Does anyone have a strong argument against God?

[Spiraler]

So you're basically saying that religion can't be proven or dis-proven. I agree with this, because that is completely what keeps religion alive. Everyone just looks for an explanation for life, so they come up with their own.

Also, question for everyone in the christian section. When Y2k and all the other predictions of the end of the world/judgement day didn't happen, did that make you think, 'is this really as realistic as I used to think?" or do you think, "Oh, I just must have read the signs wrong, so nothing is unrealistic about it."?

[OldTrees]

So you're basically saying that religion can't be proven or dis-proven.

No. I am not going as far as to make that claim.
If a religion makes falsifiable claims then those claims can be disproved if false or given support if not disproved.
(See Ezikiel's disproof about an aspect of the Baal worship religion in the bible)
If a religion makes non falsifiable claims then those claims can not be investigated through science.

[Spiraler]

As in most claims that are made by religion are not falsifiable.

[OldTrees]

As in most claims that are made by religion are not falsifiable.

With out current knowledge of reality, yes. Especially morality.

[RagingAlien]

While i do not have any particular strong argument against god, i do have a pretty overused one:

WHY, why is, and was, so much war, hate, and so on, if there really is a supreme benevolent deity that watches over all the Universe, and particularly the earth, why doesn't it do ANYTHING? Aren't most of the wars because, while most people agree on the existance of a supreme being, they don't agree on what exactly might his/hers/its name is? Shouldn't God then just poof over into everybody's house and say "my name is *such*, you can now stop every war, and so on, about me. stop hating everybody, too."

[Astrocyte]

While i do not have any particular strong argument against god, i do have a pretty overused one:

WHY, why is, and was, so much war, hate, and so on, if there really is a supreme benevolent deity that watches over all the Universe, and particularly the earth, why doesn't it do ANYTHING? Aren't most of the wars because, while most people agree on the existance of a supreme being, they don't agree on what exactly might his/hers/its name is? Shouldn't God then just poof over into everybody's house and say "my name is *such*, you can now stop every war, and so on, about me. stop hating everybody, too."

Some responses (varying widely by religion and sects within religions) I've heard are:
-- God has a plan. He hasn't told you the plan because you wouldn't understand, or because your knowing the plan might inherently defeat the plan, or simply because it's not your place to know the plan. You must have faith that the plan is ultimately beneficial to you.
-- God allows these events to happen to test the faithful. He's watching to see what you do in the face of such bad things.
-- God allows these events to happen to punish the faithful. If the faithful were more faithful, they wouldn't happen.
-- You don't need to worry about it, God doesn't let these things happen to the faithful. If they do happen, he'll fix it soon, or they're blessings in disguise.
-- What are you doing sitting around while others claim your God isn't real? Go get 'em! (where "get" can mean "convert," "kill," or "threaten to kill if they don't convert")

I'm sure there are others, this is just off the top of my head at 1 AM.

[Bloodshadow]

Every single one of the reasons above absolutely disgusts me. They make God sound like a pompous, spiteful bastard. +1 for why I don't believe in Christianity.

[daccoo]

Every single one of the reasons above absolutely disgusts me. They make God sound like a pompous, spiteful bastard. +1 for why I don't believe in Christianity.

..... Chill m8...

[Bloodshadow]

..... Chill m8...

Yeah yeah, sure. I can "chill" while I burn in Hell for the rest of eternity. Chill indeed.

[Time_lord_victorius]

please, we need to settle something else first:

does anyone have strong argouments against the Flying Spaghetti Monster?
or else i'll assume that it exists...

I see what you did there!!! nice south park refference!!!

[UTAlan]

-- God has a plan. He hasn't told you the plan because you wouldn't understand, or because your knowing the plan might inherently defeat the plan, or simply because it's not your place to know the plan. You must have faith that the plan is ultimately beneficial to you.
-- God allows these events to happen to test the faithful. He's watching to see what you do in the face of such bad things.
-- God allows these events to happen to punish the faithful. If the faithful were more faithful, they wouldn't happen.
-- You don't need to worry about it, God doesn't let these things happen to the faithful. If they do happen, he'll fix it soon, or they're blessings in disguise.
-- What are you doing sitting around while others claim your God isn't real? Go get 'em! (where "get" can mean "convert," "kill," or "threaten to kill if they don't convert")

The first reason is the only one that is not completely ignorant/contrary to Scripture. Even so, the first one isn't a valid response to the question posed. The real reason that there is evil and suffering in this world is that God could not eliminate these things without also eliminating freedom and, therefore, love.

We can, perhaps, conceive of a world in which God corrected the results of this abuse of free will by His creatures at every moment: so that a wooden beam became soft as grass when it was used as a weapon, and the air refused to obey me if I attempted to set up in it the sound waves that carry lies or insults. But such a world would be one in which wrong actions were impossible, and in which, therefore, freedom of the will would be void; nay, if the principle were carried out to its logical conclusion, evil thoughts would be impossible, for the cerebral matter which we use in thinking would refuse its task when we attempted to frame them

[Nepycros]

The first reason is the only one that is not completely ignorant/contrary to Scripture. Even so, the first one isn't a valid response to the question posed. The real reason that there is evil and suffering in this world is that God could not eliminate these things without also eliminating freedom and, therefore, love.

If God did make the universe, and is truly omnipotent, then that means He chose the initial configurations by which this universe's laws stand. He created us by these means, and through our observations, we have created a definition of "free will" that is satisfactory when it comes to everyday life.

Consider the anthropic principle, which states that the we see the universe this way because, if it was different, we would not be alive to see it. Now, considering this, that actually presets a level of conceitedness on our own existence. Consider that we AREN'T at the "highest level" of free will, that is offered by the omnipotency of God, but are, in fact, only given a portion of free will that He has chosen to give us? Through this, it's like looking at a bird in a cage with no way to look out of the bars. Their universe is contained in the cage, and they live by the laws of the cage, in that they believe that their maximum potential freedom is offered in that tiny space.

Saying God COULDN'T offer us higher "free will" would be ideally moronic, since that contradicts the concept that He is omnipotent. God knew full well what He was making. Should He have designed us in a way that we were inherently empathic and loyal to Him, we would not object, because that would be the maximum scope by which we understand ourselves and the universe... Just like the way it is now.

I would've hoped that someone would've at least compared their opinion to my own. Again, saying "God could not eliminate these things without also eliminating freedom and, therefore, love." is not proven to be true. Again, there are ways that he could've made us in a way in which we have free will and yet did no wrong. That's what omnipotency is.