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Offline WerdbootyTopic starter

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg272332#msg272332
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2011, 02:04:58 am »
Originally intended to have a cost of 1 :entropy, with the only text being: "Paper Crane's HP is always 1." Figured the quasi-immortal nature of it would value at approximately 2 quanta. The complication arose because I couldn't figure out a decent way of off-setting the "always 1" motif. I realize it's most likely a failed mechanic, but the possibility was too much to pass up. I wanted to see if I could do anything with it.

I suppose it could also work as a simple 1|1 for 1, upgrades to the quanta generation effect with a 0 casting cost. Seems a little plain, but I guess that's the name of the game.
"A kind of synthesis, but with some elements that perhaps you wouldn't have expected in advance. I always like that when that happens, when something comes that is more than the sum of the parts." —Evan Parker

Offline OldTrees

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg272335#msg272335
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2011, 02:08:40 am »
Originally intended to have a cost of 1 :entropy, with the only text being: "Paper Crane's HP is always 1." Figured the quasi-immortal nature of it would value at approximately 2 quanta. The complication arose because I couldn't figure out a decent way of off-setting the "always 1" motif. I realize it's most likely a failed mechanic, but the possibility was too much to pass up. I wanted to see if I could do anything with it.

I suppose it could also work as a simple 1|1 for 1, upgrades to the quanta generation effect with a 0 casting cost. Seems a little plain, but I guess that's the name of the game.
Compare to the current Gnome and Dragonfly for help balancing. Small quanta generating creatures do not follow my old theory.
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

Offline Ajit

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg272454#msg272454
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2011, 05:57:18 am »
I love the theme, but I'm not going to lie, I don't really understand the ability.

Anyways "Paper Crane" just feels great!

rohlfo

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg272529#msg272529
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2011, 10:31:20 am »
I love the theme, but I'm not going to lie, I don't really understand the ability.

Anyways "Paper Crane" just feels great!
kinda on the same lines here!
I think the tricky thing is to know when the crane loses 0HP and gets back to 1.
For example, could it survive attacking Fire Shield?
I'm not sure I understand, but perhaps "Paper Crane's HP is always 1." is all you need? Or is it the case that it 'dies' when buffed, then comes back with 1HP to stop this (kinda immaterial) creature gain endless attack with blessing etc?

Offline WerdbootyTopic starter

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg272751#msg272751
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2011, 08:26:32 pm »
I sat for a long time staring at the words "HP is always 1" before I decided to go with it. It's tricky.

So: Crane's HP is always 1. What this means is that Crane can attack a Fire Shield and not take damage. Its HP will "always be 1." RoF and Thunderstorm would not affect it. Plate Armor would not give the Crane a bonus to HP either. It's HP will - say it with me - always remain at 1. No buffs. Immaterial still open to Petrify, Freeze, Devour (etc) in other words.

Now for where the confusion comes in (deep breath): I screwed up. Sorry. I didn't do the research before finalizing the card. After going through what is already in the game, I've compiled a short list of possible ways this creature's stats could be affected (Sky Blitz, Rage, Chaos Power, Holy Flash, etc) and realized - there are no cards in Elements that boost only attack, outside of the aforementioned Sky Blitz & Rage (and mutation). Well then, that changes things. Let's forget the second half of the card's text for a moment, shall we? What does the leave us with?

Gravity Pull. If this creature can't take damage, and GP gets tossed on it...well, that's an uber-wall that can only be devoured. Is this OP?

Now, the alternative, in my mind, is to open up the Crane to damage. State clearly that this creature's HP will always remain at 1 and it can take damage. It is, after all, only paper. But ew. What's the good of it, other than a quanta-generator when upgraded? Of course, the text could be removed altogether, leaving it as a 1|1 Airborne. It is meant to be Vanilla or close-to.

Finally,
kinda on the same lines here!
I think the tricky thing is to know when the crane loses 0HP and gets back to 1.
For example, could it survive attacking Fire Shield?
I'm not sure I understand, but perhaps "Paper Crane's HP is always 1." is all you need? Or is it the case that it 'dies' when buffed, then comes back with 1HP to stop this (kinda immaterial) creature gain endless attack with blessing etc?
    I like this idea. Hm. It would fit with Schrodinger's Kitty and activate Death effects.


Sorry for all the confusion, peoples. I'll be sure to be clearer in the future. In the meantime...suggestions?

"A kind of synthesis, but with some elements that perhaps you wouldn't have expected in advance. I always like that when that happens, when something comes that is more than the sum of the parts." —Evan Parker

rohlfo

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg273906#msg273906
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2011, 04:09:27 pm »
with GP it could be OP!
it would have to only block 1 damage, ('die'), let the rest of the damage through, then come back with 1HP...?

Offline WerdbootyTopic starter

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg273933#msg273933
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2011, 04:51:27 pm »
Well, if I had a Crane out with Gravity Pull on it, you could always GP another of my creatures. Barring that, my question is this: does Gravity Pull block all damage, or does GP'd damage max out at a critter's HP? More to the point, would the Crane - as rohlfo mentioned - block only 1 point of damage and let the rest thru (effectively "dying" then coming back at 1HP)? I'm assuming that if this is the case, GP would be removed from the Crane when it "dies."

"A kind of synthesis, but with some elements that perhaps you wouldn't have expected in advance. I always like that when that happens, when something comes that is more than the sum of the parts." —Evan Parker

Offline RagingAlien

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg273940#msg273940
« Reply #9 on: February 19, 2011, 05:00:34 pm »
I think making it vulnerable to anything other than Direct damage (direct damage counting Fire Shield and possible Freeze-Shockwave) so as to make it killable. probably not all that easy to code, but a really nice idea.
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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg281359#msg281359
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2011, 01:36:43 am »
Fractal cranes would be really strong.  Gravity pull probably wouldn't help because the crane would just be reincarnated.  The good thing about an interpretation that allows the cranes to die but be reincarnated is that they wouldn't retain the Attack boost that blessing or Chaos Power would give them.

This would make it the only truly immortal creature in the game.  No other immortal actually cannot die.  They just can't be targeted.  I think that effect deserves a cost increase and the absolution of the generate quanta ability.

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Re: Paper Crane | Noshi Crane https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21280.msg282621#msg282621
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2011, 11:13:59 pm »

Quote from: The Communal Card Creation team
The Communal Card Creation team congratulates Paper Crane | Noshi Crane (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21280.msg290501.html) on winning the CCC's "Vanilla/Semi Vanilla" competition. It is a quality example of potential Semivanilla card. We feel that this card would be an improvement to Elements the Game. If you liked this card you may like the other winners Invisible Stalker | Invisible Stalker (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21399.msg292362.html), Lizardman | Lizardman (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21211.0.html) and Garden Spider | Garden Recluse (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21189.0.html) as well.
You will want to add this quote to the opening post.
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

 

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