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Elements Mafia
Started by Mastermind79, Continued by killsdazombies, Implosion, ddevans96, icecoldbro, Demagog, Purity_Riot, Dragoon1140, killsdazombies, 1world24, RavingRabbid, majofa, TStar, killsdazombies, mesaprotector, Regen2k9, Kuroaitou, whatifidogetcaught?, UnderneathTheLens, RootRanger, killsdazombies, Elbirn, ji412jo, dawn to dusk, eljoemo, Zawadx, killsdazombies, theelkspeaks, iancudorinmarian, DoubleCapitals, Dm, Espithel, killsdazombies, skyironsword, Submachine, Coffeeditto, mathman101, Naesala, Ginyu, Linkcat, Solaris, Ryli, killsdazombies, Naii_the_Baf, PlayerOa, and skyironsword.
All of the players in the game are collectively referred to as the Town. The Town is split into two factions. There is a minority faction, the mafia (False Gods), and a majority faction, the innocents (Elementals). The False Gods start the game with the knowledge of who the other members are, and their goal is to kill all of the Elementals. The Elementals start the game not knowing who is a False God and who is a fellow Elemental, and their goal is to kill all of the False Gods.
The game is split into two phases. It generally starts with a Night Phase, in which the False Gods choose one member of the Town to kill. This is called the Nightkill. Also, players may use abilities given to them by their roles during this phase. Following each Night Phase is the Day Phase. During the day, the Town may choose to lynch one player through the use of votes. Each player gets one vote, and the person with the most votes at the end of the day is lynched and removed from the game. This cycle continues until either all of the False Gods are dead, or the number of False Gods is equal to or greater than the number of Elementals at the beginning of a Day Phase. This is called reaching parity.
How to determine who is mafia and who is innocent is entirely up to the players. As a False God your job is to blend into the Town and direct lynches onto Elementals without giving yourself away. As an Elemental your job is to use logic, reason, tells, intuition, and any abilities you may have to determine who the False Gods are and lynch them. An inactive town will easily fall prey to the mafia, so try to generate as much information as possible. In the game of mafia you have two main weapons; your voice and your vote. Use them wisely.
Village - Town
Villager - Innocent
Civ - Innocent
Wolf - Mafia
Scum - Mafia
Alignment - Primary Role
Roll/Rand - Having a role assigned to you
PR/Power Role - Roles that are very useful to the town - usually includes cop and medic
Cop - A role that has the ability to determine the alignment of another player
Medic - A role that has the ability to protect other players from the Nightkill
Shoot - Use an ability that would kill another player
Claim/Roleclaim - Say that you have a specific role
Soft/Softclaim - Hint that you have a specific role
Civvy Central - A group of confirmed innocents
Scummy - Acting like a mafia
Towny - Acting like an innocent
Town-Cred/Town Points - Factors that make it more likely that a player is innocent
Read - How scummy or towny you think someone is
Wagon/Train - A player that has multiple votes on them
FoS/Finger of Suspicion - Declare that you suspect someone without voting them
Tunnel - Having tunnel vision on a single player
Pocket - Townread someone to get them on your side
Thunderdome - Confront someone as to narrow the possibly lynch to to those two players
Self-Preservation - Vote on the biggest other wagon when you are a leading wagon, this is not a read-based vote unless stated
Hammer - Casting the final vote needed for a lynch
Bus - Throw a fellow mafia member under the bus to get town-cred
OMGUS - Oh My God, U Suck - Voting on the person who voted on you
CFD/Chinese Fire Drill - At EoD, pile votes onto someone who has little to no votes
Breadcrumb - Give hints to your role or actions in a post that you can call back on to give credibility to your claim
Breadpost - Shitpost
EV - Expected Value
EoD/End of Day - The last hours before the end of the day phase
PoE/Process of Elimination - Rank the lynch priority of the remaining players to give the best chance of lynching mafia sooner.
LyLo/Lynch or Lose - Town must lynch correctly or they lose
MyLo/Mislynch and Lose - If town mislynches they lose, but if they No Lynch the game continues
EBWOP - Edit By Way Of Post - Making another post with changes instead of editing a previous one
RQS - Random Question Stage, a common way to start games where one player puts forth a survey of questions for every player to answer
WIFOM - Wine In Front Of Me (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9TRMQwMNnY) - The dilemma that arises from trying to predict whether someone has made an optimal but expected choice, or a suboptimal but unexpected one
General Mafia Rules
1. Do not post, chat, OR PM ANY revealing information if you have been killed/removed from this mafia. You are allowed one death post that contains no information or commentary about the players.
2. You are not allowed to edit or remove your post. Instead, EBWOP will take effect. This means you must post again with the correct fixes. Coded messages are not allowed.
3. Directly quoting or providing proof in any way of any PM sent by the host will result in an instant modkill and referral to the FGO.
4. You are not allowed to directly quote any PM sent by another player, unless you are quoting it to a fellow mafia member confirmed by the host.
5. You are not allowed to request to be modkilled in the thread. If you PM the host requesting to be modkilled, the host must find a substitute or modkill you at the end of the phase.
6. All players' actions should be primarily motivated by winning the game. Throwing the game or outing your teammates for no strategic value is not allowed.
7. The host has the final say in any dispute. Do not impersonate the host.
8. Any flaming/trolling will not be tolerated.
9. Players' actions should be motivated by this game's events solely. You may look at past mafias to determine behaviors for better reads, but keep personal affairs out of the game.
10. Anything said within the context of the game, including promises, bets, etc, stays within the game. Players can lie, deceive, and manipulate, (but not cheat) in any way they like. Slander within the context of the game is usually not meant as a personal offense.
*Any use of the word PM by the host or FGO refers to any method of communication outside of the game thread and the blab chat.
Breaking any of the above rules may result in a modkill as determined by the host, or a ban from future mafias or forum games in general as determined by the Forum Game Organizer.
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Mafia 74: Honkai Eruption
Honkai energy is a malevolent force with a will of its own. It corrupts everything it touches, turning humans into shells of their former selves. It imbues certain individuals, known as Herrschers, with god-like power and strips away their humanity. Brave young women known as Valkyries fight to protect the innocent, no matter the cost.
The game will start on Night 0, which will be followed by Day 1. Players may post at night.
Phases will be 48 hours, though this may change due to extenuating circumstances. The day will be extended by up to 30 minutes if less than 7 minutes have passed since the last vote or vote tally. The day will immediately end after 30 minutes.
If you do not post for three consecutive phases, you will be modkilled.
The roles that are in the game will not be disclosed until after the game is over. In addition, you are not notified when you are targeted unless stated otherwise.
The nightkill is factional and cannot be tracked or roleblocked, and it does not target. The nightkill cannot be used on Night 0.
The Herrscher:Valkyrie ratio is roughly 1:4. There will be 3 Herrschers starting at 15 players, and 4 Herrschers starting at 19 players. Herrschers are the mafia, and may communicate outside the thread. You may communicate in the official Elements blab chat, but all relevant messages must be posted in the thread immediately afterward. No other communication is permitted outside the thread.
Valkyries win if all the Herrschers are dead. Herrschers win if they achieve parity at the beginning of a day phase.
Voting Total ties will result in No Lynch. No Lynch can be voted on independently, and will automatically win if no votes are cast. Clearly declaring your intent to vote without using the proper format is a valid way to vote.
Deaths
Lynch [Name] was lynched. He/she was [Role].
Nightkill [Name] was nightkilled. He/she was [Role].
Modkill [Name] was modkilled. He/she was [Role].
Rapid Decay [Name] suddenly disintegrated. He/she was [Role].
Field of Blades [Name] was impaled in a field of blades. He/she was [Role].
Red Thread of Fate [Name]’s thread of life was severed. He/she was [Role].
Flash Counter [Name] was killed by a counterattack. He/she was [Role].
Typhoon Cutter [Name] was cut in half. He/she was [Role].
Abyssal Flower [Name] fell into the abyss. He/she was [Role].
If the player that died was affected by Black Hole, the message will be changed:
[...] His/her role could not be identified.
If the player that died was holding a Honkai Core, the message will be extended:
[...] They were holding the [Core Name].
Private Notifications
Valkyrie Role You are [Role].
Herrscher Role [Name] - [Role]; [Honkai Core]. [Name] - [Role]; [Honkai Core]. (etc.)
Ability Blocked You failed to use your ability. Ability has been refunded.
Invalid Command You can’t do that because [Reason].
Global Analysis Your target’s role is [Role].
Chain Lightning The selected player targeted [Name List], and was targeted by [Name List].
Rapid Decay You have been targeted by Rapid Decay. You will die at the end of the day!
Time Fracture You were affected by Time Fracture. You can’t vote tomorrow.
Charge Beam (No Vote) You didn’t vote today. Your Voting Power is now (#).
Charge Beam (Vote) You voted today, so your Voting Power has been reset to 1.
Spear of Judgement Your target’s ability type was [Type].
Rose Petals You were forced to use your ability.
Typhoon Cutter Typhoon Cutter killed a Valkyrie, and its remaining uses have been lost.
Quantum State You have gained the [Ability] ability.
Break of Dawn (Herrscher) Your target was a Herrscher! They have a Honkai Core.
Break of Dawn (Valkyrie) Your target was a Valkyrie. They do not have a Honkai Core.
Abyssal Flower [Name] targeted you with Abyssal Flower. Their role is [Role].
Idyllic Dreams (User) You targeted [Name] with Idyllic Dreams, and they targeted you back. Their role is [Role].
Idyllic Dreams (Target) [Name] targeted you with Idyllic Dreams, and you targeted them back. Their role is [Role].
Radio Wave The players you selected used a total of (#) abilities.
Theory of Relativity Your target was affected by [Ability List].
Theory of Relativity (No Abilities) Your target was not affected by any abilities.
Atomic Signature [Name List] have the [Ability] ability.
Atomic Signature (No Players) No one has the [Ability] ability.
Surveillance Network You know that [Name] is [Role], [Name] is [Role], and [Name] is [Role].
Soul Funeral The correct player was lynched. You have gained the [Ability] ability.
While there is a notification if your ability failed (i.e. you were roleblocked, or one of your targets was affected by Consecrate Ground), there is not a notification if your ability simply did nothing because one or more conditions were not met.
Public Notifications
If Break of Dawn was activated successfully, there will be a public notification at the start of the day phase:
[Name] cannot be voted on today.
If the player holding the Core of Binding is lynched, there will be a public notification at the start of the night phase:
Role abilities cannot be used tonight. (Honkai Core abilities are unaffected.)
Abilities will be resolved in the following order.
Death will not stop abilities from being used on the current night. Once an ability has resolved, its effect will last for the stated duration, even if the user dies.
- Phantom Image
- Rose Petals
- Time Fracture
- Consecrate Ground
- All other abilities
- Red Thread of Fate
- Nightkill
- Abyssal Flower
- Typhoon Cutter
- Chain Lightning, Field of Blades, Idyllic Dreams, Theory of Relativity*
*These abilities will detect each others’ presence.
Please note that some abilities have effects that occur at the beginning or end of a specific phase. These abilities will trigger at the specified time, even if the user is dead.
Passive abilities are always active.
ER abilities can be used Every Round.
EoR abilities are usable Every other Round. (In other words, they have a 1-night cooldown.)
#U abilities have # Uses.
Each Herrscher starts the game with a Honkai Core ability, in addition to their role ability. Honkai Core abilities do not conflict with or replace role abilities, and may be activated at the same time. Honkai Cores can be excluded, but not repeated. The presence of a Honkai Core is always revealed on death.
Core of Reason Global Analysis (EoR) Target a player. Learn their original role.
Core of Void Black Hole (2U) Target a player. If they die tonight, their role is not revealed. (Honkai Cores will still be revealed.)
Core of Lightning Chain Lightning (ER) Target a player. At the end of the night, you learn which players they targeted, and which players targeted them. (Ability names are not revealed.)
Core of Death Rapid Decay (1U) Target player dies at the end of the next day phase. They will receive a notification immediately.
Core of Binding Binding Chains (Passive) When you are lynched, all role abilities are disabled for the following night. (Honkai Core abilities are unaffected.)
Roles can be excluded, but not repeated. All players will have a role, including mafia members, unless there are more than 20 players, in which case the excess players may end up being Valkyries with no role. A player’s original role will be revealed on death unless the player is affected by Black Hole.
Kiana Kaslana Time Fracture (EoR) Target a player. Their abilities can’t be used tonight, and they can’t vote on the following day. They will be notified. You can’t target yourself. (Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)
Raiden Mei Phantom Image (ER) Target exactly two players. Tonight, anything that targets the first player affects the second player instead, and vice versa. This includes the nightkill. You can’t target yourself. (This can cause abilities to be used on otherwise illegal targets, such as for abilities that can’t normally target the user. Note that this ability has very high priority.)
Bronya Zaychik Charge Beam (Passive) Not voting increases your Voting Power by 1 the next time you do vote. This effect stacks. (This is checked at the end of the day. In other words, voting and then removing your vote later will simply count as not voting.)
Himeko Murata Field of Blades (2U) Target a player. If they are targeted by at least two other role abilities this night, kill them. You can’t target yourself. (Passives, nightkills, and Honkai Core abilities do not count.)
Yae Sakura Consecrate Ground (EoR) Target up to three players. Other abilities targeting them will fail tonight. You can’t target yourself. (Nightkills are unaffected. Abilities that target a protected player will fail entirely even if their other targets are valid. Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)
Theresa Apocalypse Spear of Judgement (ER) Target a player. If they are a Herrscher, you learn their Honkai Core’s ability type. Otherwise, you learn the ability type of their original role ability. You can’t target yourself. (The ability types are ER, EoR, Passive, and #U. Does not distinguish between Honkai Core abilities and role abilities.)
Fu Hua Phoenix Rebirth (ER) Target player can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. You may target yourself, but you can’t target the same player twice in a row.
Kallen Kaslana Red Thread of Fate (EoR) Target exactly two players. If one dies tonight, so does the other. You may target yourself, and if you’re a Herrscher, you must do so.
Rita Rossweisse Rose Petals (ER) Target a player. If they have any abilities that can be used tonight and can have exactly one target, force them to use it on you. You can’t target yourself. (If successful, this overrides any target(s) they may have selected. The abilities still occur at their normal priority level. EoR abilities still go on cooldown, and #U abilities still lose a use. They will be notified.)
Liliya Olenyeva Flash Counter (1U) You can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. At the end of the night, kill all players who targeted you with an ability that would have killed you. If the nightkill is prevented this way, this automatically kills one Herrscher, preferring the living Honkai Core holder that appears earliest in the Honkai Core list. (Abilities that do not immediately kill you, or would not have killed you due to a condition not being met, will not trigger this effect.)
Rozaliya Olenyeva Typhoon Cutter (2U) Kill target player. If they were a Valkyrie, lose all remaining uses of this ability. You can’t target yourself.
Seele Vollerei Quantum State (Passive) You permanently gain a copy of the first role ability to target you. (Priority matters! You’ll receive a notification. The ability will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You still technically have the Quantum State ability.)
Durandal Break of Dawn (EoR) Target a player. At the start of the next day, whether they are a Herrscher will be revealed to you. They can’t be voted on that day. (There will be a public notification for this part.) You can’t target yourself.
Cecilia Schariac Abyssal Flower (ER) Target a player. If this is the first time you’ve targeted them with this ability, reveal your name and original role to them. If this is the second time you’ve targeted them with this ability, kill them instead. You can’t target yourself.
Shigure Kira Idyllic Dreams (EoR) Target up to three players. If any of them targeted you tonight, you learn each other’s name and original role. You can’t target yourself.
Frederica Tesla Radio Wave (ER) Target any number of players. You learn how many abilities those players used tonight, in total. You can’t target yourself. (Includes Honkai Core abilities. You don’t learn the ability name or target. Players can use more than one ability each night.)
Lieserl Einstein Theory of Relativity (ER) Target a player. You receive a list of all ability names that targeted them tonight, other than this one. You may target yourself. (Player names are not revealed.)
Emma Planck Atomic Signature (EoR) Name a role. You learn which player, if any, has that role. (This includes players who have gained that role, and players who are already dead. Honkai Cores are not roles.)
Cocolia Surveillance Network (Passive) At the start of Night 0, you learn the role ability of three random other players. (If you’re a Herrscher, this won’t reveal roles of other Herrschers.)
Sin Mal Soul Funeral (3U) Target a player. If they are lynched tomorrow, you permanently gain a copy of their original role ability if you do not already have it. You can’t target yourself. (You’ll receive a notification. Abilities will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You may use multiple abilities in one night.)
-Gained abilities (from Quantum State or Soul Funeral) are not revealed on death.
-Modkills will generally only occur at the end of a phase. As such, it is possible to target those players until then, including with abilities such as Black Hole.
-Players who are already dead can’t be targeted, but targeting will still succeed if a player is targeted in the same phase that they die. Atomic Signature does not target.
-If multiple abilities with the same priority (such as Chain Lightning and Idyllic Dreams) target a player with an active Quantum State ability, one will be selected at random.
-The following abilities will trigger Flash Counter’s counterattack: Red Thread of Fate, Abyssal Flower, Typhoon Cutter, and Field of Blades. Rapid Decay will not, as death is not immediate. When a nightkill is prevented this way, Flash Counter chooses a living Herrscher based on the order of the Honkai Cores in the list. (Reason > Void > Lightning > Death > Binding)
-Chain Lightning will include the user in the results.
-Abyssal Flower and Idyllic Dreams reveal your original role, not the role corresponding to those abilities. If you are Seele Vollerei or Sin Mal, your target will learn this!
-The nightkill has no targeting restrictions. You may attempt to nightkill a Herrscher, though this will rarely be helpful.
-Voting while under the effect of Time Fracture will result in a modkill at the end of the phase, even if that vote is removed later. Voting on a player affected by Break of Dawn is discouraged, but as this is a public notification already, those players will simply be treated as though they did not vote. No modkill will occur.
-Abyssal Flower is tracked per player, so two different players targeting the same player will not result in a kill. Targeting a player with Abyssal Flower three times (or more) has no effect.
-Rose Petals will affect all abilities a player has, including Honkai Core abilities and abilities gained through effects. The user of Rose Petals will be the only target of any affected abilities.
-The targets of Idyllic Dreams will not learn the roles of the other targets. The condition is checked separately for each of the ability's targets.
-You cannot use the same ability more than once per round, but you may activate multiple abilities in the same round. Passives can never be activated. See this post (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299599/#msg1299599) for more information.
-Phoenix Rebirth cannot be used twice in a row on the same player. This only considers the intended target, not the final target, which may be changed by Phantom Image or Rose Petals.
-Abilities do not target unless they specifically say that they do. As such, Flash Counter, Atomic Signature, and all passive abilities do not target.
-Some niche scenarios can occur due to duplication of roles by Seele Vollerei and Sin Mal. Interaction between two or more players with the same ability is listed here (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299637/#msg1299637).
-Please note that #U is its own ability type. Theresa's ability will not report the specific number of uses.
-Additional rulings will be added here as needed.
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- Night 0 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299562/#msg1299562)
- Day 1 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299726/#msg1299726)
- Night 1 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300173/#msg1300173)
- Day 2 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300290/#msg1300290)
- Night 2 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300601/#msg1300601)
- Day 3 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300724/#msg1300724)
- Night 3 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300886/#msg1300886)
- Day 4 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301086/#msg1301086)
- Night 4 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301221/#msg1301221)
- Day 5 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301322/#msg1301322)
- Night 5 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301433/#msg1301433)
- Day 6 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301532/#msg1301532)
- Night 6 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301609/#msg1301609)
- Day 7 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301654/#msg1301654)
- Game Over (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1301731/#msg1301731)
Signups have ended.
As an additional incentive to sign up, you may send a PM to the host with up to three roles you would prefer to have. You will be slightly more likely to receive one of those roles when roles are being distributed, though it is far from guaranteed.[/list]
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In.
The Terminology section has been expanded to include terms that came up in the last mafia. Please refer to it if you come across a term or abbreviation you don't recognize.
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In.
The Terminology section has been expanded to include terms that came up in the last mafia. Please refer to it if you come across a term or abbreviation you don't recognize.
This is great.
The hosted by... appears to be missing the hosts of 68-72 btw.
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Cecilia Schariac
Bronya Zaychik
Kallen Kaslana
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Not going to lie, all these new role names and terms are to me confusing as heck, but I’ll give it a shot nonetheless.
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As an additional incentive to sign up, you may send a PM to the host with up to three roles you would prefer to have. You will be slightly more likely to receive one of those roles when roles are being distributed, though it is far from guaranteed.
Am I allowed to ask to what extent is this additional likelihood? (Assuming if you don't do this, the roles are evenly distributed)
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I'm too lazy to read the rules. In.
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I'm too lazy to read the rules. In.
Same
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In.
The Terminology section has been expanded to include terms that came up in the last mafia. Please refer to it if you come across a term or abbreviation you don't recognize.
This is great.
The hosted by... appears to be missing the hosts of 68-72 btw.
People generally only show in the order they first hosted. All those people are listed earlier.
As an additional incentive to sign up, you may send a PM to the host with up to three roles you would prefer to have. You will be slightly more likely to receive one of those roles when roles are being distributed, though it is far from guaranteed.
Am I allowed to ask to what extent is this additional likelihood? (Assuming if you don't do this, the roles are evenly distributed)
3x, so about 1/3 to get one of the three roles.
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May I ask for the extension to be reduced to half an hour. The idea of extension is mainly to stop last minute vote thing, no need for an hour extension. There’s no reason for these extensions when there’s been 48 hours of phases to talk, it just encourages late phase activity and people just wait assuming extensions are part of the phases and essentially bound to happen every time.
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May I ask for the extension to be reduced to half an hour. The idea of extension is mainly to stop last minute vote thing, no need for an hour extension. There’s no reason for these extensions when there’s been 48 hours of phases to talk, it just encourages late phase activity and people just wait assuming extensions are part of the phases and essentially bound to happen every time.
+1
From a host perspective from last mafia, this did feel pretty ludicrous at times.
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I was mostly including it because the previous mafia did. I've shortened the extension to half an hour, as requested.
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In.
The Terminology section has been expanded to include terms that came up in the last mafia. Please refer to it if you come across a term or abbreviation you don't recognize.
This is great.
The hosted by... appears to be missing the hosts of 68-72 btw.
People generally only show in the order they first hosted. All those people are listed earlier.
(https://i.ibb.co/7gqWNZf/Skjermbilde-2020-06-30-kl-16-22-59.png)
:-*
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Killsda OP
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In
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in
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Sure, I'll sign up
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time to embarass myself again
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If that doesn't discourage anyone from joining, I'm in. I am still a bit exhausted from the previous mafia, so I need a change of pace this time.
I already showed I can play the high effort game as mafia, so now it's time to test out the low effort game as town. (And if I get mafia, I guess low effort works there too.)
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I forgot if I added myself multiple times to the hosted list, or if someone else did. I still laugh when I see it
Anyway I read like, 2 roles, decided that was enough and am now in. Activity will be limited on m/w/f and until the 7th. So uh... hopefully I dont die because of it.
Also this post is me bread crumbling that I am mafia. So be sure to quote it when you lynch me please
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Also sky is in their twice so you can't say I'm the only one listed twice in the host list. @Oa
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i would like to join
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Some contemplation... I'm /in. If I role a killing ability pretty sure I know who I'm shooting as soon as possible. :-*
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Yeah I don't see shock living past N1 this game.
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I shall use doc on him :P :P
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Yeah I don't see shock living past N1 this game.
Aw man, and just when he is about to flip mafia. I will never see how he plays as mafia, will I? :( :silly:
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I forgot if I added myself multiple times to the hosted list, or if someone else did. I still laugh when I see it
It all started when the Fire Nation attacked in this mafia topic:
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-game-archive/elements-mafia-69-by-killsdazombies/msg1261860/#msg1261860
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sky why u do dis, I play, like 4 mobile games and HI3 isn't one of these, I got no ammo to make shitty roleplays, aaaaaaaaaaah.
as a friend advised me, Kiana, Bronya and Seele
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ebwop not a meta pick i just took whatever my friend who plays thought was cool
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I forgot if I added myself multiple times to the hosted list, or if someone else did. I still laugh when I see it
It all started when the Fire Nation attacked in this mafia topic:
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-game-archive/elements-mafia-69-by-killsdazombies/msg1261860/#msg1261860
HA Thank you sub, I dont remember this even a little.
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Actually it started when I revived the list in 64. For anyone who doesn't understand why, it's because kdz has hosted the most games with 11, nobody else is close. Kuro is second with 6. This mafia will put Sky in third with 4. Also the current host is always listed last even if they hosted before. Nobody else is doubled. Another fun fact, Oa is our 40th unique host. Congrats.
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Signups have ended.
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In
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In, I guess.
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In, will be less busy starting at the end of this week.
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Signups have ended. Roles are currently being distributed.
Night 0 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Night 0
There are 3 Herrschers and 15 Valkyries. Please note that roles cannot be repeated.
Night 0 has ended.
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It's time to start highlighting some important roles and group the other roles by category as well as suggest their intended usage. Deviating from this intended usage will likely be perceived as scummy, so speak up if you disagree instead of simply ignoring my advice.
Cop: Durandal
Medic: Fu Hua
Cop targets are publicly notified the day after and they cannot be lynchvoted that day. My suggestion is to hard-claim when finding a mafia, say nothing when finding town. Town targeted by cop is more likely to be nightkilled due to notification.
Emma Planck should target Cop N0, Medic N2 (if still alive). Fake cop claims should be denied by Emma Planck, not the actual cop.
If you have been targeted by Cecilia Shariac, make sure to publicly reveal this, but keep the identity of the person with this role a secret until someone town dies from that role. Verify or deny claims made for that role if someone claims.
All false claims should lead to getting lynched, this way, Theresa Apocalypse can identify mafia that make true role claims if their Honkai Core's ability type differs from their original role ability. Roles are also unique, so if someone claims to be your role, they are lying.
Now for the rest of the roles, note that offensive roles should not be used lightly, especially N0.
Not sure how using this ability is not scummy.
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
Useful for scum to tip the voting scales in their favor. People should lynch vote every day, even with this role.
Coordinate with info roles to kill people.
Seems like an overpowered scum ability to protect their entire team from cop. Please do not use this ability.
Allows you to verify if the player's role claim matches their ability type. If not, claim and lynch.
Allows scum to take a town down with them, not sure what the most useful usage for town is. Best to just leave the ability be or try to drag down someone scummy with a likely NK target.
With how many offensive abilities there are, this practically feels like suicide to use at random. Using this on other defensive roles or cop (why???) should be perceived as scummy.
If everyone suddenly wants you dead on a night, this will eliminate them all. Veruy useful if you will be the next nightkill target.
Kills, plain and simple.
Please do not claim to be the role you received, unless explicitly mentioning this role as well. See received role for suggested usage of that role.
Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
Can likely be used freely. Please do not target power roles to prevent outing them to mafia.
Can be used freely. Most useful when used on individual players to spy them using 2 abilities during one night (=mafia).
Can be used freely.
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
No usage.
If you can predict whom gets lynched this ability is extremely useful, but after obtaining new abilities soem informative roles may perceive you as scum. Avoid using two abilities in one night.
There is a lot to add (or modify) to my list of brief suggestions, so I would love to see some discussion on role usage. I wrote this before roles were revealed, so you won't find any soft-claims in this post.
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I may eventually read all of that Torb... At some point. For now though...
YOU DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO. 8-) I have a TV that does this for me. ;)
And now some of my own mechanical blather-- the game would go to day 7 if only lynches (mislynches at that) and standard nightkills occurred. Great news that we stayed at 18 players to get the max 15:3 ratio too.
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Clarification on Shigure Kira's ability, Idyllic Dreams: Kira's targets will not learn the roles of your other targets. I apologize if the wording was unclear.
For example: Shigure Kira targets player A, player B and player C. Player A and player B target Kira, but Player C does not. Shigure Kira will learn Player A's role, and Player A will learn Kira's role. Kira will learn Player B's role, and Player B will learn Kira's role. No one learns Player C's role. Players A and B do not learn each other's role.
The rulings section has been updated.
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@mafia PLEASE PLEASE DO NOT NK ME EARLY. LONGER YOU LET ME LIVE, TOWN WILL BE SUS AND WILL KILL ME ANYWAYS TY.
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Entering chill mode.~
Got my role. Those who need protection should speak up about it, www.
EBWOP: Wow, I wanted to post this before www spoke. Nailed it.
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Also I stand by my standing preference and belief that shooting into a low-activity low-content difficult-to-effectively-POE crowd is a net-expected-benefit for town. I can't think of a scenario this game where I'd advise it night 0 (ref n0 Fate Egg rolling n0-only Otyugh last game) but I still support firing in the above described way at some point if a better target isn't clear to the shooter. Which you seem to be against hardline, TorB?
NB: I'm away pessimistic of certain players shooting offensively at any point at any target. :-\
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This makes my point on that role moot. I interpreted it as all three knowing eachothers roles as long as one targeted Shigure Kira. Thank you for the clarification.
This means my advice is now to use it as much as you want, prioritize those likely to target you to get some effect out of it.
YOU DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO. 8-) I have a TV that does this for me. ;)
I'm trying to make suggestions and categorize actions as scummy, towny or neutral. I want to make sure everyone at the very least realizes how their actions can help or hurt town and how to identify the people trying to hurt town. We can assume those to be the best lynch targets, yes? I know, your comment is only half serious, half implying you intend to vigi N0 again if you can (they're the same half, but whatever).
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It's time to start highlighting some important roles and group the other roles by category as well as suggest their intended usage. Deviating from this intended usage will likely be perceived as scummy, so speak up if you disagree instead of simply ignoring my advice.
Cop: Durandal
Medic: Fu Hua
Cop targets are publicly notified the day after and they cannot be lynchvoted that day. My suggestion is to hard-claim when finding a mafia, say nothing when finding town. Town targeted by cop is more likely to be nightkilled due to notification.
Emma Planck should target Cop N0, Medic N2 (if still alive). Fake cop claims should be denied by Emma Planck, not the actual cop.
If you have been targeted by Cecilia Shariac, make sure to publicly reveal this, but keep the identity of the person with this role a secret until someone town dies from that role. Verify or deny claims made for that role if someone claims.
All false claims should lead to getting lynched, this way, Theresa Apocalypse can identify mafia that make true role claims if their Honkai Core's ability type differs from their original role ability. Roles are also unique, so if someone claims to be your role, they are lying.
Now for the rest of the roles, note that offensive roles should not be used lightly, especially N0.
Not sure how using this ability is not scummy.
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
Useful for scum to tip the voting scales in their favor. People should lynch vote every day, even with this role.
Coordinate with info roles to kill people.
Seems like an overpowered scum ability to protect their entire team from cop. Please do not use this ability.
Allows you to verify if the player's role claim matches their ability type. If not, claim and lynch.
Allows scum to take a town down with them, not sure what the most useful usage for town is. Best to just leave the ability be or try to drag down someone scummy with a likely NK target.
With how many offensive abilities there are, this practically feels like suicide to use at random. Using this on other defensive roles or cop (why???) should be perceived as scummy.
If everyone suddenly wants you dead on a night, this will eliminate them all. Veruy useful if you will be the next nightkill target.
Kills, plain and simple.
Please do not claim to be the role you received, unless explicitly mentioning this role as well. See received role for suggested usage of that role.
Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
Can likely be used freely. Please do not target power roles to prevent outing them to mafia.
Can be used freely. Most useful when used on individual players to spy them using 2 abilities during one night (=mafia).
Can be used freely.
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
No usage.
If you can predict whom gets lynched this ability is extremely useful, but after obtaining new abilities soem informative roles may perceive you as scum. Avoid using two abilities in one night.
There is a lot to add (or modify) to my list of brief suggestions, so I would love to see some discussion on role usage. I wrote this before roles were revealed, so you won't find any soft-claims in this post.
I would not hard claim straight away if i was a cop and found mafia. Unless its in latter stages of mafia.
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Haven't even read TorB's guide yet but would like to say that we could already agree on a lynch this night to give Sin Mal a boost.
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I still support firing in the above described way at some point if a better target isn't clear to the shooter. Which you seem to be against hardline, TorB?
Nah, mostly the argument you used last mafia. Using vigi on someone that would get modkilled anyway, in the hopes of town cred. That's how I read it, anyway.
I would not hard claim straight away if i was a cop and found mafia. Unless its in latter stages of mafia.
I guess it depends on how early one expects mafia to find out about the cop. If cop takes info to the grave, that would be a shame. Mafia Emma Planck could identify whom the cop is N0.
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Haven't even read TorB's guide yet but would like to say that we could already agree on a lynch this night to give Sin Mal a boost.
not worth finding a target this early and being set on it. It just means the role gets transfered and we lose a player. hows that beneficial to town??
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www I would typically agree but also I think a mid day 1 cop hard claim on a scum find from n0 has definite advantages if you are a high profile player or hit a high profile mafia player. It would solve 33% of the team we're searching for and if enough day 1 is allowed to play prior to such claim it forces teammates if the mafia to make hard decisions early about how to handle the proposition of losing a third of their team out of the gate. Also the doc could play the 50\50 game on protecting to try to survive the cop about two nights to get another peek?
But in general I tend to agree that instant hard claim of a found scum is typically the wrong play.
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yh on that note, as doc is EoR, should not use it this night incase cop has to claim next day. Can do n2 protection that way. Or just use it this night and bluff the cop proc next day. Yay for playing with mafia heads and confusing them.
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/ nvm doc is ER
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It's time to start highlighting some important roles and group the other roles by category as well as suggest their intended usage. Deviating from this intended usage will likely be perceived as scummy, so speak up if you disagree instead of simply ignoring my advice.
Cop: Durandal
Medic: Fu Hua
Cop targets are publicly notified the day after and they cannot be lynchvoted that day. My suggestion is to hard-claim when finding a mafia, say nothing when finding town. Town targeted by cop is more likely to be nightkilled due to notification. You don't need to hardclaim since it is publicly announced in the thread if you find scum.
Emma Planck should target Cop N0, Medic N2 (if still alive). Fake cop claims should be denied by Emma Planck, not the actual cop. I find Emma to be a very useful role but for a 1on1 trade with scum easily worth sacrificing. Also, remmeber that there are two cops in this game. Theresa is more powerful but has to claim after finding scum.
If you have been targeted by Cecilia Shariac, make sure to publicly reveal this, but keep the identity of the person with this role a secret until someone town dies from that role. Verify or deny claims made for that role if someone claims. Sure claim, not sure that the targetted player learns the player's name, though.
All false claims should lead to getting lynched, this way, Theresa Apocalypse can identify mafia that make true role claims if their Honkai Core's ability type differs from their original role ability. Roles are also unique, so if someone claims to be your role, they are lying. I don't think I understand the first bit. But I like policy lynching.
Haven't even read TorB's guide yet but would like to say that we could already agree on a lynch this night to give Sin Mal a boost.
not worth finding a target this early and being set on it. It just means the role gets transfered and we lose a player. hows that beneficial to town??
We're going to lynch someone regardless. This way we make use of that role which otherwise offers very little.
Newest post: If by cop you mean Durandal there is no need to claim since Herrschers will be made public.
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@Ian: Don't make us wait. Roll your dice and tell us who the mafia is.
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Cop claim can even wait until close to end of N1, so short before deadline that mafia has no time to react. Remember: the target cannot be lynched day 1 regardless. I just think it's a shame if cop died with info on mafia.
Isn't it the target, not the alignment that is made public? May need clarification. I read it only as the target being public, not their role.
Theresa only shows you how often a core or role can be used.
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yikes
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Cop claim can even wait until close to end of N1, so short before deadline that mafia has no time to react. Remember: the target cannot be lynched day 1 regardless. I just think it's a shame if cop died with info on mafia.
Isn't it the target, not the alignment that is made public? May need clarification. I read it only as the target being public, not their role.
Theresa only shows you how often a core or role can be used.
Well, that clarifies a lot. Durandal makes anyone unlynchable for one day, Herrschers and Valkyries alike. And I totally missed the core's ability type for Theresa. Sounded way too easy for town. Everything starts to make sense now. Still haven't read your plans in the spoilers.
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Isn't it the target, not the alignment that is made public? May need clarification. I read it only as the target being public, not their role.
This is correct. If you look at the System Messages section, you will see that Break of Dawn's public notification makes no distinction between Herrschers and Valkyries.
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Without telling what my role is, I plan to conform to TorB's guide tonight until later notice. It saved me a lot of time, so thanks.~
And I, too, would like to ask mafia to let me live tonight.
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FYI I give zero cred for all you trying to derp clear on thinking there is a night 0 NK ::)
Hint: rules say there is no n0 nk.
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FYI I give zero cred for all you trying to derp clear on thinking there is a night 0 NK ::)
Hint: rules say there is no n0 nk.
Fair, I would have only skimmed the rules and would have overlooked that part with both alignments.
But only talk for yourself. Www gets my derp clear on that one.
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Without telling what my role is, I plan to conform to TorB's guide tonight until later notice. It saved me a lot of time, so thanks.~
And I, too, would like to ask mafia to let me live tonight.
mafia cant nk today
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/rob ninjjaed me
also i wasnt talking about n0, who said that smh. i mean all the subsequent nights
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Raiden mei can make durandal semiimmortal while both live and raiden knows who durandal is (provided noone randomly kills the other person, raiden lives and of course this is only good if both exist and are town)
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also i wasnt talking about n0, who said that smh. i mean all the subsequent nights
Timing, Watson. If people spoke up not wanting to get nightkilled on Day 1, it would be out of place. Just like your plea, especially if you knew you had time to make your plea for six more days.
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Also, you totally didn't know there were no nightkills on Night 0. You can stop the bluff. ;)
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Raiden mei can make durandal semiimmortal while both live and raiden knows who durandal is (provided noone randomly kills the other person, raiden lives and of course this is only good if both exist and are town)
This plan falls apart fairly quickly even if all assumptions apply, when scum has chain lightning, so I wouldnt start with this plan earlier than necessary
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Haven't even read TorB's guide yet but would like to say that we could already agree on a lynch this night to give Sin Mal a boost.
Unless we somehow manage to catch someone acting scummy in N0 I think this is not a good idea.
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For Sin Mal, you can simply target the three players with the lowest post counts at the end of N0 for N0. Unless some interesting information comes up from N0 abilities, they are the ones most likely to get lynched from my point of view. If they do not, well, too bad.
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I probably agree with everything i omit from this quote or havent found information in those parts.
Cop: Durandal
Medic: Fu Hua
Cop targets are publicly notified the day after and they cannot be lynchvoted that day. My suggestion is to hard-claim when finding a mafia, say nothing when finding town. Town targeted by cop is more likely to be nightkilled due to notification.
agreed on not claiming if town, not sure if the claim should happen immediately after finding scum. Need to mule this over. Obv the scumalready knows they've been found at daystart, so cant catch them offguard by claiming midday. Hoping to find 2 scum is certainly optimistic and durandal has to wait for 2 whole nights before being able to claim another finding, so consideringthere is a chance raiden mei can keep her alive aswell, I guess its correct to claim after finding scum. Maybe not immediately,
cuz while the scum already knows its happening, town might actually townspew themselves.
Coordinate with info roles to kill people.
Bookmarking that i need to think about this one.
Seems like an overpowered scum ability to protect their entire team from cop. Please do not use this ability.
There isnt much that prevents abilities, so if any nonkilling ability fails the hunt for yae sakura is on, as this ability shouldnt be used by town unless i am overlooking sth
Allows you to verify if the player's role claim matches their ability type. If not, claim and lynch.
Yh, def dont fps as town in this game and claim truthfully. This way if theresa finds that ability type doesnt match a scum is found.
Allows scum to take a town down with them, not sure what the most useful usage for town is. Best to just leave the ability be or try to drag down someone scummy with a likely NK target.
This ability probably doesnt involve the lynch. Mathematically its correct to use that ability every night on 2 other players as town, hoping one of them is scum (same argument as the cycle vig that you still dont believe). This can also mske you conftown under certain circumstances.
With how many offensive abilities there are, this practically feels like suicide to use at random. Using this on other defensive roles or cop (why???) should be perceived as scummy.
Technically using it on cop removes the need for sprculstion on alignement but def not a good play. Then sgain it does lrt you know who the cop is without publicly revealing it. Prob not worth though.
If everyone suddenly wants you dead on a night, this will eliminate them all. Veruy useful if you will be the next nightkill target.
Will kill at most 1 scum really but coulf kill a lot of town used at the wrong time.
Kills, plain and simple.
While you already advocate very conservative use of these types of abilities its actually correct here. Use to shoot conf scum found by durandal and get a free shot.
Please do not claim to be the role you received, unless explicitly mentioning this role as well. See received role for suggested usage of that role.
Some interesting interactions with potential duplicate roles here, to be adressed later.
Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
Can likely be used freely. Please do not target power roles to prevent outing them to mafia.
Can be used freely.
the highrolly way to use it would be as you said in the part i accidentally deleted. Well actually the highest roll would be to witness 3 people use 6 abiloties and immediately out the entire scumteam. In praxis its better to start wide, divide and conquer and narrow down over time on the people that seem to use more abilities. Interestingly this will likely give seele the same ability, allowing you to compare your findings when one claims. A very interesting ability that is its own minigame and probably deserves a whole post dedicated to it.
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
not sure how you would protect them other than diverting the lynch, when you cant even know their alignement. This ability is mostly used to catch fake claims.
No usage.
Well, technically timing of revealing what youve known from the start is crucial.
If you can predict whom gets lynched this ability is extremely useful, but after obtaining new abilities soem informative roles may perceive you as scum. Avoid using two abilities in one night.
well if you are ever successfull you pretty much have to use 2 abilities to not miss out. 3 uses are enough to last half the game pretty much. We could make a policy to stop using the main ability(or the other one) after obtaining one, but it doesnt seem worth, since sin mal is exceptionally difficult to fakeclaim.
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I am very confused about roles. Not on functionality or anything, I just can't follow all the names and it makes my head spin. High chance I will post something nonsensical at some point.
Will post some thoughts on TorB's post about role usage later.
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Rita can force honkai cores to target her, which has potential especially when tsrgeted by lieserl
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:earth :life :fire :fire
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A few people have expressed some confusion over what constitutes an ability use.
To use an ability, simply send me a PM. If your targets are valid, your ability is not on cooldown, and you have uses remaining, you will attempt to use that ability. You cannot use the same ability more than once per round (even in the case of #U abilities), but you can use more than one ability on the same night, if you have multiple. Because passives can never be manually activated, they can also never be used (for the purpose of abilities that check whether an ability was activated) and cannot be disabled, except by your death. If you fail to use your ability (most commonly because of Time Fracture or Consecrate Ground), it will be treated as though you simply did not activate your ability. If you send me an invalid command, like targeting yourself with an ability that cannot do so, I will tell you this, but if you do not update your action it will be treated as though you did not activate your ability.
Rose Petals is a special case. If all conditions for Rose Petals are met, and your ability has a lower priority than Rose Petals, you will be compelled to use your abilities on Rita, regardless of any instructions you may have provided. Note that in very rare circumstances, this may cause abilities to fail when they otherwise would not. (For example, if Rita is affected by Consecrate Ground but your original target was not, you will receive the message for being compelled by Rose Petals, as well as the message for your ability failing, and your ability use will be refunded as if you simply did not activate your ability.) Keep in mind that Rose Petals only checks to see if the ability can target one player, not whether it currently is, so it will affect abilities that target "up to three" players, or "any number of players" in the case of Radio Wave.
The rulings section has been updated.
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Rate up is a lie
/me hisses
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I implore you guys to not fucking lie about your role. This setup more so than others I think, it would make our lives easier. I hate that this has to be said.
Again, don't lie. Unless you scum, then do whatever the fuck you want, I don't care.
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For Sin Mal, you can simply target the three players with the lowest post counts at the end of N0 for N0. Unless some interesting information comes up from N0 abilities, they are the ones most likely to get lynched from my point of view. If they do not, well, too bad.
You cannot use the same ability more than once per round (even in the case of #U abilities), but you can use more than one ability on the same night, if you have multiple.
I re-read Sin Mal and you can only target one player at a time, it seems. I still get the "too bad" vibe, though. We do not even know the alignment of Sin Mal, so I see no reason to agree on a lynch beforehand.
Can be used freely.
the highrolly way to use it would be as you said in the part i accidentally deleted. Well actually the highest roll would be to witness 3 people use 6 abiloties and immediately out the entire scumteam. In praxis its better to start wide, divide and conquer and narrow down over time on the people that seem to use more abilities. Interestingly this will likely give seele the same ability, allowing you to compare your findings when one claims. A very interesting ability that is its own minigame and probably deserves a whole post dedicated to it.
Scum may intentionally avoid using two abilities in one night for most nights, to prevent revealing themselves to information roles. So just because 3 people use 6 abilities in one night, if you target a group of 6 people with 7 ability uses total (including those 3), finding less than 3 ability uses the next night on a subset of 3 people tells you nothing about those people (positive confirms, negative does not deny).
Instead of writing an entire post about it, I just left a hint at how it can be useful and left it at that. People will use abilities at their own discretion regardless, so I will not bother thinking it out loud. Or even think about it at all if I do not have this role.
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
not sure how you would protect them other than diverting the lynch, when you cant even know their alignement. This ability is mostly used to catch fake claims.
Well, they are only power roles in hands of town. You cannot know their alignment and you cannot do much to protect them, so just subtle things. Even just not lynchvoting them helps.
No usage.
Well, technically timing of revealing what youve known from the start is crucial.
I thought about this, but did not think of anything useful to put here and there is no ability use, so no need to discuss whether and how to use it. Catching liars with fake claims can be good.
If you can predict whom gets lynched this ability is extremely useful, but after obtaining new abilities soem informative roles may perceive you as scum. Avoid using two abilities in one night.
well if you are ever successfull you pretty much have to use 2 abilities to not miss out. 3 uses are enough to last half the game pretty much. We could make a policy to stop using the main ability(or the other one) after obtaining one, but it doesnt seem worth, since sin mal is exceptionally difficult to fakeclaim.
As long as people are being truthful about roles, I guess. Still, even a Sin Mal claim does not mean they are not scum, it just means they could potentially use an additional ability when not scum.
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Good morning, gents. Feels good to be back, although I kinda miss being in god mode :P
After a short scan of TorB's ideas there are no parts I disagree with or stand out as controversial. Also worth mentioning I'm principally against a rushed vig on such a thin basis as we have N0. That is borderline scummy to me. Otherwise, I don't have too much to add at this stage.
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I have a trash role :cwy:
I have no idea if it's the worst, since I lack the patience to read the wall of text, but it's pretty damn bad.
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i'm writing this here for future reference: if a cc is forced between durandals or other important roles, know what a roleswap is and how to use it if need be. we need to divert attention from the real durandal (if in the game) as much as possible, which is obvious, so lie about who is what if we are forced into a situation where they need to claim to out a counterclaim. softing is also beneficial. (or don't, and trip them up)
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(https://i.imgur.com/AyLR30g.png)
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Not sure how using this ability is not scummy.
Can be used to roleblock offensive Herrscher roles?
Coordinate with info roles to kill people.
Would require using more than one targeting role, and less reliable and resourceful or abilities than a lynch. Much more beneficial for scum than town.
Seems like an overpowered scum ability to protect their entire team from cop. Please do not use this ability.
Can be beneficial for town as long as it doesn't coincide with Durandal target. Yae should out a list of targets here and Durandal investigates outside of it.
Allows you to verify if the player's role claim matches their ability type. If not, claim and lynch.
Has great synergy with Emma; Emma can find a role, and Theresa can check for a different ability type than they're supposed to have to check for Honkai Core.
Allows scum to take a town down with them, not sure what the most useful usage for town is. Best to just leave the ability be or try to drag down someone scummy with a likely NK target.
Can be used in conjunction with Durandal target to link Durandal to his target if they come up Herrscher on a night where Hua's ability is on cooldown.
With how many offensive abilities there are, this practically feels like suicide to use at random. Using this on other defensive roles or cop (why???) should be perceived as scummy.
Can ask for Hua protection and pull a killing ability like Rozaliya's to them to negate it.
Please do not claim to be the role you received, unless explicitly mentioning this role as well. See received role for suggested usage of that role.
Can stagger Hua saves with Hua if both are town sided. Very useful.
Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
Can confirm self with Theresa (in a 4/5 chance)(assuming both are town).
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
Both can be Herrscher.
No usage.
I disagree; if someone claims, Cocolia can verify this. only concern would be a fake or maf Cocolia.
If you can predict whom gets lynched this ability is extremely useful, but after obtaining new abilities soem informative roles may perceive you as scum. Avoid using two abilities in one night.
Can be very useful if Hua or Durandal flip Herrscher.
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There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
If Seele outs and Hua uses their save on Seele n0/n1, assuming that it's successful, we can have staggered docs such that there isn't a round in which someone isn't saved until they kill one of the docs. This could be useful a bit later in the game. We could also infinitely chain the docs on each other as long as Raiden is town sided and doesn't drive one of them away from the other. A town Liliya could further solidify this strat assuming that the Raiden is still town sided, as the Raiden can drive the Flash Counter from Liliya onto another player. Will need confirmation from sky on that one.
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Not sure how using this ability is not scummy.
Can be used to roleblock offensive Herrscher roles?
If you already know they are Herrscher, they should be lynched. There are some cases where it may be good to use as town (an extremely likely Herrscher doesn't get lynched), but I will not advocate its use.
Seems like an overpowered scum ability to protect their entire team from cop. Please do not use this ability.
Can be beneficial for town as long as it doesn't coincide with Durandal target. Yae should out a list of targets here and Durandal investigates outside of it.
This sounds like a bad plan. All the targets will be immune to Fu Hua, allowing mafia a choice of guaranteed NKs. Raiden Mei takes priority and could potentially move the NK elsewhere (including Herrscher), but you would effectively be nullifying Fu Hua.
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
Both can be Herrscher.
As I mentioned before, subtle things. Like not forcing Durandal to counterclaim if someone thinks a fake Durandal claim will save them from getting lynched, but having Emma Planck do it. If you need to choose between lynching one of two people of unknown alignment, of which one has a role that is really useful to town if they are town, you choose the other.
No usage.
I disagree; if someone claims, Cocolia can verify this. only concern would be a fake or maf Cocolia.
I'm not saying the information is useless, I am saying you do not need tips on ability usage for an ability that is passive.
There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
That's basically what I was saying on Theresa. You do not even need Emma Planck for this. As long as people are truthful about their role claims, anyone that has claimed will be a viable target. That's one of the reasons I'm being so insistent on truthful role claims.
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We could also infinitely chain the docs on each other as long as Raiden is town sided and doesn't drive one of them away from the other.
Minor town points for Coffee for coming up with a doc chain idea, though I have yet to check what these roles actually do and how viable this is.
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I implore you guys to not fucking lie about your role. This setup more so than others I think, it would make our lives easier. I hate that this has to be said.
Again, don't lie. Unless you scum, then do whatever the fuck you want, I don't care.
I claim Zilean.
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I claim Zilean.
For anyone wondering what this means, Zilean was a role in a different mafia, where claiming Zilean was relevant for forgotten reasons.
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I implore you guys to not fucking lie about your role. This setup more so than others I think, it would make our lives easier. I hate that this has to be said.
Again, don't lie. Unless you scum, then do whatever the fuck you want, I don't care.
I claim Zilean.
Durandal you should target him and make him UNLYNCHABLE
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Jokes aside, I like that idea. Investigating Linkcat Night 0 is a big plus in my eye.
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I have a question to those who analyzed the roles more than I did. Is there any drawback of discussing Cop targets? Can mafia intercept it without giving away one of their roles?
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Core of Lightning
Raiden
Himeko
Yae
Lieserl
^ Mafia Cores/Roles that may potentially be a problem
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You can intercept it, have it aid in identifying cop, have it aid in killing the target and more. Cop should not target an agreed upon person.
Also keep in mind that mafia may reduce the potential number of confirmed town asap by NK-ing those that have been targeted by Durandal but were not mafia, I think.
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If Seele outs and Hua uses their save on Seele n0/n1, assuming that it's successful, we can have staggered docs such that there isn't a round in which someone isn't saved until they kill one of the docs. This could be useful a bit later in the game. We could also infinitely chain the docs on each other as long as Raiden is town sided and doesn't drive one of them away from the other. A town Liliya could further solidify this strat assuming that the Raiden is still town sided, as the Raiden can drive the Flash Counter from Liliya onto another player. Will need confirmation from sky on that one.
Would likely get neutered by mafia if they have any ability which supercedes the Doctor's ability (at least 4, more depending on how precedence works), especially if they have a good mafia role that does nothing for town
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Core of Lightning
Raiden
Himeko
Yae
Lieserl
^ Mafia Cores/Roles that may potentially be a problem
Ughh, you made me look up what these roles do.
Core of Lightning can identify the cop, which is admittedly bad if the cop does not immediately find mafia.
Raiden on an agreed cop target can only be mafia. It gives the information to town that a Raiden is mafia.
Himeko on agreed cop target essentially gives away that a Himeko is mafia. And if cop is about to target mafia, they won't use it.
Yae is a wildcard, because a failed ability is vague enough to backtrack it to a single role. But if we do, we know a Yae is mafia.
Why did you list Lieserl here? Mafia knows that the target was targeted by a cop, but won't know which player has the cop.
The only good reasons why I think discussing cop targets is not good are the following:
- Core of Lightning, because if the cop does not find mafia, we lose the cop in the following two nights.
- Yae can block it without making it easy to figure out it was Yae.
- You could argue that identifying a role to be mafia is not worth delaying the cop for one night. If you are that kind of person.
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Sorry I mistook Liserl for a Dragonfly-type ability and thought they could see names
And look what I made you do :^) jkjk im sorry
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I read the roles in a bit more detail. The thing that stood out the most (that I haven't seen discussed yet) is how much Emma deters scum from doing something that would lead to a role hunt (see me in the last game). Of course using it to role hunt would delay identifying Durandal and Fu Hua but it might still be worth it.
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There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
That's basically what I was saying on Theresa. You do not even need Emma Planck for this. As long as people are truthful about their role claims, anyone that has claimed will be a viable target. That's one of the reasons I'm being so insistent on truthful role claims.
We can’t rely on the honesty of others claiming their roles. Mafia have 5 roles to potentially hide in, and this method can confirm someone as mafia if their ability type differs from that of their role. There’s no reason not to utilize this second cop. Will respond to others and more points when i am not on mobile
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I read the roles in a bit more detail. The thing that stood out the most (that I haven't seen discussed yet) is how much Emma deters scum from doing something that would lead to a role hunt (see me in the last game). Of course using it to role hunt would delay identifying Durandal and Fu Hua but it might still be worth it.
There is no reason to hunt for a specific role yet N0, but it's a valid alternative suggestion for N2 if it comes down to it. Better than Fu Hua if it can determine scum. The best part is that the ability does not target players, meaning it cannot be blocked unless you specifically target Emma.
There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
That's basically what I was saying on Theresa. You do not even need Emma Planck for this. As long as people are truthful about their role claims, anyone that has claimed will be a viable target. That's one of the reasons I'm being so insistent on truthful role claims.
We can’t rely on the honesty of others claiming their roles. Mafia have 5 roles to potentially hide in, and this method can confirm someone as mafia if their ability type differs from that of their role. There’s no reason not to utilize this second cop. Will respond to others and more points when i am not on mobile
That is what I want to establish the you lie you die part for. Mafia does not know all the roles other than their own they can pose as. I'm not saying you should not use it or trust role claims, I'm saying you should point out players whose type differs from their claim and lynch them. Either they lied about their role, or they are mafia.
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We can’t rely on the honesty of others claiming their roles. Mafia have 5 roles to potentially hide in, and this method can confirm someone as mafia if their ability type differs from that of their role. There’s no reason not to
On phone to say that I disagree. 18 players, 20 roles, and I was recently reminded that roles are not duplicated. Two roles are unused in the game, and unless mafia knows what those two roles are, they will high chance claim an already existing role. It leads to a 50-50 where one is mafia and the other is town. I like those odds.
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A town Liliya could further solidify this strat assuming that the Raiden is still town sided, as the Raiden can drive the Flash Counter from Liliya onto another player. Will need confirmation from sky on that one.
For the purposes of this game, abilities do not target unless they specifically say that they do. As such, Flash Counter, Atomic Signature, and all passive abilities do not target.
The rulings section has been updated.
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We can’t rely on the honesty of others claiming their roles. Mafia have 5 roles to potentially hide in, and this method can confirm someone as mafia if their ability type differs from that of their role. There’s no reason not to
On phone to say that I disagree. 18 players, 20 roles, and I was recently reminded that roles are not duplicated. Two roles are unused in the game, and unless mafia knows what those two roles are, they will high chance claim an already existing role. It leads to a 50-50 where one is mafia and the other is town. I like those odds.
So much this. Roles not being duplicated is a gamechanger. I wouldn't advice to be throwing roleclaims around yet, but the principle of lynch all liars is more relevant this game than ever.
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Some niche scenarios can occur due to duplication of roles by Seele Vollerei and Sin Mal. Interaction between two or more players with the same ability is listed below.
- Time Fracture: If they target each other, both will lose the ability to vote on the following day.
- Phantom Image: If both abilities target the exact same two players, they effectively cancel out and no swap will happen that night. If both abilities share one target, that player will be affected by any abilities targeting either of the other targets, as well as any abilities that would target them. (For example, if one Mei targets Players A and B, and another targets Players B and C, anything that targets one of those three players will target Player B instead.) This can result in an ability having fewer targets than before. (Continuing the previous example, if Kallen Kaslana targets both Players A and B with Red Thread of Fate, only Player B will be affected, which effectively does nothing.)
- Consecrate Ground: All targets of both abilities will be affected. No interference occurs.
- Red Thread of Fate: If they share targets, and one of the targets dies, all targets will die, as expected.
- Rose Petals: If they target the same player, nothing happens at all. Rose Petals only affects abilities with a lower priority, meaning it will not affect Rose Petals abilities of other players.
- Abyssal Flower: Tracked independently per player. See the Rulings section for more details.
- Theory of Relativity: Only excludes self from the results, not other uses of Theory of Relativity. In other words, if both players target the same player, they will learn that Theory of Relativity was used on their target.
All other abilities work as expected, and should not cause confusion.
The rulings section has been updated.
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I agree that cop should call out scum. This gives us confirmed town, who are also likely high-profile players that can be protected, or a 1-for-1 trade* with scum with the potential to further mess with NK.
That is assuming cop is town which I don't think is guaranteed in this set-up. Nevertheless, we should absolutely protect cop should he get outed.
Useful for scum to tip the voting scales in their favor. People should lynch vote every day, even with this role.
Saving your vote should be fine if there is a long enough wagon at EOD.
Allows you to verify if the player's role claim matches their ability type. If not, claim and lynch.
Again, I am in favour of policy lynching.
Allows scum to take a town down with them, not sure what the most useful usage for town is. Best to just leave the ability be or try to drag down someone scummy with a likely NK target.
Taking someone with you is a good play more often than not. Can also be used to confirm town. I.e. you are able to target two other players.
Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
Is the sole purpose of this role to be able to confirm your role? At later stages you might get to snipe some players, though.
Can likely be used freely. Please do not target power roles to prevent outing them to mafia.
Are you talking about the possibility of scum Shigure? I lean towards using this role as much as possible and gather information / find people lying about their roles.
Can be used freely. Most useful when used on individual players to spy them using 2 abilities during one night (=mafia).
Using this ability on more than one person at a time increases the speed at which you can parse through players. More than three drastically increases the chance of someone not using their ability or having a passive ability. Starting N1 this becomes unclear, though, since EoR messes with this. I guess going 3, then 2 the following nights is fine, unless you are suspicious of a specific person.
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
By helping I suspect you mean protecting from lynching? Extremely powerful role, especially in the wrong hands.
If you can predict whom gets lynched this ability is extremely useful, but after obtaining new abilities soem informative roles may perceive you as scum. Avoid using two abilities in one night.
The latter part is void. But as TorB said later in this thread using it on ~inactive folks seems like the best use. I don't expect too much out of it anymore. Following through on a plan that's build on little information and is prone to being manipulated is tough. I won't further perpetuate my earlier idea.
All in all, I thought it would read more like a plan than an analysis. But it's solid groundwork.
If everyone suddenly wants you dead on a night, this will eliminate them all. Veruy useful if you will be the next nightkill target.
Will kill at most 1 scum really but coulf kill a lot of town used at the wrong time.
Purely by numbers a losing gamble until later in the game. Good catch.
There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
It can confirm Sin Mal but that should be it. Otherwise I like the theory-crafting in this post and the role analysis before that. It's just a bit too much for me at the moment to fully immerse myself.
I have a question to those who analyzed the roles more than I did. Is there any drawback of discussing Cop targets? Can mafia intercept it without giving away one of their roles?
Possibly giving away a role and finding out who cop is is totally worth it for mafia.
Also keep in mind that mafia may reduce the potential number of confirmed town asap by NK-ing those that have been targeted by Durandal but were not mafia, I think.
Fortunately, mafia does not have a guaranteed NK in this iteration. But confirmed town surely feels like Linkcat on a hot tin roof.
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Can likely be used freely. Please do not target power roles to prevent outing them to mafia.
Are you talking about the possibility of scum Shigure? I lean towards using this role as much as possible and gather information / find people lying about their roles.
This was based on my misunderstanding of the role, which I rectified after clarification. I had the idea that if at least one person would target Shigure Kira, everyone involved would know everyone's identity. Can be used freely since you will only learn the identity of the one targeting you and those targeting you will only know Shigure's identity.
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We can’t rely on the honesty of others claiming their roles. Mafia have 5 roles to potentially hide in, and this method can confirm someone as mafia if their ability type differs from that of their role. There’s no reason not to
On phone to say that I disagree. 18 players, 20 roles, and I was recently reminded that roles are not duplicated. Two roles are unused in the game, and unless mafia knows what those two roles are, they will high chance claim an already existing role. It leads to a 50-50 where one is mafia and the other is town. I like those odds.
The mafia know 3 of their roles, and there’s a 2/17 chance that they claim a role not taken. It’s reasonably possible that they’ll claim a role already taken, but they could also roleswap in each other’s roles, and what if someone claims an important role like hua, durandal or emma? we lynch in ccs and possible mislynch a power role to the greater detriment of the town.
There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
That's basically what I was saying on Theresa. You do not even need Emma Planck for this. As long as people are truthful about their role claims, anyone that has claimed will be a viable target. That's one of the reasons I'm being so insistent on truthful role claims.
We can’t rely on the honesty of others claiming their roles. Mafia have 5 roles to potentially hide in, and this method can confirm someone as mafia if their ability type differs from that of their role. There’s no reason not to utilize this second cop. Will respond to others and more points when i am not on mobile
That is what I want to establish the you lie you die part for. Mafia does not know all the roles other than their own they can pose as. I'm not saying you should not use it or trust role claims, I'm saying you should point out players whose type differs from their claim and lynch them. Either they lied about their role, or they are mafia.
[/quote]how could important power roles ever hide? if someone is forcing a player who rolled durandal to claim, how are we to hide them in other roles? also, am i understanding you correctly that you think we don’t need the emma confirmation? what happens in the event that theresa rolled maf and lies to get someone lynched? they could blame it on the person lying about their role.
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how could important power roles ever hide? if someone is forcing a player who rolled durandal to claim, how are we to hide them in other roles? also, am i understanding you correctly that you think we don’t need the emma confirmation? what happens in the event that theresa rolled maf and lies to get someone lynched? they could blame it on the person lying about their role.
It's not like everyone needs to claim. In fact, the reason people shouldn't claim too early is for this very purpose. You don't need to lie for this.
If someone gets lynched as the role they claimed (role is revealed on death), we have just outed a mafia Theresa, it's a major victory from my point of view.
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how could important power roles ever hide? if someone is forcing a player who rolled durandal to claim, how are we to hide them in other roles? also, am i understanding you correctly that you think we don’t need the emma confirmation? what happens in the event that theresa rolled maf and lies to get someone lynched? they could blame it on the person lying about their role.
It's not like everyone needs to claim. In fact, the reason people shouldn't claim too early is for this very purpose. You don't need to lie for this.
If someone gets lynched as the role they claimed (role is revealed on death), we have just outed a mafia Theresa, it's a major victory from my point of view.
I just feel as if in order for someone to claim something and get lynched after, that would mean the town is forcing someone to claim, right? It’s as if you’re suggesting that at some point, the town will force someone to claim and for theresa to put their report on them, and then we either catch a scum which isn’t a bad thing or catch a lying scummy theresa. I think we’re just agreeing here, other than my distaste at forcing someone to claim.
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The mafia know 3 of their roles, and there’s a 2/17 chance that they claim a role not taken. It’s reasonably possible that they’ll claim a role already taken, but they could also roleswap in each other’s roles, and what if someone claims an important role like hua, durandal or emma? we lynch in ccs and possible mislynch a power role to the greater detriment of the town.
First of all, why would they ever swap their claimed roles? Mafia swapping claims with other mafia has zero benefit and hurts them more than anything else.
And if they claim an important role, it will still be a 50-50, and no role is so important that I wouldn't trade them in for a guaranteed mafia kill. Not to mention that if we lynch mafia from the 50-50, we not only kill a mafia but also soft-confirm a town.
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By the way, the scenario I'm talking about is a late-game mass roleclaim. Nothing that is relevant right now.
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I just feel as if in order for someone to claim something and get lynched after, that would mean the town is forcing someone to claim, right? It’s as if you’re suggesting that at some point, the town will force someone to claim and for theresa to put their report on them, and then we either catch a scum which isn’t a bad thing or catch a lying scummy theresa. I think we’re just agreeing here, other than my distaste at forcing someone to claim.
Town does not need to force claims out of people just for this reason. In the event of there being no relevant claims, like right now, Theresa can also gather information that does not become relevant until after the claim.
The mafia know 3 of their roles, and there’s a 2/17 chance that they claim a role not taken. It’s reasonably possible that they’ll claim a role already taken, but they could also roleswap in each other’s roles, and what if someone claims an important role like hua, durandal or emma? we lynch in ccs and possible mislynch a power role to the greater detriment of the town.
First of all, why would they ever swap their claimed roles? Mafia swapping claims with other mafia has zero benefit and hurts them more than anything else.
And if they claim an important role, it will still be a 50-50, and no role is so important that I wouldn't trade them in for a guaranteed mafia kill. Not to mention that if we lynch mafia from the 50-50, we not only kill a mafia but also soft-confirm a town.
I think it's way too risky due to the ability to detect which role someone has from certain town roles, but you could swap mafia roles to make that role type match their core type.
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Equivalent to mafia casting Red Thread of Fate on themselves. Mafia do that please
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I just feel as if in order for someone to claim something and get lynched after, that would mean the town is forcing someone to claim, right? It’s as if you’re suggesting that at some point, the town will force someone to claim and for theresa to put their report on them, and then we either catch a scum which isn’t a bad thing or catch a lying scummy theresa. I think we’re just agreeing here, other than my distaste at forcing someone to claim.
Town does not need to force claims out of people just for this reason. In the event of there being no relevant claims, like right now, Theresa can also gather information that does not become relevant until after the claim.
That’s a fair point and I agree that that’s the best play for a town Theresa right now.
The mafia know 3 of their roles, and there’s a 2/17 chance that they claim a role not taken. It’s reasonably possible that they’ll claim a role already taken, but they could also roleswap in each other’s roles, and what if someone claims an important role like hua, durandal or emma? we lynch in ccs and possible mislynch a power role to the greater detriment of the town.
First of all, why would they ever swap their claimed roles? Mafia swapping claims with other mafia has zero benefit and hurts them more than anything else.
And if they claim an important role, it will still be a 50-50, and no role is so important that I wouldn't trade them in for a guaranteed mafia kill. Not to mention that if we lynch mafia from the 50-50, we not only kill a mafia but also soft-confirm a town.
I would argue that there are scenarios in which certain roles might oust information due to being cc’d. For example, we would want to know who Theresa cc’s were on and their reports to determine who to lynch or gain information before one of them dies. This might give valuable role info to the maf. As far as role swapping goes, torb makes a really good point about matching the ability types. What i was thinking more was hiding an important role like killing roles until an information role comes forward to call out the lie, and then the maf can kill the baited out investigator.
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Coffee trying to escape that N1 Oty ;)
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Coffee trying to escape that N1 Oty ;)
I would have n0'd Ge0 last game if this coffee had shown up there. :D are you feeling motivated as a different alignment coffee? ::)
All this mechanics talk... I take from it an agreement about no roleclaiming unless necessary and no mass claiming advantage present until later, if ever. Also, cop should probably claim a red peek or scum result asap. Any other major mechanical points I'm missing in this banter?
Link you're unusually quite so far - what gives eh?
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Town's gonna win even with a N0 mass :^)
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Coffee trying to escape that N1 Oty ;)
I would have n0'd Ge0 last game if this coffee had shown up there. :D are you feeling motivated as a different alignment coffee? ::)
All this mechanics talk... I take from it an agreement about no roleclaiming unless necessary and no mass claiming advantage present until later, if ever. Also, cop should probably claim a red peek or scum result asap. Any other major mechanical points I'm missing in this banter?
Link you're unusually quite so far - what gives eh?
Are you feeling demotivated cause of a different alignment? Been quiet so sad :silly: tho i do like lack this quiet rob more :D
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All this mechanics talk... I take from it an agreement about no roleclaiming unless necessary and no mass claiming advantage present until later, if ever. Also, cop should probably claim a red peek or scum result asap. Any other major mechanical points I'm missing in this banter?
This is what I'm getting too. Nothing unusual from TorB nor are there any significant ideas contradicting to mine yet. It's still only N0, and these roles are too new for me being able to comfortable flesh out new ideas as of today.
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This is a distinctively different Coffeeditto than the one I remember from the last couple of mafias, though, where he kept rolling town... Although I guess that's probably just a result of more free time.
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did he graduate
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This is a distinctively different Coffeeditto than the one I remember from the last couple of mafias, though, where he kept rolling town... Although I guess that's probably just a result of more free time.
there is a prior mafia game #[redacted for raisins] here where coffee was not town and was a bit active like this. However I have I think too little of experience sample playing with coffee to try to activity or meta read him this early (if at all). Great news coffee I don't think I shoot you n0 this game.... If I am vig (and if you're town), that is. \thumbsup
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Wow quiet you die, and if you talk you get sussed cause it’s not “normal†poor coffee
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Wow quiet you die, and if you talk you get sussed cause it’s not “normal†poor coffee
If you are coffee you die :silly:
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Wow quiet you die, and if you talk you get sussed cause it’s not “normal†poor coffee
interesting soft defense from coffee teammate www3. ;D. I guess you're not exactly wrong about it though except I'm actually trying to compare it to past experience albeit very loosely (admitted as much already). Shade me harder www3 or something eh? :)
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I was saying that because every mafia people ask normal inactives to speak up and they won’t judge them on that, and when someone speaks up we put them as sus :-X :'(
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Kiana Kaslana = Stronger, more scummy Warden. Use the same way.
Raiden Mei = Bad deal if mafia has it. Very strong and should be used very very lightly.
Bronya Zaychik = Graboid that charges up while burrowed. Dont unborrow until needed. We should try to hide this role.
Himeko Murata = This is Oty late game and a possible oty early game. You should use your ability when you know it will work
Yae Sakura = Warden that targets 3 people. See Kiana
Theresa Apocalypse = Basically Golden Nymph.
Fu Hua = Basically Guardian Angel
Kallen Kaslana = This is a power role. This is actually more powerful in the hands of town but also scummy if you get the wrong players. I have a feeling who ever got this role is going to be a headache late game.
Rita Rossweisse = Lmao this is a fantastic role. Whoever has this is probably paranoid AF to use it. Go wild. May RNG be with you.
Liliya Olenyeva = so pretty much, just hardclaim GN then use your ability. GG ez
Rozaliya Olenyeva = Oty
Seele Vollerei = Fate egg with extra steps.
Durandal = Another GN ability
Cecilia Schariac = Toadfish with more power. If you get targeted, do not reveal name.
Shigure Kira = fly on the wall but really its on yourself
Frederica Tesla = Dragonfly but way better
Lieserl Einstein = Literally just dragonfly
Emma Planck = Scion but OP
Cocolia = Reveal your findings on N2 i say
Sin Mal = Vulture but better.
This is for me to reflect on. I know torb already did something like this but here is my take. This also helps me to remember the roles better.
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I was saying that because every mafia people ask normal inactives to speak up and they won’t judge them on that, and when someone speaks up we put them as sus :-X :'(
I mean right now there isn't much I know so I'm sus on everyone at this point. Is this a problem though? I suspect inactive people to try to activate them so I can read an active player on which I start out suspicious of active players because I don't know whose side they're on. ;)
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Kiana Kaslana = Stronger, more scummy Warden. Use the same way.
Raiden Mei = Bad deal if mafia has it. Very strong and should be used very very lightly.
Bronya Zaychik = Graboid that charges up while burrowed. Dont unborrow until needed. We should try to hide this role.
Big difference is that this 'Graboid' is targetable
Himeko Murata = This is Oty late game and a possible oty early game. You should use your ability when you know it will work
Yae Sakura = Warden that targets 3 people. See Kiana
Theresa Apocalypse = Basically Golden Nymph.
Fu Hua = Basically Guardian Angel
Kallen Kaslana = This is a power role. This is actually more powerful in the hands of town but also scummy if you get the wrong players. I have a feeling who ever got this role is going to be a headache late game.
With enough luck I bet shock got this
Rita Rossweisse = Lmao this is a fantastic role. Whoever has this is probably paranoid AF to use it. Go wild. May RNG be with you.
Contradictory but I agree with general sentiment
Liliya Olenyeva = so pretty much, just hardclaim GN then use your ability. GG ez
LOL, why don't 'cha lead by example?
Rozaliya Olenyeva = Oty
Seele Vollerei = Fate egg with extra steps.
Durandal = Another GN ability
Cecilia Schariac = Toadfish with more power. If you get targeted, do not reveal name.
Shigure Kira = fly on the wall but really its on yourself
Frederica Tesla = Dragonfly but way better
Lieserl Einstein = Literally just dragonfly
Emma Planck = Scion but OP
Cocolia = Reveal your findings on N2 i say
Why N2 and not now then?
Sin Mal = Vulture but better.
Not exactly, you need to predict the lynch, not the NK
This is for me to reflect on. I know torb already did something like this but here is my take. This also helps me to remember the roles better.
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I am not a fan of hiding the Graboid in this game, because the increasing voting power is less useful in town's hand as dangerous it is in mafia's (or a bad town's) hands.
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I'm not seeing any benefit to a town role that increases voting power if they cannot also have special insight to alignments. Allowing a player to gain voting power risks them being scum that could wear havoc in a Mylo\LYLO scenario... And town loses if they ever are outnumbered. Actually, what IS the benefit of town abstaining from voting just to boost their voting power?
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Actually, what IS the benefit of town abstaining from voting just to boost their voting power?
In this game specifically? Nothing. It is actually harmful now, unlike in the previous mafia.
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MW- I think you were advocating hiding the voting-power-grows role? Howcome, what are we overlooking as the benefit?
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I was saying that because every mafia people ask normal inactives to speak up and they won’t judge them on that, and when someone speaks up we put them as sus :-X :'(
I’m usually not sus at people for not posting like madmen though
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MW- I think you were advocating hiding the voting-power-grows role? Howcome, what are we overlooking as the benefit?
Nothing.
You guys bring up good points. I think we shouldnt hide them.
When i read the role, i just saw it as graboid. I didnt think of mafia being able to have it actually makes it pretty scary.
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w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
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w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
Can't argue with this level of logic :P
When i read the role, i just saw it as graboid. I didnt think of mafia being able to have it actually makes it pretty scary.
Please read the roles carefully this time, they are subtler than the ones in the last game.
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w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
This is why I'm quiet rob, I already gave up since I know I can't win with this team.
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w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
This is why I'm quiet rob, I already gave up since I know I can't win with this team.
S O L V E D G A M E
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You guys already shot down my Sin Mal idea. You also don't seem to agree with my take on Bronya (save your vote if the outcome is clear). The motivation was to make the lynch less susceptible to scum manipulation.
Here's another one: Cocolia should breadcrumb the players they have information on.
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Everyone should breadcrumb everything.
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Here's another one: Cocolia should breadcrumb the players they have information on.
The only possible downside is if Cocolla gets NK'd because the crumbs can be hard to recover, but I mostly agree with this (Cocolla should still probably claim further down the line)
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You guys already shot down my Sin Mal idea. You also don't seem to agree with my take on Bronya (save your vote if the outcome is clear). The motivation was to make the lynch less susceptible to scum manipulation.
Here's another one: Cocolia should breadcrumb the players they have information on.
I agree with moe regarding hiding bronya if vote is clear, it may help if it is in a good towns hand (of which, there are a lot in this game I believe). I haven’t read over the sin mal idea completely so will comment when I do. There’s so many weird name roles q.q
A reminder to Cop that you don’t have to use ability tonight as there is no nk
Also after I am nked, don’t bother reading my posts for breadcrumb. I never breadcrumb.
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A reminder to Cop that you don’t have to use ability tonight as there is no nk
I really, really hope you meant medic. Of course cop should use.
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You guys already shot down my Sin Mal idea. You also don't seem to agree with my take on Bronya (save your vote if the outcome is clear). The motivation was to make the lynch less susceptible to scum manipulation.
Here's another one: Cocolia should breadcrumb the players they have information on.
I agree with moe regarding hiding bronya if vote is clear, it may help if it is in a good towns hand (of which, there are a lot in this game I believe). I haven’t read over the sin mal idea completely so will comment when I do. There’s so many weird name roles q.q
A reminder to Cop that you don’t have to use ability tonight as there is no nk
Also after I am nked, don’t bother reading my posts for breadcrumb. I never breadcrumb.
I wanted to flesh out a N0 lynch that we don't even manage to properly execute at EOD. So that Sin Mal can get a successsful use out of their ability. Hard to execute / get everyone behind and rob also took a lot of flak for his big play N0.
I don't want Bronya to hide, just collect voting power. Hiding only works once she hasn't voted at least once and there is a wagon at EOD, which won't happen D1
Cop should absolutely use their ability N0. Even Healer should do so to collect info for themselves and others as well.
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Bronya should really REALLY know what he’s doing if he’s hammering with invisivotes. I’m not gonna lie, I’m kinda afraid of the havoc it can wreck, especially when we won’t know who’s placing the hammer.
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Bronya should really REALLY know what he’s doing if he’s hammering with invisivotes. I’m not gonna lie, I’m kinda afraid of the havoc it can wreck, especially when we won’t know who’s placing the hammer.
We would have some idea if most people are still voting (as we can more easily track Bronya charging in the previous days). Personally I just don't think it's worth it sacrificing your voting power in the previous days for the payoff you get.
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Bronya should really REALLY know what he’s doing if he’s hammering with invisivotes. I’m not gonna lie, I’m kinda afraid of the havoc it can wreck, especially when we won’t know who’s placing the hammer.
If we need to emphasise it that much, that just shows we should not let it go out of hand. And by that, I mean I will hard vote on anyone who's not voting for more than 1 day, and I will keep a continuous tally of who haven't voted. Any more than two voting power is dangerous, even in town's hand.
@Sky: Does it count as voting if the vote is removed by the end of day?
I wanted to flesh out a N0 lynch that we don't even manage to properly execute at EOD. So that Sin Mal can get a successsful use out of their ability. Hard to execute / get everyone behind and rob also took a lot of flak for his big play N0.
I don't want Bronya to hide, just collect voting power. Hiding only works once she hasn't voted at least once and there is a wagon at EOD, which won't happen D1
Cop should absolutely use their ability N0. Even Healer should do so to collect info for themselves and others as well.
If you really wish to put this plan in motion, I suggest gathering D1 lynch statistics from previous mafias, which will show you than you cannot go wrong with Linkcat.
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EBWOP:
I wanted to flesh out a N0 lynch that we don't even manage to properly execute at EOD. So that Sin Mal can get a successsful use out of their ability. Hard to execute / get everyone behind and rob also took a lot of flak for his big play N0.
If you really wish to put this plan in motion, I suggest gathering D1 lynch statistics from previous mafias, which will show you that you cannot go wrong with Linkcat.
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A reminder to Cop that you don’t have to use ability tonight as there is no nk
I really, really hope you meant medic. Of course cop should use.
OOPS yes I meant medic my bad :cwy:
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EBWOP:
I wanted to flesh out a N0 lynch that we don't even manage to properly execute at EOD. So that Sin Mal can get a successsful use out of their ability. Hard to execute / get everyone behind and rob also took a lot of flak for his big play N0.
If you really wish to put this plan in motion, I suggest gathering D1 lynch statistics from previous mafias, which will show you that you cannot go wrong with Linkcat.
Hey, I've only been lynched twice on Day 1, once as each alignment. Day 2 on the other hand, twice as mafia and once as town. So you should wait to lynch me on Day 2. Cause that worked out so well the last game.
For anyone curious, the Day 1 town lynch was due to me trolling, two of the mafia lynches were cop checks, and the Day 2 one was a gambit that worked but actually failed because of voting power roles.
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@Sky: Does it count as voting if the vote is removed by the end of day?
Bronya Zaychik Charge Beam (Passive) Not voting increases your Voting Power by 1 the next time you do vote. This effect stacks. (This is checked at the end of the day. In other words, voting and then removing your vote later will simply count as not voting.)
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Turns out I've been NK'd the first Night 2 times and the second Night 3 times, a mirror of the first two days. I wonder if the balance will be upset this game.
I would rather just force everyone to vote and not have to worry about Bronya.
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Coffee trying to escape that N1 Oty ;)
I would have n0'd Ge0 last game if this coffee had shown up there. :D are you feeling motivated as a different alignment coffee? ::)
This is a distinctively different Coffeeditto than the one I remember from the last couple of mafias, though, where he kept rolling town... Although I guess that's probably just a result of more free time.
did he graduate
I'd like to take a game more seriously and this happens to be that game :) And no, I'm out of uni for the summer and back next fall so I do have more free time while I look for a job.
This is a distinctively different Coffeeditto than the one I remember from the last couple of mafias, though, where he kept rolling town... Although I guess that's probably just a result of more free time.
there is a prior mafia game #[redacted for raisins] here where coffee was not town and was a bit active like this. However I have I think too little of experience sample playing with coffee to try to activity or meta read him this early (if at all). Great news coffee I don't think I shoot you n0 this game.... If I am vig (and if you're town), that is. \thumbsup
thanks, rob!
Wow quiet you die, and if you talk you get sussed cause it’s not “normal†poor coffee
If you are coffee you die :silly:
yes
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A reminder to Cop that you don’t have to use ability tonight as there is no nk
I really, really hope you meant medic. Of course cop should use.
OOPS yes I meant medic my bad :cwy:
I would be willing to further argue that if we're going the strat in which Durandal always outs with a guilty, then doc shouldn't use ability this evening. They should save it for tomorrow so Durandal can get at least report out (if it's a guilty) and out another before they die. It's risky, but I would rather have a 1/15 chance to lose Durandal tonight than a 1/1 chance to lose them tomorrow if they out (seeing as how if doc hits Durandal tonight, they can't protect them again tomorrow)(there's a 1/15 chance to hit Durandal but the odds are low both ways regardless)(I would love feedback)
I'm not seeing any benefit to a town role that increases voting power if they cannot also have special insight to alignments. Allowing a player to gain voting power risks them being scum that could wear havoc in a Mylo\LYLO scenario... And town loses if they ever are outnumbered. Actually, what IS the benefit of town abstaining from voting just to boost their voting power?
There's one benefit that has the same effect as a detriment: in the event that there's a maf Durandal that hides, and the game gets into a situation where it's n maf vs n+1 town (like 3 town vs 2 maf alive) a maf Durandal can force someone not to vote and cause the vote to be forced into a NL. To circumvent this, i propose that Bronya saves one vote such that their voting power is 2 and leaves it at that. Obviously this could have drawbacks if Bronya flips maf, but so can't every plan we have.
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Bronya's voting power resets after voting, note how it says "the next time you vote", not for the rest of the game. So just keep lynchvoting and save everyone worries and headaches.
Doc is an ER ability that does not allow consecutive uses on the same target, so as long as Durandal is not targeted, its use makes no difference.
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Bronya's voting power resets after voting, note how it says "the next time you vote", not for the rest of the game. So just keep lynchvoting and save everyone worries and headaches.
I missed that. Always voting as town Bronya is best, then.
Doc is an ER ability that does not allow consecutive uses on the same target, so as long as Durandal is not targeted, its use makes no difference.
I've just remembered that there's not a nk n0 anyway, so this makes doccing tonight obsolete anyway unless mafia has killing roles. I've pointed out that the risk of hitting Durandal n0 and not being able to save them should they come forward with a scum report is dangerous; however, I'm unsure it outweighs the possiblity for saving someone.
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Doc can self-target to prevent vigi kills. Even if doc does miraculously target cop, as long as mafia expects doc to successfully use ability on cop N1, actually successfully using it is not required. There is only a 1/19 chance that a target other than doc is cop, after all.
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1/17 actually
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1/17 actually
Only if a cop is guaranteed to exist, which I do not believe is the case.
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I was bored, so I did the math. Apparently, there's a 0.75 probability of there being a civvy cop. Same probability for there being a civvy doc. (according to hypergeometric calculator with: pop = 20 roles, nr successes = 1, sample size = 15 - for 15 civvy - , nr successes in sample = 1)
So that leaves us with 0.75 * 0.75 = 0.5625 probability of having both civvy cop and civvy doc. Then the probability of both existing AND the doc hitting the cop is 0.5625 * (1/17) = 0.03308823529 ~= 0.033.
So that leaves us with 3.3% chance.
Of course, all this information is worthless, but as said, I was bored.
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It's true that the chance of any given role being town is 75%, but the chance for additional roles also being town decreases since the sample size and number of town left in them decreases. So the chance of both being town is even lower.
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I fully support a self-doc n0.
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An extreme example of this, is that the chance of 16 given roles are all town is not 0.75^16, but 0. Since there are only 15 town.
The difference is minimal, instead of (15/20)*(15/20)=0.5625 we get (15/20)*(14/19)~=0.5526
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I was bored, so I did the math. Apparently, there's a 0.75 probability of there being a civvy cop. Same probability for there being a civvy doc. (according to hypergeometric calculator with: pop = 20 roles, nr successes = 1, sample size = 15 - for 15 civvy - , nr successes in sample = 1)
So that leaves us with 0.75 * 0.75 = 0.5625 probability of having both civvy cop and civvy doc. Then the probability of both existing AND the doc hitting the cop is 0.5625 * (1/17) = 0.03308823529 ~= 0.033.
So that leaves us with 3.3% chance.
Of course, all this information is worthless, but as said, I was bored.
Did you take into account that some people have have listed cop or medic on their list, increasing the chance they exist this game :sillyspin:
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Not bothered to carefully read and go in depth over everything posted so far.
I agree with the role usage TorB put forward, but I think as long as someone finds a good usage for their role and can explain why they did something, they should go for it. Of course, use your best judgement.
w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
This list seems good, I trust in your dice rolls.
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TorB is right. I derped.
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A reminder to Cop that you don’t have to use ability tonight as there is no nk
I really, really hope you meant medic. Of course cop should use.
OOPS yes I meant medic my bad :cwy:
I would be willing to further argue that if we're going the strat in which Durandal always outs with a guilty, then doc shouldn't use ability this evening. They should save it for tomorrow so Durandal can get at least report out (if it's a guilty) and out another before they die. It's risky, but I would rather have a 1/15 chance to lose Durandal tonight than a 1/1 chance to lose them tomorrow if they out (seeing as how if doc hits Durandal tonight, they can't protect them again tomorrow)(there's a 1/15 chance to hit Durandal but the odds are low both ways regardless)(I would love feedback)
Without external information all we need to do is make it plausible enough that mafia might waste a Nightkill to deter them.
I'm not seeing any benefit to a town role that increases voting power if they cannot also have special insight to alignments. Allowing a player to gain voting power risks them being scum that could wear havoc in a Mylo\LYLO scenario... And town loses if they ever are outnumbered. Actually, what IS the benefit of town abstaining from voting just to boost their voting power?
There's one benefit that has the same effect as a detriment: in the event that there's a maf Durandal that hides, and the game gets into a situation where it's n maf vs n+1 town (like 3 town vs 2 maf alive) a maf Durandal can force someone not to vote and cause the vote to be forced into a NL. To circumvent this, i propose that Bronya saves one vote such that their voting power is 2 and leaves it at that. Obviously this could have drawbacks if Bronya flips maf, but so can't every plan we have.
Durandal's target cannot be voted on but can still vote. Still there are a few roles that can mess with parity.
It's true that the chance of any given role being town is 75%, but the chance for additional roles also being town decreases since the sample size and number of town left in them decreases. So the chance of both being town is even lower.
In a random distribution the chance is roughly 55% for most players, ~75% for cop/doc and either ~80% or 0% for mafia.
Did you take into account that some people have have listed cop or medic on their list, increasing the chance they exist this game :sillyspin:
It is pretty likely that both exist. Plus town benefits from mafia believing that they exists.
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There's more than 1 effective cop role though :^)
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Theresa is much more useful late game and much less likely to be able to identify mafia Day1, even if one was targeted by them N0. No need to consider Theresa for the purpose of medic target N0, as in they are unlikely to be in need of protection N1 due to public Theresa claim to out mafia.
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Cop type roles should "ABC"... Always Be Checking. It any sure red peeks (which in this setup is a bit murky as no 'true' cop role exists...). I've yet to see a convincing argument for a cop role to holster this game...?
Doc should probably decide themselves who to target. Following a thread consensus likely opens up a chance for scum to doc-hunt (corollary to not wanting a cop to check a thread agreed target?), even a self target consensus if followed.
It is possible, albeit unlikely, that we have NEITHER town doc nor town cop and less likely but still possible neither in the game at all. :o
RIPtown in those worlds.
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EBWOP
*And out any sure red peeks
(Phone posting almost always sucks)
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Speaking of cop and medic: there's also a significant chance that mafia has the core of death. Medic only prevents deaths during the night, while core of death kills the day after. It's one use only and Raiden can still deflect the effect elsewhere. Still, cop seems like the most obvious target for it.
I agree with rob on doc targets, merely wanted to point out that there are no huge reasons not to use it on whomever you feel like.
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dumb idea I remembered from Town of Salem
Raiden can protect away cop-type roles from the nightkill if they are forced to claim
congrats ian, you're useful now
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So a town Raiden Mei can add another layer of decision for scum to weigh by possibly (or not!) targeting a claimed red peek and the Durandal claimant? Risks seem to be that a scum Raiden Mei would create a disastrous first round of any such attempt...? This cop-role-but-cannot-lynch-next is really a pain to try to work into a more "straight" cop sort of functionality.
Also, wonder if anyone tries to go full-Rob and shoot into the completely-inactive-0-posting-n0 group? :-X
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Unfortunately I managed to not roll one of the 80 vig roles so someone else will have to shoot shock.
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Comments in yellow.
It's time to start highlighting some important roles and group the other roles by category as well as suggest their intended usage. Deviating from this intended usage will likely be perceived as scummy, so speak up if you disagree instead of simply ignoring my advice.
Cop: Durandal
Medic: Fu Hua
Cop targets are publicly notified the day after and they cannot be lynchvoted that day. My suggestion is to hard-claim when finding a mafia, say nothing when finding town. Town targeted by cop is more likely to be nightkilled due to notification.
Emma Planck should target Cop N0, Medic N2 (if still alive). Fake cop claims should be denied by Emma Planck, not the actual cop.
Maf could simply out Emma Planck at the cost of one of their members just by faking a cop claim; they only need to wait until the notification appears (which will likely happen D1). I'd rather keep a town Emma Planck around for a while longer. An outed Emma should be targeted by doc, although Chain Lightning poses a huge problem if it exists. A way to counter it is to have many people targeting Emma, but that could potentially out offensive town roles.
If you have been targeted by Cecilia Shariac, make sure to publicly reveal this, but keep the identity of the person with this role a secret until someone town dies from that role. Verify or deny claims made for that role if someone claims.
All false claims should lead to getting lynched, this way, Theresa Apocalypse can identify mafia that make true role claims if their Honkai Core's ability type differs from their original role ability. Roles are also unique, so if someone claims to be your role, they are lying.
Now for the rest of the roles, note that offensive roles should not be used lightly, especially N0.
Not sure how using this ability is not scummy.
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
A town Raiden Mei would have to know who is medic for this, though. Not sure if it's a good idea to use this ability now if town, but it'll be useful later on when we have more information about roles.
Useful for scum to tip the voting scales in their favor. People should lynch vote every day, even with this role.
A maf that pretends to be inactive with this role may be going for this. This is another reason why Cecilia should target inactives; this role's usage is more scum than not, so if anyone detects abnormalities, Cecilia will be able to narrow down the targets if they want to hunt Bronya.
Coordinate with info roles to kill people.
Seems like an overpowered scum ability to protect their entire team from cop. Please do not use this ability.
Anyone whose ability fails should say so.
Allows you to verify if the player's role claim matches their ability type. If not, claim and lynch.
Should be able to get some maf out if they claim truthfully, but they could very well coordinate to play pretend─ that is, a maf claims another maf's ability that DOES match. Roleclaims should be checked anyway; an outed false roleclaim with a Cecilia claim will probably out several mafia.
Allows scum to take a town down with them, not sure what the most useful usage for town is. Best to just leave the ability be or try to drag down someone scummy with a likely NK target.
With how many offensive abilities there are, this practically feels like suicide to use at random. Using this on other defensive roles or cop (why???) should be perceived as scummy.
Do not use this ability. It's a bad meatshield.
If everyone suddenly wants you dead on a night, this will eliminate them all. Veruy useful if you will be the next nightkill target.
Kills, plain and simple.
We get an extra kill from this role if they hit a maf, so if town, they should wait until a maf is confirmed.
Please do not claim to be the role you received, unless explicitly mentioning this role as well. See received role for suggested usage of that role.
Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
Can likely be used freely. Please do not target power roles to prevent outing them to mafia.
Can be used freely. Most useful when used on individual players to spy them using 2 abilities during one night (=mafia).
Can be used freely.
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
No usage.
It basically confirms which roles are in the game. Its use is very limited, but it may help by actually confirming what roles exist instead of leaving us to strategize on roles that may not even be present. Question to Sky: This role reveals ANY player's role, dead or alive, correct? That's how I understood this. Also, can Cocolia receive Cocolia as one of the three roles?
If you can predict whom gets lynched this ability is extremely useful, but after obtaining new abilities soem informative roles may perceive you as scum. Avoid using two abilities in one night.
We could attempt to coordinate a lynch during the night for this role to work. We may want to protect this target from the NK, since the lynch target being killed during the night would just make this fail rotundly.
There is a lot to add (or modify) to my list of brief suggestions, so I would love to see some discussion on role usage. I wrote this before roles were revealed, so you won't find any soft-claims in this post.
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Naii - I think a trade of Emma for 1 scum is good positive value for town... You seem to say that is not a good value in your first yellow statements. Can you clarify your thoughts on this?
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Further background on my thought there-- it is currently 15-3 so trading a non cop non medic (if those are in the game and if those are town) for 1\3 of the scum team sounds great to me.
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Naii - I think a trade of Emma for 1 scum is good positive value for town... You seem to say that is not a good value in your first yellow statements. Can you clarify your thoughts on this?
I do admit it's a trade that favors town, however, Emma has a lot of value as an information source. I did mention "for a while longer", in other words, I think this trade should not be performed too early.
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Cocalia starts out with this information, when no one is dead yet. Not sure why there is a need for clarification on information received at the start of the game when no one is dead yet. So basically, the roles of three people are known to Cocalia as I understand.
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Whoops, I read wrong. My bad. For some reason I thought it was learning three random roles on every night, not just N0.
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@Naii - About Raiden I think what torb meant is for medic and Raiden to protect some power role that needed to claim (like Durandal). This just requires some coordination.
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Raiden Mei does not require coordination, quite the opposite. By targeting someone to be protected and an unwitting victim, all kill abilities will affect the unwitting victim instead of the one being protected. As soon as you coordinate whom the second target is, mafia can simply target them. Raiden Mei is an ER ability, too, so can indefinitely protect someone as long as there is a scapegoat, Raiden Mei lives and binding chains does not take effect. Whether or not Fu Hua helps out and protects the scapegoat (by targeting the power role) is irrelevant in saving the power role.
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The issue with having Hua protect the scapegoat(s) is that someone would need to out a scapegoat target, and then the mafia can just nightkill them instead and the phantom swap on Durandal would kill him off. It’s a little to unreliable and easy to circumvent a strategy, I think.
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Oh, that kind of coordination, now I'm contradicting myself, hah.
The original idea behind alternating with Fu Hua was that Fu Hua can prevent someone from dying altogether, while Raiden Mei only deflects the effect onto someone else (making Fu Hua the better choice). So coordinate which role to use might be optimal, but it's much safer to just use Raiden Mei every round if you want to protect someone since it works every round, unlike Fu Hua.
The issue with having Hua protect the scapegoat(s) is that someone would need to out a scapegoat target, and then the mafia can just nightkill them instead and the phantom swap on Durandal would kill him off. It’s a little to unreliable and easy to circumvent a strategy, I think.
Fu Hua will also be deflected to the scapegoat, so its identity does not need to be known to anyone but Raiden Mei.
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Night 0 has ended. Notifications are currently being sent.
Day 1 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Day 1
PlayerOa cannot be voted on today.
Day 1 has ended.
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dawn to dusk (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Ii's time to lynch.
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Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
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Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
Imagine if you were a vig, hehe
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dawn to dusk (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Ii's time to lynch.
I mean it is daytime so yeah we want to lynch someone... Why dawn? That's really low-hanging fruit mi amigo.
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dawn to dusk (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Ii's time to lynch.
I mean it is daytime so yeah we want to lynch someone... Why dawn? That's really low-hanging fruit mi amigo.
hes just pressing dawn to talk, c'mon rob :P
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I think it's because dawn didn't make a single post N0, rob.
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Ah, ninja'd.
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dawn to dusk (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Ii's time to lynch.
I mean it is daytime so yeah we want to lynch someone... Why dawn? That's really low-hanging fruit mi amigo.
Inactivity. Reminds me of mafia 72, where dawn was also mafia. I did hint at going to lynch the player with the lowest post count N0.
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dawn to dusk (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Ii's time to lynch.
I mean it is daytime so yeah we want to lynch someone... Why dawn? That's really low-hanging fruit mi amigo.
hes just pressing dawn to talk, c'mon rob :P
that's odd, I just shoot 'em ;)
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dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
I'm game for pressing to get people posting. :o
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dawn to dusk (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Ii's time to lynch.
I mean it is daytime so yeah we want to lynch someone... Why dawn? That's really low-hanging fruit mi amigo.
hes just pressing dawn to talk, c'mon rob :P
that's odd, I just shoot 'em ;)
Why shoot when you can try mislynch and waste a lynch? :P
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dawn to dusk (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Ii's time to lynch.
I mean it is daytime so yeah we want to lynch someone... Why dawn? That's really low-hanging fruit mi amigo.
hes just pressing dawn to talk, c'mon rob :P
that's odd, I just shoot 'em ;)
Why shoot when you can try mislynch and waste a lynch? :P
what it dawn is scum?
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Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
Imagine if you were a vig, hehe
I'll take that as hardclaim not rita :P (since you wouldnt want to get shot)
I'm kind of upset that my ability was redirected, so i kinda dont like rita right now, but I'm not sure whether scum!rita would be so sure i wasnt vig.
Its probably just shock or mw or so using their role simply because they cant resist
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;D :D ;D :D ;D
"It's probably just shock..." Hoo boy.
Well you do give clues about aspects of your role by the fact nobody died from having you redirect into them. (I'm going to operate as you are truthful about the event)
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yh, but I still think rita targeting me shouldnt be sth thats left unreported, even if it hardconfirms me not durandal or vig.
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Anyone have ideas why a Rita would, as I see it, blindly point at kae? I suppose maybe a Raiden occurred too?
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yh, but I still think rita targeting me shouldnt be sth thats left unreported, even if it hardconfirms me not durandal or vig.
you can still be durandal
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Btw rob, can you link me to the game where coffee tawed up because he was scum? I was going to peck activity from him as towny per default, since he could easily just give us nothing without us noticing anything unusual.
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yh, but I still think rita targeting me shouldnt be sth thats left unreported, even if it hardconfirms me not durandal or vig.
you can still be durandal
unfortunately not if you put 2+2 together. i would know who I targeted in that case.
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Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
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Just the ability being usable, non-lethal and targeted on a person eliminates like half the abilities. We also know it isn't Durandal, as kaempfer explained while I was getting ninja-ed. I agree that using Rita was uncalled for, something to remember for N2 Emma Planck? Would prefer to see a claim and/or explanation before then. If someone acts like that with that role for no good reason, then tries to hide, they're almost certainly scum from my point of view.
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Just the ability being usable, non-lethal and targeted on a person eliminates like half the abilities. We also know it isn't Durandal, as kaempfer explained while I was getting ninja-ed. I agree that using Rita was uncalled for, something to remember for N2 Emma Planck? Would prefer to see a claim and/or explanation before then. If someone acts like that with that role for no good reason, then tries to hide, they're almost certainly scum from my point of view.
I hesitate short of calling for a Rita role claim straight out, BUT Rita isn't exactly a power role and really leaves me perplexed it was used on kae on N0 like that (I can actually think of reasons one might think too use it on a few players but kae so far this game is not in that vein for me).
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I do not remember any good reasons applicable being mentioned here, least of all for N0. MW did mention it was a "fantastic role" and for that role to "go wild".
I'll accept these as valid reasons to try and lynch shock or MW if one were so inclined. Unfortunately it's not alignment indicative for them and I'm more interested in lynching scum.
Do not need to hard claim Rita yet, just something to keep in mind depending on how N1 goes. Call it a yellow flag if you want.
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I'm not gonna insult scums intelligence this game, so I will sum up what roles I can have and what me not immediately jumping to the conclusion that rita is scum means (obviously i know exactly which it is, but this is what you should be able to confirm using basic logic and I am not sure if I should out completely):
Kiana Kaslana Time Fracture (EoR) Target a player. Their abilities can’t be used tonight, and they can’t vote on the following day. They will be notified. You can’t target yourself. (Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)
Raiden Mei Phantom Image (ER) Target exactly two players. Tonight, anything that targets the first player affects the second player instead, and vice versa. This includes the nightkill. You can’t target yourself. (This can cause abilities to be used on otherwise illegal targets, such as for abilities that can’t normally target the user. Note that this ability has very high priority.)
Impossible
Bronya Zaychik Charge Beam (Passive) Not voting increases your Voting Power by 1 the next time you do vote. This effect stacks. (This is checked at the end of the day. In other words, voting and then removing your vote later will simply count as not voting.)
Impossible
Himeko Murata Field of Blades (2U) Target a player. If they are targeted by at least two other role abilities this night, kill them. You can’t target yourself. (Passives, nightkills, and Honkai Core abilities do not count.)
At most 1 other ability targeted Rita or fu hua did.
Yae Sakura Consecrate Ground (EoR) Target up to three players. Other abilities targeting them will fail tonight. You can’t target yourself. (Nightkills are unaffected. Abilities that target a protected player will fail entirely even if their other targets are valid. Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)
Possible
Theresa Apocalypse Spear of Judgement (ER) Target a player. If they are a Herrscher, you learn their Honkai Core’s ability type. Otherwise, you learn the ability type of their original role ability. You can’t target yourself. (The ability types are ER, EoR, Passive, and #U. Does not distinguish between Honkai Core abilities and role abilities.)
If rita has a honkai core it is the core of lightning
Fu Hua Phoenix Rebirth (ER) Target player can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. You may target yourself, but you can’t target the same player twice in a row.
Possible
Kallen Kaslana Red Thread of Fate (EoR) Target exactly two players. If one dies tonight, so does the other. You may target yourself, and if you’re a Herrscher, you must do so.
Impossible
Rita Rossweisse Rose Petals (ER) Target a player. If they have any abilities that can be used tonight and can have exactly one target, force them to use it on you. You can’t target yourself. (They will be notified. If successful, this overrides any target(s) they may have selected. The abilities still occur at their normal priority level. EoR abilities still go on cooldown, and #U abilities still lose a use.)
Unique
Liliya Olenyeva Flash Counter (1U) You can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. At the end of the night, kill all players who targeted you with an ability that would have killed you. If the nightkill is prevented this way, this automatically kills one Herrscher, preferring the living Honkai Core holder that appears earliest in the Honkai Core list. (Abilities that do not immediately kill you, or would not have killed you due to a condition not being met, will not trigger this effect.)
Impossible
Rozaliya Olenyeva Typhoon Cutter (2U) Kill target player. If they were a Valkyrie, lose all remaining uses of this ability. You can’t target yourself.
Only possible if fu hua targeted rita
Seele Vollerei Quantum State (Passive) You permanently gain a copy of the first role ability to target you. (Priority matters! You’ll receive a notification. The ability will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You still technically have the Quantum State ability.)
Impossible
Durandal Break of Dawn (EoR) Target a player. At the start of the next day, whether they are a Herrscher will be revealed to you. They can’t be voted on that day. (There will be a public notification for this part.) You can’t target yourself.
I would know what i did.
Cecilia Schariac Abyssal Flower (ER) Target a player. If this is the first time you’ve targeted them with this ability, reveal your name and original role to them. If this is the second time you’ve targeted them with this ability, kill them instead. You can’t target yourself.
Rita would know that i am this role
Shigure Kira Idyllic Dreams (EoR) Target up to three players. If any of them targeted you tonight, you learn each other’s name and original role. You can’t target yourself.
i would know ritas identity
Frederica Tesla Radio Wave (ER) Target any number of players. You learn how many abilities those players used tonight, in total. You can’t target yourself. (Includes Honkai Core abilities. You don’t learn the ability name or target. Players can use more than one ability each night.)
rita did not use a honkai core tonight, if I am this role
Lieserl Einstein Theory of Relativity (ER) Target a player. You receive a list of all ability names that targeted them tonight, other than this one. You may target yourself. (Player names are not revealed.)
Possible
Emma Planck Atomic Signature (EoR) Name a role. You learn which player, if any, has that role. (This includes players who have gained that role, and players who are already dead. Honkai Cores are not roles.)
Doesnt directly target
Cocolia Surveillance Network (Passive) At the start of Night 0, you learn the role ability of three random other players. (If you’re a Herrscher, this won’t reveal roles of other Herrschers.)
nope
Sin Mal Soul Funeral (3U) Target a player. If they are lynched tomorrow, you permanently gain a copy of their original role ability if you do not already have it. You can’t target yourself. (You’ll receive a notification. Abilities will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You may use multiple abilities in one night.
If I am this role, I kinda want rita dead to not waste my ability, but its not worth lynching a town for it.)
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There are arguments to use rita immediately, its just not nice to be on the receiving end no matter what you are. for instance if you force the poison honkai core you can immediately out a scum. The more I think about it and the clearer my head gets the more inclined I am to believe rita is actually town.
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moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
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kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
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kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
tf, did you just out?
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Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
Please note that the System Messages section includes every notification that can arise from normal gameplay, including role ability messages.
(Dynamic messages, such as answers to questions, are not listed for obvious reasons.)
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raiden doesnt really matter much as rita still used her ability on the person i was swapped with in that case. Also i dont really know why raiden would target me in particular, but then again same for rita.
But anyway ballsiness actually speaks for Rita town now that i thought about it. using it blindly may well attract a vig or durandal that otherwise would have left you alone.
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The fact that there was a chance that Rita pulled a cop away from mafia by using it on an even night is still a bad town play from my point of view, not to mention the possible vigis.
I was actually thinking over moehrpi's suggestion of Rita and Cocalia w/w to use it without backfire, but the fact you claimed and Emma can track them down means there is an even worse backfire of outing 2 mafia members. Would be incredibly stupid.
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dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
based on potential slip.
i dont know how you can fuck up so bad, but i cant think of a reason for town!moe to say that either.
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Kae - HUH? :-\
Are you having a MW moment?
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Why is shock still alive
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
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dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
based on potential slip.
i dont know how you can fuck up so bad, but i cant think of a reason for town!moe to say that either.
Ok, i can think of one, but its still poor play and i am not gonna point out what it is until he responds.
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moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I case i confused people, this is the slip
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Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
Rob, that was a scrubbed game that we played literally half a decade ago. Don't try to read off of it.
kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I soft counterclaim your soft confirm.
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dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
U N L Y N C H A B L E
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You realize that by voting me you're admitting iancu was more correct with his rolls than you?
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I will ofcourse take my vote off you smh
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moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I case i confused people, this is the slip
what have you been smoking kae?
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moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
Oh, muh, gawd. You suck.
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
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dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
Voting shock since i have no scum reads and shock is always scum.
Y'all are hella mean btw
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dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
(https://i.imgur.com/fK7Glts.png)
Speeeeak
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I know you all disagree, but I'm going to keep saying this because maybe 5 games down the road someone will actually listen. No lynch is a viable strategy, and can at times be more winning than lynching based off principle. This is even more true this game, where we have more potential roles that can find mafia and we have roles that can stop the NK. We also, imo, have much more useful information roles that can work together. A random lynch day 1 is almost certainly going to kill a town, unless someone has information to share, or if a mafia slips up really, REALLY badly. I don't see either of those happening yet. Any who thinks you can get a read off of like 3 posts day 1 that aren't slip ups is just lying to themselves.
So unless someone has information to share, we gain a lot by skipping this lynch for the following reasons:
1.) random lynch day 1 is almost always killing a town
2.) random lynch could remove a very useful role that we need
3.) putting someone up for lynch could force a role claim. What if the cop is the one with the most votes towards the end of day and has to reveal now?
3.) keeping more targets alive gives more cover for the useful roles to get the information they need before dying
4.) we have more time to make informed decisions, especially regarding how to use roles since this version of mafia is quite drastically different than previous ones
5.) I personally think day 1 lynch vote patterns are almost always meaningless, unless we get really lucky and find a way to get significant votes on a mafia, forcing them to pull some maneuvers. The odds of this are below 50/50 though (don't BS me with "reads"), and most of the time all we end up with is a dead town, a lost role, and close to zero new info.
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DC-
If you decide to get off your OMGUS vote then there are two competing wagons forming... Care for one of them?
shock-
Your advocacy for no vote deserves a rebuttal post that should be typed on a keyboard not a phone... Such rebuttal coming soon. Your started belief in no Lynch as a viable strategy (it isn't) would hold some (mL maybe) water if you followed your own advice and voted no lynch.
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1.) random lynch day 1 is almost always killing a town
We have a 1/5 chance of hitting the mafia, and we can afford a mislynch here. If it's an important role, they can claim or otherwise defend themselves with information.
2.) random lynch could remove a very useful role that we need
See above.
3.) putting someone up for lynch could force a role claim. What if the cop is the one with the most votes towards the end of day and has to reveal now?
We switch off of them, get information, and have Hua or Raiden protect them that night.
3.) keeping more targets alive gives more cover for the useful roles to get the information they need before dying
Keeping more Herrscher roles alive gives more cover for the Herrscher to get the information and kills they need before dying.
4.) we have more time to make informed decisions, especially regarding how to use roles since this version of mafia is quite drastically different than previous ones
We can make more informed decisions based off of the information we get from the lynch today. Not lynching is a day wasted not gathering information.
5.) I personally think day 1 lynch vote patterns are almost always meaningless, unless we get really lucky and find a way to get significant votes on a mafia, forcing them to pull some maneuvers. The odds of this are below 50/50 though (don't BS me with "reads"), and most of the time all we end up with is a dead town, a lost role, and close to zero new info.
The odds are 1/5. Vote patterns are probably meaningless, that's true, but that's not a valid reason to not lynch today.
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DC-
If you decide to get off your OMGUS vote then there are two competing wagons forming... Care for one of them?
shock-
Your advocacy for no vote deserves a rebuttal post that should be typed on a keyboard not a phone... Such rebuttal coming soon. Your started belief in no Lynch as a viable strategy (it isn't) would hold some (mL maybe) water if you followed your own advice and voted no lynch.
2 wagons for policy lynches? Probably shock, not because he's shock but because I'll vote up whoever asks to NL always. Are you telling me to move my vote though?
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I know you all disagree, but I'm going to keep saying this because maybe 5 games down the road someone will actually listen. No lynch is a viable strategy, and can at times be more winning than lynching based off principle. This is even more true this game, where we have more potential roles that can find mafia and we have roles that can stop the NK. We also, imo, have much more useful information roles that can work together. A random lynch day 1 is almost certainly going to kill a town, unless someone has information to share, or if a mafia slips up really, REALLY badly. I don't see either of those happening yet. Any who thinks you can get a read off of like 3 posts day 1 that aren't slip ups is just lying to themselves.
So unless someone has information to share, we gain a lot by skipping this lynch for the following reasons:
1.) random lynch day 1 is almost always killing a town This is not much different than most any other day - unless you think town has rolled most of the killing roles then the town killing power is really the lynch. Not using it is holstering a chance to kill the enemy.
2.) random lynch could remove a very useful role that we need It isn't random. Also, it could remove a very anti-town mafia role.
3.) putting someone up for lynch could force a role claim. What if the cop is the one with the most votes towards the end of day and has to reveal now? Then the cop should gett gud and do things that convince people not to vote them and to instead vote someone scummy. Also, you seem to be forgetting that the cop roles this setup could also be scum-sided or not present (obviously Durandal is present given the Oa announcement at start of Day).
3.) keeping more targets alive gives more cover for the useful roles to get the information they need before dying So you are suggesting to just sit pat and try to have nobody die while town uses roles to find all the scum and win 15-0? I just cannot agree that No Lynch is viable/right strategy here.
4.) we have more time to make informed decisions, especially regarding how to use roles since this version of mafia is quite drastically different than previous ones We are almost assured at least 5 day phases, probably 6 or 7, even without hitting many scum - how long do you think roles need? As much killing power as it looks like the game has... town kills by lynching (hint: scum kills by night).
5.) I personally think day 1 lynch vote patterns are almost always meaningless, unless we get really lucky and find a way to get significant votes on a mafia, forcing them to pull some maneuvers. The odds of this are below 50/50 though (don't BS me with "reads"), and most of the time all we end up with is a dead town, a lost role, and close to zero new info. Reading other players is really a thing. Now, I won't reach so far as to claim that I know everyone can do it -- there is a bit of touch and ability to pay attention to detail required that not all have. Also, heads up but the only time it can be 50/50 odds is at parity when town loses. A dead mafia is preferred of course but things are learned to varying degrees by ANY death while aiming to kill scum.
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@shock
Taking last game for example, the NL in day 1 ended up causing a lot of unnecessary confusion, just because we couldn't get a clear read of what the votes meant.
People will try to analyse vote patterns regardless, so it's best to have a clearer idea of what those patterns mean (even if it's to decide there's nothing there).
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DC-
If you decide to get off your OMGUS vote then there are two competing wagons forming... Care for one of them?
shock-
Your advocacy for no vote deserves a rebuttal post that should be typed on a keyboard not a phone... Such rebuttal coming soon. Your started belief in no Lynch as a viable strategy (it isn't) would hold some (mL maybe) water if you followed your own advice and voted no lynch.
2 wagons for policy lynches? Probably shock, not because he's shock but because I'll vote up whoever asks to NL always. Are you telling me to move my vote though?
Just prodding you, I suppose... but voting www right now seems a waste if you're not going to push him or sus him at all, right?
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dumb idea I remembered from Town of Salem
Raiden can protect away cop-type roles from the nightkill if they are forced to claim
congrats ian, you're useful now
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
Just saw this. Did you not read his guide?
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dumb idea I remembered from Town of Salem
Raiden can protect away cop-type roles from the nightkill if they are forced to claim
congrats ian, you're useful now
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
Just saw this. Did you not read his guide?
somehow it slipped my mind, I stopped reading at 'extremely powerful for scum' and thought 'oh, we don't use this' at first. Fuck me LOL
DC-
If you decide to get off your OMGUS vote then there are two competing wagons forming... Care for one of them?
shock-
Your advocacy for no vote deserves a rebuttal post that should be typed on a keyboard not a phone... Such rebuttal coming soon. Your started belief in no Lynch as a viable strategy (it isn't) would hold some (mL maybe) water if you followed your own advice and voted no lynch.
2 wagons for policy lynches? Probably shock, not because he's shock but because I'll vote up whoever asks to NL always. Are you telling me to move my vote though?
Just prodding you, I suppose... but voting www right now seems a waste if you're not going to push him or sus him at all, right?
I thought we're are at the stage where we can still vote for shits and giggles...
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DC-
Sure I guess. I just stated once you get off your OMGUS (as you called it at the time) vote or giggles-vote or whatever, then hey make it a more 'real' vote next. www on Link is similar category I suppose... Also - quite interested to see where kae was going with w/e he was doing with moe.
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Who are we kidding, we're always at that stage.
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Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
I was town in 49.
I'm interested in having Emma check who Rita is this evening, just so we can address the early burning and misuse of such an ability.
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while it does sound like a move i would do, i did not target oa nor Kaempf.
my stance is, we should be keeping an eye on Kaempf.
Kaempf is acting strange, and kinda jumpy but i guess i think that every game i play with him
i personally theorize that who ever acts dumb, but is really quite competent with this rule set will be maf. maf have another platform that they can discuss roles and interactions all while seeing what town is talking about and discovering. they will be more in tune with interactions and what not in this more complicated ruleset.
my vote on shock is just a placeholder. Ill remove that now. these rules gimmie too much of a headache to shitpost. ill put a vote on Kaempf, not with intention to lynch, but with the intention of adding some pressure.
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
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If I'm mafia you better call me out according to the consensus we reached N0. But you won't, because I'm not. Guess a scum Durandal targetting scum Oa is the only world where I'm scum, and even if there is, it doesn't confirm anything.
I'll need doc on me from time to time - not necessarily today, just pick a pattern where scum cannot predict when to NK me.
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Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
I was town in 49.
I'm interested in having Emma check who Rita is this evening, just so we can address the early burning and misuse of such an ability.
Emma is EoR, thus on cooldown N1 if the ability was used N0 as suggested.
Agree on Oas post.
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while it does sound like a move i would do, i did not target oa nor Kaempf.
This is basically hard claim not Rita or Durandal. There is no reason to look for Rita with info roles, since it's almost certainly shock at this point.
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I know you all disagree, but I'm going to keep saying this because maybe 5 games down the road someone will actually listen. No lynch is a viable strategy, and can at times be more winning than lynching based off principle. This is even more true this game, where we have more potential roles that can find mafia and we have roles that can stop the NK. We also, imo, have much more useful information roles that can work together. A random lynch day 1 is almost certainly going to kill a town, unless someone has information to share, or if a mafia slips up really, REALLY badly. I don't see either of those happening yet. Any who thinks you can get a read off of like 3 posts day 1 that aren't slip ups is just lying to themselves.
So unless someone has information to share, we gain a lot by skipping this lynch for the following reasons:
1.) random lynch day 1 is almost always killing a town
2.) random lynch could remove a very useful role that we need
3.) putting someone up for lynch could force a role claim. What if the cop is the one with the most votes towards the end of day and has to reveal now?
3.) keeping more targets alive gives more cover for the useful roles to get the information they need before dying
4.) we have more time to make informed decisions, especially regarding how to use roles since this version of mafia is quite drastically different than previous ones
5.) I personally think day 1 lynch vote patterns are almost always meaningless, unless we get really lucky and find a way to get significant votes on a mafia, forcing them to pull some maneuvers. The odds of this are below 50/50 though (don't BS me with "reads"), and most of the time all we end up with is a dead town, a lost role, and close to zero new info.
I do agree that no lynch does work. Tho for now, it is good to vote and keep talking and look for mafia slipups and such. It is possible to find maf day 1, so we shouldn’t stop looking
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Oh I forgot to say but Yh, medic make sure to target me kthnx
Also whys rob telling DC to look at two wagons forming...it is barely a wagon. So sus much wow nub rob
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I cant fathom how you cant see that moe essentially claimed to have knowledge on the scum team or being scum (which means he also has knowledge on the scumteam duh) with his slip.
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What happened to not insulting mafia's intelligence? Soft confirming yourself as mafia is the epitome of stupidity. How about we leave it at confirming the rolls themselves and not the implied meaning behind it?
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Tell us what you know about DC, moe. There gotta be something.
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EBWOP based on kaempfers line of thoughts
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@Kae, why did you not jump on Linkcat's similar and much earlier joke mafia claim?
w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
This is why I'm quiet rob, I already gave up since I know I can't win with this team.
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well that one is obviously a joke and linkcat is fairly well known to troll every now and then. i didnt really see moehrpi as joking there
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EBWOP based on kaempfers line of thoughts
arent you forgetting someone :P
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well that one is obviously a joke and linkcat is fairly well known to troll every now and then. i didnt really see moehrpi as joking there
Funny you say that. I actually believe there is a chance Linkcat is mafia in this one.
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Role question to the players:
Can Mafia use other players' roles? Roles that they do not have.
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EBWOP based on kaempfers line of thoughts
arent you forgetting someone :P
Given if moe didn’t out himself and I’m all but confirmed.. nah I don’t think so ;)
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Eh, linkcat was so ridiculously scummy last game; holding back townreads, pushing buttons to see what sticks, rolefishing, having pseudoclears he didnt disclose etc.. i'll head your advice from last time and not jump the gun on linkcat this time. I'm by no means saying that i townread him though, just that this type of mafia claim doesnt seem unusual for him, while it surprises me from moe
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Role question to the players:
Can Mafia use other players' roles? Roles that they do not have.
What
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For example, if i claim a killing role, can mafia:
a.) Use or copy my killing role?
b.) Make me use it on someone?
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Www is suspiciously overplaying the towny confusion in this game. (3 weird attempts already) He might be mafia trying to look town.
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Role question to the players:
Can Mafia use other players' roles? Roles that they do not have.
What
For example, if i claim a killing role, can mafia:
a.) Use or copy my killing role?
b.) Make me use it on someone?
Rita would die doing it, so that will not happen. Raiden can change your target, but knowing your role does not help with that.
I am more concerned about all the hard not Durandal claims, though. The pool of possible cops is rapidly shrinking at this pace.
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I am more concerned about all the hard not Durandal claims, though. The pool of possible cops is rapidly shrinking at this pace.
If the cop is smart, he already soft/hard-claimed not-Durandal.
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Www is suspiciously overplaying the towny confusion in this game. (3 weird attempts already) He might be mafia trying to look town.
your question was a What question tho. Why would you say "to the players", its better to ask host. Secondly, youre one of the people who is acc usually very thorough and has read rules and roles like multiple times. Thirdly, we've already been talking about rita, so you know that exists. Fourthly, do you really expect mafia to be able to use other players' role freely? Fifthly, atleast i replied to it and carrying on the conversation, while Oa and kaemp just ignored it (possibly because of the nature of the What question tho)
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Role question to the players:
Can Mafia use other players' roles? Roles that they do not have.
only way to plan copying a role is to lynch someone with a certain role while being sin mal. rita can redirect the targeting to self (as torb said not smart). the honkai cores all give or deny info or poison.
only way to duplicate a living role is by being seele.
Obviously some honkai core holders may try to disguise themselves as other roles, but its possible to catch them redhanded.
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oops forgot raiden redirecting
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I am more concerned about all the hard not Durandal claims, though. The pool of possible cops is rapidly shrinking at this pace.
If the cop is smart, he already soft/hard-claimed not-Durandal.
After establishing a no lying policy, this would be pretty risky. The only role Durandal can safely pretend as is Emma Planck (knows Durandal identity if my plan was followed and has the same ability type), which would still be a priority NK target.
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Also yh, sub of all people not reading the rules is actually really weird. Seems like this is another one of his roleplays. Does he do that all the time (figuring a new playstyle each game) regardless of alignement or only when he doesnt read his role or is scum?
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@Kae, www:
I am still a bit exhausted from the previous mafia, so I need a change of pace this time.
I already showed I can play the high effort game as mafia, so now it's time to test out the low effort game as town.
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Hm, still I had the impression that rulebending is your favourite thing to do, so i would have expected your low effort game to consist of not adressing the thread that much and make crazy mechanical plans. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Also, I'm a little weirded out that you are that agressive when you clearly didnt put in the effort to achieve any lvl of confidence.
Oh well, i suppose non of those things is AI, just means that my ability to predict how people behave is lackluster.
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I mostly plan to just follow my gut this game. That would explain the thing you are weirded out by.
I don't intend to spend hours doing stuff, but I will still solve.
Www is suspiciously overplaying the towny confusion in this game. (3 weird attempts already) He might be mafia trying to look town.
your question was a What question tho. Why would you say "to the players", its better to ask host. Secondly, youre one of the people who is acc usually very thorough and has read rules and roles like multiple times. Thirdly, we've already been talking about rita, so you know that exists. Fourthly, do you really expect mafia to be able to use other players' role freely? Fifthly, atleast i replied to it and carrying on the conversation, while Oa and kaemp just ignored it (possibly because of the nature of the What question tho)
Scummy response for a few reasons.
- Does not address him being called out as scummy.
- Goes defensive by trying to discredit me.
- Putting words in my mouth. ("you know that exists")
- Pretending to be useful while not. ("atleast i replied to it and carrying on the conversation")
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so you got me curious about coffe rob and the only game in the last 35 where he has over 20 posts was mafia 68.
Where he was -drumroll-
town
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I mostly plan to just follow my gut this game. That would explain the thing you are weirded out by.
I don't intend to spend hours doing stuff, but I will still solve.
Www is suspiciously overplaying the towny confusion in this game. (3 weird attempts already) He might be mafia trying to look town.
your question was a What question tho. Why would you say "to the players", its better to ask host. Secondly, youre one of the people who is acc usually very thorough and has read rules and roles like multiple times. Thirdly, we've already been talking about rita, so you know that exists. Fourthly, do you really expect mafia to be able to use other players' role freely? Fifthly, atleast i replied to it and carrying on the conversation, while Oa and kaemp just ignored it (possibly because of the nature of the What question tho)
Scummy response for a few reasons.
- Does not address him being called out as scummy.
- Goes defensive by trying to discredit me.
- Putting words in my mouth. ("you know that exists")
- Pretending to be useful while not. ("atleast i replied to it and carrying on the conversation")
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/445/167/a5a.png)
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dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
I agree with Link, why is shock still alive? We don't need some rogue town or annoying mafia running around.
No-lynch is bad. Anyone who claims no-lynch is a viable strategy is either bad or trolling.
Also, kae is either high or scum. Or both.
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Well shock is obviously bad at the game, which makes him a good policy lynch and i would vote him over dawn obviously (with the information i have at the time), but i do not agree that we should settle for him this early, killing wagonomics and part of the discussion.
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I'm always high (in mafia games) as of recently it seems. Actually, i do take meds that might slightly impair my judgement, it shouldnt be as bad as people claim though. But honestly, is what I am saying really more farfetched than sub making a scumread out of what he interprets as derpclear attempts from w3 for instance?
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Analysis of town vs scum motivation to target certain roles (in case of targeting blindly obviously take the average of all possible roles; not all of them way equally though)
Kiana Kaslana Time Fracture (EoR) Target a player. Their abilities can’t be used tonight, and they can’t vote on the following day. They will be notified. You can’t target yourself. (Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)Instantly learn the ability at the cost of votepower, which for scum isnt necessarily a drawback. also since we agreed this ability shouldnt be used, somehow observing its use might start a kiana hunt if she fails to report being affected by rosepetals
Raiden Mei Phantom Image (ER) Target exactly two players. Tonight, anything that targets the first player affects the second player instead, and vice versa. This includes the nightkill. You can’t target yourself. (This can cause abilities to be used on otherwise illegal targets, such as for abilities that can’t normally target the user. Note that this ability has very high priority.)
this is the start of a long slew of roles where you can make an educated guess about targets role by noone reporting to be affected by rose petals; very slightly more usefull for scum
Bronya Zaychik Charge Beam (Passive) Not voting increases your Voting Power by 1 the next time you do vote. This effect stacks. (This is checked at the end of the day. In other words, voting and then removing your vote later will simply count as not voting.)
see above
Himeko Murata Field of Blades (2U) Target a player. If they are targeted by at least two other role abilities this night, kill them. You can’t target yourself. (Passives, nightkills, and Honkai Core abilities do not count.)
very risky, but uses up a use for what is unlikely to result in a kill; if it does though its very bad for scum
Yae Sakura Consecrate Ground (EoR) Target up to three players. Other abilities targeting them will fail tonight. You can’t target yourself. (Nightkills are unaffected. Abilities that target a protected player will fail entirely even if their other targets are valid. Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)
see kiana -learning the ability used+ being immune to other targeting
Theresa Apocalypse Spear of Judgement (ER) Target a player. If they are a Herrscher, you learn their Honkai Core’s ability type. Otherwise, you learn the ability type of their original role ability. You can’t target yourself. (The ability types are ER, EoR, Passive, and #U. Does not distinguish between Honkai Core abilities and role abilities.)
If rita has a honkai core it is the core of lightning or she is really risking it
Fu Hua Phoenix Rebirth (ER) Target player can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. You may target yourself, but you can’t target the same player twice in a row.
detracting protection from death from other target
Kallen Kaslana Red Thread of Fate (EoR) Target exactly two players. If one dies tonight, so does the other. You may target yourself, and if you’re a Herrscher, you must do so.
see above
Liliya Olenyeva Flash Counter (1U) You can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. At the end of the night, kill all players who targeted you with an ability that would have killed you. If the nightkill is prevented this way, this automatically kills one Herrscher, preferring the living Honkai Core holder that appears earliest in the Honkai Core list. (Abilities that do not immediately kill you, or would not have killed you due to a condition not being met, will not trigger this effect.)
see above
Rozaliya Olenyeva Typhoon Cutter (2U) Kill target player. If they were a Valkyrie, lose all remaining uses of this ability. You can’t target yourself.
Suicide unless fu hua is scum.
Seele Vollerei Quantum State (Passive) You permanently gain a copy of the first role ability to target you. (Priority matters! You’ll receive a notification. The ability will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You still technically have the Quantum State ability.)
see above; actually i am not sure if this forces seele to get rosepetals
Durandal Break of Dawn (EoR) Target a player. At the start of the next day, whether they are a Herrscher will be revealed to you. They can’t be voted on that day. (There will be a public notification for this part.) You can’t target yourself.
This is outing if scum
Cecilia Schariac Abyssal Flower (ER) Target a player. If this is the first time you’ve targeted them with this ability, reveal your name and original role to them. If this is the second time you’ve targeted them with this ability, kill them instead. You can’t target yourself.
On the one hand this is preparing for suicide, on the other it immediately outs a role and if they knew that their target doesnt know who they were forced to target they would still be pretty safe.
Shigure Kira Idyllic Dreams (EoR) Target up to three players. If any of them targeted you tonight, you learn each other’s name and original role. You can’t target yourself.
narrowing it down to one target is a dickmove, but it also outs your role and guarantess success. obv it also outs kiras role.
Frederica Tesla Radio Wave (ER) Target any number of players. You learn how many abilities those players used tonight, in total. You can’t target yourself. (Includes Honkai Core abilities. You don’t learn the ability name or target. Players can use more than one ability each night.)
It is bad to use it on town tesla, but it also means that you cant use a honkai core. So rita probably doesnt have core of lightning or psion core in that case.
Lieserl Einstein Theory of Relativity (ER) Target a player. You receive a list of all ability names that targeted them tonight, other than this one. You may target yourself. (Player names are not revealed.)
redirecting this ability is slightly bad.
Emma Planck Atomic Signature (EoR) Name a role. You learn which player, if any, has that role. (This includes players who have gained that role, and players who are already dead. Honkai Cores are not roles.)
see above
Cocolia Surveillance Network (Passive) At the start of Night 0, you learn the role ability of three random other players. (If you’re a Herrscher, this won’t reveal roles of other Herrschers.)
see above
Sin Mal Soul Funeral (3U) Target a player. If they are lynched tomorrow, you permanently gain a copy of their original role ability if you do not already have it. You can’t target yourself. (You’ll receive a notification. Abilities will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You may use multiple abilities in one night.
reduces the effect of that ability unless you intend to get lynched
Honkaicores:
Core of Reason Global Analysis (EoR) Target a player. Learn their original role.
Imo ritas ability isnt very impressive and def not durandals, thus I consider this an upside
Core of Void Black Hole (2U) Target a player. If they die tonight, their role is not revealed. (Honkai Cores will still be revealed.)
uses up a limited use and opens them up for lieserl or tesla to witness usage
Core of Lightning Chain Lightning (ER) Target a player. At the end of the night, you learn which players they targeted, and which players targeted them. (Ability names are not revealed.)
slightly good, as scum has no idea who rita is yet, so has limited information gain, but was probably going to use it anyway
Core of Death Rapid Decay (1U) Target player dies at the end of the next day phase. They will receive a notification immediately.
Immediately outs scum and uses up the ability. If rita dies from another ability it still makes this core unuseable
Core of Binding Binding Chains (Passive) When you are lynched, all role abilities are disabled for the following night. (Honkai Core abilities are unaffected.)
no effect
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EBWOP actually triggering core of reason is even better than i thought as rita, as they dont even learn who that ability belongs to
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so i dont agree with the target, but dont think town!rita using it is clearcut wrong and id imagine scum!rita to be scared to use it blindly. If cocolia is scum this might change things a little.
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What stands out is that the green that I mostly agree with, is either a cop-like role or a mafia only ability. Drawing cop-like roles onto yourself is bad for both alignments, however. You want to find mafia, not confirm town. shock is apparently a priority lynch regardless of alignment, so the potential to drag down cop with you sounds much better when put into that perspective.
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eh, this as far as I go defending rita. I'm still pissed she targeted me after all.
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Didn't read kae's Rita-motivation but to address his burning question: I simply pointed out Oa as confirmed town, buddying him hard, when www3 published his rolls while i was typing. I appreciated the irony and added another line.
I also don't know anything about DC's alignment as Oa implied.
shock seems to defend NL as an idea and not himself by saying we might hit an important role. So I am not opposed to a lynch.
Other people who should feel the need to be more talkative are cal and kdz.
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shouldnt that be softcounterclaiming then (in fact hard counterclaiming since it includes you)?
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This Rita/kae interaction is quite interesting and I think there are some conclusions we can draw from it.
There is almost certainly a Rita in the game and they indeed targeted kae.
Unless kae heavily hinted at his ability and I missed it, I don't think scum!Rita would blindly use this ability, it's too risky, so there are some scenarios in which I think that's possible:
- Mafia has a Cocolia that learned the role of kae and knows it's not dangerous to them, or can make use of Yae Sakura to stop the ability if it's important, or use Fu Hua to take an use out of a vig ability.
- Mafia does not have a Cocolia but can roleblock someone using Yae Sakura/Rita combo.
- Kae is mafia and so they know the exact effect of using Rita (Why would mafia do this though?)
I don't see any reason town!Rita would do this though, but it does not have such a big, negative impact if gone wrong.
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It wouldn't surprise me if some town MW is going rogue again and randomly roleblocking people, even if it's somewhat soft roleblock.
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Didn't read kae's ....but to address his burning question: I simply pointed out Oa as confirmed town, buddying him hard, when www3 published his rolls while i was typing. I appreciated the irony and added another line.
Welp you kinda said the opposite though, confirming means you know one or more of them is scum.
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Www is suspiciously overplaying the towny confusion in this game. (3 weird attempts already) He might be mafia trying to look town.
It's w3, he's always confused.
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but wasn't MW like Dragonfly last game? He went rogue?
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ian simply holds a mean, long grudge. MW has already claimed not Rita.
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dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
RNG would never betray me :-X
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It is still sus as he did not say anything about me being wrong about him. Instead, he went straight for the shading. Not enough for me to tunnel him, but enough to put him at n-. It works out for him, because he is less likely to get nightkilled if he gets lynched first. :silly:
I am more disturbed right now by those players who I expect to remain low contributors for the rest of the game. Currently true for both dawn and shock, with slightly leading wagons.
Kdz is another zero poster. Waiting for more talk from all of them.
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hey TorB, since you're here, why do you think shock is Rita? I can infer but I just wanted to clarify
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I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be confirming these or not, but Cecilia went with TorB's plan. Just to confirm if Cecilia is found, that they did not actively go against what Town wanted/agreed upon, even though it would be rather stupid if they did at this stage (regarding targeting inactive users).
So regardless if Rita is mafia or not, the people who actively disagreed/targeted Kaempfer could be interesting to look at, and this becomes especially important if Rita is mafia.
If a Rita is found who was objective against Kaempf, putting a target on their back is likely a bad idea. You can manage some WIFOM out of this, but I think it's just more likely for them not to be mafia. Similarly, if Rita is found to be mafia, and did not scumread Kaempf, we can look at those same people under the glasses of whether they would be trying to "defend" their ally or not.
High chance I'm posting this too early, but these are my main thoughts. Catching up on active mafias has always been the death of me.
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hey TorB, since you're here, why do you think shock is Rita? I can infer but I just wanted to clarify
There are only a few people that do not give a damn about consensus and would pull moves considered to be bad town. MasterWalks has already claimed not Rita, shock has not. The fact that the target was kaempfer13 further increases the chances of Rita being shock.
I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be confirming these or not, but Cecilia went with TorB's plan.
Lynching dawn is a waste in this case. Can simply vigi instead of waste a lynch.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
I still need something from kdz.
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By the way I am of the opinion that a Day 1 lynch has a 0% chance of hitting mafia without some extremely heavy misplays, but the information gained is likely worth the lynch
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what was torbs plan with cecila, sorry i have really bad memory
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what was torbs plan with cecila, sorry i have really bad memory
Cecilia would target inactives. dawn had the lowest post count. Lynching dawn is a waste because using the ability on dawn a second time would kill dawn. Not saying Cecilia should (or should not, for that matter), just that it's a better alternative to wasting a lynch.
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Mobile post to point out in my signup I said I'd be busy until the 7th and m/w/f. I was just skimming the thread so I wouldn't be too lost when I get home when I noticed some pressure for me to talk. I'll vote and talk when I get back, promise
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1.) I am Rita.
It may be suspicious to say this, but if I were anyone else I would basically take this to mean that shock is a confirmed town. I'm crazy, but I'm not that stupid and I do appreciate winning. Targeting a random town, even if I know their potential role due to my mafia teammates is still a bad play as mafia because the town would obviously call me out as kaempf has done, causing attention to be brought to myself when players already want to lynch me before the game starts. Not to mention, I would probably have mafia teammates telling me not to use my role, especially on someone who it would work on, and someone (kaempf) who will likely be vocal about the effect.
Sure, I guess both kaempf and I could both be mafia. If you truly believe that though, it would be better to lynch kaempf first, because lynching me and flipping town doesn't clear kaempf as town. On the other hand, if we assume the only real scenario where I'm mafia as Rita is if kaempf is also mafia, then lynching kaempf first will either clear me, or convict me (yes there's a scenario where I'm town and kaempf is mafia, but in that case we still kill a mafia).
Now, if I was Rita, why would I use my role N0? I've thought a lot about this, whether or not I am actually Rita. In my opinion, using Rita N0 has way more upside than downside despite you all bandwagoning Torb's "logical" plan for each role:
- Because everyone thinks using Rita is so scummy, and since using Rita as mafia doesn't actually have too much upside without knowing everyone's role, using Rita N0 is about as town of a move as it gets, which can basically confirm someone as town if it is successful enough for the recipient to confirm its use (since you all are so keen on getting reads day 1)
- The only real info roles Rita could be interfering negatively with are Theresa and Durandal. HOWEVER, there are 3 potential mafia Rita could interfere with, which is a positive outcome, especially if the mafia hit has core of death. AND THEN, we have to factor in the fact that Theresa and Durandal could be roles given to mafia. The way I see it, it's roughly 50/50, so no net gain or loss compared to not using the ability as Rita
- I personally don't believe in N0 reads being any what accurate in determining whether someone is a cop or not. If someone has hinted so obviously that they are cop, then they're just helping mafia anyways. With that said, Rita interfering with Fu Hua has no net gain or loss, because Fu Hua is essentially guessing between all 18 players anyways, so having it protect Rita N0 is not any worse than who Fu Hua was originally protecting. If anything, Fu Hua protects the most useless role on N0 while still maintaining the same probability of protecting a town and leaving all 17 other players open to protection that next night once there is more info
- The rest of the roles being interfered with really aren't a big deal in my opinion. Honestly, probably a win to hit Yae Sakura, because Yae probably shouldn't be roleblocking anyways, since Yae actually stops roles from working and 3 of them, whereas Rita only redirects 1. Some roles, its annoying the individual players to get redirected to Rita, but honestly shouldn't make a difference in the outcome of the game compared to potentially hitting the previously mentioned roles.
So basically if I rolled Rita, then yes, I would definitely use it N0 because I actually see the upside beyond the superficial "downside" that everyone else sees. You all need to think outside the box more. If you're so set on SOLVING THE GAME THROUGH LOGIC, then we should all just role reveal now and lynch anyone who doesn't follow it, including me. It's 15 town and 3 mafia, and there are more than enough useful roles to figure out who's mafia or who is lying about their actions before we all get NKed. If you all want to role reveal and solve the game now, I'll happily follow along. If we're expected to follow Torb's "initial thoughts" on role usage, then I might deviate according to my own opinions.
I have also thought a lot about this scenario, regardless of if I'm Rita or not. One potential scenario involves mafia Rita and probably another mafia role that either allows them to block the Rita target or give them knowledge of the Rita target to ensure Rita doesn't die (which is actually pretty unlikely to happen). In this case, the mafia Rita gets the benefit of blocking kaempf while also knowing that myself and MW are the most likely players to be blamed. The upside:
- MW or shock are forced to role claim, giving mafia more info
- MW or shock are lynched, allowing for an easy town lynch day 1, that probably doesn't give many reads and creates voting patterns that are VERY EASY for mafia to hide in. I don't think anyone is getting town or mafia cred for voting me.
- We waste all day talking about Rita, which is probably not helpful at all for town (unless you're willing to stop casting my opinions aside because of my character and realize that the things I'm writing in both these spoilers are actually quite insightful and go much deeper into the game than any of you are doing)
- Forces kaempf to soft claim or narrow his role range, as well as potentially getting other players to make claims or hints towards their roles, narrowing the potential field for cops and info roles
Downsides:
- Depending on which roles town got, could be very easy to confirm who the actual Rita is the next night, and if it's not shock or MW, then it might lead to an insta lynch of the real Rita (HOWEVER, if they have Cocolia, have certain info roles themselves, or can role block, then they might be willing to go forth with this planning anyways, knowing they can get away with it while reaping the upside mentioned above.)
- If they actually just random used Rita, they're probably even crazier than me, and upon that realization may have to quit elements for life
- Everyone considers it scummy to use Rita and why draw attention to yourself when you can just hide behind Torb's plan and Rob/Linkcat's talking and get slight town reads from everyone?
Now let's explore the last scenario in which Rita is not me and is also town. In this case, they either came to the same realization I did, in which using Rita N0 can actually have some upside, or they're an idiot and are lying, and their name is MasterWalks. Who knows? I'm sure we'll find out soon enough though.
Final thoughts:
Either I'm a confirmed town Rita, or I'm not Rita but have a potentially useful role. And if I'm not Rita, then stop voting me up because you think I might be Rita and misplayed. And if you're voting me just because you think I'm chaotic, then stop taking the easy way out and being an arrogant elitist thinking players like me are so much worse at the game that you're better off wasting a lynch on a town, than potentially killing a mafia and getting way more info on someone who's been talking more. If no lynch is so bad because you don't get information and waste your power to take a stab at killing mafia, then voting up me just because you think I'm bad and a liability for town is being quite hypocritical. Instead, take your 3/17 chance on someone else rather than a 0/1 chance on me.
ACCEPTABLE REASONS TO VOTE ME TODAY:
1.) You don't think I'm Rita AND you do have information that makes you believe I might be mafia.
2.) You're one of those players who pretends to be logical but then uses shitty night 0 reads to lynch someone and one of those shitty reads happens to be that I'm mafia based off the 3 posts I've made thus far including this one.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
I'm willing to change my vote should actual, tangible information on someone come out today.
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ftr, I don't like how shock plays, BUT I don't feel like his words so far imply he's scum (yes he does play 7D chess and lie about stuff and shit, but we can clear him with the abundance of investigative roles if we really wanted), but I do think we shouldn't NL, especially in this group of pals where advocating NL kills a thread faster than w3 kills his Trials hopes :^). I'll fucking RL rather than NL even if that target ends up being me, at least that would say something about someone...
Which reminds me, Link, can you add NAI into the glossary?
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shock do you have a crush on kae though, I'm curious xD
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@shock I kinda see your point about Rita being likely town, in that town cares less than mafia if they get killed. It still sounds extremelly reckless to me to do it in N0 tho and it still hurts town just because it can disrupt roles (it's a bit like a watered down version of Yae in this sense). It should just be used if you know what your doing (which is not the case in N0)
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on second thought a watered down mind flayer is a better analogy
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I disagree with Rita usage and think shock is just as "confirmed town" as rob was "confirmed mafia" last mafia, regardless of role. Just because a move is bad as scum, it does not mean it is good as/for town or that you are town. This does not mean I think Rita is scum for it, either. The people currently lynch voting shock do not seem to be voting him on the basis of believing he is scum either.
I'm still interested in lynching mafia, though. Low content posters are harder to read, so mafia likes hiding among them. shock's last post was anything but low content. Sticking with current lynch vote for now, but it's liable to change depending on how the rest of the day develops. kdz and Cal currently stand out as potential lynch targets for me.
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@andre
There are 3 mafia and disrupting any of them is always good. There are arguably 4 useful town info roles that Rita can negatively disrupt. So roughly 50/50 odds of doing good vs. doing bad. Another key point is that it's not a role block, but a redirect. Using Rita just the first night only, isn't that bad even if it hits a cop, because then the cop knows you're safe. Not as good as finding a mafia, but also not the same as straight up role blocking. Additionally, hitting core of death or core of void with Rita is pretty great return and potentially game winning. Sure, Rita can redirect a couple other arguably relevant roles, but most of those redirects will have 0 net change in outcome if Rita is just used N0.
And I'm talking about Rita being used N0, not every night. Rita should not be used every night unless there is a clear target, but I'm talking about the benefits or Rita using her ability N0. The main goal is to get confirmed as town. The fact that there is as much upside as downside to using the role N0 is what justifies it being used N0 to try to get a free confirm.
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Also don't forget, that the useful town info roles can belong to mafia or might not even exist in this game. This improves the odds of Rita usage N0 having a positive outcome. Everyone is down to lynch no matter what on day 1 with little to no information and terrible odds. Rita has greater odds and can effectively confirm herself as town, or potentially confirm a mafia. Hitting an info role with Rita doesn't even do as much harm as you think, whereas random lynching (which you all seem to prefer over no lynch) just straight up kills a town like 90-95% of the time.
I would also argue that whoever Rita is choosing to use her ability N0, ended up causing a lot of day 1 discussion and actually leading to things happening that can create reads. So the amount of information Rita usage can potentially gain (even if it "blocks" a town role) is comparable to random lynching some town on day 1 with minimal info and no previous voting patterns.
Can you disagree with me? Sure, but at least I'm offering discussion instead of memeing about how moehrpi gave himself away or random dice rolls in chat. Those posts are legit just cluttering up the thread and making it harder for low activity players to catch up when they do have the chance to read. In fact, tons of useless posts probably cause several players to skim over posts when there's a lot and make them miss out on useful info.
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I disagree with Rita usage and think shock is just as "confirmed town" as rob was "confirmed mafia" last mafia, regardless of role. Just because a move is bad as scum, it does not mean it is good as/for town or that you are town. This does not mean I think Rita is scum for it, either. The people currently lynch voting shock do not seem to be voting him on the basis of believing he is scum either.
I'm still interested in lynching mafia, though. Low content posters are harder to read, so mafia likes hiding among them. shock's last post was anything but low content. Sticking with current lynch vote for now, but it's liable to change depending on how the rest of the day develops. kdz and Cal currently stand out as potential lynch targets for me.
But it is very easy for mafia to stay alive early phases, if you base it off activity (All they have to do is make some posts). There always tend to be a couple townies who are inactive at the start. I wouldnt lynch inactives at the start of mafia, tho if they’ve been inactive or posting useless stuff for a few phases, then i will consider going after them.
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I'm still interested in lynching mafia, though. Low content posters are harder to read, so mafia likes hiding among them. shock's last post was anything but low content. Sticking with current lynch vote for now, but it's liable to change depending on how the rest of the day develops. kdz and Cal currently stand out as potential lynch targets for me.
I think as long as we take shock's posts with a grain of salt there's no big harm on letting him live for now.
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Oh hey, dawn is alive. He claims to be Cecilia's target, so there's little point in voting dawn now.
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
@shock:
Rita, regardless of alignment, is dangerous to the user, not to the target.
I kinda see your point in disrupting mafia abilities, however, as mafia or town, hitting an offensive role will probably get you killed or disabled, which is not good for whatever alignment you have.
Using Rita tells us nothing about your alignment, so attempting to claim town based on this is nonsense. If we follow your logic and train of thought, then a mafia Rita has as much to gain from disrupting town abilities as a town Rita has to gain from disrupting mafia abilities. The only difference is that a mafia Rita isn't guessing alignments blindly. In other words, Rita would be using their ability every night regardless of alignment.
A town Rita hitting a town EoR/#U ability just wastes it and will have a negative outcome because it is the loss of an ability use that could have been useful that night. Since mafia doesn't have to worry about hitting their own kind, I find it to be a more beneficial move as scum.
Also, I think you missed something from Rita's role: It will succeed if and ONLY if the ability has exactly one target. Hitting Yae and other roles with zero or multiple targets will have no effect.
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Also, I think you missed something from Rita's role: It will succeed if and ONLY if the ability has exactly one target. Hitting Yae and other roles with zero or multiple targets will have no effect.
Keep in mind that Rose Petals only checks to see if the ability can target one player, not whether it currently is, so it will affect abilities that target "up to three" players, or "any number of players" in the case of Radio Wave.
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Sky with the clutch assist.
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Shock trying to use WIFOM to confirm himself omegalul
(https://media.giphy.com/media/71TKWPNxCawZa/giphy.gif)
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Also, I think you missed something from Rita's role: It will succeed if and ONLY if the ability has exactly one target. Hitting Yae and other roles with zero or multiple targets will have no effect.
Keep in mind that Rose Petals only checks to see if the ability can target one player, not whether it currently is, so it will affect abilities that target "up to three" players, or "any number of players" in the case of Radio Wave.
Just some extra clarification, in the case of an ability that can target more than one player, does Rose Petal makk Rita the only target?
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Just some extra clarification, in the case of an ability that can target more than one player, does Rose Petal makk Rita the only target?
Yes, Rita will be the only target of the affected abilities if Rose Petals succeeds.
The rulings section has been updated.
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I mean, if shock is rita and using his ability willynilly he will die sooner or later. Which means we dont have to lynch him now. It's kind of the perfect role for him :P. additionally a town!lieserl may be able to find out if he attracted a honkai core.
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Hello friends. I still have a bit to catch up, some things are better read on pc then mobile. One of things I saw early is the importance of voting to limit the hidden voting power, so I'll be sure to toss one down before EoD. As for now I'll try and get up to speed, like I said in my sign up and once more before this AFKness was planned and necessary.
As for a right away kill on shock, that feels a little scuffed. Lets not take our bad blood from last game into this game. It was an unfortunate miscalculation, but lynching someone for exclusively that reason now leaves a bad taste in my mouth. It seems like there is some deeper discussion surrounding shock going on in addition to that, so i'll have to read through that, but felt I should offer my initial thought
Generally I think a no lynch is a bad call, it doesn't really accomplish anything, it just allows the mafia to make the first move. DC said they would rather RL then NL which after last game I kinda agree with. I tried to play it reserved and not vote unless I was sure, but all it did was add a layer of confusion. Now, I'll admit I dont have the strongest grasp on the rules. I know what my ability is and thats about the extent of my understanding, so its possible I'm missing a compelling reason to no lynch
I know you all disagree, but I'm going to keep saying this because maybe 5 games down the road someone will actually listen. No lynch is a viable strategy, and can at times be more winning than lynching based off principle. This is even more true this game, where we have more potential roles that can find mafia and we have roles that can stop the NK. We also, imo, have much more useful information roles that can work together. A random lynch day 1 is almost certainly going to kill a town, unless someone has information to share, or if a mafia slips up really, REALLY badly. I don't see either of those happening yet. Any who thinks you can get a read off of like 3 posts day 1 that aren't slip ups is just lying to themselves.
So unless someone has information to share, we gain a lot by skipping this lynch for the following reasons:
1.) random lynch day 1 is almost always killing a town
2.) random lynch could remove a very useful role that we need
3.) putting someone up for lynch could force a role claim. What if the cop is the one with the most votes towards the end of day and has to reveal now?
3.) keeping more targets alive gives more cover for the useful roles to get the information they need before dying
4.) we have more time to make informed decisions, especially regarding how to use roles since this version of mafia is quite drastically different than previous ones
5.) I personally think day 1 lynch vote patterns are almost always meaningless, unless we get really lucky and find a way to get significant votes on a mafia, forcing them to pull some maneuvers. The odds of this are below 50/50 though (don't BS me with "reads"), and most of the time all we end up with is a dead town, a lost role, and close to zero new info.
Shock does make some good points, and I agree no lynching can be smart, especially near the end of the game, but at the beginning all it does is take us from a pretty good chance to lose a town first to a near 100% chance to lose a town first. We already had a night phase to gather info, this isn't a blind first day phase
Im going to take a few moments to read the passages I skimmed on mobile, (hint, its most of the thread) but if anyone wants to prod me over anything specific I've skated past I'll be on all day.
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sorry, have been busy, will put thoughts in a bit. for now, what are the odds shock is Bronya?
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Cecilia Schariac
Bronya Zaychik
Kallen Kaslana
Assuming this is shocks final list of preferred roles, his (prerand) odds of being bronya is about 10% and pretty slim to be rita. However he is behaving more like the latter.
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I'd like to see more lynch votes, the current tally is asking for end of day madness.
Also, I mulled over this post last night and some things were bothering me.
Torb's "logical" plan for each role
It was never meant to be a dictate on what to do, but rather a starting point for a discussion. Speaking of:
hide behind Torb's plan and Rob/Linkcat's talking and get slight town reads from everyone?
Only agreeing with me is literally the least effort next to not posting one could put in. I appreciated the discussions with people disagreeing with me, and they're the actual town leans here from my point of view. I'm not omniscient, a saint or confirmed town, so only mafia has no reason to speak up against me when disagreeing with me. Simply disagreeing with me but staying silent about it N0 -like you did- is my least favorite response to that post.
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Yep, I’m kinda contradicting myself by not voting yet but I’ll get to it long before EoD, don’t you worry!
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I did not have much time to think about votes, so I'm doing it now.
First of all, I do not believe No Lynch would be useful in this meta. The investigative roles are not guaranteed to be town, so I would not fully rely on them.
It's Day 1, so I prefer to lynch someone who's going to be less useful on the long run.
I'll take the risk of siding with shock here and say that he hasn't done anything wrong yet. Quite the opposite. With what little he has said, I get the feeling he's not mafia.
I could vote kdz, but he said he will follow up, so I'm not taking that chance away from him yet.
MW and ian are on the upper limit of low posters, plus I believe they will only get more active as time progresses.
So I am currently deciding between Calindu and dawn. They both have only 2 posts with barely any content other than theorizing about Rita and stating neutral facts.
Dawn has been targeted by Cecilia, which I believe should not be ground for not lynching dawn, but I believe others believe otherwise, so his wagon would not catch speed today.
So I am left with only one choice.
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
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Well, i'll give you the follow up now then sub, since its really nothing. A lot of the topics of discussion are either pointless or were about last nights ability usage, which doesn't really matter now.
I think the weird flak Coffee got for trying to talk when they're usually afk is just silly. They died last game n0 for being afk, and now they try to be active only to get called out for it. Its a catch-22.
I think a no lynch here is a bad call. This may seem like a departure from last game, but my inactivity (or really, indecision) caused a headache last game, and I'd rather avoid that this game and vote early
I agree with a statement torb made earlier about voting every round to limit hidden votes. I assume voting for no lynch doesn't count though.
Really I agree with pretty much everything torb had to say in their first n0 post about role usage. Not really a lot to disagree on though, most of it is pretty common sense.
I think lynching shock just because last game was rough is a silly reason to kill someone.
I don't understand what Kae is saying when they say they outed Moe.
Doesn't seem like there is much else to comment on beyond the above. Unless people want me to make comment on the plans of last night, but that just feels a little silly. If there is anything specific I missed let me know.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
Gonna go lay down for a bit, will be on for EoD.
Also, Linkcat can you include a gif/sass in every comment please. I would appreciate it. Thanks <3
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As for coffee i went as far back as 5 years to see if rob had any grounds for his argument and only found evidence of the opposite. gonna peck them as not w/w for now and slight sus for rob, as he might just be trying to lynch a lhf that isnt as lhf as he would normally be.
kdz, moe essentially said he knows one or more of oa, dc and himself are mafia. Now he claimed that he actually meant the opposite, that he doesnt believe oa is scum and thus disagrees with w3s roll. It's a matter of which version of his story you find more believable.
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Time to get some wagons going.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
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If our strat is literally to just vote off the lowest post count person then may gold help us.
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dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (1) - PlayerOa
It would be hypocrital of me not to vote, considering my chitchat and fear of Bronya in the wrong hands. Don’t put too much into it for now.
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If our strat is literally to just vote off the lowest post count person then may gold help us.
Do you have a counterproposal? Compared to a full random lynch, lynching one of the less active players seems less harmful in the long run. Activity generally benefits town. Lowest post count is indeed a terrible metric, low content is much more useful. For example: you, DC and Link have really low content/post ratios so far.
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If our strat is literally to just vote off the lowest post count person then may gold help us.
Do you have a counterproposal? Compared to a full random lynch, lynching one of the less active players seems less harmful in the long run. Activity generally benefits town. Lowest post count is indeed a terrible metric, low content is much more useful. For example: you, DC and Link have really low content/post ratios so far.
I would rather no lynch than vote someone purely because they havent posted as much. There will always be someone with the lowest posts
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dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (1) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
Guess I'll add to the action and pile on the pressure.. Though I have a sinking feeling the mafia team isn't giving a crap about the lynch (2-2-2-1-1-1-1-1-1 is... something). Or maybe it's my Asian timezone and the flurry of votes comes later tonight...
Fwiw w3 I don't think you're scum for realises, in fact you took the words right outta my mouth so you slight lean town for me
Edit to address TorB - yeah I do feel like I just spam stuff like as with talking conversations which is why each of my posts is short and might artificially inflate my post count so I apologise for that
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dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
EBWOP to fix post count also I don't think you're scum for realsies* not realises
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To further solidify my reasons for this kind of lynch vote: if town had lynched one of the people with exactly 1 post N0 like I found the most suspicious at some point last mafia, town would have had a 100% chance of hitting mafia. I know this is all hindsight, but the argument that this is a terrible strategy by default is flawed.
@DC: it's no big deal to me. It's just an example of how post count is not necessarily directly proportional to content.
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Honestly, I don't like how w3 is talking much without saying anything at all.
Also, as I said before, whoever thinks no lynch is a valid play, especially this early in the game with no plan, is bad. I still want shock dead, but maybe this train is easier to get going.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
I'm also fine with lynching one of the less active people, but for now, keeping my vote here.
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Honestly, I don't like how w3 is talking much without saying anything at all.
Half of your posts involving doing roll and calculating some math :-*
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Indeed ian, you havent said anything at all that either isnt just common sense (yh shock no lynch is bad, get that in your brain already) or scumreads based on stuff that isnt ai at all. I've come to get used to seeing that from you, but if we're going to lynch the most worthless player today it may well be you.
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If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
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If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
pfft, rob claimed that for some reason, but the reason i actually wasnt keen on lynching you last game was that you've been completely and utterly useless throughout in the game before except for getting lucky with getting a role that was confirmable by gunsmith.
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actually I think that was about calindu, so nvm I'm not even sure why you claim to be usefull late game
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If our strat is literally to just vote off the lowest post count person then may gold help us.
Do you have a counterproposal? Compared to a full random lynch, lynching one of the less active players seems less harmful in the long run. Activity generally benefits town. Lowest post count is indeed a terrible metric, low content is much more useful. For example: you, DC and Link have really low content/post ratios so far.
I would rather no lynch than vote someone purely because they havent posted as much. There will always be someone with the lowest posts
Do you remember what you said last mafia from deadpad? How no lynch was never a good idea? Now I'm pointing out how lynching inactive is not necessarily worse than a random lynch, yet you suddenly advocate no lynch while ignoring your chance to make a counter proposal? I think I'll take you up on your suggestion. Inactives were just a substitute for a lack of scum leans. Now I have one.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
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If our strat is literally to just vote off the lowest post count person then may gold help us.
Do you have a counterproposal? Compared to a full random lynch, lynching one of the less active players seems less harmful in the long run. Activity generally benefits town. Lowest post count is indeed a terrible metric, low content is much more useful. For example: you, DC and Link have really low content/post ratios so far.
I would rather no lynch than vote someone purely because they havent posted as much. There will always be someone with the lowest posts
Do you remember what you said last mafia from deadpad? How no lynch was never a good idea? Now I'm pointing out how lynching inactive is not necessarily worse than a random lynch, yet you suddenly advocate no lynch while ignoring your chance to make a counter proposal? I think I'll take you up on your suggestion. Inactives were just a substitute for a lack of scum leans. Now I have one.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
i doubt i ever said no lynching was never a good idea, considering i have voted no lynch myself before in mafia, as town.
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I know you all disagree, but I'm going to keep saying this because maybe 5 games down the road someone will actually listen. No lynch is a viable strategy, and can at times be more winning than lynching based off principle. This is even more true this game, where we have more potential roles that can find mafia and we have roles that can stop the NK. We also, imo, have much more useful information roles that can work together. A random lynch day 1 is almost certainly going to kill a town, unless someone has information to share, or if a mafia slips up really, REALLY badly. I don't see either of those happening yet. Any who thinks you can get a read off of like 3 posts day 1 that aren't slip ups is just lying to themselves.
So unless someone has information to share, we gain a lot by skipping this lynch for the following reasons:
1.) random lynch day 1 is almost always killing a town
2.) random lynch could remove a very useful role that we need
3.) putting someone up for lynch could force a role claim. What if the cop is the one with the most votes towards the end of day and has to reveal now?
3.) keeping more targets alive gives more cover for the useful roles to get the information they need before dying
4.) we have more time to make informed decisions, especially regarding how to use roles since this version of mafia is quite drastically different than previous ones
5.) I personally think day 1 lynch vote patterns are almost always meaningless, unless we get really lucky and find a way to get significant votes on a mafia, forcing them to pull some maneuvers. The odds of this are below 50/50 though (don't BS me with "reads"), and most of the time all we end up with is a dead town, a lost role, and close to zero new info.
I do agree that no lynch does work. Tho for now, it is good to vote and keep talking and look for mafia slipups and such. It is possible to find maf day 1, so we shouldn’t stop looking
Its not sudden, i posted before too agreeing with shock. Not my fault, the post just got ignored at the time
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No lynch, are u kidding me? only good time to no lynch is when im one of the leading vote tallys.
So you're claiming this was totally not you? And that this totally does not imply you think no lynch is a terrible idea?
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Finally people are realizing that www has been playing scummy so far. There is only one logical scenario where I can imagine www doing this as town, but this is not the way to do it, and he should rather take inspiration from shockcannon in that case.
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No lynch, are u kidding me? only good time to no lynch is when im one of the leading vote tallys.
So you're claiming this was totally not you? And that this totally does not imply you think no lynch is a terrible idea?
haha. that was me being sad that ill have to go more days without anyone in dead pad. Context is important and every game is different.
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http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-game-archive/elements-mafia-72-by-ginyu/msg1291899/#msg1291899
oh look sub and torb on no lynch train, with me and shock
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http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-game-archive/elements-mafia-72-by-ginyu/msg1291899/#msg1291899
oh look sub and torb on no lynch train, with me and shock
That was to answer the leading train on yourself, though? :-\
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http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-game-archive/elements-mafia-72-by-ginyu/msg1291899/#msg1291899
oh look sub and torb on no lynch train, with me and shock
That was to answer the leading train on yourself, though? :-\
shock and i were on same votes, and i went on no lynch instead of voting shock because i believed him to be town. i couldve voted shock and killed him instead as well
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It's not about whether or not no lynch is a good idea. Did I say it was a bad idea? It's about the fact that you advocate no lynch this game with no leading wagons, when you previously stated no lynch was a bad idea, only agreeing in that specific scenario you pointed out where you were a leading wagon.
No lynch, are u kidding me? only good time to no lynch is when im one of the leading vote tallys.
So you're claiming this was totally not you? And that this totally does not imply you think no lynch is a terrible idea?
haha. that was me being sad that ill have to go more days without anyone in dead pad. Context is important and every game is different.
You're right. Every game is different, you never know when someone suddenly rolls mafia and changes opinion.
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Looks like everyone is getting exposed now. Guess who's always been consistent though every game? When town has no information and has the ability to gain a lot more information the next night, no lynch increases the player count to increase the odds of getting that information you need. Just because lynch is town's greatest power for killing mafia, doesn't mean you always have to use it. If done wrong, it actually speeds up the game for mafia. The only time mafia doesn't want a lynch to happen is when one of their members is at risk of being voted up or if they know they control most of the important information roles.
Think about if you're mafia. Would you rather have a no lynch or have town kill off one of their own members on day 1 when having someone die day 1 says pretty much nothing about anyone else? Like imagine if Calindu or Masterwalks is town. Mafia is probably hoping that one of them gets offed today because it gives us basically 0 information about anyone else. That's a much preferred outcome for mafia than a no lynch, which keeps around those players who could gain real, helpful information on a following night, or who maybe have a killing role or something that could mess them up.
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SOLVING THE GAME THROUGH LOGIC
- We waste all day talking about Rita, which is probably not helpful at all for town (unless you're willing to stop casting my opinions aside because of my character and realize that the things I'm writing in both these spoilers are actually quite insightful and go much deeper into the game than any of you are doing)
- Depending on which roles town got, could be very easy to confirm who the actual Rita is the next night, and if it's not shock or MW, then it might lead to an insta lynch of the real Rita (HOWEVER, if they have Cocolia, have certain info roles themselves, or can role block, then they might be willing to go forth with this planning anyways, knowing they can get away with it while reaping the upside mentioned above.)
Four posts and I am already tilted.
That mafia plan is way to intricate to commit that many resources into it.
FWIW, mafia would use Rita N1 to find cop. kae did not mention being blocked, too.
@andre
There are 3 mafia and disrupting any of them is always good. There are arguably 4 useful town info roles that Rita can negatively disrupt. So roughly 50/50 odds of doing good vs. doing bad. Another key point is that it's not a role block, but a redirect. Using Rita just the first night only, isn't that bad even if it hits a cop, because then the cop knows you're safe. Not as good as finding a mafia, but also not the same as straight up role blocking. Additionally, hitting core of death or core of void with Rita is pretty great return and potentially game winning. Sure, Rita can redirect a couple other arguably relevant roles, but most of those redirects will have 0 net change in outcome if Rita is just used N0.
And I'm talking about Rita being used N0, not every night. Rita should not be used every night unless there is a clear target, but I'm talking about the benefits or Rita using her ability N0. The main goal is to get confirmed as town. The fact that there is as much upside as downside to using the role N0 is what justifies it being used N0 to try to get a free confirm.
That's fucking terrible.
Another word for kae: I did absolutely say DC, Oa and I are mafia. But that's not something I, or anyone else, would say unironically. As mafia or town alike. Again, I said Oa is confirmed town and obviously every post I make I try to send out town vibes. That last sentence was just to acknowledge the irony that as scum I would also try hard to make my buddies look town which coincided with www3's roll.
I will be online for the next ~3 hours and maybe for EOD. Placing my not so confident vote now on MW. He has a low enough post count and little substance in his posts. Still a shot in the dark.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
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This is the part where we wait for Cal and MW to show up and try to cover their asses. If you're 'those players who could gain real, helpful information' then you haven't done your job by getting voted up this early, whether by saying something dumb, being awol enough to be considered lhf, etc. I think someone already mirrored this sentiment, and I'll go dig this up.
Look at w3, taking shit from Oa, ian and Beef. Substantiated by a real risk of the lynch he has to speak up and defend himself, think that'll happen on NL?
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Also, Linkcat can you include a gif/sass in every comment please. I would appreciate it. Thanks <3
(https://66.media.tumblr.com/4466b8f36d8eaa1d0ed7b9d34a145d4c/tumblr_inline_n7n4evoIaJ1snrzeh.gif)
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That mafia plan is way to intricate to commit that many resources into it.
FWIW, mafia would use Rita N1 to find cop. kae did not mention being blocked, too.
I'd totally 1 for 1 Durandal for a mafia member though, why would mafia want to make that trade?
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ok, that explains it
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
just unvoting for now
i think the only (weak) scumlead i have now is rob
will reread the thread and then make my decision
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moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Coincidence?
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moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Coincidence?
S O L V E D G A M E
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MW and ian are on the upper limit of low posters, plus I believe they will only get more active as time progresses.
So I am currently deciding between Calindu and dawn. They both have only 2 posts with barely any content other than theorizing about Rita and stating neutral facts.
Haha, again deciding the lynch based on number of posts/activity level, maybe at some point it will be a lesson that this doesn't really work and you will stop doing this every single mafia.
I haven't really managed to form a scumread about anyone yet, though there are some people I slightly townread, mainly kae, TorB, Oa and shock.
kae - Seems to be making constant plans and tries to read players, I don't think he would accuse moe that hard if he were mafia
TorB - I haven't seen him play as mafia yet, but his play seems consistent to the previous mafias
Oa - This is mainly because of the Durandal check on him, though it might be completely wrong, really
shock - I disagree with the no lynch plan, since I still believe in a lynch D1, but he argues it well and plays as usual
This is the part where we wait for Cal and MW to show up and try to cover their asses. If you're 'those players who could gain real, helpful information' then you haven't done your job by getting voted up this early, whether by saying something dumb, being awol enough to be considered lhf, etc. I think someone already mirrored this sentiment, and I'll go dig this up.
Look at w3, taking shit from Oa, ian and Beef. Substantiated by a real risk of the lynch he has to speak up and defend himself, think that'll happen on NL?
Sorry I haven't done my job by being inactive N0 and half of D1, but I'll play like usual and won't put more time into it. Here's a vote on you for the time being.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
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Look at w3, taking shit from Oa, ian and Beef. Substantiated by a real risk of the lynch he has to speak up and defend himself, think that'll happen on NL?
I dont understand what conclusion you want us to derive from that.
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Look at w3, taking shit from Oa, ian and Beef. Substantiated by a real risk of the lynch he has to speak up and defend himself, think that'll happen on NL?
I dont understand what conclusion you want us to derive from that.
The morale I get from that sentence is that a No Lynch does not drive people to defend themselves. Is that not correct?
I haven't really managed to form a scumread about anyone yet, though there are some people I slightly townread, mainly kae, TorB, Oa and shock.
kae - Seems to be making constant plans and tries to read players, I don't think he would accuse moe that hard if he were mafia
TorB - I haven't seen him play as mafia yet, but his play seems consistent to the previous mafias
Oa - This is mainly because of the Durandal check on him, though it might be completely wrong, really
shock - I disagree with the no lynch plan, since I still believe in a lynch D1, but he argues it well and plays as usual
Fair post from Calindu. Sure, it doesn't give much, but I share his views on his four townreads, and putting out FOUR townreads is more solving than what the average player has done in this game.
Vote change coming soon.
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That mafia plan is way to intricate to commit that many resources into it.
FWIW, mafia would use Rita N1 to find cop. kae did not mention being blocked, too.
I'd totally 1 for 1 Durandal for a mafia member though, why would mafia want to make that trade?
They would not necessarily trade because Break of Dawn is most likely on cooldown. Rita failing her ability N1 gives a decent shot at Durandal.
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Kae was being real silly about moe but I think it makes him towny.
While it's tempting to lynch w3 D1 after he died N0 last game, I'm going to need to see more before I go down that route.
Cal lynch is silly, don't want to lynch dawn since he's half dead already, would rather lynch MW.
No Lynch is only a good idea when it's very unlikely that any top wagon is town and there's not enough time to find a new target. This happened I believe in both 68 and 72. However, in this game even in such a scenario we can just lynch shock which is a +EV play.
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Kae was being real silly about moe but I think it makes him towny.
While it's tempting to lynch w3 D1 after he died N0 last game, I'm going to need to see more before I go down that route.
Cal lynch is silly, don't want to lynch dawn since he's half dead already, would rather lynch MW.
No Lynch is only a good idea when it's very unlikely that any top wagon is town and there's not enough time to find a new target. This happened I believe in both 68 and 72. However, in this game even in such a scenario we can just lynch shock which is a +EV play.
you mean mafia, or very likely, not unlikely
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//thats a slipup! links a mafia
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This is the part where we wait for Cal and MW to show up and try to cover their asses. If you're 'those players who could gain real, helpful information' then you haven't done your job by getting voted up this early, whether by saying something dumb, being awol enough to be considered lhf, etc. I think someone already mirrored this sentiment, and I'll go dig this up.
Look at w3, taking shit from Oa, ian and Beef. Substantiated by a real risk of the lynch he has to speak up and defend himself, think that'll happen on NL?
Rob said it earlier too
(snip)
3.) putting someone up for lynch could force a role claim. What if the cop is the one with the most votes towards the end of day and has to reveal now? Then the cop should gett gud and do things that convince people not to vote them and to instead vote someone scummy. Also, you seem to be forgetting that the cop roles this setup could also be scum-sided or not present (obviously Durandal is present given the Oa announcement at start of Day).
3.) keeping more targets alive gives more cover for the useful roles to get the information they need before dying So you are suggesting to just sit pat and try to have nobody die while town uses roles to find all the scum and win 15-0? I just cannot agree that No Lynch is viable/right strategy here.
(snip)
Look at w3, taking shit from Oa, ian and Beef. Substantiated by a real risk of the lynch he has to speak up and defend himself, think that'll happen on NL?
I dont understand what conclusion you want us to derive from that.
The morale I get from that sentence is that a No Lynch does not drive people to defend themselves. Is that not correct?
(snip)
More or less, votes speak. Maybe I'm being influenced by elections tonight I'm sorry
That mafia plan is way to intricate to commit that many resources into it.
FWIW, mafia would use Rita N1 to find cop. kae did not mention being blocked, too.
I'd totally 1 for 1 Durandal for a mafia member though, why would mafia want to make that trade?
They would not necessarily trade because Break of Dawn is most likely on cooldown. Rita failing her ability N1 gives a decent shot at Durandal.
Oh right, Rita can't force a ability if it's on CD right?
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Oh right, Rita can't force a ability if it's on CD right?
Right.
You could still draw a kill role to yourself or an info role (though NAI, I guess, unless Theresa), while not drawing any ability is true for enough abilities to not be substantial evidence, so I think Rita N1 is not particularly good as scum. Better than N0, I suppose.
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There is only one logical scenario where I can imagine www doing this as town, but this is not the way to do it, and he should rather take inspiration from shockcannon in that case.
I'm trying to wrap my head around this, but it does not make sense for www to do what he does in the one scenario I'm thinking about... This scenario is having a power role he wants to save by not getting nightkilled, which he wants to achieve by looking slightly scummy. But if this is the case, then he is doing it horribly and it's only his fault if he gets lynched for it.
So yeah, put my vote on www.
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So yeah, put my vote on www.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
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Finally people are realizing that www has been playing scummy so far. There is only one logical scenario where I can imagine www doing this as town, but this is not the way to do it, and he should rather take inspiration from shockcannon in that case.
im not sure what part is scummy. saying i agree with no vote, in certain instances? As mafia, i would go along with lynching is good and put a vote on so many options that are already present rather than bring upon attention :facepalm:
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I grossly overestimated how much time I would have available to play this game. I will either be absent at EOD (boooo >:( ) or phone/mobile posting only (also boooo). C'est la vie.
I presume a town-sided Durandal would claim red peek on Oa by now. If the Durandal was active enough to pick a target then I strongly presume they would out if Oa were scum. If Durandal was redirected off of Oa then well we have some thinking cut out for ourselves at some point as cop would not really be proper to out that now - but it would mean that it is likely scum has redirect role and that Oa is a separate scum, only likely though not guaranteed.
--> It is likely Oa is town - if Durandal is scum, or if Oa was a redirect and not Durandal's real target then it gets murky regarding Oa.
kae/moe unlikely w/w could be t/t. It seems odd that at the end of it, kae was taking moe as somehow being serious about any kind of comment implying any sort of roll is accurate or inaccurate. Like nobody outs themselves like that in my opinion. As I ponder it kae actually thinking that makes little sense because experience tells he is more keen than that but kae faking that reaction also makes little sense UNLESS he is scum and latching on to that "out" was a thought that others would buy into it? Again though little sense because surely kae knows moe was not being serious on that part and would know almost nobody would think that was an 'out' and join his push on moe? I guess for me moe seems fine in that event/interaction and kae is ?wtf? for me (slightly more scum than town lean though as I think town kae knows that isn't an out and sees no benefit in trying to push it as one; scum!kae just _might_ could be searching hard enough for something to push someone on that he was caught up enough to think others would believe moe was lynchable on that post -- scum!kae = town!moe; town!kae = ??town!moe?).
shock is now making some shock posts. Again having no past scum!shock basis to judge against we're left guessing at the scum-end of the play scale for shock. No Lynch in this case I believe is bad play bad idea. Not exactly scummy the way shock brings it up - nobody was on the No Lynch topic until shock brought it up right? I think... I'm unsure if shock is Rita or not-Rita but I have a hunch one certain way that I'll keep private _for now_. I lean a bit town on shock at the moment - I still think a scum!shock is going to be "less shock-like" and so far it is a thumbprint match to what I saw of him last game and heard of him about previous games.
Coffee shade earlier was based on a very old (thanks Link for pointing out JUST how old!!) recollection that was foggy at best, as I stated already when I brought it up. If I actually thought coffee had a true activity tell and that this was indicative only of a scum!coffee then I would have pushed it much harder than I did. I didn't even vote him on it (was it night still at the time and I couldn't vote? if it was I would have said I'd vote him but can't instead I just didn't vote nor mention wanting to vote him). The 49 game never actually finished so perhaps I was simply confused by a lean I had that was never resolved. IN any case I'd like to rest the coffee activity thing because active coffee is good for the game (active anyone is good for the game) and I do NOT believe it is any kind of 'tell' for him.
whoever said it resonated with me ---- www3 doing a lot of posting/defending in a way that seems only about saving himself not solving around on others. That is a scummy thing generally. However, I wouldn't put it past a town!www3 to be doing it just like this. Also in reading back some of his posts to find why he is sitting on DC (hint: he stated RNG ??) I found a post with www3 asking medic to protect him - either more www3 low-content posting or a serious post that only serves to unnecessarily endanger him if he is town and appear as role-fishing if he is scum. A tip - you don't seem like a very likely NK candidate at this point...... a very slight scum lean from www3 so far, but maybe that's his plan?
Link has been oddly somewhat awol - but truly NAI stuff from him so far (that is, I believe he is easily well-well-well within his scum or town 'range' -- shock, if you hate feel/gut reads, reads in general, lynching people, and other general aspects of regular mafia gameplay I'm surprised you haven't latched onto the "range" principle several of us have used in recent games...).
dawn still being very very low post and basically low-content due to such VERY few posts. While in a vacuum that isn't exactly scummy, recent games I have played on here the low posters has almost always had a scum in it (Ge0 and timpa last game, both of which I sus'd early but nobody wanted to join me). The idea some are floating that lynching low posters is just always bad and never do it is not a good plan. Especially considering around here the prevailing opinion is NOT to shoot vig roles into inactive crowd during mid-game. Put those two together and wtf would scum not want to sit among low posters as long as possible? Get in gear and start posting things - at least something. If you have to low post then please high-content post but if you can a moderate-to-higher volume AND content is even better.
MW - maybe his RL is different and a fwe days is a small sample size, but his activity seems not only lower but different than last game... he was more like a butterfly last game flitting here and there sometimes appearing no purpose to it or confusing purpose and other times displaying intent to solve/investigate/kill-scum/etc --- whereas this game very few "flits" and just a very different MW vibe. Not exactly scummy at this point, but it does get some scum-lean from me.
Surely I have overlooked some aspects of the thread flow so far and players with something to be said about them... but I just don't have time to get too far into it on EVERYONE at this stage. A traveshamockery of my usual style of play. I do not apologize.
Town leans - Oa, moe, shock, coffee // TorB, Naii
Neutral territory - Link // ian, timpa, Sub, kdz, DC
Scum angled - kae, www3, d2d, MW
at this point I haven't been able to flesh enough out to try to give honest vv v n+ n n- w ww categorizing yet... and the order above is the order I found to talk about them farther above. I still find d2d a viable wagon and lynch option today. He still has votes (wagon) but not much traction (current ebb is toward www3 vs MW). I have a scum lean on all three (scummy coincidence? or just par for those three having generally had the most non-town/scummy play so far? you decide). I think it is time to start truly building legit lynch candidate wagons.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
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Also, I believe at least several players get anxiety over the idea of late game-day antics, movement, and investigating-by-creating-vote-chocie-and-wagon-information activity... I was a common instigator of such last game and I thought it was useful and still think it is. I approve of it. I just won't be able to do it much if at all this day from a phone at EOD. Don't hate/love me for it. If others can do it for value/info then have at!
/PSA nobody asked for
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Town leans - Oa, moe, shock, coffee // TorB, Naii
Neutral territory - Link // ian, timpa, Sub, kdz, DC
Scum angled - kae, www3, d2d, MW
What do the slashes in your reads mean?
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A hot thought just popped into mind... it is last game based but could be relevant again in this one as both players are in it and alive / active.
Sub- I should have been "on to you" last game when you made it abundantly clear you remembered scum!rob from years past mislynching town!Sub for one of your bad-town-Sub ideas/plans yet you displayed very very little apprehension about me being town or scum last game. Town or scum Sub makes sense to remember that horribly successful mislynch push on you I made that game but town!Sub would have been much more affected by it I think whereas you just kind of mentioned it and mostly let go of it rest of the game. /20-20-hindsight-is-fun
THIS GAME: That being said, I know pre-game you mentioned taking a different approach of being much less active but looking so far you're quite active. Were just pre-game covering in case you rand scum again and needed a break from the extreme grind that rolling scum can take on detailed solve-y type players? In any case, I'm currently thinking that is towny of you --- scum Sub would simply lean harder into his pre-game cover post but town!Sub probably gets caught up in the game and drawn into it a bit... I think what I see is more the latter than former (although you did mention a callback to the pre-game cover post once, your just not following/leaning on it much).
Town leans - Oa, moe, shock, coffee, Sub // TorB, Naii
Neutral territory - Link // ian, timpa, kdz, DC
Scum angled - kae, www3, d2d, MW
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Town leans - Oa, moe, shock, coffee // TorB, Naii
Neutral territory - Link // ian, timpa, Sub, kdz, DC
Scum angled - kae, www3, d2d, MW
What do the slashes in your reads mean?
Oh right, I forgot to explain that part. They have some meaning and thanks for asking.
Slashes mean I didn't yet mention a direct recent read of them in that category with supporting reasons etc but on an overall feel (get incited, shock!) of the person's play so far they fit that category of gut-read (double down shock!).
For example, Sub just got a read post from me... and moved from past-slashes neutral to before-slashes town leans.
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What about Calindu missing on the lists?
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I interpreted a post that simply said "ok" as a slip once and raved about it all game and scum wouldnt let me lynch the dude (who was town while i was innocent child). I'm extremely sensitive when it comes to slips and I didnt see a jokey tone in moe's post. But yh, i'll drop the issue I should have learned from that experience after all.
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What about Calindu missing on the lists?
I definitely left my scumbuddy off the list to try to sneakily avoid drawing attention to him. 8-)
He is in there with 'territorials', like this:
Town leans - Oa, moe, shock, coffee, Sub // TorB, Naii
Neutral territory - Link // ian, timpa, kdz, DC, Cal
Scum angled - kae, www3, d2d, MW
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Sub- I should have been "on to you" last game when you made it abundantly clear you remembered scum!rob from years past mislynching town!Sub for one of your bad-town-Sub ideas/plans yet you displayed very very little apprehension about me being town or scum last game. Town or scum Sub makes sense to remember that horribly successful mislynch push on you I made that game but town!Sub would have been much more affected by it I think whereas you just kind of mentioned it and mostly let go of it rest of the game.
I tried, but then I discovered something that made me drop that point entirely. Would you believe me if I confused you with JCJ because of your avatar? ^^"
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W3 always defends himself a lot, that's not a scumtell.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
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Ok going through the signuplist one by one:
Linkcat
I dont like how he straight went to lynching shock without even trying to gage anyones alignement (especially shocks) first, but considering how shock is its own antitownfaction its understandable. However if you think shock always plays against townwincondition and should always be lynched you just shouldnt let him signup in the first place.
Other than that he seems to go with the same shitposty lowcontent approach he had in mafia 72 and has raised some valid points at least.
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so n, probably leaning more + than - as he seems to put some content out now.
Sorry, forgot to give the actual rating I will keep it at 1 post per person starting now.
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so n, probably leaning more + than - as he seems to put some content out now.
Sorry, forgot to give the actual rating I will keep it at 1 post per person starting now.
maybe more than one person per post?
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those types of walls simply make ian not play anymore, so I want to avoid that
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so n, probably leaning more + than - as he seems to put some content out now.
Sorry, forgot to give the actual rating I will keep it at 1 post per person starting now.
maybe more than one person per post?
Gotta win that top poster "award".
those types of walls simply make ian not play anymore, so I want to avoid that
Walls of posts are much worse, while having at least as much text. You can always put the read for each person in a spoiler. Let's not make a repeat of last mafia where you had 12+ posts in a row?
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alright, but theres another reason im not doing full walls anymore; you sit for 4hours on a post simply to make a readlist, a bad breeze and its all gone so you copy your progress multiple times and have the choice of being completely unable to react or constantly busy reacting to the thread.
ok to more than 1 person though
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5Head solution: Write in a text document, then copy and post at the end.
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However if you think shock always plays against townwincondition and should always be lynched you just shouldn't let him signup in the first place.
Now that would just be mean.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
reason?
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Do I need one?
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Well I don't understand why I'm still getting hate
(https://v.cdn.vine.co/r/thumbs/21ED0CD9DC1365098513670844416_1.3.4.mp4.jpg?versionId=HRZZMdasW2fXPR3UOhL19qSeWZjc2_U2)
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Do I need one?
I'm going to go with 'yes'.
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TheonlyrealBeef
just like last time we disagree about some mechanics, but now i know that that isnt sus for him. He puts out a lot of content and is making sense so I put him at n+
shockcannon
Sigh. I see no difference to his usual (town-)play. If he doesnt get himself killed or out a mafia through his role his lynch is probably inevitable and may or may not be a good thing.
PlayerOa
I suppose Durandal resolves this unless durandal is scum. i found his long silence after being durandaled suspicious, but that has somewhat subsided and durandal feels no need to claim, so probably town. v
iancudorinmarian
Useless. n
worldwideweb3
I too gave him flak for being overly defensive in mafia 72. as link said, thats just his normal. Advocating no lynch this early is odd, but at the same time he brings extra attention to himself by doing that. Still wrong to do that rn, no lynch is for eod panic (and even then rarely advantageous) and mylo only.
I cant really form much of a read from the rest of his posts either unfortunately. n
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However if you think shock always plays against townwincondition and should always be lynched you just shouldn't let him signup in the first place.
Now that would just be mean.
And just intakilling him each game while dragging down whichever faction hes playing for is less mean?
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However if you think shock always plays against townwincondition and should always be lynched you just shouldn't let him signup in the first place.
Now that would just be mean.
And just intakilling him each game while dragging down whichever faction hes playing for is less mean?
Well none of our like 6 vigs shot him and he currently has zero votes, so I don't think it will be a problem.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
I actually have no idea where to place my vote, but for this game at least, voting is a must.
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I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be confirming these or not, but Cecilia went with TorB's plan. Just to confirm if Cecilia is found, that they did not actively go against what Town wanted/agreed upon, even though it would be rather stupid if they did at this stage (regarding targeting inactive users).
So regardless if Rita is mafia or not, the people who actively disagreed/targeted Kaempfer could be interesting to look at, and this becomes especially important if Rita is mafia.
The Cecilia part is important to note for who targeted who, but it sounds like it was aligned with how town asked, like you said. This could be important later. As far as the disagreeing with Kaempfer, the way he had repeatedly addressed his dissatisfaction with being targeted by her was kind of odd, but not out of character, and I could feasibly see a shock(rita) or town rita fun-using their ability just for the hell of it, even though it has many more potential negative outcomes than positive for town; we hadn't discussed such before the night ended, so someone who hadn't considered the possibilities could have just wasted it on a random town. We will need to see how rita or kaempfer flip.
By the way I am of the opinion that a Day 1 lynch has a 0% chance of hitting mafia without some extremely heavy misplays, but the information gained is likely worth the lynch
3/15 chance.
1.) I am Rita.
It may be suspicious to say this, but if I were anyone else I would basically take this to mean that shock is a confirmed town. No. I'm crazy, but I'm not that stupid and I do appreciate winning. Targeting a random town, even if I know their potential role due to my mafia teammates is still a bad play as mafia because the town would obviously call me out as kaempf has done, causing attention to be brought to myself when players already want to lynch me before the game starts. Not to mention, I would probably have mafia teammates telling me not to use my role, especially on someone who it would work on, and someone (kaempf) who will likely be vocal about the effect. The thing is, you could easily hide in other roles or not claim until investigated or lynched. There would be no need for you to go on the defense about Rita abilities like as such.
Sure, I guess both kaempf and I could both be mafia. If you truly believe that though, it would be better to lynch kaempf first, because lynching me and flipping town doesn't clear kaempf as town. On the other hand, if we assume the only real scenario where I'm mafia as Rita is if kaempf is also mafia, then lynching kaempf first will either clear me, or convict me (yes there's a scenario where I'm town and kaempf is mafia, but in that case we still kill a mafia). Ideally, we avoid lynching either of you, but a kaempf lynch wouldn't be awful as we know he isn't Durandal. The issue arises if he is Theresa, but he would out that if so.
Now, if I was Rita, why would I use my role N0? I've thought a lot about this, whether or not I am actually Rita. In my opinion, using Rita N0 has way more upside than downside despite you all bandwagoning Torb's "logical" plan for each role:
- Because everyone thinks using Rita is so scummy, and since using Rita as mafia doesn't actually have too much upside without knowing everyone's role, using Rita N0 is about as town of a move as it gets, which can basically confirm someone as town if it is successful enough for the recipient to confirm its use (since you all are so keen on getting reads day 1) That's absolutely not true. That doesn't confirm someone in either direction, and it would be dumb in either direction to claim because you would get scumread either way. It would just show as a ballsy or dumb maf.
- The only real info roles Rita could be interfering negatively with are Theresa and Durandal. HOWEVER, there are 3 potential mafia Rita could interfere with, which is a positive outcome, especially if the mafia hit has core of death. AND THEN, we have to factor in the fact that Theresa and Durandal could be roles given to mafia. The way I see it, it's roughly 50/50, so no net gain or loss compared to not using the ability as Rita. You forgot about driving the doc save away from someone and confirming a kill with a maf-sided vig role or the core of death.
- I personally don't believe in N0 reads being any what accurate in determining whether someone is a cop or not. If someone has hinted so obviously that they are cop, then they're just helping mafia anyways. With that said, Rita interfering with Fu Hua has no net gain or loss, because Fu Hua is essentially guessing between all 18 players anyways, so having it protect Rita N0 is not any worse than who Fu Hua was originally protecting. If anything, Fu Hua protects the most useless role on N0 while still maintaining the same probability of protecting a town and leaving all 17 other players open to protection that next night once there is more info. Again, a mafia Rita can take the doc off of someone and confirm a vig kill.
- The rest of the roles being interfered with really aren't a big deal in my opinion. Honestly, probably a win to hit Yae Sakura, because Yae probably shouldn't be roleblocking anyways, since Yae actually stops roles from working and 3 of them, whereas Rita only redirects 1. Some roles, its annoying the individual players to get redirected to Rita, but honestly shouldn't make a difference in the outcome of the game compared to potentially hitting the previously mentioned roles. Valid.
So basically if I rolled Rita, then yes, I would definitely use it N0 because I actually see the upside beyond the superficial "downside" that everyone else sees. You all need to think outside the box more. If you're so set on SOLVING THE GAME THROUGH LOGIC, then we should all just role reveal now and lynch anyone who doesn't follow it, including me. It's 15 town and 3 mafia, and there are more than enough useful roles to figure out who's mafia or who is lying about their actions before we all get NKed. If you all want to role reveal and solve the game now, I'll happily follow along. If we're expected to follow Torb's "initial thoughts" on role usage, then I might deviate according to my own opinions. Spouting about how we're playing wrong and we should listen to you or we're dumb is not making you look like a useful player.
I have also thought a lot about this scenario, regardless of if I'm Rita or not. One potential scenario involves mafia Rita and probably another mafia role that either allows them to block the Rita target or give them knowledge of the Rita target to ensure Rita doesn't die (which is actually pretty unlikely to happen). In this case, the mafia Rita gets the benefit of blocking kaempf while also knowing that myself and MW are the most likely players to be blamed. The upside:
- MW or shock are forced to role claim, giving mafia more info
- MW or shock are lynched, allowing for an easy town lynch day 1, that probably doesn't give many reads and creates voting patterns that are VERY EASY for mafia to hide in. I don't think anyone is getting town or mafia cred for voting me.
- We waste all day talking about Rita, which is probably not helpful at all for town (unless you're willing to stop casting my opinions aside because of my character and realize that the things I'm writing in both these spoilers are actually quite insightful and go much deeper into the game than any of you are doing) Come on, guy.
- Forces kaempf to soft claim or narrow his role range, as well as potentially getting other players to make claims or hints towards their roles, narrowing the potential field for cops and info roles,
Downsides:
- Depending on which roles town got, could be very easy to confirm who the actual Rita is the next night, and if it's not shock or MW, then it might lead to an insta lynch of the real Rita (HOWEVER, if they have Cocolia, have certain info roles themselves, or can role block, then they might be willing to go forth with this planning anyways, knowing they can get away with it while reaping the upside mentioned above.)
- If they actually just random used Rita, they're probably even crazier than me, and upon that realization may have to quit elements for life. what
- Everyone considers it scummy to use Rita and why draw attention to yourself when you can just hide behind Torb's plan and Rob/Linkcat's talking and get slight town reads from everyone?More kills from maf means easier win?
Now let's explore the last scenario in which Rita is not me and is also town. In this case, they either came to the same realization I did, in which using Rita N0 can actually have some upside, or they're an idiot and are lying, and their name is MasterWalks. Who knows? I'm sure we'll find out soon enough though.
Thoughts inside spoilers
Making a couple more posts, should be 3 total
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
I actually have no idea where to place my vote, but for this game at least, voting is a must.
Worst vote so far. Don't push someone further into the lead unless you're scumreading them.
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MasterWalks
his ideas of how to use certain roles killed some brain cells, but this isnt ai for him. He's not exactly acting unusual so far, but cant say that i liked anything I saw so far either. n
andretimpa
I think he's posting much more than last time, even if much of it is quite short and rule questions. Maybe the tiniest townlean. n+
dawn to dusk
Welp lowest poster in the game, obviously i got pretty much nothing. His catchup post sounded earnest to me, but obv there is a serious lack of content. n
Submachine
Sub isnt even Sub this game. he seems to go for hyperagression and lowish effort and didnt scrutinize mechanics himself. I'm a little confused. Per default i assume that not fully explainable deviations from normal playstyle=scumlean so n-
killsdazombies
unusually defensive for someone who claimed to usually go for twtbaw-charm last game. not sure if he is adjusting to our playstyle (nai) or scum. n-
Coffeeditto
He's posting. v
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I think the weird flak Coffee got for trying to talk when they're usually afk is just silly. They died last game n0 for being afk, and now they try to be active only to get called out for it. Its a catch-22.
As for coffee i went as far back as 5 years to see if rob had any grounds for his argument and only found evidence of the opposite. gonna peck them as not w/w for now and slight sus for rob, as he might just be trying to lynch a lhf that isnt as lhf as he would normally be.
hey thanks guys :)
I would rather no lynch than vote someone purely because they havent posted as much. There will always be someone with the lowest posts
And those people, coupled with low substance, don't add to the town positively and we have somewhere around 5 mislynchs we can afford. I would rather cull the least helpful than allow them to keep using abilities if they're maf.
If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
Not a solid defense unless it's some weird soft, and kind of scumread this line as a defense with nonchalance as a mask.
Do I need one?
Well I don't understand why I'm still getting hate
(https://v.cdn.vine.co/r/thumbs/21ED0CD9DC1365098513670844416_1.3.4.mp4.jpg?versionId=HRZZMdasW2fXPR3UOhL19qSeWZjc2_U2)
weird interaction
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Once ya'll are done killing MW today, can ya'll be a little nicer to them.
The dude already asked ya'll to stop
...
Y'all are hella mean btw
From what I understand MW misplayed with a blocking role a few games ago, thats cool. If theres real bitterness in your heart over that you gotta let it go. Don't take this as me defending MW btw, I have no insight into their alignment. But I can say I wouldn't really be all the eager to post if I were catching half the flak they are.
I'd just like to really remind everyone that all the players here are people, and that this is just a game. :) I understand that 95% of this game is just acting, and the things that are said don't really reflect what ya'll think but lets calm this down before it gets out of hand.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
I actually have no idea where to place my vote, but for this game at least, voting is a must.
Worst vote so far. Don't push someone further into the lead unless you're scumreading them.
There's still well over 5 hours left with plenty of people bound to be on around deadline, so creating a tie is not bad, yet. Analyzing wagons is far less useful if one wagon maintains a solid lead, watching one of the three wagons dissolve around EoD to form two wagons will be really interesting.
Once ya'll are done killing MW today, can ya'll be a little nicer to them.
The dude already asked ya'll to stop
...
Y'all are hella mean btw
From what I understand MW misplayed with a blocking role a few games ago, thats cool. If theres real bitterness in your heart over that you gotta let it go. Don't take this as me defending MW btw, I have no insight into their alignment. But I can say I wouldn't really be all the eager to post if I were catching half the flak they are.
I'd just like to really remind everyone that all the players here are people, and that this is just a game. :) I understand that 95% of this game is just acting, and the things that are said don't really reflect what ya'll think but lets calm this down before it gets out of hand.
ian isn't even on the MW wagon :P
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Also, I believe at least several players get anxiety over the idea of late game-day antics, movement, and investigating-by-creating-vote-chocie-and-wagon-information activity... I was a common instigator of such last game and I thought it was useful and still think it is. I approve of it. I just won't be able to do it much if at all this day from a phone at EOD. Don't hate/love me for it. If others can do it for value/info then have at!
/PSA nobody asked for
The EoD antics just get tiring when they happen every time. I agree they can put some pep in peoples step, and it opens the door for the mafia to make misplays when they panic. It does however, open the door for town to make mistakes too. We play with fire when we do these EoD dances, and we saw we have a tendency to get burned. Just remember moderation rob, beyond that I look forward to spending every other day refreshing this page like crazy at eod :P
Also, Linkcat can you include a gif/sass in every comment please. I would appreciate it. Thanks <3
(https://66.media.tumblr.com/4466b8f36d8eaa1d0ed7b9d34a145d4c/tumblr_inline_n7n4evoIaJ1snrzeh.gif)
thank you :)
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Sub- I should have been "on to you" last game when you made it abundantly clear you remembered scum!rob from years past mislynching town!Sub for one of your bad-town-Sub ideas/plans yet you displayed very very little apprehension about me being town or scum last game. Town or scum Sub makes sense to remember that horribly successful mislynch push on you I made that game but town!Sub would have been much more affected by it I think whereas you just kind of mentioned it and mostly let go of it rest of the game.
I tried, but then I discovered something that made me drop that point entirely. Would you believe me if I confused you with JCJ because of your avatar? ^^"
Side note, I did that twice last game. You are not alone in your pain.
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MasterWalks
his ideas of how to use certain roles killed some brain cells, but this isnt ai for him. He's not exactly acting unusual so far, but cant say that i liked anything I saw so far either. n
andretimpa
I think he's posting much more than last time, even if much of it is quite short and rule questions. Maybe the tiniest townlean. n+
dawn to dusk
Welp lowest poster in the game, obviously i got pretty much nothing. His catchup post sounded earnest to me, but obv there is a serious lack of content. n
Submachine
Sub isnt even Sub this game. he seems to go for hyperagression and lowish effort and didnt scrutinize mechanics himself. I'm a little confused. Per default i assume that not fully explainable deviations from normal playstyle=scumlean so n-
killsdazombies
unusually defensive for someone who claimed to usually go for twtbaw-charm last game. not sure if he is adjusting to our playstyle (nai) or scum. n-
Coffeeditto
He's posting. v
this read list has a lot of nearly full-opposite angles than I hold, and stated in my own reads.
Kae-
MW: I find your take to be not inline with thread content, as I see it. Last game town!MW was a daily post of handfuls of posts/ideas... looks like around 20 posts per "day/night" most of which I recall being in the category of saying something about or to or on the game in some way. Here he has 6 posts one is signup and one is "yikes", not just post count but really I find his style and content of posting to be a little like his last time but on the whole your read of his 6 (really 4) posts so far seems ...... "off" to me. Almost like you wanted to say things about his play but didn't know what. Gives me a scummy little ping when I read it.
timpa: is this just a straight postcoutn town-lean fromyou? Again, can't quite put my finger on it but it has a feel similar to what I said above, has a feel of a manufactured read?
Sub: what do you think about his play so far looking a bit different than his pre-game cover about being less involved?
kdz: unusually defensive in 7 posts (most were pre-game I think) where he mostly seems to be just like last game where he mentions his lack of tiem for the game a lot and it aligns with his pre-game schedule mentions etc. Not sure how you get to the read you stated from what he's done so far?
Coffee: is this just a straight postcount village lean? What is leading you to tie coffee alignment to post count in this way?
--> kae - why are you forcing something on every player? I mean, doing it is fine I suppose but it really feels forced on your end so far and I don't understand why you might think you have to force on every player to have a read (that is, text that accompanies how you lean or do not lean them).
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because i kinda hate voting without having a read on everyone; last time I ran out of time I think, this time there is just nothing there really.
didnt consider postcount for mw, just that like always I immediately regret reading anything he writes.
timpa- pretty much
sub, ill have another look at what he said pregame, but it seemed to me like he was just going to post less not switch up his playstyle entirely.
didnt pay attention to how many of those posts were pregame. I do agree that the content that is not "oh shit I need to post more or people will scumread me" is valid though, but I do want to know why so paranoid when he claims to normally actually deliberately look scummy.
coffee
I think his points are all valid too.
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killsdazombies
unusually defensive for someone who claimed to usually go for twtbaw-charm last game. not sure if he is adjusting to our playstyle (nai) or scum. n-
I mentioned I tend to do this in in-person games. Its much harder for me to do so in text mafia. I tend to over examine my posts and tone, and it makes either my memey scummness appear overtly phony or just boring to read. I've written up posts and tried to go for it here and last game, but either I over think it, or it just doesn't contribute, so whats the point. You'll notice I didn't go out of my way to do it last game (I just sorta let myself sit near the spotlight for some time.) because I had a power role and therefor something to gain by being immune to the NK.
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ebwop: Unlike you stated there actually seems to be a link between postcount and alignement for coffee, which is opposite to what you said.
And as stated before coffee has a meta of 0 content, which is easy to continue as scum, yet he chose not to.
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Coffee/dawn - Whos you’re vote on rn
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ebwop: Unlike you stated there actually seems to be a link between postcount and alignement for coffee, which is opposite to what you said.
And as stated before coffee has a meta of 0 content, which is easy to continue as scum, yet he chose not to.
I would disagree - I don't think there is any postcount tell for coffee which means I was down the wrong path at first, but NOT opposite of what I said. That's how I see it anyway. I'd point out that if you have non-postcount reasons for a read or lean on someone you should include that instead of defaulting to a short/small postcount-only read. Again that's how I see it anyway.
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Coffee/dawn - Whos you’re vote on rn
making read post right now one minute
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
I actually have no idea where to place my vote, but for this game at least, voting is a must.
Worst vote so far. Don't push someone further into the lead unless you're scumreading them.
I agree with this sentiment, and will add that you could also do it if you'd like more information on them. That being said, I scumread ian a bit for just going afk after people stopped pushing him, but I see more of a lack in content from recent DC posts and I would rather him than MasterWalks; I see more potential output from
dumb idea I remembered from Town of Salem
Raiden can protect away cop-type roles from the nightkill if they are forced to claim
congrats ian, you're useful now
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
Just saw this. Did you not read his guide?
somehow it slipped my mind, I stopped reading at 'extremely powerful for scum' and thought 'oh, we don't use this' at first. Fuck me LOL
Forgot to point this out earlier; this feels like a dumbtell. You didn't read someones insight into a role because you saw that it said powerful for scum?
//
As of right now, everyone has posted since d1 started, and as such, we can safely assume we have either a maf Durandal or oa is town.
Link is being Link as many others have said already, and I can't formulate a read on him.
TORB is being very useful for town, so i townread him as we should. Might be worth to investigate him just to be sure.
Shock's posts have been less than helpful, and instead provided some pseudo-sciences behind his odd thought process on what would be viable in the game. Not especially helpful.
ian is one of my stronger scumreads after that line i quoted in my prior post; it seems a little too careless for a maf, but he knew the bandwagon wasn't going to turn on him, so it might have been smart to act nonplussed by it.
I don't see www3 as maf here yet. defense is not inherently scummy, he could be an important PR.
MW is a not so helpful town right now to me.
andre makes good posts when he does post, so neutral for me.
dawn claimed he was hit once by the 2hit vig, so he is probably dead, but i townread him outing the vig hit. can't rule out the possibility he was lying about it to not get lynched, though.
kaempfer is all over the place.
Sub is a little less active and pushing than the sub i have seen earlier, maybe keep an eye on him but neutral to me for now.
rob is a different rob but making the same valid points, so I have to townread him for now. he has also given a reason for his activity and ~honor system~
dc needs to give us actual content instead of fillering. scum read here
Calindu isn't going to contribute much to the game I feel, but he isn't being detrimental.
naii's vote was very odd and his content otherwise has been lacking. scummyish
i like moe's reactions a lot to be honest. his interactions with kae put him into a slight town read for me.
out of these 3, I would lynch DC for his scumdumbtells and info other than the filler, but otherwise, I would rather get ian. for now, my vote lies on dc
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
i can elaborate on any of my reads if anyone would like. I will be around at day end
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ebwop: Unlike you stated there actually seems to be a link between postcount and alignement for coffee, which is opposite to what you said.
And as stated before coffee has a meta of 0 content, which is easy to continue as scum, yet he chose not to.
I would disagree - I don't think there is any postcount tell for coffee which means I was down the wrong path at first, but NOT opposite of what I said. That's how I see it anyway. I'd point out that if you have non-postcount reasons for a read or lean on someone you should include that instead of defaulting to a short/small postcount-only read. Again that's how I see it anyway.
I mean there is literally only one game where coffee has over 20 posts (in fact way more, 168) yet scum on average lives longer than town, so there is 0 precedence for scum!coffee being active, unless that got him lynched day1, in which case I wouldnt expect him to repeat that. Perhaps you are right that this topic never should have been a big deal in the first place, in which case I wonder why you put at least moderate emphasis on it, when you werent even sure about it.
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EBWOP
I agree with this sentiment, and will add that you could also do it if you'd like more information on them. That being said, I scumread ian a bit for just going afk after people stopped pushing him, but I see more of a lack in content from recent DC posts and I would rather him than MasterWalks; I see more potential output from MW and www3 in the future.
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ebwop: Unlike you stated there actually seems to be a link between postcount and alignement for coffee, which is opposite to what you said.
And as stated before coffee has a meta of 0 content, which is easy to continue as scum, yet he chose not to.
I would disagree - I don't think there is any postcount tell for coffee which means I was down the wrong path at first, but NOT opposite of what I said. That's how I see it anyway. I'd point out that if you have non-postcount reasons for a read or lean on someone you should include that instead of defaulting to a short/small postcount-only read. Again that's how I see it anyway.
I mean there is literally only one game where coffee has over 20 posts (in fact way more, 168) yet scum on average lives longer than town, so there is 0 precedence for scum!coffee being active, unless that got him lynched day1, in which case I wouldnt expect him to repeat that. Perhaps you are right that this topic never should have been a big deal in the first place, in which case I wonder why you put at least moderate emphasis on it, when you werent even sure about it.
The emphasis I put on it early was minor and early stages where there was very little to poke around at... now I poke at it only when brought up by others etc. I no longer have any desire to postcount read coffee - and no desire to strictly postcount read anyone else. We should be more careful to differentiate no post vs low post vs low-content vs poor content too.
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
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dawn claimed he was hit once by the 2hit vig, so he is probably dead, but i townread him outing the vig hit. can't rule out the possibility he was lying about it to not get lynched, though.
If this is the case, I would like to see a counter-claim from Cecilia. I figured this was implied, but a counter-claim pretty much either proves dawn or the counter-claimer as scum. dawn can out the identity of Cecilia if the counter-claimer is lying.
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dawn claimed he was hit once by the 2hit vig, so he is probably dead, but i townread him outing the vig hit. can't rule out the possibility he was lying about it to not get lynched, though.
If this is the case, I would like to see a counter-claim from Cecilia. I figured this was implied, but a counter-claim pretty much either proves dawn or the counter-claimer as scum. dawn can out the identity of Cecilia if the counter-claimer is lying.
that's very valid. if the cecilia is town and did hit dawn, they should stay hidden. however, there's the possibility that there is no cecilia in the game at all, which would be a hugely ballsy claim from dawn, but if cecilia isn't in game or is maf, it pays off for him. i wouldn't think too much of it right now without a cc.
I mean there is literally only one game where coffee has over 20 posts (in fact way more, 168)
you forgot about this one with 22 where I was mafia
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-game-archive/elements-mafia-70-by-linkcat/
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
it's a defensive reaction that he tried to downplay with a meme. that's scummy fmpov
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
www3 - why do you ask?
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dawn claimed he was hit once by the 2hit vig, so he is probably dead, but i townread him outing the vig hit. can't rule out the possibility he was lying about it to not get lynched, though.
If this is the case, I would like to see a counter-claim from Cecilia. I figured this was implied, but a counter-claim pretty much either proves dawn or the counter-claimer as scum. dawn can out the identity of Cecilia if the counter-claimer is lying.
that's very valid. if the cecilia is town and did hit dawn, they should stay hidden. however, there's the possibility that there is no cecilia in the game at all, which would be a hugely ballsy claim from dawn, but if cecilia isn't in game or is maf, it pays off for him. i wouldn't think too much of it right now without a cc.
As long as Emma Planck lives and is town, outing a role as mafia is the easiest way to track a mafia down. Cecilia being mafia is by far the most probable case if dawn is lying. Any alternative is a huge gamble, when dawn did not even have a significant wagon yet (read, not worth the gamble).
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I mean there is literally only one game where coffee has over 20 posts (in fact way more, 168)
you forgot about this one with 22 where I was mafia
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-game-archive/elements-mafia-70-by-linkcat/
fair enough, but thats still only 7 posts a day
Anyway, enough of that topic, although I'm still hung up why rob who advocates activity more than anyone would scumread someone for it with 0 evidence for it and then drop it as a reason entirely the moment he cant use it to scumread someone.
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
www3 - why do you ask?
Just came across to me as a normal meme interaction and nothing more
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
www3 - why do you ask?
Just came across to me as a normal meme interaction and nothing more
That's cool. Broski, while you're here... are you still voting DC? Why are you still voting DC? It was RNG last I could tell and here you are jumping in questioning someone (me, and coffee too/first) scumreading DC. What's your scumread on him eh?
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
www3 - why do you ask?
Just came across to me as a normal meme interaction and nothing more
That's cool. Broski, while you're here... are you still voting DC? Why are you still voting DC? It was RNG last I could tell and here you are jumping in questioning someone (me, and coffee too/first) scumreading DC. What's your scumread on him eh?
You scrumreading DC makes me doubt my read :-X ?_?
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
www3 - why do you ask?
Just came across to me as a normal meme interaction and nothing more
That's cool. Broski, while you're here... are you still voting DC? Why are you still voting DC? It was RNG last I could tell and here you are jumping in questioning someone (me, and coffee too/first) scumreading DC. What's your scumread on him eh?
You scrumreading DC makes me doubt my read :-X ?_?
WHAT READ are you referring to? I do not find you reading DC in any direct way... just RNG vote on him (confirm that is your vote on him?) and soft-defend/deflect him.... what read have you posted of him?
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I don’t really remember my reasoning for voting DC tbh LOL, it was 50% rng and 50% instinct, fun to see 3 others pile on :o
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Is there something you want to tell us w3?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
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Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
www3 - why do you ask?
Just came across to me as a normal meme interaction and nothing more
That's cool. Broski, while you're here... are you still voting DC? Why are you still voting DC? It was RNG last I could tell and here you are jumping in questioning someone (me, and coffee too/first) scumreading DC. What's your scumread on him eh?
You scrumreading DC makes me doubt my read :-X ?_?
WHAT READ are you referring to? I do not find you reading DC in any direct way... just RNG vote on him (confirm that is your vote on him?) and soft-defend/deflect him.... what read have you posted of him?
//vote not Necesarily read
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Well i typed up a long reply with quotes and everything but it got deleted and im running low on time. Ill try to post it better when i get to work.
Basically, thanks KDZ for sticking up for me on the personal level of things but i am starting to embrace becoming a meme in mafia.
Rob reasoning to scum read me makes the most sense. The reason i am posting way less is simply becuase i dont have an information role and therefore no information to share. also, i am trying to play a bit smarter with these more complicated rules and wanting to be sure of something before i start spewing words out and losing ALL my credibility.
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I don’t really remember my reasoning for voting DC tbh LOL, it was 50% rng and 50% instinct, fun to see 3 others pile on :o
Well, don't let my scum-lean and reaaction to DC's interaction with Link deter you from your RNG/instinct/test vote on DC. Eh? You should really develop something about a player that you think gives them +EV to be scum to the average player and then vote on that person.
MW- you have more than one person scumreading you and voting you... you say my reason makes sense - can you look at your wagon and the related reasons and try to sus if you think anyone there is scum and who you think taht might be? I know often the person being suspsected and voted up has a unique vantage on how the train is forming and developing on them that everyone else lacks perspective to be able to provide insight about...
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I don’t really remember my reasoning for voting DC tbh LOL, it was 50% rng and 50% instinct, fun to see 3 others pile on :o
I kind of townread this line?
//
rob, he wasn't scumreading us for question dc's reaction, he was asking for insight because from an outsider perspective it looks like 'coffee and rob are both saying the same thing about someone that i voted with no reasoning. huh.' i don't see this as a scum reaction.
MW- you have more than one person scumreading you and voting you... you say my reason makes sense - can you look at your wagon and the related reasons and try to sus if you think anyone there is scum and who you think taht might be? I know often the person being suspsected and voted up has a unique vantage on how the train is forming and developing on them that everyone else lacks perspective to be able to provide insight about...
I completely agree here. MW, i would love to hear where your scumreads are relative to the people voting on you, and if you have any information on any of them. this might be a better way to make others townread you than saying "i'm meming maf from now on" and not contributing further. I neutral read you/useless town read you right now, but i would love to hear your thoughts regardless. :)
Is there something you want to tell us w3?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
what is this vote
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Coffee - I'm really jiving with what you're posting and thoughts you're expressing so far. Again, on the timpa vote also.
timpa -- what is your vote about? I mean, there is one possibility for your vote that wouldn't exactly deserve the following inquiry, but still the naked vote is not a good look when you dont' ahve any content behind it previously or in the vote itself... where do you have any thoughts about thinking www3 is scummy or could be scum, or are you saving someone else if so why do you think the competing wagons are town-y? Do you have reads? Are you past reading roles and trying to grip mechanical aspects of the game which seem to dominate your early game posts so far? (I'll never hate on good meme posts but add to them some content please good sir)
--> Are you scumreading www3, why/why not? Are you town-reading DC and/or MW, why/why not?
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Chances are I'll move my vote away from you, MW. While you're not a townread to me, you're not a straight up scumread either, and more importantly have I never looked at you as a mafia meme. I kinda just placed my vote on someone to avoid Bronza hypocrisy, with my current belief that not voting is scummy behavior. Although I guess the Durandal situation has made it so I'm in a position where I actually can act slightly scummy without having all the guns pointed towards me.
I'll have to say, I'm not incredibly comfortable with the fact I (unpurposely) have started a MasterWalks train. Because that was not the goal. Yet, a MasterWalks lynch is in my eyes among the more sensible targets. Your statement of not possessing an information role is intriguing to me - I would have liked to discuss your role in more detail, but I guess that's info we shouldn't let mafia get.
Are you comfortable with sharing whether you used your role or not last night?
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
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d2d, kaempfer, I really don't want to see you not voting today.
EBWOP would you look at that w3, great minds think alike
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
asking over and over makes you look scared that the vote will end up on you
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
asking over and over makes you look scared that the vote will end up on you
I never asked kae, it’s my first time
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And with that my at a computer time comes to a tragic close for today... mobile following as i can and maybe squeezing in some phone posting.
I depart with:
vv
Oa
moe
v
coffee
TorB
shock(?) - gets special comment: I cannot wrap my head around his play style making sense to him as either alignment, I land currently in "just has to be town again" land... close to just n+/n
n+
Sub
kdz
n
Cal
ian
Link
n-
timpa
kae
d2d
w
DC
www3
MW
Annoying myself with top 3 "w" reads being the three top wagons... feels "too easy" from me for me to just have it that way. But they've developed that way so be it. Results in me being quite content with the three current wagons heading into EOD.
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
asking over and over makes you look scared that the vote will end up on you
I never asked kae, it’s my first time
not just kae, i mean everyone. myself, kae, dawn
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Reposting the votes as we approach EoD
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
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Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
Removing my vote at this point will cause 3 wagons to tie at four votes. We want to lynch someone every day optimally, I'm just not all for lynching any of the people in the current wagons. If I'm lynching someone right now it would be shock-- and that's just because he tried to use Rita rushedly to confirm himself as town, to which I responded. I did not vote on him straight away as I was waiting for a response or something a little stronger. Going just by that tells me nothing worthwhile and is a very weak read that doesn't really deserve a vote.
If I don't remove my vote, however, it looks like I'm trying to push for the MW lynch, which I have already stated is not something in in favor of. One thing is pushing someone to speak as I did near the start of D1, and another is actually pushing for a lynch. I went for MW since he has the lowest content on him. Right now near EoD it's pushing for a lynch.
I'll move my vote over to shock since I've really got nothing better to tread on. I'm not good at this game and it's already caused me a stress reaction, so I might become a little toxic for a while.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
Make of this what you will.
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
asking over and over makes you look scared that the vote will end up on you
I never asked kae, it’s my first time
not just kae, i mean everyone. myself, kae, dawn
As I see it, I’ve asked each of you only once, as we get closer to deadline. This is normal? :o
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@rob My main reason for the vote in w3 was the interaction between you and him regarding DC. That sounded extremely fishy to me. (sorry, I thought that was obvious given the context, guess not)
Basically, why is w3 defending DC, while voting on him and for reasons that he admits are 50% RNG?
DC's interaction was awkward but not on the same level (I'd say n-)
MW hasn't given me any reason to scum read him so far
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
asking over and over makes you look scared that the vote will end up on you
I never asked kae, it’s my first time
not just kae, i mean everyone. myself, kae, dawn
As I see it, I’ve asked each of you only once, as we get closer to deadline. This is normal? :o
I'm not pushing you for a reason or calling it scummy, my friend, i'm simply suggesting that it appears from a town perspective that you might be getting a little antsy with the votes tied up on you
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@rob My main reason for the vote in w3 was the interaction between you and him regarding DC. That sounded extremely fishy to me. (sorry, I thought that was obvious given the context, guess not)
Basically, why is w3 defending DC, while voting on him and for reasons that he admits are 50% RNG?
DC's interaction was awkward but not on the same level (I'd say n-)
MW hasn't given me any reason to scum read him so far
I never defended - just asked rob why he thought it was awkward o.O q.q
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let me know how it looks from a maf perspective, w3 ;D
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
I'm softening about being mean to MW, even though we're not. Scumread persists on MW for now. Conflicted about two high scumreads if mine voting two other scumreads of mine... If any are accurate reads and someone is soft-bussing I suspect www3 on DC could be it, also really want to vote where coffee is right now. Is already thinking if moving of f MW and moe my other townread yet to show for any EOD appearance he might make...
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
asking over and over makes you look scared that the vote will end up on you
I never asked kae, it’s my first time
not just kae, i mean everyone. myself, kae, dawn
As I see it, I’ve asked each of you only once, as we get closer to deadline. This is normal? :o
I'm not pushing you for a reason or calling it scummy, my friend, i'm simply suggesting that it appears from a town perspective that you might be getting a little antsy with the votes tied up on you
Nah, if you look at past few mafias, I’m always up there with votes anyways. It’s fine hehe, just wanted to try avoid EOD panic voting and such
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EBWOP - *Oa is already thinking...
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
asking over and over makes you look scared that the vote will end up on you
I never asked kae, it’s my first time
not just kae, i mean everyone. myself, kae, dawn
As I see it, I’ve asked each of you only once, as we get closer to deadline. This is normal? :o
I'm not pushing you for a reason or calling it scummy, my friend, i'm simply suggesting that it appears from a town perspective that you might be getting a little antsy with the votes tied up on you
Nah, if you look at past few mafias, I’m always up there with votes anyways. It’s fine hehe, just wanted to try avoid EOD panic voting and such
fair enough. hadn't been there the past few mafias, my bad if it's not out of character
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ebwop - been active the past few
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The deadline is in 3.5 hrs. Kae, where’s your vote going?
Probably rob, but i should at least have another look and case him properly first. and then that train probably wont gain any traction, so i will probably have to settle for an n- (or worse) in the end
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MW- you have more than one person scumreading you and voting you... you say my reason makes sense - can you look at your wagon and the related reasons and try to sus if you think anyone there is scum and who you think taht might be? I know often the person being suspsected and voted up has a unique vantage on how the train is forming and developing on them that everyone else lacks perspective to be able to provide insight about...
Smart!
So looking at my votes when you typed this out;
Rob- Makes sense. You kill anyone with less than 100 posts by EOD 1
Oa-started the vote with what i belive to be a place holder. I caught up really fast so mightve missed why he voted me
DC- same as Oa really, though, i think DC wouldnt mind as much as Oa if i actually was lynched.
Moe and Naii are proabbly the sketchiest votes on me. They voted once the wagon started rolling and havent really said much against me. Seems like they are gunning for a town lynch.
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If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
What exactly do you mean by this? That you see yourself as one of the most competent end gamers among us? Role related? Something else?
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Hmm, I'm still not feeling EoD. I do not have to refresh the page every 5 seconds to see the latest post.
Back on topic, Naii's vote on MW received way less attention than it should have. I kinda feel bad for him that he's already being stressed out, but his vote makes sense as mafia.
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Oa-started the vote with what i belive to be a place holder. I caught up really fast so mightve missed why he voted me
Yes, pretty much, but I'm playing around with some theories about your secondary, hence why I asked earlier. I'll keep those thoughts for myself as of now, though. But I'd still like to know whether you made an action N0 or not.
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Oa-started the vote with what i belive to be a place holder. I caught up really fast so mightve missed why he voted me
Yes, pretty much, but I'm playing around with some theories about your secondary, hence why I asked earlier. I'll keep those thoughts for myself as of now, though. But I'd still like to know whether you made an action N0 or not.
I did not make an action N0
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Oa-started the vote with what i belive to be a place holder. I caught up really fast so mightve missed why he voted me
Yes, pretty much, but I'm playing around with some theories about your secondary, hence why I asked earlier. I'll keep those thoughts for myself as of now, though. But I'd still like to know whether you made an action N0 or not.
I did not make an action N0
Ok thanks, that does help.
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Hmm, I'm still not feeling EoD.
You realize that, as of now, there is over 2 and a half hours left even without extensions? It's still early enough not to have madness.
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I head out for 1 gaming session with friends and get piled on, how fun. Well time to put my money where my mouth is. Won't be around for late EoD but I'll stay for a bit before I sleep
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It's ironic considering I'm not doing my due either and instead going for a walk, because i have a :life now, but I'm kinda pissed that ian just noped out of the thread even though I tried my darndest to provoke him to post actually usefull stuff in order to prove me wrong.
As such, while I'm out this is a simple pressure vote, it's not final.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
In the meantime what doyouguysthinkaboutanextension
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kae, could you instead find a scumread in the current three people instead of pushing on someone the vote will not flip onto? the same goes for shock, killsda, and naii. it only harms the town to split the vote unless you think all 3 of w3, dc and mw are town. I want to lynch ian too but we couldn't get the vote rolling right now.
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In the meantime what doyouguysthinkaboutanextension
Are extensions past the potential 30 minute madness a thing in this iteration?
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kae, could you instead find a scumread in the current three people instead of pushing on someone the vote will not flip onto? the same goes for shock, killsda, and naii. it only harms the town to split the vote unless you think all 3 of w3, dc and mw are town. I want to lynch ian too but we couldn't get the vote rolling right now.
It is so easy to lynch another person if u believe them to be scum, especially with two hours to go
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kae, could you instead find a scumread in the current three people instead of pushing on someone the vote will not flip onto? the same goes for shock, killsda, and naii. it only harms the town to split the vote unless you think all 3 of w3, dc and mw are town. I want to lynch ian too but we couldn't get the vote rolling right now.
I have stated earlier I have no real reads thus far, or at least, no reads strong enough to land a vote on any of the leading wagons.
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kae, could you instead find a scumread in the current three people instead of pushing on someone the vote will not flip onto? the same goes for shock, killsda, and naii. it only harms the town to split the vote unless you think all 3 of w3, dc and mw are town. I want to lynch ian too but we couldn't get the vote rolling right now.
I heavily disagree. The tides can turn quickly, EoD is not to take lightly and there is even 2 hours to go. If you want to lynch ian you vote him.
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kae, could you instead find a scumread in the current three people instead of pushing on someone the vote will not flip onto? the same goes for shock, killsda, and naii. it only harms the town to split the vote unless you think all 3 of w3, dc and mw are town. I want to lynch ian too but we couldn't get the vote rolling right now.
I heavily disagree. The tides can turn quickly, EoD is not to take lightly and there is even 2 hours to go. If you want to lynch ian you vote him.
kae, could you instead find a scumread in the current three people instead of pushing on someone the vote will not flip onto? the same goes for shock, killsda, and naii. it only harms the town to split the vote unless you think all 3 of w3, dc and mw are town. I want to lynch ian too but we couldn't get the vote rolling right now.
It is so easy to lynch another person if u believe them to be scum, especially with two hours to go
i will be keeping my vote on DC until he rebutts any votes on him or others express interest in flipping onto ian. I see them both as mafia, but ian as less useful for the town even as mafia.
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quote author=rob77dp link=topic=67869.msg1299966#msg1299966 date=1594397677]
Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
[/quote]Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
it's a defensive reaction that he tried to downplay with a meme. that's scummy fmpov
I thought Link's vote was serious, still trying to make sense of his most laid back style of play this time, but I thought he wouldn't vote without reason. Probably shouldn't have used such meme with strong emotion but it was the first one I thought of xD
dc needs to give us actual content instead of fillering. scum read here
out of these 3, I would lynch DC for his scumdumbtells and info other than the filler, but otherwise, I would rather get ian. for now, my vote lies on dc
So is it a scumtell or a dumbtell? Make up your mind... Also shitposting is something I do real often and I'll probably understand if Coffee hasn't seen/forgot about it in games past. I don't think I'm worse than anyone who has said fuck all either.
that's cool. Broski, while you're here... are you still voting DC? Why are you still voting DC? It was RNG last I could tell and here you are jumping in questioning someone (me, and coffee too/first) scumreading DC. What's your scumread on him eh?
You scrumreading DC makes me doubt my read :-X ?_?
Probably a moot point since your vote has to be on me to gotta cover your ass now, but I'm curious too, why keep your vote while defending me?
Gonna cover my own ass here too but I'm honestly not sure I can show anyway right now, I didn't get anything useful either and sky, I want my crystals back, screeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
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If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
What exactly do you mean by this? That you see yourself as one of the most competent end gamers among us? Role related? Something else?
A combination of all the things you listed.
I meant to say more useful. I don't like the chaos of early game, so I mostly just sit back and watch the world burn.
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Are extensions past the potential 30 minute madness a thing in this iteration?
Only under extraordinary circumstances.
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If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
What exactly do you mean by this? That you see yourself as one of the most competent end gamers among us? Role related? Something else?
A combination of all the things you listed.
I meant to say more useful. I don't like the chaos of early game, so I mostly just sit back and watch the world burn.
Do you have some popcorn? I'm all out over here. I could share my mike and ikes.
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ask, and ye shall receive! :)
Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
it's a defensive reaction that he tried to downplay with a meme. that's scummy fmpov
I thought Link's vote was serious, still trying to make sense of his most laid back style of play this time, but I thought he wouldn't vote without reason. Probably shouldn't have used such meme with strong emotion but it was the first one I thought of xD
i would want to have a reason too, but putting a meme after it is not the way I would go about portraying my nonchalance.
dc needs to give us actual content instead of fillering. scum read here
out of these 3, I would lynch DC for his scumdumbtells and info other than the filler, but otherwise, I would rather get ian. for now, my vote lies on dc
So is it a scumtell or a dumbtell? Make up your mind... Also shitposting is something I do real often and I'll probably understand if Coffee hasn't seen/forgot about it in games past. I don't think I'm worse than anyone who has said fuck all either.
that's valid, I try not to base my reads off of meta from past games. it doesn't change the fact that you're still not contributing to the town in a meaningful way. both scumtell and dumbtell, not mutually exclusive
that's cool. Broski, while you're here... are you still voting DC? Why are you still voting DC? It was RNG last I could tell and here you are jumping in questioning someone (me, and coffee too/first) scumreading DC. What's your scumread on him eh?
You scrumreading DC makes me doubt my read :-X ?_?
Probably a moot point since your vote has to be on me to gotta cover your ass now, but I'm curious too, why keep your vote while defending me?
Gonna cover my own ass here too but I'm honestly not sure I can show anyway right now, I didn't get anything useful either and sky, I want my crystals back, screeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
What exactly do you mean by this? That you see yourself as one of the most competent end gamers among us? Role related? Something else?
A combination of all the things you listed.
I meant to say more useful. I don't like the chaos of early game, so I mostly just sit back and watch the world burn.
If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
What exactly do you mean by this? That you see yourself as one of the most competent end gamers among us? Role related? Something else?
A combination of all the things you listed.
I meant to say more useful. I don't like the chaos of early game, so I mostly just sit back and watch the world burn.
Do you have some popcorn? I'm all out over here. I could share my mike and ikes.
so you're both saying you're not going to contribute to the game at all right now. why play
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Now this is getting more like EoD. :)
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I've contributed, were not EoD yet, I'm fine with where my vote is cast. If something has to change it will, EoD madness will shake up the votes. I'm just having a bit of fun with ian, don't get it twisted m8, calm down. You can have some mike and ikes too, I bought the share size. Just leave me the green ones please.
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If I don't remove my vote, however, it looks like I'm trying to push for the MW lynch, which I have already stated is not something in in favor of. One thing is pushing someone to speak as I did near the start of D1, and another is actually pushing for a lynch. I went for MW since he has the lowest content on him. Right now near EoD it's pushing for a lynch.
Explain this please. Is it referring to you not scumreading any of the big wagons or sth else?
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I've contributed, were not EoD yet, I'm fine with where my vote is cast. If something has to change it will, EoD madness will shake up the votes. I'm just having a bit of fun with ian, don't get it twisted m8, calm down. You can have some mike and ikes too, I bought the share size. Just leave me the green ones please.
okay. sorry for getting a little bent out of shape there, i'm not me when i'm hungry
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Now this is getting more like EoD. :)
Nah, still just 4-5 posts per refresh :silly:
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quote author=rob77dp link=topic=67869.msg1299966#msg1299966 date=1594397677]
Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
DC usually doesn't care too much about various breadposting going on, he picked out this one from Link to ask for a reason on the vote - fair, we often around here ask that - but then Link gives him sass and DC just then decides he doesn't like the general "hate" (votes and shade?) he is getting and is suddenly not interested further in a real reason from Link for the vote. I mean, DC asked in the first place so I presume he had a reason (odd he doesn't push to get one from Link?) or he was just chatting (odd how he still keeps it game-related to votes/pressure he's getting).
Also coffee's take of DC's retort to Link's 'reply' to DC's questioning of Link's vote is somewhat on-track with my own. That is, weird way that DC responded to Link. Coffee I think finds the interaction weird (both sides?) though whereas I think that's just Link being Link but DC response is awkward on its own.
Whys DCs response awkward?
it's a defensive reaction that he tried to downplay with a meme. that's scummy fmpov
I thought Link's vote was serious, still trying to make sense of his most laid back style of play this time, but I thought he wouldn't vote without reason. Probably shouldn't have used such meme with strong emotion but it was the first one I thought of xD
dc needs to give us actual content instead of fillering. scum read here
out of these 3, I would lynch DC for his scumdumbtells and info other than the filler, but otherwise, I would rather get ian. for now, my vote lies on dc
So is it a scumtell or a dumbtell? Make up your mind... Also shitposting is something I do real often and I'll probably understand if Coffee hasn't seen/forgot about it in games past. I don't think I'm worse than anyone who has said fuck all either.
that's cool. Broski, while you're here... are you still voting DC? Why are you still voting DC? It was RNG last I could tell and here you are jumping in questioning someone (me, and coffee too/first) scumreading DC. What's your scumread on him eh?
You scrumreading DC makes me doubt my read :-X ?_?
Probably a moot point since your vote has to be on me to gotta cover your ass now, but I'm curious too, why keep your vote while defending me?
Gonna cover my own ass here too but I'm honestly not sure I can show anyway right now, I didn't get anything useful either and sky, I want my crystals back, screeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
[/quote]
Tbf my vote on you was a bit of a meme rng vote as I said. I do now think there’s a possibility youre acc town lean, given how people just jumped on you. If u flip town, I become another easy town lynch target probably.
I don’t like subs play, but I never like subs play. I didn’t like it last game either, but put it as sub being sub ?_?
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Ewwww I blame error on DCs formatting. I only wrote the last bit in that post.
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I've contributed, were not EoD yet, I'm fine with where my vote is cast. If something has to change it will, EoD madness will shake up the votes. I'm just having a bit of fun with ian, don't get it twisted m8, calm down. You can have some mike and ikes too, I bought the share size. Just leave me the green ones please.
okay. sorry for getting a little bent out of shape there, i'm not me when i'm hungry
I'm just having a bit of fun friend <3 I got some bite size snickers if you want.
Now this is getting more like EoD. :)
Nah, still just 4-5 posts per refresh :silly:
Don't worry we'll get there soon :)
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Are extensions past the potential 30 minute madness a thing in this iteration?
Only under extraordinary circumstances.
Ah damn, so i have to puke out my last reads barely before deadline and then barely have time for my serious vote.
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I've contributed, were not EoD yet, I'm fine with where my vote is cast. If something has to change it will, EoD madness will shake up the votes. I'm just having a bit of fun with ian, don't get it twisted m8, calm down. You can have some mike and ikes too, I bought the share size. Just leave me the green ones please.
okay. sorry for getting a little bent out of shape there, i'm not me when i'm hungry
I'm just having a bit of fun friend <3 I got some bite size snickers if you want.
i would be elated to indulge
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Ewwww I blame error on DCs formatting. I only wrote the last bit in that post.
soz I flubbed that up too mb
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Basically, thanks KDZ for sticking up for me on the personal level of things but i am starting to embrace becoming a meme in mafia.
Good, young padawan. Let the meme flow through you.
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Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
Removing my vote at this point will cause 3 wagons to tie at four votes. We want to lynch someone every day optimally, I'm just not all for lynching any of the people in the current wagons. If I'm lynching someone right now it would be shock-- and that's just because he tried to use Rita rushedly to confirm himself as town, to which I responded. I did not vote on him straight away as I was waiting for a response or something a little stronger. Going just by that tells me nothing worthwhile and is a very weak read that doesn't really deserve a vote.
If I don't remove my vote, however, it looks like I'm trying to push for the MW lynch, which I have already stated is not something in in favor of. One thing is pushing someone to speak as I did near the start of D1, and another is actually pushing for a lynch. I went for MW since he has the lowest content on him. Right now near EoD it's pushing for a lynch.
I'll move my vote over to shock since I've really got nothing better to tread on. I'm not good at this game and it's already caused me a stress reaction, so I might become a little toxic for a while.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
Make of this what you will.
Great post, I was about to make a push on you but now I will look elsewhere.
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If I don't remove my vote, however, it looks like I'm trying to push for the MW lynch, which I have already stated is not something in in favor of. One thing is pushing someone to speak as I did near the start of D1, and another is actually pushing for a lynch. I went for MW since he has the lowest content on him. Right now near EoD it's pushing for a lynch.
Explain this please. Is it referring to you not scumreading any of the big wagons or sth else?
That's correct. Just noticed I made a typo which may have been what confused you.
EBWOP: not something I'm in favor of*
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i would want to have a reason too, but putting a meme after it is not the way I would go about portraying my nonchalance.
Well sorry I don't portray it like you then :/
that's valid, I try not to base my reads off of meta from past games. it doesn't change the fact that you're still not contributing to the town in a meaningful way. both scumtell and dumbtell, not mutually exclusive
I'm trying my best to, and if my best is not enough then perhaps you can give me some pointers after this game?
Tbf my vote on you was a bit of a meme rng vote as I said. I do now think there’s a possibility youre acc town lean, given how people just jumped on you. If u flip town, I become another easy town lynch target probably.
I don't think you're that scummy either; I'd be more willing to vote ian up (I don't really like his AtE post) than you but alas you're stuck on me and me to you, care to change that with me?
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i would want to have a reason too, but putting a meme after it is not the way I would go about portraying my nonchalance.
Well sorry I don't portray it like you then :/
that's valid, I try not to base my reads off of meta from past games. it doesn't change the fact that you're still not contributing to the town in a meaningful way. both scumtell and dumbtell, not mutually exclusive
I'm trying my best to, and if my best is not enough then perhaps you can give me some pointers after this game?
Tbf my vote on you was a bit of a meme rng vote as I said. I do now think there’s a possibility youre acc town lean, given how people just jumped on you. If u flip town, I become another easy town lynch target probably.
I don't think you're that scummy either; I'd be more willing to vote ian up (I don't really like his AtE post) than you but alas you're stuck on me and me to you, care to change that with me?
those first two lines aren't actual responses to what I said. you also can't just back out of the vote on you by trying to flip the vote onto someone others are considering lynching; could you provide a reason other than what we have said why you would want to lynch ian? has your vote on w3 lost momentum and reasoning?
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those first two lines aren't actual responses to what I said. you also can't just back out of the vote on you by trying to flip the vote onto someone others are considering lynching; could you provide a reason other than what we have said why you would want to lynch ian? has your vote on w3 lost momentum and reasoning?
I've already said I don't like his own AtE post when he posted earlier:
If lynching me gives you any information, then sure, go ahead. But once I flip civvy, remember how you killed one of the people that actually becomes useful in the lategame.
My vote on w3 is to save myself, anyone else would have done the same, but if there's another competing wagon that isn't mine, is that not worth consideration?
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Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
Removing my vote at this point will cause 3 wagons to tie at four votes. We want to lynch someone every day optimally, I'm just not all for lynching any of the people in the current wagons. If I'm lynching someone right now it would be shock-- and that's just because he tried to use Rita rushedly to confirm himself as town, to which I responded. I did not vote on him straight away as I was waiting for a response or something a little stronger. Going just by that tells me nothing worthwhile and is a very weak read that doesn't really deserve a vote.
If I don't remove my vote, however, it looks like I'm trying to push for the MW lynch, which I have already stated is not something in in favor of. One thing is pushing someone to speak as I did near the start of D1, and another is actually pushing for a lynch. I went for MW since he has the lowest content on him. Right now near EoD it's pushing for a lynch.
I'll move my vote over to shock since I've really got nothing better to tread on. I'm not good at this game and it's already caused me a stress reaction, so I might become a little toxic for a while.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
Make of this what you will.
Great post, I was about to make a push on you but now I will look elsewhere.
What qualifies this post great?
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Hey DC, I'll jump off you if you vote shock with me.
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Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
Removing my vote at this point will cause 3 wagons to tie at four votes. We want to lynch someone every day optimally, I'm just not all for lynching any of the people in the current wagons. If I'm lynching someone right now it would be shock-- and that's just because he tried to use Rita rushedly to confirm himself as town, to which I responded. I did not vote on him straight away as I was waiting for a response or something a little stronger. Going just by that tells me nothing worthwhile and is a very weak read that doesn't really deserve a vote.
If I don't remove my vote, however, it looks like I'm trying to push for the MW lynch, which I have already stated is not something in in favor of. One thing is pushing someone to speak as I did near the start of D1, and another is actually pushing for a lynch. I went for MW since he has the lowest content on him. Right now near EoD it's pushing for a lynch.
I'll move my vote over to shock since I've really got nothing better to tread on. I'm not good at this game and it's already caused me a stress reaction, so I might become a little toxic for a while.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
Make of this what you will.
Great post, I was about to make a push on you but now I will look elsewhere.
What qualifies this post great?
It believably justifies a terrible vote.
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Nah I don’t like lynching ian this early, nor have I paid much attention to his posts to decide where I stand on him
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This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
Randomly voting someone "who has no wagon":
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
I actually have no idea where to place my vote, but for this game at least, voting is a must.
Then Link:
It believably justifies a terrible vote.
Link - Naii possible mafia team?
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Lol
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Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
To be clear, the first line and the second line both talk about the previous vote, yes?
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I need to sleep soon, within the next 10-15 minutes or so, so...
Nah I don’t like lynching ian this early, nor have I paid much attention to his posts to decide where I stand on him
Are you willing to at least mutually remove each others votes on each other? Since we are kinda just forced to do it outta self-preservation?
Hey DC, I'll jump off you if you vote shock with me.
I don't think by the way shock is talking he's scum but I don't have any basis for scum!shock, but nonetheless because it's an EV+ for us?
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Is that a yes?
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
is this the latest vote tally
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Sub, your sequence of events doesn't seem very credible when you start with a quote that has a more recent timestamp. He's voting on someone without a wagon now since he apparently did not vote to kill.
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Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
To be clear, the first line and the second line both talk about the previous vote, yes?
No. Only the first line is about the previous vote.
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I believe it was so
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
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Sub, your sequence of events doesn't seem very credible when you start with a quote that has a more recent timestamp. He's voting on someone without a wagon now since he apparently did not vote to kill.
That's what I am confused about. See, the second line starts with past tense, so I assumed it was about his "previous vote", as he called it, and not the vote he was about to make. Hence my question later about the two lines being about the same vote.
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robs progression on coffee just doesnt make sense. First he scumreads him for activity (which is the opposite of basic logic and the phantom memory he had has no grounds in reality, which may or may not mean that its completely made up), then townreads him for it when his memory was jogged (as he puts him in townleans with no other reason given than his initial read being wrong and coffee-activity=good), then claims activity is not a tell for coffee at all, but then keeps his townread on him anyway, while buddying him.
Yes, i still havent gotten over this.
Other rob related things: - his mechanics-talk is fine (pretty good) really, but in case of rob i wouldnt expect anything else really.
as he noted himself, his readlist developed to fit the wagons that were forming. it is indeed too consensy and him wanting to vote with certain other people (oa) further drives this home, passing responsibility for a misslynch to someone else.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
I hope I'm doing the right thing... Gonna have to dip now, so good night y'alls~
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I welcome your vote www, though I do require an explanation.~
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
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I really dont like these voting negotiations btw. Selfpreservation is a valid reason, but other than that you always should be voting your scumreads anyway independently
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
Dont wanna lycnh W3 yet.
Dont wanna lynch DC yet.
Dont wanna No Lynch.
Ill go with the scummiest person on this list that isnt moe.
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I really dont like these voting negotiations btw. Selfpreservation is a valid reason, but other than that you always should be voting your scumreads anyway independently
I'll give you 20 bucks if you vote with me
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I really dont like these voting negotiations btw. Selfpreservation is a valid reason, but other than that you always should be voting your scumreads anyway independently
my vote was irrelevant of if DC would take his one off mine or not fwiw
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
i cased him properly now and only found confirmation for my bias (which tbh I always do regardless if I'm right or not, so take it with a grain of salt I guess)
Voting him up while he likely cant be around is kinda rude, but he is my biggest scumlean.
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I really dont like these voting negotiations btw. Selfpreservation is a valid reason, but other than that you always should be voting your scumreads anyway independently
I'll give you 20 bucks if you vote with me
you rat bastard
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I really dont like these voting negotiations btw. Selfpreservation is a valid reason, but other than that you always should be voting your scumreads anyway independently
I'll give you 20 bucks if you vote with me
you rat bastard
Sorry, I'm bad with money.
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I really dont like these voting negotiations btw. Selfpreservation is a valid reason, but other than that you always should be voting your scumreads anyway independently
I'll give you 20 bucks if you vote with me
I take PayPal if you want
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That's convenient.
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Sub, your sequence of events doesn't seem very credible when you start with a quote that has a more recent timestamp. He's voting on someone without a wagon now since he apparently did not vote to kill.
That's what I am confused about. See, the second line starts with past tense, so I assumed it was about his "previous vote", as he called it, and not the vote he was about to make. Hence my question later about the two lines being about the same vote.
@TorB: Did I properly convey my thought process, and if so, what is your opinion about the situation?
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I can find nothing unusual about dc either. he was voted with almost no reasons given at all, so his memeresponse was fitting for the situation, no?
I do like his thoughts about always lynching, but as I said before this should really just be common sense and its unfortunate that for certain other people its apparently not.
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That's convenient.
Venmo works too
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That's convenient.
Venmo works too
please let me know if the money comes through or if its a scam
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Can we get some more discussion going this near to EoD? Currently the votes are tied, so changes will happen anyway. Let's discuss those changes while we have time to think and read.
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Sub, your sequence of events doesn't seem very credible when you start with a quote that has a more recent timestamp. He's voting on someone without a wagon now since he apparently did not vote to kill.
That's what I am confused about. See, the second line starts with past tense, so I assumed it was about his "previous vote", as he called it, and not the vote he was about to make. Hence my question later about the two lines being about the same vote.
@TorB: Did I properly convey my thought process, and if so, what is your opinion about the situation?
Well, if we're both confused about it, then that's fine. My opinion has shifted now that shock has suddenly become a leading wagon, seems like Naii just went from one leading wagon to the other, even if unintended.
Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
You mean "this leaves me" as the past tense part? He should have said "this left me" if it applied to the previous vote.
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As I count, the only person not voting is dawn.
Admittedly, my previous vote is a stupid one. As I said, I have no idea where to place my vote right now.
I did also say that voting is a must. This leaves me with only the option to just random vote someone who has no wagon and won't get lynched just so I get to vote and we avoid any voting power shenanigans if I am Bronya.
You mean "this leaves me" as the past tense part? He should have said "this left me" if it applied to the previous vote.
No, what I mean is, he started his second line with "I did also say...", and at first, I assumed everything after it was a continuation of the previous line.
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EBWOP:
Especially, because his "previous vote", as he called it, also said "voting is a must", so the two things lined up perfectly.
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I'm not town leaning a single member of the shock train, nor do I have a scum lean on shock himself, so I'm currently stuck voting on my only scum lean. No lynch isn't optimal, but I'll get a really good laugh out of it, seeing how shock and w3 both wanted no lynch and they're the top wagons.
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That's convenient.
Venmo works too
please let me know if the money comes through or if its a scam
He actually paid me twice, once on each platform. Be it was he who was scammed. #moremoneymoreproblems
Can we get some more discussion going this near to EoD? Currently the votes are tied, so changes will happen anyway. Let's discuss those changes while we have time to think and read.
Fine, I like my vote. If people want to shift to it cool, if not cool.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
as for the top 3/4
DC - Dont think theyre mafia. They Jebait and just say shit. Nothing they have done has screamed unusual to me, nor has it screamed sus
MW - Playing more reserved then previously. Some are calling it sus, but I think its just growth.
w3 - I dont wanna vote on w3 because they died first last game and I would feel bad. This is my real take on this mind you, not some meme nonsense. I'll at least do them the courtesy of waiting until tomorrow to vote on them if I really am inclined to.
Shock - If the vote is because people are upsetti over last game, thats such an easy cop out to actual thought, and anyone on the shock train should be taken with a grain of sus. Except DC, I believe that is self preservation. If shock flips town, everyone on their train will basically get a free pass, which i dislike. They had a bad idea on no lynching, but I dont think thats enough to tip someone into W territory.
im eating some dinner, but my eye is on the thread.
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No, what I mean is, he started his second line with "I did also say...", and at first, I assumed everything after it was a continuation of the previous line.
Yes, which is his reason for not simply removing his vote after realizing it was stupid. He then continues with what he will vote for.
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Calindu
Just like last time his postcount is exceptionally low, but at least he does seem to put effort into the ones he makes and I largely agree with his argumentation.
Maybe n+ but there is just too little for a real read.
Naii_the_Baf
Well, either way he's an lhf for sure. As we saw with Ge0 last game though, that doesnt mean he's town. His inexperience is really showing. n
moehrpi n+/w
This may come as a surprise, but in case his 'slip' was really just an overly dry delivered joke, i actually find his content consistently towny otherwise.
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I can't be around any longer so I'm just going to say this. You all argue that no lynch is bad because lynching is how town wins, and even if you lynch a town you gain valuable information. Well everyone seems to be voting me just because. Tell me what info you get if I get lynched? Are you going to vote out one of the players who voted me next? Somehow I doubt that.
I'm not going to random vote and cause others to panic and random vote also when there's literally no mechanical information out there yet since no one has really revealed anything. So I'm going to keep voting no lynch, and hopefully in roughly 5 games, like I said, you're realize the power that no lynch actually holds for town.
Lastly, you may be surprised what little information you actually do learn when I flip. Hopefully you like surprises. I sure do.
Sincerely,
Mafia Rita
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No, what I mean is, he started his second line with "I did also say...", and at first, I assumed everything after it was a continuation of the previous line.
Yes, which is his reason for not simply removing his vote after realizing it was stupid. He then continues with what he will vote for.
If that is the case, then my discovery is null. Yet a sour taste will remain for the random MW vote, with the only explanation given that it was a bad vote.
Hey, um, Link. I just want to get it out of the way for transparency's sake. I get the feeling that you are a bit unmotivated. I will not say that is scummy, and I will not compare it to previous games. But can you explain why you are keeping a low profile this time? I believe it is for the greater good if everybody heard your explanation, if you have any.
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Also if I die, you should read my first post that wasn't my sign up post. Maybe it'll help, maybe you'll just confuse yourself more. But it's there.
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I can't be around any longer so I'm just going to say this. You all argue that no lynch is bad because lynching is how town wins, and even if you lynch a town you gain valuable information. Well everyone seems to be voting me just because. Tell me what info you get if I get lynched? Are you going to vote out one of the players who voted me next? Somehow I doubt that.
I'm not going to random vote and cause others to panic and random vote also when there's literally no mechanical information out there yet since no one has really revealed anything. So I'm going to keep voting no lynch, and hopefully in roughly 5 games, like I said, you're realize the power that no lynch actually holds for town.
Lastly, you may be surprised what little information you actually do learn when I flip. Hopefully you like surprises. I sure do.
Sincerely,
Mafia Rita
Shock, I'm taking the risk to believe that you are town. It seems there is only a set amount of players who are voting on you, and only as a scapegoat option. I heard at least one other people say too that he believed you would be town. Does that not give you some hope to make you stay and figure out a lynch target other than No Lynch?
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Looking forward to seeing shock vote No Lynch for the next 5 games.
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I can't be around any longer so I'm just going to say this. You all argue that no lynch is bad because lynching is how town wins, and even if you lynch a town you gain valuable information. Well everyone seems to be voting me just because. Tell me what info you get if I get lynched? Are you going to vote out one of the players who voted me next? Somehow I doubt that.
I'm not going to random vote and cause others to panic and random vote also when there's literally no mechanical information out there yet since no one has really revealed anything. So I'm going to keep voting no lynch, and hopefully in roughly 5 games, like I said, you're realize the power that no lynch actually holds for town.
Lastly, you may be surprised what little information you actually do learn when I flip. Hopefully you like surprises. I sure do.
Sincerely,
Mafia Rita
There is no way that a mafia shock would give up like this. I wouldn't believe it if I saw it. It might be a last ditch effort to get votes off of him, but I'm willing to believe a mafia shock would not claim himself as mafia 10 minutes before the day end.
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Reminder that with a few minutes left, everyone is currently essentially voting No Lynch.
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So in summary:
v
PlayerOa
Coffee (yes, seeing a large number of thoughts that make sense is an auto tr for me in his case, as scum him has no need to give us anything to work with considering his meta)
n+
TorB
moehrpi
n
Calindu
timpa (yh the + is too tiny for it to matter)
DC
w3
Link (trended down due to overly focussing on getting shock dead without actually scumreading him)
d2d
ian
n-
kdz
Sub
w
rob
MW
usefullnessscale (tiebreaker for how I'm ok with dying in absence of more effort and any other reason):
TorB
Coffee (surprisingly)
Oa
rob
Link
w3
Sub
DC
d2d
Calindu
kdz
timpa
ian
shock
MW
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I can't be around any longer so I'm just going to say this. You all argue that no lynch is bad because lynching is how town wins, and even if you lynch a town you gain valuable information. Well everyone seems to be voting me just because. Tell me what info you get if I get lynched? Are you going to vote out one of the players who voted me next? Somehow I doubt that.
I'm not going to random vote and cause others to panic and random vote also when there's literally no mechanical information out there yet since no one has really revealed anything. So I'm going to keep voting no lynch, and hopefully in roughly 5 games, like I said, you're realize the power that no lynch actually holds for town.
Lastly, you may be surprised what little information you actually do learn when I flip. Hopefully you like surprises. I sure do.
Sincerely,
Mafia Rita
Shock, I'm taking the risk to believe that you are town. It seems there is only a set amount of players who are voting on you, and only as a scapegoat option. I heard at least one other people say too that he believed you would be town. Does that not give you some hope to make you stay and figure out a lynch target other than No Lynch?
Last post from me since I really have to go. I'm not going to go around switching votes like everyone else this time. Then people start creating these ridiculous reads based off vote switches and all that. Like I said, I'm perfectly fine lynching someone day 1 if we have even a bit of info to work off of. All we have is reads based off other people memeing.
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I can find nothing unusual about dc either. he was voted with almost no reasons given at all, so his memeresponse was fitting for the situation, no?
I do like his thoughts about always lynching, but as I said before this should really just be common sense and its unfortunate that for certain other people its apparently not.
I gave my reasons, that being dumbtelling from an experienced player and oddly over defensive reactions from dc who usually takes things in stride (or so I hear). Even this game, he's been whimsical until link voted him, and now is willing to shift in self defense, but we get info either way, right? I don't like how he used going to bed as an excuse.
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I can find nothing unusual about dc either. he was voted with almost no reasons given at all, so his memeresponse was fitting for the situation, no?
I do like his thoughts about always lynching, but as I said before this should really just be common sense and its unfortunate that for certain other people its apparently not.
I gave my reasons, that being dumbtelling from an experienced player and oddly over defensive reactions from dc who usually takes things in stride (or so I hear). Even this game, he's been whimsical until link voted him, and now is willing to shift in self defense, but we get info either way, right? I don't like how he used going to bed as an excuse.
its like 5 am where he lives
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I personally would like to see shock live for a couple more days before throwing him off. Not because I necessarily town read him, I see him as n/n+, but for a so called info lynch it would make so much more sense to me giving him some more time. I do think he's more likely town than the other leading trains, w3 and DC, which are plain n.
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No, what I mean is, he started his second line with "I did also say...", and at first, I assumed everything after it was a continuation of the previous line.
Yes, which is his reason for not simply removing his vote after realizing it was stupid. He then continues with what he will vote for.
If that is the case, then my discovery is null. Yet a sour taste will remain for the random MW vote, with the only explanation given that it was a bad vote.
Hey, um, Link. I just want to get it out of the way for transparency's sake. I get the feeling that you are a bit unmotivated. I will not say that is scummy, and I will not compare it to previous games. But can you explain why you are keeping a low profile this time? I believe it is for the greater good if everybody heard your explanation, if you have any.
Me being so quiet N0 was due to being asleep for most of it, trying not to do a repeat of last game like I said I wouldn't, and not having a lot of energy since the Smash community just got hit by MeToo. Since then I've just kept the same mood and I haven't seen much for me to make aggressive pushes on. Also we have a lot more good players now so I don't feel the need to drive the game as much as I did in the past.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
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Put my placeholdervote on ian for time and me seeing votecount
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@Kae: Why is dawn above 6 other people on the usefulness scale? He's still sitting on only 2 posts and he is the only person not voting.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
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well this is truly ironic lol, thanks ian
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I'd prefer w3 lynch over shock, but definitely shock over no lynch.
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The time alloted for Day 1 has ended, but will be extended by up to 30 minutes or until 7 minutes have passed since the last vote or vote tally.
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@Kae: Why is dawn above 6 other people on the usefulness scale? He's still sitting on only 2 posts and he is the only person not voting.
This is taking into consideration that we dont need to lynch him to kill him, if we instead agree that that role (forgot the name) does the job instead
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I'd prefer w3 lynch over shock, but definitely shock over no lynch.
Sensible to me, although I'm not voting off w3 yet.
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Me being so quiet N0 was due to being asleep for most of it, trying not to do a repeat of last game like I said I wouldn't, and not having a lot of energy since the Smash community just got hit by MeToo. Since then I've just kept the same mood and I haven't seen much for me to make aggressive pushes on. Also we have a lot more good players now so I don't feel the need to drive the game as much as I did in the past.
That's fair enough. For future phases, what level of activity do you foresee from yourself? Will it rise or stagnate? How much will you solve?
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i dont think shocks mafia, there was me and DC there as targets before if mafia wanted to save shock, unless ofcourse mafia was already on us.
TBH, most likely all 3 are town, DC being most likely to be maf probs
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I can find nothing unusual about dc either. he was voted with almost no reasons given at all, so his memeresponse was fitting for the situation, no?
I do like his thoughts about always lynching, but as I said before this should really just be common sense and its unfortunate that for certain other people its apparently not.
I gave my reasons, that being dumbtelling from an experienced player and oddly over defensive reactions from dc who usually takes things in stride (or so I hear). Even this game, he's been whimsical until link voted him, and now is willing to shift in self defense, but we get info either way, right? I don't like how he used going to bed as an excuse.
its like 5 am where he lives
oh my bad
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Eh according to my usefullnessscale i prefer w3 to live over shock, but truly the wagon on him is pretty much just anger carried on from previous games and his way of giving up does give townvibes.
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Shock is in the US lol
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Shock is in the US lol
that was about DC
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Its like 4pm where shock is
DC is Hong Kong
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
I don't see www happening, hmm. After all this, I really hope you are at least a Durandal, www. Switching to DC.
Lynching shock without an in-this-game reason seems bad.
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Shock is in the US lol
that was about DC
You may be correct, but I'm still more useful than you according to kaempfer.
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I am voting shock for an in-this-game reason.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
I'd rather see shock live than DC tbh
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
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Someone wanna speed me up on why we are scum reading DC?
Seems like normal DC to me
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Reasons? There are 2-3 town leans voting DC, there are 0 town leans voting shock. shock is not lynch voted for being scum, I want to lynch scum. Both feel n, ties are meant to be broken.
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Someone wanna speed me up on why we are scum reading DC?
Seems like normal DC to me
Same can be said about all the topwagons imo :/
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Someone wanna speed me up on why we are scum reading DC?
Seems like normal DC to me
It's a priority thing. People could not lynch who they wanted, because it would have resulted in a no lynch, so it seems we are making compromises with other voters to avoid No Lynch.
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Someone wanna speed me up on why we are scum reading DC?
Seems like normal DC to me
Same can be said about all the topwagons imo :/
QFT
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Think about it. With shock in the game, there's effectively 4 mafia. If we lynch shock we're guaranteed to at least go down to 3. But if he actually is mafia, then we've effectively gone from 4 to 2, killing half the team with one lynch. That's pretty high EV, I see no flaw in my math.
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Someone wanna speed me up on why we are scum reading DC?
Seems like normal DC to me
I honestly have no idea.
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Think about it. With shock in the game, there's effectively 4 mafia. If we lynch shock we're guaranteed to at least go down to 3. But if he actually is mafia, then we've effectively gone from 4 to 2, killing half the team with one lynch. That's pretty high EV, I see no flaw in my math.
(((And this was the point where Sub realized that this game only has 3 mafia in it.....)))
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Theres a nice juicy kill up near the top. I'll let you sit near the front of the train if you want.
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Well, no wonder ian only rolled 3 dice. I found it weird at first, but didn't think much of it.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
what if DC is an important role? is it really worth lynching? #nolynchgang
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so did w3
derpclear denied
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
CFD?
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why do people I talk about always post 2 seconds before I submit my posts?
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Eh, although shock has an unorthodox style and missed his shot last mafia, he definitely brings something to the table. Ref maf 70.
Anyway, on that note I'll stop defending him, because I really don't have any reason to. But I wouldn't be too hasty to kill him on what I personally find thin ground... too bad the same would be said about both DC and w3 too. :/ I'm open for new trains.
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I'm open to move to a dawn wagon.
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Dawn is pointless, he'll die anyway.
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sub really likes killing people who are inactive at EOD doesnt he
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
I can entertain some wagonomics at the very least, this doesn't change much, yet.
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what if DC is an important role?
Can be said about literally anyone.
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Lmao, top level ninja.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
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Between DC and Shock, which is the better lynch in a time of no scum reads?
assuming both are town;
DC is a shitposter who is pretty harmless to town
Shock is beyond shitposter that is pretty harmful to town.
Why is he harmful?
Shock has an occultic personality. He seems crazy and in his own world at first, then when times are dire, he actually starts to make sense, and you start listening. Then its hard to stop listening. Now you are in the shock cult.
Dont get in the shock cult.
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what if DC is an important role?
Can be said about literally anyone.
nope, DC cannot claim that important role due to him not being here rn.
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Dawn is pointless, he'll die anyway.
We can pointless hang him then, if you like :P
sub really likes killing people who are inactive at EOD doesnt he
hehe
Between DC and Shock, which is the better lynch in a time of no scum reads?
assuming both are town;
DC is a shitposter who is pretty harmless to town
Shock is beyond shitposter that is pretty harmful to town.
Why is he harmful?
Shock has an occultic personality. He seems crazy and in his own world at first, then when times are dire, he actually starts to make sense, and you start listening. Then its hard to stop listening. Now you are in the shock cult.
Dont get in the shock cult.
I know I love it. Shock cult all the wayyyyyy
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I afk for 10 minutes to eat my dinner and I'm suddenly the one getting lynched, huh? Typical EOD NotLikeThis
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what if DC is an important role?
Can be said about literally anyone.
nope, DC cannot claim that important role due to him not being here rn.
nobody said anything about claiming an important role, you listening even?
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Lmao, top level ninja.
When the difference in time is so small, the new post notification does not appear x)
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what if DC is an important role?
Can be said about literally anyone.
nope, DC cannot claim that important role due to him not being here rn.
nobody said anything about claiming an important role, you listening even?
Are you just playing dumb or what? ?_?
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I afk for 10 minutes to eat my dinner and I'm suddenly the one getting lynched, huh? Typical EOD NotLikeThis
Theres your mistake, as soon as you stop paying attention to the thread you die.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
current tally
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welp, looks like my placeholdervote might end up the lynch. Oh well, i guess i prefer him over the other options rn.
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That's the Master of Time for you.
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I afk for 10 minutes to eat my dinner and I'm suddenly the one getting lynched, huh? Typical EOD NotLikeThis
Just bring out the memes already. Eating dinner this late is a lynchable offense anyway :P
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I remove vote
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If www lives, a role might be incoming towards his way tonight.~
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I afk for 10 minutes to eat my dinner and I'm suddenly the one getting lynched, huh? Typical EOD NotLikeThis
Just bring out the memes already. Eating dinner this late is a lynchable offense anyway :P
Yeah, I have spaghetti sitting on the stove because we sort these things out in the final 5 minutes of every day like REAL mafia players
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
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I afk for 10 minutes to eat my dinner and I'm suddenly the one getting lynched, huh? Typical EOD NotLikeThis
Just bring out the memes already. Eating dinner this late is a lynchable offense anyway :P
Oh believe me, I would, but tough luck, I'm not mafia this time.
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If www lives, a role might be incoming towards his way tonight.~
Doc :D
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I remove vote
Ew, make sure to place it somewhere else within deadline though, my Bronya paranoia is real.
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Imagine wasting Doc on w3
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ftr, i still prefer ian over the other 2, but the last 2 tallies were corections and thus time was running out
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Imagine wasting Doc on w3
Would've worked last game lmao
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
Breaking ties.
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ftr, i still prefer ian over the other 2, but the last 2 tallies were corections and thus time was running out
All tallies including corrections count, don't worry.
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Imagine wasting Doc on w3
Would've worked last game lmao
nah, gold nymph is immune to doc
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w3 still defending dc at this point gives me a slight townlean on him
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EOD shit like this is why town will lose this game as well. Too bad I'm going to be on the losing end because of you all.
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Imagine wasting Doc on w3
Would've worked last game lmao
nah, gold nymph is immune to doc
It would've worked in spirit.
I need to stop saying dumb things, I'm off today.
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w3 still defending dc at this point gives me a slight townlean on him
ive to support fellow TrO q.q
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oh, oops I#m totally out of touch, shock is the cw :-X
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I'm gonna go ahead and guess dawn isn't happening today :/
Imagine wasting Doc on w3
Would've worked last game lmao
nah, gold nymph is immune to doc
It would've worked in spirit.
I need to stop saying dumb things, I'm off today.
Thats what really matters, the spirit of it all. Good on you link, for seeing what really matters
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
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2mins hard limit!!!
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This is going to look really bad for me if DC flips mafia lmao
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
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I don’t like this lynch at all
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Get rekt son
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I don’t like this lynch at all
Agreed.
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Day 1 has ended.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Night 1 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Night 1
shockcannon was lynched. He was Rita Rossweisse.
Night 1 has ended.
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No Honkai Core mention, so town.
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(https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.593081012.0332/ap,550x550,12x12,1,transparent,t.u7.jpg)
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I gotta save that one link, excellent as always.
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kaempfer is looking more and more town to me. TorB as well - while I'm not happy with lynching shock at all, he's had a similar train of thought as me through the whole vote. Naii and MW are giving me slight sus vibes from this lynch, ian and DC are somewhat excused due to self preserving but I'll be keeping an extra eye on them. Link is Link.
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I'll need doc on me from time to time - not necessarily today, just pick a pattern where scum cannot predict when to NK me.
@Fu Hua
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(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/c3/c36ae716b8e83c5b97e98be43cd9f478ff85a15e16e0578388c63c6ad1fcc7ef.jpg)
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kaempfer is looking more and more town to me. TorB as well - while I'm not happy with lynching shock at all, he's had a similar train of thought as me through the whole vote. Naii and MW are giving me slight sus vibes from this lynch, ian and DC are somewhat excused due to self preserving but I'll be keeping an extra eye on them. Link is Link.
I was getting some torb trust from his "ties are made to be broken" thought process. However, its not exactly hard to work up the courage to decide between two town as mafia. I don't think they should be let off the hook that easily, but it does soften the blow. I am with you on the Naii/MW/DC thought process though. Ian idk, he didnt share his popcorn with me, which is pretty mean imo.
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kaempfer is looking more and more town to me. TorB as well - while I'm not happy with lynching shock at all, he's had a similar train of thought as me through the whole vote. Naii and MW are giving me slight sus vibes from this lynch, ian and DC are somewhat excused due to self preserving but I'll be keeping an extra eye on them. Link is Link.
I was getting some torb trust from his "ties are made to be broken" thought process. However, its not exactly hard to work up the courage to decide between two town as mafia. I don't think they should be let off the hook that easily, but it does soften the blow. I am with you on the Naii/MW/DC thought process though. Ian idk, he didnt share his popcorn with me, which is pretty mean imo.
Yeah, if anything, the tiebreak speaks against him as it’s a vintage, low effort no risk town move. But again, in my book, every other action of his has been 100% on point. Solid townread of mine as of now, only kaempfer is higher.
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Smh w3, your breadposting game is weak. This is why I'm more useful than you. Just let the pros handle it.
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kaempfer is looking more and more town to me. TorB as well - while I'm not happy with lynching shock at all, he's had a similar train of thought as me through the whole vote. Naii and MW are giving me slight sus vibes from this lynch, ian and DC are somewhat excused due to self preserving but I'll be keeping an extra eye on them. Link is Link.
I was getting some torb trust from his "ties are made to be broken" thought process. However, its not exactly hard to work up the courage to decide between two town as mafia. I don't think they should be let off the hook that easily, but it does soften the blow. I am with you on the Naii/MW/DC thought process though. Ian idk, he didnt share his popcorn with me, which is pretty mean imo.
Yeah, if anything, the tiebreak speaks against him as it’s a vintage, low effort no risk town move. But again, in my book, every other action of his has been 100% on point. Solid townread of mine as of now, only kaempfer is higher.
thats fair, I just wanted to point it out. Don't want to miss anything because we put our towngoggles on.
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Based on context clues, I may have figured out who Sin Mal is, but I will keep the information to myself. :whistles:
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Only dawn didn't vote, so he's either Bronya with 2 voting power now, or Bronya still has 1.
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I'm guessing Link was already counting on me to do just that, forcing someone to tiebreak with 2 minutes left on the timer... at least I wasn't a Graboid this time :sillyspin:
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hey link
bad lynch
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i have to at least slight scumread link for forcing a switch/no lynch with his last moment vote, there were 2 minutes left and that’s just a textbook blitz. you can’t hide under a facade of “oopsie daisies†when people expressed that they townread shock. they were only voting him because of your late vote and claim that he was detrimental to the town as town; i don’t like that at all. torb is okay because we had to lynch someone other than the forced nl we were put into.
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Without reading the past 20 pages, I'll say that it is rather likely that one of the original trains (MW, DC, www3) is mafia, And if so, Naii is almost certainly town due to how his first vote on Shock felt. Only way I see that being a scum vote leading to a kill is if 2 scum did it, and that's an extremely heavy investment this early on.
Similarly, I think it is likely that at least/exactly one vote on Shock is mafia.
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This is the first time we've policy lynched someone since CR in 59. That one was unanimous though, the only holdout being Sky's vote on me. This one was a lot funner, we should do it more often.
If I had a scumread I would have voted for them. As it stands it's as good an outcome as we were gonna get besides lynching a mafia, and it's a lot better than we got last game with serp in charge.
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This was a waste of lynch and if anyone believes in policy lynching, I’m up for policy lynching them, even if it’s someone who is U N L Y N C H A B L E
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Without reading the past 20 pages, I'll say that it is rather likely that one of the original trains (MW, DC, www3) is mafia, And if so, Naii is almost certainly town due to how his first vote on Shock felt. Only way I see that being a scum vote leading to a kill is if 2 scum did it, and that's an extremely heavy investment this early on.
Similarly, I think it is likely that at least/exactly one vote on Shock is mafia.
I’m of opposite thinking that hardly anyone is mafia and mafia were watching us kill each other, as usual. Only DC has slight scum poss imo.
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Honestly, with shock already 90% outed as Rita, along with shock being shock, shock was actually one of the worst town wagons for mafia. Should have been easy enough to pick off one of w3/MW/DC and potentially eliminate a much better role. With MW hardclaiming not Durandal, w3 and DC would have probably been the best bets.
Not saying it was a good lynch as town, just that that does not make it an optimal lynch for mafia either.
This also means I lynch voted with what would be optimal as mafia, but what can you do.
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And to add, since I've briefly read up on the rest, I change my mind about the lynch. I still think there's a considerable enough chance that MW/DC/www3 are mafia, though pretty much all of the votes on Shock had basically no reason. Naii did it not thinking he would die, DC MW were self preservation, Link was "policy lynching" or something, ian could be someone to look into but I don't think there's enough there yet, and TorB is being helpful enoufh elsewhere to warrant a townread, though I'm absolutely not discounting the chance that he's mafia, and was willing to throw shade at him at some point due to a hunch I had earlier in the day.
This isn't to say I'm townreading the people who voted Shock, just that there was very little to go off considering the context.
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I also don't like how the two highest vote trains were for people who were inactive at the end of the phase, though it's bound to happen considering timezones
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Honestly, with shock already 90% outed as Rita, along with shock being shock, shock was actually one of the worst town wagons for mafia. Should have been easy enough to pick off one of w3/MW/DC and potentially eliminate a much better role. With MW hardclaiming not Durandal, w3 and DC would have probably been the best bets.
Not saying it was a good lynch as town, just that that does not make it an optimal lynch for mafia either.
This also means I lynch voted with what would be optimal as mafia, but what can you do.
I believe it was so
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
this was the last vote before the shock wagon fully gained momentum. ian and DC came from the w3 train, MW from kaempf, and Link and TORB from DC.
it's under my impression that once it looked like the DC lynch was going to gain momentum, DC and Link switched onto someone more viable and convincing than w3, seeing as how we didn't have any real scum reads on either but shock is more regarded as maf/useless town universally. I want to keep track of this in the future, but I wouldn't push anything yet besides still wanting to lynch DC tomorrow.
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Now that we have some EOD dynamics I think I can build some reads
Linkcat (n-) Most of what he posted during the day was fairly neutral. The way he pushed for a shock lynch could just be bad blood from the previous game (which shouldn't be a thing imo) but that would also be a perfect cover.
Torb (v) The effort he put into strategizing and discussing strats was very townie imo (scum wants a confused town, discussing roles clears up confusion). On top of that he insisted on going after someone he actually had a read on during EOD.
Oa (v) Unless there is a ruse involving a mafia Durandal, oa is confirmed. The way he played in EOD was similar to torb, which points in the same direction
ian (n-) Only a few low content posts during the day is remembering me the ian from the previous game (tho apparently he always plays like this). He was mostly self preserving during EOD which I consider NAI
w3 (n) My vote on him was based on an awkward interaction that he had with rob, which was the closest to a tell I had that far. During EOD, the de-escalation between him and DC felt like mutual self preservation. Tho he kept defending DC even when he was top lynch, which is not something I see scum doing, so I'm putting him back to neutral.
MW (n) his posting has been lackluster so far, so not much to form a read. During EOD his only move was hopping on the shock train (from a vote on kae?). Needs more for a proper read.
dawn (n-) Nearly no posts, not even a vote (when people agreed on voting all days).
kae (n) His interaction with moe was weird to say the least, but I also think that was just kae missing a joke. His voting always on people with no votes yet strikes me as someone without a solid idea on who to vote, but still trying to avoid Bronya shenanigans (I'd say that's NAI in D1)
Sub (n) His posting has felt mostly neutral to me, during EOD he just parked the vote on DC, which is not much to read imo, just means they are likely not w/w.
kdz (n) Not much substance so far, but he has a good excuse for that. Just parked on dawn and stuck to it (even tho dawn will probably just die to Cecilia). Needs more for a better read.
Coffee (v) Has been actively discussing strategy and has been proactive, which is good for town. During voting he stuck since the beggining in the DC train (which as with Sub just tells me they are likely not alligned)
rob (n) He's quieter than usual, but still prodding people to talk (tho with rob that's NAI, as he does that as scum too). Wasn't around for EOD, so nothing to read there.
DC (n) His interaction with Link was a bit awkward, but on the other hand DC is also a shitposter and that could very well be just memeing. Did mostly self preservation at EOD and had to leave early. Will be keeping a closer eye on him, but I'll stick with an n for now
Cal (n) Few posts, but they at least had some content. Wasn't around for EOD but parked on DC. Need more for a better read.
Naii (n) Not enough content to make a read so far. Was voting just for the sake of voting (due to Bronya). I feel like mafia wouldn't do that unless all the wagons (DC, MW and w3 at the time of his vote) were town.
moe (n+) This is more of a feeling tbh, I got some town vibes from the way he reacted to kae. Wasn't around for EOD.
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I've read once through catching up - was absent from last post until a few minutes ago. Sadly mobile EOD was not feasible either. Such is life remodeling one's "forever" home I guess. That's enough b/s about RL that nobody cares about.
THAT WAS AN AWFUL LYNCH OF SHOCK. I'll need some time to process through that EOD, probably tomorrow. But come on guys that was not good. OK maybe I agree that shock distracts and misleads town as town but I think scum was on the docket between DC / www3 / ?MW?. I do apologize for missing EOD - I enjoy them and think they are important for players to be present for and I missed this one.
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robs progression on coffee just doesnt make sense. First he scumreads him for activity (which is the opposite of basic logic and the phantom memory he had has no grounds in reality, which may or may not mean that its completely made up), then townreads him for it when his memory was jogged (as he puts him in townleans with no other reason given than his initial read being wrong and coffee-activity=good), then claims activity is not a tell for coffee at all, but then keeps his townread on him anyway, while buddying him.
Yes, i still havent gotten over this.
Other rob related things: - his mechanics-talk is fine (pretty good) really, but in case of rob i wouldnt expect anything else really.
as he noted himself, his readlist developed to fit the wagons that were forming. it is indeed too consensy and him wanting to vote with certain other people (oa) further drives this home, passing responsibility for a misslynch to someone else.
My progression is fine. While it may be 'flawed' as in I don't have the answers at the start, but you are somewhat mischaracterizing it. I scumread him suddenly being active and different in a major way from last game wehre he was town (as in, he posted stuff this game... so I thought a variation in playstyle was something to scumlean THAT EARLY IN THE GAME when info is scarce) - and it was based on a faulty memory I had. Yes I corrected and adjusted my read when proper context and history was shown to me. I try to avoid activity tells on ANYONE when there is not a clear and hardline set of evicence to support it which does not exist for coffee - so yeah I rescinded any sort of postcount tell/read on coffee. I am not buddying him - I am finding that I have several times thought very similarly to him while trying to find some to work with a bit that I townread. It isn't foundless and I don't consider it buddying.
The fact that I was willing to try to get reads going so early is towny. The fact I was willing to adjust based on presented evidence and rescinde a scumlean based on facts is towny. Is it WIFOM for me to point this out? Sure, but sheesh kae that's a pretty poor set of reasoning as I see it.
I hate mechanics talk - but in a game so HEAVILY reliant on understanding and discussing roles like this one is I find myself somewhat forced into discussing mechanics. FYI - mafia tend to love discussing mechanics.
My readlist was developing BEFORE they were all wagons - I simply realized it was aligning and thought it was very unlikely I would have them all pegged rightly and that the thread would too - so I commented on it.
I didn't pass any responsibility and it is weird you characterize my voting scumreads of mine as "misslynch" responsibility passing - I see them as good lynches and only once a player flips is it even possible for me to know if right or not.
Kae - your attempt to scumread me is as shaky as I've commented before about some of your reads. I think I asked this before / last game --- do you have a scum-game example to link us to for background / meta? You seem different than last game --- you have a ton of reads that strike me as faked, poor, or misguided in ways that feel forced which I do not remember getting sense of from you at all last game when you were town. I want to try to compare a most recent scum game of yours to last game (you were town) with this game so far. Please / thanks.
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Torb (v) The effort he put into strategizing and discussing strats was very townie imo (scum wants a confused town, discussing roles clears up confusion). On top of that he insisted on going after someone he actually had a read on during EOD.
Unless I'm missing something, this isn't what happened at all.
Reasons? There are 2-3 town leans voting DC, there are 0 town leans voting shock. shock is not lynch voted for being scum, I want to lynch scum. Both feel n, ties are meant to be broken.
He said he'd have liked to vote for someone, but since neither train was a scumread, he voted to break the tie.
So I'll ask TorB, why move vote from DC to Shock, rather than from DC to someone else? I get moving vote to break the tie, but you implied distaste towards lynching Shock
By the way I do trust that Cecilia won't kill me tonight, and instead start to prepare kills elsewhere. There is an uncomfortable amount of implications of Cecilia killing me tonight
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Oh and I don't much like the whole "compare how people acted between games" things that Rob asked for. I remember it being stated on multiple occasions, the distaste that people have of being scumread based on how they were posting last game, including multiple times this game with people not wanting to lynch Shock based purely off vendettas from the most previous one. Perhaps things have changed since then, but I always saw it as something that people didn't want to happen
On that note, this quote irritates me slightly
I hate mechanics talk - but in a game so HEAVILY reliant on understanding and discussing roles like this one is I find myself somewhat forced into discussing mechanics. FYI - mafia tend to love discussing mechanics.
Adding the "FYI" onto the end of it feels like an attempt to say "Here's why I'm town and different to mafia," which is very commonly scum behaviour. Not enough to force a read from me on him for now, as my current favoured votes for next day phase lie with probably MW or DC, but can reinforce some opinions in the future
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I didnt vote shock based on prior games. I voted due to him being prime suspect for targeting kae for no real reason with a disrupting role. Thats really the scummiest thing that happend the whole night and day phases so why not. It was shock, no lynch, or inactives before EoD shenanigans happened. Sucks we hit a town but what other option did we have?
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@dawn, the situation looked like this when I switched to shock:
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
I had 1 minute and 38 seconds to break a tie with the second largest train being ian with 2.
Can you elaborate how I had any other choice but to break the tie to lynch shock, if I wanted to break the tie and minimize the odds someone else voting last minute would restore the tie, intentionally or otherwise?
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I must also emphasize that, at no point in time, did I town read shock. I got the feeling that, similar to how it took two days to get Linkcat lynched last mafia, not lynching shock now would not stop him from being lynchvoted day 2. This is the absolute worst possible outcome for town.
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EBWOP: no lynching Day 1 to save shock, only to lynch him Day 2 is the worst possible outcome for town.
-
By the way I do trust that Cecilia won't kill me tonight, and instead start to prepare kills elsewhere. There is an uncomfortable amount of implications of Cecilia killing me tonight
You can mitigate this by hard-claiming not Bronya. We dislike how Bronya influences lynch voting and you were the only person not to lynch vote.
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With Shock inactive, I doubt anyone would have tied the vote. And even if they did, that would be almost a guaranteed lynch on the next vote, as it is such a horribly scummy thing to do, considering everyone has stated how bad no lynching is.
And by saying "distaste towards lynching shock", I meant more of a preference towards the other train, due to townread patterns as you explained in your earlier vote for DC.
By the way I do trust that Cecilia won't kill me tonight, and instead start to prepare kills elsewhere. There is an uncomfortable amount of implications of Cecilia killing me tonight
You can mitigate this by hard-claiming not Bronya. We dislike how Bronya influences lynch voting and you were the only person not to lynch vote.
I claim not Bronya, and if wished, I will place my vote on someone with no votes to remove the possibility of Bronya votes (disregarding the case where I must vote out of self-preservation).
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Link tied the vote at that time. If you look through the lynch history, you will see Oa and I created an unintentional three way tie at some point, it happened before and can happen again. There was very little time to react before hard deadline.
-
At least this time around there is some actual wagonomics to work with; will get on lynchlog soontm
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I don't see why defending against an unsubstantiated scumread get me so strong townreads (rob, Coffee [only a 'slight townlean' in case of Coffee; I remembered the 'I like his reaction a lot' just a bit better]). I take it but at the same time feel a bit uneasy that little scrutiny early might turn on me in later stages of the game. Fortunately MW comes to the rescue:
Moe and Naii are proabbly the sketchiest votes on me. They voted once the wagon started rolling and havent really said much against me. Seems like they are gunning for a town lynch.
I am gunning for a lynch and votes from everyone alive. So, I do vote and vote people who do not contribute as much as others. I hate pressure on people so they spew out information D1 which is simply not there, but I have incorporated the No Lynch = bad mentality. Seeing Oa on you made that decision (too) easy for me.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
Dont wanna lycnh W3 yet.
Dont wanna lynch DC yet.
Dont wanna No Lynch.
Ill go with the scummiest person on this list that isnt moe.
This took me a bit by surprise. I take it your reservation is due to me being absent? But also that I am your biggest scumread? I'll try to take it as an incentive to make better plays in your eyes in the future. :|
I'm not town leaning a single member of the shock train, nor do I have a scum lean on shock himself, so I'm currently stuck voting on my only scum lean. No lynch isn't optimal, but I'll get a really good laugh out of it, seeing how shock and w3 both wanted no lynch and they're the top wagons.
The first sentence resonated very well with me. +cred
I only finished reading page 44 and sky's mod post.
-
v
kaempfer - seems genuinely interested in solving
TorB - a lot of his thoughts allocate with mine
n+
dawn - going out early on calling out Cecilia gives slight town cred in my book. I believe his claim on not being Bronya, but if he turns out to be, it's looking real bad for him
moe - hard buddying me, which isn't even slightly controversial, but his posts seem genuine to me. Explains his MW vote on his trust on me, fair enough.
w3 - just like moe, he's playing exactly the way I'd expect town w3 to play. I'm not implying it's a difficult task, since it's not, but his play makes sense
n-
MW - I like they way he responded on the pressure, but I'm not convinced yet. Being on shock
Naii - getting weird vibes, although his confusion is likely legit, as I've felt just the way he has on earlier occasions. I don't like his reasoning on voting MW, although it might sound hypocrital as 1) I was on MW and 2) MW is a mere n- for me
ian - kinda had to stay at a pile bigger than his, so can't blame him on staying on shock, but the timing of his vote is not looking good to me. The post about "don't kill me as I'm OP in the endgame" without any more substance (he said it was a mashup of many factors) is kinda throwing me off.
The rest are standing at n. For now.
Piling up on shockcannon just because sHoCk Is ShOcK is a scummy move in my book and it's definitely influencing my readlist.
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Regarding Oa, I know you're probably meme-ing, but just in case: I never said I'm OP in lategame. All I said is that I'll be more useful than I am right now, so lynching me because I'm one of the more "useless" people right now is not really a valid reason to lynch me. Nothing more, nothing less.
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Yep the way I wrote OP can be seen as memeing, but it's at least not built on nothing. I'm probably putting too much into it, though, I realize that. You know I always scumread you by default :*
However, I never based my read on the fact that you're so-called "useless", though. That's pretty important to me to make clear.
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Eep, haven't been on the chopping block for as long as I remembered, if anyone thought I stopped being jokey and shit, that was probably why.
Reads maybe a bit later, but before that, @MW I never considered you as a joke, I respect ya as a player and a friend alright? If you embrace your own meme it's fine but if it hurts too much do sound out and I'll stop, and I'm sure the rest would stop too. In the same vein, ian I don't think you're useless either :(
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I was rereading abilities to make a suggested use list for tonight again. However, look at this:
Raiden's Phantom Image redirects abilities from both players to one another. This could mean that a Raiden could redirect a doc off of somebody. Town!Raiden shouldn't use their ability at all if they're in a game.
Raiden Mei Phantom Image (ER) Target exactly two players. Tonight, anything that targets the first player affects the second player instead, and vice versa. This includes the nightkill.
Does this mean that a mafia!Raiden could just nightkill one of their own and Phantom Image the night kill away from them and onto somebody, including someone protected by a doctor? The priority is what makes this troublesome, as it is the very first ability on the priority list. I would love to hear thoughts, or can we simply not protect against this??
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Town Raiden Mei can also protect confirmed town power roles this way. Depending on whom you redirect the nightkill to, it might even kill mafia. You might redirect the medic, but if the medic protected the target that would be nightkilled, it will still protect the new target and prevent a nightkill from taking place. The main problem is redirecting town vigis onto other town or Raiden Mei being scum. I see no reason not to use it. A random redirect from a likely NK target changes the chance of mafia getting NK-ed from 0% to something more. It's still a minor chance, but an improvement.
For the specific case of nightkill on a mafia and redirecting it onto someone else... there is only one Fu Hua at most, since a town Fu Hua would not know whom is mafia, there is little benefit to go through such lengths yet, I'd think.
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Eep, haven't been on the chopping block for as long as I remembered, if anyone thought I stopped being jokey and shit, that was probably why.
Reads maybe a bit later, but before that, @MW I never considered you as a joke, I respect ya as a player and a friend alright? If you embrace your own meme it's fine but if it hurts too much do sound out and I'll stop, and I'm sure the rest would stop too. In the same vein, ian I don't think you're useless either :(
Thanks DubC! I'm good with the meme. I dig the "are you pulling a MW" when someone says they scum read a post thats really not all that sus.
I dont have much for reads right now. To address this:
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
Dont wanna lycnh W3 yet.
Dont wanna lynch DC yet.
Dont wanna No Lynch.
Ill go with the scummiest person on this list that isnt moe.
This took me a bit by surprise. I take it your reservation is due to me being absent? But also that I am your biggest scumread? I'll try to take it as an incentive to make better plays in your eyes in the future. :|
Nahh i scum read you because you and Naii were the most sus votes on me. If shock didnt target kaempf with disrupting role, my vote woulda been on you or naii since thats really all the reads i had and still do have.
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Town Raiden Mei can also protect confirmed town power roles this way. Depending on whom you redirect the nightkill to, it might even kill mafia. You might redirect the medic, but if the medic protected the target that would be nightkilled, it will still protect the new target and prevent a nightkill from taking place. The main problem is redirecting town vigis onto other town or Raiden Mei being scum. I see no reason not to use it. A random redirect from a likely NK target changes the chance of mafia getting NK-ed from 0% to something more. It's still a minor chance, but an improvement.
For the specific case of nightkill on a mafia and redirecting it onto someone else... there is only one Fu Hua at most, since a town Fu Hua would not know whom is mafia, there is little benefit to go through such lengths yet, I'd think.
Until we have our investigative roles out with their reports (which should not happen yet) it's dangerous to possibly redirect onto Dura or other investigative roles like Emma and Theresa. The odds are both 3/14 for a redirect onto either. I think it comes down to what risks we're willing to take, but I will admit the redirect makes it possible to kill mafia. It probably is more beneficial to us for the redirect to happen, as it's possible that we hit mafia like you said.
That being said, the mechanics I'm talking about are if the mafia night kill one of their own AND redirect (in the case of mafia!Raiden) onto a target from there. Because all targeting gets switched, that means not only will the nightkill always go through, but if they hit someone with doc protection, the mafia gets a free protection from town vig hits.
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I get that, I'm just pointing out that the mafia the nightkill is directed at, would not have a lower chance of getting doc protection than several town members if doc is town, since doc does not know they are targeting mafia.
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For now, yes. I guess my point is that we should be very wary about claiming important roles like Dura because even with protection, there's the possibility (albeit small) that the mafia can get around it. Any other thoughts on things to be aware of?
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Core of Reason, Durandal and Emma Planck should all be on cooldown tonight, having Frederica Tesla target the exact same targets as last night may give insight on those roles. In case shock was included, we already know he used his ability N0 and did not have a Honkai Core.
At least one player has already given significant hints on their role. The one that first comes to mind might not be the most important one, but they would make perfect Theresa targets. For town Theresa with info on unclaimed people: remember that the other two top town roles are both EoR. So they should not be a priority when "random" lynching.
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fucking finally, i got interrupted by being asked to do chores whenever I worked up like a minute to work on this. You may want to doublecheck my patchwerkwork.
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (1) - PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
-
forgot my greens
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (1) - PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
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No, what I mean is, he started his second line with "I did also say...", and at first, I assumed everything after it was a continuation of the previous line.
Yes, which is his reason for not simply removing his vote after realizing it was stupid. He then continues with what he will vote for.
If that is the case, then my discovery is null. Yet a sour taste will remain for the random MW vote, with the only explanation given that it was a bad vote.
Hey, um, Link. I just want to get it out of the way for transparency's sake. I get the feeling that you are a bit unmotivated. I will not say that is scummy, and I will not compare it to previous games. But can you explain why you are keeping a low profile this time? I believe it is for the greater good if everybody heard your explanation, if you have any.
Me being so quiet N0 was due to being asleep for most of it, trying not to do a repeat of last game like I said I wouldn't, and not having a lot of energy since the Smash community just got hit by MeToo. Since then I've just kept the same mood and I haven't seen much for me to make aggressive pushes on. Also we have a lot more good players now so I don't feel the need to drive the game as much as I did in the past.
Sounds solid. Believable, good reasoning and active enough to keep a good understanding without the O R C H E S T R A A T I O N. But I guess I am more easily swayed by people who are good with words.
Also, great questioning form Sub.
Think about it. With shock in the game, there's effectively 4 mafia. If we lynch shock we're guaranteed to at least go down to 3. But if he actually is mafia, then we've effectively gone from 4 to 2, killing half the team with one lynch. That's pretty high EV, I see no flaw in my math.
(((And this was the point where Sub realized that this game only has 3 mafia in it.....)))
I am not quite sure what to make of this... But I mostly agree with kae: 'derpclear denied'
EOD shit like this is why town will lose this game as well. Too bad I'm going to be on the losing end because of you all.
Sounds sincere to me. Slight town lean.
EOD
kaempfer is looking more and more town to me. TorB as well - while I'm not happy with lynching shock at all, he's had a similar train of thought as me through the whole vote. Naii and MW are giving me slight sus vibes from this lynch, ian and DC are somewhat excused due to self preserving but I'll be keeping an extra eye on them. Link is Link.
I don't get sus vibes for early votes on shock. There are better targets as mafia. I agree with the rest except that I find myself struggling with the idea to put kae above n, but definetly not below it.
(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/c3/c36ae716b8e83c5b97e98be43cd9f478ff85a15e16e0578388c63c6ad1fcc7ef.jpg)
Your meme game is way behind Link's. :-X
If I had a scumread I would have voted for them. As it stands it's as good an outcome as we were gonna get besides lynching a mafia, and it's a lot better than we got last game with serp in charge.
I don't think it's anywhere near 'as good as we were gonna get' when most people had a strong hunch that shock was indeed town Rita. So far I really liked most of what you said. :/
Without reading the past 20 pages, I'll say that it is rather likely that one of the original trains (MW, DC, www3) is mafia, And if so, Naii is almost certainly town due to how his first vote on Shock felt. Only way I see that being a scum vote leading to a kill is if 2 scum did it, and that's an extremely heavy investment this early on.
Similarly, I think it is likely that at least/exactly one vote on Shock is mafia.
And to add, since I've briefly read up on the rest, I change my mind about the lynch. I still think there's a considerable enough chance that MW/DC/www3 are mafia, though pretty much all of the votes on Shock had basically no reason. Naii did it not thinking he would die, DC MW were self preservation, Link was "policy lynching" or something, ian could be someone to look into but I don't think there's enough there yet, and TorB is being helpful enoufh elsewhere to warrant a townread, though I'm absolutely not discounting the chance that he's mafia, and was willing to throw shade at him at some point due to a hunch I had earlier in the day.
This isn't to say I'm townreading the people who voted Shock, just that there was very little to go off considering the context.
Those are two very solid posts with very little information. I feel conflicted as how to take this. Not voting is also something that we all don't like all that much. Count me suspicious. :-\
I also don't like how the two highest vote trains were for people who were inactive at the end of the phase, though it's bound to happen considering timezones
I do like this one, though.
Honestly, with shock already 90% outed as Rita, along with shock being shock, shock was actually one of the worst town wagons for mafia. Should have been easy enough to pick off one of w3/MW/DC and potentially eliminate a much better role. With MW hardclaiming not Durandal, w3 and DC would have probably been the best bets.
Not saying it was a good lynch as town, just that that does not make it an optimal lynch for mafia either.
This also means I lynch voted with what would be optimal as mafia, but what can you do.
I believe it was so
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
this was the last vote before the shock wagon fully gained momentum. ian and DC came from the w3 train, MW from kaempf, and Link and TORB from DC.
it's under my impression that once it looked like the DC lynch was going to gain momentum, DC and Link switched onto someone more viable and convincing than w3, seeing as how we didn't have any real scum reads on either but shock is more regarded as maf/useless town universally. I want to keep track of this in the future, but I wouldn't push anything yet besides still wanting to lynch DC tomorrow.
I like / enjoy this kind of analysis. Mostly because I am too lazy to read up those kind of things. Coffee is another town lean for me. Also props to kae for the logs in general ;)
Two pages behind, andre just posted his reads list N1. Taking a bit of time to fully catch up. But here are a few thoughts up until that point:
I would have liked DC lynch better since shock was town for me. But not EOD lynching afk is something I like to advocate. It has a terrible track record (maf 71?). Ian became a viable lynch option later who I could also have gotten behind. So for me: lynch DC/MW/ian > lynch shock, unsure about www. So some earlier pressure on DC is fine. But without info - that we also won't get N1 and D2 - EOD frenzy is very likely to happen again. Therefore, I'd proceed carefully lynching DC. But I don't feel too strongly about it any more D2.
I am not sure any more who implied dawn is going to die soon anyway. Can we agree as town not to use Cecilia as a killing tool? I see the benefit of having the option to vig people at later stages but this early it is beyond scummy.
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Wagonomics strongly suggest DC town. He was topwagon very frequently (competing with various different wagons) and the vote that decided he lives another day was torb, who i tr and who also had voted him with intend to kill afaik before, so doesnt look like any effort went into saving him.
To a lesser extend, I tr w3 for the same reason I tr timpa last game (that was wrong though, so maybe i shouldnt tr people for this anymore) as after he stopped memevoting dc he actually defended dc as early as when he was the competing topwagon.
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robs progression on coffee just doesnt make sense. First he scumreads him for activity (which is the opposite of basic logic and the phantom memory he had has no grounds in reality, which may or may not mean that its completely made up), then townreads him for it when his memory was jogged (as he puts him in townleans with no other reason given than his initial read being wrong and coffee-activity=good), then claims activity is not a tell for coffee at all, but then keeps his townread on him anyway, while buddying him.
Yes, i still havent gotten over this.
Other rob related things: - his mechanics-talk is fine (pretty good) really, but in case of rob i wouldnt expect anything else really.
as he noted himself, his readlist developed to fit the wagons that were forming. it is indeed too consensy and him wanting to vote with certain other people (oa) further drives this home, passing responsibility for a misslynch to someone else.
My progression is fine. While it may be 'flawed' as in I don't have the answers at the start, but you are somewhat mischaracterizing it. I scumread him suddenly being active and different in a major way from last game wehre he was town (as in, he posted stuff this game... so I thought a variation in playstyle was something to scumlean THAT EARLY IN THE GAME when info is scarce) - and it was based on a faulty memory I had. Yes I corrected and adjusted my read when proper context and history was shown to me. I try to avoid activity tells on ANYONE when there is not a clear and hardline set of evicence to support it which does not exist for coffee - so yeah I rescinded any sort of postcount tell/read on coffee. I am not buddying him - I am finding that I have several times thought very similarly to him while trying to find some to work with a bit that I townread. It isn't foundless and I don't consider it buddying.
The fact that I was willing to try to get reads going so early is towny. The fact I was willing to adjust based on presented evidence and rescinde a scumlean based on facts is towny. Is it WIFOM for me to point this out? Sure, but sheesh kae that's a pretty poor set of reasoning as I see it.
I hate mechanics talk - but in a game so HEAVILY reliant on understanding and discussing roles like this one is I find myself somewhat forced into discussing mechanics. FYI - mafia tend to love discussing mechanics.
My readlist was developing BEFORE they were all wagons - I simply realized it was aligning and thought it was very unlikely I would have them all pegged rightly and that the thread would too - so I commented on it.
I didn't pass any responsibility and it is weird you characterize my voting scumreads of mine as "misslynch" responsibility passing - I see them as good lynches and only once a player flips is it even possible for me to know if right or not.
Kae - your attempt to scumread me is as shaky as I've commented before about some of your reads. I think I asked this before / last game --- do you have a scum-game example to link us to for background / meta? You seem different than last game --- you have a ton of reads that strike me as faked, poor, or misguided in ways that feel forced which I do not remember getting sense of from you at all last game when you were town. I want to try to compare a most recent scum game of yours to last game (you were town) with this game so far. Please / thanks.
I already posted my only scumgame in the previous game. Kinda dissapointed you didnt even register that even though you already asked for it last time I thought. I suppose that doesnt matter for this game though.
Link: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/24094-Poisonous-Vigilantes-Re-Rand
Bonus: in the initial round I was town and another asshat scumread me for the exact same reason you did now.
https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/24079-Poisonous-Vigilantes-21er?p=3566885#post3566885
The lower effort version would have been to just not mention the people i arrived at n on anyway and you wouldnt have perceived it as odd at all, yet i shared why i arrived at ultimately not having strong feelings.
(https://i.redd.it/dqkpi5rq2gk11.png)
This post is also scumpinging me (sort of appeasy/defensive, also the attempt to get reads wasnt scummy, the resulting reads were), but I suppose I'm deep enough in the tunnel that i would scumread you for donating to charity (distracting from the relevant topic, maybe fighting a bad conscience).
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Alright so im at a catch .22
Im looking for legit advice here.
People want me lynched for what seems like not being as blatantly stupid as last game. So, do i dumb down? Do i just take the lynch? Not really sure. I cant even defend myself because what can i even say? "Sorry guys, these rules are more complicated and so im trying to put more thought into my posts as to not spread misinformation." I already said that. Its not working.
If its because of the shock vote, i already explained my vote. I voted due to a scummy action he made. Isnt that hOw MaFiA wOrKs?
I have given all the information about myself. Lemme bulletin it so that if i do get lynched, youll see there is no info to gain from it.
- Im Town
- I do NOT have an information role
- I have NOT used my role yet
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MW: your lynch train was actually the first to break down before EoD. If trying to improve your game will cause you to respond differently from a previous game where you were town, people will naturally be suspicious. To further improve your game, having more content posts will help. There just is nothing (for me, at least) to townread you on at the moment.
If we really want a lynch, none of the bullet points (mafia would still call themselves town) provide any grounds not to. Nothing you can do about that part.
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Now that we have some EOD dynamics I think I can build some reads
kae (n) His interaction with moe was weird to say the least, but I also think that was just kae missing a joke. His voting always on people with no votes yet strikes me as someone without a solid idea on who to vote, but still trying to avoid Bronya shenanigans (I'd say that's NAI in D1)
Most people don't have a solid idea on who to vote on. But voting on people with no votes on / being reluctant about hammering people let's other people (mafia) do it. As a concept it's easily as bad as NL. But I feel the same way in this situation. Luckily, there's a sound mix of people with different mindsets that take care of this problem. Still I think it's nice to remind yourself that those kind of votes don't really help town as much. Saying this while being guilty of the same fallacy. :-\
Avoiding no vote with Bronya is 100% in character for kae, maybe even 110% for scum!kae.
kdz (n) Not much substance so far, but he has a good excuse for that. Just parked on dawn and stuck to it (even tho dawn will probably just die to Cecilia). Needs more for a better read.
I'm guilty of the same thing. But I have to address this again as I catch it: Don't kill dawn if you are Cecilia.
THAT WAS AN AWFUL LYNCH OF SHOCK. I'll need some time to process through that EOD, probably tomorrow. But come on guys that was not good. OK maybe I agree that shock distracts and misleads town as town but I think scum was on the docket between DC / www3 / ?MW?. I do apologize for missing EOD - I enjoy them and think they are important for players to be present for and I missed this one.
It's easy to see suspicion everywhere when town get lynched and three others get off the hook. I find it perfectly believable but please try not to get hung up on this.
Kae - your attempt to scumread me is as shaky as I've commented before about some of your reads. I think I asked this before / last game --- do you have a scum-game example to link us to for background / meta? You seem different than last game --- you have a ton of reads that strike me as faked, poor, or misguided in ways that feel forced which I do not remember getting sense of from you at all last game when you were town. I want to try to compare a most recent scum game of yours to last game (you were town) with this game so far. Please / thanks.
Coming in as a character reference: kae started out as being very cautious and methodical but with experience transformed into someone who pressures / accuses early even when information is scarce. I welcome this provision of early content. It's just important to be able to hold your own judgement accountable. But I am seeing progress on this front, too. However, you two seem to clash frequently. I was trying to mediate last game, too, but I can't say I townread the both of you this game already. Just keep a cool head and see this as what it may be a vastly different perspective. Only this game I am not serpcleared.
On that note, this quote irritates me slightly
I hate mechanics talk - but in a game so HEAVILY reliant on understanding and discussing roles like this one is I find myself somewhat forced into discussing mechanics. FYI - mafia tend to love discussing mechanics.
Adding the "FYI" onto the end of it feels like an attempt to say "Here's why I'm town and different to mafia," which is very commonly scum behaviour. Not enough to force a read from me on him for now, as my current favoured votes for next day phase lie with probably MW or DC, but can reinforce some opinions in the future
Ironically, judging from other games and his own declaration (e.g. last game) he does this quite a lot. I.e. saying he is town - as town and scum.
But more generally I do like your recent posts [Albeit a strange point in regard to TorB regarding content as he himself has pointed out] and am starting to back-pedal from my professed suspicion. To put it in numbers: 'n', I guess. >.<
I didnt vote shock based on prior games. I voted due to him being prime suspect for targeting kae for no real reason with a disrupting role. Thats really the scummiest thing that happend the whole night and day phases so why not. It was shock, no lynch, or inactives before EoD shenanigans happened. Sucks we hit a town but what other option did we have?
You're making it a bit too easy for yourself here. I guess I can put the regained suspicion from dawn onto you. If others feel differently I can elaborate what bugs me. But for now I am inclined to catch up.
With Shock inactive, I doubt anyone would have tied the vote. And even if they did, that would be almost a guaranteed lynch on the next vote, as it is such a horribly scummy thing to do, considering everyone has stated how bad no lynching is.
And by saying "distaste towards lynching shock", I meant more of a preference towards the other train, due to townread patterns as you explained in your earlier vote for DC.
TorB already said it was fewer than 100 seconds until deadline. Take it at face value. What is this even about? Switching votes from TorB was a good play.
By the way I do trust that Cecilia won't kill me tonight, and instead start to prepare kills elsewhere. There is an uncomfortable amount of implications of Cecilia killing me tonight
You can mitigate this by hard-claiming not Bronya. We dislike how Bronya influences lynch voting and you were the only person not to lynch vote.
I claim not Bronya, and if wished, I will place my vote on someone with no votes to remove the possibility of Bronya votes (disregarding the case where I must vote out of self-preservation).
You should put your vote on your scumreads. If it messes with the outcome of the lynchvote I am absolutely sure about the path we're going to go down. Vote you must.
moe - hard buddying me, which isn't even slightly controversial, but his posts seem genuine to me. Explains his MW vote on his trust on me, fair enough.
To clarify: I looked for someone to put my vote on that might very well stay there until EOD. Not that I expected crucial information to surface until then but atmosphere can change quickly and one scummy post might be enough to swing an entire day's worth of discussion and votes. MW was my least towny/solving read at the time when I had to place my vote and your previous vote made it easier. It was more a catalyst than a reason.
Regarding Oa, I know you're probably meme-ing, but just in case: I never said I'm OP in lategame. All I said is that I'll be more useful than I am right now, so lynching me because I'm one of the more "useless" people right now is not really a valid reason to lynch me. Nothing more, nothing less.
To be fair, I also read it as more useful than others lategame. Which is a weird statement.
I dont have much for reads right now. To address this:
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
Dont wanna lycnh W3 yet.
Dont wanna lynch DC yet.
Dont wanna No Lynch.
Ill go with the scummiest person on this list that isnt moe.
This took me a bit by surprise. I take it your reservation is due to me being absent? But also that I am your biggest scumread? I'll try to take it as an incentive to make better plays in your eyes in the future. :|
Nahh i scum read you because you and Naii were the most sus votes on me. If shock didnt target kaempf with disrupting role, my vote woulda been on you or naii since thats really all the reads i had and still do have.
I don't see how someone voting another person that only you know to be town is scummy. But with the assumption that 'it's not unlike that in a group of four people voting together there is scum and the timing is poorly chosen' and a case of OMGUS you are suspicious of me. Let's get better reads D2. That does not mean I townread you.
Town Raiden Mei can also protect confirmed town power roles this way. Depending on whom you redirect the nightkill to, it might even kill mafia. You might redirect the medic, but if the medic protected the target that would be nightkilled, it will still protect the new target and prevent a nightkill from taking place. The main problem is redirecting town vigis onto other town or Raiden Mei being scum. I see no reason not to use it. A random redirect from a likely NK target changes the chance of mafia getting NK-ed from 0% to something more. It's still a minor chance, but an improvement.
For the specific case of nightkill on a mafia and redirecting it onto someone else... there is only one Fu Hua at most, since a town Fu Hua would not know whom is mafia, there is little benefit to go through such lengths yet, I'd think.
Until we have our investigative roles out with their reports (which should not happen yet) it's dangerous to possibly redirect onto Dura or other investigative roles like Emma and Theresa. The odds are both 3/14 for a redirect onto either. I think it comes down to what risks we're willing to take, but I will admit the redirect makes it possible to kill mafia. It probably is more beneficial to us for the redirect to happen, as it's possible that we hit mafia like you said.
That being said, the mechanics I'm talking about are if the mafia night kill one of their own AND redirect (in the case of mafia!Raiden) onto a target from there. Because all targeting gets switched, that means not only will the nightkill always go through, but if they hit someone with doc protection, the mafia gets a free protection from town vig hits.
Not happy with this analysis. Chances for redirecting onto them is the same for deflecting in the same pool of players. Raiden can also redirect onto mafia but hardly deflect. (There is a Seele Raiden×2 plus roleblocking interaction possible but 99% irrelevant.) But Raiden messes with more town roles than it messes with mafia roles. Still, mafia roles are more important than town. Undecided about its usefulness but it's annoying, just ask kae.
Other thoughts: mafia might have good information already and kill an important role. On the other hand, if not-Durandal dies, Emma is town or Durandal is maf. This theory becomes even stronger after N2.
Again, I don't want Cecilia to go about killing heaps of people. Do we have a consensus here? I'm going as far as wanting Emma to call Cecilia out D3 if dawn gets killed N1/N2.
How annoying is it to read my thoughts on things that happened 10 pages in the past?
It helps to make my conclusions in the form of readslists more comprehensible, but I also name things other players have already pointed out just not at the time of my writing subject. So, it is redundant or could be a copy of others.
Ideally, I am up to date all the time but if I fall behind it helps me to close the gap whereas I could not fully catch up if I did not do it at all while still giving input. But I could keep it a bit shorter, obviously my EOD thoughts don't affect the lynch that already happened.
This would also reduce my walls of text and make it more readable. So far I believe more content=better. It's more a question of mass quotes or a write-up then.
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Is it just me or is moe way more confident this game than any other he's played in? Almost like a different person. I think this is the result of him rolling mafia for the first time and finally not being in the dark.
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I agree with the observation but not the conclusion.
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What's the reason then?
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Been thinking the same thing.
He might have important role and therefore trying to look important and knowledgeable.
Or hes maf
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...Or he just wants to take a more active role this game. There's nothing inherently scummy with trying to produce high content posts
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I'd most like to attribute it to growing experience. I really only played two mafia here and and more specifically was confirmed town for the most part in the second one. But before being outed I could communicate freely with serp. This led to me not having to be as cautious as I had been before. However, when posting publicly I still want to come off as conscientious and put a lot of thought into how I express myself.
I guess I also am in a better place personally but that's a weird thing to claim here.
Being townread (across games) is also something that helps. This is especially nice to read:
Is it just me or is moe way more confident this game
I don't think of myself being or coming off as knowledgeable but the one thing I was hesitant about revealing is anything related to my role. But I guess if it is so apparent I need to make a further convincing argument. This is the first game where my role allows me to gather at least some information and not being completely dependent on public information. It's kind of nice to be able to do something.
I also don't think of myself producing high content posts. Of course I try to add something to the discussion but I don't add info but mainly try not to appear scummy.
My 'I agree with the observation but not the conclusion.' was the ballsiest comment I could come up with that I felt was suitable and prove itself. It was rather foreseeable that it would not be enough to let me off the hook and let me keep any information regarding my role private. I still hoped it would...
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Been thinking the same thing.
He might have important role and therefore trying to look important and knowledgeable.
Or hes maf
you did not respond in the same manner when a sus on coffee was raised due to a similar reason though :-\
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MW and I are maf partners :o
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Is it just me or is moe way more confident this game than any other he's played in? Almost like a different person. I think this is the result of him rolling mafia for the first time and finally not being in the dark.
I'd assume that a town who rolls their first mafia game would want to emulate their previous towny play or act less confident, not more confident. He's mantained this after being slightly scumread IIRC and a mafia would probably back off at that point. I'm not sure, though.
robs progression on coffee just doesnt make sense. First he scumreads him for activity (which is the opposite of basic logic and the phantom memory he had has no grounds in reality, which may or may not mean that its completely made up), then townreads him for it when his memory was jogged (as he puts him in townleans with no other reason given than his initial read being wrong and coffee-activity=good), then claims activity is not a tell for coffee at all, but then keeps his townread on him anyway, while buddying him.
Yes, i still havent gotten over this.
Other rob related things: - his mechanics-talk is fine (pretty good) really, but in case of rob i wouldnt expect anything else really.
as he noted himself, his readlist developed to fit the wagons that were forming. it is indeed too consensy and him wanting to vote with certain other people (oa) further drives this home, passing responsibility for a misslynch to someone else.
I think he didn't scumread me for my activity, and instead wanted to note it as he has only played with less active me. A lot of people have mentioned how it's just a different thing, not a scummy thing. I still believe using meta from previous games is lame, but that's just me. His reads based on activity are not related to his reads based on the content of my post, and he can think one is scummy and the other is towny. I don't see this as a maf rob buddying with me. As far as voting with oa, if his reads aligned with oa's i don't see rob using this as an excuse to pass on blame. He expressed his distate with a shock lynch and his vote reflected that.
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Um, kae I do not recall ever visiting that link before... so if you shared it last game I ignored it (sorry if so, given you recall I asked for it... don't remember doing that though myself).
Also, the game that actually completed you got vigi shot by town-vig as scum... while being scum-read based on you behaving differently that you had in viewable town games. Which is basically wha tI"m doing here. So the way I see it I have a scum-lean on you this game for something that you were scum-read for in a prior game where you were scum.
What am I missing though? Because I read your post as being so self-assured that you sharing your scum game here would help me want to question a scum-read of you this game... but it doesn't??
robs progression on coffee just doesnt make sense. First he scumreads him for activity (which is the opposite of basic logic and the phantom memory he had has no grounds in reality, which may or may not mean that its completely made up), then townreads him for it when his memory was jogged (as he puts him in townleans with no other reason given than his initial read being wrong and coffee-activity=good), then claims activity is not a tell for coffee at all, but then keeps his townread on him anyway, while buddying him.
Yes, i still havent gotten over this.
Other rob related things: - his mechanics-talk is fine (pretty good) really, but in case of rob i wouldnt expect anything else really.
as he noted himself, his readlist developed to fit the wagons that were forming. it is indeed too consensy and him wanting to vote with certain other people (oa) further drives this home, passing responsibility for a misslynch to someone else.
My progression is fine. While it may be 'flawed' as in I don't have the answers at the start, but you are somewhat mischaracterizing it. I scumread him suddenly being active and different in a major way from last game wehre he was town (as in, he posted stuff this game... so I thought a variation in playstyle was something to scumlean THAT EARLY IN THE GAME when info is scarce) - and it was based on a faulty memory I had. Yes I corrected and adjusted my read when proper context and history was shown to me. I try to avoid activity tells on ANYONE when there is not a clear and hardline set of evicence to support it which does not exist for coffee - so yeah I rescinded any sort of postcount tell/read on coffee. I am not buddying him - I am finding that I have several times thought very similarly to him while trying to find some to work with a bit that I townread. It isn't foundless and I don't consider it buddying.
The fact that I was willing to try to get reads going so early is towny. The fact I was willing to adjust based on presented evidence and rescinde a scumlean based on facts is towny. Is it WIFOM for me to point this out? Sure, but sheesh kae that's a pretty poor set of reasoning as I see it.
I hate mechanics talk - but in a game so HEAVILY reliant on understanding and discussing roles like this one is I find myself somewhat forced into discussing mechanics. FYI - mafia tend to love discussing mechanics.
My readlist was developing BEFORE they were all wagons - I simply realized it was aligning and thought it was very unlikely I would have them all pegged rightly and that the thread would too - so I commented on it.
I didn't pass any responsibility and it is weird you characterize my voting scumreads of mine as "misslynch" responsibility passing - I see them as good lynches and only once a player flips is it even possible for me to know if right or not.
Kae - your attempt to scumread me is as shaky as I've commented before about some of your reads. I think I asked this before / last game --- do you have a scum-game example to link us to for background / meta? You seem different than last game --- you have a ton of reads that strike me as faked, poor, or misguided in ways that feel forced which I do not remember getting sense of from you at all last game when you were town. I want to try to compare a most recent scum game of yours to last game (you were town) with this game so far. Please / thanks.
I already posted my only scumgame in the previous game. Kinda dissapointed you didnt even register that even though you already asked for it last time I thought. I suppose that doesnt matter for this game though.
Link: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/24094-Poisonous-Vigilantes-Re-Rand
Bonus: in the initial round I was town and another asshat scumread me for the exact same reason you did now.
https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/24079-Poisonous-Vigilantes-21er?p=3566885#post3566885
The lower effort version would have been to just not mention the people i arrived at n on anyway and you wouldnt have perceived it as odd at all, yet i shared why i arrived at ultimately not having strong feelings.
(https://i.redd.it/dqkpi5rq2gk11.png)
This post is also scumpinging me (sort of appeasy/defensive, also the attempt to get reads wasnt scummy, the resulting reads were), but I suppose I'm deep enough in the tunnel that i would scumread you for donating to charity (distracting from the relevant topic, maybe fighting a bad conscience).
-
Oa-
I get a weird feeling about your reads list... it omits the 4th through 8th (you're 9th and from there the cutline gets murkier) highest posters but you included a slight town lean (n+) on a 10-post player and a slight scum lean (n-) on a 14 poster, 17 poster, and 19 poster. I'm curious what background you can give as to this aspect of your list?
Also, your heavier town leans (v) are very brief and blaise thoughts when you then have more in-depth things about lower-post count and content players that get n-/+ treatment then dumping "the rest" as n (do you mean null or neutral)?
I had such a strong townread on you I guess based mostly on the Durandal moderator SOD 1 statement to which no Durandal has claimed to have seen "red" on you. I'm a bit shaky on that townread now, but it seems so unlikely you aren't town given that Durandal pinged you without reporting... which could mean you are scum ONLY if Durandal is playing a dangerous (or poor, depends on perspective) game OR if Durandal is scum. I'll be frank --- given the amoutn of in-thread discussion where I think the general consensus is for Durandal to out any scum hits that the most likely of the scenarios where Oa is scum is scum Durandal. Which worries me a fair bit.
All this said, it is still much more likely Durandal is town and so is Oa -- however from the read of Oa's list (as I outlined above) I'm softening my townread of Oa quite a bit.
INPUT PLEASE ON THIS --> Does it seem likely, as I believe it is, that a scum!Durandal would ping a teammate N0 to try to cover a teammate for a while? Perhaps even - as Oa (the N0 Durandal result) has done - request doctor attending next night to sus out the doc role?? Thinking that made more sense than once I've typed it out though...... :-\
v
kaempfer - seems genuinely interested in solving
TorB - a lot of his thoughts allocate with mine
n+
dawn - going out early on calling out Cecilia gives slight town cred in my book. I believe his claim on not being Bronya, but if he turns out to be, it's looking real bad for him
moe - hard buddying me, which isn't even slightly controversial, but his posts seem genuine to me. Explains his MW vote on his trust on me, fair enough.
w3 - just like moe, he's playing exactly the way I'd expect town w3 to play. I'm not implying it's a difficult task, since it's not, but his play makes sense
n-
MW - I like they way he responded on the pressure, but I'm not convinced yet. Being on shock
Naii - getting weird vibes, although his confusion is likely legit, as I've felt just the way he has on earlier occasions. I don't like his reasoning on voting MW, although it might sound hypocrital as 1) I was on MW and 2) MW is a mere n- for me
ian - kinda had to stay at a pile bigger than his, so can't blame him on staying on shock, but the timing of his vote is not looking good to me. The post about "don't kill me as I'm OP in the endgame" without any more substance (he said it was a mashup of many factors) is kinda throwing me off.
The rest are standing at n. For now.
Piling up on shockcannon just because sHoCk Is ShOcK is a scummy move in my book and it's definitely influencing my readlist.
-
Squeezing in a reads list update here too:
vv
moe
v
coffee
TorB
n+
Oa
Sub
kdz
n
Cal
ian
Link
n-
timpa
MW
d2d
w
kae
DC
www3
-
As a maf Durandal, it seems much safer to target town N0. This will make it much more likely to gain you town support by the time you claim, rather than having to out and rely on mafia buddies to save your hide. N4 seems like the most sensible night to try a fake mafia is town target to claim, by then maf Durandal can keep its credit long enough to win mafia the game on mislynches. If they live long enough to get to N6 without scum winning the game, they might even pull a town is maf fake claim target.
Durandal being mafia is not very likely (3/17), but you never know. More importantly: if neither Oa nor Durandal are NK-ed for a few nights in a row, it may be worth it for town to start growing suspicious of Durandal. But it just feels too early right now.
-
I'm in a bit of a bind here, I have this really ominous feeling I can already derive Durandals identity based on public information... I can only pray it's WIFOM from mafia's perspective, but if Durandal really is whom I suspect, they're doing a terrible job of keeping quiet about it.
-
I'm stating this now, for the record, because at this point I'm questioning whether a hard claim combined with Raiden Mei/Fu Hua may be a safer bet than pretending I did not see it and pray mafia either misses it or I am wrong.
-
My bad, I'll try to be more subtle next time.
-
Don't worry Link; I'll protect you tonight.
-
All's well that ends well.
-
I'm glad someone's critical. I'm not really familiar with readlists, and I'm perfectly aware it was by no means comprehensive.. still I felt like writing my thoughts down.
I get a weird feeling about your reads list... it omits the 4th through 8th (you're 9th and from there the cutline gets murkier) highest posters but you included a slight town lean (n+) on a 10-post player and a slight scum lean (n-) on a 14 poster, 17 poster, and 19 poster. I'm curious what background you can give as to this aspect of your list?
I kinda don't give a shit about post count, at least not at this early stage.
Also, your heavier town leans (v) are very brief and blaise thoughts when you then have more in-depth things about lower-post count and content players that get n-/+ treatment then dumping "the rest" as n (do you mean null or neutral)?
Neutral, not null. I have thoughts about, for example, DC as well, as I've already talked about. But he's at status quo for me right now.
I had such a strong townread on you I guess based mostly on the Durandal moderator SOD 1 statement to which no Durandal has claimed to have seen "red" on you. I'm a bit shaky on that townread now, but it seems so unlikely you aren't town given that Durandal pinged you without reporting... which could mean you are scum ONLY if Durandal is playing a dangerous (or poor, depends on perspective) game OR if Durandal is scum. I'll be frank --- given the amoutn of in-thread discussion where I think the general consensus is for Durandal to out any scum hits that the most likely of the scenarios where Oa is scum is scum Durandal. Which worries me a fair bit.
Y'know, I've always been pretty cautious about not looking suspicious or writing things that could be looked as scummy. But now, I treat myself as confirmed town, and I can't say I'm not enjoying it. Yes, I'm not confirmed - but I'm acting like I am. Town Durandal would have outed me by now if I flipped red. Yes, scum Durandal could have peeked at scum Oa, but imagine the scenes in the scenario Durandal is found and I'm mafia. Looking pretty bad, throwing 66% of the team with a risky 4D chess move N0. That's some heavy shit to pull off.
INPUT PLEASE ON THIS --> Does it seem likely, as I believe it is, that a scum!Durandal would ping a teammate N0 to try to cover a teammate for a while? Perhaps even - as Oa (the N0 Durandal result) has done - request doctor attending next night to sus out the doc role?? Thinking that made more sense than once I've typed it out though...... :-\
See previous snippet. TLDR: A big, loud "hell no".
Are there better targets for doc right now than me (not necessarily tonight, but in a pattern that's unpredictable to the mafia, so they hopefully won't risk the NK)? Yes - Durandal, but we don't know who that is (Or do we, TorB? I've not picked up the clues you seem to have). And if you find a situation where I'm not NKed for a couple of days suspicious, that's fine, but remember this is really looking like how TorB got the stab last mafia.
-
(Or do we, TorB? I've not picked up the clues you seem to have)
That's good. I may elaborate on this at some later point along with providing a read list, but doing so at this point in time will not help town from my point of view. If you think that's scummy of me, you can always try to force an early reveal with lynch votes next day. Your choice.
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Funny how if you don't have the exact same number of posts as in the previous mafia or if you happen to have a different opinion than you had 20 mafias ago, it means you changed your gameplay because you're scum.
If anything, we should be looking at people that are actually trying too hard to keep the same gameplay.
-
I mean, you've all seen how easy it was for Sub to fool you all last game, just because he was "the same old silly Sub"
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Funny how if you don't have the exact same number of posts as in the previous mafia or if you happen to have a different opinion than you had 20 mafias ago, it means you changed your gameplay because you're scum.
If anything, we should be looking at people that are actually trying too hard to keep the same gameplay.
For once i wholeheartedly agree with you. Can we stop discouraging people from towning up already?
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And Oa, regarding not getting nightkilled meaning suspicious: I'm talking about a shift from hard town read never lynch to NAI neutral until Durandal flips town.
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And Oa, regarding not getting nightkilled meaning suspicious: I'm talking about a shift from hard town read never lynch to NAI neutral until Durandal flips town.
Fair. Nobody should be completely invincible unless mechanically confirmed.
-
Squeezing in a reads list update here too:
vv
moe
v
coffee
TorB
n+
Oa
Sub
kdz
n
Cal
ian
Link
n-
timpa
MW
d2d
w
kae
DC
www3
(https://i.imgflip.com/1rsik2.jpg)
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Um, kae I do not recall ever visiting that link before... so if you shared it last game I ignored it (sorry if so, given you recall I asked for it... don't remember doing that though myself).
Also, the game that actually completed you got vigi shot by town-vig as scum... while being scum-read based on you behaving differently that you had in viewable town games. Which is basically wha tI"m doing here. So the way I see it I have a scum-lean on you this game for something that you were scum-read for in a prior game where you were scum.
What am I missing though? Because I read your post as being so self-assured that you sharing your scum game here would help me want to question a scum-read of you this game... but it doesn't??
robs progression on coffee just doesnt make sense. First he scumreads him for activity (which is the opposite of basic logic and the phantom memory he had has no grounds in reality, which may or may not mean that its completely made up), then townreads him for it when his memory was jogged (as he puts him in townleans with no other reason given than his initial read being wrong and coffee-activity=good), then claims activity is not a tell for coffee at all, but then keeps his townread on him anyway, while buddying him.
Yes, i still havent gotten over this.
Other rob related things: - his mechanics-talk is fine (pretty good) really, but in case of rob i wouldnt expect anything else really.
as he noted himself, his readlist developed to fit the wagons that were forming. it is indeed too consensy and him wanting to vote with certain other people (oa) further drives this home, passing responsibility for a misslynch to someone else.
My progression is fine. While it may be 'flawed' as in I don't have the answers at the start, but you are somewhat mischaracterizing it. I scumread him suddenly being active and different in a major way from last game wehre he was town (as in, he posted stuff this game... so I thought a variation in playstyle was something to scumlean THAT EARLY IN THE GAME when info is scarce) - and it was based on a faulty memory I had. Yes I corrected and adjusted my read when proper context and history was shown to me. I try to avoid activity tells on ANYONE when there is not a clear and hardline set of evicence to support it which does not exist for coffee - so yeah I rescinded any sort of postcount tell/read on coffee. I am not buddying him - I am finding that I have several times thought very similarly to him while trying to find some to work with a bit that I townread. It isn't foundless and I don't consider it buddying.
The fact that I was willing to try to get reads going so early is towny. The fact I was willing to adjust based on presented evidence and rescinde a scumlean based on facts is towny. Is it WIFOM for me to point this out? Sure, but sheesh kae that's a pretty poor set of reasoning as I see it.
I hate mechanics talk - but in a game so HEAVILY reliant on understanding and discussing roles like this one is I find myself somewhat forced into discussing mechanics. FYI - mafia tend to love discussing mechanics.
My readlist was developing BEFORE they were all wagons - I simply realized it was aligning and thought it was very unlikely I would have them all pegged rightly and that the thread would too - so I commented on it.
I didn't pass any responsibility and it is weird you characterize my voting scumreads of mine as "misslynch" responsibility passing - I see them as good lynches and only once a player flips is it even possible for me to know if right or not.
Kae - your attempt to scumread me is as shaky as I've commented before about some of your reads. I think I asked this before / last game --- do you have a scum-game example to link us to for background / meta? You seem different than last game --- you have a ton of reads that strike me as faked, poor, or misguided in ways that feel forced which I do not remember getting sense of from you at all last game when you were town. I want to try to compare a most recent scum game of yours to last game (you were town) with this game so far. Please / thanks.
I already posted my only scumgame in the previous game. Kinda dissapointed you didnt even register that even though you already asked for it last time I thought. I suppose that doesnt matter for this game though.
Link: https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/24094-Poisonous-Vigilantes-Re-Rand
Bonus: in the initial round I was town and another asshat scumread me for the exact same reason you did now.
https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/threads/24079-Poisonous-Vigilantes-21er?p=3566885#post3566885
The lower effort version would have been to just not mention the people i arrived at n on anyway and you wouldnt have perceived it as odd at all, yet i shared why i arrived at ultimately not having strong feelings.
(https://i.redd.it/dqkpi5rq2gk11.png)
This post is also scumpinging me (sort of appeasy/defensive, also the attempt to get reads wasnt scummy, the resulting reads were), but I suppose I'm deep enough in the tunnel that i would scumread you for donating to charity (distracting from the relevant topic, maybe fighting a bad conscience).
Did you even actually read the game? Day2 i hardbussed a teammate, which left the evenvig as literally the only person to scumread me at that stage. I couldnt keep up with the thread at all, as i was more carefull about what i said and affected by tmi I barely managed any reads at all. Then when people rightfully voted me up, I hid behind an overly casual "Haha, Im in danger"-attittude to hide my lack of confidence.
If your metareads is a "find the differences"-game you should never scumread me here. At worst you should realize that there are differences to any game I played before and then actually start trying to read me based on what I actually do.
Also your durandal-questioning comes way too early. it kinda reminds me of how sub tried to sus mw last game (after mw outed ian), which I didnt find suspicious then, as sub always gets hung up on weird things and tbh mw's townplay is questionable, except its even less subtle.
-
Oa-
I get a weird feeling about your reads list... it omits the 4th through 8th (you're 9th and from there the cutline gets murkier) highest posters but you included a slight town lean (n+) on a 10-post player and a slight scum lean (n-) on a 14 poster, 17 poster, and 19 poster. I'm curious what background you can give as to this aspect of your list?
Also, your heavier town leans (v) are very brief and blaise thoughts when you then have more in-depth things about lower-post count and content players that get n-/+ treatment then dumping "the rest" as n (do you mean null or neutral)?
That's ironic considering your following reads list. But any update is appreciated. Still, I questioned - rather was wondering out loud - about your strong townread on me. Yet, you stay silent on the latest topic about me even though you regularly compare play across games. On a more general note I assume people not commenting means they are undecided / suspicious about it. This freaks me out a bit as I'd like to know where I stand but guess that's part of it.
I had such a strong townread on you I guess based mostly on the Durandal moderator SOD 1 statement to which no Durandal has claimed to have seen "red" on you. I'm a bit shaky on that townread now, but it seems so unlikely you aren't town given that Durandal pinged you without reporting... which could mean you are scum ONLY if Durandal is playing a dangerous (or poor, depends on perspective) game OR if Durandal is scum. I'll be frank --- given the amoutn of in-thread discussion where I think the general consensus is for Durandal to out any scum hits that the most likely of the scenarios where Oa is scum is scum Durandal. Which worries me a fair bit.
I also thought about claiming red peek at the end of the following night. Scum already knows they're hit, and it essentially saves the trouble to protect cop for one night. Most people have the ablility to be online EON. In the case that Oa is indeed scum it could be publicised later today. But I don't see Oa posting what he is as scum that's about to go down.
Wasn't it you who also mentioned way earlier that Raiden might have messed with Break of Dawn? Implying that cop's green peek might not actually be Oa? I find it hard to believe that mechanics could work that way. It clearly stated that Oa was hit. If Phantom Image was used Durandal simply targeted someone else and was redirected. You seem to throw a lot of shade at Oa. I like the idea not to rule out any possibility mechanically but you're that's a lot. I am sorry if that was not you, as I don't think I addressed this before and did not save the post. If it wasn't you please say so and I will dig it up as not to give a wrong picture.
All this said, it is still much more likely Durandal is town and so is Oa -- however from the read of Oa's list (as I outlined above) I'm softening my townread of Oa quite a bit.
INPUT PLEASE ON THIS --> Does it seem likely, as I believe it is, that a scum!Durandal would ping a teammate N0 to try to cover a teammate for a while? Perhaps even - as Oa (the N0 Durandal result) has done - request doctor attending next night to sus out the doc role?? Thinking that made more sense than once I've typed it out though...... :-\
I actually do see it working. You got to work with what you've got. Emma would be the only information role red that can hard-confirm scum?! All you needed to do was target plausible targets the following nights (2 targets are easy enough to find) to make it look like you're wasting the ability.
v
kaempfer - seems genuinely interested in solving
TorB - a lot of his thoughts allocate with mine
n+
dawn - going out early on calling out Cecilia gives slight town cred in my book. I believe his claim on not being Bronya, but if he turns out to be, it's looking real bad for him
moe - hard buddying me, which isn't even slightly controversial, but his posts seem genuine to me. Explains his MW vote on his trust on me, fair enough.
w3 - just like moe, he's playing exactly the way I'd expect town w3 to play. I'm not implying it's a difficult task, since it's not, but his play makes sense
n-
MW - I like they way he responded on the pressure, but I'm not convinced yet. Being on shock
Naii - getting weird vibes, although his confusion is likely legit, as I've felt just the way he has on earlier occasions. I don't like his reasoning on voting MW, although it might sound hypocrital as 1) I was on MW and 2) MW is a mere n- for me
ian - kinda had to stay at a pile bigger than his, so can't blame him on staying on shock, but the timing of his vote is not looking good to me. The post about "don't kill me as I'm OP in the endgame" without any more substance (he said it was a mashup of many factors) is kinda throwing me off.
The rest are standing at n. For now.
Piling up on shockcannon just because sHoCk Is ShOcK is a scummy move in my book and it's definitely influencing my readlist.
As a maf Durandal, it seems much safer to target town N0. This will make it much more likely to gain you town support by the time you claim, rather than having to out and rely on mafia buddies to save your hide. N4 seems like the most sensible night to try a fake mafia is town target to claim, by then maf Durandal can keep its credit long enough to win mafia the game on mislynches. If they live long enough to get to N6 without scum winning the game, they might even pull a town is maf fake claim target.
I believe Durandal claim on its own is enough to save you form the gallows. Theresa can check Durandal/their claims N3 or later if they haven't died until then. I am still anxious about finding dead cop tomorrow. Without Theresa it gets nasty, though. For now I don't really want to entertain that thoguht but it's there somewhere.
Durandal being mafia is not very likely (3/17), but you never know. More importantly: if neither Oa nor Durandal are NK-ed for a few nights in a row, it may be worth it for town to start growing suspicious of Durandal. But it just feels too early right now.
(Or do we, TorB? I've not picked up the clues you seem to have)
That's good. I may elaborate on this at some later point along with providing a read list, but doing so at this point in time will not help town from my point of view. If you think that's scummy of me, you can always try to force an early reveal with lynch votes next day. Your choice.
Not scummy at all. Night isn't the time for it at all. Unless you really feel cop gave himself away already. But this would put you in a very rough position.
Funny how if you don't have the exact same number of posts as in the previous mafia or if you happen to have a different opinion than you had 20 mafias ago, it means you changed your gameplay because you're scum.
If anything, we should be looking at people that are actually trying too hard to keep the same gameplay.
I second this sentiment. ian seems uncannily casual/disinterested as usual.
Also, www3's posts become better.
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I'm stating this now, for the record, because at this point I'm questioning whether a hard claim combined with Raiden Mei/Fu Hua may be a safer bet than pretending I did not see it and pray mafia either misses it or I am wrong.
I have a good idea about who you mean but don't believe that's the case. However, just mentioning it is a good play. Not sure how intentional this was but this cements my town read on you.
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I tried to compile a reads list, yeah...
vv
Oa
honorary v
shock
v
TorB
coffee
n+
rob I feel the need to write something here in particular as I did criticise him earlier. I find his points more intriguing than sus which gives me a fairly positive read on him even if I voiced my disagreement in some regards. I am pretty sure I made some comments on everyone else on this list.
kae
dawn
n
ian
x
Linkcat
worldwideweb3
MasterWalks
andretimpa
Submachine
killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals
Calindu
Naii_the_Baf
x basically means no read. Those are a few more than I expected and certainly hoped. Wouldn't be surprised to find all three mafia in this mix. I am more confident with some lynches over others. For instance I have a decent idea what to look out for regarding Link at later stages in the game than I have for, say, MW. I don't think I'll ever get to read Sub. The ones not under x are in descending order and I'd hate to see them lynched. The ones under x I'd like to see more of, obviously I also want to see more of my town reads. ::)
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:earth :life :fire :fire
shock wanted us to look at this for some reason; Probably a waste of time since he couldnt possibly have any information at that time. It directly follows my post about rita having potential as one of the roles that can out scum (with massive drawbacks as discussed, let's not get into it again, its gone or in hands of sin mal now), so could be a roleclaim.
The elements could be a reference to the roles he had in mafias, but that doesnt really seem to add up (for instance rita would be :death if anything). the first letters of the elements add up to elff which almost seemed like sth provided he accidently tapped fire twice, but even then I cant make sense of it.
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Imagine trying to analyze shock's posts
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Alright so im at a catch .22
Im looking for legit advice here.
People want me lynched for what seems like not being as blatantly stupid as last game. So, do i dumb down? Do i just take the lynch? Not really sure. I cant even defend myself because what can i even say? "Sorry guys, these rules are more complicated and so im trying to put more thought into my posts as to not spread misinformation." I already said that. Its not working.
If its because of the shock vote, i already explained my vote. I voted due to a scummy action he made. Isnt that hOw MaFiA wOrKs?
I have given all the information about myself. Lemme bulletin it so that if i do get lynched, youll see there is no info to gain from it.
- Im Town
- I do NOT have an information role
- I have NOT used my role yet
I'm all for you trying to improve your game. If you are scared this will get you misslynched, don't be:
- If people see you flip town while being more serious, we will take you more seriously in the next game
- If you play dumb on purpose, mafia will leave you alone, but that's because you are being detrimental to town
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MW and I are maf partners :o
S O L V E D G A M E
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MW I don't really care how you change your play and I won't scumread you for it but please just stop sharing information about your role way too early.
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Now that we have some EOD dynamics I think I can build some reads
kdz (n) Not much substance so far, but he has a good excuse for that. Just parked on dawn and stuck to it (even tho dawn will probably just die to Cecilia). Needs more for a better read.
I'm guilty of the same thing. But I have to address this again as I catch it: Don't kill dawn if you are Cecilia.
My comment about dawn is from the perspective of what was happening at EOD, when he had still posted nearly nothing. I think dawn's chances of surviving the night have improved since then.
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Btw, since timpa just brought that quote up and i wanted to see what was in the original post. There is a 0%chance I am bronya and I really hope you guys are smart enough to figure out why.
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ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.
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Btw, since timpa just brought that quote up and i wanted to see what was in the original post. There is a 0%chance I am bronya and I really hope you guys are smart enough to figure out why.
You cannot be forced to use a passive ability, so you would not have gotten notified of being targeted by Rita.
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@kae I feel dumb now, but it's good to know there was a reason behind your votes.
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Stop townreading Torb for discussing roles, that's the easiest way for mafia to build towncred.
I will be online for the next ~3 hours and maybe for EOD. Placing my not so confident vote now on MW. He has a low enough post count and little substance in his posts. Still a shot in the dark.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
I don't like this vote at all.
However if you think shock always plays against townwincondition and should always be lynched you just shouldn't let him signup in the first place.
Now that would just be mean.
And just intakilling him each game while dragging down whichever faction hes playing for is less mean?
Well none of our like 6 vigs shot him and he currently has zero votes, so I don't think it will be a problem.
This post didn't age well lol
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dumb read: if timpa is scum he didnt discuss roles of people with his scummates at all. (so basically this dumb read equates to a tr or scum doesnt give a fuck this game)
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DC's delayed response to my deal felt weird at the time, now I think it might be because he was talking to his team about whether to take it. If so his most likely teammate is iancu.
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Night 1 has ended. Notifications are currently being sent.
Day 2 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Day 2
Linkcat was nightkilled. He was Theresa Apocalypse.
dawn to dusk fell into the abyss. He was Shigure Kira.
Day 2 has ended.
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Atleast Link remained U N L Y N C H A B L E this mafia, also guess the vig is maf too
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Linkcat just leaves me with a lot of ???
I would have sworn he would be Sin Mal (or scum) with how he made deals to lynch shock who he basically wasnt even scumreading.
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(https://imgur.com/o6GUCl7.png)
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that’s one of our two mechanically mafia confirming roles gone. aaaaaaAAAAAA
i wonder if the shock lynch really was just policy
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that’s one of our two mechanically mafia confirming roles gone. aaaaaaAAAAAA
i wonder if the shock lynch really was just policy
I mean, what is the alternative. Theres nothing that stops a mafia death from being revealed, and we already killed shock. I cant imagine the mafia would put a redirect onto shock, hell I was surprised shock didnt get Vig killed n0.
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What was the point in killing dawn now? Shouldn't Cecilia have targeted someone else?
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Just back from camping and read up. Very confused about the nightkill, but i think it helps. Mafia killing Linkcat to me reads as mafia being largely inexperienced and worried about more experienced players. However, not only does it read like that to me but it also throws some sus onto Rob. I think a rob mafia would kill linkcat first just like a shock mafia would kill Kaempfer first. These are just theories and my initial thoughts.
I would also like to throw the idea out that whoever killed d2d might not actually be mafia. d2d would be a decent target for a trigger happy oty town due to inactivity and confidence when he was active. Still, if it was town that pulled the trigger on dawn, it was a very very wasteful role use and dont be surprised if your lynched right away if/when someone finds out who is the killer.
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Well that's a shame, good luck town
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Just back from camping and read up. Very confused about the nightkill, but i think it helps. Mafia killing Linkcat to me reads as mafia being largely inexperienced and worried about more experienced players. However, not only does it read like that to me but it also throws some sus onto Rob. I think a rob mafia would kill linkcat first just like a shock mafia would kill Kaempfer first. These are just theories and my initial thoughts.
I would also like to throw the idea out that whoever killed d2d might not actually be mafia. d2d would be a decent target for a trigger happy oty town due to inactivity and confidence when he was active. Still, if it was town that pulled the trigger on dawn, it was a very very wasteful role use and dont be surprised if your lynched right away if/when someone finds out who is the killer.
Alright, so then who might you posit as your team of 3 'largely inexperienced' players who plink Link on N1 because he is experienced? Oh wait, you then follow up that it actually has you sus on me. I suppose maybe you think I'm inexperienced but really I'm guessing it is just you putting hedging statements back-to-back there. I'd like to hear how your thought process develops further if you continue to weight the N1 NK, thanks.
A trigger happy town shooting dawn bang-bang N0+N1 to kill is more than just trigger happy. I float the idea out for at-large opinion/comment about asking Cecelia to come forward now if they are town to discuss they're double-tapping of now-flipped town!dawn. I know last game I had a kind of slightly similar N0 action nomming coffee - but in they are actually quite different and I find this dawn kill to be a bad move (cue the flack aimed at me about the previous game and my negativity toward this kill...).
Atleast Link remained U N L Y N C H A B L E this mafia, also guess the vig is maf too
If www3 flips mafia then Cecelia-vig is very likely town. However, this take on the dawn-Cecelia double-tap resonates with me whereas MW's above feels almost like forcing extra talk about it. Towny-bump for www3.
that’s one of our two mechanically mafia confirming roles gone. aaaaaaAAAAAA
i wonder if the shock lynch really was just policy
I mean, what is the alternative. Theres nothing that stops a mafia death from being revealed, and we already killed shock. I cant imagine the mafia would put a redirect onto shock, hell I was surprised shock didnt get Vig killed n0.
I've tried reading it a few times now and I can't fully figure what you're trying to say here kdz - can you clarify what you mean?
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Coffee said "I wonder if the shock lynch really was just policy" which I took to imply linkcat /thought/ they were lynching a mafia
which, if im not wrong, can only be done with a redirect. Meaning for linkcat to have gotten a mafia ping from their copbility, he would have had to target shock, and someone would have had to redirect from shock to a mafia member (and vice versa) which I found hard to believe.
So if it really wasn't a policy lynch, as coffee is stating, then someone had to have randomly directed from shock to someone else, and that 2nd person returned a mafia ping. I assume it would have to be a random person, because no mafia member would redirect with shock, since they were pretty likely to get Vig killed n0. That feels pretty tinfoil, which is all I was trying to state. I'm a tired boi, and I already make very little sense. Bad combo
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dawn to dusk fell into the abyss. He was Shigure Kira.
(https://wompampsupport.azureedge.net/fetchimage?siteId=7575&v=2&jpgQuality=100&width=700&url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.kym-cdn.com%2Fentries%2Ficons%2Ffacebook%2F000%2F029%2F223%2Fcover2.jpg)
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If Cocolia exists, is not scum, and knows Cecilia, ...good time to out that now?
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That being said, in looking at the Link NK... was it a power role suspicion (Link was a bit low-lying Day 1 for his usual punchy self, which he waved away as being due to essentially RL things) vs shot-in-the-dark (would probably be the case if scum wanted to avoid interring / blocking role actions) vs on-point dangerous reads (don't remember many reads from Link yet)?
Link's last posts were a final-seconds-of-N1 post shading DC and ian --- I don't think this post affected NK targeting at all being 4 seconds before deadline for actions? Also, there are others with harder scum-reads on DC and ian than that from Link.
Link also posted shading TorB and moe about an hour before end of N1 --- this could I guess have impacted a mafia NK decision but only if they were online/active in that last hour. One post on TorB and two on moe seems light compared to some stronger shade and pushing going on elsewhere.
Link posted near middle of Night 1 with suspicion of moe... with his post before this moe-shade being him lightly celebrating shock's lynch/mislynch and declaring himself to have no scumreads.
During Day 1, he posted about "would rather lynch MW" - which could loosely be seen as sort of a slight scum-lean on MW...
--> Other than shock (RIP), Link didn't really push many beyond the above most of which are soft-pushes anyway which feels awfully thin for it to be a "Link has scum pegged - panic-kill-him-now" scenario.
Meh I suppose given the role madness and multitude of possible ways scum can be foiled if they go for high town-read targets (I can think of Oa as an example) - I don't think many had any public town-reads on Link yet. So a scum-team knowing he is town could see that as a chance to try to kill a strong player that they know is town.
I don't see him doing this anywhere in his ISO...
==> I'm not seeing any kind of hard lines related to Link's NK there... but I would hazard to guess most likely is a shot at an experienced player that was laying low.
Everyone should breadcrumb everything.
Just found this - we need to find where Link might have crumbed his N0 result...? (Also just saw kdz reply that he was sort of trying to get on this with his previous post)
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If Cocolia exists, is not scum, and knows Cecilia, ...good time to out that now?
Oh wow, looking again at Cocolia ability... a scum Cocolia makes a TON of sense on how Theresa-Link could get sniped N1 out of the gate. It just seems so unlikely any other Nk target reasons make sense - but scum knowing Link's role combined with his not being high town-read make shooting Link N1 make sense a little bit.
Also, DC - I'm not sure your plan is a good one as it outs two roles and the main aim (finding Cecilia?) is only somewhat likely as Cecilia is not sure to be town. (NB: if Cocolia exists in the game that is, of course)
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Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
Rob, that was a scrubbed game that we played literally half a decade ago. Don't try to read off of it.
kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I soft counterclaim your soft confirm.
moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
This is the "www3 roll" that moe was referring to that Link soft counterclaimed moe's facetious "soft confirm"... Could it be Link crumbing that his N0 'spear' returned a non-Herscherr result on one of the players www3's rolls playfully identified - being moe / DC / Oa. Perhaps but seems a stretch, then again crumbs are supposed to be thin and veiled or not too obvious otherwise they are detected too soon??
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Some other theories:
- Mafia could have used Core of Reason N0 to determine Link's role.
- Mafia took Link's joke statement implying he was Durandal serious.
With just N0 and no role claims to go on, it would have been virtually impossible to find mafia with Theresa already. If Link did, he would at the very least have made a scum read. Pretty sure no scum "read" was the breadcrumb for no scum result from ability.
I do not feel very confident in putting a lynch vote somewhere right now, will try to make some time for a full reads list first. It will be a list that removes the Durandal factor that I do weigh in my head, however.
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I tried writing up a read list, but I found myself just writing nonsense about people I didn't have a read on to justify having a lot of people in N, so i'll just save us the theatrics
Oa - V - Vibing with oa right now. I'm picking up a lot of what they are putting down, and I agree on most points.
Torb - N+ - I've mentioned my thoughts on torb breaking the tie, but I've really been alright with most of what they were saying.
DC - N+ - Playing how I expect DC to play. Very memey and passive, but this is the first I've seen DC get some real honest pressure, and they reacted pretty reasonably. Also they'll probably get bussed late game because someone does EoD antics while DC is asleep (5 am eod is rough as hell. Rip in peace)
Ian - N- - Has a good amount of posts, but very few of them really contain uhhh content. Now I shit post a lot too, but it feels very similar to 73, a game ian was mafia and just coasted by the first few nights posting little, and when they do post its either a vote or non content. Like a post about having a bad role, a little math talk about having a scumcop, and a lot of bread. Like I'm not saying we gotta go for em right away, but we should at least be aware and acknowledge that this pattern of play lets a scum ian just slip by for 3+ rounds unfettered by questioning/prodding.
Cali - N- - 4 posts
Naii - N? - I'm seeing a lot of panic here, and that to me is indicative of mafia. Linkcat made a decent point about them though, and their justification for a pretty bad vote felt valid. I want to put them as an N-, but it seems to change by the second
www3- N - I don't really see why a www3 train formed and got so much traction. Even Linkcat was on them for a while, but I think that was just a meme tbh. Maybe someone else can fill me in but I haven't picked up anything really sus from them, and their reactions all felt pretty okay to me.
The Folks with changed playstyles - MW/Moe/Coffee - Neutral across the board, with a slight town bump for coffee. These three are all playing a bit different then their last games, moe is more confident, MW is trying to play a bit more purposefully, and coffee is actually alive. Eyes should be on them, but I don't think they should be condemned for playing in their space
Everyone else - Idk, N. I either haven't gotten a good read on you, am still processing and trying to find a conclusion, or ???
Honestly, out of everyone I'd like to vote / put some pressure on Ian, Cali or Naii, and I'd really like to not do it within a few hours of EoD too. If someone has a better idea or a better read somewhere I'd like to hear it but we gotta be talking. I'm actually surprised Rob and Kae aren't blowing up the thread tbh.
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ER
Raiden Mei - Phantom Image
Theresa Apocalypse - Spear of Judgement
Fu Hua - Phoenix Rebirth
Rita Rossweisse - Rose Petals
Cecilia Schariac - Abyssal Flower
Frederica Tesla - Radio Wave
Lieserl Einstein - Theory of Relativity
Core of Lightning - Chain Lightning
EoR
Kiana Kaslana - Time Fracture
Yae Sakura - Consecrate Ground
Kallen Kaslana - Red Thread of Fate
Durandal - Break of Dawn
Shigure Kira - Idyllic Dreams
Emma Planck - Atomic Signature
Core of Reason - Global Analysis
1U
Liliya Olenyeva - Flash Counter
Core of Death - Rapid Decay
2U
Himeko Murata - Field of Blades
Rozaliya Olenyeva - Typhoon Cutter
Core of Void - Black Hole
3U
Sin Mal - Soul Funeral
Passive
Bronya Zaychik - Charge Beam
Seele Vollerei - Quantum State
Cocolia - Surveillance Network
Core of Binding - Binding Chains
I'm thinking whether Link could have hit anything useful and was trying to crumb anything related to this... I'm leaning towards no, otherwise I'd have expected Link to talk a bit more rather than just go for shock.
That, or he targetted shock with his ability which I would rule out because why burn it on someone who would eat the N0 vig
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Please note that #U is its own ability type. Theresa's ability will not report the specific number of uses.
The rulings section has been updated.
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TYPE[/i] and not the core role. I want to post this still as it contains plenty of research into Link's ISO and possible crumbs despite being based on thinking he would have -known- a red peek if he hit one on N0]DC- it reads as you're presuming Link must have hit a green peek with his N0... do you see evidence of such in Link's ISO?
It could be the case, but in looking it seems like Link was more frequently posting toward what I think could be red peeks... albeit I might expect at some point he would have harder pushed a red peek?
Anyway, now on to the post I was working up when DC posted.
The first line RE: kae/moe - feeding in to the moe section/spoiler farther down my post, the way Link attaches these two together here is such that if moe flips scum then I'd bet dollars-to-donuts that Link had a red peek on moe and believes only a town!kae interacts with moe that way... hmmmm. --> Link putting down in essence not-w/w on kae/moe?
Kae was being real silly about moe but I think it makes him towny.
While it's tempting to lynch w3 D1 after he died N0 last game, I'm going to need to see more before I go down that route.
Cal lynch is silly, don't want to lynch dawn since he's half dead already, would rather lynch MW.
No Lynch is only a good idea when it's very unlikely that any top wagon is town and there's not enough time to find a new target. This happened I believe in both 68 and 72. However, in this game even in such a scenario we can just lynch shock which is a +EV play.
If either of these are Link's N0 then he was VERY lightly crumbing... could possible be a green peek on Cal or red peek on MW. However, the latter I would have expected Link to let the push on MW continue instead of the squirrel-trail distraction that the push on shock's mislynch became.
W3 always defends himself a lot, that's not a scumtell.
Could have been a green on www3, but this (and the light mention on www3 above) don't give off any crumb vibes - that is, it feels like more of just a legit Link thought rather than him having inside intel about www3 alignment.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
Do I need one?
Someone wanna speed me up on why we are scum reading DC?
Seems like normal DC to me
I honestly have no idea.
DC's delayed response to my deal felt weird at the time, now I think it might be because he was talking to his team about whether to take it. If so his most likely teammate is iancu.
Seeing these together in order like this, it sure feels like Link has a slant toward the scum angle for DC. My problem being that DC was a real wagon and possible lynch on D1 so if Link had a red peek on him N0 why not push that just a slight little bit ??? Him returning back to DC again in his last 4 seconds of life this game sure feels like a strong hint or breadcrumb. In the least, it is a strong scum-read from a now dead town!Link. Ugh, I'm going to keep getting stuck on Link not having more appetite for lynching DC on Day 1 though...
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
CFD?
*repeat quote*
DC's delayed response to my deal felt weird at the time, now I think it might be because he was talking to his team about whether to take it. If so his most likely teammate is iancu.
I guess maybe in a soft sort of way Link's vote on ian was hinting at ian here seeing if he could get necessary traction onto a N0 red peek? He does double-down on ian with his post in his last minute of game-breath.
Is it just me or is moe way more confident this game than any other he's played in? Almost like a different person. I think this is the result of him rolling mafia for the first time and finally not being in the dark.
Stop townreading Torb for discussing roles, that's the easiest way for mafia to build towncred.
I will be online for the next ~3 hours and maybe for EOD. Placing my not so confident vote now on MW. He has a low enough post count and little substance in his posts. Still a shot in the dark.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
I don't like this vote at all.
-snip-
removed unrelated statement about how wrong prior-Link was about shock's safety
The former feeling a LOT like a breadcrumb post... maybe Link had a N0 red peek on moe? At the least it is a dying town's scum-lean on moe.
In a softer way -- Link is softly implying maybe scum!TorB in the bolded statement... maybe that was his N0 breadcrumb?
---> I suppose my summary of what I find in Link's ISO about possible crumbs summarizes as:
* Maaayyybe a green peek on Cal
* Maybe a red peek on MW (but I think Link would probably have pushed MW harder D1 given MW was a legit wagon and Link was on EOD1)
* Maayybe a green peek on www3
* Could have had a red peek on DC (but I think Link likely pushes harder for DC lynch D1 given DC was a legit wagon... but Link does revisit a scum-read on DC right before Link is NK'd)
* Could have had a red peek on iancu (he also tried to CFD onto ian - and revisits a continued scum-read on ian right before he is NK'd)
* Maaaaayyyyyyybe a red peek on TorB
* Could have red-peekd moe (as Link suddenly on N1 scumreads moe and doubles-down on that read "not liking" a moe vote post with about an hour before Link is NK'd)
Of this, I see a few green-peeks Link might have crumbed but he has more posts that I could see as being hints about his N0 being a RED peek instead. If I rank them, then it looks something like:
Maybe red on:
ian > DC > moe >> TorB > MW
>> And maybe green on:
ww3 > Cal
Folks we really need to comb Link's posts a little bit at least to try to find his peek's breadcrumb... he openly stated everyone should ABC (always be crumbing) so for sure he followed his own advice, right?
LINK - in your graveyard chat roll over 10 times (privately of course) if it was red on one of the wagons you could have pushed at EOD (MW / DC).
///I'm presuming 100% that Link used N0 and that he successfully learned the Honkai Core ability (scum) or role type (town) of somebody and crumbed it somewhere///
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I'm going to bed, starting to think a lot of that Link ISO conclusion needs plenty of re-work given how Theresa role really works and not how I thought it worked. The ISO and posts that I think could be crumbs are legit and accurate but conclusions drawn I need to revisit after I sleep on the revelation... Adieu.
Alright yeah, re-reading the Theresa role again just now... and my post again... I'm not so convinced that finding Link's breadcrumb is as paramount as I thought when I set about that task. >:( >:( >:( And with that goodnight for a bit.
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Rob, link wouldve outed had he found a scum. You’re Too focussed on him
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You know rob, you arent the only one in that "misunderstood Theresa" boat. Sigh x100
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And that after all the trouble I went through to explain it, too :(
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Torb I have the reading comprehension of a third grader. You cannot penetrate my mind with facts or reality.
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Linkcat you hypocrite didn't crumb. i suppose the next best thing is someone he defended for no real reason (Cal?), as he would wait for a conflicting role claim and eversoslightly prefer them staying alive since he got some information on them. Also in case he targeted mw he didnt get a turnout that would conflict with a role that was agreed upon to sit idly, as he didnt scumread him.
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It'll take like 8 hours before I come up with a readslist, but I do not like the lack of lynch votes right now. Here, I'll take point with a vote that is likely to change if I can find something scummy somewhere.
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
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yh I've read every post of link twice now and find zero reference to what I can find in the honkai wiki about theresa, the claims are all not serious aside from "ccing" moe, but none of dc,oa,moe has shared a role that link could confirm, so this was talking about durandal
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Slight townlean on everyone that thought that theresa was a much more powerfull role than it is, as scum would probably have questioned why there should be 2 true cops in the game, one of which is er. Hm, this conflicts with my rob read so far.
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So rob, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt with this potential derpclear. Why do you not apply your principles consistently? You shot down several attempts of people to do townier things, just because it doesnt match your memory of their townplay, but then refused to do the inverse when coreected, even though you think activity is important and you are kind of discouraging people to post with your behaviour. You only seem to want to apply metareads when they result in a scumread.
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So rob, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt with this potential derpclear. Why do you not apply your principles consistently? You shot down several attempts of people to do townier things, just because it doesnt match your memory of their townplay, but then refused to do the inverse when coreected, even though you think activity is important and you are kind of discouraging people to post with your behaviour. You only seem to want to apply metareads when they result in a scumread.
because I think everyone is a noob incapable of properly matching their town meta when they roll scum? Nah half kidding. I often find myself seeing it difficult for another to "play like they do as town" when they're mafia and the world is clearer than when town... I'm not hard pushing you because I think our squabble doesn't deserve a thunderdome and we can settle our differences as the game develops if needed. Link had an instance of a townlean on you due to his scumread on moe, so your simply bumped to my n- group at the time.
Also, got to wrapped up in Link-crumb searching to do this last night, but I'm giving shifts to reads based on some of Link's reads, he's the most confirmed town (as for shock I don't need to wreck myself looking too deep there, and I'll also do similar with dawn to an extent but haven't time yet to revisit his reads and any "dying wishes"):
vv
v
Oa
coffee
TorB
n+
Sub
Cal
kdz
moe
n
n-
timpa
kae
ian
w
www3
MW
DC
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iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
These would be fine competing wagons to start the day with... Could add in moe or MW too but these here are a great place to begin.
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So it looks like dawn's scumreads were MW\DC\www3. \\how convenient for me aligning with mine and now he's dead\\ :-\
It seems unlikely dawn was killed for accuracy of his scumreads given I have similar and I've been much more vocals on them than I saw dawn doing... What other good reason exists outside of Cecelia being scum -- unless some brazen townie went all in thinking dawn was lying on his hardclaim-not-Bronya? (Sidenote Bronya is assured at 1 voting power today, if they're in the game) Then again couldn't a scum Bronya simply "play along" visiting different players setting up multiple mid- late-game additional kills to play it safe if they got hit with one of this games many role-outing roles?
--> my reads don't already much weighing in dead town!dawn reads but his do reinforce some reads I already had.
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DC is actually my biggest townread according to wagonomics. Unless you believe scum tried raising various different cws until sth sticks absolutely no effort went into saving DC.
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Speaking of wagonomics, a larger update than usual during the night:
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (1) - PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
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Tbh, i dont really see why Cecilia finishing dawn off is particularly scummy. I mean it does go against the consensus of vocal players, but very publicly so; similiar to how shock did, i dont exactly condon going against the grain without even speaking up about it, but as scum!cecilia you are just painting a target on your back. In fact as scum!Cecilia its best to mark many different people, denying us the flip and then finish them off one after the other, ending the game early.
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As the person to nom Coffee N0 last game, considering a vigi shot on an inactive scummy seems a bit hypocritical from my perspective. I do think it would be save to out Cecilia's identity the next time someone is targeted, but it's NAI for me so far. It would definitely go against my personal play style, so I'll hard claim not Cecilia right here and now.
Then again couldn't a scum Bronya simply "play along" visiting different players setting up multiple mid- late-game additional kills to play it safe if they got hit with one of this games many role-outing roles?
Cecilia? You need to remember that Cecilia reveals their identity to their targets. Personally, just being targeted by one would make me want to lynch them. If they marked multiple targets and Cecilia kills someone town, all the marked targets might want to lynch them. Not sure how you plan to kill multiple targets once your identity is revealed.
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So it looks like dawn's scumreads were MW\DC\www3. \\how convenient for me aligning with mine and now he's dead\\ :-\
It seems unlikely dawn was killed for accuracy of his scumreads given I have similar and I've been much more vocals on them than I saw dawn doing... What other good reason exists outside of Cecelia being scum -- unless some brazen townie went all in thinking dawn was lying on his hardclaim-not-Bronya? (Sidenote Bronya is assured at 1 voting power today, if they're in the game) Then again couldn't a scum Bronya simply "play along" visiting different players setting up multiple mid- late-game additional kills to play it safe if they got hit with one of this games many role-outing roles?
--> my reads don't already much weighing in dead town!dawn reads but his do reinforce some reads I already had.
F, sit down! I demand a complete rewrite, as you are contradicting yourself multiple times.
Anyway Ill just address everything you wrote until I get the number of negations that makes sense with your conclusion.
If dawn was killed for his reads by scum!cecilia, dawn was marked n0 because its in line with torbs plan and finished off now because its fast and scum were really scared of dawn being a major factor in voting?
.
Why exactly should dawn only be killed by town!Cecilia if he's bronya? You're acting like its the only reason to scumread someone. Sure the potential to swingvote if bronya would have added to dawns scum-equity if bronya, but claiming not-bronya merely nullifies that point and doesnt make him conftown.
Your last point I would take as scum!cecilia would not want to kill dawn now, as it makes more sense, but it doesnt match your conclusion at all. In case you actually meant bronya, I'm sure she would stick to consensus of not using role regardless of alignement. In case you meant town!cecilia would visit multiple people before making a kill I suppose the logic would be that they should only pull the trigger if consensus of town would want them lynched, but we can just ask cecilia to do it instead?
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iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
I will do an ISO on all soon, but for now
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Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
scum!cecilia you are just painting a target on your back. In fact as scum!Cecilia its best to mark many different people, denying us the flip and then finish them off one after the other, ending the game early.
Okay so... is following this plan towny or scummy now...? Damned if you do damned if you didn't I guess
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cecila vig is scummy, and once found should be lynched.
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Feel free to target neutral/inactive players once each, since this does not kill them. Targeting mafia as town will make you a very likely NK target, however.
scum!cecilia you are just painting a target on your back. In fact as scum!Cecilia its best to mark many different people, denying us the flip and then finish them off one after the other, ending the game early.
Okay so... is following this plan towny or scummy now...? Damned if you do damned if you didn't I guess
I already pointed out that targeting once reveals the target Cecilia's name + role. So I deem kaempfer13's statement here false (all the survivors can reveal Cecilia's identity once a single town dies). The action they did now was the easiest way to get away with a town kill.
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I mean if you assume that killing a town is automatically scummy your logic makes sense, otherwise there would be no real issue with people knowing who you are.
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Well, judging by the amount of people wanting to kill Cecilia now, I would definitely think it to be a problem. All their targets would start to feel especially uncomfortable, don't you think?
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Well, I did promise a read list.
Durandal target. Useful posts with reads list that seems to mostly match my train of thoughts. We even made the exact same lynch vote on the exact same second at some point during EoD1. Precognition OP. My actual read is slightly different in the direction (relative to n) I read they whom I suspect to be Durandal.
Enjoying the town strategy talks.
A lot of good discussion points.
Useful posts with reads list that seems to mostly match my train of thoughts. Seems quite different from mafia andretimpa last game from my point of view.
Inactive at the start, but apparently that was planned and NAI. I remember being really distrustful last game and finding these reasons to count as "convenient excuses", but kdz was town then, too. Posts seem good enough, but not reading any alignment from it. Agreeable reads list.
Seems a bit too aggressive on points I consider completely useless like the dice roll thing (wtf). Other than that, his own read on me seems to reflect mine on him as well :silly:
just like last time we disagree about some mechanics, but now i know that that isnt sus for him. He puts out a lot of content and is making sense so I put him at n+
I'm a bit baffled about the number of contradictions I find in rob's posts. In fact, I find them to be so numerous that I would have expected rob to be better at thinking up a consistent story as mafia.
I hate mechanics talk - but in a game so HEAVILY reliant on understanding and discussing roles like this one is I find myself somewhat forced into discussing mechanics. FYI - mafia tend to love discussing mechanics.
v
Oa
coffee
TorB
Coffee and I are having a lot of mechanics talk, which seem to be a significant part of our town reads. I mean, I do not mind, but neither do I understand :silly:
Posts have become increasingly useful after getting some lynch votes D1, I need to remember this for future mafias :sillyspin:
Hey, um, Link. I just want to get it out of the way for transparency's sake. I get the feeling that you are a bit unmotivated. I will not say that is scummy, and I will not compare it to previous games. But can you explain why you are keeping a low profile this time? I believe it is for the greater good if everybody heard your explanation, if you have any.
You can also try to keep a low profile because you have a power role like Link did. Fishy fishy?
Finally people are realizing that www has been playing scummy so far. There is only one logical scenario where I can imagine www doing this as town, but this is not the way to do it, and he should rather take inspiration from shockcannon in that case.
I am still waiting for an explanation on why you think w3 is scum, Sub. Right now, this seems like a very opportunistic vote, potentially to try and start a competing wagon to save a mafia buddy.
The overall read is still neutral, but you'll have to forgive me for being extremely skeptical after last game :P
Not much to go on aside from the MW vote, that does not look particularly good.
Even if you survived up until an F3 again like last mafia, you would get lynched again regardless of alignment. Please do not let it come down to that. I want to see more posts that help town o:
If you really want to improve your game, you will really have to at least try posting something more useful than trying to defend yourself. It's better to try and fail, than to never try and get voted off for inactivity.
When you have so many posts yet so little content. Actively tried to distract from useful conversations during N0 and D1, then suddenly went silent N1. In fact, I scum lean shitposting and shit posting in general. At least Linkcat still made funny enough shitposts to be worth reading. :silly:
If anything, we should be looking at people that are actually trying too hard to keep the same gameplay.
Someone already pointed out the irony of this statement, but there we go. Like, imagine having a meaningful discussion about something. Can't have that. Mostly lynch voting now to prevent a blitz lynch later, giving ian no time to come up with a defense or meaningful claims that would help town as town.
Conclusions may not always seem to match the points I bring up, just that those are the ones that stand out. Rest would then come from a more general feel.
-
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Maybe the lynchtrain will work this time.
-
Sorry for not contributing much, didn't have the time to put effort into this, I'll try to be more active, but I will still post sparingly.
Cecilia is probably mafia given that they went against the town plan and killed dawn on the spot, when he wasn't that inactive and he even declared he got targeted by Cecilia, so little chance in him being mafia. Will report the name if I ever get targeted. In fact, I hope everyone does the same.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
Dont wanna lycnh W3 yet.
Dont wanna lynch DC yet.
Dont wanna No Lynch.
Ill go with the scummiest person on this list that isnt moe.
I didnt vote shock based on prior games. I voted due to him being prime suspect for targeting kae for no real reason with a disrupting role. Thats really the scummiest thing that happend the whole night and day phases so why not. It was shock, no lynch, or inactives before EoD shenanigans happened. Sucks we hit a town but what other option did we have?
This vote feels weird, maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen any explanation of why he voted on shock before voting and the explanation after seems really scummy, since I don't see why scum!Rita would target kae like that, unless in very special circumstances. Feels like he tried to protect one of www3 or DC.
-
Also, not sure exactly why people overthink that much about Linkcat's role, there's a very small chance he actually found scum, given that almost no roles were claimed, making it almost impossible to find scum just using that.
Given that it's Linkcat, he could have been NKed for any reason really, but this does throw some shade on Cocolia if found.
-
Eh, while I heavily disagree with the decision on shooting d2d, it does not mean Cecilia is (or should be, for that matter) a dead man walking.
Why would the Linkcat NK throw shade on Cocolia? While we won't know for sure, there probably is one, but then again, it's only a 3/16 chance he would find Link, given Cocolia is town. And even then, I feel like Theresa's generally been considered somewhat... overrated. Especially at this stage. It could prove to be useful lategame, but there are, in my opinion, better roles in the current state of the game. Most likely they killed off Link purely because they know the resource he can turn out to be for town.
-
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
I'll drop off a vote on one of the guys on my watchlist for now, giving another train alternative.
-
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
Gonna park it here for now.
My only reads are Rob and Moe and both sit at N-. Rob simply because link was lynched right away. I really hate to base a read off an assumption, but i dont have much more.
Moe is really just kinda off. Yea he seems to have a lotta confidence this game and one of the first things i said at the start of this mafia is anyone who really really know the rules well and are confident with them should have some sus since mafia has a pad where they can discuss them. If i say anymore i will be hypocritical for basing a read off earlier games while telling everyone to stop doing it to me. Really, its just an unusual confidence thing. Dont change moe.
I dont really want to lynch either of them but i think Rob would give more info than moe. I N F O L Y N C H.
Really tho, if someone can come forward with any reason to vote someone thats not Rob or Moe, ill be right on it.
-
My thoughts on what happened:
Cecilia killing dawn was a bad play imo. I'd be okay with it had dawn remained completely silent or had just made a single post to avoid a modkill. Instead he started being more active in N1. imo the better play would have been to target Cal to put some pressure on him to participate a bit more. Also, with the amount of people wanting to lynch Cecilia right now, I doubt even a town!Cecilia would step forward.
About Link being the NK. I doubt Link found anything relevant in N0, given how vague the information Theresa gets is (I think he'd have to collect info for some nights and compare with role claims to start drawing conclusions). Most likely it was either Core of Reason in N0 or Theresa was the juiciest role a mafia!Cocolia had. It could also just been that mafia wanted to get Link out of the way before he started getting any protection.
-
During the night my reads remained mostly the same (only exception being my scumlean on dawn softening a bit, but that's not relevant anymore). I'll be voting for now on the only surviving n- on my list
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
-
My thoughts on what happened:
Cecilia killing dawn was a bad play imo. I'd be okay with it had dawn remained completely silent or had just made a single post to avoid a modkill. Instead he started being more active in N1. imo the better play would have been to target Cal to put some pressure on him to participate a bit more. Also, with the amount of people wanting to lynch Cecilia right now, I doubt even a town!Cecilia would step forward.
Town!Cecilla has to come forward now and explain, otherwise the more time it passes, the scummier it looks. At least if it happens now, it can be discussed and we can reach a conclusion about it, but otherwise Cecilla wouldn't be able to use their role anymore without being outed on the spot and probably lynched.
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w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
now that's proven wrong, i think another roll is due ian
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w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
now that's proven wrong, i think another roll is due ian
Well, 2/3 right is still pretty good
-
Don't worry Link; I'll protect you tonight.
what happened to this?
-
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
It is good when there are wagons forming on multiple mafia.
-
I would ideally like the next votes to be from kdz/moe/cal/naii before the usual actives start talking/voting etc
-
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Was just waiting until I wrapped up and got dinner to post, thats all www3
Willing to look at Cali and Naii as well, everything else Id need some posts/reads to sway
-
Don't worry Link; I'll protect you tonight.
what happened to this?
here’s a couple of things, the obvious and the wifom:
1. I was roleswapping, as Link was (but apparently wasn’t)
2. I was driven away
am I roleswapping now? who knows
-
by the way, I am crafting a post
-
It is good when there are wagons forming on multiple mafia.
Are we missing something, www3? Please elaborate on this statement.
Reads(not in descending order):
vv
v
TorB ─ Mainly useful to town, and I've had little to no qualms with his statements.
Oa ─ Durandal target. Not vv since Durandal might be scum, and I'm inclined to distrust more than I am inclined to trust.
kae ─ While his playstyle looks a little too aggressive in my perspective, it does seem like he's attempting to win as town more than anything.
moe ─ I didn't bother to read much into him after some of those damn big posts, but I agree with most of the statements in what I did read.
n+
MW ─ Mostly because of the actions he's taken during the game. There is some stuff he's done so far that I don't think scum should do, and he's been doing well enough so far, in my perspective.
n
andre ─ He hasn't given much that would make me lean one way or the other. I do like several of his comments, however.
Sub ─ The opposite of andre; has things that make me lean both ways. His most notable play so far was his scumread on me because of my D1 MW vote and justification, which I find towny for the most part, but there is also some stuff that seems somewhat odd to me (minor stuff, though).
n-
www3 ─ I am genuinely confused about this man's intentions and comments. n- because gut and some of his posts.
rob ─ Has excluded me from every reads list :( (jk, actually null)
Calindu ─ There's very few posts from him. Would be n if not for this.
w
ww
Anyone not in the list is a null read.
Also, here's my vote.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
-
w3, Linkcat, kdz are mafia, according to dice roll. Solved game.
now that's proven wrong, i think another roll is due ian
Well, 2/3 right is still pretty good
The context for W3s vote / comment on forming wagons on multiple mafia @naii
-
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
I will do an ISO on all soon, but for now
(https://s3media.247sports.com/Uploads/Assets/151/341/8341151.png)
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kae - I don't have the mental fortitude nor spare time to spend this game to go down the rabbit hole of us just going around and around in a thunderdome-esque fashion. Does everything I say or post as I play make perfect sense all the time? No, I'm human. Do I have a tendency to often hone in on specifics that may not ultimately matter but I try to find purpose or intent in it? Yes, it's in my nature. I have other suspicions I want to prioritize using my time to try to sus out and read further.
-
As the person to nom Coffee N0 last game, considering a vigi shot on an inactive scummy seems a bit hypocritical from my perspective. I do think it would be save to out Cecilia's identity the next time someone is targeted, but it's NAI for me so far. It would definitely go against my personal play style, so I'll hard claim not Cecilia right here and now.
Then again couldn't a scum Bronya simply "play along" visiting different players setting up multiple mid- late-game additional kills to play it safe if they got hit with one of this games many role-outing roles?
Cecilia? You need to remember that Cecilia reveals their identity to their targets. Personally, just being targeted by one would make me want to lynch them. If they marked multiple targets and Cecilia kills someone town, all the marked targets might want to lynch them. Not sure how you plan to kill multiple targets once your identity is revealed.
TorB, my N0 shot last game and the double-tap by Cecelia on dawn this game are quite different. I shot a 0-poster, dawn was low-activity, got dinged once and started coming into it a little bit. I had a one-night use-it-or-lose it chance, Cecelia here is premeditation. And I'm still quite conflicted as to whether it was scummy or towny for someone to Cecelia-snipe dawn like that first two nights of the game... scum would knowingly be skirting a very challenging uphill battle for doing it, but as you can see so far mostly got away with it if they are mafia!Cecelia; town would be understandably shy and probably a bit worried to out that they would face a stiff opposition to get off the hook. I will say that a town!Cecelia should have considered the cost of doing that snipe on dawn and been prepared to face the public outcry - I know I was ready for it when I sniped last game, yet here they still hide. Surely you can see why that would be viewed as scummy? I also admit that my premise here of "the two vig shots this and last game are vastly different" comes into play on my last statement there about "be ready to defend yourself" since I knew my shot would be outed by the host post whereas Cecelia this game could have decided to snipe without fully preparing to face the game at-large.
--> The vig shots are different. I want and we need to stop comparing them probably.
--> I think Cecelia has plenty of scum- or town-equity from this depending on how you review it.
--> I am undecided about whether they should claim as it likely turns this days' vote into a big push against/away from that one person... do we need that right now?
-
@TorB-
Your read on DC is that his posts have become increasingly more useful since he had D1 pressure/lynch votes on him. Can you show a few examples of posts you were thinking of as you typed out your general-feel-read on DC?
-snip-
Posts have become increasingly useful after getting some lynch votes D1, I need to remember this for future mafias :sillyspin:
-snip-
And I was going to question your read on timpa... but then I realized in a quick ISO of timpa that he has been a bit more - "involved" (is that the right word?) this game than I remember him last game or a ways back when he and I scummed together.
--> As I look at timpa's readlist I notice 2/3 of his n- reads (the scummiest he went on the scale) died last night and the lone standout is ian who timpa is now voting on. Nothing fishy there I guess... but @timpa - have you updated or progressed any reads in the last 3 days' time? Who are you scum-reading besides ian right now? Any townreads outside of TorB / Oa / Coffee and/or have they moved down at all? etc...
-
Eh, while I heavily disagree with the decision on shooting d2d, it does not mean Cecilia is (or should be, for that matter) a dead man walking.
Why would the Linkcat NK throw shade on Cocolia? While we won't know for sure, there probably is one, but then again, it's only a 3/16 chance he would find Link, given Cocolia is town. And even then, I feel like Theresa's generally been considered somewhat... overrated. Especially at this stage. It could prove to be useful lategame, but there are, in my opinion, better roles in the current state of the game. Most likely they killed off Link purely because they know the resource he can turn out to be for town.
Oa- you seem to have rested quite well given you are pretty close to a consensus town-read (albeit a few people, myself included) that managed to avoid at least two dangerous situations (Cecelia targeted dawn again and Link was NK)... thoughts on that? Hmm, you posit that Link _might_ have been NK just as a way of mafia trying to kill a town that is know to push and solve throughout the game as town --- how much does that thought process leave you wanting to give a bit of credence to Link's dying reads??
-
@timpa - have you updated or progressed any reads in the last 3 days' time? Who are you scum-reading besides ian right now? Any townreads outside of TorB / Oa / Coffee and/or have they moved down at all? etc...
---> Cue me finding this a few minutes later... I really don't have the proper time to devote to the game right now.......
During the night my reads remained mostly the same (only exception being my scumlean on dawn softening a bit, but that's not relevant anymore). I'll be voting for now on the only surviving n- on my list
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
-
by the way, I am crafting a post
(https://media.tenor.com/images/557be21d7b247784500702e1b59d8926/raw)
-
Where is everybody at? During the few hours I can carve out in the evening to sit and play I'm reduced to hollering into the void with myself back-to-back posting left to simply read during the day without able to post much.... >:( >:( >:(
Don't worry Link; I'll protect you tonight.
what happened to this?
here’s a couple of things, the obvious and the wifom:
1. I was roleswapping, as Link was (but apparently wasn’t)
2. I was driven away
am I roleswapping now? who knows
What the heck is roleswapping? And what does driven away mean - I wasn't aware of a way to drive a saving role away that leaves the NK intact on a target?? What I had seen discussed and made sense to me was that the redirect role was high(est) enough priority to effectively not be something that could be used (on purpose by scum or incidentally by town) to prevent a NK save --- but that seems to be what you're softing here Coffee. (DO NOT out in response - I don't need to know your role or not your role etc. but want to understand what you're getting on about)
-
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
Gonna park it here for now.
My only reads are Rob and Moe and both sit at N-. Rob simply because link was lynched right away. I really hate to base a read off an assumption, but i dont have much more.
Moe is really just kinda off. Yea he seems to have a lotta confidence this game and one of the first things i said at the start of this mafia is anyone who really really know the rules well and are confident with them should have some sus since mafia has a pad where they can discuss them. If i say anymore i will be hypocritical for basing a read off earlier games while telling everyone to stop doing it to me. Really, its just an unusual confidence thing. Dont change moe.
I dont really want to lynch either of them but i think Rob would give more info than moe. I N F O L Y N C H.
Really tho, if someone can come forward with any reason to vote someone thats not Rob or Moe, ill be right on it.
-
If it makes you feel better I am reading everything you are posting rob :)
-
kdz - good to know actually! I will read and keep up to -date and TRY to be on at EOD this time too. :) I take it if you thought I was way off base or out in left field on something, you'd have called me on it or interrupted my ten (was it 9 or 10?) straight repeat posts. 8-)
WTF?!? I haven't had Naii in any readlist yet? Other than my initial partial reads list, I have not had Naii in at all... how did I overlook that and how did nobody catch/question it until now?!
Naii sits at 'n' on my reads... having been a scum-ping for the vote that Link called him on - but the explanation I guess made sense enough. Then this reads list comes across OK too - so neutral read for now. Other than his list goes from v to n- then stops and has me in n- yet he states finding me actually 'null'?? But a read list that has no little oddity to it or such tends to be scummier than towny I think.
--> Naii still neutral for me.
(Trying to fit in several Naii reads here since I left him out for so many already)
It is good when there are wagons forming on multiple mafia.
Are we missing something, www3? Please elaborate on this statement.
Reads(not in descending order):
vv
v
TorB ─ Mainly useful to town, and I've had little to no qualms with his statements.
Oa ─ Durandal target. Not vv since Durandal might be scum, and I'm inclined to distrust more than I am inclined to trust.
kae ─ While his playstyle looks a little too aggressive in my perspective, it does seem like he's attempting to win as town more than anything.
moe ─ I didn't bother to read much into him after some of those damn big posts, but I agree with most of the statements in what I did read.
n+
MW ─ Mostly because of the actions he's taken during the game. There is some stuff he's done so far that I don't think scum should do, and he's been doing well enough so far, in my perspective.
n
andre ─ He hasn't given much that would make me lean one way or the other. I do like several of his comments, however.
Sub ─ The opposite of andre; has things that make me lean both ways. His most notable play so far was his scumread on me because of my D1 MW vote and justification, which I find towny for the most part, but there is also some stuff that seems somewhat odd to me (minor stuff, though).
n-
www3 ─ I am genuinely confused about this man's intentions and comments. n- because gut and some of his posts.
rob ─ Has excluded me from every reads list :( (jk, actually null)
Calindu ─ There's very few posts from him. Would be n if not for this.
w
ww
Anyone not in the list is a null read.
Also, here's my vote.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
-
by the way, I am crafting a post
(https://media.tenor.com/images/557be21d7b247784500702e1b59d8926/raw)
the post will have to wait for now.
Where is everybody at? During the few hours I can carve out in the evening to sit and play I'm reduced to hollering into the void with myself back-to-back posting left to simply read during the day without able to post much.... >:( >:( >:(
Don't worry Link; I'll protect you tonight.
what happened to this?
here’s a couple of things, the obvious and the wifom:
1. I was roleswapping, as Link was (but apparently wasn’t)
2. I was driven away
am I roleswapping now? who knows
What the heck is roleswapping? And what does driven away mean - I wasn't aware of a way to drive a saving role away that leaves the NK intact on a target?? What I had seen discussed and made sense to me was that the redirect role was high(est) enough priority to effectively not be something that could be used (on purpose by scum or incidentally by town) to prevent a NK save --- but that seems to be what you're softing here Coffee. (DO NOT out in response - I don't need to know your role or not your role etc. but want to understand what you're getting on about)
A roleswap is when you claim or soft a role that you aren't to bait a vig hit or night kill away from the actual role. Here, Link and I were roleswapping for the Dura and Fua. (or maybe not, considering Link flipped Theresa)
When I say 'driven away', I mean I was possibly targeted by the Raiden and swapped my doc save on Link to someone else. (Not that I am claiming Fua here)
-
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.
Read List
V
PlayerOa: Willing to bet duran woulda left some sorta hint after Oa was investigated if he was Maf.
N+
TORB: Laid the gameplan out early on. Engaged and very towny. I still believe that as knowledgeable he is about everything, that could be due to having another pad to discuss this. Only reason hes not in V.
Kaempf: Open about being targetted. Helpful and acts pretty normal.
KDZ: Honestly seems kinda confused, going with the flow. Maybe under the radar a bit but is seeming pretty normal.
N
Everyone not listed: Seem normal
N-
Moe: Has really been rubbing me the wrong way all game. Only a very slight scum read that a bit superstititous but still, gut feeling for now.
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK but i didnt want to list him in the everyone else catagory.
Cal, Naii: Inactivity is scummy at this point in the game. Cal literally has less posts than shock, the first kill.
Sub: Suspiciously confused. Maybe im remembering too much from early early game but man, really unlike you.
N--
Coffee: REALLY dont like the promise to protect then failing to do so. Almost feels like you said you would so that he didnt get targeted by anything else as to not disrupt the kill. Like roleswapping or not, thats kinda scummy thing to do. Also, id like to point out him telling info roles to not reveal anything. There are only 3 mafia this game. A mafia kill now would set us FAR ahead. Info roles could be killed off before sharing as we are already 3 town down.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
-
@rob:
My read on you is null; I put you in n- as a joke because I noticed you hadn't put me in any of your reads lists so far and that made me sad.
-
Eh, while I heavily disagree with the decision on shooting d2d, it does not mean Cecilia is (or should be, for that matter) a dead man walking.
Why would the Linkcat NK throw shade on Cocolia? While we won't know for sure, there probably is one, but then again, it's only a 3/16 chance he would find Link, given Cocolia is town. And even then, I feel like Theresa's generally been considered somewhat... overrated. Especially at this stage. It could prove to be useful lategame, but there are, in my opinion, better roles in the current state of the game. Most likely they killed off Link purely because they know the resource he can turn out to be for town.
Oa- you seem to have rested quite well given you are pretty close to a consensus town-read (albeit a few people, myself included) that managed to avoid at least two dangerous situations (Cecelia targeted dawn again and Link was NK)... thoughts on that? Hmm, you posit that Link _might_ have been NK just as a way of mafia trying to kill a town that is know to push and solve throughout the game as town --- how much does that thought process leave you wanting to give a bit of credence to Link's dying reads??
Fear of doc protection, I guess?
Reads of confirmed town should always be taken in consideration, but then again, his role couldn't quite influence his reads so far... Throwing suspicion on iancu and DC is fair play in my book and somewhat aligns with my own thoughts.
-
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
I will do an ISO on all soon, but for now
(https://s3media.247sports.com/Uploads/Assets/151/341/8341151.png)
I did read the whole thread again, dw
-
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.
Read List
V
PlayerOa: Willing to bet duran woulda left some sorta hint after Oa was investigated if he was Maf.
N+
TORB: Laid the gameplan out early on. Engaged and very towny. I still believe that as knowledgeable he is about everything, that could be due to having another pad to discuss this. Only reason hes not in V.
Kaempf: Open about being targetted. Helpful and acts pretty normal.
KDZ: Honestly seems kinda confused, going with the flow. Maybe under the radar a bit but is seeming pretty normal.
N
Everyone not listed: Seem normal
N-
Moe: Has really been rubbing me the wrong way all game. Only a very slight scum read that a bit superstititous but still, gut feeling for now.
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK but i didnt want to list him in the everyone else catagory.
Cal, Naii: Inactivity is scummy at this point in the game. Cal literally has less posts than shock, the first kill.
Sub: Suspiciously confused. Maybe im remembering too much from early early game but man, really unlike you.
N--
Coffee: REALLY dont like the promise to protect then failing to do so. Almost feels like you said you would so that he didnt get targeted by anything else as to not disrupt the kill. Like roleswapping or not, thats kinda scummy thing to do. Also, id like to point out him telling info roles to not reveal anything. There are only 3 mafia this game. A mafia kill now would set us FAR ahead. Info roles could be killed off before sharing as we are already 3 town down.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
You can’t sus coffee so much based on that...ofcourse a medic would never out itself this early. I just brought the post up for mems and how Mafia still went ahead with the nk
-
As the person to nom Coffee N0 last game, considering a vigi shot on an inactive scummy seems a bit hypocritical from my perspective. I do think it would be save to out Cecilia's identity the next time someone is targeted, but it's NAI for me so far. It would definitely go against my personal play style, so I'll hard claim not Cecilia right here and now.
Then again couldn't a scum Bronya simply "play along" visiting different players setting up multiple mid- late-game additional kills to play it safe if they got hit with one of this games many role-outing roles?
Cecilia? You need to remember that Cecilia reveals their identity to their targets. Personally, just being targeted by one would make me want to lynch them. If they marked multiple targets and Cecilia kills someone town, all the marked targets might want to lynch them. Not sure how you plan to kill multiple targets once your identity is revealed.
TorB, my N0 shot last game and the double-tap by Cecelia on dawn this game are quite different. I shot a 0-poster, dawn was low-activity, got dinged once and started coming into it a little bit. I had a one-night use-it-or-lose it chance, Cecelia here is premeditation. And I'm still quite conflicted as to whether it was scummy or towny for someone to Cecelia-snipe dawn like that first two nights of the game... scum would knowingly be skirting a very challenging uphill battle for doing it, but as you can see so far mostly got away with it if they are mafia!Cecelia; town would be understandably shy and probably a bit worried to out that they would face a stiff opposition to get off the hook. I will say that a town!Cecelia should have considered the cost of doing that snipe on dawn and been prepared to face the public outcry - I know I was ready for it when I sniped last game, yet here they still hide. Surely you can see why that would be viewed as scummy? I also admit that my premise here of "the two vig shots this and last game are vastly different" comes into play on my last statement there about "be ready to defend yourself" since I knew my shot would be outed by the host post whereas Cecelia this game could have decided to snipe without fully preparing to face the game at-large.
--> The vig shots are different. I want and we need to stop comparing them probably.
--> I think Cecelia has plenty of scum- or town-equity from this depending on how you review it.
--> I am undecided about whether they should claim as it likely turns this days' vote into a big push against/away from that one person... do we need that right now?
Both vig shots left a bad taste in my mouth by killing town, but they would both be valid under kaempfer13's statement that if there are 18 players, killing 17 of them as town wins you the game.
Where is everybody at? During the few hours I can carve out in the evening to sit and play I'm reduced to hollering into the void with myself back-to-back posting left to simply read during the day without able to post much.... >:( >:( >:(
I don't really read or post much in my sleep 5 - 6 am. Same is likely true for almost every European out there.
@TorB-
Your read on DC is that his posts have become increasingly more useful since he had D1 pressure/lynch votes on him. Can you show a few examples of posts you were thinking of as you typed out your general-feel-read on DC?
It's more like the opposite, the lack of shitposting. Less useless posts = more useful posts.
but wasn't MW like Dragonfly last game? He went rogue?
This post and all the ones before it felt like almost zero content one-liners. Maybe just adding in quotes felt like they had more content, too, lol. Just a feeling I got while reading through his posts.
-
While thinking it over, I have this strange feeling that Cecilia is indeed mafia, with both them and at least one mafia buddy trying to completely ignore this discussion point, despite a lot of people having given their opinion about this. Trying to give your opinion about it after this post would be moot, of course, nor do I have any substantial evidence. Just a gut feeling enhanced by the fact that the mafia team I currently have in my head is staying awfully silent about Cecilia. Which would make my n- reads MW and w3 town.
-
Link NK supports the idea that mafia do have decent information.
Just back from camping and read up. Very confused about the nightkill, but i think it helps. Mafia killing Linkcat to me reads as mafia being largely inexperienced and worried about more experienced players. However, not only does it read like that to me but it also throws some sus onto Rob. I think a rob mafia would kill linkcat first just like a shock mafia would kill Kaempfer first. These are just theories and my initial thoughts.
I would also like to throw the idea out that whoever killed d2d might not actually be mafia. d2d would be a decent target for a trigger happy oty town due to inactivity and confidence when he was active. Still, if it was town that pulled the trigger on dawn, it was a very very wasteful role use and dont be surprised if your lynched right away if/when someone finds out who is the killer.
Experienced or not killing Link makes sense every way you look at it. But you can hardly ever deduce a single mafia member from NK target. Mafia is too smart for that, even shock.
I don't like your second idea. I'm all for hunting down Cecilia.
Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
Rob, that was a scrubbed game that we played literally half a decade ago. Don't try to read off of it.
kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I soft counterclaim your soft confirm.
moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
This is the "www3 roll" that moe was referring to that Link soft counterclaimed moe's facetious "soft confirm"... Could it be Link crumbing that his N0 'spear' returned a non-Herscherr result on one of the players www3's rolls playfully identified - being moe / DC / Oa. Perhaps but seems a stretch, then again crumbs are supposed to be thin and veiled or not too obvious otherwise they are detected too soon??
Theresa needs outside information to confirm alignment. Neither of us claimed their role.
Ian - N- - Has a good amount of posts, but very few of them really contain uhhh content. Now I shit post a lot too, but it feels very similar to 73, a game ian was mafia and just coasted by the first few nights posting little, and when they do post its either a vote or non content. Like a post about having a bad role, a little math talk about having a scumcop, and a lot of bread. Like I'm not saying we gotta go for em right away, but we should at least be aware and acknowledge that this pattern of play lets a scum ian just slip by for 3+ rounds unfettered by questioning/prodding.
Good points, although I want to believe ian's proclamation to be more helpful later. Will keep an eye out but as I said earlier he appears sincere to me.
TYPE[/i] and not the core role. I want to post this still as it contains plenty of research into Link's ISO and possible crumbs despite being based on thinking he would have -known- a red peek if he hit one on N0]DC- it reads as you're presuming Link must have hit a green peek with his N0... do you see evidence of such in Link's ISO?
It could be the case, but in looking it seems like Link was more frequently posting toward what I think could be red peeks... albeit I might expect at some point he would have harder pushed a red peek?
Anyway, now on to the post I was working up when DC posted.
The first line RE: kae/moe - feeding in to the moe section/spoiler farther down my post, the way Link attaches these two together here is such that if moe flips scum then I'd bet dollars-to-donuts that Link had a red peek on moe and believes only a town!kae interacts with moe that way... hmmmm. --> Link putting down in essence not-w/w on kae/moe?
Kae was being real silly about moe but I think it makes him towny.
While it's tempting to lynch w3 D1 after he died N0 last game, I'm going to need to see more before I go down that route.
Cal lynch is silly, don't want to lynch dawn since he's half dead already, would rather lynch MW.
No Lynch is only a good idea when it's very unlikely that any top wagon is town and there's not enough time to find a new target. This happened I believe in both 68 and 72. However, in this game even in such a scenario we can just lynch shock which is a +EV play.
If either of these are Link's N0 then he was VERY lightly crumbing... could possible be a green peek on Cal or red peek on MW. However, the latter I would have expected Link to let the push on MW continue instead of the squirrel-trail distraction that the push on shock's mislynch became.
W3 always defends himself a lot, that's not a scumtell.
Could have been a green on www3, but this (and the light mention on www3 above) don't give off any crumb vibes - that is, it feels like more of just a legit Link thought rather than him having inside intel about www3 alignment.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
Do I need one?
Someone wanna speed me up on why we are scum reading DC?
Seems like normal DC to me
I honestly have no idea.
DC's delayed response to my deal felt weird at the time, now I think it might be because he was talking to his team about whether to take it. If so his most likely teammate is iancu.
Seeing these together in order like this, it sure feels like Link has a slant toward the scum angle for DC. My problem being that DC was a real wagon and possible lynch on D1 so if Link had a red peek on him N0 why not push that just a slight little bit ??? Him returning back to DC again in his last 4 seconds of life this game sure feels like a strong hint or breadcrumb. In the least, it is a strong scum-read from a now dead town!Link. Ugh, I'm going to keep getting stuck on Link not having more appetite for lynching DC on Day 1 though...
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
CFD?
*repeat quote*
DC's delayed response to my deal felt weird at the time, now I think it might be because he was talking to his team about whether to take it. If so his most likely teammate is iancu.
I guess maybe in a soft sort of way Link's vote on ian was hinting at ian here seeing if he could get necessary traction onto a N0 red peek? He does double-down on ian with his post in his last minute of game-breath.
Is it just me or is moe way more confident this game than any other he's played in? Almost like a different person. I think this is the result of him rolling mafia for the first time and finally not being in the dark.
Stop townreading Torb for discussing roles, that's the easiest way for mafia to build towncred.
I will be online for the next ~3 hours and maybe for EOD. Placing my not so confident vote now on MW. He has a low enough post count and little substance in his posts. Still a shot in the dark.
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
I don't like this vote at all.
-snip-
removed unrelated statement about how wrong prior-Link was about shock's safety
The former feeling a LOT like a breadcrumb post... maybe Link had a N0 red peek on moe? At the least it is a dying town's scum-lean on moe.
In a softer way -- Link is softly implying maybe scum!TorB in the bolded statement... maybe that was his N0 breadcrumb?
---> I suppose my summary of what I find in Link's ISO about possible crumbs summarizes as:
* Maaayyybe a green peek on Cal
* Maybe a red peek on MW (but I think Link would probably have pushed MW harder D1 given MW was a legit wagon and Link was on EOD1)
* Maayybe a green peek on www3
* Could have had a red peek on DC (but I think Link likely pushes harder for DC lynch D1 given DC was a legit wagon... but Link does revisit a scum-read on DC right before Link is NK'd)
* Could have had a red peek on iancu (he also tried to CFD onto ian - and revisits a continued scum-read on ian right before he is NK'd)
* Maaaaayyyyyyybe a red peek on TorB
* Could have red-peekd moe (as Link suddenly on N1 scumreads moe and doubles-down on that read "not liking" a moe vote post with about an hour before Link is NK'd)
Of this, I see a few green-peeks Link might have crumbed but he has more posts that I could see as being hints about his N0 being a RED peek instead. If I rank them, then it looks something like:
Maybe red on:
ian > DC > moe >> TorB > MW
>> And maybe green on:
ww3 > Cal
Folks we really need to comb Link's posts a little bit at least to try to find his peek's breadcrumb... he openly stated everyone should ABC (always be crumbing) so for sure he followed his own advice, right?
LINK - in your graveyard chat roll over 10 times (privately of course) if it was red on one of the wagons you could have pushed at EOD (MW / DC).
///I'm presuming 100% that Link used N0 and that he successfully learned the Honkai Core ability (scum) or role type (town) of somebody and crumbed it somewhere///
This would make for a very elaborate scum scheme and a shot for mafia MVP. +town cred
You know rob, you arent the only one in that "misunderstood Theresa" boat. Sigh x100
Ironically enough I was also confused at first, posted my erroneous view and later - also publicly - corrected it. I believe it was TorB:
And that after all the trouble I went through to explain it, too :(
vv
v
Oa
coffee
TorB
n+
Sub
Cal
kdz
moe
n
n-
timpa
kae
ian
w
www3
MW
DC
Very confused about yoru read on Oa but at least your read on me is a bit more understandable now.
Tbh, i dont really see why Cecilia finishing dawn off is particularly scummy. I mean it does go against the consensus of vocal players, but very publicly so; similiar to how shock did, i dont exactly condon going against the grain without even speaking up about it, but as scum!cecilia you are just painting a target on your back. In fact as scum!Cecilia its best to mark many different people, denying us the flip and then finish them off one after the other, ending the game early.
Your last sentence is very good point. At the very least you should mark two players, then kill them before Emma gets a chance to out you. This is even more convenient if one of your peeks is scumread and a vig is seen as towny. I'll put in more thought in it. So far a hunt for Cecilia was my topmost course of action. I guess peeking into a scummy person could even change my perspective. It surely would add a lot of pressure. IF Cecilia really is town her peeking scum could also pressure mafia into a NK if they have any information on her. Keep in mind, though, that this can be used by mafia. Either way I am a bit anxious about this role. :/
As the person to nom Coffee N0 last game, considering a vigi shot on an inactive scummy seems a bit hypocritical from my perspective. I do think it would be save to out Cecilia's identity the next time someone is targeted, but it's NAI for me so far. It would definitely go against my personal play style, so I'll hard claim not Cecilia right here and now.
Then again couldn't a scum Bronya simply "play along" visiting different players setting up multiple mid- late-game additional kills to play it safe if they got hit with one of this games many role-outing roles?
Cecilia? You need to remember that Cecilia reveals their identity to their targets. Personally, just being targeted by one would make me want to lynch them. If they marked multiple targets and Cecilia kills someone town, all the marked targets might want to lynch them. Not sure how you plan to kill multiple targets once your identity is revealed.
Paranoia averted. Disregard most of what I wrote in response to kae. Reading roles is useful sometimes.
cecila vig is scummy, and once found should be lynched.
I don't think anyone targeted by Cecilia will keep quiet about her identity.
// Thinking about Cecilia a bit more and I still find it very scummy. They picked out very low-activity town N0 who then became active. Still they went through with killing them. This screams low hanging fruit so much you don't even need anyone help you pick it. It's just so weird because mafia can hardly make use out of this ability any more... What bug me is that there is no way I could have seen dawn as scummy N1 and went through with my plan to vig him if that was my plan N0. But there weren't too many townreads on him at that point in time? I might read back, phew.
Also, I do like TorB's reads list, there needs to be a major revelation to change my townread on him.
...I'll be with y'all in three pages.
-
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (1) - Calindu
Stated previously why I'm scumreading him, he also seems much more confident this game than during all other games I remember, and very early into the game. Might be because of more information available to him.
-
v
Oa - If he's scum so is Dura and if so, tf y'alls doing scum?
w3 - If he's mafia he should have let me die
n+
Beef - typical of him, the way he's trying to hold back seeing he thinks he knows Dura's identity but doesn't want to give it away seems towny
kae - based on his interaction with shock I feel like he's being honest
n
andre - Is just there, nothing out of the ordinary
kdz - is busy irl
rob - joined my train soon after with the same reasoning though I think either 1 jumped onto the other (mafia would be ballsy to pile both on me) and I'm more inclined to say he's playing pretty similarly to last time. Sans the salt :^)
Cal - exists. He's talking a bit more now though (and if you see this, I did not mean to say that you should talk more to the point it affects IRL - I merely named you because I was replying to shock who mentioned you as well)
Naii - Confused town or maf who didn't give a shit EoD1. If the former, makes MW more towny
moe - His initial confusion about softclaims and the like seems NAI, I don't really see the confidence everyone talks about
n-
ian - don't like the way he reacted when he got pushed
MW - If you assume one of the trains between me w3 and him are scum, it'll have to be him
Coffee - I can't seem to shake off that bias that he's talking way more than he did last game, but regardless I feel like he latched on me yesterday with rather weak arguments.
Parking my vote in case college fucks me tonight
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
-
It's nice to see people voting a long time before EOD, but we're still almost at a 3-way tie again.
If you're going to lynch me, just do it already.
Before I die, here's the solved game mafia team: w3, TorB/roB, MW
-
Darn, I'm working in the afternoon so have to rush out my readlist now. I had the impression that there are too many people who dont really solve much atp, making it easy (and statistically probable) for 1-2scum to hide among them. Unfortunately, its not like shooting at random among them is very likely to end in success, so I just need more people to try harder or glasses. If coffee and andre can do it, so can you!
-
I think the only people defending cecilia's action were me (confirmed not cecilia) and mw (who claims to have stayed put n0). Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems the real cecilia didnt even try to justify themselves. So now i've come around to agree that cecilia is probably scum.
-
My thoughts on what happened:
Cecilia killing dawn was a bad play imo. I'd be okay with it had dawn remained completely silent or had just made a single post to avoid a modkill. Instead he started being more active in N1. imo the better play would have been to target Cal to put some pressure on him to participate a bit more. Also, with the amount of people wanting to lynch Cecilia right now, I doubt even a town!Cecilia would step forward.
Town!Cecilla has to come forward now and explain, otherwise the more time it passes, the scummier it looks. At least if it happens now, it can be discussed and we can reach a conclusion about it, but otherwise Cecilla wouldn't be able to use their role anymore without being outed on the spot and probably lynched.
I am not convinced town needs to know Cecilia's identity any more. As soon as she targets a not commonly scumread person, she should get outed, though. Also, apparently my idea's for Cecilia don't matter too much to Cecilia. So, if we collectively allow Cecilia to vig scummy people there will be plenty scummy townsfolk that a potential mafia could get rid of. I do not like this. I also would want her outed if she makes that attempt.
I would ideally like the next votes to be from kdz/moe/cal/naii before the usual actives start talking/voting etc
You're not an all too unlikely candidate yourself. But I am not so well at scumreading people.
moe ─ I didn't bother to read much into him after some of those damn big posts, but I agree with most of the statements in what I did read.
That's not good, this is where I post my thoughts on ten pages of content. The small posts only reflect a fraction of that.
N-
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK but i didnt want to list him in the everyone else catagory.
You cannot deduct mafia form the NK target. There are information roles and some people are good at solving and pose a greater risk as town. rob is not the only one to know this.
N--
Coffee: REALLY dont like the promise to protect then failing to do so. Almost feels like you said you would so that he didnt get targeted by anything else as to not disrupt the kill. Like roleswapping or not, thats kinda scummy thing to do. Also, id like to point out him telling info roles to not reveal anything. There are only 3 mafia this game. A mafia kill now would set us FAR ahead. Info roles could be killed off before sharing as we are already 3 town down.
I don't think anyone pegged Coffee as Fu Hua after his post. You cannot announce to mafia what the power roles are going to do exactly. Your point baffles me. I don't like the term 'roleswapping' it's just a fancy word for a concept that's always been there. Of course you're going to muddy the water for yourself and mafia information acquisition!?
To be fair, I guess I try to be a bit harsher than usual as there's a bit of OMGUS going on on my part.
While thinking it over, I have this strange feeling that Cecilia is indeed mafia, with both them and at least one mafia buddy trying to completely ignore this discussion point, despite a lot of people having given their opinion about this. Trying to give your opinion about it after this post would be moot, of course, nor do I have any substantial evidence. Just a gut feeling enhanced by the fact that the mafia team I currently have in my head is staying awfully silent about Cecilia. Which would make my n- reads MW and w3 town.
I also look at them with suspicion and like your this post in general as it gives me some direction towards solving. I am far from getting scumreads but looking at your play it shows a distinct path to follow.
People I am currently fine placing my vote on: MW, w3, ian, Naii out of the more suspicious looking lot. Cal, DC, andre, kdz I still don't have a read. Sub I don't think I will ever get one.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
I did not expect to be stuck with the same reads I had D1. ?_?
-
Looking into TorB's theory btw. So, I might end up giving MW and www3 town cred as a result. But I don't see it yet.
-
Looks like Sub died irl, hasnt been online since nighttime. No wonder it felt so quiet.
-
Before I die, here's the solved game mafia team: w3, TorB/roB, MW
If this is the case, which of them is Cecilia? Or do you believe Cecilia is town?
My current top suspects for mafia Cecilia are:
- iancudorinmarian
- Submachine
Unless Emma Planck is mafia, mafia already knows the chances of there being an Emma Planck are still quite high (chances reduce with each other role revealed to be in-game, chance is 0% if Emma Planck is mafia), meaning a no-Cecilia hard false-claim would still be caught on N2, which is a guaranteed death from my point of view. Easiest way out is to simple ignore the Cecilia discussion, however, hoping I wouldn't raise the point I did.
-
7.
Calindu n
Same as before, for the amount of time he puts in the game his posts seem fine, there's just not enough for a read.
d2d,link vv dead
naii n
not w/w with rob lol. His readlist is agreeable for the most part, maybe too much so. Other than that I can mostly just derive his lack of experience which is mostly nai(ha!). You could argue that his scumteam didnt help him kick up less dirt with his votes, but meh, dont really want to force a read out of that.
mw n
Dude what are you doing? Unfortunately, I find myself asking that every time with him. Arguably, him assuming that the scumteam would exchange themselves over correct roleusage for town, is eversoslightly towny, as there has never been a scumchat that did that, so maybe he still hasnt been in one.
Some of his reads seem fine, others are really farfetched. Voting someone you dont actually want to lynch is always questionable, but he admits that he doesnt have real scumreads, so might just be antibronya measure.
moe n+
I see real efforts to solve here. Lets just forget I mentioned a potential slip, ok? :-[
iancudorinmarian n-
I see nothing of value here. His reads seem to be mostly memes. His reactions to being voted up are rather strong, but i dont actually see him trying any harder.
andretimpa n+
I see him trying much harder this time, I think he doesnt just coast along. Also, some of the awkward tone he had in his early posts the game before seems gone (dont give too much on that,I'm almost tonedeath)
kdz n
I feel a little better about him now for some reason. Probably because I get his sentiment that its really hard to put people anywhere else but n right now (see this list) and some other small things. ironically this strips me off a read entirely.
Oa vv
Durandal+ decent solviness
DC v
based on wagonomics minimal effort went into keeping him alive. Constantly in danger and the people starting new cws were always different i think. i think his cws had various different votes as well.
Coffee v
lots of solving + I think the fact that he's even trying at all makes him towny per default considering his meta.
Sub n/n-
Many uncharacteristic behaviours that throw me off. has been completely awol today (nai!).
rob n/n-
I still dont like many of his posts, but i dont want to end up in the situation again where I sus all active towns early and then am stuck with the only person posting halfway sensibly (autotr based on lack of alternatives) being scum. additionally he might have derpcleared himself and rob may be right that he would absolutely avoid getting caught in contradictions as scum. For why I dont like his posts just grab 2 of my posts at random and you more likely than not get an answer.
w3 n
His contributions are pretty minimal. I want to give some cred for not being particularly keen on voting DC once he got serious, even though dc started as his only serious cw.
TorB v
He's really helpfull to town overall.
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Unless Emma Planck is mafia, mafia already knows the chances of there being a TOWN Emma Planck are still quite high (chances reduce with each other role revealed to be in-game, chance is 0% if Emma Planck is mafia)
EBWOP in red.
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I kinda want to to do sth with my vote, as I'm out until ~1hour before deadline, but the vote that I would place right now would be on ian and I feel like parking there just denies future wagonmovement, as he already has 3 votes.
He seems to insist on not cooperating so pressurevotes do nothing for him either (either he's scum scared to spew sth, or he just never gives a damn).
i kinda want to give rob a second chance, so i guess this leaves me with Sub. Not entirely happy with that, as he should become more active or on the contrary might be completely unable to login and thus not explain himself or roleclaim if necessary, but I will most likely be there before EoD.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
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@TorB, I hard claim NOT Cecilia.
@kae, I insist on not cooperating? How did you even get that impression is beyond me. Just because I have nothing of value to relay does not mean I'm purposely trying to not "cooperate".
The real scum are laughing their asses off in their pad while you're all busy throwing shade at me.
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Forgot to answer "who do you think is Cecilia" comment. If I had to guess, it would probably be MW out of that list. Although I wouldn't put it past w3 to do something like that either.
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And to be honest, I didn't even read the full role list yet. All these names confuse me, so I never bothered.
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And to be honest, I didn't even read the full role list yet. All these names confuse me, so I never bothered.
this line is weird for being 2 game days in
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@TorB, I hard claim NOT Cecilia.
Forgot to answer "who do you think is Cecilia" comment. If I had to guess, it would probably be MW out of that list. Although I wouldn't put it past w3 to do something like that either.
Keeping both in mind. We are currently at a balance on you vs MW in terms of lynch votes, so I mostly want to see whom will break the balance and for which reasons. Totally willing to go for an MW lynch today, though having him be the only one to make an effort to defend Cecilia as Cecilia, but then not claim... I guess it's not beyond MW. Actually, I read kaempf's post on MW's defense and presumed as such, but apparently he never mentioned Cecilia either. So forget clearing MW as town by finding scum Cecilia.
Still, dawn was still alive when MW posted this, and never counter-claimed:
I have given all the information about myself. Lemme bulletin it so that if i do get lynched, youll see there is no info to gain from it.
- Im Town
- I do NOT have an information role
- I have NOT used my role yet
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I heavily doubt MW is Cecilia.
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Nice catch. So MW basically confirmed not Cecilia then.
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okay here we go guys
I hardclaim Cecilia, and intentionally killed dawn last night. I wasn't driven, it wasn't a mistaken pm, I killed dawn on purpose.'
Here's how it happened:
I am not sure any more who implied dawn is going to die soon anyway. Can we agree as town not to use Cecilia as a killing tool? I see the benefit of having the option to vig people at later stages but this early it is beyond scummy.
Again, I don't want Cecilia to go about killing heaps of people. Do we have a consensus here? I'm going as far as wanting Emma to call Cecilia out D3 if dawn gets killed N1/N2.
Here are the posts by moe that indicate a lack of supporting my follow through with the kill. There wasn't much backing nor reasoning behind not killing him from what I read.
Dawn did not claim any important role, as he should have (ex. "I am a power role") after being hit by me the first time. When he didn't claim something investigative or a doctor (what I might consider important roles), the roles he could have had that were beneficial to the town were limited. Other than the investigative roles and Hua, the only other roles that could positively impact us as town would be Raiden, Seele (by copying another role (but he would already have copied Cecilia)), and Liliya. I was willing to take the risk if he was Liliya, as it would have shown me dying as Ceciliya when the kill would or should have been Dawn. It made more sense to me to stop him from possibly getting away with a free pass from lynching for having a Cecilia hit on him.
He also didn't contribute during his time alive very heavily. People claim he began to put out more content, but the only posts with substance were his light reads and filler otherwise. That reads to me as scummy. With him staying alive for the extra day/night phase, it could have resulted in him roleblocking Hua, getting a Typhoon Cutter off onto an investigative role or taking me down with him if he were a maf Kallen and we decided to have me vig hit him tomorrow.
I'd like to say I learned from the best (Rob).
-----------------
As far as my scumreads go, ian's repeated odd lines with the "I will be more useful later" and his last line I quoted about him never reading the lists reads more and more scummy to me as the game goes on. This has led me to FOS him almost equally as hard as DC.
Coffee - I can't seem to shake off that bias that he's talking way more than he did last game, but regardless I feel like he latched on me yesterday with rather weak arguments.
This is OMGUS and both of your points are weak; a reaction test is just as valid as any other scum read, and most people have already established that my playstyle for nearly every other game was to coast regardless of alignment. I'm also talking way more than last game because I'm not dead yet.
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And for the record, I am completely disinterested in lynching mafia Cecilia today. Rather, I would prefer above else to find their most likely accomplices in the hopes that Emma Planck can track Cecilia themselves down next night. So the vote on ian is not because I still find him the primary Cecilia suspect. Similarly, MW not being Cecilia is not a reason not to lynch vote him.
Oh, and then Coffee posts, making most of my points above moot. I would have preferred to see this post earlier, but at least we can stop witch hunting.
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Coffee, you should've killed rob to take revenge, what are you even doing?
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Coffee, you should've killed rob to take revenge, what are you even doing?
You’re so right.
Oh, and then Coffee posts, making most of my points above moot. I would have preferred to see this post earlier, but at least we can stop witch hunting.
Ideally, I would have posted tomorrow day after getting someone else to confirm me. I was hoping my roleswap soft of doc would take some abilities or the night kill away from an important role like Dura. I was also against outing everyone’s roles or what they aren’t so early, because as we do this with everyone the mafia is able to narrow who is who.
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okay here we go guys
I hardclaim Cecilia, and intentionally killed dawn last night. I wasn't driven, it wasn't a mistaken pm, I killed dawn on purpose.'
Here's how it happened:
I am not sure any more who implied dawn is going to die soon anyway. Can we agree as town not to use Cecilia as a killing tool? I see the benefit of having the option to vig people at later stages but this early it is beyond scummy.
Again, I don't want Cecilia to go about killing heaps of people. Do we have a consensus here? I'm going as far as wanting Emma to call Cecilia out D3 if dawn gets killed N1/N2.
Here are the posts by moe that indicate a lack of supporting my follow through with the kill. There wasn't much backing nor reasoning behind not killing him from what I read.
Dawn did not claim any important role, as he should have (ex. "I am a power role") after being hit by me the first time. When he didn't claim something investigative or a doctor (what I might consider important roles), the roles he could have had that were beneficial to the town were limited. Other than the investigative roles and Hua, the only other roles that could positively impact us as town would be Raiden, Seele (by copying another role (but he would already have copied Cecilia)), and Liliya. I was willing to take the risk if he was Liliya, as it would have shown me dying as Ceciliya when the kill would or should have been Dawn. It made more sense to me to stop him from possibly getting away with a free pass from lynching for having a Cecilia hit on him.
He also didn't contribute during his time alive very heavily. People claim he began to put out more content, but the only posts with substance were his light reads and filler otherwise. That reads to me as scummy. With him staying alive for the extra day/night phase, it could have resulted in him roleblocking Hua, getting a Typhoon Cutter off onto an investigative role or taking me down with him if he were a maf Kallen and we decided to have me vig hit him tomorrow.
I'd like to say I learned from the best (Rob).
-----------------
As far as my scumreads go, ian's repeated odd lines with the "I will be more useful later" and his last line I quoted about him never reading the lists reads more and more scummy to me as the game goes on. This has led me to FOS him almost equally as hard as DC.
Coffee - I can't seem to shake off that bias that he's talking way more than he did last game, but regardless I feel like he latched on me yesterday with rather weak arguments.
This is OMGUS and both of your points are weak; a reaction test is just as valid as any other scum read, and most people have already established that my playstyle for nearly every other game was to coast regardless of alignment. I'm also talking way more than last game because I'm not dead yet.
There was a consensus to not kill dawn, so why did you go kill him? If I was dawn, I wouldn’t be claiming either as a town cecila wouldnt hammer like that. Especially given that you’ve been previously not as active, and then using your reasoning as inactivity to kill dawn? Cal was more inactive, you could’ve targeted him and given dawn one more day atleast.
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From my point of view the optimal play for mafia Cecilia would have been to kill off the town with the lowest credibility, then force a power role to claim D3, while for town its better to sacrifice yourself than waste a fellow town power role just to live for one more day.
Town lean thus far is another reason why I am giving Coffee the benefit of doubt for now and not lynch voting. No one is in danger of getting killed by Cecilia role upcoming night.
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This is OMGUS and both of your points are weak; a reaction test is just as valid as any other scum read, and most people have already established that my playstyle for nearly every other game was to coast regardless of alignment. I'm also talking way more than last game because I'm not dead yet.
What the hell ya want me to do, pick a better meme?
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What www3 said. With added-- but would a scum!Coffee out this way? Even after a once over on coffee claim past I'm conflicted if the shots are true scummy or town as I struggle to grasp EITHER alignment doing it this way??
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okay here we go guys
I hardclaim Cecilia, and intentionally killed dawn last night. I wasn't driven, it wasn't a mistaken pm, I killed dawn on purpose.'
Here's how it happened:
I am not sure any more who implied dawn is going to die soon anyway. Can we agree as town not to use Cecilia as a killing tool? I see the benefit of having the option to vig people at later stages but this early it is beyond scummy.
Again, I don't want Cecilia to go about killing heaps of people. Do we have a consensus here? I'm going as far as wanting Emma to call Cecilia out D3 if dawn gets killed N1/N2.
Here are the posts by moe that indicate a lack of supporting my follow through with the kill. There wasn't much backing nor reasoning behind not killing him from what I read.
Dawn did not claim any important role, as he should have (ex. "I am a power role") after being hit by me the first time. When he didn't claim something investigative or a doctor (what I might consider important roles), the roles he could have had that were beneficial to the town were limited. Other than the investigative roles and Hua, the only other roles that could positively impact us as town would be Raiden, Seele (by copying another role (but he would already have copied Cecilia)), and Liliya. I was willing to take the risk if he was Liliya, as it would have shown me dying as Ceciliya when the kill would or should have been Dawn. It made more sense to me to stop him from possibly getting away with a free pass from lynching for having a Cecilia hit on him.
He also didn't contribute during his time alive very heavily. People claim he began to put out more content, but the only posts with substance were his light reads and filler otherwise. That reads to me as scummy. With him staying alive for the extra day/night phase, it could have resulted in him roleblocking Hua, getting a Typhoon Cutter off onto an investigative role or taking me down with him if he were a maf Kallen and we decided to have me vig hit him tomorrow.
I'd like to say I learned from the best (Rob).
-----------------
As far as my scumreads go, ian's repeated odd lines with the "I will be more useful later" and his last line I quoted about him never reading the lists reads more and more scummy to me as the game goes on. This has led me to FOS him almost equally as hard as DC.
Coffee - I can't seem to shake off that bias that he's talking way more than he did last game, but regardless I feel like he latched on me yesterday with rather weak arguments.
This is OMGUS and both of your points are weak; a reaction test is just as valid as any other scum read, and most people have already established that my playstyle for nearly every other game was to coast regardless of alignment. I'm also talking way more than last game because I'm not dead yet.
There was a consensus to not kill dawn, so why did you go kill him? If I was dawn, I wouldn’t be claiming either as a town cecila wouldnt hammer like that. Especially given that you’ve been previously not as active, and then using your reasoning as inactivity to kill dawn? Cal was more inactive, you could’ve targeted him and given dawn one more day atleast.
The consensus was not vocalized heavily. Also, mafia would know my identity if I was on them and then we risk out vig getting killed. I don’t understand your point behind the me not being active thing.
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What www3 said. With added-- but would a scum!Coffee out this way? Even after a once over on coffee claim past I'm conflicted if the shots are true scummy or town as I struggle to grasp EITHER alignment doing it this way??
But this was the only way for a scum cecila to survive. Once outed by cecilas next target or by emma plank, its death for sure.
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From my point of view the optimal play for mafia Cecilia would have been to kill off the town with the lowest credibility, then force a power role to claim D3, while for town its better to sacrifice yourself than waste a fellow town power role just to live for one more day.
Town lean thus far is another reason why I am giving Coffee the benefit of doubt for now and not lynch voting. No one is in danger of getting killed by Cecilia role upcoming night.
I can either not target somebody tomorrow evening, or target someone to confirm my identity which wouldn’t make sense to me. I agree that I should have been willing to self sac for a power role, but as I said, he would have softed had he been an important role. He was not contributing positively to the town.
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For the record, I was talking about the lynch for today, sorry that was not clear. I meant that instead of claiming now, you would frame some poor town sod for it and let the Cecilia witch hunt continue.
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What www3 said. With added-- but would a scum!Coffee out this way? Even after a once over on coffee claim past I'm conflicted if the shots are true scummy or town as I struggle to grasp EITHER alignment doing it this way??
But this was the only way for a scum cecila to survive. Once outed by cecilas next target or by emma plank, its death for sure.
It’s also the only way for me to survive as town, because I was already put into a catch 22 for doing this night-zero/one vig hit. I assumed because people were okay with rob doing it last game as otyugh that I would be received not as negatively. I would rather claim now and have us know I am ceciliya, seeing as how maf could hide if emma was killed tonight. I also don’t want to force emma to out this early.
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Coffee, you need to vote too btw.
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Coffee, you need to vote too btw.
You right. loving the consistency w3 :)
This is OMGUS and both of your points are weak; a reaction test is just as valid as any other scum read, and most people have already established that my playstyle for nearly every other game was to coast regardless of alignment. I'm also talking way more than last game because I'm not dead yet.
What the hell ya want me to do, pick a better meme?
or contribute
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
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okay here we go guys
I hardclaim Cecilia, and intentionally killed dawn last night. I wasn't driven, it wasn't a mistaken pm, I killed dawn on purpose.'
Here's how it happened:
I am not sure any more who implied dawn is going to die soon anyway. Can we agree as town not to use Cecilia as a killing tool? I see the benefit of having the option to vig people at later stages but this early it is beyond scummy.
Again, I don't want Cecilia to go about killing heaps of people. Do we have a consensus here? I'm going as far as wanting Emma to call Cecilia out D3 if dawn gets killed N1/N2.
I don't see how especially the second post did not make you second guess your plan. t.t
Here are the posts by moe that indicate a lack of supporting my follow through with the kill. There wasn't much backing nor reasoning behind not killing him from what I read.
I agree with the 'little backing' that is why I brought it up repeatedly. I was a bit annoyed especially at the start of day. Kae's post made me change my perspective a bit but in the end I stand somewhat disappointed.
Dawn did not claim any important role, as he should have (ex. "I am a power role") after being hit by me the first time. When he didn't claim something investigative or a doctor (what I might consider important roles), the roles he could have had that were beneficial to the town were limited. Other than the investigative roles and Hua, the only other roles that could positively impact us as town would be Raiden, Seele (by copying another role (but he would already have copied Cecilia)), and Liliya. I was willing to take the risk if he was Liliya, as it would have shown me dying as Ceciliya when the kill would or should have been Dawn. It made more sense to me to stop him from possibly getting away with a free pass from lynching for having a Cecilia hit on him.
I don't see the burden of proof on his end. He was a random player who did pick up his activity. If you go about vigging people as town you better have a good reason. This is a massive point.
He also didn't contribute during his time alive very heavily. People claim he began to put out more content, but the only posts with substance were his light reads and filler otherwise. That reads to me as scummy. With him staying alive for the extra day/night phase, it could have resulted in him roleblocking Hua, getting a Typhoon Cutter off onto an investigative role or taking me down with him if he were a maf Kallen and we decided to have me vig hit him tomorrow.
'Him staying alive could block a role' versus Cecilia doing her thing outright kills people. How do you think this is supposed to look from the outside? This is a serious question that hopefully gets you reevaluating your judgement. I, for one, am disappointed in the use of your role in general and killing dawn in particular.
I'd like to say I learned from the best (Rob).
I am not sure how seriously I should take this. If I did I'd respond along the lines of: He himself pointed out the vast differences.
Otherwise, you're just adding insult to injury. You don't even seem to show some doubt nor hindsight.
-----------------
As far as my scumreads go, ian's repeated odd lines with the "I will be more useful later" and his last line I quoted about him never reading the lists reads more and more scummy to me as the game goes on. This has led me to FOS him almost equally as hard as DC.
Coffee - I can't seem to shake off that bias that he's talking way more than he did last game, but regardless I feel like he latched on me yesterday with rather weak arguments.
This is OMGUS and both of your points are weak; a reaction test is just as valid as any other scum read, and most people have already established that my playstyle for nearly every other game was to coast regardless of alignment. I'm also talking way more than last game because I'm not dead yet.
Town lean thus far is another reason why I am giving Coffee the benefit of doubt for now
My sentiments also.
What www3 said. With added-- but would a scum!Coffee out this way? Even after a once over on coffee claim past I'm conflicted if the shots are true scummy or town as I struggle to grasp EITHER alignment doing it this way??
I want to believe I saw it coming but the outcry came too late. Town could and should have swayed Coffee more. Coffee's judgement is beyond me.
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iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
I think this is the correct vote count.
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The timing of Coffee's reveal... I wouldn't have managed to hit a more suspicious time even if I tried.
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The timing of Coffee's reveal... I wouldn't have managed to hit a more suspicious time even if I tried.
So you town read him for it?
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The opposite.
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The timing of Coffee's reveal... I wouldn't have managed to hit a more suspicious time even if I tried.
I’m only saying this to be an asshole:
It could have been more suspicious if I waited until tomorrow night, yes?
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Again, I don't want Cecilia to go about killing heaps of people. Do we have a consensus here? I'm going as far as wanting Emma to call Cecilia out D3 if dawn gets killed N1/N2.
I don't see how especially the second post did not make you second guess your plan. t.t
I did second guess it, but I thought that I was taking the best course of action in the end. If I hit a mafia, that’s a mafia dead. If I hit a town, I figured he wasn’t an important role and knew that I would get scumread for it, and I accepted that fact. I’m not backing down from believing that there is some justification behind this move. I’m not just going to be like “sorry sorry sorry†and ask for forgiveness.
I agree with the 'little backing' that is why I brought it up repeatedly. I was a bit annoyed especially at the start of day. Kae's post made me change my perspective a bit but in the end I stand somewhat disappointed.
Then we agree that there wasn’t enough heavy agreement on to use or not to use my ability?
I don't see the burden of proof on his end. He was a random player who did pick up his activity. If you go about vigging people as town you better have a good reason. This is a massive point.
I’ve already stated my reasoning. He may have picked up his activity, but more posts with less content doesn’t mean he’s any townier. This is the same reason I scumread DC.
'Him staying alive could block a role' versus Cecilia doing her thing outright kills people. How do you think this is supposed to look from the outside? This is a serious question that hopefully gets you reevaluating your judgement. I, for one, am disappointed in the use of your role in general and killing dawn in particular.
I could either hit a mafia, or I could leave him alive and risk him roleblocking our doc or vig killing an investigative role. From my perspective, it made sense for me to hit him because based off of his lack of a claim he was not a role we would have missed and I know I am most likely not going to hit something we need. He could either vig hit me knowing I was on him (and that’s only a loss of a town vig that reveals info about dawn) or he could one of the investigatives.
“I'd like to say I learned from the best (Rob).â€
I am not sure how seriously I should take this. If I did I'd respond along the lines of: He himself pointed out the vast differences.
Otherwise, you're just adding insult to injury. You don't even seem to show some doubt nor hindsight.
Again, obviously I regret hitting town, but I can’t back down from this or take it back. The rob thing is in reference to last game. I am wondering how the town would have reacted if dawn was maf? the fact that I misvigged is the biggest scum read on me here, yes? And that I didn’t claim earlier? When the pressure is maf if you do, maf if you don’t, I would rather claim late today than be found later and auto lynched. If I was maf, i could have hidden and hoped that emma died tonight.[/quote]
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@Coffee, your vote is on DC because although he posts, you dont find the content to be useful. You killed dawn because of lack of posts. Yet i dont see you talk about Cal much? unless you did and i forgot about it?
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Also, yh idk what happened to sub. He hasnt logged in, in 4 days
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@Coffee, your vote is on DC because although he posts, you dont find the content to be useful. You killed dawn because of lack of posts. Yet i dont see you talk about Cal much? unless you did and i forgot about it?
I don’t because it’s universally agreed upon according to cal’s 2nd post that he does this, or so I assumed. I also thought the 3rd maf would be someone in the more townread or talkative category, so my thoughts were either ian (not falling into that category and instead just being my scumread) or kaempfer/rob/moe in that order of towniness. I don’t currently scum read any of those three, though.
But Cal and I are a team, you’re right.
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iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
I think this is the correct vote count.
\this voting pattern always lynches a scum\
www3 - I don't think kdz is in the table today...
kae- same for Sub.
MW- fine one of the more major trains\wagons\targets? (WIFOM coming from me but meh)
Oa- push harder for naii or find a better wagon?
--> some consolation really needs to start getting traction here folks.
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And for the record, I am completely disinterested in lynching mafia Cecilia today. Rather, I would prefer above else to find their most likely accomplices in the hopes that Emma Planck can track Cecilia themselves down next night. So the vote on ian is not because I still find him the primary Cecilia suspect. Similarly, MW not being Cecilia is not a reason not to lynch vote him.
Oh, and then Coffee posts, making most of my points above moot. I would have preferred to see this post earlier, but at least we can stop witch hunting.
forgetting which team you're on or supposed to be on TorB??
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@ian @Naii
Lynching me is pointless as i am town. Go vote for your next scumread as thats more helpful.
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And for the record, I am completely disinterested in lynching mafia Cecilia today. Rather, I would prefer above else to find their most likely accomplices in the hopes that Emma Planck can track Cecilia themselves down next night. So the vote on ian is not because I still find him the primary Cecilia suspect. Similarly, MW not being Cecilia is not a reason not to lynch vote him.
Oh, and then Coffee posts, making most of my points above moot. I would have preferred to see this post earlier, but at least we can stop witch hunting.
forgetting which team you're on or supposed to be on TorB??
Nah i think torb means we can lynch a maf cecilia tomorrow too, it doesnt make a difference.
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@ian @Naii
Lynching me is pointless as i am town. Go vote for your next scumread as thats more helpful.
What is this line? what do you mean you're town
is this from your point of view or did we mechanically confirm you and I missed it
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@ian @Naii
Lynching me is pointless as i am town. Go vote for your next scumread as thats more helpful.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_dzjiDP36bBY/TPAzSDoHxSI/AAAAAAAAAFc/w6kxFksWZ-U/s320/copycat.jpg)
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And for the record, I am completely disinterested in lynching mafia Cecilia today. Rather, I would prefer above else to find their most likely accomplices in the hopes that Emma Planck can track Cecilia themselves down next night. So the vote on ian is not because I still find him the primary Cecilia suspect. Similarly, MW not being Cecilia is not a reason not to lynch vote him.
Oh, and then Coffee posts, making most of my points above moot. I would have preferred to see this post earlier, but at least we can stop witch hunting.
forgetting which team you're on or supposed to be on TorB??
Nah i think torb means we can lynch a maf cecilia tomorrow too, it doesnt make a difference.
Right, what w3 said. If Cecilia were mafia, they'd be the least interesting of the 3 to lynch, since they could be tracked down by Emma. Same for any other mafia we know the role of, unless that role was Emma.
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@ian @Naii
Lynching me is pointless as i am town. Go vote for your next scumread as thats more helpful.
What is this line? what do you mean you're town
is this from your point of view or did we mechanically confirm you and I missed it
Fromy my point of view :P its a vote wasted
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@ian @Naii
Lynching me is pointless as i am town. Go vote for your next scumread as thats more helpful.
What is this line? what do you mean you're town
is this from your point of view or did we mechanically confirm you and I missed it
Fromy my point of view :P its a vote wasted
seems legit :sillyspin:
Still catching up, but I'll be here for EOD this time
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@Coffee, your vote is on DC because although he posts, you dont find the content to be useful. You killed dawn because of lack of posts. Yet i dont see you talk about Cal much? unless you did and i forgot about it?
I don’t because it’s universally agreed upon according to cal’s 2nd post that he does this, or so I assumed. I also thought the 3rd maf would be someone in the more townread or talkative category, so my thoughts were either ian (not falling into that category and instead just being my scumread) or kaempfer/rob/moe in that order of towniness. I don’t currently scum read any of those three, though.
But Cal and I are a team, you’re right.
But we don't know a single mafia yet. You can't exclude them from your process of elimination. Quite the contrary if the others are town you'd miss your first and second mafia for our team. ::)
Probably not around for EOD again. At least not fully. I could check form phone to ensure my vote lands on one of the top wagons. Around for around one more hour.
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@Coffee, your vote is on DC because although he posts, you dont find the content to be useful. You killed dawn because of lack of posts. Yet i dont see you talk about Cal much? unless you did and i forgot about it?
I don’t because it’s universally agreed upon according to cal’s 2nd post that he does this, or so I assumed. I also thought the 3rd maf would be someone in the more townread or talkative category, so my thoughts were either ian (not falling into that category and instead just being my scumread) or kaempfer/rob/moe in that order of towniness. I don’t currently scum read any of those three, though.
But Cal and I are a team, you’re right.
But we don't know a single mafia yet. You can't exclude them from your process of elimination. Quite the contrary if the others are town you'd miss your first and second mafia for our team. ::)
Probably not around for EOD again. At least not fully. I could check form phone to ensure my vote lands on one of the top wagons. Around for around one more hour.
I meant the 3rd in my reads, as i already had 1 scum read in dc and was working under the hopes that my vig hit on dawn flipped maf. I can’t rule out that Cal is scum, but he said us pushing him for info won’t get us a response, and as such, we just kinda can’t get anything from him. I dislike that way of playing the game heavily but it’s what he wants I guess
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Without compelling reason I think we should be lynching among ian / www3 / DC / MW today... those not voting there currently what's up? Compel your vote choice into the top candidate strata or explain why you're off-wagon (is anyone townreading ALL of this group of suspects...)?
Why those four candidates? you might ask. They have enough attention to garner more than 1 vote already for a solid period of Day 2 time now thereby having enough content from and/or about them that I think warrants their further attention (ooohhh, again it aligns with where my top scumleans have developed - suspicious?).
MW - you're voting me, please consider the above.
Oa - you're voting naii, please consider the above.
www3 - you're on kdz, please consider the above.
kae - what are you doing on Sub??
Sub - is not currently voting but hasn't logged on for multiple days? (really hope nothing is actually wrong there)
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer
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Okay, I'm caught up with the thread.
Coffee is getting a wtf from me so far. I'm taking back my townlean on you, but I also want to echo moe and torb and give you the benefit of the doubt for now. I really need to think about this harder (it does not compute to me why scum would out themselves at all or why a townie wouldn't have done it earlier).
Regardless, I think what has been said so far about Cecilia could allow us to draw some association reads (I haven't had the time for that and likely will only be able to dig deeper during the night).
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The timing of Coffee's reveal... I wouldn't have managed to hit a more suspicious time even if I tried.
I’m only saying this to be an asshole:
It could have been more suspicious if I waited until tomorrow night, yes?
Depending on role usage, I guess.
Oa - you're voting naii, please consider the above.
Yeah sure. I'm cool with any of those bar w3. Back on iancu for time being. Coffee is shaping up as a valid option as well.
iancudorinmarian (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
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Oa - are you not agreeing with TorB? RE: letting a claimed Cecelia live another night... Coffee has now claimed (w/o counter - LOL someone countering that claim) and we know he cannot finish-a-kill tonight no matter his alignment. So the suggestion, that I tend to concur with at this point, is it could be less urgent to try pushing a coffee lynch today given the current group of options.
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Oa - are you not agreeing with TorB? RE: letting a claimed Cecelia live another night... Coffee has now claimed (w/o counter - LOL someone countering that claim) and we know he cannot finish-a-kill tonight no matter his alignment. So the suggestion, that I tend to concur with at this point, is it could be less urgent to try pushing a coffee lynch today given the current group of options.
I agree, there's no rush, and I'm completely fine with letting him go for now - but then again, this is all about lynching who we think are mafia. And I don't like the way Coffee revealed at all.
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@Coffee, your vote is on DC because although he posts, you dont find the content to be useful. You killed dawn because of lack of posts. Yet i dont see you talk about Cal much? unless you did and i forgot about it?
I don’t because it’s universally agreed upon according to cal’s 2nd post that he does this, or so I assumed. I also thought the 3rd maf would be someone in the more townread or talkative category, so my thoughts were either ian (not falling into that category and instead just being my scumread) or kaempfer/rob/moe in that order of towniness. I don’t currently scum read any of those three, though.
But Cal and I are a team, you’re right.
But we don't know a single mafia yet. You can't exclude them from your process of elimination. Quite the contrary if the others are town you'd miss your first and second mafia for our team. ::)
Probably not around for EOD again. At least not fully. I could check form phone to ensure my vote lands on one of the top wagons. Around for around one more hour.
I meant the 3rd in my reads, as i already had 1 scum read in dc and was working under the hopes that my vig hit on dawn flipped maf. I can’t rule out that Cal is scum, but he said us pushing him for info won’t get us a response, and as such, we just kinda can’t get anything from him. I dislike that way of playing the game heavily but it’s what he wants I guess
I think I see where you're coming from but this was not clear to me from the first statement. After dawn flipping town you are sus / scum reading Cal, correct? You still assume one or more of the more silent group is mafia? Also, you don't just push them for info if you believe they are scum. You want them dead. I'm afraid only voting on the ones who defend themselves won't get you too far.
On a general note, I don't like forming a top wagon on DC at EOD-ish. But can't say I am really opposed to voting DC on principle. This will be hard to coordinate, though, and is more a way to at least get something out of DC if we are to lynch him.
That and I believe there are good enough other candidates on the chopping block for now.
Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
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Oa - are you not agreeing with TorB? RE: letting a claimed Cecelia live another night... Coffee has now claimed (w/o counter - LOL someone countering that claim) and we know he cannot finish-a-kill tonight no matter his alignment. So the suggestion, that I tend to concur with at this point, is it could be less urgent to try pushing a coffee lynch today given the current group of options.
I agree, there's no rush, and I'm completely fine with letting him go for now - but then again, this is all about lynching who we think are mafia. And I don't like the way Coffee revealed at all.
Concur with emphasized. I'm still quite conflicted about whether coffee's shooting is more likely scum or town - so wanting to punt on that for a short bit. You were a bit unsure too until coffee claimed - what parts of it now being claimed has you sliding him toward scummy in your reads?
Eh, while I heavily disagree with the decision on shooting d2d, it does not mean Cecilia is (or should be, for that matter) a dead man walking.
Why would the Linkcat NK throw shade on Cocolia? While we won't know for sure, there probably is one, but then again, it's only a 3/16 chance he would find Link, given Cocolia is town. And even then, I feel like Theresa's generally been considered somewhat... overrated. Especially at this stage. It could prove to be useful lategame, but there are, in my opinion, better roles in the current state of the game. Most likely they killed off Link purely because they know the resource he can turn out to be for town.
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Oa - are you not agreeing with TorB? RE: letting a claimed Cecelia live another night... Coffee has now claimed (w/o counter - LOL someone countering that claim) and we know he cannot finish-a-kill tonight no matter his alignment. So the suggestion, that I tend to concur with at this point, is it could be less urgent to try pushing a coffee lynch today given the current group of options.
I agree, there's no rush, and I'm completely fine with letting him go for now - but then again, this is all about lynching who we think are mafia. And I don't like the way Coffee revealed at all.
Concur with emphasized. I'm still quite conflicted about whether coffee's shooting is more likely scum or town - so wanting to punt on that for a short bit. You were a bit unsure too until coffee claimed - what parts of it now being claimed has you sliding him toward scummy in your reads?
Eh, while I heavily disagree with the decision on shooting d2d, it does not mean Cecilia is (or should be, for that matter) a dead man walking.
Why would the Linkcat NK throw shade on Cocolia? While we won't know for sure, there probably is one, but then again, it's only a 3/16 chance he would find Link, given Cocolia is town. And even then, I feel like Theresa's generally been considered somewhat... overrated. Especially at this stage. It could prove to be useful lategame, but there are, in my opinion, better roles in the current state of the game. Most likely they killed off Link purely because they know the resource he can turn out to be for town.
The claim itself, and the timing of it.
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@Coffee, your vote is on DC because although he posts, you dont find the content to be useful. You killed dawn because of lack of posts. Yet i dont see you talk about Cal much? unless you did and i forgot about it?
I don’t because it’s universally agreed upon according to cal’s 2nd post that he does this, or so I assumed. I also thought the 3rd maf would be someone in the more townread or talkative category, so my thoughts were either ian (not falling into that category and instead just being my scumread) or kaempfer/rob/moe in that order of towniness. I don’t currently scum read any of those three, though.
But Cal and I are a team, you’re right.
But we don't know a single mafia yet. You can't exclude them from your process of elimination. Quite the contrary if the others are town you'd miss your first and second mafia for our team. ::)
Probably not around for EOD again. At least not fully. I could check form phone to ensure my vote lands on one of the top wagons. Around for around one more hour.
I meant the 3rd in my reads, as i already had 1 scum read in dc and was working under the hopes that my vig hit on dawn flipped maf. I can’t rule out that Cal is scum, but he said us pushing him for info won’t get us a response, and as such, we just kinda can’t get anything from him. I dislike that way of playing the game heavily but it’s what he wants I guess
I think I see where you're coming from but this was not clear to me from the first statement. After dawn flipping town you are sus / scum reading Cal, correct? You still assume one or more of the more silent group is mafia? Also, you don't just push them for info if you believe they are scum. You want them dead. I'm afraid only voting on the ones who defend themselves won't get you too far.
On a general note, I don't like forming a top wagon on DC at EOD-ish. But can't say I am really opposed to voting DC on principle. This will be hard to coordinate, though, and is more a way to at least get something out of DC if we are to lynch him.
Yes, what you said about my read on Cal is correct. I have a strong scumread on DC still and ian is also reading to me as scum. As far as the DC bandwagon goes, I think someone reminded me D1 that dc isn’t on at EoD because it’s 5am for them.
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But I'm conflicted on the matter, myself. :-X
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Eh, the hell with it, let Coffee live for now. He's not surviving until lylo anyway.
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
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So you think Coffee might be scum on the timing / claim content... thoughts on how TorB has somewhat quickly come to a position (and I've somewhat echoed it now) of defending coffee for today's lynch on the heels of the claim? Do you think that gives TorB (or... ?myself?) scum-equity for using the timing as a way to maybe try hedging between Cecelia not fully hiding and also not fully outing more quickly when it became a contentious action?? (Or is if you think Coffee is scummy for the claim (timing reasons) he is just getting lucky that town?TorB and myself are willing to publicly advance a narrative to not lynch him for it yet...?)
Is EOD cranking up now/yet??
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
Unless Sub has actually disappeared for a more extended period of time and you tap him the next two nights and he isn't around to out?? Actually, that is a worrisome thought on multiple fronts...
SUB - come back, it's EOD, september hasn't started so we're not waiting for it to end to wake you up either.
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So you think Coffee might be scum on the timing / claim content... thoughts on how TorB has somewhat quickly come to a position (and I've somewhat echoed it now) of defending coffee for today's lynch on the heels of the claim? Do you think that gives TorB (or... ?myself?) scum-equity for using the timing as a way to maybe try hedging between Cecelia not fully hiding and also not fully outing more quickly when it became a contentious action?? (Or is if you think Coffee is scummy for the claim (timing reasons) he is just getting lucky that town?TorB and myself are willing to publicly advance a narrative to not lynch him for it yet...?)
Is EOD cranking up now/yet??
Nah, not really. It's quite an intricate situation, and as you saw yourself, it's only 24 hours since I had a pretty different stance. It all boils down to whether or not you think the claim made sense for a town Cecilia, I guess, and I respect and even appreciate different takes on the situation, so we can work out together how this really works.
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If you consider Coffee scum, analyze whom his likely mafia partners would be, either having Coffee target them or not use ability at all. That is my point of view. I have not really analyzed this part yet, so I cannot give an opinion on preferred targets now. Coffee not having had lynch wagons so far gives me very little to base possible mafia buddies on.
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Oa - are you not agreeing with TorB? RE: letting a claimed Cecelia live another night... Coffee has now claimed (w/o counter - LOL someone countering that claim) and we know he cannot finish-a-kill tonight no matter his alignment. So the suggestion, that I tend to concur with at this point, is it could be less urgent to try pushing a coffee lynch today given the current group of options.
I agree, there's no rush, and I'm completely fine with letting him go for now - but then again, this is all about lynching who we think are mafia. And I don't like the way Coffee revealed at all.
Concur with emphasized. I'm still quite conflicted about whether coffee's shooting is more likely scum or town - so wanting to punt on that for a short bit. You were a bit unsure too until coffee claimed - what parts of it now being claimed has you sliding him toward scummy in your reads?
Eh, while I heavily disagree with the decision on shooting d2d, it does not mean Cecilia is (or should be, for that matter) a dead man walking.
Why would the Linkcat NK throw shade on Cocolia? While we won't know for sure, there probably is one, but then again, it's only a 3/16 chance he would find Link, given Cocolia is town. And even then, I feel like Theresa's generally been considered somewhat... overrated. Especially at this stage. It could prove to be useful lategame, but there are, in my opinion, better roles in the current state of the game. Most likely they killed off Link purely because they know the resource he can turn out to be for town.
The claim itself, and the timing of it.
I'd have prefered the claim to be earlier tbh, but at least Coffee gave us time to discuss it (I'd expect scum to just hardclaim not Cecilia and be done with it)
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
Unless Sub has actually disappeared for a more extended period of time and you tap him the next two nights and he isn't around to out?? Actually, that is a worrisome thought on multiple fronts...
SUB - come back, it's EOD, september hasn't started so we're not waiting for it to end to wake you up either.
wouldn't Sub get modkilled in this case?
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
Unless Sub has actually disappeared for a more extended period of time and you tap him the next two nights and he isn't around to out?? Actually, that is a worrisome thought on multiple fronts...
SUB - come back, it's EOD, september hasn't started so we're not waiting for it to end to wake you up either.
wouldn't Sub get modkilled in this case?
Not in only 2 phases.
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
Unless Sub has actually disappeared for a more extended period of time and you tap him the next two nights and he isn't around to out?? Actually, that is a worrisome thought on multiple fronts...
SUB - come back, it's EOD, september hasn't started so we're not waiting for it to end to wake you up either.
wouldn't Sub get modkilled in this case?
Not in only 2 phases.
D2/N2/D3/N3 ?
that looks like 4 to me
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
oh wait you’re right
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
Unless Sub has actually disappeared for a more extended period of time and you tap him the next two nights and he isn't around to out?? Actually, that is a worrisome thought on multiple fronts...
SUB - come back, it's EOD, september hasn't started so we're not waiting for it to end to wake you up either.
wouldn't Sub get modkilled in this case?
Not in only 2 phases.
D2/N2/D3/N3 ?
that looks like 4 to me
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
oh wait you’re right
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
Unless Sub has actually disappeared for a more extended period of time and you tap him the next two nights and he isn't around to out?? Actually, that is a worrisome thought on multiple fronts...
SUB - come back, it's EOD, september hasn't started so we're not waiting for it to end to wake you up either.
wouldn't Sub get modkilled in this case?
Not in only 2 phases.
D2/N2/D3/N3 ?
that looks like 4 to me
oh wait you’re right
ebwop
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
There’s an option of me not using my ability at all any more. If I do, whoever I hit with it could out it as me going against the town’s CLEAR AND DISTINCTIVE wishes.
Unless Sub has actually disappeared for a more extended period of time and you tap him the next two nights and he isn't around to out?? Actually, that is a worrisome thought on multiple fronts...
SUB - come back, it's EOD, september hasn't started so we're not waiting for it to end to wake you up either.
wouldn't Sub get modkilled in this case?
That's a great point timpa. So worrisome front #1 resolved - Sub is game-handled by rule if he is AWOL. Front #2 is still hoping he's OK.
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I second front #2, it's not like him to go awol like that :(
Will be on phone until 30 min to EOD btw
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Regarding Cecilia talk: should we try to find a consensus on role usage for next night? One that is received as such? Mislynch is sure to leave some people bloodthirsty.
This boils down to, do we trust Coffee not to double-tap in N3? Even if he goes along with our choice in N2?
This boils down to, do we let Coffee investigate someone (we might have agreed upon) without lynching him?
If you consider Coffee scum, analyze whom his likely mafia partners would be, either having Coffee target them or not use ability at all. That is my point of view. I have not really analyzed this part yet, so I cannot give an opinion on preferred targets now. Coffee not having had lynch wagons so far gives me very little to base possible mafia buddies on.
Good idea but fails in practice for N2 bar EOD crazies.
I guess I like to have him around and only act on majority voting or the likes. Naturally, he is on a relatively short leash.
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I hard claim Kallen Kaslana.
I don't expect this to make you want to not lynch me, quite the opposite, actually, but I guess I'll just give you a little bit of info to have into consideration.
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I hard claim Kallen Kaslana.
I don't expect this to make you want to not lynch me, quite the opposite, actually, but I guess I'll just give you a little bit of info to have into consideration.
This should be easy to confirm. There are roles that can check who you targeted, no?
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Actually, Kallen Kaslana has the unique feature of only being able to target two targets other than yourself if you are not mafia, otherwise you are forced to target yourself. Now for the important part of how to verify that.
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Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
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Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?
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For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
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But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...
Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?
And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.
For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
o.O
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For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
Soooo, you're on cool-down tonight? That's unfortunate/convenient/interesting. Presuming that is who you targeted - why those two ?
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I thought TorB would get NK'd and I wanted w3 to die along with him.
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I thought TorB would get NK'd and I wanted w3 to die along with him.
Are you still high-town-reading TorB and scum-reading www3??
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Just throwing something out here, but remember blab chat is allowed. Will EoD shenanigans be easier to sort out in blab?
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Definitely still scum reading w3. TorB is slight scum-lean for me at this point in time, although at that time I TorB was a town read for me.
What changed? I'm not sure.
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Definitely still scum reading w3. TorB is slight scum-lean for me at this point in time, although at that time I TorB was a town read for me.
What changed? I'm not sure.
Who would you target tonight if you were not on cooldown and could use again? (and why)
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
That sounds better, now I'll let someone break ties again :D
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Don't do silly EoD madness again. I purposefully gave you plenty of time to analyze all this.
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I'd probably still target w3 and whoever I think is most likely to get NK'd. If I'd have to choose right now, I'd say Oa.
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
fixed voting totals
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
just kidding. now they are really fixed
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Just throwing something out here, but remember blab chat is allowed. Will EoD shenanigans be easier to sort out in blab?
That's actually a great suggestion if everyone is down, but it might also be harder to sort through later whilst reflecting.
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Quad post here
I thought TorB would get NK'd and I wanted w3 to die along with him.
If I am scumread for misvigging dawn for thinking he was maf, is this not in a similar vein?
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
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Quad post here
I thought TorB would get NK'd and I wanted w3 to die along with him.
If I am scumread for misvigging dawn for thinking he was maf, is this not in a similar vein?
Except town doesn't know if ian would be / was missvigging? Do you ???
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Quad post here
I thought TorB would get NK'd and I wanted w3 to die along with him.
If I am scumread for misvigging dawn for thinking he was maf, is this not in a similar vein?
Except town doesn't know if ian would be / was missvigging? Do you ???
I don't, just as I didn't and town didn't know if I would be misvigging. Right?
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Quad post here
I thought TorB would get NK'd and I wanted w3 to die along with him.
If I am scumread for misvigging dawn for thinking he was maf, is this not in a similar vein?
Except town doesn't know if ian would be / was missvigging? Do you ???
I don't, just as I didn't and town didn't know if I would be misvigging. Right?
You got scum-leans AFTER we knew dawn was a missed vig shot... You're now trying to ask us to go similarly on ian for a not yet known situation - do you know it "should apply" because you know ian's target(s) are town? Seems might be a possible POV slip here coffee......
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Coffee, my ability isn't a sure kill, so it's way less scummy, if at all.
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But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...
Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?
And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.
For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
o.O
I did not receive any notification I can’t vote so this is false
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Quad post here
I thought TorB would get NK'd and I wanted w3 to die along with him.
If I am scumread for misvigging dawn for thinking he was maf, is this not in a similar vein?
Except town doesn't know if ian would be / was missvigging? Do you ???
I don't, just as I didn't and town didn't know if I would be misvigging. Right?
You got scum-leans AFTER we knew dawn was a missed vig shot... You're now trying to ask us to go similarly on ian for a not yet known situation - do you know it "should apply" because you know ian's target(s) are town? Seems might be a possible POV slip here coffee......
No, I'm saying it is a similarly risky move. I didn't know dawn was town until I hit him, and ian here had risked w3 dying if torb was killed also without knowing if he is town or not. The situation is different in that I knew dawn was going to die had my ability gone through, while ian had only made the potential for 2 targets to die had maf hit one of torb or w3. I don't read him too much more scum than I already did because of this claim, it's just the same principle of theoretically killing someone without knowing alignment like I did.
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Wait I mistook the role they’re too similar soz
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But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...
Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?
And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.
For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
o.O
I did not receive any notification I can’t vote so this is false
Wrong Kaslana, w3
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Wait I mistook the role they’re too similar soz
Ninja'd
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Coffee, my ability isn't a sure kill, so it's way less scummy, if at all.
Your ability would force you to use it on yourself and one other target, and you wouldn't be able to target both w3 and TorB as you said you did if you were mafia, so you're either lying or telling the truth, and if you're telling the truth, you're town. Simple as that.
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Ian, will you definitely be targeting me tonight? If so I’ll have to vote you
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bruh, my ability is EoR
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Ian, will you definitely be targeting me tonight? If so I’ll have to vote you
Ian wouldn't target you unless he was town. Also what ian just said
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Ah ok guess I don’t have to hurry in voting ian then q.q I just got back so will read up and see
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I want reiterate a point I made like 3 minutes ago. Unless ian is lying, there is no reason for him to target anyone unless he suspects they are mafia, which was true in the case of w3 into torb. He wouldn't target anyone if he were maf unless he expected to be killed during the night OR if there is a mafia Raiden who could drive the death away. Sky, can I get confirmation or not on this?
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ian - if you're Kallen then what about that role made you state earlier it becomes useful in late game? I'm not sure that makes sense with that role...
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The idea was that I'd be able to keep it secret and potentially take down a mafia with me. Guess that plan's out the window now.
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If Ian’s targets are right, he’s town. But he could be lying for all we know
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Repeating what others said doesn't give you town credibility, w3.
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Sorry, I haven’t really read stuff posted in the last two hours in great detail, was away and just got back :cwy:
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I want reiterate a point I made like 3 minutes ago. Unless ian is lying, there is no reason for him to target anyone unless he suspects they are mafia, which was true in the case of w3 into torb. He wouldn't target anyone if he were maf unless he expected to be killed during the night OR if there is a mafia Raiden who could drive the death away. Sky, can I get confirmation or not on this?
As mentioned in the rules, Phantom Image may allow for otherwise illegal targets. In this case, it will allow for a Herrscher Kallen to target two players other than herself.
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Is nobody else pinged by Coffee shading ian with t he lines about well if coffee is getting heat for misvig on dawn why is ian not getting similar heat for his targets? I just feel there is possibly something there with coffee perspective slip - if coffee scum then ian/www3/TorB get town bump for me due to this (Coffee would know ian targets are "misvigs" and might have slipped a little, maybe)
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What is the current tally / votes???
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Could we use ian's ability to help control Coffee? If this is not a dumb idea I'd be willing to move my vote from him.
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What is the current tally / votes???
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
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Idk why no one wants to lynch kills/naii/cal ): Just kinda feel we will end up lynching a town again
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Idk why no one wants to lynch kills/naii/cal ): Just kinda feel we will end up lynching a town again
I'm game on Naii lynch
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I want reiterate a point I made like 3 minutes ago. Unless ian is lying, there is no reason for him to target anyone unless he suspects they are mafia, which was true in the case of w3 into torb. He wouldn't target anyone if he were maf unless he expected to be killed during the night OR if there is a mafia Raiden who could drive the death away. Sky, can I get confirmation or not on this?
As mentioned in the rules, Phantom Image may allow for otherwise illegal targets. In this case, it will allow for a Herrscher Kallen to target two players other than herself.
With this being said, if ian is a maf Kallan and there's a maf Raiden, ian's ability becomes far more harmful to us, except I would think he would have already done that night 1? Unless town seele was targeted night 0 by Raiden and gained his ability and happened to drive away mafia raiden but I don't know those interactions.
Is nobody else pinged by Coffee shading ian with t he lines about well if coffee is getting heat for misvig on dawn why is ian not getting similar heat for his targets? I just feel there is possibly something there with coffee perspective slip - if coffee scum then ian/www3/TorB get town bump for me due to this (Coffee would know ian targets are "misvigs" and might have slipped a little, maybe)
i was speaking about the possibility of a misvig. w3 or torb (i highly doubt the latter) could certainly be mafia, but it's as likely a misvig as mine.
Could we use ian's ability to help control Coffee? If this is not a dumb idea I'd be willing to move my vote from him.
No, because if I did decide to go around hitting random people again I would get outed by the first person I targeted anyway
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www3 - why are you townreading MW / and seemingly unconcerned that ian claims to have hit you with a possibly deadly ability last night??
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
www will you self-pres onto one of the the other wagons? You're really that sold out on Naii as scum??
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Idk why no one wants to lynch kills/naii/cal ): Just kinda feel we will end up lynching a town again
They have been flying under the radar, true that. Could use more content in general from them, or anything to help make a better read.
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www3 - why are you townreading MW / and seemingly unconcerned that ian claims to have hit you with a possibly deadly ability last night??
Because he failed to kill me. If he was a Mafia, he couldn’t have targetted those two. So either he’s lying or is Town.
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
www will you self-pres onto one of the the other wagons? You're really that sold out on Naii as scum??
I’m not tbh but it bugs me no ones going after nai or cal despite the lack of input and involvement
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Actually, when would a mafia want to use that Kallan ability anyway??!? What am I missing there?
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Actually, when would a mafia want to use that Kallan ability anyway??!? What am I missing there?
Exactly. That’s why if those targets are real, he’s town. But he could be lying
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Coffee why are you off-wagon at this point?
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Actually, when would a mafia want to use that Kallan ability anyway??!? What am I missing there?
Exactly. That’s why if those targets are real, he’s town. But he could be lying
Suppose you could make a situation and set of targets for a scum!Kallan to use, themselves and anyone --- it only clicks if one dies so scum would only be able to set themselves up to get killed, why use??
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Coffee why are you off-wagon at this point?
Because I am still willing to hard push DC if we can flip in the next 7 minutes, but I will flip in 4 if not, most likely to master if someone else will go with me.
Actually, when would a mafia want to use that Kallan ability anyway??!? What am I missing there?
If I as Cecilia hit them once already, or Rozaliya threatens to vig them.
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Remind me again why we're lynching W3 today?
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ugh, ian is not a good lynch because it may be possible to softconfirm him with that role (and I seriously doubt its a fake claim, way too risky)
w3 not being interested in any of his cws makes me tr him
I'm not exactly sold on mw, but it seems likely that he will be of limited use to town and at least gives us some insight on day1 wagonomics
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
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yes, if coffee lives we can force ian to kill someone in addition to coffees kil (and coffee not using your ability after already outing is beyond dumb, as the first half has literally no drawback)
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
Naiis vote on me is the only one i feel sketchy on my wagon. Cal and DC are other good targets imo.
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
So be it. I'd agree that there's not a firm reason to scumread w3 and ian has been limited in his use of ability/our ability to confirm it in the next couple of day night phases.
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RIght now I'm only off DC for a test AND because it feels a bit awkward to hard push to lynch someone who is known AFK for timezone at EOD. >.<
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yes, if coffee lives we can force ian to kill someone in addition to coffees kil (and coffee not using your ability after already outing is beyond dumb, as the first half has literally no drawback)
I would want to HEAVILY discuss this before going through with it.
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iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
coffee missed my vote
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MW lynch before w3 lynch. Fkin hell guys let me vote, keep getting ninjad :P
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
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The time alloted for Day 2 has ended, but will be extended by up to 30 minutes or until 7 minutes have passed since the last vote or vote tally.
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My vote onto DC, trouble getting naltest vote count copied >.<
Any appetite still for DC lynch? I know he is AFK, but last game I went too sfot on my scumreads at EOD's...
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Naii lynch before w3 lynch as well. Can include DC there too
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
If we can push this, I'd love to lynch this today. I forgot there were 30 minute extensions oops
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to follow up that last post, I intended to lynch the least scummy of w3 and MW because I forgot we have time to change this onto DC
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I want to be quite clear that I have sympathy for missing players at EODs, but that shouldn't make someone copmletely off limits. There, my 2 cents on the issue - I mean, ya'll buried shock last EOD so precedent set.
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My vote onto DC, trouble getting naltest vote count copied >.<
Any appetite still for DC lynch? I know he is AFK, but last game I went too sfot on my scumreads at EOD's...
I'm not that confortable jumping on the wagon Coffee pushed so hard. I'm staying on ian for now
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So many of my scumreads are wagons / on the table right now I'm a bit unsure where my vote really wants to land among them........ :o
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I dont like a DC llynch either. Hell, i dont even like a MW lynch :-\
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
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I just realized EoD started after getting caught up gaming, just caught up and extended timer, you wanted different lynches? I can still move my vote to any of my n- or lower n reads.
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I'm down for a lynch between MW or Coffee, so I won't change my vote for now.
I really don't like Coffee's explanation since multiple people agreed with TorB's assessment of roles and it clearly said he should have targeted different people.
Www3 throws inactive names around I feel like, but might be mostly self preservation.
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MW, DC or Naii for me. Coffee's a joker.
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TorB -- vote DC wagon, 6-2-2-2 is not close enough to make anyone sweat. Also, DC more likely scum. :thumbsup:
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MW, DC or Naii for me. Coffee's a joker.
what does this mean
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MW, DC or Naii for me. Coffee's a joker.
what does this mean
Oa peeked you N0 as jester, of course.
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TorB -- vote DC wagon, 6-2-2-2 is not close enough to make anyone sweat. Also, DC more likely scum. :thumbsup:
But no one came to help DC last day? infact it was Link who gave DC a way out
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MW, DC or Naii for me. Coffee's a joker.
what does this mean
Vote wagons I'll consider. I guess I already explained how uncomfortable your reveal made me :P
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
I didn't lynch voted shock last time to save DC, I lynch voted shock to prevent no lynch. So there we go, no issue with me.
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
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Reminder that i still think day1 wagonomics make dc town
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
I didn't lynch voted shock last time to save DC, I lynch voted shock to prevent no lynch. So there we go, no issue with me.
In fact noone voted with intent to save dc
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Reminder that i still think day1 wagonomics make dc town
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
I didn't lynch voted shock last time to save DC, I lynch voted shock to prevent no lynch. So there we go, no issue with me.
In fact noone voted with intent to save dc
I'm not sold on that --- shock as the counter gives SOOOO much leeway for scapegoat as he is sucha volatile player it isn't hard to "build a quick case" on shock or even just stand back and let shock be a lightning rod once one person (Link) opens the gate....
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Unless MW is being tanked by his team here.... SOMEBODY wagon would have taken hold to 'save' MW if he was scum, right? That's my thought in the moment here...
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But the last 2 votes on shock were Link (conftown) and torb. at most you can argue that there was no need to save dc while shock was such a strong deterrent for any other lynch
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Unless MW is being tanked by his team here.... SOMEBODY wagon would have taken hold to 'save' MW if he was scum, right? That's my thought in the moment here...
Unless his team is in DC/Sub/Killsda, yes?
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yh, but who do you want me to cfd now (dc is not an option)?
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Unless MW is being tanked by his team here.... SOMEBODY wagon would have taken hold to 'save' MW if he was scum, right? That's my thought in the moment here...
Unless his team is in DC/Sub/Killsda, yes?
Fair enough, yeah... was just thinking along those lines... or Naii in that group too. Seems tight space for scum team if ithat is remotely accurate. THat is, too many of them on the table to save any of the team? Dunno....
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
juggle? not DC?
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Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Except DC should legit be a wagon here.
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So we still learned nothing from D1 EoD madness, did we?
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Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
i wanted to vote you but none of them supported me ): will you back me?
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I was absent EOD1, so I guess I didn't learn no... what was the life lesson kemosabe?
So we still learned nothing from D1 EoD madness, did we?
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Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
i wanted to vote you but none of them supported me ): will you back me?
Yeah sure, mafias gotta bus mafia or we just fold together.
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Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
ian claimed kallen kaslana and is thus mechanically confirmable eventually and w3 doesnt want his cws lynched which imo means he's town regardless of their alignements, see above why I think dc is town and mw is just the only semiviable wagon fmpov
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Except DC should legit be a wagon here.
FWIW im not sold on DC lynch and will vote on a better counter wagon close to deadline if DC is in threat to getting lynched
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (3) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Will simply go with MW later if no good points are brought up, I think. His play reminds me of geo last game. "Shit, I rolled mafia, how do I look town?" But it's mostly still an n read and nothing serious.
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kae, who is MW"s team? and where are they right now leaving him out to dry as a laeding wagong for a long time this Day?
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Switching to someone else entirely at the last minute is almost always civvy lynch. The chance that you snipe a mafia out of instinct in a moment of time pressure is almost 0%.
I was absent EOD1, so I guess I didn't learn no... what was the life lesson kemosabe? So we still learned nothing from D1 EoD madness, did we?
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Switching to someone else entirely at the last minute is almost always civvy lynch. The chance that you snipe a mafia out of instinct in a moment of time pressure is almost 0%.I was absent EOD1, so I guess I didn't learn no... what was the life lesson kemosabe? So we still learned nothing from D1 EoD madness, did we?
Got it - good thing I'm bouncing between my scumreads then. 8-)
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
This wagon i can sorta get behind
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kae, who is MW"s team? and where are they right now leaving him out to dry as a laeding wagong for a long time this Day?
you and cofee are literally hell bent on saving him???
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Switching to someone else entirely at the last minute is almost always civvy lynch. The chance that you snipe a mafia out of instinct in a moment of time pressure is almost 0%.I was absent EOD1, so I guess I didn't learn no... what was the life lesson kemosabe? So we still learned nothing from D1 EoD madness, did we?
Where did you grab that statistic from?
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kae, who is MW"s team? and where are they right now leaving him out to dry as a laeding wagong for a long time this Day?
you and cofee are literally hell bent on saving him???
I'm hell bent on lynching my foremost scum read, not saving MW. I can lynch him if we go through with it but I would prefer DC
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If a town is lynched in this mess here... I'm shooting into my scumread crowd tonight if I'm vig. :-*
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kae, who is MW"s team? and where are they right now leaving him out to dry as a laeding wagong for a long time this Day?
TBH I dont think there is one, just that all other cws so far looked like they would leave town in worse shape (except current vote)
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kae, who is MW"s team? and where are they right now leaving him out to dry as a laeding wagong for a long time this Day?
fwiw, the position MW is in RN is exactly the position DC was in last day phase. Now you see why kae believes dc is town?
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Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
ian claimed kallen kaslana and is thus mechanically confirmable eventually and w3 doesnt want his cws lynched which imo means he's town regardless of their alignements, see above why I think dc is town and mw is just the only semiviable wagon fmpov
That assumes that ian either gets it correct, and two people die and we get the prompt, which frankly feels unlikely, or we as town have someone confirmed tesla? Did I miss a hardclaim for Tesla or something?
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kae, who is MW"s team? and where are they right now leaving him out to dry as a laeding wagong for a long time this Day?
you and cofee are literally hell bent on saving him???
I'm hell bent on lynching my foremost scum read, not saving MW. I can lynch him if we go through with it but I would prefer DC
LIterally my exact thought Coffee, DC is not a 'save of MW' for me in any stretch of imagination land. He is my scumread and push. I have a scumread on MW right now too FYI, however his wagon flying up gave me pause. :thumbsup:
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If a town is lynched in this mess here... I'm shooting into my scumread crowd tonight if I'm vig. :-*
Is that a soft? because if w3 (who you scumread, yes?) is maf and was seele who got ian's ability, you're in for a world of ow
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not exactly - I still think MW is slightly higher equity to be scum than not, but much lower than DC's equity.
kae, who is MW"s team? and where are they right now leaving him out to dry as a laeding wagong for a long time this Day?
fwiw, the position MW is in RN is exactly the position DC was in last day phase. Now you see why kae believes dc is town?
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Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
ian claimed kallen kaslana and is thus mechanically confirmable eventually and w3 doesnt want his cws lynched which imo means he's town regardless of their alignements, see above why I think dc is town and mw is just the only semiviable wagon fmpov
That assumes that ian either gets it correct, and two people die and we get the prompt, which frankly feels unlikely, or we as town have someone confirmed tesla? Did I miss a hardclaim for Tesla or something?
scumkallen has to target self, so would be forced to kermit suicide with this plan
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ANYONE tying the vote into NL should get vigged too. M:mmmmmmm, need more vig action.
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ANYONE tying the vote into NL should get vigged too. M:mmmmmmm, need more vig action.
flip with me to mw
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Hmmmmm, MW might be scum here --- he isn't exactly being saved but he isn't being smashed either like shock was??
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MW vote - no NL no ties!
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Day 2 has ended.
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Night 2 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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mw vote too
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aw yikes
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MW vote - no NL no ties!
you literally caused a NL rob.
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sky, if that rob post was him voting mw, it was before the 30 min deadline and counts right?
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Wait warmly, I'm unsure how this works out. I clearly stated intent to vote only if -not- NL. When did Naii get to 4-3 lead???
//waits warmly and agitatedly
MW vote - no NL no ties!
you literally caused a NL rob.
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iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
This wagon i can sorta get behind
Here, rob.
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Wait warmly, I'm unsure how this works out. I clearly stated intent to vote only if -not- NL. When did Naii get to 4-3 lead???
I don't normally allow conditional votes, but your intent was clear.
So in this case, I will allow you to clarify: Do you want to vote?
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MW vote - no NL no ties!
you literally caused a NL rob.
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/028/961/cover6.jpg)
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Day 2 has ended.
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Night 2 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
"Final vote tally" even sky got ninjaed :sillyspin:
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Wait warmly, I'm unsure how this works out. I clearly stated intent to vote only if -not- NL. When did Naii get to 4-3 lead???
I don't normally allow conditional votes, but your intent was clear.
So in this case, I will allow you to clarify: Do you want to vote?
Heck no. NO VOTE. If it causes a tie I abstain from changing my vote. Please. Thank you.
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rob right now
(https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/uje_e1CMQYtsn3CJ7cO671CwRfE=/0x0:1200x675/1200x0/filters:focal(0x0:1200x675)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/10838143/monkas.png)
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Day 2 has ended. Again.
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Night 2 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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As a good citizen, I shall post this very important chat log.
[00:33:32] ‹Naii_the_Baf› Aw, I couldn't actually log in for EoD. Now I'm dead :(
[00:36:02] ‹worldwideweb3› ): you spent valuable seconds rolling the dice instead :cwy:
[00:36:16] ‹TheonlyrealBeef› :awesome:
[00:37:13] ‹iancudorinmarian› RIP Naii. Roll in peace
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How do you log for chat when you can't log in the forums? ?_?
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Night 2
Naii_the_Baf was lynched. He was Rozaliya Olenyeva.
Night 2 has ended.
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Maybe you guys will believe my statistics now.
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Maybe we should have lynched DC.
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atleast it was a vig :-[
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Also now who's going to throw blades into my POE with Naii dead??
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darn if naii had a honkai core my desperation vote out of lack of other options would have outted the entire scumteam :'( now I'm left assuming they are all town and all want town dc sorta dead too.
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So what's the plan for my ability tonight? I would prefer not to use it at all, considering if we wanted me to use it both tonight and tomorrow night a mafia raiden could bus me onto my first target if we out both targets. I would rather not target anyone tonight to circumvent this.
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If MW is scum then that was a very half-hearted save attempt that barely nipped Naii instead of MW. I suppose his team might have been absent (Sub, moe, DC, ?Cal?) or already busing MW (Cal/DC/moe) or both?? If MW is town though, then that looks to open up the possibilities for his possible team since they could have faked onto either "town" wagon or stayed off, or been on Naii trying to save MW, etc. you get the picture.
Final vote count:
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Time to do other stuff now for a bit...
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So what's the plan for my ability tonight? I would prefer not to use it at all, considering if we wanted me to use it both tonight and tomorrow night a mafia raiden could bus me onto my first target if we out both targets. I would rather not target anyone tonight to circumvent this.
I could make a suggestion but it would give scum clues how to stop it... But my idea has two parts and they're both contained within your thinking-out-loud ideas there. ;)
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I mean, thats kinda exactly what we need to happen in order to confirm ian in the first place though (and raiden interference would confirm the raidenrole to be in hands ofscum anyway). Why are you suddenly so opposed to using your ability adter you barely gave d2d a chance before?
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Also noone is forcing you to tell your next target beforehand
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I mean, thats kinda exactly what we need to happen in order to confirm ian in the first place though (and raiden interference would confirm the raidenrole to be in hands ofscum anyway). Why are you suddenly so opposed to using your ability adter you barely gave d2d a chance before?
Because I misvigged d2d and I am concerned I will misvig again. If I don’t follow a rest-of-town approved target, I could just be shooting wild like with D2D. I don’t want to repeat a mistake. How would we confirm ian without having 2 people die? is it worth it to confirm him as a clear with two other people dying? what if I or he dies or gets lynched before then, or the mafia interfere with roleblocking ian and making him look scum? I see many flaws here.
So you’re saying that I should hit a random and not tell anybody, and ask the person I hit not to out that I hit them.
Also noone is forcing you to tell your next target beforehand
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Also noone is forcing you to tell your next target beforehand
So you’re saying that I should hit a random and not tell anybody, and ask the person I hit not to out that I hit them.
ebwop
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Just ignore a potential Raiden Mei and let Emma track down Raiden Mei. If Raiden interferes, a mafia is now exposed. If Raiden is town, a semi-doc is now known to Emma. Unless someone knows of a role that is almost certainly mafia for Emma to target?
Durandal gets to use ability again, really hoping that has more luck than the lynches so far.
For Cecilia and Kallen I would prefer no ability usage, possibly with Frederica keeping an eye on them to ensure no abilities or Honkai Cores are used.
I really hope Sub isn't scum Bronya pretending to be inactive.
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Durandal, you are our only hope :cwy:
Also, when should we consider a mass role claim? is there any benefits to it?
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Durandal, you are our only hope :cwy:
Also, when should we consider a mass role claim? is there any benefits to it?
We should ideally wait until we lynch or vighit 1 mafia, such that there are 2 left. At that point, we can ask for ability usage or information gathered and either look for ccs if mafia lies about their roles or analyze/fact check the interactions between roles and people.
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Wow, missed EoD and that was a lot to catch up on.
First off. Yall had missed this whole post? cuz you guys never moved my vote off rob. @kae, when you do kaevision, please fix it to me voting on coffee.
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.
Read List
V
PlayerOa: Willing to bet duran woulda left some sorta hint after Oa was investigated if he was Maf.
N+
TORB: Laid the gameplan out early on. Engaged and very towny. I still believe that as knowledgeable he is about everything, that could be due to having another pad to discuss this. Only reason hes not in V.
Kaempf: Open about being targetted. Helpful and acts pretty normal.
KDZ: Honestly seems kinda confused, going with the flow. Maybe under the radar a bit but is seeming pretty normal.
N
Everyone not listed: Seem normal
N-
Moe: Has really been rubbing me the wrong way all game. Only a very slight scum read that a bit superstititous but still, gut feeling for now.
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK but i didnt want to list him in the everyone else catagory.
Cal, Naii: Inactivity is scummy at this point in the game. Cal literally has less posts than shock, the first kill.
Sub: Suspiciously confused. Maybe im remembering too much from early early game but man, really unlike you.
N--
Coffee: REALLY dont like the promise to protect then failing to do so. Almost feels like you said you would so that he didnt get targeted by anything else as to not disrupt the kill. Like roleswapping or not, thats kinda scummy thing to do. Also, id like to point out him telling info roles to not reveal anything. There are only 3 mafia this game. A mafia kill now would set us FAR ahead. Info roles could be killed off before sharing as we are already 3 town down.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
Secondly, i town lean ian much more now. His timing is odd sure but it also isnt. I think EoD is the best time to role claim. Most people are active and youll get most discussion.
Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
ian claimed kallen kaslana and is thus mechanically confirmable eventually and w3 doesnt want his cws lynched which imo means he's town regardless of their alignements, see above why I think dc is town and mw is just the only semiviable wagon fmpov
^this right here and no rebuttal to it means we have 0 info. No one has anything to go off of besides 2(?) role claims. So, why wouldnt you guys info lynch? Ya aint gonna get any info off lynching me, i havent breadcrumbed. Why not lynch someone who has the potential to give off some info, at least in the smallest amount, so we have something to base our next day off? idk who would be the best lynch for that but i dont think its me or really Naii.
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Why would you even Town lean ian just because he said what his role is?
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Why would you even Town lean ian just because he said what his role is?
Issa confirm-able role that could be used very very wrongly. Also, while i dont agree on his torb scum read, i dont blame him for picking you and torb. You always die first and he just picked his biggest read (torb i guess) as the other person to die.
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MW-- i looked briefly and didn't see it really apparent... Where is ian scumreading TorB?? I think you night be misunderstanding how Kallan role works, you would typically as town target a scumread you'd like to die with a townread you think might\likely die to get +town EV in the result where the townie is nk. At least that's how I see it being a role use for town favor (still confused by how that role can benefit scum... Much better as a town role in terms of power)
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MW-- i looked briefly and didn't see it really apparent... Where is ian scumreading TorB??
Definitely still scum reading w3. TorB is slight scum-lean for me at this point in time, although at that time I TorB was a town read for me.
What changed? I'm not sure.
Right there, rob. It feels like omgus to me, I explained from the very start that my idea behind voting ian early was to prevent him getting EoD blitzed, giving him some time for explanations and stuff.
Wow, missed EoD and that was a lot to catch up on.
First off. Yall had missed this whole post? cuz you guys never moved my vote off rob. @kae, when you do kaevision, please fix it to me voting on coffee.
It seems Cal missed your vote, moehrpi continued from Cal's vote count, Coffee went with a much older vote count alltogether and I then "corrected" it to moehrpi's vote count that included Coffee's vote, but not yours.
After that it was lost in the void.
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If Ian’s targets are right, he’s town. But he could be lying for all we know
No, because he could be mafia and know they are both town? This makes sense if he sees the possibility of someone vigging w3.
Edit: Right, this needs Raiden to work...
Could we use ian's ability to help control Coffee? If this is not a dumb idea I'd be willing to move my vote from him.
Sure, let mafia know ian is going to use his ability on Coffee and his next target.
yes, if coffee lives we can force ian to kill someone in addition to coffees kil (and coffee not using your ability after already outing is beyond dumb, as the first half has literally no drawback)
If he is scum it has.
Unless MW is being tanked by his team here.... SOMEBODY wagon would have taken hold to 'save' MW if he was scum, right? That's my thought in the moment here...
Unless his team is in DC/Sub/Killsda, yes?
I might eventually change my vote D3.
So we still learned nothing from D1 EoD madness, did we?
This time rob is around.
Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
ian claimed kallen kaslana and is thus mechanically confirmable eventually and w3 doesnt want his cws lynched which imo means he's town regardless of their alignements, see above why I think dc is town and mw is just the only semiviable wagon fmpov
What is cw again? >.<
MW vote - no NL no ties!
Did you fucking vote into a tie three seconds before deadline?
ANYONE tying the vote into NL should get vigged too. M:mmmmmmm, need more vig action.
...
Wait warmly, I'm unsure how this works out. I clearly stated intent to vote only if -not- NL. When did Naii get to 4-3 lead???
I don't normally allow conditional votes, but your intent was clear.
So in this case, I will allow you to clarify: Do you want to vote?
How is this even a consideration? smh
Just ignore a potential Raiden Mei and let Emma track down Raiden Mei. If Raiden interferes, a mafia is now exposed. If Raiden is town, a semi-doc is now known to Emma. Unless someone knows of a role that is almost certainly mafia for Emma to target?
Durandal gets to use ability again, really hoping that has more luck than the lynches so far.
For Cecilia and Kallen I would prefer no ability usage, possibly with Frederica keeping an eye on them to ensure no abilities or Honkai Cores are used.
I really hope Sub isn't scum Bronya pretending to be inactive.
Actually, I am not too opposed to let Coffee target common scumreads once.
Scum Bronya is a nuisance but I don't see it as that big of a deal. Especially since town Sub would claim Bronya prior to voting.
Durandal, you are our only hope :cwy:
Someone's boosting their ego again?
Why would you even Town lean ian just because he said what his role is?
Issa confirm-able role that could be used very very wrongly. Also, while i dont agree on his torb scum read, i dont blame him for picking you and torb. You always die first and he just picked his biggest read (torb i guess) as the other person to die.
I believe you confused his to reads.
MW-- i looked briefly and didn't see it really apparent... Where is ian scumreading TorB?? I think you night be misunderstanding how Kallan role works, you would typically as town target a scumread you'd like to die with a townread you think might\likely die to get +town EV in the result where the townie is nk. At least that's how I see it being a role use for town favor (still confused by how that role can benefit scum... Much better as a town role in terms of power)
Targeting two scumreads might be even better. You are quite sure to be mistaken at least once. If both are commonly scumread it is a bit trickier. At early stages it probably won't attract a NK but at later stages the pool gets narrower and vig roles might sense their time and take action.
The wrong vote count is partially on me. Sorry, folks. :/
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Ugh, Sub inactive is really annoying. His opportunistic vote on w3 is really bothering me. I have theories where they are an attempt to form a serious counter-wagon to save at least one mafia buddy (MW or DC), but they are all moot until one of them flips scum. Because I think the three way tie on MW/DC/w3 was one of the more interesting moments to analyze lynch wagon movements. Early vote on ian D2 was also partially to poke around Link's theory of an ian/DC team, but at the moment I am more inclined towards an MW/Sub team. Both Sub and MW seem to have been fishing for info roles in their own way. And this?
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK
This part holds just as true -or even more so- for Sub, from my point of view. Of course, that would not be convenient to mention of a mafia buddy.
The third member might be DC or deep town.
But shading people that aren't even around to defend themselves, blegh. Just wanted to throw my motivations and thoughts out there in the not unlikely case I get NK-ed.
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Quick reads: rob and coffe pretty much have to be town for a last minute attempt to save naii (because bussing doesnt make sense in that position and lynching town!mw doesnt exactly improve their reputation while naiis alignement would remain unknown). i still hate almost everything rob writes ofc and I'll have another look into cecilia debacle... eventually. Other than MW being much in the same position DC was, noone caring who he was actually voting makes me tr mw even more (vote was nothing personal, just all other wagons were likely town imo as well).
Sigh, editing lynchlog will be a nightmare. Let's be honest, at most I will make an unedited version of what most of us thought were the votecounts and given I'm not very satisfied with just that, I'll probably just finish both tomorrow.
Imo all the wagons we ever had were pretty bad and most wagonmovement was probably intitiated by town only to move to another town in the end.
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^woes off having 5/6th of the players town; no matter where you look you still hit another town most of the time
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So now can we kill killsda like I’ve been saying?
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So now can we kill killsda like I’ve been saying?
That seems a little harsh there doesn't it? Even after all I've done to banter with you. I'm hurt w3 :c
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So now can we kill killsda like I’ve been saying?
That seems a little harsh there doesn't it? Even after all I've done to banter with you. I'm hurt w3 :c
Ok I take my words back please don’t kill me tonight senpai
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
So you admit lacking the self control to not shoot www3 with the NK, eh?
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
So you admit lacking the self control to not shoot www3 with the NK, eh?
Are you trying to get a read off of that line?
This seems more a judge of character than gameplay
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
So you admit lacking the self control to not shoot www3 with the NK, eh?
Are you trying to get a read off of that line?
This seems more a judge of character than gameplay
\quietly sips a cup of coffee
The character thing, but in a gameplay way.
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-yjoDAmReCuI/W-DMw1MdVhI/AAAAAAAACUE/uRijhtex4GovsR03PZMB6xNc9DaMkcVYwCLcBGAs/s200/nudge-nudge-monty-python-105.jpg)
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
So you admit lacking the self control to not shoot www3 with the NK, eh?
Are you trying to get a read off of that line?
This seems more a judge of character than gameplay
\quietly sips a cup of coffee
The character thing, but in a gameplay way.
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-yjoDAmReCuI/W-DMw1MdVhI/AAAAAAAACUE/uRijhtex4GovsR03PZMB6xNc9DaMkcVYwCLcBGAs/s200/nudge-nudge-monty-python-105.jpg)
i don’t get it :)
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
So you admit lacking the self control to not shoot www3 with the NK, eh?
True facts. I just can't contain myself. Too juicy a target you know? Anyway lets get back to the titanpad rob, no reason to flesh out our NK here you know.
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
So you admit lacking the self control to not shoot www3 with the NK, eh?
True facts. I just can't contain myself. Too juicy a target you know? Anyway lets get back to the titanpad rob, no reason to flesh out our NK here you know.
I'm waiting for DC to resend me the link, I accidentally deleted the message. |shrug|
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Oh I got you, its www.titanpad.com/oursecretmafiapadhowspookyamiright
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This post made me realize titanpad died :C Sad boy hours
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Alright kdz, you're ok breadposting and you're around -- any plans to read up and get actively engaged and taper off the lurking? My amigo, www3 thinks you're scum who do you think is scum? (You know besides you me DC)
8-)
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I have read up, there is just nothing worth saying. EoD madness happened and people killed a town. It happens like every time. I can give an updated read list, but I'd rather see how this night phase pans out first.
www3 might think I'm scum, but I can't imagine why. Hasn't really stated a reason, so I'm guessing theyre just trying to feel out the room for a Sin kill. I don't really care one way or another about www3 in the context of the game though, I don't really care about killing them, but then again I dont think I could be bothered to defend them either.
I thought a member of the scum team hid inside Ian/Naii/Cali/d2d, but two are dead, another can be mechanically confirmed, and my stance on cali has shifted somewhat. Still sus of them a slight amount, but that was primarily due to inactivity.
I further had my reservations about sub, but he is MIA. OOG I really do hope all is well here, a sentiment I'm sure all share.
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What do you think about MW wiggling of the hook and DC bring a wagon that couldn't get real traction at EOD??
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I think MW is getting a bad deal so to speak. Again, not a defense, I think people (mafia) see an easy target and are latching on. Its a free kill at some point, which puts MW in an interesting position of relative immunity from the NK. They'll probably get mislynched at EoD sometime soon though.
I don't think people are willing to ride on DC any more. This could be similar to the Timpa situation from last game, which is the only reason I am so hesitant to defend, but I haven't rang the alarm bells at DC yet. DC also exists in a similar position as MW, relatively immune to NKs. I just dont see a compelling reason to execute DC.
But again, I'll wait until tonight pans out to formulate my specific thoughts :) I'm toying with some ideas but I'd rather not spoil it.
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kdz - lay your best WIFOM reasons for why you were on at EOD 2 but had basically complete apathy about who got lynched between mw\naii and ian\dc\www3?? You seem to have leaned toward a scum lean on ian\cal\naii mid day then got online 40m before deadline (really 1h 10m with extension) and did basically nothing. Once Ian train died shouldn't you have wanted to push naii as you had?have a sort of town read on MW and scumlean on naii?? Or advocate for ian lynch as he was a scumread of yours too and is where you parked your vote through all the EOD?
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Just got back home, why are we voting down MW?
I actually got on at about 20 minute after eod, and 10 until with deadlines, then I had to catch up on 5 hours of posts, about 15 pages or so. No time to convince a wagon swap back, and just barely enough time catch up, much less process it all. No reason to make an uninformed vote, but in order to make sure everyone was voting to stop breya I left my vote in place.
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You're right, I don't know how read a 24hr clock or something.
Clears that piece up some for me. Still struggling to shake this somewhat new feeling of "wtf is kdz doing I remember almost nothing of him this game unless I'm actively reading his ISO" ... Your on my watch list I guess - do something awesome again like last game when you red checked someone. 8-)
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Patience rob, Rome wasn't built in a day. It might take a night.
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Would that I could w3. Would that I could.
So you admit lacking the self control to not shoot www3 with the NK, eh?
True facts. I just can't contain myself. Too juicy a target you know? Anyway lets get back to the titanpad rob, no reason to flesh out our NK here you know.
I'm waiting for DC to resend me the link, I accidentally deleted the message. |shrug|
It's in the same PM as my Phase 2 decks I'm using against you
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I wonder if Naii was ever intended by the mafia as a lynch...
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What's more likely to me is that we were completely off track, and mafia just sat back and watched the shit show without any danger...
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What's more likely to me is that we were completely off track, and mafia just sat back and watched the shit show without any danger...
They certainly did, on both days...
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That, or mafia was not on around EoD for different reasons.
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Cecilia+Kallan:
I decided that there isnt that big a rush to confirm ian, so he should use his ability on 2 people other than himself tonight. and get confirmed n4 at the earliest I guess (unless someone actually does die to it). This way he doesnt have to holster and has a small chance to confirm himself without outside help (obv he has to choose targets in secret, otherwise mafia just nks someone else).
Cecilia should definitely target someone to confirm/deny coffee. If raiden really wants to kill someone that was previously targeted, we have confirmed mafia interference.
Coffee, if you dont want to take responsibility for the likely missvig (remember you dont even have to finish them off), you can hold an unofficial lynchvote. Just make the deadline for it before nightdeadline, otherwise you cant submit it.
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If ian used his ability N1, it will now be on cooldown. Kallen is EoR.
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Since ian claimed using ability on w3 and myself N1, your plan is simply not possible. This does open up the opportunity to confirm as early as N3 if you go for Cecilia vig. Not sure I like it, since if not at least 1 mafia gets killed by it, we'll be one day closer to lylo. That's not even counting Field of Blades, Core of Death or Flash Counter and such. Killing two town to confirm one is never worth it, so you need to somehow make sure at least one mafia is among the targets.
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Actually killing 2 town to make a town unlynchable is worth it so long as there are more than 3times as many villagers as scum, which is still the case (for simplicity if we scale it up and let the mod kill 2 random town for a modconfirmed town we would be left with 3 clear town, 1 unclear town and 3 scum, so so long as noone misslynches the unclear town the game is solved). Combine that with the fact that town vigs dont always miss and its worth going for.
Ian did you use your ability n1 or n0? I always get confused between those 2 myself, so i had assumed you used your ability asap.
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Not to mention the value when we can deny ians claim (by this I mean he cant use the ability on 2 people other than himself)
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But mafia would just NK the confirmed town, which does not sound better than a random lynch + NK, along with an additional night for information roles. Guess I'll just leave it at not worth it from my point of view.
Denying the claim is much harder, especially if there really is a Raiden Mei messing around with the plan, or Coffee gets NK-ed.
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And if Raiden Mei is town, but one of Coffee or ian is mafia, I'd totally blame everything on Raiden.
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And if Raiden Mei is town, but one of Coffee or ian is mafia, I'd totally blame everything on Raiden.
ebwop: as ian/Coffee being mafia.
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Actually, as long as the target dies you can prove there was no Raiden interference, OR that Coffee and Raiden are mafiabuddies OR that ian is the lying scum. If the target does not die, it proves nothing for ian, Coffee wil either be dead or blame Raiden.
As long as we trust Coffee, we get a long way to confirming ian or finding mafia Raiden. But afaik that is kind of an issue right now, so not something you can count on consensus for.
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to be honest, i could not follow these last few posts about what the pan for tonight is. i have no guidance on what to doand would love input on if i should use my ability tonight and also if i should out that target or not.
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def use it; if you're gonna decide yourself anyway dont telegraph it beforehand, if you want to target a consensus target... well its kinda late for that, but say so asap
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I would not trust being targeted and expect the same of any other target. If they are town leans from my point of view, I will support them in lynching Coffee in order to save another town becoming victim.
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Idk why no one wants to lynch kills/naii/cal ): Just kinda feel we will end up lynching a town again
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/031/213/ironic.jpg)
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I would not trust being targeted and expect the same of any other target. If they are town leans from my point of view, I will support them in lynching Coffee in order to save another town becoming victim.
then tell me who you suggest instead of claiming i’m maf if i hit the townreads you haven’t posted in a while please
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i do want a consensus and I would say it’s not too late as we have over 8 hours until end of day, yes?
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Actually killing 2 town to make a town unlynchable is worth it so long as there are more than 3times as many villagers as scum, which is still the case (for simplicity if we scale it up and let the mod kill 2 random town for a modconfirmed town we would be left with 3 clear town, 1 unclear town and 3 scum, so so long as noone misslynches the unclear town the game is solved). Combine that with the fact that town vigs dont always miss and its worth going for.
Ian did you use your ability n1 or n0? I always get confused between those 2 myself, so i had assumed you used your ability asap.
N1. There was no NK on N0.
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I would not trust being targeted and expect the same of any other target. If they are town leans from my point of view, I will support them in lynching Coffee in order to save another town becoming victim.
then tell me who you suggest instead of claiming i’m maf if i hit the townreads you haven’t posted in a while please
Hmmm... if something happened to Sub irl he'd get modkilled, making him a bad target. I suppose it's mostly Oa, Durandal and myself that I would mind you targeting, but you probably don't know who Durandal is :sillyspin:
MasterWalks, DoubleCapitals and Calindu come to mind as a top3.
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I don’t recommend targeting anyone right now. If coffee is maf, he can lynch that person later on, when we think we have another day and we won’t. I would wait until we have found some decent scum reads
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I don’t recommend targeting anyone right now. If coffee is maf, he can lynch that person later on, when we think we have another day and we won’t. I would wait until we have found some decent scum reads
YOU don't have any "decent scum reads"... speak for yourself on that mate. Ian if you're town I'd say you should be thinking about targeting yourself and a scum read if you think you might get popped that night OR a high scum read and town read that you think might get popped that night if you feel safe... IF you really think you need to be targeting at all, that is.
Also, ian claim still making sense as town moves\targets for him if true. Of course he could be lying, but in that case I'll say that his lies make sense too for falling town (sometimes a scum's lies seem off or weird for a town to do\claim, and I don't get that sense here with ian).
Coffee (no offense eh) I don't think has the personality that shoots a town!dawn right out of the gate like that if he is scum... I can see town coffee arriving at the conclusion that it COULD have +EV for town since a town coffee wouldn't know if he's going to get heat (town dawn) or lock status (scum dawn) before the flip.
At this point I'm believing ian and coffee claims and leaning town on them.
I'm also fairly unconvinced by kdz defense and activity\interaction yesterday... Scum lean for me there. Would consider possibly voting there tomorrow. Or DC. Or MW. Outside shoot I might be ok voting on even Cal or moe (!gasp!).
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If you have any decent scum reads, feel free to share. We’ve lost 4 towns so far, 5 after the night most likely. Our “scum reads†clearly haven’t been successful so far, and I do not want to put a kill in coffees hands at this stage, on a person that we are not sure if mafia or not.
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Also also-- no specifics should be given or discussed but I suggest doc aims about high town reads Oa \ TorB \ ?ian?coffee? (If you're believing the claim(s) that is)
And investigative roles I suggest aim into the POE among DC \ MW \ Cal \ www3 \ ?moe? \ ?ian?coffee? (claim disbelief dependent).
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Based on my sense of ian I feel like he won't be even considered by mafia for NK though?
Considering:
1) He hardclaimed a not-investigative role
and
2) He's been constantly on the ropes too by people, so he's either mafia's probable mislynch or scum himself
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www3-
DC and MW I still scumread... And recently a lean on kdz. Moe I think has plenty of scum equity. I'd put you into the Poe pile too (and just did).
Keep in mind if coffee is scum I expect he'll pick a TOWN out if the suggested pile as putting a tick on a teammate would be awfully close to a scum coffee ability later on being redirected onto same mate and killing the teammate. If he's town then he picks on his own choice from the pile and it is less likely scum know who he picks for any mafia sided redirects to hurt later.
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I don't understand why ian claiming makes him towny, wouldn't anyone claim in his position?
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Based on my sense of ian I feel like he won't be even considered by mafia for NK though?
Considering:
1) He hardclaimed a not-investigative role
and
2) He's been constantly on the ropes too by people, so he's either mafia's probable mislynch or scum himself
so doc-dc isn't targeting ian tonight, got it ;) this all becomes a big moot point if doc is scum or out of game. Or if we don't have town cop (we KNOW Durandal is in game at least).
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I don't understand why ian claiming makes him towny, wouldn't anyone claim in his position?
the simple "Ian claimed" is not the end of it... You're oversimplifying the situation as I see it. Having trouble letting go of a viable mislynch target are we? (That is, I still think you have high chance of being scum and in connection with my current town lean on ian your angle feels a bit grasping on the subject)
I find on the whole of the claim and subsequent ian statements about it that I believe he is now likely town than scum at this point.
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I don't understand why ian claiming makes him towny, wouldn't anyone claim in his position?
the simple "Ian claimed" is not the end of it... You're oversimplifying the situation as I see it. Having trouble letting go of a viable mislynch target are we? (That is, I still think you have high chance of being scum and in connection with my current town lean on ian your angle feels a bit grasping on the subject)
I find on the whole of the claim and subsequent ian statements about it that I believe he is now likely town than scum at this point.
What other reason you have for town reading him
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I have a town lean on ian based on the circumstances surrounding his claim such as choice of targets, timing of targeting, and good sections about the reaction to his claim. I have posted all (or at least most?) of my thoughts on what you're asking about already.
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EBWOP good sections >> his reactions (autocorrect typo)
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Honestly, y'alls taunts make me feel a lot of NotLikeThis and maybe it's just that I'm panicky irl and have trust issues and the like, but I know this is a game and I'll try to put my fears aside and not take this personally. Since we're here though, don't ever feel bad about lynching me when I'm not here alright? (@kdz, I think he said that?)
My fault probably for not reading back too hard because the whole claim thing happened at EoD, but the vibe I get from ian last EoD on ISO really is pretty much NAI. Since I'm one of the wagons D1/2 I'll always have a bit more perspective since I can see my role, so my guesses still lie in Coffee/MW/(deep). And even if you don't believe me I still think you're more likely the one being led on rather than Coffee in the pair that's adamant in lynching me. I'll say that if MW flips town it's more likely ian might be scum (though I acknowledge that it's also more likely I'm scum too but /shrug).
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Cecilia+Kallan:
I decided that there isnt that big a rush to confirm ian, so he should use his ability on 2 people other than himself tonight. and get confirmed n4 at the earliest I guess (unless someone actually does die to it). This way he doesnt have to holster and has a small chance to confirm himself without outside help (obv he has to choose targets in secret, otherwise mafia just nks someone else).
Cecilia should definitely target someone to confirm/deny coffee. If raiden really wants to kill someone that was previously targeted, we have confirmed mafia interference.
Coffee, if you dont want to take responsibility for the likely missvig (remember you dont even have to finish them off), you can hold an unofficial lynchvote. Just make the deadline for it before nightdeadline, otherwise you cant submit it.
I don't see any reason to not confirm ian if he uses his ability tonight. Scum know his alignment.
We don't need to confirm Coffee's role. If he should use it is entirely dependent on other considerations.
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Last time I'm saying this: My ability is EoR. I used it N1, not N0.
Also, @DC, I don't see how MW flipping town would have any relevance to my own alignment.
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Last time I'm saying this: My ability is EoR. I used it N1, not N0.
Also, @DC, I don't see how MW flipping town would have any relevance to my own alignment.
If MW is town there’s a 3/X chance of you being mafia, if he flips mafia, there’s only a 2/X chance :silly:
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If you have any decent scum reads, feel free to share. We’ve lost 4 towns so far, 5 after the night most likely. Our “scum reads†clearly haven’t been successful so far, and I do not want to put a kill in coffees hands at this stage, on a person that we are not sure if mafia or not.
I sort of agree for a roundabout reason: I don't want to put the capacity for a redirect off of an agreed Cecilia target into a mafia!raiden's hands if it does exist. In that same vein, like I mentioned earlier but we all missed because it was EoD madness, sky has pretty much confirmed that if a maf!Kallan exists (as ian) and raiden drives away from him the night we want to 'mechanically confirm' ian as town, it would show as ian not targetting himself and thus appear he is town. I'm still not sure what we all want to do, in this case. I think it would be better not to try and use both ian and I's abilities for some roundabout confirming stuff because there's too much potential for things to head south (worst case scenario is losing 2 town and not confirming anything other than possibly maf!raiden or ian town kind of).
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Didn't had time to post reads earlier, but here they are
Only weird move I saw here was him moving his vote from ian to w3, right after ian's targets were revealed
But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...
Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?
And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.
For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
o.O
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
That sounds better, now I'll let someone break ties again :D
still looks pretty minor to me, so I won't change my classification
I see no reason to change Oa's read. He is as close as mechanicaly confirmed as we have
The update is mostly due to mulling over his claim a bit. On one hand there are better things to claim than Red thread of Fate, on the other hand no repeating roles + the lynch all liars policy could make a counterclaim likely, even if not during EOD. Overall it seems more town than scum looking in retrospect (or so does my gut say :P)
Adding up on that, we can test ian's loyalty with Coffee, so I don't see a reason to push harder here
Also, this is a good point, even tho it was brought up after EOD
Could we use ian's ability to help control Coffee? If this is not a dumb idea I'd be willing to move my vote from him.
Sure, let mafia know ian is going to use his ability on Coffee and his next target.
During EOD, he stayed for quite a bit on kdz, before starting the Naii train and staying there until EOD. He also suggests going for DC or Cal. Not 100% sure how to read this (self preservation again, like in EOD1?)
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
Naiis vote on me is the only one i feel sketchy on my wagon. Cal and DC are other good targets imo.
Low content on posts deserves a scum bump at this point, imo. Also, this post
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.
That's got to be one of the worse reasons to tr rob, he always engages in conversation. Are you trying to deflect rob's scumlean on you with this?
imo the most relevant thing about kae so far is his read on DC (based on wagonomics)
Reminder that i still think day1 wagonomics make dc town
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
I didn't lynch voted shock last time to save DC, I lynch voted shock to prevent no lynch. So there we go, no issue with me.
In fact noone voted with intent to save dc
which will be interesting if we lynch DC, but so far just paints a correlation between the two for me.
During EOD he was on the MW wagon, then jumped to Naii
AWOL, will get modkilled if this doesn't change
Putting him on n- until he cuts down on the breadposting
The whole Cecilia thing rubbed me a bit the wrong way. After thinking about it for a bit I still think he's more likely town than scum. Basicaly, the rest of his game makes little sense if this was a scum premeditated move. Why bother building town cred when that is known to be different than your usual play style, if you are just planning on doing something like this? Coffee could have just coasted, killed dawn and forced Emma to spend the ability to find him (unless he thought dawn would reveal him if he was just coasting).
Anyway, I'd be a bit cautious about him, until we get more information.
I don't see anything out of the ordinary here, rob being inquisitive and pushing his scumreads is his regular play (NAI) and there is no reason from mechanics to scumread him so far
I agree with kae here that EOD1 makes him look more towny, but I'd really want more content besides bread, before giving him a town bump
His lack of posting makes i difficult to get any read. I think this deserves a scum bump at this point of the game
I'm liking his posts so far. They are a bit hard to follow, but still show his thought process
Wasn't again around for EOD.
TL;DR
town bumps: ian
scum bumps: MW, kdz, Coffee, Cal
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I'll never cut down on my bread posting. Sorry, hope you arent gluten intolerant.
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I'll never cut down on my bread posting. Sorry, hope you arent gluten intolerant.
andre has hashimoto's disease and can't get this bread
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More for the rest of us then.
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Only weird move I saw here was him moving his vote from ian to w3, right after ian's targets were revealed
But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...
Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?
And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.
For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
o.O
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
That sounds better, now I'll let someone break ties again :D
Despite having read all the roles, I initially forgot scum Kallen cannot even target two people that are not themselves during the ian interrogation. Then I was like, why are you dragging me down along with a possible vig on w3? But if it's to down a scum-read along with a town-read, it's a good pro town story.
I guess it's a story mafia can make up when they have the Kallen role, but it felt legit at the time of posting, bumping my read on ian back to n, making me switch to a different n-.
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Oops I procrastinated so much I may as well wait for the flip till I post lynchlog
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I mean, it reads almost like you already have it ready... if so why not post it?
Oops I procrastinated so much I may as well wait for the flip till I post lynchlog
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If you have any decent scum reads, feel free to share. We’ve lost 4 towns so far, 5 after the night most likely. Our “scum reads†clearly haven’t been successful so far, and I do not want to put a kill in coffees hands at this stage, on a person that we are not sure if mafia or not.
I sort of agree for a roundabout reason: I don't want to put the capacity for a redirect off of an agreed Cecilia target into a mafia!raiden's hands if it does exist. In that same vein, like I mentioned earlier but we all missed because it was EoD madness, sky has pretty much confirmed that if a maf!Kallan exists (as ian) and raiden drives away from him the night we want to 'mechanically confirm' ian as town, it would show as ian not targetting himself and thus appear he is town. I'm still not sure what we all want to do, in this case. I think it would be better not to try and use both ian and I's abilities for some roundabout confirming stuff because there's too much potential for things to head south (worst case scenario is losing 2 town and not confirming anything other than possibly maf!raiden or ian town kind of).
okay we're like 2 hours out can anyone give any opinion
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lynchlog is not finished
I think Kallan and cecilia should use their abilities independently for now, as torb is right if we ever confirm or mostly confirm ian this way he's just getting nked anyway+ if we ever get a decent poe that combo can be put to good use then
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both abilities should be used whenever possible imo
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both abilities should be used whenever possible imo
i disagree with mine being used whenever possible now because of the ability to drive me into any outed targets or for maf to drive me away from a 2nd hit on them but i agree that ian's has minor drawback as if he is maf he dies and if he is not we have the chance of hitting a maf (or 2 with my vig hit) anyway
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for the 100th time that specific scenario instantly outs a scumrole so while there is a high chance the rolesearcher is town and alive that just wont happen
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+ they need to know your next target beforehand as well
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for the 100th time that specific scenario instantly outs a scumrole so while there is a high chance the rolesearcher is town and alive that just wont happen
i think you're closer to the 2nd or maybe 3rd time
but valid point. any suggestions for targets? i might just go on dc or cal
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I prefer cal out of those for obv reasons
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If you have any decent scum reads, feel free to share. We’ve lost 4 towns so far, 5 after the night most likely. Our “scum reads†clearly haven’t been successful so far, and I do not want to put a kill in coffees hands at this stage, on a person that we are not sure if mafia or not.
I sort of agree for a roundabout reason: I don't want to put the capacity for a redirect off of an agreed Cecilia target into a mafia!raiden's hands if it does exist. In that same vein, like I mentioned earlier but we all missed because it was EoD madness, sky has pretty much confirmed that if a maf!Kallan exists (as ian) and raiden drives away from him the night we want to 'mechanically confirm' ian as town, it would show as ian not targetting himself and thus appear he is town. I'm still not sure what we all want to do, in this case. I think it would be better not to try and use both ian and I's abilities for some roundabout confirming stuff because there's too much potential for things to head south (worst case scenario is losing 2 town and not confirming anything other than possibly maf!raiden or ian town kind of).
okay we're like 2 hours out can anyone give any opinion
So what's the plan for my ability tonight? I would prefer not to use it at all, considering if we wanted me to use it both tonight and tomorrow night a mafia raiden could bus me onto my first target if we out both targets. I would rather not target anyone tonight to circumvent this.
I could make a suggestion but it would give scum clues how to stop it... But my idea has two parts and they're both contained within your thinking-out-loud ideas there. ;)
Use it or don't use it... your choice in MY OPINION. Others should weigh in I guess. IF YOU USE IT, then plan to use it without broadcasting your targets. That opens up to scum tampering. Repeatedly asking for a consensus on a specific target is just asking for trouble I think. Target players in the POE that could possibly end up living a while... as soon as you broadcast who you will target OR someone outs they were hit by you once then scum will know where to go for trying to get another kill (all the various "if they are town" / "if they are scum" caveats apply to all this of course).
My gist being, don't broadcast your target... but be smart about it. And be prepared to have a great defense/reasoning for your target choice later. Also be ready to stop using it if we get into situations where it might be risky - but as of now there is no way using it once tonigth could kill anyone. /cheers.
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If you have any decent scum reads, feel free to share. We’ve lost 4 towns so far, 5 after the night most likely. Our “scum reads†clearly haven’t been successful so far, and I do not want to put a kill in coffees hands at this stage, on a person that we are not sure if mafia or not.
I sort of agree for a roundabout reason: I don't want to put the capacity for a redirect off of an agreed Cecilia target into a mafia!raiden's hands if it does exist. In that same vein, like I mentioned earlier but we all missed because it was EoD madness, sky has pretty much confirmed that if a maf!Kallan exists (as ian) and raiden drives away from him the night we want to 'mechanically confirm' ian as town, it would show as ian not targetting himself and thus appear he is town. I'm still not sure what we all want to do, in this case. I think it would be better not to try and use both ian and I's abilities for some roundabout confirming stuff because there's too much potential for things to head south (worst case scenario is losing 2 town and not confirming anything other than possibly maf!raiden or ian town kind of).
okay we're like 2 hours out can anyone give any opinion
So what's the plan for my ability tonight? I would prefer not to use it at all, considering if we wanted me to use it both tonight and tomorrow night a mafia raiden could bus me onto my first target if we out both targets. I would rather not target anyone tonight to circumvent this.
I could make a suggestion but it would give scum clues how to stop it... But my idea has two parts and they're both contained within your thinking-out-loud ideas there. ;)
Use it or don't use it... your choice in MY OPINION. Others should weigh in I guess. IF YOU USE IT, then plan to use it without broadcasting your targets. That opens up to scum tampering. Repeatedly asking for a consensus on a specific target is just asking for trouble I think. Target players in the POE that could possibly end up living a while... as soon as you broadcast who you will target OR someone outs they were hit by you once then scum will know where to go for trying to get another kill (all the various "if they are town" / "if they are scum" caveats apply to all this of course).
My gist being, don't broadcast your target... but be smart about it. And be prepared to have a great defense/reasoning for your target choice later. Also be ready to stop using it if we get into situations where it might be risky - but as of now there is no way using it once tonigth could kill anyone. /cheers.
I like this response a lot. +towncred for rob here
i will use it tonight, then. i will also refrain from double tapping it upon input from others tomorrow.
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@timpa REZ: reads--
what's scummy about kdz breadposting, in your opinion? He did it quite a bit last game as a town power role... perhaps that's the case again. Perhaps he is scum. But why do you give a scum-bump to him for it?
that is a pretty terrible read explanation by MW for his U-turn townread on me.......... maybe you should have voted on a viable wagon at EOD2 such as MW's where Coffee and I were looking for takers at EOD? :-*
you should really start trying to read me based on my abundance of posts... pretty please? Unless Durandal is town and has an itch to scratch and decides to target me. Unless unless I am Durandal. Now that's some fun WIFOM for a WIFOM-enthusiast like myself.
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vv
Oa
v
TorB
ian (from n)
Coffee
n+
kae
n
rob: I can't seem to work him out...
x/n(-)
worldwideweb3
andretimpa
killsdazombies
MasterWalks
DoubleCapitals
Calindu
xx
Sub
Still no reads on half the people. This time order is slightly descending. But not much to read in there. I didn't even attempt to make sense of the lynch logs either. That might explain why DC is not listed very high which conflicts with kae's analysis.
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@timpa REZ: reads--
what's scummy about kdz breadposting, in your opinion? He did it quite a bit last game as a town power role... perhaps that's the case again. Perhaps he is scum. But why do you give a scum-bump to him for it?
I just don't like having so little to actually form a read on him. Breadposting is fine, as long as there's some posts with content together. It's to some extent the same problem I have with Cal.
that is a pretty terrible read explanation by MW for his U-turn townread on me.......... maybe you should have voted on a viable wagon at EOD2 such as MW's where Coffee and I were looking for takers at EOD? :-*
Yeah, I was tunelling on ian and needed some time to think over his claim. For D3 I'm willing to vote on my n- reads and MW is the most solid one I have.
you should really start trying to read me based on my abundance of posts... pretty please? Unless Durandal is town and has an itch to scratch and decides to target me. Unless unless I am Durandal. Now that's some fun WIFOM for a WIFOM-enthusiast like myself.
I think it'll be easier to get a read on you as we get more voting patterns and correlations start popping up, for now it all looks NAI.
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I’m still against the use because I don’t trust coffee to be a conf town.
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I’m still against the use because I don’t trust coffee to be a conf town.
if i use the ability to kill again and it flips town, you can lynch me.
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www3 - keep in mind Coffee isn't able to _kill_ anyone with it this night. Also, maybe he will decide not to use it tonight?
My scumreads rn:
MW > DC > www3/Cal/kdz > moe > ian
townreads are Oa > TorB > timpa/coffee/kae
If I die, that's the list I'm speaking and yelling at you all from the grave... A bit rushed so if I forgot someone they're _probably_ in my neutral area. OK thank GLGL.
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Oh I guess... Sub - but he might be about to sort himself?? Dunno forget how many phases are rules and when he last posted, but for now a big "X" read there for AWOL Sub...
here comes the anxious wait. :-\
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Night 2 has ended. Notifications are currently being sent.
Day 3 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Day 3
PlayerOa was nightkilled. He was Cocolia.
killsdazombies cannot be voted on today.
Day 3 has ended.
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This is bad.
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I believe in you guys...
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This is bad.
Doc is $#@! or not in the game or scum... also no Durandal report - Sub?!!??
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shitty that oa didn't out their info from Cocolia
--
did dura not use their ability last night? or were they roleblocked?
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Sorry, there was a mistake. It has been fixed.
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This is bad.
Doc is $#@! or not in the game or scum... also no Durandal report - Sub?!!??
Thats just what I was thinking, or got roleblocked
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This is bad.
Doc is $#@! or not in the game or scum... also no Durandal report - Sub?!!??
Thats just what I was thinking, or got roleblocked
actually sky made a mistake and it looks like you were the target of dura
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I saw right after I posted coffee, my rising fear has been abated
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This is bad.
Doc is $#@! or not in the game or scum... also no Durandal report - Sub?!!??
This is what I thought as well
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doc might have been on oa the day before and not have been able to heal oa, doc can still exist (technically he could even have been roleblocked or trying to wifom safe someone else)
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One of the Raiden Meis could have diverted from Oa, too, if they wanted.
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One of the Raiden Meis could have diverted from Oa, too, if they wanted.
if my understanding of raiden is correct, that would divert the nightkill from Oa as well
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One of the Raiden Meis could have diverted from Oa, too, if they wanted.
if my understanding of raiden is correct, that would divert the nightkill from Oa as well
Exactly, that's my point. They're basically semi-docs that can divert the nightkill to potential mafia members.
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One of the Raiden Meis could have diverted from Oa, too, if they wanted.
if my understanding of raiden is correct, that would divert the nightkill from Oa as well
Exactly, that's my point. They're basically semi-docs that can divert the nightkill to potential mafia members.
oh my bad. I misunderstood what you were trying to say. yes, that's true
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That assumes of course we have both a doc and a raiden. I agree with Kae though, there is a lot that could have happened. I think its wrong to condemn them for this
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welp with cocolia town it is likely that mafia posesses the core of reason based on n1 kill
durandal alive at this point means that either durandal is scum, emma planck is town or emma was one of the people that thought Theresa was the scarier cop (which in a team of 3 seems unlikely). Obv i dont want any of them to claim unless forced, just sth to keep in mind.
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welp, kdz posting more than ever means we wiffed again :/
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Anyway, now that I've set a trend, gotta keep it going. Rise and shine, it's lynch vote time!
MasterWalks (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
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Or rather what I was saying is, there is no guarantee we have either a doc or raiden, and even if we did I don't think its right to condemn them for missing this save, there is lots that could have happened, or they could have simply made a misplay. Sorry for the poor phrasing, on mobile and its hard to collect my thoughts well.
When I get home I'll try and collect myself alittle more and post something big.
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Or rather what I was saying is, there is no guarantee we have either a doc or raiden, and even if we did I don't think its right to condemn them for missing this save, there is lots that could have happened, or they could have simply made a misplay. Sorry for the poor phrasing, on mobile and its hard to collect my thoughts well.
When I get home I'll try and collect myself alittle more and post something big.
can you out as mafia now? we dont wanna waste our durandal ):
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MasterWalks (1) - rob77dp
I haven't changed my mind on my POE.
/TorB tried to ninja me
MasterWalks (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
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Would that I could w3, but you were on the wrong path.
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If doc was busy saving me instead, I don't blame them for anything :silly:
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Oh man I just realized I can bread post nonstop without fear of death this round. Hell yeah. Thanks Dura, you a real one
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welp with cocolia town it is likely that mafia posesses the core of reason based on n1 kill
Just from a numbers perspective I am not sold on this. It would be very unlikely and there is a good chance mafia used Core of Void on Link, too.
durandal alive at this point means that either durandal is scum, emma planck is town or emma was one of the people that thought Theresa was the scarier cop (which in a team of 3 seems unlikely). Obv i dont want any of them to claim unless forced, just sth to keep in mind.
I didn't even think of scenario #3. If Emma is town I'd also expect them to buddy publicly but I did not spot anything like that.
Oh man I just realized I can bread post nonstop without fear of death this round. Hell yeah. Thanks Dura, you a real one
inb4 you missed a Rapid Decay PM. Also, you're on mafia's plate now.
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Oh man I just realized I can bread post nonstop without fear of death this round. Hell yeah. Thanks Dura, you a real one
Don't fake it too hard, mi amigo. That's what you were doing anyway before you got Durandal'd. The fact you act so sure you were the prime target is interesting too. Or if you're town, take an opportunity to push places that otherwise might be dangerous for town to push? I dunno, can't think of anything specific but just publicizing that you're wanting to just not solve any is ... well, disappointing if you're town.
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moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
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Votes as people thought they were:
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (1) - PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (1) - Calindu
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (3) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Honorary votes:
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Thats all the busy work I can be arsed with rn, corrections way later, but the outcome doesnt change obviously and it may be better to look on what people thought were the actual vcs anyway.
-
Ok, I will correct myself though:
Votes as people thought they were:
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalks
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (1) - PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (1) - Calindu
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (3) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Honorary votes:
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
-
moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
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Considering noone even cared who mw voted and he was in the same situation dc was in multiple times (and 2 of my townreads are voting him), I feel obligated to defend him (for those 2 reasons).
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Oh man I just realized I can bread post nonstop without fear of death this round. Hell yeah. Thanks Dura, you a real one
Don't fake it too hard, mi amigo. That's what you were doing anyway before you got Durandal'd. The fact you act so sure you were the prime target is interesting too. Or if you're town, take an opportunity to push places that otherwise might be dangerous for town to push? I dunno, can't think of anything specific but just publicizing that you're wanting to just not solve any is ... well, disappointing if you're town.
Oh do relax rob, I'm just enjoying the relative freedom while I can. Would you deny me that rob? Really?
I'm unsure what you mean by prime target, does this imply you think I was redirected? Do we even have a redirect other than ians claim? So unless you live in a world where ian lied, we can be assured that I was the prime target yes? TBH I was trying to lightning rod last night, I just expected to be hit by the NK not Dura.
Never said I don't want to solve <3 when I get home I'll post my read lists comment. As an aside, I love how when rob added me to n- Timpa followed suit. Flying below the radar, buddying a vocal "Good town"
Also, are we looking for info dumps from our Dura targets? Role claims and all that jazz? Or are we playing it close to the chest here? I don't mind either way frankly
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moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
WHOA whoa whoa. You are saying that some cores may not be present in the game? Like scum have limited access to their special abilities? If that's true then well... there are more caveats going to be needed as we start eventually finding where some cores are being "held" or "not held"?!?
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If you got usefull info relevant now, say it, otherwise you can crumb your targets I guess or claim in the night
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moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
The point being that if they had both, then it would have been optimal for mafia to use both. It is likely that mafia has at most one of those cores, OR is simply saving void while using info gathered from Core of Reason to try and single out Durandal and Emma.
Only 3/5 cores are in the game afaik.
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moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
wait you've been thinking 2 mafia were holding multiple cores all this time? Or just being sarcastic now?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
WHOA whoa whoa. You are saying that some cores may not be present in the game? Like scum have limited access to their special abilities? If that's true then well... there are more caveats going to be needed as we start eventually finding where some cores are being "held" or "not held"?!?
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EBWOP:
moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
WHOA whoa whoa. You are saying that some cores may not be present in the game? Like scum have limited access to their special abilities? If that's true then well... there are more caveats going to be needed as we start eventually finding where some cores are being "held" or "not held"?!?
[/quote]
wait you've been thinking 2 mafia were holding multiple cores all this time? Or just being sarcastic now?
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If kdz is the next NK mafia is hardly looking for Dura.
moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
WHOA whoa whoa. You are saying that some cores may not be present in the game? Like scum have limited access to their special abilities? If that's true then well... there are more caveats going to be needed as we start eventually finding where some cores are being "held" or "not held"?!?
There are only three mafia in the game?
If we don't lynch scum soon, Dura might not live to use their ability another time.
moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
The point being that if they had both, then it would have been optimal for mafia to use both. It is likely that mafia has at most one of those cores, OR is simply saving void while using info gathered from Core of Reason to try and single out Durandal and Emma.
Only 3/5 cores are in the game afaik.
But you waste Void if you don't use it. So, you'd rather use it.
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EBWOP:moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
WHOA whoa whoa. You are saying that some cores may not be present in the game? Like scum have limited access to their special abilities? If that's true then well... there are more caveats going to be needed as we start eventually finding where some cores are being "held" or "not held"?!?
wait you've been thinking 2 mafia were holding multiple cores all this time? Or just being sarcastic now?
I don't recall thinking about it much before... we have talked about "X power role being possibly not in the game" often. I was simply thinking Cores were scum powers and if a scum died, they were revealed with a Core. It seems obvious thinking through it right now to have Cores assigned etc. I have slept several tiems since the game started so if that was ever discussed I since forgot about it. Notable enough now though we should all be on the same page with it.
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Void only has 2 uses, it's not wasting but saving.
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For the record, we aren't giving townleans for derp right? we've had like a half dozen people miscount mafia, or misunderstand mafia roles. At this rate everyone will get towncred for this.
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For the record, we aren't giving townleans for derp right? we've had like a half dozen people miscount mafia, or misunderstand mafia roles. At this rate everyone will get towncred for this.
No, we aren't.
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Well, mafia can try to hit Durandal and then hard-confirm multiple town members even if they succeed, or they can take the easy road and minimize the number of potential confirmed town asap. Until they find out whom Durandal actually is, hitting random town won't do them much good. Durandal is expected to expose themselves by the time they hit even one mafia, anyway.
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EBWOP:moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
WHOA whoa whoa. You are saying that some cores may not be present in the game? Like scum have limited access to their special abilities? If that's true then well... there are more caveats going to be needed as we start eventually finding where some cores are being "held" or "not held"?!?
wait you've been thinking 2 mafia were holding multiple cores all this time? Or just being sarcastic now?
I don't recall thinking about it much before... we have talked about "X power role being possibly not in the game" often. I was simply thinking Cores were scum powers and if a scum died, they were revealed with a Core. It seems obvious thinking through it right now to have Cores assigned etc. I have slept several tiems since the game started so if that was ever discussed I since forgot about it. Notable enough now though we should all be on the same page with it.
derpclear denied
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http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299980/#msg1299980
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300003/#msg1300003
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300005/#msg1300005
Wild theory but Oa might have had insight into MW's role and using it N0 could be scummy. In that case MW not using it gives him towncred. I personally don't read too much into it. Maybe after checking back all the roles. Oa could also just try to work through roles and people to get a better picture in general.
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Feels as though robs iq dropped by at least 20 points. Then again he did some stupid shit last time as well, maybe I just notice it more now that it took longer to see a reason to tr him.
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In that case Kiana Kaslana, Himeko Murata and Yae Sakura come to mind. Being observed using those roles would lead to a witch hunt on those roles if exposed, so it might just be mafia laying low. Nothing that proves town.
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Well, mafia can try to hit Durandal and then hard-confirm multiple town members even if they succeed, or they can take the easy road and minimize the number of potential confirmed town asap. Until they find out whom Durandal actually is, hitting random town won't do them much good. Durandal is expected to expose themselves by the time they hit even one mafia, anyway.
Or a scum!Durandal is just picking random targets because if they got found and were NOT targeting people then they'd be insta-lynched. But yeah, scum still get to NK twice as often as Durandal can confirm town - so they really should be trying to hit a scum and then out the found mafia.
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EBWOP:moe-
One of us is confused about Core of Void then... because I just read it and if Link was voided on the night he died we would not have been told he was Theresa. Right?
I wasn't clear in my writing. I meant there is a good chance mafia does have Core of Void. If they knew Link was Theresa they would have used it on him. That's my guess.
WHOA whoa whoa. You are saying that some cores may not be present in the game? Like scum have limited access to their special abilities? If that's true then well... there are more caveats going to be needed as we start eventually finding where some cores are being "held" or "not held"?!?
wait you've been thinking 2 mafia were holding multiple cores all this time? Or just being sarcastic now?
I don't recall thinking about it much before... we have talked about "X power role being possibly not in the game" often. I was simply thinking Cores were scum powers and if a scum died, they were revealed with a Core. It seems obvious thinking through it right now to have Cores assigned etc. I have slept several tiems since the game started so if that was ever discussed I since forgot about it. Notable enough now though we should all be on the same page with it.
derpclear denied
When have I ever cared about trying to get derpcleared? I have something like 4 or so "derp" chat pings set for a reason. Move along to something more useful that your post here, por favor.
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Feels as though robs iq dropped by at least 20 points. Then again he did some stupid shit last time as well, maybe I just notice it more now that it took longer to see a reason to tr him.
What does this mean? Why do you feel a need to have to townread me? After all I could be scum, or at least from a town's initial and somewhat on-going perspective I could be.
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Feels as though robs iq dropped by at least 20 points. Then again he did some stupid shit last time as well, maybe I just notice it more now that it took longer to see a reason to tr him.
What does this mean? Why do you feel a need to have to townread me? After all I could be scum, or at least from a town's initial and somewhat on-going perspective I could be.
I think kae means last mafia he had reasons to TR you earlier own so ignored your Derps but they stand out this mafia because he didn’t have reasons to tr you so noticed them more
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Feels as though robs iq dropped by at least 20 points. Then again he did some stupid shit last time as well, maybe I just notice it more now that it took longer to see a reason to tr him.
What does this mean? Why do you feel a need to have to townread me? After all I could be scum, or at least from a town's initial and somewhat on-going perspective I could be.
I think kae means last mafia he had reasons to TR you earlier own so ignored your Derps but they stand out this mafia because he didn’t have reasons to tr you so noticed them more
I'm curious about kae's meaning/input. www3, you should find somebody to push or sus out and interact with. You're still just vacillating around all languid and whatnot...
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http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299980/#msg1299980
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300003/#msg1300003
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300005/#msg1300005
Wild theory but Oa might have had insight into MW's role and using it N0 could be scummy. In that case MW not using it gives him towncred. I personally don't read too much into it. Maybe after checking back all the roles. Oa could also just try to work through roles and people to get a better picture in general.
While I'm probably not helping my own case in saying this, I believe Oa did not roll me on N0
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http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299980/#msg1299980
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300003/#msg1300003
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300005/#msg1300005
Wild theory but Oa might have had insight into MW's role and using it N0 could be scummy. In that case MW not using it gives him towncred. I personally don't read too much into it. Maybe after checking back all the roles. Oa could also just try to work through roles and people to get a better picture in general.
While I'm probably not helping my own case in saying this, I believe Oa did not roll me on N0
What do you make of this then?
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Well, mafia can try to hit Durandal and then hard-confirm multiple town members even if they succeed, or they can take the easy road and minimize the number of potential confirmed town asap. Until they find out whom Durandal actually is, hitting random town won't do them much good. Durandal is expected to expose themselves by the time they hit even one mafia, anyway.
Or a scum!Durandal is just picking random targets because if they got found and were NOT targeting people then they'd be insta-lynched. But yeah, scum still get to NK twice as often as Durandal can confirm town - so they really should be trying to hit a scum and then out the found mafia.
If Durandal is scum... I'm sitting here pondering how much discussion wolfchat dedicated to whether they check people. But typing through that I suppose it is a bit obvious if you are a scumteam and you roll the Durandal you realize quickly you have to use it - would they use it on town EoR and just plink that town next chance they get? Of course, that would be after they pop champagne and recover from the party hangover surely occurring if mafia rolled the town's investigative role. :'(
MastwerWalks --- what are your thoughts about COffee and I trying to save Naii EOD2 to kill you instead? Also, your vote just sitting there on me that whole last segment of Day 2 when you were dying is a bit ????
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EBWOP:
Well, mafia can try to hit Durandal and then hard-confirm multiple town members even if they succeed, or they can take the easy road and minimize the number of potential confirmed town asap. Until they find out whom Durandal actually is, hitting random town won't do them much good. Durandal is expected to expose themselves by the time they hit even one mafia, anyway.
Or a scum!Durandal is just picking random targets because if they got found and were NOT targeting people then they'd be insta-lynched. But yeah, scum still get to NK twice as often as Durandal can confirm town - so they really should be trying to hit a scum and then out the found mafia.
If Durandal is scum... I'm sitting here pondering how much discussion wolfchat dedicated to whether they check people. But typing through that I suppose it is a bit obvious if you are a scumteam and you roll the Durandal you realize quickly you have to use it - would they use it on town EoR and just plink that town next chance they get? Of course, that would be after they pop champagne and recover from the party hangover surely occurring if mafia rolled the town's investigative role. :'(
MastwerWalks --- what are your thoughts about COffee and I trying to save Naii EOD2 to kill you instead? Also, your vote just sitting there on me that whole last segment of Day 2 when you were at serious risk of dying is a bit ????
Added the emphasized.
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MastwerWalks --- what are your thoughts about COffee and I trying to save Naii EOD2 to kill you instead? Also, your vote just sitting there on me that whole last segment of Day 2 when you were dying is a bit ????
Fun fact, i actually didnt keep my vote on you EOD. My vote count was skipped over because people didnt care about my vote. PROOF:
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.
Read List
V
PlayerOa: Willing to bet duran woulda left some sorta hint after Oa was investigated if he was Maf.
N+
TORB: Laid the gameplan out early on. Engaged and very towny. I still believe that as knowledgeable he is about everything, that could be due to having another pad to discuss this. Only reason hes not in V.
Kaempf: Open about being targetted. Helpful and acts pretty normal.
KDZ: Honestly seems kinda confused, going with the flow. Maybe under the radar a bit but is seeming pretty normal.
N
Everyone not listed: Seem normal
N-
Moe: Has really been rubbing me the wrong way all game. Only a very slight scum read that a bit superstititous but still, gut feeling for now.
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK but i didnt want to list him in the everyone else catagory.
Cal, Naii: Inactivity is scummy at this point in the game. Cal literally has less posts than shock, the first kill.
Sub: Suspiciously confused. Maybe im remembering too much from early early game but man, really unlike you.
N--
Coffee: REALLY dont like the promise to protect then failing to do so. Almost feels like you said you would so that he didnt get targeted by anything else as to not disrupt the kill. Like roleswapping or not, thats kinda scummy thing to do. Also, id like to point out him telling info roles to not reveal anything. There are only 3 mafia this game. A mafia kill now would set us FAR ahead. Info roles could be killed off before sharing as we are already 3 town down.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
As far as trying to save Naii, yea i dont really blame you. I dont really know why Naii was getting votes to begin with. Seemed like people doing the typical and usually bad "if X is scum then Y must be town".
Looking like i will be gathering votes again tonight. Oh well. Ill role claim at EoD.
I still would like to to get a train going on coffee for the same reasons as before.
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1299980/#msg1299980
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300003/#msg1300003
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-74-by-skyironsword/msg1300005/#msg1300005
Wild theory but Oa might have had insight into MW's role and using it N0 could be scummy. In that case MW not using it gives him towncred. I personally don't read too much into it. Maybe after checking back all the roles. Oa could also just try to work through roles and people to get a better picture in general.
While I'm probably not helping my own case in saying this, I believe Oa did not roll me on N0
What do you make of this then?
I think Oa was trying to go through a process of elimination to discover as many roles as possible. Remember, by the time he died, he wouldve known 8 (?) roles. Since each role is only distributed once, he can narrow my role down quite a bit, probably down to 2 or 3.
MasterWalks (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Final Day 1 Vote Tally...
The lead up to this appears to have been a three-way between DC, www3 and town!shock, then three-way race between DC, town!shock, and iancu, and finally rested as a narrow town!shock lynched over close second on DC.
I believe there is something telling in there - in how the wagonomics worked out. Can't put my finger on it yet, but I want to revisit or come back to it when I can, or if someone else has thoughts on it too. If those really were/are all town wagons then at least one, probably two, scum could have been slacking around the _whole_ time of that occurring while being present. Dunno, have to run out now but getting this in the record as a bit of a bookmark so I might come back to it / restumble upon it again to flesh out if warranted.
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MW - Oa only knew the three roles he learned on N0, I don't think his role description as Cocolia included further investigations... I've forgotten why you scumread coffee and hence am unclear why you're voting him as your counter-wagon?
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No, he wouldave had the 3 roles from N0. +ian hard claim. +shock, d2d, link, naii death reveals. That makes 8 roles.
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EBWOP: Granted his 3 N0 rolls couldve been the deaths in which he would have less than 8. Still, he had more than we did and could use process of elimination
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I've forgotten why you scumread coffee and hence am unclear why you're voting him as your counter-wagon?
Here, let me show yall this post. People mightve missed it. I should just make it my forum signature at this point since THIS IS THE SECOND TIME IM POSTING IT ON THE SAME PAGE AS THE LAST TIME AND THE 4TH TOTAL TIME I HAVE QUOTED IT.
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.
Read List
V
PlayerOa: Willing to bet duran woulda left some sorta hint after Oa was investigated if he was Maf.
N+
TORB: Laid the gameplan out early on. Engaged and very towny. I still believe that as knowledgeable he is about everything, that could be due to having another pad to discuss this. Only reason hes not in V.
Kaempf: Open about being targetted. Helpful and acts pretty normal.
KDZ: Honestly seems kinda confused, going with the flow. Maybe under the radar a bit but is seeming pretty normal.
N
Everyone not listed: Seem normal
N-
Moe: Has really been rubbing me the wrong way all game. Only a very slight scum read that a bit superstititous but still, gut feeling for now.
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK but i didnt want to list him in the everyone else catagory.
Cal, Naii: Inactivity is scummy at this point in the game. Cal literally has less posts than shock, the first kill.
Sub: Suspiciously confused. Maybe im remembering too much from early early game but man, really unlike you.
N--
Coffee: REALLY dont like the promise to protect then failing to do so. Almost feels like you said you would so that he didnt get targeted by anything else as to not disrupt the kill. Like roleswapping or not, thats kinda scummy thing to do. Also, id like to point out him telling info roles to not reveal anything. There are only 3 mafia this game. A mafia kill now would set us FAR ahead. Info roles could be killed off before sharing as we are already 3 town down.
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalks
-
N--
Coffee: REALLY dont like the promise to protect then failing to do so. Almost feels like you said you would so that he didnt get targeted by anything else as to not disrupt the kill. Like roleswapping or not, thats kinda scummy thing to do. Also, id like to point out him telling info roles to not reveal anything. There are only 3 mafia this game. A mafia kill now would set us FAR ahead. Info roles could be killed off before sharing as we are already 3 town down.
hello
i wanted to start off apologizing for people seeming to have ignored you, that's fucked and happened to me this game too (@last night trying to figure out an action)
the promise to protect was just as wifom as the brazen cop claim from link, and there were far more important people to protect based off of the knowledge we had at that point in the game anyway (Oa who was soft clear).
it's not scummy because why would the doc protect link anyway in that scenario? unless they for some reason had info that he was theresa which none of us did at the time, then like i said earlier, there were better options. i don't think anyone including myself believed him to be cop but it seems to me now that those were some of link's weird mind games going on, claiming cop when he's actually cop.
share where i said info roles should not release any info period please
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share where i said info roles should not release any info period please
Town Raiden Mei can also protect confirmed town power roles this way. Depending on whom you redirect the nightkill to, it might even kill mafia. You might redirect the medic, but if the medic protected the target that would be nightkilled, it will still protect the new target and prevent a nightkill from taking place. The main problem is redirecting town vigis onto other town or Raiden Mei being scum. I see no reason not to use it. A random redirect from a likely NK target changes the chance of mafia getting NK-ed from 0% to something more. It's still a minor chance, but an improvement.
For the specific case of nightkill on a mafia and redirecting it onto someone else... there is only one Fu Hua at most, since a town Fu Hua would not know whom is mafia, there is little benefit to go through such lengths yet, I'd think.
Until we have our investigative roles out with their reports (which should not happen yet) it's dangerous to possibly redirect onto Dura or other investigative roles like Emma and Theresa. The odds are both 3/14 for a redirect onto either. I think it comes down to what risks we're willing to take, but I will admit the redirect makes it possible to kill mafia. It probably is more beneficial to us for the redirect to happen, as it's possible that we hit mafia like you said.
That being said, the mechanics I'm talking about are if the mafia night kill one of their own AND redirect (in the case of mafia!Raiden) onto a target from there. Because all targeting gets switched, that means not only will the nightkill always go through, but if they hit someone with doc protection, the mafia gets a free protection from town vig hits.
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share where i said info roles should not release any info period please
Town Raiden Mei can also protect confirmed town power roles this way. Depending on whom you redirect the nightkill to, it might even kill mafia. You might redirect the medic, but if the medic protected the target that would be nightkilled, it will still protect the new target and prevent a nightkill from taking place. The main problem is redirecting town vigis onto other town or Raiden Mei being scum. I see no reason not to use it. A random redirect from a likely NK target changes the chance of mafia getting NK-ed from 0% to something more. It's still a minor chance, but an improvement.
For the specific case of nightkill on a mafia and redirecting it onto someone else... there is only one Fu Hua at most, since a town Fu Hua would not know whom is mafia, there is little benefit to go through such lengths yet, I'd think.
Until we have our investigative roles out with their reports (which should not happen yet) it's dangerous to possibly redirect onto Dura or other investigative roles like Emma and Theresa. The odds are both 3/14 for a redirect onto either. I think it comes down to what risks we're willing to take, but I will admit the redirect makes it possible to kill mafia. It probably is more beneficial to us for the redirect to happen, as it's possible that we hit mafia like you said.
That being said, the mechanics I'm talking about are if the mafia night kill one of their own AND redirect (in the case of mafia!Raiden) onto a target from there. Because all targeting gets switched, that means not only will the nightkill always go through, but if they hit someone with doc protection, the mafia gets a free protection from town vig hits.
fair enough
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i'd like to think that in a scenario where there's a mafia!Hua or a mafia!Raiden, then there would be no way for the informational roles to be saved, and because we're not sure about there these alignments lie, i thought it would be better until they either had more reports or someone flipped scum. at the time, there was only a maximum of 1 report from any given role. now it would be safe to out important and useful reports.
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Feels as though robs iq dropped by at least 20 points. Then again he did some stupid shit last time as well, maybe I just notice it more now that it took longer to see a reason to tr him.
What does this mean? Why do you feel a need to have to townread me? After all I could be scum, or at least from a town's initial and somewhat on-going perspective I could be.
What w3 said. Look at you ignoring important stuff continously. As for why I tr you after all, its the late attempt to save naii and your derps seem genuine.But cant you pay a bit more attention now?
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Another reason why I just want to tr you, is that chances of you providing actual content is higher than most.
Unfortunately so far, half your posts are asking stuff you could just read up and the other half is mostly desperately trying to justify clinging onto your initial reads or making pushes based on stuff I dont consider ai at all.
Also (unrelated, but since I'm already talking to you) I was very surprised that you were fine with Coffee holstering, considering you play on mu. 2 popular setups there are cop13 and vig13, both of which are considered equally balanced. Basically, doing the lynch and alignement reveal in one go is equal in power to having to claim your findings and spent the lynch on scum in return for al your town targets living.
Now, part of that ofc is that the vig never has to out, which doesnt apply to cecilia, but still holstering is wrong.
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dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Final Day 1 Vote Tally...
The lead up to this appears to have been a three-way between DC, www3 and town!shock, then three-way race between DC, town!shock, and iancu, and finally rested as a narrow town!shock lynched over close second on DC.
I believe there is something telling in there - in how the wagonomics worked out. Can't put my finger on it yet, but I want to revisit or come back to it when I can, or if someone else has thoughts on it too. If those really were/are all town wagons then at least one, probably two, scum could have been slacking around the _whole_ time of that occurring while being present. Dunno, have to run out now but getting this in the record as a bit of a bookmark so I might come back to it / restumble upon it again to flesh out if warranted.
Decent theory (though I wish you had done the actual work). People who didnt move their vote since w3 was in the lead day1: timpa, moe, rob, coffee.
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The longer I monologue the less towncred I want to give coffe/rob for naai safe. Still, robs initial push on coffee makes them unlikely w/w at least
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I got targeted by Coffee last night.
Also, I find it strange that he's not more heavily scumread for the vig shot on N1 on dawn. Rob was much more scumread for his vig shot.
Coffee waited a long time to reveal, posting multiple times between the reveal and him claiming, despite people discussing in the thread about wanting a reveal. He also shot someone that wasn't really scumread at that point and started posting more.
The possibility of him getting 2 free kills and getting away with it is really bad for town. It's even worse if mafia actually has Durandal, like it's being discussed, since Coffee could line up 2 kills, take 1 and get Durandaled to be immune the next day and take another one the following night.
I feel bad for voting alongside my scumread MW, but I scumread Coffee more as it stands.
MasterWalks (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
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MasterWalks (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
With so much pushing towards MW, you guys must be onto something. w3 still top scum lean for me though, but it seems he's currently U N L Y N C H A B L E for some reason.
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With so much pushing towards MW, you guys must be onto something.
What is this?
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With so much pushing towards MW, you guys must be onto something.
What is this?
someone mistakenly left his sarcasm detector in the microwave while nuking a smurfberry pop tart.
Pretty sure ian is being sarcastic.
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Ugh, its phoneposting only for the rest of the weekend. Sorry mw, noone cares about you, but i just cant be arsed to edit votecounts just for you. I'm happy once I managed a readlist at all.
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Awkward timing, but I'm back.~ I had a rough week with work and health, sorry to make everyone wait.
I am 50 pages behind, so I would appreciate if someone summarized what has been going on.
Also, I realize I missed a day without voting, so in case I am Bronya with 2 voting power (I am not), I'm parking my vote on myself to reset it to 1.
Submachine (1) - Submachine
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Awkward timing, but I'm back.~ I had a rough week with work and health, sorry to make everyone wait.
I am 50 pages behind, so I would appreciate if someone summarized what has been going on.
Also, I realize I missed a day without voting, so in case I am Bronya with 2 voting power (I am not), I'm parking my vote on myself to reset it to 1.
Submachine (1) - Submachine
well, irl comes first. Glad to have you back :)
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MasterWalks (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
I am really lost here, ill read back again and see if it helps.
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I've been trying to work up the energy to post /anything/ today, so I'm going to give a simple read list before I pass out. Sorry I know I should make use of my relative immortality, but I am physically exhausted. I'll be on tomorrow and try and analyze some posts individually. Also vote
TheonlyrealBeef - (v) - was a "Tie breaker" day 1. At first, I disliked this heavily, it felt like an easy way to enforce a kill, but I think we would have probably no lynched, and frankly I think we would be in a much worse place without said kill. I also find myself agreeing with most of their statements and actions.
iancudorinmarian - (???) - Can be hard confirmed, which isn't something to turn our noses up at. Unsure if we want to make a plan for this for the nightphase, or if we just take them out on our own.
moehrpi - (n+) - Very assertive/aggressive. Not sure what I make of it. It is nice however to see a departure from the rather passive play we saw from moe last game. Making lots of attempts to read and solve.
Coffeeditto - (n+) - Killed d2d, which I dont think was really a bad thing. Obv there was a town consensus not to kill d2d, and that flew in the face of the towns "choice". That being said, having a vig who kills low posters isnt the worst thing in the world to me. Further I can see a town making the plays coffee has made, including feigning to save linkcat. It set a WIFOM to the mafia, and didn't actually dissuade the real doc from targeting link. Ive been dancing between N and N+
kaempfer13 - (? , probably n+) - Idk what to think about kae ever. I can't tell if they are insane, or the only sane person. Theyll post 9 times in a row that make no sense, then say exactly what im thinking.
MasterWalks - (n) - I don't doubt that they could be mafia, but I just dont see the team, and I'm worried for some of you its just a policy lynch.
Submachine - (n) - has been mia for a few days, so we've missed a lot of potential content from sub. before their disappearance I was N+ on them I think, but the mia has really put some concern in my heart. N until they catch up and can interact.
DoubleCapitals - (n) - I just dont see the scum team here, unless its w3? Idk. Honestly, at this rate they are a mislynch in waiting, since there are people with mild sus on them and they cant defend themselves at EoD.
rob77dp - (n-) - While I'm sure my innate mistrust of rob is coming in here, they are a smarty. I dont think they would make as many derps as they have been, and further I think rob is trying to downplay his usefulness/mafia prowess.
Calindu - (n-) - They have effectively stated we wont get any additional info out of them, and we wont get much more activity. They claim to have been tagged by coffee, and I dont know if I oppose killing them via coffee. We'll probably have to poe them at some point anyway, its too easy for scum to play around with low posters
worldwideweb3 - (n-) - Obviously I know w3 has been pushing a town (me) but obviously none of you can confirm I am without a doubt town. Further beyond this, I notice www3 is on the attack quite a bit in general, they are always pushing something, but they defended dc? Idk what to make of it all. Everything they've said has felt a little sour, hence my previous apathy to their continued life.
andretimpa - (n-) - I dislike how they have sorta slipped under the radar, I dont think I've seen many people directly interact with timpa, nor has timpa really said anything decisive, at least not that rings a bell to me. Feel free to point out anything o nthat I've missed. Further, I disliked how they n-'d me with a sort of flimsy reasoning right after rob did. It looked like someone trying to help someone else push a kill. I just cant shake this sus of them. In their defense however, they have been posting a lot more then last game
If you disagree or question anything I've said about someone just let me know and we can flush it out. I'm pretty out of it as I said so theres always room for mistake or misunderstanding.
Correction: Sub voted on themselves
MasterWalks (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
I'll still be checking the thread and stuff, and I'll try and respond to anything directed at me as quick as I can. Its just one of those days ya'll know?
IMO letting coffee live today so that cali can get got sounds like a reasonable strat. Plus we can use it with ian to confirm, since we can use the already loaded vig kill on cali to force the thread of fate kill, without having to use a much more taxing vig ability. Of course, this plan then means ian would probably be a likely NK target.
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@kdz
About my read on you, I'm not against bread, just put something together with the bread :P. The post you just made is the kind of thing I felt was missing. Also, the scum bump I gave you is consistent with the ones I gave to Cal and MW, I wasn't singling you out (tho the wording was indeed influenced by rob).
About your other scumleans:
- I agree that keeping some distrust of rob is healthy, it just hasn't got to the point I'm scumleaning him. Do you think his derps could be him turning a blind eye to things that could out his team?
- Your thoughts on Cal align with my reads post a lot
- I started scumleaning w3, but dropped it because of EOD1, where he kept defending DC. Tho in EOD2 we have this
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
Naiis vote on me is the only one i feel sketchy on my wagon. Cal and DC are other good targets imo.
where he suggests voting on DC. Not enough for a scumlean (people are allowed to change opinion :silly:) but raises an eyebrow for me
btw, welcome to v town :P
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How can no one think coffee is mafia using his ability to pick off inactives while being able to use the excuse of them being inactive to get away with it? How can he literally play scummy but still get no attention?
If hes so itchy to use his ability, why not hit someone who is actually likely to be scum? maybe someone on everyones scumreads? Why hasent he killed me so town doesnt waste time on another lynch?
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How can no one think coffee is mafia using his ability to pick off inactives while being able to use the excuse of them being inactive to get away with it? How can he literally play scummy but still get no attention?
If hes so itchy to use his ability, why not hit someone who is actually likely to be scum? maybe someone on everyones scumreads? Why hasent he killed me so town doesnt waste time on another lynch?
Well, as time goes on being inactive gets more and more suspicious, but more than that is that its easy to push for lynches on inactives, its not like they can really defend themselves. So the question is would we rather spend a day phase killing inactives, or would we rather it be over with at night? Idk, thats really what I wanted to open discussion to. For this exact moment with coffee, we can use that vig shot to confirm that Ian can target two people other then himself, and have a now confirmed town pick someone to kill, and still kill coffee later if we want.
For context, we are at 3/13 right now.
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Why hasent he killed me so town doesnt waste time on another lynch?
In order to vig you, he needs two nights. On N0, he could not have known that town would be lynch voting you. In fact, using his ability on you N1 might even look bad since if we follow the reasoning of not lynching people that are one night away from getting vigged anyway, he could just leave his mafiabuddies in purgatory without ever actually killing them off (if he is mafia). If they DO get lynched, well that's an ability use entirely wasted. We're still missing his lynch vote, but he might have been intent to lynch you anyway.
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About Coffee, I townread him, because I would have vigged dawn too if I had the chance. That dawn turned out to be town is mere unfortunate, but I can’t scumread him for it.
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I got targeted by Coffee last night.
Also, I find it strange that he's not more heavily scumread for the vig shot on N1 on dawn. Rob was much more scumread for his vig shot.
Coffee waited a long time to reveal, posting multiple times between the reveal and him claiming, despite people discussing in the thread about wanting a reveal. He also shot someone that wasn't really scumread at that point and started posting more.
The possibility of him getting 2 free kills and getting away with it is really bad for town. It's even worse if mafia actually has Durandal, like it's being discussed, since Coffee could line up 2 kills, take 1 and get Durandaled to be immune the next day and take another one the following night.
I feel bad for voting alongside my scumread MW, but I scumread Coffee more as it stands.
MasterWalks (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
If I killed you, people would know I used my ability to kill you. I can also just not use it tonight, but I repeatedly asked what I should do with my ability last night and you didn't provide any input, that doesn't resonate with me. I would have preffered you said that to me /before/ it was already too late. I have posted my reason for claiming when I did, and right now, this feels a lot like and OMGUS vote.
How can no one think coffee is mafia using his ability to pick off inactives while being able to use the excuse of them being inactive to get away with it? How can he literally play scummy but still get no attention?
If hes so itchy to use his ability, why not hit someone who is actually likely to be scum? maybe someone on everyones scumreads? Why hasent he killed me so town doesnt waste time on another lynch?
I'm not "itchy" to use it, and I won't use it tonight if that's what we agree on. You can't argue that I'm using it on not scummy people because scumreads are subjective and although I dislike that you're pushing on me so heavily, I can't be arsed to believe you are more scum than a non-contributing Calindu or a slippery DC. Like I said, I don't have to hit anyone twice and I don't want to if they come out with information that's helpful or beneficial for the town instead of coasting.
Sub - Glad to have you back in the game. : )
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I'll put my money where my mouth is
that is a pretty terrible read explanation by MW for his U-turn townread on me.......... maybe you should have voted on a viable wagon at EOD2 such as MW's where Coffee and I were looking for takers at EOD? :-*
Yeah, I was tunelling on ian and needed some time to think over his claim. For D3 I'm willing to vote on my n- reads and MW is the most solid one I have.
MasterWalks (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
My trials match with asdw will intersect a bit with EOD. I'll try to keep an eye on the thread, but some activity earlier would be appreciated.
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I wanted to say that I started a job yesterday and have work starting 1.5 hrs before deadline so I will also not be here for EoD but I will vote before then. Something tells me my attempts at a DC bandwagon won't gain traction
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Sub, don’t end up voting yourself. I’d rather you vote someone else
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Well, I expected a lot more activity but today is really slow. Going to be around for EOD this time. :)
Sub, don’t end up voting yourself. I’d rather you vote someone else
I second this.
I don't feel too hot for a MW lynch anymore. I'm not entirely opposed and to me it's the best option out of those voted so far but I'll go with my bigger scumread - more like stronger suspicion.
MasterWalks (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - moehrpi
I haven't seen anything that makes me townread him with a high volume of posts.
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(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcSu2mMu6edqMs-q317bkxtuZ4w-RkZlcLp_yA&usqp=CAU)
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Oof, I overslept and thats pretty much all the time I had for this game today, as Im glued to my family today. With that little activity across the board can we ask for an Extension?
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i don’t think that people just not being here is a good enough reason to warrant an extension, but i’m not the host.
that being said, I have to go now, so I am parking my vote here but i might be able to move it in a very small period of time later if i slip to the restroom or something.
MasterWalks (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
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(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcSu2mMu6edqMs-q317bkxtuZ4w-RkZlcLp_yA&usqp=CAU)
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The vote on myself was in case people believed i was Bronya, but reading up, only TorB said this.
I am on the road now. Will vocalize who i would vote at home, and will make a decision of voting at EoD.
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Kiana Kaslana
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Anyway I can barely squeeze in posts and yet keep up with the thread. Thats pretty much end of the line for us (town). Its def not mw and I dont feel good about any of the other trains either.
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Anyway I can barely squeeze in posts and yet keep up with the thread. Thats pretty much end of the line for us (town). Its def not mw and I dont feel good about any of the other trains either.
Then what train do you feel good about?
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MasterWalks (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
This is our current vote. I dont favour a coffee kill, I've stated before I think we have use for coffee tonight. Similarly, we can hard confirm Ian, and actually MW's ability is the only thing standing in the way of hard confirming ian one way or another. Thus, with our current trains we can either hedge our bets and just remove MW's interrupt from the equation, or we can just take out W3 or we can shift to something new but for now I think a coffee vote is jumping the gun, unless people here really want to save cali.
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Already knew MWs ability was useless, so for a lynch town does not really lose out on much with MW gone. If MW is mafia, we gain a ton of information from past lynches.
Kiana Kaslana
That's it? Your town credibility is zero. No dying wishes or regrets, thoughts on whom is mafia, or anything at all that can help town win this game? This role reveal is like... "okay"
Anyway I can barely squeeze in posts and yet keep up with the thread. Thats pretty much end of the line for us (town). Its def not mw and I dont feel good about any of the other trains either.
Vote for your heaviest scum lean. The only thing bothering me in the current lynch vote is the lack of people voting. You will never get a wagon going if you do not even vote.
The fact that I am okay with the top wagon is the primary reason for me to see no reason to discuss anything new. I already hammered the fact that everyone should vote before. I feel an urge to hunt down Bronya rising, since they can easily get away with not voting when so few people vote.
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Who is not voting rn?
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Wouldn’t a mafia MW be using his role?
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Wouldn’t a mafia MW be using his role?
No, people would claim to be targeted and Emma would hunt them down and expose them.
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Who is not voting rn?
I dont have my vote placed sub, neither are Kaes nor DC's
Wouldn’t a mafia MW be using his role?
If someone got roleblocked randomly we would probably start a witch hunt, since that role is almost exclusively anti-town
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ninja'd by the beef himself.
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MW is pure N for me. DC not voting is interesting.
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Wouldn’t a mafia MW be using his role?
Perhaps MW on his own, but his team would have talked him out of it.
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lol well role claiming didnt do much.
Dying wish? Lynch coffee
Regrets? No Ragrets
Suspected Mafia? coffee/super active person/probably moe
Lynching me is just going to show you that rob and torb start wagoning me and people jump on and off.
TBH if i live, i spam coffee with my role.
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MW is pure N for me. DC not voting is interesting.
DC has been pretty inactive this day phase, I know hes probably asleep (5am his time and all)
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inb4 tunnel pictures
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inb4 tunnel pictures
For you
(https://i.imgflip.com/1rsiwl.jpg)
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MW is pure N for me. DC not voting is interesting.
DC has been pretty inactive this day phase, I know hes probably asleep (5am his time and all)
Probably forgot about the game because of trials (I'm half here half playing asdw for example)
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MW is pure N for me. DC not voting is interesting.
DC has been pretty inactive this day phase, I know hes probably asleep (5am his time and all)
Probably forgot about the game because of trials (I'm half here half playing asdw for example)
yeah, after I posted it I gave a look at the rest of the forum and noticed the huge amount of trials stuff. A bad day for mafia playing it seems
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I feel very out of the loop, I don’t have proper reads on a lot of people. What is the general read on moe? His posts escape my memory.
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I probably want my vote on someone that never had to feel threatened by the lynch except TorB and kdz. Considering my theory that all wagons so far were town, thats were the scum would have to be. Although the people coming to mind there are timpa and calindu, who i dont have particularly good reason to scumread outside that. And chances are that noone would hop on anyway, since people tend to hold onto old grudges here.
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MasterWalks (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
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Honestly, if MW is going to just roleblock coffee, and I want coffee to kill cali, then I guess I have to vote MW
MasterWalks (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, Killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
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Why would you want to kill Cali so soon? almost everyone is against it. Thats a bad vote on MW.
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We can use cali to confirm Ian without revealing or relying, on another unconfirmed role to lock ian in as a confirmed town. I'd trade an inactive sus player + a random vig shot for a confirmed town any day of the week.
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The time alloted for Day 3 has ended, but will be extended by up to 30 minutes or until 7 minutes have passed since the last vote or vote tally.
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MasterWalks (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, Killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
I really dont like MW lynch but if no one is willing to move off of it, then i guess no point delaying
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Calindu is already hanging on the gallows as long as coffee lives. If andre is scum, DoubleCapitals could be a likely teammate.
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Honestly, there is no point in me voting with the current votecount. Ian can be confirmed later, sub is voting self and also pretty much my only hope for fresh wind now, even if my last read on him was a small scum lean, and w3 wasnt particularly keen on selfpressing on any counterwagon ever.
And you know im not bronya
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Just vote on someone atleast, jump with me on andre
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I would like to contribute, but I lack the time to analyze posts this eod, so I keep self voting.
@kae: fresh wind?
Just vote on me, it’s safe here. :)
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Yh whatever, put my vote on andre
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MasterWalks (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, Killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (2) - worldwideweb3, kaempfer13
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
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I need a lot of time to resort my thoughts. I dont really have proper scumreads now
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Something to note, I notice rob is absent from another EoD, the first was note worthy, but this is the second in 3 day phases. Not sure if it means anything, obv people are people and can't watch this game 100% but still
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Day 3 has ended.
MasterWalks (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalks, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (2) - worldwideweb3, kaempfer13
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
Night 3 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Getting a serious vibe of rob just not caring this game. I kinda scumread it as you can easily pickup from many of my posts, but I've also never seen a scum trying to save a town last minute before. Idk
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inb4 tunnel pictures
For you
(https://i.imgflip.com/1rsiwl.jpg)
Anything with substance would be nice.
Something to note, I notice rob is absent from another EoD, the first was note worthy, but this is the second in 3 day phases. Not sure if it means anything, obv people are people and can't watch this game 100% but still
I was absent 2/2 EODs and no one seemed to care. Half-away for this one. too. Hoped for more EOD frenzy to chime in at the end. But there's nothing happening.
Also, I only managed minimal activity to keep up to date the past two/three days. :/
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Night 3
MasterWalks was lynched. He was Kiana Kaslana.
Night 3 has ended.
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Getting a serious vibe of rob just not caring this game. I kinda scumread it as you can easily pickup from many of my posts, but I've also never seen a scum trying to save a town last minute before. Idk
rob probably is content with shock lynch and fulfilled his goal this game. I'm sure many share your observation about rob.
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Night 3
MasterWalks was lynched. He was Kiana Kaslana.
Night 3 has ended.
I have only just noticed sky's subject change lel
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCuPtHaVoAAT29n.jpg)
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inb4 tunnel pictures
For you
(https://i.imgflip.com/1rsiwl.jpg)
Anything with substance would be nice.
Something to note, I notice rob is absent from another EoD, the first was note worthy, but this is the second in 3 day phases. Not sure if it means anything, obv people are people and can't watch this game 100% but still
I was absent 2/2 EODs and no one seemed to care. Half-away for this one. too. Hoped for more EOD frenzy to chime in at the end. But there's nothing happening.
Also, I only managed minimal activity to keep up to date the past two/three days. :/
I have already said that MW is a bad lynch, i cant make people agree with me now, can i?
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My bad, I thought you were speaking for yourself. Was more skimming through the last few posts.
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
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Man. It goes to show much I need food. Smh. I lose like 30 IQ points when I take a late lunch
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
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it also means that the original raden targetted the seele, which is interesting...
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Another thing, why not reveal it during the day that just went? Id have thought that the best time would either be during the day, or right at the end of this night so leaving the info incase you die
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
All right...
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
He obviously played bad if you know his identity.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
Can confirm.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
TorB is vv now.
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There were no interesting lynch targets. I did not want mafia pranking around during the day to see which people I would bother to protect because they had power roles. Since there were plans to vig Cal and use Kallen to vig another and confirm ian, I felt it was extremely important to let people know just how shaky this plan is with two Raidens running amok. They could both be town, but the plan cannot be safely executed unless both their identities are revealed so you know whom to blame and lynch. But then we're outing two semi-docs, whom could both be town.
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Another thing, why not reveal it during the day that just went? Id have thought that the best time would either be during the day, or right at the end of this night so leaving the info incase you die
This way you might get saved. But revealing before lynch sounds like the better option.
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One of the Raiden Meis could have diverted from Oa, too, if they wanted.
Also, notice this post that somehow nobody questioned why it was plural, lol.
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
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So what's the consensus about my ability usage tonight? Do I target two people "at random"?
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
no not now, i meant why not ask for a role claim before reveal :/
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
Would mafia give themselves a second Raiden? I didn't liek the thought from mafia perspective but there aren't too many other roles that you want to have. If not there is at least one town Raiden / semi-doc.
I trust ian to be town, so I want him to use his ability.
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So what's the consensus about my ability usage tonight? Do I target two people "at random"?
We should probably hold a nightly lynchvote for coffees target if the result is cal we can ask you to target cal+someone, else uae it on targets at your own disgression
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What happens if two raidens target the same person again?
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
no not now, i meant why not ask for a role claim before reveal :/
That would still out all the power roles to mafia, which I didn't think to be a good idea. I was already being considered for protection anyway, so that does not change much. If anything, I'm more curious why DoubleCapitals did not already claim.
Would mafia give themselves a second Raiden? I didn't liek the thought from mafia perspective but there aren't too many other roles that you want to have. If not there is at least one town Raiden / semi-doc.
I trust ian to be town, so I want him to use his ability.
Target should be preset, so that Raiden Mei interference is either intentional and scum or non-existant. I had a theory on whom Raiden is (town) and whom Seele, but when I checked lynch votes, it didn't make sense for Seele to be the Nightkill sink from their perspective.
Raiden Mei allows mafia to bypass Fu Hua protection and divert Durandal onto a different target. It is incredibly useful as mafia. If this happened to Durandal, now might be a perfect time to claim so we can hang the original targets. Otherwise, it would not have made sense to claim this as Durandal as it would out their identity but not that of the perpetrator. Ignore this topic altogether if this did not happen, I already know whom you are, others need not know.
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
All right...
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
He obviously played bad if you know his identity.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
Can confirm.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
TorB is vv now.
EBWOP
So what's the consensus about my ability usage tonight? Do I target two people "at random"?
We should probably hold a nightly lynchvote for coffees target if the result is cal we can ask you to target cal+someone, else uae it on targets at your own disgression
I find it a bit early to force a consensus and vig Cal. Night only just started, give him some time.
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
no not now, i meant why not ask for a role claim before reveal :/
That would still out all the power roles to mafia, which I didn't think to be a good idea. I was already being considered for protection anyway, so that does not change much. If anything, I'm more curious why DoubleCapitals did not already claim.
Would mafia give themselves a second Raiden? I didn't liek the thought from mafia perspective but there aren't too many other roles that you want to have. If not there is at least one town Raiden / semi-doc.
I trust ian to be town, so I want him to use his ability.
Target should be preset, so that Raiden Mei interference is either intentional and scum or non-existant. I had a theory on whom Raiden is (town) and whom Seele, but when I checked lynch votes, it didn't make sense for Seele to be the Nightkill sink from their perspective.
Raiden Mei allows mafia to bypass Fu Hua protection and divert Durandal onto a different target. It is incredibly useful as mafia. If this happened to Durandal, now might be a perfect time to claim so we can hang the original targets. Otherwise, it would not have made sense to claim this as Durandal as it would out their identity but not that of the perpetrator. Ignore this topic altogether if this did not happen, I already know whom you are, others need not know.
Trusting you on this one. I am Durandal and targeted DC N0.
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Alright, I read skys post again.if raidens share a target, that target will get everything, which means that we need to make conventiens when seele and when og raiden should protect a specific person from the nk
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Ok raiden protect moe and seele protect torb i guess.
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Hm, I think raiden shouldnt have been used at all n0 considering no nk and added confusion
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But I dont think we discussed that at all
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DC is Raiden Mei.
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That's why it's scummy and I'd like to take the risk and have ian target TorB or myself with a scumread. Our respective protectors are the first thought but it's too easy for mafia to play this against town since, obviously, they know alignments.
Also, for the record, yes, I did play obviously when you stated you know who Durandal is and MW was right about me having a power role, too. :p
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Hm, I think raiden shouldnt have been used at all n0 considering no nk and added confusion
There are still vigs tho
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DC is Raiden Mei.
*Seele
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Dc is seele you mean, raiden cant self target. Hm, if raiden and seele were a scum team that would be the optimal move n0
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Ah, right. andretimpa as Raiden Mei, then.
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Ah, right. andretimpa as Raiden Mei, then.
So much for keeping the semi-docs hidden. I can give you my list of actions and reasonings, just give me a sec.
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Torb, did raiden try to protect dc from the lynch?
Nvm, stop ninjaing me
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If we just traded two power roles for two scum, things are looking good. But you must really not use any vig roles in the meantime if BOTH Raiden Mei and Seele are scum. Fu Hua cannot be relied upon, either. The fact that Coffee kept hammering mafia Raiden is also very suspicious from my point of view, like he already knew...?
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These claims came to fast for me to consider whwther it would be good to reveal but i guess they are out now. I guess thats pretty much all power roles out, so at this point we may consider a massclaim
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These claims came to fast for me to consider whwther it would be good to reveal but i guess they are out now. I guess thats pretty much all power roles out, so at this point we may consider a massclaim
Can we please keep Fu Hua hidden? ffs
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These claims came to fast for me to consider whwther it would be good to reveal but i guess they are out now. I guess thats pretty much all power roles out, so at this point we may consider a massclaim
Can we please keep Fu Hua hidden? ffs
Nah, I don't think so.
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Hm, actually I dont like a massclaim just yet
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At this point, town is playing a losing game unless we throw out extra info that will help win the game, from my point of view (other info is not relevant). Hence my claim of Emma Planck to begin with. Just going with random or inactive lynches isn't working when you're not hitting mafia to see correlations, no need to continue a losing strategy.
Maybe if literally all information was on the table, Frederica Tesla would be able to discern some Core usage. But so far, unless it was Core of Reason, there has been no visible Honkai Core usage, so there does not seem to be significant use out of that.
I really can't tell if outing all this info was the best move, but continuing the old course meant a certain town loss.
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Ah, right. andretimpa as Raiden Mei, then.
in which case he is mafia.
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im still confused by what happens if raden and seele target, sky please do explain ty
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N0: Oa and DC. Even tho there is no NK, we still have Rozalya to worry about. Oa looked like someone that wouldn't be a doc top priority (I'd say Link and rob were these), but still useful to town - (which is more or less the reasoning for the N0 in last game). DC on the other hand seemed expendable (mostly shitposts there).
It seemed sensible to me at the time. If DC is mafia!Seele I screwed up here, feel free to lynch me.
N1: Oa and MW. Protecting Oa here. Following the plan we laid out at the beggining.
N2: torb and MW. torb started telegraphing already that he was Emma (talking way more about that role than other ones). Since we needed him alive for the ian plan to go through I prioritized him over Oa.
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She already did. Same targets nothing happens. 1 target the same- target absorbs all 3 things
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i am not buying andres n0 reasoning tbh. Using any vig roles n0 were bound to result in emma plank and out the mafia. I will read up on andres interaction with DC to see if it suggests w/w or no
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Anyway gn. I have a lot to think about
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moe, confirm kdz is town just for the sake of it?
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N0: Oa and DC. Even tho there is no NK, we still have Rozalya to worry about. Oa looked like someone that wouldn't be a doc top priority (I'd say Link and rob were these), but still useful to town - (which is more or less the reasoning for the N0 in last game). DC on the other hand seemed expendable (mostly shitposts there).
Scum Rozaliya gets Emma'd and lynched instantly. DC was likely (more likel than any other person) to be Seele, which was the motivation for me to target him. Another plus is that he'd struggle to be around EOD. Which I see as a good reason to confirm them as town.
kdz is town.
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Well I got my thai food, but WOW a lot has been posted now. Okay, well... first off, thank you for revealing that torb, I was willing to hedge that if there was a raiden and they were mafia, we would at least be able to track them down. Figured the worst case was we lose our conf town for a conf mafia, but I see now I hadn't even considered there to be two raidens. Obv that plan can't work, but I must say I am still in favor of a cali kill anyway... Though obviously less so now, so I'll bow out to town consensus
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moe, confirm kdz is town just for the sake of it?
Sorry, you can still tunnel me though. I don't mind.
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N1: Oa and MW. Protecting Oa here. Following the plan we laid out at the beggining.
N2: torb and MW. torb started telegraphing already that he was Emma (talking way more about that role than other ones). Since we needed him alive for the ian plan to go through I prioritized him over Oa.
While those make sense they're equally good plays as scum.
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moe, confirm kdz is town just for the sake of it?
Sorry, you can still tunnel me though. I don't mind.
(https://i.imgflip.com/1rsim2.jpg)
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I would like to see DC disclose everything he knows, then have the rest claim. I hope we can agree on the first part for now.
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I would like to see DC disclose everything he knows, then have the rest claim. I hope we can agree on the first part for now.
that'll likely happen tomorrow or later tonight, given his likelihood of being asleep right now.
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I would like to see DC disclose everything he knows, then have the rest claim. I hope we can agree on the first part for now.
first part, yh. Might still be worth not having the rest claim to hide Fu Hua imo
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The cons of messing up targeting with Raiden Mei far, far outweighs the insignificant chance of having a helpful kill redirect on a night with no nightkill. Unless you actually knew their alignments, which makes you mafia. Lynch andretimpa.
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The cons of messing up targeting with Raiden Mei far, far outweighs the insignificant chance of having a helpful kill redirect on a night with no nightkill. Unless you actually knew their alignments, which makes you mafia. Lynch andretimpa.
i tried to :'(
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Still, if we want to give andre/DC the benefit of the doubt, kaempfs plan works.
Ok raiden protect moe and seele protect torb i guess.
Mafia definitely wants us dead, so raiden/seele getting NK-ed is logical and preferred over getting mislynched. If one of us dies, town immediately knows whom to lynch.
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She already did. Same targets nothing happens. 1 target the same- target absorbs all 3 things
This seems to go really well with that plan, since mafia will no longer be able to NK the one taking the hit to hit the power role.
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After the abject disaster the previous game was for me --- getting shock!stormed after investing so much, taking time off from family and kids' things, slacking behind on work, and other RL things I should not exactly have been doing to play that game (73). All that effort went totally into the $#@!er when shock decided to go full fill_in_your_own_term_here and ridiculously thunderdome t/t with me where I Managed to CORRECTLY as town identify that he was also town and push elsewhere... not to dredge up the whole thing, but I attest that it gave me a rEALLY sour taste toward putting in top-poster kind of effort. So the fallout is this game you've seen me miss two EOD (1 and 3) to do family and then a long-time reconnected friend things, and to try to stay caught up at work, and generally prioritize this game more properly in my life. You can thank the above mentioned turn of events if you don't like the rob I've become in Elements mafia.
So, yes, I missed EOD again today, and I"ll admit to not even once checking in until a few minutes ago reading up after the day's activities have settled. I'll be putting a few posts together but in about 40 minutes I"ll be closing this game again in order to do other things more important to me. #sorrynotsorry
Give me a bit to re-read start-of-night again here, because I am somewhat sure I have a few things to say about a few aspects. Also, I do NOT support any sort of mass roleclaim yet. I think the claims we have on the table now can sort into at least one scum and looks quite possibly two...? Stay tuned 8-)
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Getting a serious vibe of rob just not caring this game. I kinda scumread it as you can easily pickup from many of my posts, but I've also never seen a scum trying to save a town last minute before. Idk
rob probably is content with shock lynch and fulfilled his goal this game. I'm sure many share your observation about rob.
No, once again I read him as town last game despite his ridiculous thunderdome false case against me last game... and I was leaning him quite town again this game but missed EOD and you pleebs mislynched town!shock. I am not happy that a town shock died that way. The vibe you're getting kae (that moe thinks lots may share) is quite accurate that I have dialed WAY back my level of caring about these online games. It is not a slight to anyone as an offense, but I have my reasons. Alright, now I really will attempt to keep it to more game-type replies etc. :thumbsup:
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
The only way I see TorB as trying to ridiculously play this Emma claim as mafia would be if Durandal is also scum or if Durandal would be DEAD already. The latter hasn't happened and the former (Durandal!moe and Emma!TorB both being scum) seems SO SO SO far fetched for the timing as scum have town on the ropes a little bit, no way that scum duo goes crazy fancy play for no reason at this stage. I am all in ride-or-die moving forward as TorB's claim 100% true. I know this was already the general thread direction, but I want to put it out there for clarity. I'm also all-in on buying moe's claim as real.
timpa = Raiden Mei original
DC = Raiden ability via passive copying
---> The odds of this particularly useful-to-scum ability getting copied by a town from a town is almost ludicrous to consider. ---> It seems very very likely at least one is scum and very probably both are scum, right? Like if timpa is town and DC is scum then scum team probably feeling like winning lottery when he was hit with that scum-useful ability on a N0 when the Raiden ability being used seems to heavily favor being used only by scum. It really makes sense both are scum and timpa felt Oa was a good place to dump the other half of his intent to get DC a useful scum role.
Now that we have some EOD dynamics I think I can build some reads
Linkcat (n-) Most of what he posted during the day was fairly neutral. The way he pushed for a shock lynch could just be bad blood from the previous game (which shouldn't be a thing imo) but that would also be a perfect cover.
Torb (v) The effort he put into strategizing and discussing strats was very townie imo (scum wants a confused town, discussing roles clears up confusion). On top of that he insisted on going after someone he actually had a read on during EOD.
Oa (v) Unless there is a ruse involving a mafia Durandal, oa is confirmed. The way he played in EOD was similar to torb, which points in the same direction
ian (n-) Only a few low content posts during the day is remembering me the ian from the previous game (tho apparently he always plays like this). He was mostly self preserving during EOD which I consider NAI
w3 (n) My vote on him was based on an awkward interaction that he had with rob, which was the closest to a tell I had that far. During EOD, the de-escalation between him and DC felt like mutual self preservation. Tho he kept defending DC even when he was top lynch, which is not something I see scum doing, so I'm putting him back to neutral.
MW (n) his posting has been lackluster so far, so not much to form a read. During EOD his only move was hopping on the shock train (from a vote on kae?). Needs more for a proper read.
dawn (n-) Nearly no posts, not even a vote (when people agreed on voting all days).
kae (n) His interaction with moe was weird to say the least, but I also think that was just kae missing a joke. His voting always on people with no votes yet strikes me as someone without a solid idea on who to vote, but still trying to avoid Bronya shenanigans (I'd say that's NAI in D1)
Sub (n) His posting has felt mostly neutral to me, during EOD he just parked the vote on DC, which is not much to read imo, just means they are likely not w/w.
kdz (n) Not much substance so far, but he has a good excuse for that. Just parked on dawn and stuck to it (even tho dawn will probably just die to Cecilia). Needs more for a better read.
Coffee (v) Has been actively discussing strategy and has been proactive, which is good for town. During voting he stuck since the beggining in the DC train (which as with Sub just tells me they are likely not alligned)
rob (n) He's quieter than usual, but still prodding people to talk (tho with rob that's NAI, as he does that as scum too). Wasn't around for EOD, so nothing to read there.
DC (n) His interaction with Link was a bit awkward, but on the other hand DC is also a shitposter and that could very well be just memeing. Did mostly self preservation at EOD and had to leave early. Will be keeping a closer eye on him, but I'll stick with an n for now
Cal (n) Few posts, but they at least had some content. Wasn't around for EOD but parked on DC. Need more for a better read.
Naii (n) Not enough content to make a read so far. Was voting just for the sake of voting (due to Bronya). I feel like mafia wouldn't do that unless all the wagons (DC, MW and w3 at the time of his vote) were town.
moe (n+) This is more of a feeling tbh, I got some town vibes from the way he reacted to kae. Wasn't around for EOD.
--> So where is your scumread-push follow-up on who you thought N0 was scummy to get a redirect of what might hit "towny"Oa?
During the night my reads remained mostly the same (only exception being my scumlean on dawn softening a bit, but that's not relevant anymore). I'll be voting for now on the only surviving n- on my list
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
You still haven't scumread DC but your N0 claim heavily insinuates you were/should have been... this would have been a GREAT chance for you to push scumread!DC instead you go elsewhere? If you're scum which quite likely right now, and DC is town SURELY SURELY you would have been ok pushing him with me like you were later with town!MW?? You treated two scumreads that I've pushed a lot VERY differently. I think you and DC are both scum.
My vote onto DC, trouble getting naltest vote count copied >.<
Any appetite still for DC lynch? I know he is AFK, but last game I went too sfot on my scumreads at EOD's...
I'm not that confortable jumping on the wagon Coffee pushed so hard. I'm staying on ian for now
THIS is almost like you're townreading DC? Where did you change your mind? It certainly isn't in your ISO. You never pushed DC despite you N0 action claim insinuating you scumread him N0... you never helped me push his wagon (but you did so on my town!MW scumread??). You actually defer AWAY from a DC vote/push when I asked you to go there. Hmm.
Didn't had time to post reads earlier, but here they are
Only weird move I saw here was him moving his vote from ian to w3, right after ian's targets were revealed
But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...
Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?
No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?
And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.
For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB
o.O
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
That sounds better, now I'll let someone break ties again :D
still looks pretty minor to me, so I won't change my classification
I see no reason to change Oa's read. He is as close as mechanicaly confirmed as we have
The update is mostly due to mulling over his claim a bit. On one hand there are better things to claim than Red thread of Fate, on the other hand no repeating roles + the lynch all liars policy could make a counterclaim likely, even if not during EOD. Overall it seems more town than scum looking in retrospect (or so does my gut say :P)
Adding up on that, we can test ian's loyalty with Coffee, so I don't see a reason to push harder here
Also, this is a good point, even tho it was brought up after EOD
Could we use ian's ability to help control Coffee? If this is not a dumb idea I'd be willing to move my vote from him.
Sure, let mafia know ian is going to use his ability on Coffee and his next target.
During EOD, he stayed for quite a bit on kdz, before starting the Naii train and staying there until EOD. He also suggests going for DC or Cal. Not 100% sure how to read this (self preservation again, like in EOD1?)
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
Naiis vote on me is the only one i feel sketchy on my wagon. Cal and DC are other good targets imo.
Low content on posts deserves a scum bump at this point, imo. Also, this post
I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!
MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].
You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.
That's got to be one of the worse reasons to tr rob, he always engages in conversation. Are you trying to deflect rob's scumlean on you with this?
imo the most relevant thing about kae so far is his read on DC (based on wagonomics)
Reminder that i still think day1 wagonomics make dc town
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
I didn't lynch voted shock last time to save DC, I lynch voted shock to prevent no lynch. So there we go, no issue with me.
In fact noone voted with intent to save dc
which will be interesting if we lynch DC, but so far just paints a correlation between the two for me.
During EOD he was on the MW wagon, then jumped to Naii
AWOL, will get modkilled if this doesn't change
Putting him on n- until he cuts down on the breadposting
The whole Cecilia thing rubbed me a bit the wrong way. After thinking about it for a bit I still think he's more likely town than scum. Basicaly, the rest of his game makes little sense if this was a scum premeditated move. Why bother building town cred when that is known to be different than your usual play style, if you are just planning on doing something like this? Coffee could have just coasted, killed dawn and forced Emma to spend the ability to find him (unless he thought dawn would reveal him if he was just coasting).
Anyway, I'd be a bit cautious about him, until we get more information.
I don't see anything out of the ordinary here, rob being inquisitive and pushing his scumreads is his regular play (NAI) and there is no reason from mechanics to scumread him so far
(spoiler removed by rob to emphasize in my current post)DC (n)
I agree with kae here that EOD1 makes him look more towny, but I'd really want more content besides bread, before giving him a town bump
His lack of posting makes i difficult to get any read. I think this deserves a scum bump at this point of the game
I'm liking his posts so far. They are a bit hard to follow, but still show his thought process
Wasn't again around for EOD.
TL;DR
town bumps: ian
scum bumps: MW, kdz, Coffee, Cal
---> You really really really should have at some point thinking DC was scummy if you really thought N0 he was scummy enough to redirect onto from towny Oa?!!?
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@TorB-
I think Raiden Mei swaps ALL targeting on two players... you posted thinking it would allow scum to prevent saves from a NK but the role description for Raiden Mei directly states NK included gets swapped.
My time to look over the recent developments is now at a close. I bid adieu for now.
In closing--
DC very very likely scum, and timpa too.
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I go to sleep, and I come back and people wanna lynch me, what's new?
Yeah TorB's right, I'm Seele, I got slapped N0 with Raiden, and I didn't use my ability all game, because that would be stupid, and I already implied I didn't since D1, because I said it would be stupid. I coulda saved people, but I knew that the OG Raiden was being stupid and I didn't wanna contribute to that mess and I didn't know the implications if I picked the same targets or something.
N0: Oa and DC. Even tho there is no NK, we still have Rozalya to worry about. Oa looked like someone that wouldn't be a doc top priority (I'd say Link and rob were these), but still useful to town - (which is more or less the reasoning for the N0 in last game). DC on the other hand seemed expendable (mostly shitposts there).
Expendable? Excuse me? :( Plus I finally got a shiny fun role and you, you had to take it all away from me... Sucks even more backreading and realised I coulda been the second Dura too... bah :/.
Since MW is dead, Coffee/ian/timpa then, calling it. Probably all this new info is certainly not gonna help my case, but if I count correct we got at least 2 mislynches left so, eh. I'm sure even I'm the next mislynch we're gonna win anyway /shrug
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Also rob, I know you hate my guts in this game, but take care of yourself man... no silly children's game is worth losing yourself over...
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Had to come back to post one more.... (and I see DC is feeling the heat!)
ShowerThoughts(TM):
If DC is scum, then as a somewhat vocal player this game and someone carrying around a scumread of DC and trying to lynch him more than once ---- why am I still alive? (Could be a bit narcissistic but that's the thought: if it is DC as part of the team then why kill Link on N1 without trying to kill me?) Hmmmmm. Anyway, hopefully you stay active posting this Night + Day phase DC - if you're town then it only helps us try to see that in your posts and not kill you and if you're scum well you can only risk exposing teammates or finding some quality lolcatting to contribute a little of.
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Had to come back to post one more.... (and I see DC is feeling the heat!)
ShowerThoughts(TM):
If DC is scum, then as a somewhat vocal player this game and someone carrying around a scumread of DC and trying to lynch him more than once ---- why am I still alive? (Could be a bit narcissistic but that's the thought: if it is DC as part of the team then why kill Link on N1 without trying to kill me?) Hmmmmm. Anyway, hopefully you stay active posting this Night + Day phase DC - if you're town then it only helps us try to see that in your posts and not kill you and if you're scum well you can only risk exposing teammates or finding some quality lolcatting to contribute a little of.
me too
but this makes us both look like we're on a team with DC
but then why bus him?
it seems like DC is just scum seele//raiden to me and this only confirms my earlier suspicions.
i will have to read back to see andre's reactions, I had townread a lot of his reads but thinking back maybe it was coasting? idk not sure give me some time
what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
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Alright, I do want the massclaim after all and I want to claim last. Not because I'm looking for roles to hide as but because I have insight that at least one person is lying and may catch more.
Trust me you'll see once I reveal.
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@rob
Raiden Mei redirects everything, so say Fu Hua targets me and no one targets ian. You nightkill ian and use Raiden Mei on me and ian. The result is ian getting targeted by Fu Hua and me being dead. Medic save bypassed.
Alright, I do want the massclaim after all and I want to claim last. Not because I'm looking for roles to hide as but because I have insight that at least one person is lying and may catch more.
Trust me you'll see once I reveal.
I am okay with this.
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what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
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I'm Liliya Olenyeva.
I know it will look scummy, but I fully intent to protect myself from the Coffee/ian plan, if it comes to that. I don't trust that Coffee is not mafia, and the plan to trade me and another person of ian's choosing(since deciding the target in the thread is bound to fail) to confirm him feels really bad. Not worth trading 2 civvies to confirm one.
what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
I'm not sure if this is exactly how it works, but if he's redirected, it would be his first shot on anyone it redirects to but me, so it shouldn't vig them, right?
Here's a basic readlist as well
vv
kdz
v
TorB
kae
moe
n+
ian
rob
n
Sub
www3
n-
w
timpa
Coffee
DC
ww
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what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
I'm not sure if this is exactly how it works, but if he's redirected, it would be his first shot on anyone it redirects to but me, so it shouldn't vig them, right?
Right, but if Raiden/Seele are scum and Coffee is town, agreeing on a target allows Cecilia to be redirected onto you, killing you.
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what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
I'm not sure if this is exactly how it works, but if he's redirected, it would be his first shot on anyone it redirects to but me, so it shouldn't vig them, right?
Right, but if Raiden/Seele are scum and Coffee is town, agreeing on a target allows Cecilia to be redirected onto you, killing you.
Well, he can probably target someone else at random then, and hope that the ability is not redirected. Also, if they use the ability like that, they can't redirect the NK as well, unless they have both Seele and Raiden.
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The only way I see TorB as trying to ridiculously play this Emma claim as mafia would be if Durandal is also scum or if Durandal would be DEAD already. The latter hasn't happened and the former (Durandal!moe and Emma!TorB both being scum) seems SO SO SO far fetched for the timing as scum have town on the ropes a little bit, no way that scum duo goes crazy fancy play for no reason at this stage. I am all in ride-or-die moving forward as TorB's claim 100% true. I know this was already the general thread direction, but I want to put it out there for clarity. I'm also all-in on buying moe's claim as real.
Me townreading you also stems from my role. I had a strong idea that you were Emma and therefore townreading me. I still don't fully grasp your read but now I can focus my thoughts in another direction.
I go to sleep, and I come back and people wanna lynch me, what's new?
Yeah TorB's right, I'm Seele, I got slapped N0 with Raiden, and I didn't use my ability all game, because that would be stupid, and I already implied I didn't since D1, because I said it would be stupid. I coulda saved people, but I knew that the OG Raiden was being stupid and I didn't wanna contribute to that mess and I didn't know the implications if I picked the same targets or something.
N0: Oa and DC. Even tho there is no NK, we still have Rozalya to worry about. Oa looked like someone that wouldn't be a doc top priority (I'd say Link and rob were these), but still useful to town - (which is more or less the reasoning for the N0 in last game). DC on the other hand seemed expendable (mostly shitposts there).
Expendable? Excuse me? :( Plus I finally got a shiny fun role and you, you had to take it all away from me... Sucks even more backreading and realised I coulda been the second Dura too... bah :/.
Since MW is dead, Coffee/ian/timpa then, calling it. Probably all this new info is certainly not gonna help my case, but if I count correct we got at least 2 mislynches left so, eh. I'm sure even I'm the next mislynch we're gonna win anyway /shrug
Scum could also see the risk of town!Seele getting a power role and giving them Raiden instead. This significantly decreases the probability of Core of Lightning. This in return would mean we need to worry about Core of Death more. I'm not sure what roles can prevent this. Yae Sakura is dangerous to play with.
Alright, I do want the massclaim after all and I want to claim last. Not because I'm looking for roles to hide as but because I have insight that at least one person is lying and may catch more.
Trust me you'll see once I reveal.
I'm game. You're smart enough to know ou have to deliver. ;)
To put it in words: andre is my biggest scumread at this moment.
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what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
I'm not sure if this is exactly how it works, but if he's redirected, it would be his first shot on anyone it redirects to but me, so it shouldn't vig them, right?
Right, but if Raiden/Seele are scum and Coffee is town, agreeing on a target allows Cecilia to be redirected onto you, killing you.
Well, he can probably target someone else at random then, and hope that the ability is not redirected. Also, if they use the ability like that, they can't redirect the NK as well, unless they have both Seele and Raiden.
N0 Raiden makes the most sense if you wanted Seele to get Raiden from my point of view. Your current scum reads are also Seele and Raiden, so I do not want to give a plausible excuse of being redirected.
@moehrpi
How would scum know DC was Seele again? Cocalia flipped town, so they should not have known?
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Also, does everyone remember the timings of the clarifications of multiple Raidens intersecting? I think we can read something into this as well. Town DC asking for this clarification via pms does not seem very likely, and no one else should have known there were two Raidens at that point unless DC is scum. Galaxy brain read right there :silly:
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Ok, here's my current summary on the situation that people can refer to should I get killed.
My current guess on the scum team is, in order of likelihood:
- andretimpa
- DoubleCapitals
- CoffeeDitto
If anyone not on that list has concrete evidence of a third mafia in favor of Coffee, my following plan for this night will be void. The plan is to give the entire auspected scum team a chance to redeem themselves. If I die, they failed at that and you should probably stick to lynching that team.
andretimpa: target moehrpi and Calindu
DoubleCapitals: target TheonlyrealBeef and Calindu
Coffeeditto: target Calindu
Calindu: use Flash Counter
The only way I can see us not lynching Coffee tomorrow is if someone has a concrete lead on a different scum member or he kills himself. Killing yourself instead of mislynch is a pro town move.
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COFFEE, DO NOT USE ABILITY IF YPU ARE TOWN
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Kaemp, are you sure on role claim? Not only do we risk outing Fu Hua, if it doesn’t exist we are telling mafia that info
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Ok, here's my current summary on the situation that people can refer to should I get killed.
My current guess on the scum team is, in order of likelihood:
- andretimpa
- DoubleCapitals
- CoffeeDitto
If anyone not on that list has concrete evidence of a third mafia in favor of Coffee, my following plan for this night will be void. The plan is to give the entire auspected scum team a chance to redeem themselves. If I die, they failed at that and you should probably stick to lynching that team.
andretimpa: target moehrpi and Calindu
DoubleCapitals: target TheonlyrealBeef and Calindu
Coffeeditto: target Calindu
Calindu: use Flash Counter
The only way I can see us not lynching Coffee tomorrow is if someone has a concrete lead on a different scum member or he kills himself. Killing yourself instead of mislynch is a pro town move.
In this case, how does raden mei redirect work, if cal is targetted does the target move to moe or Torb or both?
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Sticks to Calindu as sky clarified before.
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Also I don’t think coffee dc is w/w becauze coffee was very much trying to kill DC earlier on iirc?
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Then follow kaempfer13s plan and hope we get a different mafia team.
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We/I did make a dumb mistake in hammering on Andre so early, shouldve waited to see if anyone comes to support him first. BUT, it is what it issss
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I'd say w3 is the 3rd mafia member instead of Coffee.
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Ok, here's my current summary on the situation that people can refer to should I get killed.
My current guess on the scum team is, in order of likelihood:
- andretimpa
- DoubleCapitals
- CoffeeDitto
If anyone not on that list has concrete evidence of a third mafia in favor of Coffee, my following plan for this night will be void. The plan is to give the entire auspected scum team a chance to redeem themselves. If I die, they failed at that and you should probably stick to lynching that team.
andretimpa: target moehrpi and Calindu
DoubleCapitals: target TheonlyrealBeef and Calindu
Coffeeditto: target Calindu
Calindu: use Flash Counter
The only way I can see us not lynching Coffee tomorrow is if someone has a concrete lead on a different scum member or he kills himself. Killing yourself instead of mislynch is a pro town move.
EBWOP: re this^
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what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
I'm not sure if this is exactly how it works, but if he's redirected, it would be his first shot on anyone it redirects to but me, so it shouldn't vig them, right?
Right, but if Raiden/Seele are scum and Coffee is town, agreeing on a target allows Cecilia to be redirected onto you, killing you.
Well, he can probably target someone else at random then, and hope that the ability is not redirected. Also, if they use the ability like that, they can't redirect the NK as well, unless they have both Seele and Raiden.
N0 Raiden makes the most sense if you wanted Seele to get Raiden from my point of view. Your current scum reads are also Seele and Raiden, so I do not want to give a plausible excuse of being redirected.
@moehrpi
How would scum know DC was Seele again? Cocalia flipped town, so they should not have known?
Not know, just play the odds. DC posted it in his entry post.
Also, does everyone remember the timings of the clarifications of multiple Raidens intersecting? I think we can read something into this as well. Town DC asking for this clarification via pms does not seem very likely, and no one else should have known there were two Raidens at that point unless DC is scum. Galaxy brain read right there :silly:
I was suspicious after N0 but obviously did not know. My 'can confirm' after your reveal was not positive but it lined up perfectly with my observations.
Ok, here's my current summary on the situation that people can refer to should I get killed.
My current guess on the scum team is, in order of likelihood:
- andretimpa
- DoubleCapitals
- CoffeeDitto
If anyone not on that list has concrete evidence of a third mafia in favor of Coffee, my following plan for this night will be void. The plan is to give the entire auspected scum team a chance to redeem themselves. If I die, they failed at that and you should probably stick to lynching that team.
andretimpa: target moehrpi and Calindu
DoubleCapitals: target TheonlyrealBeef and Calindu
Coffeeditto: target Calindu
Calindu: use Flash Counter
The only way I can see us not lynching Coffee tomorrow is if someone has a concrete lead on a different scum member or he kills himself. Killing yourself instead of mislynch is a pro town move.
I have a very different understanding of how the mechanics work. If mafia NK Cal in this scenario, you and I end up dead, Flash Counter does nothing. o0
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Phantom Image: If both abilities target the exact same two players, they effectively cancel out and no swap will happen that night. If both abilities share one target, that player will be affected by any abilities targeting either of the other targets, as well as any abilities that would target them. (For example, if one Mei targets Players A and B, and another targets Players B and C, anything that targets one of those three players will target Player B instead.) This can result in an ability having fewer targets than before. (Continuing the previous example, if Kallen Kaslana targets both Players A and B with Red Thread of Fate, only Player B will be affected, which effectively does nothing.)
Here, the relevant clarification.
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I didnt have the Impression that coffee/andre were w/w although i dont remember what made me think that also yh coffee/dc also seems unlikely
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I like the current developments. So, do I roleclaim now? Yes?
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Yes
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Kaemp, are you sure on role claim? Not only do we risk outing Fu Hua, if it doesn’t exist we are telling mafia that info
I am sure.
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Phantom Image: If both abilities target the exact same two players, they effectively cancel out and no swap will happen that night. If both abilities share one target, that player will be affected by any abilities targeting either of the other targets, as well as any abilities that would target them. (For example, if one Mei targets Players A and B, and another targets Players B and C, anything that targets one of those three players will target Player B instead.) This can result in an ability having fewer targets than before. (Continuing the previous example, if Kallen Kaslana targets both Players A and B with Red Thread of Fate, only Player B will be affected, which effectively does nothing.)
Here, the relevant clarification.
I remember not liking that clarification at the time it was posted either. Well, thanks. I guess that's one possible plan then.
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I'm da one and only... Yae Sakurae! Yes, I can make up to 3 people's abilities fail, but since that would have been scummy, I did not use it at all.~
I do not have proper crumbs, but I tried to ask people earlier whether it is safe to claim my role, or can mafia utilize my ability by copying it. I planned to reveal at that point, because people were concerned that Yae could interfere with them, and I wanted to rest them assured that I won't.
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Sub doesnt understand his ability. Anyway need w3 and rob now. Kdz is conf town so doesnt nwcessarily have to claim I guess.
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kae, a lot of Fates are being entrusted to your hands these next hours. Godspeed in your responsibilities with this information.
I am Fu Hua. I have used every night. I very much prefer, very very much prefer not to reveal targets. At least this way there is a chance to bluff or double bluff or something scum about where I target.
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Bronya, y’all made me vote every phase smh
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what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
I'm not sure if this is exactly how it works, but if he's redirected, it would be his first shot on anyone it redirects to but me, so it shouldn't vig them, right?
Right, but if Raiden/Seele are scum and Coffee is town, agreeing on a target allows Cecilia to be redirected onto you, killing you.
Well, he can probably target someone else at random then, and hope that the ability is not redirected. Also, if they use the ability like that, they can't redirect the NK as well, unless they have both Seele and Raiden.
N0 Raiden makes the most sense if you wanted Seele to get Raiden from my point of view. Your current scum reads are also Seele and Raiden, so I do not want to give a plausible excuse of being redirected.
@moehrpi
How would scum know DC was Seele again? Cocalia flipped town, so they should not have known?
Not know, just play the odds. DC posted it in his entry post.
I knew I shouldn't have let my ex-bf pick 3 characters.
andretimpa: target moehrpi and Calindu
DoubleCapitals: target TheonlyrealBeef and Calindu
Coffeeditto: target Calindu
Calindu: use Flash Counter
I feel like if the scum team is who I think it is, this is gonna fail in some capacity no matter what... But regardless of the night outcome we probably get some decent trades for once come tomorrow
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Lol, self criticism when oa died . Anyway 1 more to go.
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EBWOP okay to explain he wasn't an ex until after the game begun :sillyspin:
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kae, a lot of Fates are being entrusted to your hands these next hours. Godspeed in your responsibilities with this information.
I am Fu Hua. I have used every night. I very much prefer, very very much prefer not to reveal targets. At least this way there is a chance to bluff or double bluff or something scum about where I target.
Ty for keeping me alive :thumbs-up:
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Oh missed w3s post.
I am Frederica Tesla.
Shock didnt have a honkai core and i was really pissed he significantly decreased the effectiveness of my ability.
Anyway 7 abilities other than my own were used n1.
Now the important part: N2 i targeted sub, kdz, coffee, mw, ian and cal n2. Only a single ability was used, coffees. However if andre and dc are truthfull I should have witnessed torb use an ability as well
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I made sky doublecheck that the count of abilities was correct, so andre and/or Dc are lying. I dont need to explain why there isnt a single world in the multiverse where torb lies and coffee is reluctantly backed by calindu
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So sorry torb your plan doesnt work, a raiden is scum. Dc,andre if you're town the other one is outed to you.
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so andre and/or Dc are lying
Also, :water is wet :^)
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Btw, dc actually said that rate up was a lie, claiming that he didnt get any of the roles his friend suggested, though he did. Perhaps he wanted to disguise as real raiden from the start.+ I too thought that seele clarification came a bit early, making it seem planned. So yh I think both are wolves. Sorry I defended dc for so long.
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Also rob I dont really see a problem outing targets more than a night ago
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So sorry torb your plan doesnt work, a raiden is scum. Dc,andre if you're town the other one is outed to you.
I never expected it to work, tbh. I was hoping mafia would realize it's best to play along so our power roles live another night and we get no new info from the NK :sillyspin:
Btw, dc actually said that rate up was a lie, claiming that he didnt get any of the roles his friend suggested, though he did. Perhaps he wanted to disguise as real raiden from the start.+ I too thought that seele clarification came a bit early, making it seem planned. So yh I think both are wolves. Sorry I defended dc for so long.
Agreed, and not a problem. But what about number three? If it is really Coffee, then he is the most dangerous one. Raiden Mei just messes with Fu Hua, but not much else.
The roles I pm-ed were: Durandal, Emma Planck, Rozaliya Olenyeva
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I did not know you could submit this in private
/me facepalms
Damn you, shock.
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We can leash coffee. We can ask ian to target dc and timpa, coffee to target one of them. If they get redirected pnto cal a scum raiden dies.
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Well unless both target cal, in which case they are outed as teammates.
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Please have it noted I was the first to vote DC and the first to vote timpa. Kthnxbye.
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We can leash coffee. We can ask ian to target dc and timpa, coffee to target one of them. If they get redirected pnto cal a scum raiden dies.
And if Cal dies, Coffee just outed himself as scum. Cal should threaten to use ability every night, but never reveal the night it was actually used to sweeten the deal.
Well unless both target cal, in which case they are outed as teammates.
Too risky for maf if Cal chooses to use Flash Counter.
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Please have it noted I was the first to vote DC and the first to vote timpa. Kthnxbye.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcSu2mMu6edqMs-q317bkxtuZ4w-RkZlcLp_yA&usqp=CAU)
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Hm, or coffee is scum in that case who just murdered cal straight up. Either way we'll find 2 scum witth the plan with at most a missvig and a misslynch
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We can leash coffee. We can ask ian to target dc and timpa, coffee to target one of them. If they get redirected pnto cal a scum raiden dies.
Can’t a raiden just redirect Ian’s ability on another town, killing two town tonight?
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Scenario coffee t plus one of them town also exists, in which case coffee priming one should go through and we lynch the other one
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We can leash coffee. We can ask ian to target dc and timpa, coffee to target one of them. If they get redirected pnto cal a scum raiden dies.
Can’t a raiden just redirect Ian’s ability on another town, killing two town tonight?
only cal can die from it
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And ians ability will avenge cal
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We can leash coffee. We can ask ian to target dc and timpa, coffee to target one of them. If they get redirected pnto cal a scum raiden dies.
Can’t a raiden just redirect Ian’s ability on another town, killing two town tonight?
Right, they can redirect both ends of the ability if both are scum. One onto Cal, the other onto another town.
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So who do I target? No one?
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Yh but thats equal to admitting both are scum. It does kill 2 towns though;yikes
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Yh but thats equal to admitting both are scum. It does kill 2 towns though;yikes
Only if Cal doesn't use Flash Counter.
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Oh shit 4 towns. Ok, bad idea
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5 even
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Nah 4 cal survives.
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Uh, no? Only Coffee.
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That is the only ability targeting Cal that would otherwise kill Cal if a lot of shenanigans happens.
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Oh right ian doesnt kill cal when redirected onto him, his ability fizzles and thus cant kill a town either
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So if coffee dies from counter and only a nk other than that dc andre are scum.
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Actually that sounds pretty good
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Other thing: number of abilities used n1 7 (other than me);
We know theresa, fu hua, kallan, raiden, cecilia, dawn was eor so should have used ability n0, so 2 more must amount out of honkai cores (only er and eor(?)really possible, except for idiotic use of void), kdz ability and dcs ability which he claims to not have used
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Oh missed w3s post.
I am Frederica Tesla.
Shock didnt have a honkai core and i was really pissed he significantly decreased the effectiveness of my ability.
Anyway 7 abilities other than my own were used n1.
Now the important part: N2 i targeted sub, kdz, coffee, mw, ian and cal n2. Only a single ability was used, coffees. However if andre and dc are truthfull I should have witnessed torb use an ability as well
DC must have targetted one of your targets (I'm aware this is WIFOM).
I gave you all the info I had, I'm aware how fishy the situation looks like and how everything I say will be seen as WIFOM. Just tell me what to do tonight once town comes to a conclusion and I'll follow along.
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Easiest way to confirm a Raiden Mei is actually town, is to successfully redirect the NK to a mafia tonight. How do you even do that? I can't tell you that, because I don't know whom the NK target will be. If you are town, that should be your goal, along with identifying the real mafia.
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I think if kdz holstered n1 we can safely assume that dc is scum and they have a core of lighning, which hasnt been used by any of my true targets n2. andretimpas claim is similiarly shaky independently, as it requires mw or coffee to be targeted by dc last night, his n0 reasoning is not convincing+ he seems more focussed on his own defense rather than being happy that DC is pretty much outted at last.
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We may actually have enough information to (relatively) safely assume that both dc and timpa are scum in which case it may be best for coffee to holster while both are alive.
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If timpa voted DC day 1, he would've been lynched. That there is all I need to know to make his claims seem weak. But there is no harm in revealing what the optimal strategy is in case they actually are town. It's in town's best interests to kill mafia, so in the unlikely case they are town, I'm telling them exactly what they can do to prevent what should otherwise be regarded as an almost guaranteed loss.
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i have to catch up on a lot holy cow. making post now
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I presume all are fine with me continuing to make own selections on who to target with my role? To be fair, I haven't exactly done a stellar job so far (the self deprication post kae refers to was legit self-disgust about subpar doc targeting) but I think it only has value if scum have to guess who I try to save which requires town is in the dark too?? The integral core parts of the plan regarding some outted roles and highly likely scum players does not seem to me to hinge on a doctor being part of the plan ... other than any kill save on town is a good save. 8-)
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If timpa voted DC day 1, he would've been lynched. That there is all I need to know to make his claims seem weak. But there is no harm in revealing what the optimal strategy is in case they actually are town. It's in town's best interests to kill mafia, so in the unlikely case they are town, I'm telling them exactly what they can do to prevent what should otherwise be regarded as an almost guaranteed loss.
The first night portion of timpa's role claim would have fit oh so well with him voting DC too. I even prodded him about "hey how about voting DC" at some point and he politely declined with a deflection that appears to me completely counter-positional to his claimed DC scumread (that is, his role claim indicates his N0 action was due to scumleaning DC but all his voting and posting is opposite to such a stance being real).
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I presume all are fine with me continuing to make own selections on who to target with my role?
Even scum might be a good target with Raiden Meis on the loose. As long as at least one of them is scum, they can deflect your ability. Pre-planned is a bad idea for sure.
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Even scum might be a good target with Raiden Meis on the loose.
I'm not sure Nightkill can even be intentionally used on another mafia with the intent to deflect it with Raiden Mei, though. So it's more likely scum would just pick some town that they think will not be protected to use the nightkill on. Though "that they think will not be protected" just gained a whole new dimension by pointing it out ;)
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lol well role claiming didnt do much.
Dying wish? Lynch coffee
Regrets? No Ragrets
Suspected Mafia? coffee/super active person/probably moe
Lynching me is just going to show you that rob and torb start wagoning me and people jump on and off.
TBH if i live, i spam coffee with my role.
I'm still uncertain as to why he tunneled me so hard this game, and I know he flipped town but this reads scummy anyway. weird weird weird
Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
this leaves me wondering why you weren't nightkilled already, but i town read you very much for outing all of this without needing to. the double raiden is very concerning. i'm glad we discussed the possibility earlier.
Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
at this point so many people have claimed their roles that unless people are roleswapping (which is scummy according to the majority of us, I guess?) then whoever the mafia is can pick through us and figure out who is or isn't dura or medics.
Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
I'm going to get food right now, but this is interesting. Very interesting. Thank you torb. Hopefully someone sends you a health checkup, but we dont even know if the doctor is in.
There are at least two, the Raiden Mei and Seele Vollerei.
I wonder, wouldnt it be worth asking everyone to roleclaim and then use this as the slip?
What about this?
no not now, i meant why not ask for a role claim before reveal :/
That would still out all the power roles to mafia, which I didn't think to be a good idea. I was already being considered for protection anyway, so that does not change much. If anything, I'm more curious why DoubleCapitals did not already claim.
Would mafia give themselves a second Raiden? I didn't liek the thought from mafia perspective but there aren't too many other roles that you want to have. If not there is at least one town Raiden / semi-doc.
I trust ian to be town, so I want him to use his ability.
Target should be preset, so that Raiden Mei interference is either intentional and scum or non-existant. I had a theory on whom Raiden is (town) and whom Seele, but when I checked lynch votes, it didn't make sense for Seele to be the Nightkill sink from their perspective.
Raiden Mei allows mafia to bypass Fu Hua protection and divert Durandal onto a different target. It is incredibly useful as mafia. If this happened to Durandal, now might be a perfect time to claim so we can hang the original targets. Otherwise, it would not have made sense to claim this as Durandal as it would out their identity but not that of the perpetrator. Ignore this topic altogether if this did not happen, I already know whom you are, others need not know.
Trusting you on this one. I am Durandal and targeted DC N0.
okay nevermind then.
If we just traded two power roles for two scum, things are looking good. But you must really not use any vig roles in the meantime if BOTH Raiden Mei and Seele are scum. Fu Hua cannot be relied upon, either. The fact that Coffee kept hammering mafia Raiden is also very suspicious from my point of view, like he already knew...?
in that case, I won't because the possibility of redirection is too high with two raidens of unknown alignment in the game. as far as knowing that there was a mafia raiden, that would entail me being an investigative role (being in moe's place with the same thing happening), or outing the possible mechanics of my purported maf team to the town which would not go over well i would think.
N0: Oa and DC. Even tho there is no NK, we still have Rozalya to worry about. Oa looked like someone that wouldn't be a doc top priority (I'd say Link and rob were these), but still useful to town - (which is more or less the reasoning for the N0 in last game). DC on the other hand seemed expendable (mostly shitposts there).
so you drove away the dura investigation and gave DC raiden? seems more intentional than not that those two line up
------> I am very hard (like 95%) feeling you were just giving scumbuddy!DC a shiny scum-useful ability ASAP on N0 while also making sure he didn't get harmed early.
what he said
Yeah TorB's right, I'm Seele, I got slapped N0 with Raiden, and I didn't use my ability all game, because that would be stupid, and I already implied I didn't since D1
you implied that you didn't use your ability since D1 even though you had just gotten it??
what's my ability usage looking like tonight friends
Unless Raiden and Seele are both town, or all three of you are scum, you cannot rely on hitting the proper target. Do not use. We have a lot of info now, but I do not think we can rely on our roles to vig mafia this game.
I'm not sure if this is exactly how it works, but if he's redirected, it would be his first shot on anyone it redirects to but me, so it shouldn't vig them, right?
Right, but if Raiden/Seele are scum and Coffee is town, agreeing on a target allows Cecilia to be redirected onto you, killing you.
I would rather not risk something like this until we have raidens either confirmed town/maf (and lynched or killed if maf) because the chance of me being redirected onto you is still there, and doubled if raiden/seele is a maf team. i would ideally like to hit DC but that's just too easy for them to say syke to.
The only way I can see us not lynching Coffee tomorrow is if someone has a concrete lead on a different scum member or he kills himself. Killing yourself instead of mislynch is a pro town move.
let me know how to do that and i sure will. do you mean vig into a flash counter?
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Even scum might be a good target with Raiden Meis on the loose.
I'm not sure Nightkill can even be intentionally used on another mafia with the intent to deflect it with Raiden Mei, though. So it's more likely scum would just pick some town that they think will not be protected to use the nightkill on. Though "that they think will not be protected" just gained a whole new dimension by pointing it out ;)
Agreed, and not a problem. But what about number three? If it is really Coffee, then he is the most dangerous one. Raiden Mei just messes with Fu Hua, but not much else.
kae, a lot of Fates are being entrusted to your hands these next hours. Godspeed in your responsibilities with this information.
I am Fu Hua. I have used every night. I very much prefer, very very much prefer not to reveal targets. At least this way there is a chance to bluff or double bluff or something scum about where I target.
if I am reading this correctly, with raidens, mafia can confirm kills ignoring doc saves because of the priority. I think I investigated this earlier:
-The nightkill has no targeting restrictions. You may attempt to nightkill a Herrscher, though this will rarely be helpful.
Raiden Mei Phantom Image (ER) Target exactly two players. Tonight, anything that targets the first player affects the second player instead, and vice versa. This includes the nightkill.
Abilities will be resolved in the following order.
Death will not stop abilities from being used on the current night. Once an ability has resolved, its effect will last for the stated duration, even if the user dies.
- Phantom Image
- Rose Petals
- Time Fracture
- Consecrate Ground
- All other abilities
- Red Thread of Fate
- Nightkill
- Abyssal Flower
- Typhoon Cutter
- Chain Lightning, Field of Blades, Idyllic Dreams, Theory of Relativity*
so here, the mafia can target one of their team with the nightkill and have it redirected to anyone while redirecting any doc abilities onto themselves it seems.
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And my main point to get on here was to say that part of Sub's claimed role's description is that a blocked ability gets notified:
Failed abilities always produce a notification
I think that at some point either N0 / N2 or N1 a scum!Sub would have probably used his ability covering my probably doc-save targets. I can confirm NOT receiving any failed target notifications and nobody else has claimed one either to this affect. My evidence available to me is that Sub is truthful about role usage if his claimed role is his real role. I think scum!Sub would have used by now too - so I take it a step further and lean fairly heavily on Sub being town.
towns
kdz
TorB / moe
kae / Sub
some scum equity but less likely than the lower list
Cal / iancu / www3
scummy POE
Coffee
timpa
DC
We should be trying to kill from the bottom up and save less specifically and more generally from the top down, in my opinion.
ALSO, regarding the various Raidens / Cecilia / Kallen planning, keep in mind some unclaimed roles MIGHT be in the game Himeko / Liliya / Mal (order of potency against the plan) that could disrupt the plan. I believe one of those to be in capable town hands though, but still that first one I think might have a way to be a useful part of a town plan with (against) the Raidens?? I also think a skillful use of the 2nd (Liliya) could be part of the plan to keep a scum Raiden from being rogue?
1. Could we plan for both Raidens (timpa / DC) who we think are likely 1 or 2 scum target Coffee and each other; with a ?Himeko? (may or may not be kdz?) targeting Coffee; and kae targets the trio of timpa/DC/Coffee.
* Raiden!timpa --> targets Raiden!DC + Cecilia!Coffee
* Raiden!DC --> targets Raiden!timpa + Ceceilia!Coffee
* Tesla!kae --> targets Raiden!timpa + Raiden!DC + ?Himeko?kdz
* Himeko!kdz --> targets Cecilia!Coffee
This would mean if timpa/DC are both teammates of Coffee then both holster? If one of timpa/DC is town then one holsters?
^-- I tried coming up with an alternate plan that includes/accounts for unknown final role being any of the three unclaimed roles... but I find flaws each time I rethink it. I'm going to stick to doing my own doc mind games thing, and leave the role madness planning stuff to other professionals (I am NOT a role madness type of player or planner!)...
I'll be following along during the day and chime in as I can but otherwise it will be later that I might make a few more posts.
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The only way I can see us not lynching Coffee tomorrow is if someone has a concrete lead on a different scum member or he kills himself. Killing yourself instead of mislynch is a pro town move.
let me know how to do that and i sure will. do you mean vig into a flash counter?
Yes. Though, thinking about it, just asking you to holster with you using your ability and considering a Cal vig a scum out is better, especially since there is a lack of consensus on the third mafia member if DC and andre are both scum. As long as you do not use your ability, there is no reason to lynch you and we will have two more days to think about other people that could be scum while going for the most likely targets first.
if I am reading this correctly, with raidens, mafia can confirm kills ignoring doc saves because of the priority. I think I investigated this earlier
Right, it seemed a bit obsessive, but I might be reading too much into it.
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Well, that didn't go very well. Anyway, since I'm already considered town by most and am a juicy nightkill target, let me sweeten the deal: hard claim Emma Planck.
N0 target: Durandal, I'm keeping the result a secret for now.
N2 target: Raiden Mei, there were TWO results. One of them must be Seele Vollerei.
If you plan to out use Cecilia + Thread of Fate to kill two players, know that the chances of at least one being scum and purposefully interfering are extremely high.
this leaves me wondering why you weren't nightkilled already
To be fair, I would have tried to push against a Raiden lynch if it weren't for moehrpis reveal, since they are semi-docs.
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Yh imo we don’t need to do any silly night shenanigans. Lynch Andre then DC then see who’s the third one.
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I think if kdz holstered n1 we can safely assume that dc is scum and they have a core of lighning, which hasnt been used by any of my true targets n2. andretimpas claim is similiarly shaky independently, as it requires mw or coffee to be targeted by dc last night, his n0 reasoning is not convincing+ he seems more focussed on his own defense rather than being happy that DC is pretty much outted at last.
I used my ability on n1
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ok that only leaves one unexplained ability then, which can be core of lightning, dc using it after all or d2d having weird timing or fakeclaims. Eh perhaps we cant be sure that dc is scum just yet, but it seems likely still
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I've been trying to analyze lynch votes to see if it could help determine a third mafia to fit a DC/timpa team.
Day 1 has ended.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Night 1 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
Looking at this, Cal, Coffee, rob and Sub all seem unlikely mafia suspects if the scum team truly consists of andre and DC. The later they boarded the DC wagon, the less credit they get for it if DC flips scum from my point of view.
Day 2 has ended. Again.
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Night 2 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
timpa voted ian, from the flow of votes it seems to have been with intent to kill. Additional town points for Coffee and rob if DC flips scum.
Looking at lynch voting it seems I was wrong, Coffee (and rob) just don't fit a DC team. I was already town leaning them before and kaempfer13 and moehrpi get town reads from me for solving. andre and DC both had their votes on w3 for a while day 1, so that does not make a lot of sense for me either.
kdz has to be town if we assume moehrpi is town, only an exact team of andre, moehrpi and kdz allows him to be scum from my point of view (the DC Seele logic means maf moe requires that redirect). Still, moehrpi would have had no reason to reveal the N0 redirect.
Coffee and rob could potentially fit an andre team, but this option only feels worth exploring after andre flips scum and DC flips town. More importantly, rob should already have been NK-ed by then. My ability is practically useless now, making only moe higher priority to NK.
ian and Sub seem like the best fits if andre and DC both flip mafia. ian's claim of being able to target two players other than himself is meaningless when you have two Raiden mafia buddies.
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If both are alive next day (seems HIGHLY likely) then I'm interested to see timpa and DC case each other as to why we at-large should vote "not them" and if so then "on whom". I am on the edge of asking us to simply give them 12-24h space in the thread to thunderdome each other. Not just for popcorn either. Thoughts\opinions?
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yh, please tell us your partner ty. Also please don't kill me timpa ): :gravity :gravity
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yh, please tell us your partner ty. Also please don't kill me timpa ): :gravity :gravity
whichever doesn't indulge I consider lock scum... If one is town I feel confident this town can sus out. 8-) lock scum might as well just lolcat for entertainment
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yh, please tell us your partner ty. Also please don't kill me timpa ): :gravity :gravity
whichever doesn't indulge I consider lock scum... If one is town I feel confident this town can sus out. 8-) lock scum might as well just lolcat for entertainment
:thumbs-up:
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Easiest way to confirm a Raiden Mei is actually town, is to successfully redirect the NK to a mafia tonight. How do you even do that? I can't tell you that, because I don't know whom the NK target will be. If you are town, that should be your goal, along with identifying the real mafia.
Alright I'll give it a try. Getting the NK target right is longshot, but it's better than nothing.
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Also @rob, I said in my N0 reasoning that DC was expendable, not scummy. By that I mean that without knowing alignments or roles I thought Oa would be more useful than DC. Other options I considered were MW and shock, not because of reads, but because of their playstyles.
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Wasn't www mainly townread because he was defending DC when they were both leading lynch wagons? If they were both mafia, they would not want to vote on each other to self preserve.
I'm once again questioning why www thinks he is a sane nightkill target tonight.
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Easiest way to confirm a Raiden Mei is actually town, is to successfully redirect the NK to a mafia tonight. How do you even do that? I can't tell you that, because I don't know whom the NK target will be. If you are town, that should be your goal, along with identifying the real mafia.
Alright I'll give it a try. Getting the NK target right is longshot, but it's better than nothing.
Do I still use my ability in this case? It could end up that me and andre target the same players or andre hitting scum and me killing town by accident.
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Wasn't www mainly townread because he was defending DC when they were both leading lynch wagons? If they were both mafia, they would not want to vote on each other to self preserve.
I'm once again questioning why www thinks he is a sane nightkill target tonight.
I was just a bit less sus of him after rob and coffee went after him, as I sused them too.
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Do I still use my ability in this case? It could end up that me and andre target the same players or andre hitting scum and me killing town by accident.
As long as at least one Raiden Mei is scum, just being able to target two people other than yourself proves nothing. No.
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I am Frederica Tesla.
Shock didnt have a honkai core and i was really pissed he significantly decreased the effectiveness of my ability.
Anyway 7 abilities other than my own were used n1.
Now the important part: N2 i targeted sub, kdz, coffee, mw, ian and cal n2. Only a single ability was used, coffees. However if andre and dc are truthfull I should have witnessed torb use an ability as well
Can you re-write this so I can be sure to understand it, please?
Yh imo we don’t need to do any silly night shenanigans. Lynch Andre then DC then see who’s the third one.
I prefer this order over rob's.
My ability is practically useless now
Don't worry, you made good use out of it. :)
yh, please tell us your partner ty. Also please don't kill me timpa ): :gravity :gravity
whichever doesn't indulge I consider lock scum... If one is town I feel confident this town can sus out. 8-) lock scum might as well just lolcat for entertainment
That sounds like fun!
Also @rob, I said in my N0 reasoning that DC was expendable, not scummy. By that I mean that without knowing alignments or roles I thought Oa would be more useful than DC. Other options I considered were MW and shock, not because of reads, but because of their playstyles.
That's true. I've seen andre's proclaimed intention misrepresented a few times since. I still read him as scum. Desculpe.
Easiest way to confirm a Raiden Mei is actually town, is to successfully redirect the NK to a mafia tonight. How do you even do that? I can't tell you that, because I don't know whom the NK target will be. If you are town, that should be your goal, along with identifying the real mafia.
Alright I'll give it a try. Getting the NK target right is longshot, but it's better than nothing.
Do I still use my ability in this case? It could end up that me and andre target the same players or andre hitting scum and me killing town by accident.
I'd say yes. There isn't a clear night action plan in motion for tonight. (?) So, added confusion should help town as it's all about NK.
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@moe
shock forced me to target only him n0. He used 1 ability (duh!)
n1 I did what I wanted to do n0, target everyone but myself, witnessing 7 abilities.
n2 I targeted mw, sub, ian, coffee, cal and kdz. i got 1 ability use. That would be fine (coffee), if timpa didnt claim he swapped torb(ability used) with mw. The latter can only be true if dc messed with mw or coffee.
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@moe
shock forced me to target only him n0. He used 1 ability (duh!)
n1 I did what I wanted to do n0, target everyone but myself, witnessing 7 abilities.
n2 I targeted mw, sub, ian, coffee, cal and kdz. i got 1 ability use. That would be fine (coffee), if timpa didnt claim he swapped torb(ability used) with mw. The latter can only be true if dc messed with mw or coffee.
Somehow I didn't make the connection of swapping TorB into your pool of targets N2. I see the problem now, thanks. andre could also have lied about his usage but let's wait and watch him and DC turn on each other. :D
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Also @rob, I said in my N0 reasoning that DC was expendable, not scummy.
This is almost memeworthy at this point, I'm pretty sure I'm not as controversial as someone like shock is, and the fact you're trying use this to justify your choices makes it really sketch. I doubt a town!andre would be this... direct anyway
For what it's worth I'm not gonna bother staying up to save my ass, if on the last few hours y'all dead set on me imma start shitposting harder than you've ever seen again
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i want to say i am not going to use my ability tonight. it is far too risky with both a scummy raiden and a scummy seele!raiden.
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Night 3 has ended. Notifications are currently being sent.
Day 4 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Day 4
moehrpi was nightkilled. He was Durandal.
Day 4 has ended.
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DoubleCapitals (1) - iancudorinmarian
I did not use my ability last night.
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Rob? Didn’t target moe?
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noone claim anything before the raidens have claimed their targets. the slower one of them will get my vote
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It's not like targeting moe with Fu Hua would do you any good when there is a scum Raiden.
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I'm not voting yet. DC and timpa need to fight to the death. May the town benefit. (I cannot fathom how both could be town; if one is town though then we want to get it right; it both are scum a thunderdome is just good town +EV and entertainment)
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noone claim anything before the raidens have claimed their targets. the slower one of them will get my vote
:thumbs-up:
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And to be frank, I expected timpa or DC to come out guns blazing if they were v\w it w\v. Now DC is asleep probably but the apathetic pushback sure feels like w\w indecisive who to bus or if it even matters to bus one etc. Also the wolf of a w\v or v\w pair knows the other is enemy so I would have expected some push it only one was a wolf.
TL;DR - highly unlikely v\v timpa\DC, awkward lack of vocality if mixed, and just the right amount of ATE + apathy to feel like w\w.
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Also, no Core of Death still? If it were in the game, I would have assumed mafia to have used it on rob by now, since Core of Death bypasses Fu Hua. With 3 vs 8 this still leaves 2 mislynches as long as no one misvigs.
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@andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
Tell me why I should be voting Submachine today instead of one of you.
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@andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
Tell me why I should be voting Submachine today instead of one of you.
they can start off by telling their night actions :D
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they can start off by telling their night actions :D
I tried to redirect the NK, but thought they'd go for rob first. My targets were DC + rob.
@andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
Tell me why I should be voting Submachine today instead of one of you.
Why would you go after Sub when DC is clearly lying about his targets? (iirc kae caught that last night)
As a side note, I got targetted by Coffee :(
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
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timpa- I could take care of myself too, did can self target in this ruleset :-\ did I? Could I? Would I? Should I? :-\
Also I want DC to claim his targets. Asap.
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timpa- I could take care of myself too, did can self target in this ruleset :-\ did I? Could I? Would I? Should I? :-\
Also I want DC to claim his targets. Asap.
7ish am for him rn. We can wait rob, the anticipation is half the fun of killing mafia :P
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As a side note, I got targetted by Coffee :(
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
no you didn’t
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(https://media.makeameme.org/created/thats-a-lie-5b4ba5.jpg)
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I think linkcat would be proud w3
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I think linkcat would be proud w3
(https://i.imgflip.com/4/3r0omo.jpg)
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Oh btw kdz, did you ever claim your role?
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Oh btw kdz, did you ever claim your role?
Vanilla town, I know, im as surprised as you
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Oh btw kdz, did you ever claim your role?
Vanilla town, I know, im as surprised as you
(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WeepyCoolEstuarinecrocodile-size_restricted.gif)
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I half expected you to claim Durandal. :sillyspin:
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(https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.593081012.0332/ap,550x550,12x12,1,transparent,t.u7.jpg)
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they can start off by telling their night actions :D
I tried to redirect the NK, but thought they'd go for rob first. My targets were DC + rob.
@andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
Tell me why I should be voting Submachine today instead of one of you.
Why would you go after Sub when DC is clearly lying about his targets? (iirc kae caught that last night)
As a side note, I got targetted by Coffee :(
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
(https://media1.tenor.com/images/527875ee115ceefa4aaf737c0da439e4/tenor.gif?itemid=9081954)
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As a side note, I got targetted by Coffee :(
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
no you didn’t
It's not what the notification I got says
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What a quiet day phase this has been. I was really hoping for more fireworks, more showmanship. I brought popcorn and everything.
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@andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
Tell me why I should be voting Submachine today instead of one of you.
Why would you go after Sub when DC is clearly lying about his targets? (iirc kae caught that last night)
As a side note, I got targetted by Coffee :(
Maaaaybe you should still be interested in solving whom the mafia team is if you are town? Just saying.
As a side note: that is excellent news. If Coffee vigs you while you're town, we just found lying scum. In every other situation Coffee is town, though.
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Solved game, btw.
vv
killsdazombies - confirmed by town Durandal
kaempfer13 - solving
rob77dp - not in team with DC
Coffeeditto - not in team with DC
v
Calindu - unlikely in team with DC
iancudorinmarian - mafia voted him and his Kallen story sounded sincere
worldwideweb3 - it seems mafia really wanted him dead
w
Submachine - I've gone into specifics before, he's felt off all game. If rest is town, this is simple PoE
ww
andretimpa
DoubleCapitals
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torb, specifics, repeat them for me. I probably missed them.~
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torb, specifics, repeat them for me. I probably missed them.~
First is that I think the rest is simply townier. The thought process I've been going through to solve the third mafia has been posted here: I've been trying to analyze lynch votes to see if it could help determine a third mafia to fit a DC/timpa team.Day 1 has ended.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Night 1 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
Looking at this, Cal, Coffee, rob and Sub all seem unlikely mafia suspects if the scum team truly consists of andre and DC. The later they boarded the DC wagon, the less credit they get for it if DC flips scum from my point of view.
Day 2 has ended. Again.
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Night 2 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
timpa voted ian, from the flow of votes it seems to have been with intent to kill. Additional town points for Coffee and rob if DC flips scum.
Looking at lynch voting it seems I was wrong, Coffee (and rob) just don't fit a DC team. I was already town leaning them before and kaempfer13 and moehrpi get town reads from me for solving. andre and DC both had their votes on w3 for a while day 1, so that does not make a lot of sense for me either.
kdz has to be town if we assume moehrpi is town, only an exact team of andre, moehrpi and kdz allows him to be scum from my point of view (the DC Seele logic means maf moe requires that redirect). Still, moehrpi would have had no reason to reveal the N0 redirect.
Coffee and rob could potentially fit an andre team, but this option only feels worth exploring after andre flips scum and DC flips town. More importantly, rob should already have been NK-ed by then. My ability is practically useless now, making only moe higher priority to NK.
ian and Sub seem like the best fits if andre and DC both flip mafia. ian's claim of being able to target two players other than himself is meaningless when you have two Raiden mafia buddies.
But before that, the specifics you were likely referring to are:
Well, I did promise a read list.
Hey, um, Link. I just want to get it out of the way for transparency's sake. I get the feeling that you are a bit unmotivated. I will not say that is scummy, and I will not compare it to previous games. But can you explain why you are keeping a low profile this time? I believe it is for the greater good if everybody heard your explanation, if you have any.
You can also try to keep a low profile because you have a power role like Link did. Fishy fishy?
Finally people are realizing that www has been playing scummy so far. There is only one logical scenario where I can imagine www doing this as town, but this is not the way to do it, and he should rather take inspiration from shockcannon in that case.
I am still waiting for an explanation on why you think w3 is scum, Sub. Right now, this seems like a very opportunistic vote, potentially to try and start a competing wagon to save a mafia buddy.
The overall read is still neutral, but you'll have to forgive me for being extremely skeptical after last game :P
Ugh, Sub inactive is really annoying. His opportunistic vote on w3 is really bothering me. I have theories where they are an attempt to form a serious counter-wagon to save at least one mafia buddy (MW or DC), but they are all moot until one of them flips scum. Because I think the three way tie on MW/DC/w3 was one of the more interesting moments to analyze lynch wagon movements. Early vote on ian D2 was also partially to poke around Link's theory of an ian/DC team, but at the moment I am more inclined towards an MW/Sub team. Both Sub and MW seem to have been fishing for info roles in their own way. And this?
Rob: Been vocal about this already. Gut feeling about Link NK
This part holds just as true -or even more so- for Sub, from my point of view. Of course, that would not be convenient to mention of a mafia buddy.
The third member might be DC or deep town.
But shading people that aren't even around to defend themselves, blegh. Just wanted to throw my motivations and thoughts out there in the not unlikely case I get NK-ed.
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Nah, I was just legit sus of Linkcat. And surely I would not think of endgame consequences and come directly to the rescue of a mafia teammate on the first day. And I didn't really promise an incoming read list of www, I was referring to things I have already said at that point.
I think that's all I had to explain. If not enough, you are allowed to tunnel me after last game. ^^
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Well, there's still over a week left to do your own solving of a different mafia team before you're being seriously considered for a lynch vote, regardless. I'm just stopping my brain wracking over potential teams here, for now.
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Quick readlist:
TheonlyrealBeef - v
You gotta be almost always town to initiate a mass roleclaim.
kaempfer13 - v
Same as TorB, plus some contextual effort that would not make sense as mafia.
iancudorinmarian - N+
This is more like the town ian I'm used to seeing. He also has a confirmable role that he called attention to.
worldwideweb3 - N-
He claims to want protection, but it's not because he hides a power role (town doesn't let Bronya have effect anyway), and it's not because he's so focused on solving. One thing I know about him is he hates to lose, but he is casually fine with the state of things, instead of constantly trying to point out where he thinks town is wrong. He also had a consensual non-vote thing at EoD1 with DC. The only thing why he's not full w is because I would expect him to care more about defending his stance if he had a team behind him.
andretimpa - N-
Other than role shenanigans, I don't see much here. One of the lowest content posters. I personally find him less sus than DC, but watch that bite me in the back if he is actually maf and DC is not. >_<
killsdazombies - vv
We finally got confirmation that Durandal was town, so all hail the singular conf town we have. \o/
Coffeeditto - N+
Vigging dawn leans town for me. His frustration about not getting input is a legit town worry.
rob77dp - N-
I have fallen behind on his posts, but I get an N- vibe from him.
DoubleCapitals - w
He had a post where he straight up confirmed one of him/andre is lying. That knowledge is privvy to mafia, especially if said so confidently.
Calindu - N
I cannot do anything with such low content.
Ordered around, I think the mafs are in this group, in this order of likeliness:
Note that this was a low effort readlist. I did not go back to cross-reference my thoughts, I just went purely off memory and gut.
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@Sub
Did you at least look at the EoD votes that were literally quoted in the post I quoted that stated why rob - DC is an unlikely team? I just do not see them on the same team, meaning sus on DC almost automatically makes rob town from my point of view.
Anyway, I see no reason to wait voting anymore. We're not going to find town among andre/DC.
DoubleCapitals (3) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef
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@Sub
Did you at least look at the EoD votes
Admittedly, no. :D But now I will, hang on.
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@Sub
Did you at least look at the EoD votes that were literally quoted in the post I quoted that stated why rob - DC is an unlikely team? I just do not see them on the same team, meaning sus on DC almost automatically makes rob town from my point of view.
Anyway, I see no reason to wait voting anymore. We're not going to find town among andre/DC.
DoubleCapitals (3) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef
I still want to hear DCs targets, before solving the coffee/Andre thing before deciding on vote
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DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
welp i did promise I would vote the one to post targets later (or not at all? please dont be like that). I see several questionable things from andre today as well though. he's in thunderdome with both dc and coffee simultaneously (unless coffee did use ability and was redirected by dc (wait for dc to claim before you say anything)), so even if we assume that both thunderdomes are v/w he's still likely scum.
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Day 1 has ended.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Looking at this, Cal, Coffee, rob and Sub all seem unlikely mafia suspects if the scum team truly consists of andre and DC. The later they boarded the DC wagon, the less credit they get for it if DC flips scum from my point of view.
If I adopted your read here and combined it with my list, that would narrow it down to www as the third maf member. However, early bussing is a thing, so I will not read too much into this.
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You won’t find a maf in me, a maf www would’ve sealed the game by now :thumbs-up:
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
Andretimpa(1) - worldwideweb3
I do not want to pile as I want to hear what DC has to say firdt.
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One thing I wil say is that it is so risky using raden Mei, esp n0 and it doesn’t quite make sense as a mafia to use it. Inb4 TorB maf guiding as down wrong path, but at this point it’s GG anywyas
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What's so risky about using Raiden Mei? You screw up all the information people get from information roles and the doc target, this is really beneficial for mafia. For town, you get a possible redirect of the nightkill from town to mafia, or simply to protect a power role. This is really beneficial to town.
In this case, mafia appears to merely have wanted to give mafia Seele the ability of Raiden Mei, hence the use of the ability N0. andre's reasoning for using it N0 is bull. moe using Durandal on DC was probably just a stroke of luck, that backfired when we combined our information.
If I were maf, the only reason not to NK moe N1, is if I knew Linkcat was Theresa through Core of Reason and moe would be on cooldown anyway, meaning he could be NK-ed N2. Yet he lived until N3, and his input was required to out andre and DC as scum.
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What's so risky about using Raiden Mei? You screw up all the information people get from information roles and the doc target, this is really beneficial for mafia. For town, you get a possible redirect of the nightkill from town to mafia, or simply to protect a power role. This is really beneficial to town.
In this case, mafia appears to merely have wanted to give mafia Seele the ability of Raiden Mei, hence the use of the ability N0. andre's reasoning for using it N0 is bull. moe using Durandal on DC was probably just a stroke of luck, that backfired when we combined our information.
If I were maf, the only reason not to NK moe N1, is if I knew Linkcat was Theresa through Core of Reason and moe would be on cooldown anyway, meaning he could be NK-ed N2. Yet he lived until N3, and his input was required to out andre and DC as scum.
Risky as in once found you’ll be killed.
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Andre <-> TorB to protect andre.
Kae @ just lynching the one who claims second, sounds good, doesn't work, not my fault that I miss EoD but also miss SoD for this? Also I saw your post on my lying about rate up being a lie. I was tryna bait the good roles to come visit me, alright? I almost succeeded...
TorB I told you who I said mafia would be, I say lynch andre first and foremost obviously. If scum isn't in top 4 I'll eat my hat
Andre
Coffee
ian
Cal
Sub/TorB/rob/kae/w3
kdz
@Sub no shit? Andre's lying, I'm truthing, I don't see how that's a scumtell?
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
andretimpa(2) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals
To reiterate, you should lynch andre over me, because he's the stupid who used his role N0, even though we have had established we shouldn't use it, he's probably claimed being targetted by Coffee for brownie points, and he called me expendable and hurt my fragile feelings :< Also denied me of my dura, das why you get reverse swept
Like come on guys, town!andre wouldn't rando Raiden N0 would he?
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Even now we don't know whom the Raiden Mei targets really were. Ironically, the ideal targets for town and mafia Raiden Mei are almost the same. The only difference is that mafia will already know whom the targets are and get an almost guaranteed Nightkill. Mafia can use it to shade likely town or move vigs/Durandal from mafia/shady town to likely town and claim they were just trying to protect that town member.
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TorB I told you who I said mafia would be, I say lynch andre first and foremost obviously.
Sequence does not matter to me. I simply joined the largest wagon.Like come on guys, town!andre wouldn't rando Raiden N0 would he?
Right, so he already knew you were Seele N0 without Cocalia.
even though we have had established we shouldn't use it
Uh, what, when? I do not think I or anyone else ever literally spelled it out for N0, but using Raiden to get a chance to redirect an NK is good. Of course, that means that with no NK, there is no good reason to use it.
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Andre <-> TorB to protect andre.
And if this is your ability targeting and reasoning when you know andre is scum, you literally just outed yourself as being w/w with andre, lol.
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My brain farted, I meant to protect you .-.
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Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
And you just said, the role shouldn't have been used N0 anyway (based "Of course, that means that with no NK, there is no good reason to use it.")
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My brain farted, I meant to protect you .-.
My role is practically useless, now. The #1 priority was moe, #2 was rob. Even kaempfer13 has more use for his ability than me. Only thing I can hope to guess is the role that someone false claimed, but it seems unlikely.
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
And you just said, the role shouldn't have been used N0 anyway (based "Of course, that means that with no NK, there is no good reason to use it.")
Yeah, I just did. So it's not something you can refer to as already having been stated during N0.
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Doesn't negate the fact that it would be stupid for town to use it N0
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Doesn't negate the fact that it would be stupid for town to use it N0
Right. Which is why I intend to lynch andretimpa the next day regardless of your alignment, or today if his wagon ends up gaining more traction.
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Doesn't negate the fact that it would be stupid for town to use it N0
Right. Which is why I intend to lynch andretimpa the next day regardless of your alignment, or today if his wagon ends up gaining more traction.
it is literaall 3-2 right now without your vote, no one wagon has considerably more traction than the other
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Last I checked 3 > 2. Tie the wagons and I'll jump over.
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Well I'm not going to change your mind then about me... we're 3/8, effectively 3/7 if Coffee gets his free kill. Then in which case mislynching me goes down to 3/5 which.. Ah fuck that's MyLo...
Well, I might, I might be taking town's last ML here. Honestly your reads worry me quite a bit, and I don't think I'll do much to convince me but I'll hope when I flip you'll start listening to me.
EDIT: @w3 4-2...
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@Calindu: How are you doing on this fine day? I'm curious about your thoughts on the current matter.
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Well I'm not going to change your mind then about me... we're 3/8, effectively 3/7 if Coffee gets his free kill. Then in which case mislynching me goes down to 3/5 which.. Ah fuck that's MyLo...
Well, I might, I might be taking town's last ML here. Honestly your reads worry me quite a bit, and I don't think I'll do much to convince me but I'll hope when I flip you'll start listening to me.
EDIT: @w3 4-2...
3-2 w/out torbs vote, who can tie it 3-3
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Andre <-> TorB to protect andre.
-snip-
(https://www.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/dont_believe_you_anchorman.gif)
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We're sure only Raiden right? And that they are DC \ timpa?
I believe at least one is lying about targets. I KNOW at least one is lying about targets. I targeted moe last night yet he died.
Any Raiden care to reclaim targets and include your moe aim in it? Probably a silly ask because I still get the feeling you're both very likely scum at this point
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
andretimpa(3) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp
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EBWOP
*sure two Raidens
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As Emma Planck, I have stated that my ability returned the result that both andretimpa and DoubleCapitals have the Phantom Image ability and both of them have confirmed this claim. I see no reason to question this.
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We're sure only Raiden right? And that they are DC \ timpa?
I believe at least one is lying about targets. I KNOW at least one is lying about targets. I targeted moe last night yet he died.
Any Raiden care to reclaim targets and include your moe aim in it? Probably a silly ask because I still get the feeling you're both very likely scum at this point
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
andretimpa(3) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp
OOOF
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And coffee, did you use your ability at all? Guess it’s safe to answer now that the raidens have claimed
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In the case of competing Raidens, I would expect mafia Raiden to target moehrpi and ian/w3 to then NK ian/w3. This causes them to be able to bypass Fu Hua. Meanwhile, town Raiden targets moehrpi and the mafia Raiden, in the hopes of moving NK away from moe to a mafia. Since the second target does not match, all abilities -including Fu Hua- would have been directed at moehrpi. Knowing this, one could argue that moe being protected by Fu Hua was expected and thus an alternative strategy was employed by mafia, but none of them should result in moehrpi dying unless both Raidens are scum or the town one used a sub-optimal strategy (DCs current argument).
And coffee, did you use your ability at all? Guess it’s safe to answer now that the raidens have claimed
i want to say i am not going to use my ability tonight. it is far too risky with both a scummy raiden and a scummy seele!raiden.
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In the case of competing Raidens, I would expect mafia Raiden to target moehrpi and ian/w3 to then NK ian/w3. This causes them to be able to bypass Fu Hua. Meanwhile, town Raiden targets moehrpi and the mafia Raiden, in the hopes of moving NK away from moe to a mafia. Since the second target does not match, all abilities -including Fu Hua- would have been directed at moehrpi. Knowing this, one could argue that moe being protected by Fu Hua was expected and thus an alternative strategy was employed by mafia, but none of them should result in moehrpi dying unless both Raidens are scum or the town one used a sub-optimal strategy (DCs current argument).
And coffee, did you use your ability at all? Guess it’s safe to answer now that the raidens have claimed
i want to say i am not going to use my ability tonight. it is far too risky with both a scummy raiden and a scummy seele!raiden.
that was before the night, he couldve said it to trick mafia or something. Asking incase there was further raiden redirection as andre claimed to be targetted
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@Calindu: How are you doing on this fine day? I'm curious about your thoughts on the current matter.
I actually believe both timpa and DC are mafia, if I were to rank them by probability I'd say DC is more likely.
My readlist has Coffee as the third likely mafia, but I'm unsure now.
We have a lot of time, and 3 people have yet to vote, excluding me, so I'm going to tie the vote to not get a wagon too far ahead and not hammer someone.
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
andretimpa(4) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu
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I targeted moe last night
Aww! :3
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And coffee, did you use your ability at all? Guess it’s safe to answer now that the raidens have claimed
i want to say i am not going to use my ability tonight. it is far too risky with both a scummy raiden and a scummy seele!raiden.
that was before the night, he couldve said it to trick mafia or something. Asking incase there was further raiden redirection as andre claimed to be targetted
I didn't, and why would i want to risk using it and having it redirected to cal without him using flash counter?
As a side note, I got targetted by Coffee :(
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
no you didn’t
It's not what the notification I got says
why would you lie about this as either alignment??
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As a side note, I got targetted by Coffee :(
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
no you didn’t
It's not what the notification I got says
why would you lie about this as either alignment??
To appeal to all Coffee tunnelers, maybe. I imagine Cal in particular.
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I can easily imagine timpa trying to distance from a scum teammate coffee... I can imagine timpa trying to shade a town coffee too... I am not so successful in imagining what a town timpa gains by that lie if he's lying? (I think timpa's lying)
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(https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/54237502/i-smell-lies.jpg)
Honestly idek whos lying whos not lmao. Kae, what did your ability find?
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Wahoo
DoubleCapitals (5) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13, Submachine
andretimpa (4) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu
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I figured with 2 raidens running amok the only way to get somewhat reliable information was to target everyone again. 5 abilities were used except mine (in absence of andre and dc crossing streams anyway), yae sakura didnt use ability since my ability was successfull.
obv fu hua and both raidens used their ability, but its not immediately obvious to me what the other 2 abilities are.
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I figured with 2 raidens running amok the only way to get somewhat reliable information was to target everyone again. 5 abilities were used except mine (in absence of andre and dc crossing streams anyway), yae sakura didnt use ability since my ability was successfull.
obv fu hua and both raidens used their ability, but its not immediately obvious to me what the other 2 abilities are.
Torb's would be another one, i suppose?
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its eor
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and possibly Cal's, if he used it. or we have another liar
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Yeah, not me. I was on cooldown. Raiden Mei making you include yourself could explain one, Core of Lightning also an option. Maybe kdz as well, don't remember him mentioning his ability or having used it tonight.
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I have an idea which the other abilities were but I'm not sure its smart to share. Maybe I shouldnt even have claimed the result, it might help mafia more tbh. I dont think a honkai core was used at all (on n1/3 at least), so there is a high chance the core of binding exists and if they have the core of lightning they are afraid of my role.
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It isn't a stretch to consider coffee for 3rd scum which would make sense if he used but lied and timpa is death-distancing with coffee?
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It isn't a stretch to consider coffee for 3rd scum which would make sense if he used but lied and timpa is death-distancing with coffee?
Well what’s the use in using it anyways on timpa. No one else has claimed to be targetted by coffee.
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Votes as people thought they were:
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalksi
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalksi
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (1) - PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalksi
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (1) - Calindu
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (3) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Honorary votes:
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
MasterWalksi (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
MasterWalksi (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalksi
MasterWalksi (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
MasterWalksi (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
MasterWalksi (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
MasterWalksi (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
MasterWalksi (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
MasterWalksi (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (2) - worldwideweb3, kaempfer13
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
-
It isn't a stretch to consider coffee for 3rd scum which would make sense if he used but lied and timpa is death-distancing with coffee?
Well what’s the use in using it anyways on timpa. No one else has claimed to be targetted by coffee.
would seem to me a scum coffee had no risk really in targeting teammate (potentially) timpa and then publicly distancing about it? Although NOT using it and then teammates publicly distancing about it does _feel_ more plausible. There are some other role use possibilities throwing off the count\claim information but I think that borders on outing potentially strong endgame roles so...... YMMV
-
kaevision:
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat, MasterWalksi
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, MasterWalksi
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat,
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
Linkcat (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
dawn to dusk (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
no lynch (1) - shockcannon
dawn to dusk (1) - rob77dp
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
killsdazombies (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - DoubleCapitals
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (1) - PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (2) - Linkcat, iancudorinmarian
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (2) - Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
moehrpi (1) - kaempfer13
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (1) - worldwideweb3
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
Calindu (1) - Submachine
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (2) - rob77dp, killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
shockcannon (1) - Linkcat
DoubleCapitals (2) - worldwideweb3, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (4) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (5) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa, DoubleCapitals
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (2) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalksi
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (3) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
rob77dp(1) - kaempfer13
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (3) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (3) - , TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, Linkcat
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalksi (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (6) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalksi, iancudorinmarian, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - PlayerOa, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
iancudorinmarian (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (2) - worldwideweb3, MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (1) - iancudorinmarian
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalksi
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (1) - Calindu
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (1) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (2) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa, killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine(1) kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (6) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (2) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (3) - Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (3) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
MasterWalksi (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalksi (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
DoubleCapitals (2) - Coffeeditto, rob77dp
Honorary votes:
iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalksi
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (4) - worldwideweb3, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
MasterWalksi (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
MasterWalksi (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
MasterWalksi (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Coffeeditto (1) - MasterWalksi
MasterWalksi (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
MasterWalksi (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
MasterWalksi (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalksi (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
iancudorinmarian (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
MasterWalksi (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
MasterWalksi (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
MasterWalksi (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp, iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - MasterWalksi, Calindu
Submachine (1) - Submachine
andretimpa (2) - worldwideweb3, kaempfer13
worldwideweb3 (2) - moehrpi, Coffeeditto
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w3 in that team would be a busfest, i totally forgot to color rob limegreen.
Leaving Sub, ian and Cal as partners (in order of how likely i find them to be scum from most to least)
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How did you arrive at a green coffee there kae?
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Quick readlist:
iancudorinmarian - N+
This is more like the town ian I'm used to seeing. He also has a confirmable role that he called attention to.
How so? To me everytime ian plays looks the same, which is great for scum but horrible for town. Unfortunately the earliest point in time when he can prove himself mechanically town is when both andre and dc are dead.
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How did you arrive at a green coffee there kae?
Last minute save for Naii, heavy push on dc, basically exact same reasons as for you
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It feels to me as though scum prefers dc dying first for some reason (worse honkai core (or the passive one)?)
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DoubleCapitals (6) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13, Submachine, Coffeeditto
andretimpa (4) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu
Going with my original scumread, and assuming andre is other scum. I don't like how this vote is split, though, because andre and DC can manipulate the votes to force a NL if it's so evenly split within a margin of +/- 2 as it is here. If they know they're going to get lynched, it could just be a free kill for mafia. I would suggest we stick to one or the other for today.
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How did you arrive at a green coffee there kae?
Last minute save for Naii, heavy push on dc, basically exact same reasons as for you
fair enough... You're operating then as if coffee holstered last night? And timpa is just multi-lying (targets and being targeted)?
With DC being the Seele (correct?) I feel timpa had more scum equity at this point than DC. But WOW will I be surprised if one flips town of that pair. In a world where DC somehow is town then coffee scum equity goes WAY WAY up I think.
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It feels to me as though scum prefers dc dying first for some reason (worse honkai core (or the passive one)?)
Outside outside chance he is possibly town is there too. I struggle to imagine timpa being town at this point.
_shrug_?
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oops, sub voted to lynch dc earlier and more persistently than I remembered, however according to last game sub just kills off his teammates at the first sign of weakness, so eh.
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Or maybe DC has Binding \and|or\ timpa has Death?
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DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
andretimpa (5) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13
be it because dc is town or has the honkai core thats worse, i prefer this lynch.
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I'm pretty sure death wouldve just been used by now to kill you
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DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, Submachine, Coffeeditto
andretimpa (6) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef
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DoubleCapitals (3) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, Submachine
andretimpa (7) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef, Coffeeditto
if this is what we're deciding, i'd rather have no messing around with end of day shenanigans with 3 maf to force a NL
-
Quick readlist:
iancudorinmarian - N+
This is more like the town ian I'm used to seeing. He also has a confirmable role that he called attention to.
How so? To me everytime ian plays looks the same, which is great for scum but horrible for town. Unfortunately the earliest point in time when he can prove himself mechanically town is when both andre and dc are dead.
Naaah, last time I was playing with him as mafia, I was watching his posts and I was like "Oh my god, are they really not noticing how different he acts?". The difference is subtle, but it's there. (Or maybe it was because I knew he was mafia, idk. But this is what my gut says.)
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I'm pretty sure death wouldve just been used by now to kill you
:'( they love me, they really love me! (Or just don't have CoDeath)
(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WeakGloriousIndusriverdolphin-size_restricted.gif)
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I figured with 2 raidens running amok the only way to get somewhat reliable information was to target everyone again. 5 abilities were used except mine (in absence of andre and dc crossing streams anyway), yae sakura didnt use ability since my ability was successfull.
obv fu hua and both raidens used their ability, but its not immediately obvious to me what the other 2 abilities are.
we can clear me as not having lied by having everyone claim the abilities they used. my thoughts would be cal, ian (for some reason), or maybe a core. or kdz but i can't remember what he was?
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kdz never claimed since he's conftown, hence why i realized i should've just shut my mouth
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Since you and iput it out there though I'm pretty sure cal and kdz both used their abilities
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I figured with 2 raidens running amok the only way to get somewhat reliable information was to target everyone again. 5 abilities were used except mine (in absence of andre and dc crossing streams anyway), yae sakura didnt use ability since my ability was successfull.
obv fu hua and both raidens used their ability, but its not immediately obvious to me what the other 2 abilities are.
we can clear me as not having lied by having everyone claim the abilities they used. my thoughts would be cal, ian (for some reason), or maybe a core. or kdz but i can't remember what he was?
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/xT5LMMmrkP3C8BNRqo/giphy.gif)
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I figured with 2 raidens running amok the only way to get somewhat reliable information was to target everyone again. 5 abilities were used except mine (in absence of andre and dc crossing streams anyway), yae sakura didnt use ability since my ability was successfull.
obv fu hua and both raidens used their ability, but its not immediately obvious to me what the other 2 abilities are.
we can clear me as not having lied by having everyone claim the abilities they used. my thoughts would be cal, ian (for some reason), or maybe a core. or kdz but i can't remember what he was?
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/xT5LMMmrkP3C8BNRqo/giphy.gif)
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/QfMErvIH7r60M/giphy.gif)
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Conspiracy theory: rob never targetted moe and is claiming that to try mislynch the radens. Rob and TorB are mafia Who have just controlled us completely and we are doomed :thumbs-up:
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lol, even then that requires me to be involved in it for both raidens to be innocent
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I'm pretty sure death wouldve just been used by now to kill you
:'( they love me, they really love me! (Or just don't have CoDeath)
(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WeakGloriousIndusriverdolphin-size_restricted.gif)
I'd have shut you and Coffee's mouths if I could but my nonexistent scum team wouldn't let me :(
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Yes, you’re the third mafia
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@TorB, @rob shit he got us :o
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Since you and iput it out there though I'm pretty sure cal and kdz both used their abilities
I didn't want to claim this since it offers me some safety, but yeah, I did use my ability.
Coffee also claimed to have used his ability on andre though IIRC.
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Since you and iput it out there though I'm pretty sure cal and kdz both used their abilities
I didn't want to claim this since it offers me some safety, but yeah, I did use my ability.
Coffee also claimed to have used his ability on andre though IIRC.
other way around. andre claimed to be targetted but coffee said he didnt use his ability at all
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Since you and iput it out there though I'm pretty sure cal and kdz both used their abilities
I didn't want to claim this since it offers me some safety, but yeah, I did use my ability.
Coffee also claimed to have used his ability on andre though IIRC.
I claimed to not have, andre claims he was hit by it.
I hadn't realized but it would have been bad if i were maf for you to have outed your use of it. I wish you had saved it knowing i wasn't going to use it, but i understand why it might have looked like a bait
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Coffee also claimed to have used his ability on andre
I claimed to not have, andre claims he was hit by it.
Oh right, I forgot about this part. So andre or Coffee is lying, and I believe Coffee, so this changes my priorities.
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
andretimpa (7) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef, Coffeeditto, Submachine
Sorry for the scummy vote flipping. \o/ It's not like it matters.~
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Coffee also claimed to have used his ability on andre
I claimed to not have, andre claims he was hit by it.
Oh right, I forgot about this part. So andre or Coffee is lying, and I believe Coffee, so this changes my priorities.
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
andretimpa (7) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef, Coffeeditto, Submachine
Sorry for the scummy vote flipping. \o/ It's not like it matters.~
so you're just as content lynching timpa or DC today?
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Yeah, as the only lead I have is claimed ability uses by others, and my personal leans on them.
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And coffee, did you use your ability at all? Guess it’s safe to answer now that the raidens have claimed
i want to say i am not going to use my ability tonight. it is far too risky with both a scummy raiden and a scummy seele!raiden.
that was before the night, he couldve said it to trick mafia or something. Asking incase there was further raiden redirection as andre claimed to be targetted
I didn't, and why would i want to risk using it and having it redirected to cal without him using flash counter?
why would you lie about this as either alignment??
I could ask you the same thing.
Anyways, after you are done misslynching me, you should go after DC and Coffee (lynch all liars after all)
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And coffee, did you use your ability at all? Guess it’s safe to answer now that the raidens have claimed
i want to say i am not going to use my ability tonight. it is far too risky with both a scummy raiden and a scummy seele!raiden.
that was before the night, he couldve said it to trick mafia or something. Asking incase there was further raiden redirection as andre claimed to be targetted
I didn't, and why would i want to risk using it and having it redirected to cal without him using flash counter?
why would you lie about this as either alignment??
I could ask you the same thing.
Anyways, after you are done misslynching me, you should go after DC and Coffee (lynch all liars after all)
so what's the poe for you then? DC\coffee\?\?\??
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@TorB, @rob shit he got us :o
I'll just keep doctoring each of you alternating nights. ::) We got this in the bag. Imagine how cool this post will look after the game when we clean sweep!
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@TorB, @rob shit he got us :o
I'll just keep doctoring each of you alternating nights. ::) We got this in the bag. Imagine how cool this post will look after the game when we clean sweep!
Rob, you improved quite a lot since the last game, where you said you were not a man of banter. This banter is some next level stuff. :silly:
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@TorB, @rob shit he got us :o
I'll just keep doctoring each of you alternating nights. ::) We got this in the bag. Imagine how cool this post will look after the game when we clean sweep!
You should be glad I'm part of the team, these kinds of posts make me want to lynch people :silly:
But that can wait until after andre and DC are lynched. It's not like we're holstering Core of Death to give a false sense of having room for two mislynches or anything.
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If you've been joking on the last few pages, say sike!~
Also:
Day condension [1] - Submachine
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Actually a 6 hour condensation would be real appreciated, makes EoD at 11pm :^)
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Idm either
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Fixing vote counts.
I do not remember explicit rules about shortening phases (I honestly stayed up late last night, thinking it ended a day earlier), nor do I know sky even has time for it. kdz has not yet voted either, but the target to be lynched will not change in the coming seven and a half hour as far as I can tell, so can the day end asap instead of when timer expires.
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
andretimpa (8) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef, Coffeeditto, Submachine
Day condension (4) - Submachine, DoubleCapitals, worldwideweb3, TheonlyrealBeef
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called it, torb calling the mislynch early cause hes maf :-X
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DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
andretimpa (8) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef, Coffeeditto, Submachine
Day condension (5) - Submachine, DoubleCapitals, worldwideweb3, TheonlyrealBeef, DoubleCapitals
This vote is not strategic. It's strictly personal.
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DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
andretimpa (8) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef, Coffeeditto, Submachine
Day condension (6) - Submachine, DoubleCapitals, worldwideweb3, TheonlyrealBeef, DoubleCapitals, Calindu
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By majority vote, this phase has been shortened by 5 hours. The timer has been updated.
Due to scheduling constraints, future phases will end at the normal deadline.
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Due to scheduling constraints, future phases will end at the normal deadline.
Day condension (5) - Submachine, worldwideweb3, TheonlyrealBeef, DoubleCapitals, Calindu
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Day condension (4) - Submachine, worldwideweb3, TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
EBWOP I didn't realise you added my vote in there already
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Day 4 has ended.
DoubleCapitals (2) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa
andretimpa (8) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13, TheonlyrealBeef, Coffeeditto, Submachine
Night 4 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Night 4
andretimpa was lynched. He was Raiden Mei. He was holding the Core of Binding.
Role abilities cannot be used tonight. (Honkai Core abilities are unaffected.)
Night 4 has ended.
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(https://i.imgur.com/iHUeuOy.png)
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Or maybe DC has Binding \and|or\ timpa has Death?
I was probably exactly wrong... timpa binding :'(
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Who's expendable now?
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By majority vote, this phase has been shortened by 5 hours. The timer has been updated.
andretimpa was lynched. He was Raiden Mei. He was holding the Core of Binding.
Excellent, two more to go. Although, so much for any plans or ability usage tonight.
called it, torb calling the mislynch early cause hes maf :-X
Sorry w3, we cannot all three be mafia anymore after this reveal.
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This explains why timpa lied about Coffee's ability.
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Well, rip www. He now cannot be protected from the mafia kill. :sillyspin:
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Who's expendable now?
you, mi amigo.
Also the coffee\timpa stuff lately reeks of scum distancing to me. Coffee\DC at the top of my list. I have a suspicion my time alive in the game is possibly ~53h from ending. Emma and Tesla abilities much less powerful late game than doc.
(https://media.tenor.com/images/c870a37aa766fb2284b39553c84b109b/tenor.gif)
DC\coffee > www3\Sub\Cal
Also coffee should holster tonight :sillyspin:
More seriously though... timpa would have known he probably goes down today so whether coffee targeted him or not makes no sense claiming it? Like why? If that isn't teammate distancing then it was very well faked by timpa to frame coffee with basically a double-deke... Hmmmmm
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This explains why timpa lied about Coffee's ability.
tell it to me like I'm 5yo... I don't see how this clears that up at all really...
Well, rip www. He now cannot be protected from the mafia kill. :sillyspin:
what are you talking about?
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By majority vote, this phase has been shortened by 5 hours. The timer has been updated.
andretimpa was lynched. He was Raiden Mei. He was holding the Core of Binding.
Excellent, two more to go. Although, so much for any plans or ability usage tonight.
called it, torb calling the mislynch early cause hes maf :-X
Sorry w3, we cannot all three be mafia anymore after this reveal.
Why do you think i led the vote on timpa over DC :kappa:
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At least he called me amigo... It's fine, hearing it over and over kinda just numbs me to it over time I guess
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With timpa flipped scum now, I don't see why he targets DC night 1 outside of them being teammates and team wanting DC to have the Raiden ability...??
Feeling more and more to me like DC\coffee ... S O L V E D G A M E.
::)
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At least he called me amigo... It's fine, hearing it over and over kinda just numbs me to it over time I guess
you're take on timpa\coffee 'interaction' last night (actions) and day (posts)?
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Although, so much for any plans or ability usage tonight.
Why do you think i led the vote on timpa over DC :kappa:
They were good plans about getting a DC vig or a second doc, though ;(
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This explains why timpa lied about Coffee's ability.
tell it to me like I'm 5yo... I don't see how this clears that up at all really...
It seemed to me timpa wanted to die first to activate his nullifier, but now that I think about it, it only makes sense if DC was also mafia and they were fighting for death priority. So maybe it does not explain it as well as I thought it would. >_<
Well, rip www. He now cannot be protected from the mafia kill. :sillyspin:
what are you talking about?
It's a joke about www always wanting protection, even when he's not a sensible NK target.
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At least he called me amigo... It's fine, hearing it over and over kinda just numbs me to it over time I guess
you're take on timpa\coffee 'interaction' last night (actions) and day (posts)?
I had both as scum already and it hasn't changed what I think of them. Looks like an act and I wonder why he didn't try to hit anyone else seeing as andre and I were almost certainly gonna be the next lynches
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This explains why timpa lied about Coffee's ability.
tell it to me like I'm 5yo... I don't see how this clears that up at all really...
It seemed to me timpa wanted to die first to activate his nullifier, but now that I think about it, it only makes sense if DC was also mafia and they were fighting for death priority. So maybe it does not explain it as well as I thought it would. >_<
Well, rip www. He now cannot be protected from the mafia kill. :sillyspin:
what are you talking about?
It's a joke about www always wanting protection, even when he's not a sensible NK target.
I am ALWAYS a sensible target for the doc :thumbs-up:
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Hey @DC who were your targets last night?
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Hey @DC who were your targets last night?
andre and torb he claimed earlier. Tho one of the radens lying considering moe died. Unless rob is mafia.
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Bah, unfortunate.
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Current state... 8:2. NK tonight happens no chance to block\save. --> 7:2, lynch somebody tomorrow. Worst case they're town. 6:2. Core of death might get used tonight would be worst worse case and they die EOD also > 5:2. NK > 4:2. Lynch again, worst case is town > 3:2. NK > 2:2 parity game over.
I think we have AT LEAST two lynches to got at least 1 scum, which would get us another chance.
---> need 1 scum in next two lynches...
---> to earn another 1-in-two chance?
So MAX poe appears to be four deep.
DC\coffee almost certainly hits one; next step though I think it gets murky if DC or coffee is town... The last probably hiding among sub\www3\cal\ian? I see no way or reason for TorB \ Kae \ kdz \ [myself] to not be the next set of no targets \ non-poe.
Thoughts? (Other than the obvious but I think unavoidable minimal WIFOM that's in there)
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Current state... 8:2. NK tonight happens no chance to block\save. --> 7:2, lynch somebody tomorrow. Worst case they're town. 6:2. Core of death might get used tonight would be worst worse case and they die EOD also > 5:2. NK > 4:2. Lynch again, worst case is town > 3:2. NK > 2:2 parity game over.
I think we have AT LEAST two lynches to got at least 1 scum, which would get us another chance.
---> need 1 scum in next two lynches...
---> to earn another 1-in-two chance?
So MAX poe appears to be four deep.
DC\coffee almost certainly hits one; next step though I think it gets murky if DC or coffee is town... The last probably hiding among sub\www3\cal\ian? I see no way or reason for TorB \ Kae \ kdz \ [myself] to not be the next set of no targets \ non-poe.
Thoughts? (Other than the obvious but I think unavoidable minimal WIFOM that's in there)
Yup I have thoughts
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Current state... 8:2. NK tonight happens no chance to block\save. --> 7:2, lynch somebody tomorrow. Worst case they're town. 6:2. Core of death might get used tonight would be worst worse case and they die EOD also > 5:2. NK > 4:2. Lynch again, worst case is town > 3:2. NK > 2:2 parity game over.
I think we have AT LEAST two lynches to got at least 1 scum, which would get us another chance.
---> need 1 scum in next two lynches...
---> to earn another 1-in-two chance?
So MAX poe appears to be four deep.
DC\coffee almost certainly hits one; next step though I think it gets murky if DC or coffee is town... The last probably hiding among sub\www3\cal\ian? I see no way or reason for TorB \ Kae \ kdz \ [myself] to not be the next set of no targets \ non-poe.
Thoughts? (Other than the obvious but I think unavoidable minimal WIFOM that's in there)
Having both DC and Coffee be mafia does not seem very likely to me, either? From looking at lynch logs, at least.
Agree with logic from there on out. If someone does want to insist rob is mafia, chances are extremely high they will be proven wrong as early as tonight.
Yup I have thoughts
Best case scenario: w3 gets NK-ed. We narrow our PoE, get a higher content/post average and keep all our useful roles.
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As far as things go, I doubt Coffee is mafia.
And as much as I kept pointing out things that spoke against www, I start thinking that he's town.
I get the feeling we have exactly one deep wolf.
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Given NK has always gone through, I suppose scum may leave me alone thinking I am lying about my town role? But that's pretty far fetched. I mean, maybe they let me live if they think Raiden #2 doesn't get lynched next and then shade me as not being town because "why would mafia not NK town doc?!". Or my reads have scum in my "town core"? But the basic level 1 +EV mafia play tonight is to NK me. Hence I'll probably be posting this phase as if I won't get to say anything next day. You're welcome. And drink some of THAT WIFOM.
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As far as things go, I doubt Coffee is mafia.
And as much as I kept pointing out things that spoke against www, I start thinking that he's town.
I get the feeling we have exactly one deep wolf.
Do you count? I could def see that...
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I never vote TorB or Kae or kdz. NOBODY should be voting kdz.
It isn't me. So if you insist deep wolf I can only agree if you mean outside of those names. Are you thinking it IS ONE of those? Do tell.
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As far as things go, I doubt Coffee is mafia.
And as much as I kept pointing out things that spoke against www, I start thinking that he's town.
I get the feeling we have exactly one deep wolf.
Do you count? I could def see that...
If I would be mafia in this game, I would not count as deep wolf, as I'm highly suspected by at least 2 people. I'm talking about widely townread people as deep wolfs.
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I never vote TorB or Kae or kdz. NOBODY should be voting kdz.
It isn't me. So if you insist deep wolf I can only agree if you mean outside of those names. Are you thinking it IS ONE of those? Do tell.
Everything is possible, even if unlikely. The order in which I think deep wolfs are possible is as follows:
rob --> TorB --> kae
But as any sane town, I look for the easier to find wolves first. And the likely people to be that wolf is as follows:
DC --> Cal --> ian = Coffee = www
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I was the first to vote DC and the first to vote timpa. Heavy bussing :D
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Core of Reason, Durandal and Emma Planck should all be on cooldown tonight, having Frederica Tesla target the exact same targets as last night may give insight on those roles. In case shock was included, we already know he used his ability N0 and did not have a Honkai Core.
At least one player has already given significant hints on their role. The one that first comes to mind might not be the most important one, but they would make perfect Theresa targets. For town Theresa with info on unclaimed people: remember that the other two top town roles are both EoR. So they should not be a priority when "random" lynching.
this is a quote from n1, but i was wondering why you chose to include those specific 3 roles to mention them being on CD? the casual mention of core of reason as if you knew it was in the game was like 'huh.'
Also coffee should holster tonight :sillyspin:
can do, boss man :)
At least he called me amigo... It's fine, hearing it over and over kinda just numbs me to it over time I guess
you're take on timpa\coffee 'interaction' last night (actions) and day (posts)?
I had both as scum already and it hasn't changed what I think of them. Looks like an act and I wonder why he didn't try to hit anyone else seeing as andre and I were almost certainly gonna be the next lynches
i didn't hit timpa
I was the first to vote DC and the first to vote timpa. Heavy bussing :D
kindly prove some reads along with your bread?
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The order in which I think deep wolfs are possible is as follows:
rob --> TorB --> kae
Correction:
www --> rob --> TorB --> kae
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Actually, I don't think we have any remaining method to confirm ian, so my reads are minorly updated.
DC --> Cal = ian --> Coffee
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Anyway, this is pretty much a solved game. Bring on the memes. :D
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Core of Reason, Durandal and Emma Planck should all be on cooldown tonight, having Frederica Tesla target the exact same targets as last night may give insight on those roles. In case shock was included, we already know he used his ability N0 and did not have a Honkai Core.
At least one player has already given significant hints on their role. The one that first comes to mind might not be the most important one, but they would make perfect Theresa targets. For town Theresa with info on unclaimed people: remember that the other two top town roles are both EoR. So they should not be a priority when "random" lynching.
this is a quote from n1, but i was wondering why you chose to include those specific 3 roles to mention them being on CD? the casual mention of core of reason as if you knew it was in the game was like 'huh.'
Well, they're the most important EoR abilities. I skipped the garbage ones. Might even have forgotten some were EoR to begin with, or I expected them not to see use (Kallen/Kiana Kaslana). The reasoning was that Durandal and Emma Planck should be protected, while Core of Reason should be lynched (duh!). I mean, you cannot know the alignment of Durandal, but that's not a role you should want to lynch willy nilly.
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damn, i was exactly wrong on the honkai cores that scum wanted to trigger. I suppose I valued sub n reading timpa too highly when considering who they rather sacrifice; timpa was kinda asking to get killed with that coffee nonsense.
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considering dc cant self protect i would have asked coffee to kill him for us, but I suppose thats off the table now
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I think the remaining honkai cores are reason and void. It doesnt seem like lightning was used on either offnight when i checked everyone (and moe dying with rob protection proves no abilities were omitted through raidens crossstreaming) and death core should by all means have been used by now. Another possibility offcourse is that scum avoided activating honkai cores at all, since there is a small chance to be found out that gets even slimmer with raiden around...
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The order in which I think deep wolfs are possible is as follows:
rob --> TorB --> kae
Correction:
www --> rob --> TorB --> kae
Actually, I keep forgetting that it’s because of TorB and Kae that we even got close to a maf lynch, so make the arrow between torb and rob waaay longer. I might even take them out from consideration.
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Lets just kill w3 because it would be funny.
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Lets just kill w3 because it would be funny.
use your NK on him kthxbye
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Oh yeah, I keep forgetting we have that Rob, thanks for reminding me. Could send me the pad info from DC again? I accidentally closed it :/
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Lets just kill w3 because it would be funny.
use your NK on him kthxbye
Pls don’t nk me rob, I plan to never lynch you if you don’t nk me
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@ian: Good morning, sir. Opinions on things that has transpired?
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@ian: Good morning, sir. Opinions on things that has transpired?
No.
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A most insightful answer, yes. Well, thank you for your detailed answer, sir.
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Well, since there are no plans to be made for this night, how about a plan in advance for the next night? Maybe I should stop thinking this far ahead, but as long as there is no Core of Death and DoubleCapitals is mafia, this idea will reduce the PoE by at least three by sacrificing a single mislynch opportunity at most. That's not too bad, right?
iancudorinmarian targets Calindu and Submachine.
Coffeeditto targets Calindu.
Submachine targets no one.
If the plan succeeds and no mafia is caught, iancudorinmarian cannot be mafia. That leaves one mislynch opportunity and two people in the PoE: w3 and Coffee.
If the plan fails because only Calindu dies, iancudorinmarian is mafia.
If the plan fails because iancudorinmarian and Coffee both fail to use their ability, Submachine is mafia.
If the plan fails because only Coffees ability fails, Coffee is lying scum.
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Sounds reasonable.
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I like the plan (provided dc is scum and we only need to find one more, but cmon its obvious)
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iancudorinmarian targets Calindu and Submachine.
Coffeeditto targets Calindu.
Submachine targets no one.
If the plan succeeds and no mafia is caught, iancudorinmarian cannot be mafia. That leaves one mislynch opportunity and two people in the PoE: w3 and Coffee.
If the plan fails because only Calindu dies, iancudorinmarian is mafia.
If the plan fails because iancudorinmarian and Coffee both fail to use their ability, Submachine is mafia.
If the plan fails because only Coffees ability fails, Coffee is lying scum.
I volunteer to not use my ability on any night, regardless whether I like the plan or not.
The plan nets us the controlled death of me and Calindu, along with the nightkill. Assuming worst case scenario, that's 3 town death.[1]
Speculation:
Night 4: 8 town, 2 mafia --> kdz dies
Day 5: 7 town, 2 mafia --> DC dies
- Day 6 (DC was mafia): 7 town, 1 mafia
- Day 6 (DC was town): 6 town, 2 mafia
If Core of Death is activated tonight:
- Day 6 (DC was mafia): 6 town, 1 mafia
- Day 6 (DC was town): 5 town, 2 mafia
The next night starts, where we instantiate the plan. At worst, 3 town dies [Refer to 1].
The next day:
- Day 6 (DC was mafia): 3 town, 1 mafia
- Day 6 (DC was town): 2 town, 2 mafia
So, I like the plan, but only under the following conditions:
- We lynch mafia next.
- If we did not lynch mafia, Core of Death was not activated.
TL;DR: Yeah, all in all, I like the plan. I do not much care about my own survival, as I do understand that I am unlikely to be nightkilled, and if I get to endgame, people will suspect me by principle. (That is why I'm glad that I got one of the roles that I asked for: something expendable.) I am town though, and if Calindu is also town, I feel safe to calculate with the worst case scenario. Just be prepared for it.~
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Well, since there are no plans to be made for this night, how about a plan in advance for the next night? Maybe I should stop thinking this far ahead, but as long as there is no Core of Death and DoubleCapitals is mafia, this idea will reduce the PoE by at least three by sacrificing a single mislynch opportunity at most. That's not too bad, right?
iancudorinmarian targets Calindu and Submachine.
Coffeeditto targets Calindu.
Submachine targets no one.
If the plan succeeds and no mafia is caught, iancudorinmarian cannot be mafia. That leaves one mislynch opportunity and two people in the PoE: w3 and Coffee.
If the plan fails because only Calindu dies, iancudorinmarian is mafia.
If the plan fails because iancudorinmarian and Coffee both fail to use their ability, Submachine is mafia.
If the plan fails because only Coffees ability fails, Coffee is lying scum.
You do not have to worry about me as lynch option as I can guarantee you I am town :thumbs-up:
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Quoted from the Priority section of the rules:
"Death will not stop abilities from being used on the current night."
If the plan succeeds and no mafia is caught, iancudorinmarian cannot be mafia. That leaves one mislynch opportunity and two people in the PoE: w3 and Coffee.
If the plan fails because only Calindu dies, iancudorinmarian is mafia.
If the plan fails because iancudorinmarian and Coffee both fail to use their ability, Submachine is mafia.
If the plan fails because only Coffees ability fails, Coffee is lying scum.
@TorB: IMPORTANT. What happens if Calindu uses his ability? Account that too!
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Cal has already used his ability, he said
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Cal has already used his ability, he said
"He said", like lies do not exist. Account a scenario where Calindu uses his ability that night.
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Speculation:
Night 4: 8 town, 2 mafia --> kdz dies
Day 5: 7 town, 2 mafia --> DC dies
- Day 6 (DC was mafia): 7 town, 1 mafia
- Day 6 (DC was town): 6 town, 2 mafia
If Core of Death is activated tonight:
- Day 6 (DC was mafia): 6 town, 1 mafia
- Day 6 (DC was town): 5 town, 2 mafia
The next night starts, where we instantiate the plan. At worst, 3 town dies [Refer to 1].
The next day:
- Day 6 (DC was mafia): 3 town, 1 mafia
- Day 6 (DC was town): 2 town, 2 mafia
Why do you think kdz will die instead of rob? To keep the doc alive sounds like a terrible mafia strategy unless rob is mafia or mafia think they can frame rob as one. If we're at lylo and rob is still alive, it might be worth considering. But not before then.
@TorB: IMPORTANT. What happens if Calindu uses his ability? Account that too!
kaempfer13 and Calindu have already established that the single use Flash Counter has been wasted. If this is false, Calindu is lying scum and only Coffee dies.
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Also, I haven't closely paid attention to all claimed roles, but if we assume someone has a different role they claimed, account those possibilities too. Just for completeness sake.
Edit: Ah, Torb responded.
Why do you think kdz will die instead of rob?
I said it was speculation. It does not really matter which town dies, I just wanted to use someone as example who is the most likely to be town.
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To keep the doc alive sounds like a terrible mafia strategy
I prefer being vague about what is a good strategy for mafia, so sometimes you might see me say intentionally misleading stuff like www gets nigthkilled tonight. :P (And I expect the same from all others as well.) I already dislike how we called attention to the rob NK, even though I tried to shade him as much as I could to make mafia believe kdz is a better target, but it's pointless now.
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The role lies I can see that could prevent the plan from happening are iancudorinmarian and Submachine, which have the same end results as them having the role they claim and are scum. Coffee is already confirmed Cecilia.
You shading rob and looking for deep town just made me scum read you more, lol. Hence the framing speculation :silly:
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The role lies I can see that could prevent the plan from happening are iancudorinmarian and Submachine, which have the same end results as them having the role they claim and are scum. Coffee is already confirmed Cecilia.
You shading rob and looking for deep town just made me scum read you more, lol. Hence the framing speculation :silly:
What I'm saying is, I have speculated before the mass roleclaim that www is Sin Mal. It is still possible that he is Sin Mal with shock's ability (I saw him get a system message at EOD, though I didn't know Bronya also gets a system message even when he voted).
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He was probably just looking for the mafia pad in his inbox.
w3 using his ability N0 on shock, then vouch no lynch and rely on town Linkcat to O R C H E S T R A T E a shock lynch, finally leading to me and Linkcat breaking the lynch into a shock lynch during the last 98 seconds with w3 keeping his vote on you of all people sounds preposterous. Not to mention the dangers of a false claim.
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He was probably just looking for the mafia pad in his inbox.
w3 using his ability N0 on shock, then vouch no lynch and rely on town Linkcat to O R C H E S T R A T E a shock lynch, finally leading to me and Linkcat breaking the lynch into a shock lynch during the last 98 seconds with w3 keeping his vote on you of all people sounds preposterous. Not to mention the dangers of a false claim.
Yh I forgot to add the padri my favourites, sorry TorB seems like you’ll have to be the last one standing now that sub found me :/
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// pad idk wth is padri
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np, padre
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It's fine then. Those are all possibilities afaik.
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I can't be the only one confused as all get out about this multifaceted next night plan?? :-\ :-\ :-\
I probably don't need to grasp the specifics myself but if it can be simplified for me is be glad to review what the point is?
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I probably don't need to grasp the specifics myself but if it can be simplified for me is be glad to review what the point is?
Vig Cal and Sub, turn ian into confirmed town.
Rest are the different ways the plan can go and how that tells us whom is scum.
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Can I help in the plan? :)
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I probably don't need to grasp the specifics myself but if it can be simplified for me is be glad to review what the point is?
Vig Cal and Sub, turn ian into confirmed town.
Rest are the different ways the plan can go and how that tells us whom is scum.
And if all goes according to plan, the PoE will be only Coffee and www.
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I probably don't need to grasp the specifics myself but if it can be simplified for me is be glad to review what the point is?
Vig Cal and Sub, turn ian into confirmed town.
Rest are the different ways the plan can go and how that tells us whom is scum.
And if all goes according to plan, the PoE will be only Coffee and www.
*coffee
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So this whole plan is for tomorrow night after we kill dc yeah?
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So this whole plan is for tomorrow night after we kill dc yeah?
Yes. No abilities tonight.
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Can I help in the plan? :)
if you're town, don't cave tomorrow and convince us who the rest of timpa's team is if not you?? Otherwise you're probably dead before this next night plan goes into effect...
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@ian: Good morning, sir. Opinions on things that has transpired?
No.
Can we all appreciate that this is the best exchange in the entirety of this thread?
-
@ian: Good morning, sir. Opinions on things that has transpired?
No.
Can we all appreciate that this is the best exchange in the entirety of this thread?
No.
-
@ian: Good morning, sir. Opinions on things that has transpired?
No.
Can we all appreciate that this is the best exchange in the entirety of this thread?
No.
:(
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Side note, completely unrelated, I am all for whatever plan gets w3 killed. No ulterior motives what so ever.
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Side note, completely unrelated, I am all for whatever plan gets w3 killed. No ulterior motives what so ever.
That’s a bit mean
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Side note, completely unrelated, I am all for whatever plan gets w3 killed. No ulterior motives what so ever.
That’s a bit mean
Nah
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Side note, completely unrelated, I am all for whatever plan gets w3 killed. No ulterior motives what so ever.
That’s a bit mean
you should laugh at his jokes, then.
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/hpXxJ78YtpT0s/giphy.gif)
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Rob gets it
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Rob gets it
Yeah, I'll get it right between the eyes tonight methinks...
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Side note, completely unrelated, I am all for whatever plan gets w3 killed. No ulterior motives what so ever.
That’s a bit mean
you should laugh at his jokes, then.
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/hpXxJ78YtpT0s/giphy.gif)
Oh I thought jokes are supposed to be funny
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Side note, completely unrelated, I am all for whatever plan gets w3 killed. No ulterior motives what so ever.
That’s a bit mean
you should laugh at his jokes, then.
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/hpXxJ78YtpT0s/giphy.gif)
Oh I thought jokes are supposed to be funny
common mistake... common mistake, mi amigo. :silly:
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Side note, completely unrelated, I am all for whatever plan gets w3 killed. No ulterior motives what so ever.
That’s a bit mean
you should laugh at his jokes, then.
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/hpXxJ78YtpT0s/giphy.gif)
Oh I thought jokes are supposed to be funny
common mistake... common mistake, mi amigo. :silly:
Omg HAHHAHAHAHA that’s so funny lmao ;D
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I came out here to have a good time and honestly I just feel so attacked rn.
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Forgot to reply, but the plan seems fine to me
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(https://media1.tenor.com/images/ea85057f937fbe29da3cf1a4012d6ceb/tenor.gif?itemid=14956041)
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Imagine killing rob instead of the vastly superior w3 kill. Mafia would really be throwing this game pretty hard.
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Cmon kdz, I’m not gonna kill myself am i
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Nobody will EVER VOTE kdz, he might actually be the optimal NK eh?
Trust me.
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(https://i.imgflip.com/ibo0i.jpg)
I'm not the NK you're looking for...
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nah i still think kdz is mafia
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nah i still think kdz is mafia
Well obv
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nah i still think kdz is mafia
Well obv
https://youtu.be/geNMz0J9TEQ?t=58
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Night 4 has ended. Notifications are currently being sent.
Day 5 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Day 5
rob77dp was nightkilled. He was Fu Hua.
Day 5 has ended.
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DoubleCapitals (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
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Honestly glad rob died so I can't tunnel him for a mislynch late game.
Oh uh, and you will be missed rob.
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DoubleCapitals (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Killsdazombies
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DoubleCapitals (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, Killsdazombies, iancudorinmarian
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Dead thread, dead town.
(https://i.imgur.com/o6GUCl7.png)
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May dc never miss another eod. Unless its w3 or dc is innocent I think the game is pretty much mechanically solved now.
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DoubleCapitals (4) - TheonlyrealBeef, Killsdazombies, iancudorinmarian, kaempfer13
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May dc never miss another eod. Unless its w3 or dc is innocent I think the game is pretty much mechanically solved now.
(https://i.imgur.com/o6GUCl7.png)
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Core of Death does not seem activated, so we did not meet the worst case scenario. In this case, I gladly comply with the plan, even if DC flips town.
Day 5: 7 town, 2 mafia --> DC dies
Night 6 (DC was mafia): 7 town, 1 mafia
Night 6 (DC was town): 6 town, 2 mafia
Plan begins. At worst, 3 town dies.
The next day:
Day 6 (DC was mafia): 4 town, 1 mafia
Day 6 (DC was town): 3 town, 2 mafia
The 3 town, 2 mafia scenario sounds spooky, but assuming mafia does not have Core of Death, they cannot kill both ian and kdz, so 1 town will be confirmed.
The alive players will be: www, Coffee, TorB, kaempf, and a confirmed town. Depending on DC's flip, 1-2 of these people will be mafia. What should be discussed today is who we think the last mafia is/are in each scenario.
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DoubleCapitals (5) - TheonlyrealBeef, Killsdazombies, iancudorinmarian, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto
I wanted to apologise for not being too present during the last phase, work has been kicking my ass (who thought a job would be hard??). I would say i could catch myself up on what i missed and share thoughts, but it seems like there is no shortage of bread from everyone.
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Core of Death does not seem activated, so we did not meet the worst case scenario. In this case, I gladly comply with the plan, even if DC flips town.
Day 5: 7 town, 2 mafia --> DC dies
Night 6 (DC was mafia): 7 town, 1 mafia
Night 6 (DC was town): 6 town, 2 mafia
Plan begins. At worst, 3 town dies.
The next day:
Day 6 (DC was mafia): 4 town, 1 mafia
Day 6 (DC was town): 3 town, 2 mafia
The 3 town, 2 mafia scenario sounds spooky, but assuming mafia does not have Core of Death, they cannot kill both ian and kdz, so 1 town will be confirmed.
The alive players will be: www, Coffee, TorB, kaempf, and a confirmed town. Depending on DC's flip, 1-2 of these people will be mafia. What should be discussed today is who we think the last mafia is/are in each scenario.
All this should be discussed after DCs flip, makes it easier.
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May dc never miss another eod. Unless its w3 or dc is innocent I think the game is pretty much mechanically solved now.
Until next mafia because my asian timezone which I think no one has here, will always kick my ass. But really though, don't feel bad about lynching me at EoD, please. I'll manage.
Or, maybe I shouldn't participate, hmm.
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DoubleCapitals (6) - TheonlyrealBeef, Killsdazombies, iancudorinmarian, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, DoubleCapitals
I was wondering if I wanted to bother explaining myself. I see a majority vote before I wake up.
I'm not bothering. And frankly, I'm not even in a mood to shitpost now. Maybe tomorrow. Sorry.
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EBWOP: I don't want pity points or a shitty AtE to save my hide, which is why I'm only saying it now as opposed to before all the votes are locked on me; I'm just saying I'm tired and stressed IRL with college and certain 'friends' that I'm just moody rn :/
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DoubleCapitals (7) - TheonlyrealBeef, Killsdazombies, iancudorinmarian, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, DoubleCapitals, Calindu
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@w3
Don't forget to lynch vote. The town strategy changes to killing you asap if you gain two voting power, since it's the difference between being able to mislynch once or not at all.
@Coffee
Just make sure to catch up on what has been discussed last night before next night. An ability-less night due to Core of Binding is the perfect night to take a break from mafia.
@kdz
I don't disagree, I just towned him so hard thinking that'll make mafia think he's U N L Y N C H A B L E.
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Can I not use my ability even once ): y’all will know about it plus I’m town anyways
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@ian
Feel free to target w3 instead of Sub tonight. We know you want to :silly:
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Wut no I don’t wanna die. Ian please don’t target me I’ll give you mark codes or anything you want. Even an entropy title for this trials.
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@ian
Feel free to target w3 instead of Sub tonight. We know you want to :silly:
Say no more :silly:
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I am being dead serious, by the way. worldwideweb3 skipping out on lynch voting is a serious threat to my town plan and equals an admission to being scum if you ask me. By no means must worldwideweb3 be allowed to have more voting power and use it against people that are more likely to be town, from my point of view. Perhaps the targets I planned for were naive to begin with, thinking a mafia worldwideweb3 would just nicely wait for his turn to get lynched while voting every day.
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I am being dead serious, by the way. worldwideweb3 skipping out on lynch voting is a serious threat to my town plan and equals an admission to being scum if you ask me. By no means must worldwideweb3 be allowed to have more voting power and use it against people that are more likely to be town, from my point of view. Perhaps the targets I planned for were naive to begin with, thinking a mafia worldwideweb3 would just nicely wait for his turn to get lynched while voting every day.
cmon, a mafia me wouldnt do this at this stage when ive got it in the bag :facepalm: Also, you wouldnt even be alive by now if i was maf
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"In the bag", of course you do. Your ability is literally the only possible way for you to win this as mafia. You're already dead to me, since you clearly cannot be trusted to use your ability in a way that benefits town: never.
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Don't listen to mean torb, he made you play dials ian
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You realize that if all you use are shitty arguments, it's the same as not having an argument behind your statement to begin with, giving you, like, 0 town points for this entire mafia?
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me not voting helps town more given you trust me enough to be towny. As a mafia, this move is stupid and would draw attention needlessly. If DC somehow turns out to be town, we will have massive problem in that there will be two mafia left. That nightplan of yours will kill cal sub and a NK. Lets assume kdz is nk. This leaves you coffee kaemp me ian. 5 people, 2 mafia, and its a hard hunt for the last 2. As a towny, me with extra voting helps as it makes it a 4-2 instead of a 3-2. From my perspective, it is the right move and i would have rather not said this out but guess I will have to, to avoid random sus.
Even if DC flips mafia, and we go with night plan (of which all flip town), we will have 5 people 1 maf. It will confirm ian as town, leaving coffee kaemp you me. If we ML, ian probs gets nk due to conf status. leaves 3 of us 1 mafia. And again, a 3 vs 1 is much better than a 2 vs 1.
tldr: this is the right move as a town, and mafia has no need to draw attention needlessly. I will talk more about this "night plan" after DC flip.
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me not voting helps town more given you trust me enough to be towny. As a mafia, this move is stupid and would draw attention needlessly. If DC somehow turns out to be town, we will have massive problem in that there will be two mafia left. That nightplan of yours will kill cal sub and a NK. Lets assume kdz is nk. This leaves you coffee kaemp me ian. 5 people, 2 mafia, and its a hard hunt for the last 2. As a towny, me with extra voting helps as it makes it a 4-2 instead of a 3-2. From my perspective, it is the right move and i would have rather not said this out but guess I will have to, to avoid random sus.
Even if DC flips mafia, and we go with night plan (of which all flip town), we will have 5 people 1 maf. It will confirm ian as town, leaving coffee kaemp you me. If we ML, ian probs gets nk due to conf status. leaves 3 of us 1 mafia. And again, a 3 vs 1 is much better than a 2 vs 1.
tldr: this is the right move as a town, and mafia has no need to draw attention needlessly. I will talk more about this "night plan" after DC flip.
it helps mafia just as much or more as/than town, and the argument that "this role wouldn't do this if they were mafia" is straight up wifom. not saying that i scum read you necessarily, but i disagree in saying that it's more useful. you're basically saying that if there are two wagons you have the benefit of having to choose who gets lynched between them (including throwing it off of you) if they're somewhat even. it's not 4-2 at all, and if ian is mafia he won't be able to mechanically confirm himself so he would be either confirmed mafia or cleared in that situation. that brings a 50/50 chance that you're saying you would want to have control of the outcome over. that's just not towny to me
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I'm not sure what part is supposed to make you town, w3. "I'm town" is the primary argument you use, which sucks. It sucks so much, it only makes you even more sus.
There are two situations I am worried about, both come after the plan succeeding while hitting no maf. The most likely remaining people would indeed be me, kaempf, ian, Coffee and w3. If this is 3 vs 2 it's game solved, the mafia are Coffee and w3. If this is 4 vs 1, we still lynch both of you and it's still game solved. But 3 vs 2 would turn into 3 vs 3, town loses. 4 vs 1 would turn into either 4 vs 2 or 5 vs 1. This is the worst case scenario. You'll be unlynchable if you're town and mafia votes with you against lynching you, lynching the other person when you're maf and not voting makes it 3 vs 2 instant loss for town.
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I still suspect w3 is town and the original plan would reveal the actual third mafia after DC dying as the second. But w3 gaining additional voting power makes it undesirably hard to lynch him, forcing town to just assume he is town rather than simply being able to lynch him if he is not. This is NOT desirable, least of all if forced by w3.
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3 vs 1 is much better than a 2 vs 1.
This statement is never true, btw. Either you vote the next day or your voting power becomes 3. Essentially you are arguing the 1 must be me or kaempfer13 in favor of you being town. How stupid do you take me for?
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I'm not sure what part is supposed to make you town, w3. "I'm town" is the primary argument you use, which sucks. It sucks so much, it only makes you even more sus.
There are two situations I am worried about, both come after the plan succeeding while hitting no maf. The most likely remaining people would indeed be me, kaempf, ian, Coffee and w3. If this is 3 vs 2 it's game solved, the mafia are Coffee and w3. If this is 4 vs 1, we still lynch both of you and it's still game solved. But 3 vs 2 would turn into 3 vs 3, town loses. 4 vs 1 would turn into either 4 vs 2 or 5 vs 1. This is the worst case scenario. You'll be unlynchable if you're town and mafia votes with you against lynching you, lynching the other person when you're maf and not voting makes it 3 vs 2 instant loss for town.
That’s the whole point. I know I’m not mafia and you’re hell bent on lynching me. For town to win, I can’t let this happen. Tho this is a very unlikely scenario in that DC is most likely mafia anyways saving us trouble and this not mattering.
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3 vs 1 is much better than a 2 vs 1.
This statement is never true, btw. Either you vote the next day or your voting power becomes 3. Essentially you are arguing the 1 must be me or kaempfer13 in favor of you being town. How stupid do you take me for?
That’s exactly my point, no one is scum reading you or kaemp, so if it comes to that (which has a 1% chance btw LOL), town are guranteed loss and only way to save is for me to have the ability. It shouldn’t even come to this ability having a bearing on the vote count, unless mafia really did hid them very well
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I think we can both agree that you're essentially shifting the town loss condition from one of me and kaempfer13 being maf, to you being maf or unable to discern the true maf between me and kaempfer13. Therefore, our perspectives will never align on what is best for town.
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Tbh there’s like 0.5% chance you or kae are maf, and this is for that 0.5% situation. All other times it won’t even matter.
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But I estimate the odds of you being maf higher than the odds of kaempfer13 being maf, it's a bad deal for anyone thinking the chances of you being maf are higher than the chances of either of me or kaempfer13 being maf. So especially bad for me or kaempfer13 since we know our own alignments.
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But I estimate the odds of you being maf higher than the odds of kaempfer13 being maf, it's a bad deal for anyone thinking the chances of you being maf are higher than the chances of either of me or kaempfer13 being maf. So especially bad for me or kaempfer13 since we know our own alignments.
And I know mine, and from my view this is pro town :/
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you know w3, if one of us actually were maf youd still have to vote us, which doesnt make sense to do when you townread us more than the other players. Anyway we dont need your voting power to seal the game.
If the nightplan goes through, ian will be confirmed town and calindu and sub/you dead, torb and i were involved with uncovering that timpa was lying, kdz confirmed town, so assuming the game doesnt end by then we have to solve between you/sub(one is dead) and coffee.
If it doesnt we can find out who tampered with it.
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and thats what i said, it wont even matter unless you or torb are mafia. I cant just discount all possibilities, its one of those extreme scenarios thats unlikely but always a chance. In a last 3 of you me and torb, with one mafia, who would you vote (rhetorical q)
Also, i may townread you both more than others, but doesn't mean youre conf town.
(https://i.imgflip.com/2iujr4.jpg)
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There is a lot that needs to be unpacked here. I don't even know where to start.
First of all, Coffee vs www. In the previous game, I tried the strategy to give more towncred to those who solved more, and it proved to be effective from my PoV. Following that line, Coffee solved fairly often near the first half of the game, while www's solving is near zero. That would say, between those two, www is mafia. However, I find it very uncomfortable that Coffee just went silent after suspicion went to other people, while www became more active and "in your face". I also don't remember if Coffee's solving was role solving (which is mostly NAI) or town solving.
So to me, logic dictates that the mafia between them is www, but my gut says it is Coffee. And I cannot decide which one to follow.
Www is an interesting case, because almost everyone townreads him despite him not having any solid defense. His defenses are "I am town" (which as I showed in the previous game, mafia can say just as easily), and the WIFOM of mafia not wanting this much attention on them. However he forgets that Coffee has an even better WIFOM defense than him, because Coffee straight up shot a town during early game, which would make much less sense as mafia as www's weak attempts to call attention to himself.
Speaking of calling attention to www, I now want a straight answer from him about what his plan is in this game. He has been clearly vocal about not wanting to die (heck, that might be the only thing he did in this game), but he has not said why yet. Some people do it because they need time to gather information, but www does not have a role that becomes better as time goes on, and he is not solving enough to make his time alive worth it. Simply wanting to be alive is not an acceptable reason. And continuously calling out FOR THE MAFIA to not want getting nightkilled is insane at times when there are confirmed town and confirmed doctors on the plate.
This is the time for www to stop holding on to secrets and spill out everything. If he had any mind games planned (for example: calling out to specific mafia players to not kill him, to make that player suspect that www knows he is mafia, and actually attract a nightkill on purpose to save a more useful player from dying), it is time to reveal it. Even I reveal now that my initial attempt of asking for not getting Nightkilled was a weak attempt at actually attracting the nightkill. But after I realized that I'm not a sensible nightkill, I dropped it completely. More about www below.
Let's also talk about where this game is heading. TorB's plan will go off, no question about that. This means, the game is already on a set course towards a set result, depending on who is mafia. Town's only surefire victory with this plan is if both DC and Calindu are mafia. In every other scenario, mafia has between 50-100% chance to win this. If the last mafia is among Coffee and www, town still has a chance to win, but I can easily see this scenario ending with a loss for town. If mafia is not among them, however, then it is among Kae and TorB. Being aware that they can be mafia is fine, but they will NOT get voted unless someone actually brings up scum points about them.
So, back to www's case, he should not be allowed to hold on to 2x voting power unless he brings out a clear and logical argument about why Kae or TorB is mafia, AND actually proceed to vote on them, and not just "be aware" of the possibility.
So what I think should happen now is www to start voting today and explain everything about his overly defensive behavior, while also revealing any plans he had this whole game and what he plans to do, create a readlist (which he never did in this game, by the way), and Coffee to also start being vocal and do actual solving.
As I said, the game took a set course as soon as we all agreed to follow TorB's plan. As last game showed, being aware of someone possibly being the mafia achieves nothing if we do not vote on them. We should make a concensus whether we suspect Kae or TorB to be mafia (strongly enough that we actually vote on them!), and if not, put them off the table. I think if we have a deep wolf, it is Kae and not TorB. TorB did too many things, but I can't remember if Kae actually helped find a mafia, or he doubled down on a mafia that TorB found without him. I want an answer to this too from people who have good memory of this, then I will make a final decision whether I will consider voting Kae or not - if I even live for the next day.
And one other thing I remembered: If I am tunneled by TorB and Kae strong enough that they think I am more likely to be mafia than www and Coffee combined, then Ian should definitely not target www tonight, because if www is town, then town will be sure to mislynch on the following day. At least, with www and Coffee on the table, I believe town's opinion will be more diverse, and thus, have a chance to win.
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Also, you wouldnt even be alive by now if i was maf
This has no weight, as mafia has been constantly killing confirmed town as I remember.
This reminds me, if TorB is mafia, if we have a deep wolf among TorB and Kae, and the game reaches 3v1, I think town should No Lynch, because then mafia needs to kill a town member who would be possible to be deep wolf if they want to avoid a stalemate. Especially if Ian is alive, because then he creates an even better PoE by the time LyLo is reached.
For this though, town needs a strong determination to keep up the No Lynch as long as it is still 3v1, because it might actually be a stalemate of mafia not killing anyone and town not lynching anyone.
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This reminds me, if TorB is mafia, if we have a deep wolf among TorB and Kae,
EBWOP: "This reminds me, if we have a deep wolf among TorB and Kae,"
Ignore the "if TorB is mafia," part.
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There is a lot that needs to be unpacked here. I don't even know where to start.
First of all, Coffee vs www. In the previous game, I tried the strategy to give more towncred to those who solved more, and it proved to be effective from my PoV. Following that line, Coffee solved fairly often near the first half of the game, while www's solving is near zero. That would say, between those two, www is mafia. However, I find it very uncomfortable that Coffee just went silent after suspicion went to other people, while www became more active and "in your face". I also don't remember if Coffee's solving was role solving (which is mostly NAI) or town solving.
So to me, logic dictates that the mafia between them is www, but my gut says it is Coffee. And I cannot decide which one to follow.
Www is an interesting case, because almost everyone townreads him despite him not having any solid defense. His defenses are "I am town" (which as I showed in the previous game, mafia can say just as easily), and the WIFOM of mafia not wanting this much attention on them. However he forgets that Coffee has an even better WIFOM defense than him, because Coffee straight up shot a town during early game, which would make much less sense as mafia as www's weak attempts to call attention to himself.
Speaking of calling attention to www, I now want a straight answer from him about what his plan is in this game. He has been clearly vocal about not wanting to die (heck, that might be the only thing he did in this game), but he has not said why yet. Some people do it because they need time to gather information, but www does not have a role that becomes better as time goes on, and he is not solving enough to make his time alive worth it. Simply wanting to be alive is not an acceptable reason. And continuously calling out FOR THE MAFIA to not want getting nightkilled is insane at times when there are confirmed town and confirmed doctors on the plate.
This is the time for www to stop holding on to secrets and spill out everything. If he had any mind games planned (for example: calling out to specific mafia players to not kill him, to make that player suspect that www knows he is mafia, and actually attract a nightkill on purpose to save a more useful player from dying), it is time to reveal it. Even I reveal now that my initial attempt of asking for not getting Nightkilled was a weak attempt at actually attracting the nightkill. But after I realized that I'm not a sensible nightkill, I dropped it completely. More about www below.
Let's also talk about where this game is heading. TorB's plan will go off, no question about that. This means, the game is already on a set course towards a set result, depending on who is mafia. Town's only surefire victory with this plan is if both DC and Calindu are mafia. In every other scenario, mafia has between 50-100% chance to win this. If the last mafia is among Coffee and www, town still has a chance to win, but I can easily see this scenario ending with a loss for town. If mafia is not among them, however, then it is among Kae and TorB. Being aware that they can be mafia is fine, but they will NOT get voted unless someone actually brings up scum points about them.
So, back to www's case, he should not be allowed to hold on to 2x voting power unless he brings out a clear and logical argument about why Kae or TorB is mafia, AND actually proceed to vote on them, and not just "be aware" of the possibility.
So what I think should happen now is www to start voting today and explain everything about his overly defensive behavior, while also revealing any plans he had this whole game and what he plans to do, create a readlist (which he never did in this game, by the way), and Coffee to also start being vocal and do actual solving.
As I said, the game took a set course as soon as we all agreed to follow TorB's plan. As last game showed, being aware of someone possibly being the mafia achieves nothing if we do not vote on them. We should make a concensus whether we suspect Kae or TorB to be mafia (strongly enough that we actually vote on them!), and if not, put them off the table. I think if we have a deep wolf, it is Kae and not TorB. TorB did too many things, but I can't remember if Kae actually helped find a mafia, or he doubled down on a mafia that TorB found without him. I want an answer to this too from people who have good memory of this, then I will make a final decision whether I will consider voting Kae or not - if I even live for the next day.
And one other thing I remembered: If I am tunneled by TorB and Kae strong enough that they think I am more likely to be mafia than www and Coffee combined, then Ian should definitely not target www tonight, because if www is town, then town will be sure to mislynch on the following day. At least, with www and Coffee on the table, I believe town's opinion will be more diverse, and thus, have a chance to win.
Ofcourse i want to be alive and not die, isnt that what everyone wants for themself? It would be weird if someone said please nk me, or lynch vote me.
Im not voting kae or torb rn because theyre the least likely to be scum - but it doesnt mean they are definitely not scum. As ive said multiple times, its a very small chance but in that situation, having a 2* voting power with a towny is very helpful.
I dont think there will ever be a 3 vs 1 this mafia. End of this day phase, theres 8 left, then 3 die on night (as it stands), so 5 at start of next day. Assuming mafia is still left, itll be a 4 vs 1 or 3 vs 2. So if you think about it, we are not likely to have a 3 vs 1 this game at all, as it stands.
I cant have any secrets except knwing i am town, which all of you dont for sure obvs. idk what other secrets sub expects me to have?
Idk how coffees still alive after that dawn vig tbh, he shouldve been lynch voted by now lol. i dont even agree with this night plan, but need to wait for DC flip to make my mind up.
I was the first one to vote on andre, and on DC. idk if that doesnt give me towncred, what does. I cant do much role solving this game like torb/kae/moe etc can, my role doesnt allow that. What it does allow me is twice the voting power for town when in need, which is very helpful.
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oh i forgot to add, :thumbs-up:
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It's easy to vote for mafia members when it's not to kill them and you know their identities because they are your buddies. Also, you do remember your voting power resets to 1 after voting? Just saying. I don't think additional voting power helps town at all, only possibility where it could help from my point of view is when you are town and kaempfer13 is mafia.
w3: your objective is for town to win if you are town. I let myself get NK-ed previous mafia to prevent the risk of getting mislynched to name an example of how getting yourself NK-ed can help town as town. Only mafia has the goal of leaving at least one mafia member alive. If you prioritize your survival above all else, you're playing like mafia, which makes you look like one. Getting the NK instead of a town cop/doc is also a pro town move, like it or not.
Not sure where Sub pulls these percentages from, by the way.
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Ofcourse i want to be alive and not die, isnt that what everyone wants for themself? It would be weird if someone said please nk me, or lynch vote me.
Wrong. You should want town to win, even if that means dying. You should have realized by now that you are not only expendable, but also a distraction if you are town. Reaching endgame with less town cred than everyone else is a detriment.
I already expanded on this idea earlier, as seen in the quote below.
I do not much care about my own survival, as I do understand that I am unlikely to be nightkilled, and if I get to endgame, people will suspect me by principle. (That is why I'm glad that I got one of the roles that I asked for: something expendable.)
Im not voting kae or torb rn because theyre the least likely to be scum - but it doesnt mean they are definitely not scum. As ive said multiple times, its a very small chance but in that situation, having a 2* voting power with a towny is very helpful.
[...]
I cant have any secrets except knwing i am town, which all of you dont for sure obvs. idk what other secrets sub expects me to have?
As you have said multiple times, you think they have the least chance to be mafia. I hope we can agree that the sane thing to do is to commit to the route that has more chance to win. In this case, I want a clear statement from you whether you have any lead to actually vote on them. Everyone is aware that Kae and TorB can be mafia, but you are not special in this. But if they have less chance to be mafia than anyone else, we will not vote on them, and if you don't vote on them, you should stop worrying about your own voting power.
And we get back to the part of you revealing all your plans/secrets. If you want to hide your plan to last-minute vote on TorB with 2 voting power, and want to conceal that plan for TorB not to suspect it, you MUST reveal it now, otherwise you are not allowed to have 2 voting power, because town cannot use it for anything useful. It is only useful for mafia.
I was the first one to vote on andre, and on DC. idk if that doesnt give me towncred, what does. I cant do much role solving this game like torb/kae/moe etc can, my role doesnt allow that. What it does allow me is twice the voting power for town when in need, which is very helpful.
You were also the first one to vote on me. Voting without context is bad and will not give you any credit. You never said you suspect them, and even right now you have not given any readlists, which I am still waiting for.
On top of that, in the previous game, I was the first to vote on some mafia, because I was mafia with them. So it can just as well give you scum cred, so you are wrong again.
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Not sure where Sub pulls these percentages from, by the way.
50% comes from the base assumption that one of Coffee or www is mafia, and I think that is the best case scenario given the criteria I mentioned earlier. But don't mind my percentages, as I did not put real math behind them. Speaking of percentages though, www's 0,5% and 1% make even less sense than what I said.
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I meant for mafia's win chances. I consider them to be significantly lower than 50-100%, regardless of how the plan unfolds.
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Ofcourse i want to be alive and not die, isnt that what everyone wants for themself? It would be weird if someone said please nk me, or lynch vote me.
Wrong. You should want town to win, even if that means dying. You should have realized by now that you are not only expendable, but also a distraction if you are town. Reaching endgame with less town cred than everyone else is a detriment.
I already expanded on this idea earlier, as seen in the quote below.
I do not much care about my own survival, as I do understand that I am unlikely to be nightkilled, and if I get to endgame, people will suspect me by principle. (That is why I'm glad that I got one of the roles that I asked for: something expendable.)
Im not voting kae or torb rn because theyre the least likely to be scum - but it doesnt mean they are definitely not scum. As ive said multiple times, its a very small chance but in that situation, having a 2* voting power with a towny is very helpful.
[...]
I cant have any secrets except knwing i am town, which all of you dont for sure obvs. idk what other secrets sub expects me to have?
As you have said multiple times, you think they have the least chance to be mafia. I hope we can agree that the sane thing to do is to commit to the route that has more chance to win. In this case, I want a clear statement from you whether you have any lead to actually vote on them. Everyone is aware that Kae and TorB can be mafia, but you are not special in this. But if they have less chance to be mafia than anyone else, we will not vote on them, and if you don't vote on them, you should stop worrying about your own voting power.
And we get back to the part of you revealing all your plans/secrets. If you want to hide your plan to last-minute vote on TorB with 2 voting power, and want to conceal that plan for TorB not to suspect it, you MUST reveal it now, otherwise you are not allowed to have 2 voting power, because town cannot use it for anything useful. It is only useful for mafia.
I was the first one to vote on andre, and on DC. idk if that doesnt give me towncred, what does. I cant do much role solving this game like torb/kae/moe etc can, my role doesnt allow that. What it does allow me is twice the voting power for town when in need, which is very helpful.
You were also the first one to vote on me. Voting without context is bad and will not give you any credit. You never said you suspect them, and even right now you have not given any readlists, which I am still waiting for.
On top of that, in the previous game, I was the first to vote on some mafia, because I was mafia with them. So it can just as well give you scum cred, so you are wrong again.
Idk how town dying increases chances of town winning lol. If TorB or kae aren’t mafia, me not voting doesn’t affect anything so that shouldn’t be a problem. It’s more of a safety net in that if DC and/or Coffee ain’t mafia and I’m tied in a 3 way with TorB and kae, I can increase chances of a town win.
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Give us your full readlist on everyone, www.
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DCs death will make it clearer but him and coffee are probs mafia
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It's really not possible to have two voting power in two days if you do not vote now. You vote next day and reset to one, or don't vote again and raise it to three. And you're starting to talk like rob last game, we have no reason to believe you are town, making your elimination a priority to be safe.
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It's really not possible to have two voting power in two days if you do not vote now. You vote next day and reset to one, or don't vote again and raise it to three. And you're starting to talk like rob last game, we have no reason to believe you are town, making your elimination a priority to be safe.
Was rob town or mafia last game?
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DCs death will make it clearer but him and coffee are probs mafia
No, give today a readlist on everyone alive based on the current state of the game. Ignore the chance that you can be wrong, and do what I asked you anyway.
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Which is why you should realize that setting yourself up as a mislynch/vig target does NOT help town. You are only a risk to my plan if you have increased voting power. All risks that can be eliminated, should be eliminated.
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Which is why you should realize that setting yourself up as a mislynch/vig target does NOT help town. You are only a risk to my plan if you have increased voting power. All risks that can be eliminated, should be eliminated.
This is also a risk to a mafia torb/kaemp. I’m not sure how me increasing voting power will affect your plan. DC does, then your noght plan. What’s the plan after that again?
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I have several thoughts.
They do not matter now, but I have thoughts.
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when y'all done arguing tell me when i can shitpost again
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I have several thoughts.
They do not matter now, but I have thoughts.
They matter :'(
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Y'all have determined me to be bad, and I'm no longer gonna refute it.
No one mourns the wicked, so they don't matter.
They're observations, really. Maybe next game I'll tell.
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The plan after that depends on the outcome, I have elaborated on it in great detail earlier. And it's no problem w3. Just understand why I will seek to kill you regardless of our alignments.
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Maybe DC forgot his catchphrase that this is mafia and not Survivor, so him not giving his insights before an incoming lynch retroactively warrants his lynch. :sillyspin:
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The plan after that depends on the outcome, I have elaborated on it in great detail earlier. And it's no problem w3. Just understand why I will seek to kill you regardless of our alignments.
I don’t like statements like these that say regardless of alignments
Anyways out for next few hours, maybe I’ll vote this phase and not vote next phase, let’s see.
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If I am tunneled by TorB and Kae strong enough that they think I am more likely to be mafia than www and Coffee combined, then Ian should definitely not target www tonight, because if www is town, then town will be sure to mislynch on the following day. At least, with www and Coffee on the table, I believe town's opinion will be more diverse, and thus, have a chance to win.
Www's lack of compliance with anything asked from him makes me say to ignore the above part of my quote and let's kill www at night with ian's ability.
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Maybe DC forgot his catchphrase that this is mafia and not Survivor, so him not giving his insights before an incoming lynch retroactively warrants his lynch. :sillyspin:
I haven't been mislynched in years though buddy, you can't pull a read off that :^) Really though, you're right, I'd tell you what I think of people if I was actually town. I am not, and nothing I say can drive the vote off me in these few hours, so I will be committed to being as being useless as possible now.
Like I have been all game. And the games before that.
I never forget, mafia's just allowed to lie :^)
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(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/729886105553338508/736954089073541170/Wait_its_all_always_has_been_meme_template.png)
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So long as DC flips scum, which i think very likely, w3s silliness doesnt really matter much, if the game even continues with w3 alive, as its going to be 4 vs 1. We might be forced to cfd on him if he still refuses to vote at that point, as him scum would mean that we lose a lynch and spent the other one on someone else.
But w3 stop raising silly pseudoarguments that only apply from your own perspective, just admit that you want to use your ability once.
+ if you actually think you need extravoting power in case torb or me are scum, you must realize that youd actually have to vote us and case us. So far all you brought to the table was "but you still could be". if you think thats a scenario worth preparing for we need to talk about that asap, as i am working with the assumption that torb is town, which fmpov means the game runs on autopilot, as we have 3 kills (+calindu, which i think will be collateral dmg rather than having a real chance of hitting scum; btw excellent example of town saccing themselves for the greater good) with 7people (+calindu and dc which wont make it to the next day for basically sure (or if calin does that means someone fucked with the plan)), 2 of which will be esssentially modconfirmed and the other ones being torb and myself +3 people that we can kill just fine.
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So long as DC flips scum, which i think very likely, w3s silliness doesnt really matter much, if the game even continues with w3 alive, as its going to be 4 vs 1. We might be forced to cfd on him if he still refuses to vote at that point, as him scum would mean that we lose a lynch and spent the other one on someone else.
But w3 stop raising silly pseudoarguments that only apply from your own perspective, just admit that you want to use your ability once.
+ if you actually think you need extravoting power in case torb or me are scum, you must realize that youd actually have to vote us and case us. So far all you brought to the table was "but you still could be". if you think thats a scenario worth preparing for we need to talk about that asap, as i am working with the assumption that torb is town, which fmpov means the game runs on autopilot, as we have 3 kills (+calindu, which i think will be collateral dmg rather than having a real chance of hitting scum; btw excellent example of town saccing themselves for the greater good) with 7people (+calindu and dc which wont make it to the next day for basically sure (or if calin does that means someone fucked with the plan)), 2 of which will be esssentially modconfirmed and the other ones being torb and myself +3 people that we can kill just fine.
That too hehehe
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However, I find it very uncomfortable that Coffee just went silent after suspicion went to other people, while www became more active and "in your face". I also don't remember if Coffee's solving was role solving (which is mostly NAI) or town solving.
...
So what I think should happen now is www to start voting today and explain everything about his overly defensive behavior, while also revealing any plans he had this whole game and what he plans to do, create a readlist (which he never did in this game, by the way), and Coffee to also start being vocal and do actual solving.
I mentioned that i would be slightly less active after landing a job (which happened to not work out). However, i would like to point out that i have raised many points that were not addressed (these being over more than a couple posts). I would love for people to look back and interact with me on what my thoughts were on those, and i will be crafting a readslist soon based on dc flipping mafia (i think he gave up?). i should have it out relatively soon after the day is over.
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Day 5 has ended.
DoubleCapitals (7) - TheonlyrealBeef, Killsdazombies, iancudorinmarian, kaempfer13, Coffeeditto, DoubleCapitals, Calindu
Night 5 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Night 5
DoubleCapitals was lynched. He was Seele Vollerei. He was holding the Core of Void.
Night 5 has ended.
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rad
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DC didnt shitpost nearly enough.
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expected, but still nice.
My bet is that last scum is Sub and holding the core of reason.
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Well, one more mafia to track down.
So to summarize, the plan is:
- TheonlyrealBeef[Emma Planck]: Target Sin Mal (Sub theory, no better use).
- iancudorinmarian[Kallen Kaslana]: Target Calindu + Submachine/worldwideweb3.
- worldwideweb3[Bronya Zaychik]: Die.
- kaempfer13[Frederica Tesla]: Target iancudorinmarian + worldwideweb3 + Calindu + Submachine (should succeed and be 1 ability).
- Submachine[Yae Sakura]: No ability use.
- killsdazombies[Lieserl Einstein]: Target Calindu.
- Coffeeditto[Cecilia Schariac]: Target Calindu.
- Calindu[Liliya Olenyeva]: Out of ability uses.
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did kdz actually claim? i mean its obvious,but for some reason he wanted to keep it close to his chest
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My bet is that last scum is Sub and holding the core of reason.
Oh shi, how did you know?
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But no, seriously. What makes you think that?
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Well, one more mafia to track down.
So to summarize, the plan is:
- TheonlyrealBeef[Emma Planck]: Target Sin Mal (Sub theory, no better use).
- iancudorinmarian[Kallen Kaslana]: Target Calindu + Submachine/worldwideweb3.
- worldwideweb3[Bronya Zaychik]: Die.
- kaempfer13[Frederica Tesla]: Target iancudorinmarian + worldwideweb3 + Calindu + Submachine (should succeed and be 1 ability).
- Submachine[Yae Sakura]: No ability use.
- killsdazombies[Lieserl Einstein]: Target Calindu.
- Coffeeditto[Cecilia Schariac]: Target Calindu.
- Calindu[Liliya Olenyeva]: Out of ability uses.
So uh, hate the be the bearer of bad news but I actually am not Einstein
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look at the remainining roles and which of them would use their ability n1 in good conscience; it being er rather than failed himeko also explains the 5 ability use when i last checked everyone
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Was trying to set up a bluff for when we lynched Timpa, sadly DC targeted Timpa/Torb. Sin Mal here.
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did you not get anything, not even shock?
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I don't have shock, I was betting they would get Vig'd n0
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Ah, bummer. Well, I figured you would die anyway, so your ability use does not really matter. Though no reason to target Sin Mal now. Guess I'll just not use my ability at all :silly:
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Thanks for including me though torb :P I was hoping to die earlier, but I guess pretending to have a master plan only gets shock killed lmao.
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My bet is that last scum is Sub and holding the core of reason.
Oh shi, how did you know?
Oops, you werent asking about kdz's role.
Core of reason explains links early death and we can safely exclude core of death. core of lightning is only possible if scum decided to holster it repeatedly.
As for why i think its you, i townread coffee, calindu would never openly endorse the plan as scum, w3 would have been stuck in a 3way bus through most of day1 and timpa had no problem voting him up. Considering timpas playstyle i dont think it particularly likely. For you on the other hand bussing a mate early is not unusual, as you always want to be on the forefront of a scumlynch as soon as it has a real chance of occuring, to the point where you vote them up if 1 person scumreads them and everyone else is just too lazy to give any reads.
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I like kae, hes not mean to me :thumbs-up:
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Ah, still having faith in “wagonomicsâ€, I see.
But what you say makes sense. It actually made me think that if all of those people are townread and I also flip town, then maybe the mafia is you, kae.
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Fun fact: while my early game tends to be bad across the board (including wagonomics, especially in case of bussing that doesnt result in a lynch) after 3 lynches (+/-1) I pretty much always have 2 scum correctly in my close poe through wagonomics (yes, even in my last game that went quite horribly). As such I still consider it the best tool at my disposal.
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Tbh, I'm not sure whether you flipping town would actually make me reconsider my poe. Probably not (well, obv it wouldnt be you, but i would probably just continue with the least towny remaining person, w3 before coffee and everyone else is essentially confirmed town to me assuming the plan goes through). If I seem phoned in, its because so long as town doesnt do anything silly and there is no actual case on me other than " if it aint anyone else ot has be you duh" i think this is guaranteed to result in a town victory, so thats why im not really trying very hard anymore.
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Only thing different to your thinking kae, I find coffee to be much more scummier than you
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// as in I find him more scum more than you find him scum not that he’s gore scummier than you whoch is obvious anywyas
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// terrible phone auto spelling but hopefully you can figure it out either way
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Maybe it’s as simple like that. Let’s hope.
For now, however, let’s make this interesting. I am targeting www tonight. You all know this only leaves one option for the plan to work.
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DC didnt shitpost nearly enough.
Didn't feel like it. See the post I made 2 days ago. I thought you would understand. Maybe I'll do something special once the game ends.
Enjoy the scum range of me you finally get to see. I'm prepared to get laughed at how much I suck in dead pad.
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DC didnt shitpost nearly enough.
Didn't feel like it. See the post I made 2 days ago. I thought you would understand. Maybe I'll do something special once the game ends.
Enjoy the scum range of me you finally get to see. I'm prepared to get laughed at how much I suck in dead pad.
Fair enough, see you in the dead pad m88
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Maybe it’s as simple like that. Let’s hope.
For now, however, let’s make this interesting. I am targeting www tonight. You all know this only leaves one option for the plan to work.
Thats not exactly pro town unless you are scum. Oh well if you're gonna be like that, we necesssarily have to lynch you if you live through the night and abilities have been blocked. i hope this is just a shortcut of you giving up. Anyway ian, w3 shouldnt have a way to mess with the townplan like sub does, so he's the better target now that he insists on protecting w3 for some reason.
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As much as I like the idea of killing w3, Submachine is scum and done waiting, it seems.
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I have been thinking of targeting myself instead, but in case www flips town, which I suspect he would, then I would be mislynched next.
I have also been thinking of targeting both myself and www to force a kae flip, but I suspect the plan would not be initiated then, and town would proceed to mislynch me.
Or if I do nothing, www dies, then he either flips mafia or not, but I suspect he would flip town. And as much as I hate to admit it, he has been correct about reads more often than I was in the past. I will give my PoV during the night, but I would probably vote up kae and get mislynched for it anyway.
See, I thought this through, and my conclusion is that town benefits more from this.
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The entire initial idea of targeting you was in part because you are incapable of targeting yourself.
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Really, first rob and now kaempfer13. You already know that out of kdz/ian/kaemp and myself he is the only one with an extremely remote chance of getting mislynched, so you're shading him bad. The reactions to my plan were positive overal and gave me a decent impression of peoples' alignment. Well, w3 was being w3, which told me nothing, but your constant attempts to try and find holes in it were like that of a Magikarp flailing in the desert. You're not reaching F3, so you can give up on shading kaempfer13 now.
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TorB, after recent developments, I trust you to be town. As someone who was involved, can you sum it up what Kae did to find mafia? I cannot find that part, and it seems to me you found the mafia, and Kae just doubled down on it. If he did something ground breaking to reveal a mafia, that would make my PoE easier to advance during the night.
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I found the Raidens and was thinking that andre targeting DC N0 (as stated by moehrpi) likely meant they were both mafia. kaempfer13 compared the claimed targets of andretimpa with his ability results and concluded that he or DC (no used abilities claim) had to be lying.
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well or both lied, which i think was what happened, because why would scumdc holster?
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Yeah, I was thinking logical or, not exclusive or :silly:
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Someone remind me what Sub's ability is?
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Superwarden: Target up to three players other than yourself, all abilities targeting any of them will fail.
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well priority matters so raiden and rita ignore it, but they are all dead now
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However, I find it very uncomfortable that Coffee just went silent after suspicion went to other people, while www became more active and "in your face". I also don't remember if Coffee's solving was role solving (which is mostly NAI) or town solving.
...
So what I think should happen now is www to start voting today and explain everything about his overly defensive behavior, while also revealing any plans he had this whole game and what he plans to do, create a readlist (which he never did in this game, by the way), and Coffee to also start being vocal and do actual solving.
I mentioned that i would be slightly less active after landing a job (which happened to not work out). However, i would like to point out that i have raised many points that were not addressed (these being over more than a couple posts). I would love for people to look back and interact with me on what my thoughts were on those, and i will be crafting a readslist soon based on dc flipping mafia (i think he gave up?). i should have it out relatively soon after the day is over.
I checked your posts but found nothing that is currently relevant to respond to. Asking them again would help.
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I read the roles in a bit more detail. The thing that stood out the most (that I haven't seen discussed yet) is how much Emma deters scum from doing something that would lead to a role hunt (see me in the last game). Of course using it to role hunt would delay identifying Durandal and Fu Hua but it might still be worth it.
Just found this and was quite funny LOL
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moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
Can you appreciate how coincidental my roll was. DC/OA with that n0 raden, changing moes target. 10/10 vision.
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TheonlyrealBeef - emma plank
iancudorinmarian - one dies, other dies too.
worldwideweb3 - bronya
kaempfer13 - how many abilities were used on targets
Submachine - yae sakura
killsdazombies - i forgot
Coffeeditto - vig
Calindu - flash
Our current night plan involves killing cal and one other right? Im not too sure if its a good plan. As it stands, i believe ian is very much town with cal also having a slight town lean. coffee/sub are in my immediate sus list. if coffee is maf, then they were all hard bussing each other lol. Im not too sure if we should even go with the night plan, if the intent is just to confirm ian as town. If it is to speed up the game, then we can possibly go with cal/sub. but if sub isnt the last mafia, this will cost us 3 towns in one night.
Nightplan: if sub town, we are at 4-1 start of phase. Lynch coffee (?), if town 2-1 start of next day phase. Lylo.
no nightplan: 6-1 start of phase. Lynch sub, if town, 4-1 start of next day phase. lynch coffee (?), if town 2-1 start of next day phase. Lylo.
The difference is instead of us killing cal, mafia picks an extra town they wanna nk, which could be cal or someone else. Is this maf right?
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Ah, yes, worldwidescum, let's change nightplan last minute to confuse everyone :thumbs_up:
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The nightplan makes ian conf town. Cal is necessary sacrifice for it to work, unless ian guesses the nightkill correctly.
By the way, it would not be difficult. The nigthkill will either be ian or kdz, so he would just need to link kdz with a random target if he does not follow the plan. But just because of this, maf might spare kdz tonight and go straight for ian.
Either way, I much prefer hitting the sack tonight rather than tomorrow. Www doesn't even know who the last mafia is, and he only said it now first that he thinks the maf is among Coffee/me. Credit denied.
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Ah, yes, worldwidescum, let's change nightplan last minute to confuse everyone :thumbs_up:
i mean, i never said i agree with the nightplan, and will comment after DC's flip :P As a scum, i wouldnt be interferring with killing cal and sub at all
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Anyway, endgame should be between Kae, Coffee, and TorB. Gl hf.
I have a conditional request for Kaempfer.
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The nightplan makes ian conf town. Cal is necessary sacrifice for it to work, unless ian guesses the nightkill correctly.
By the way, it would not be difficult. The nigthkill will either be ian or kdz, so he would just need to link kdz with a random target if he does not follow the plan. But just because of this, maf might spare kdz tonight and go straight for ian.
Either way, I much prefer hitting the sack tonight rather than tomorrow. Www doesn't even know who the last mafia is, and he only said it now first that he thinks the maf is among Coffee/me. Credit denied.
ive said it numerous times over the course of this mafia that i sus coffee. andre and DCs interaction with ian makes me think he is town. cal would be a bit more active as a mafia imo, he doesnt come across as too scummy. Kae/torb have less chance of scum than you. So ofc its between you and coffee.
Ofcourse i dont know who the last mafia is, only a mafia would know that.
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The idea is to maximize the confirmed town ratio. Also, if no one will lynch me anyway, there is no guarantee I will not be NK-ed instead of confirmed town.
Cal probably is town, ian will be confirmed town and the biggest scum read will be eliminated. We can basically cross off 3 suspects that could be mafia instead of 1 that can be (additional mislynch opportunity) and 1 that cannot be (additional NK) compared to not going through with the plan.
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Anyway, endgame should be between Kae, Coffee, and TorB. Gl hf.
I have a conditional request for Kaempfer.
You probably have about 40 minutes to post the request.
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Night 5 has ended. Notifications are currently being sent.
Day 6 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Day 6
killsdazombies was nightkilled. He was Sin Mal.
Calindu fell into the abyss. He was Liliya Olenyeva.
worldwideweb3's thread of life was severed. He was Bronya Zaychik.
Day 6 has ended.
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Interesting. So now ian is confirmed town, looks like Sub was bluffing, still seems like a daring move from ian. If w3 was protected, you wouldn't have been confirmed town and the whole vig would have been for nothing. If Sub or Coffee have a good reason to suspect me/kaempfer13 over each other, now would be a good time to start making a case.
Submachine (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
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Submachine(1) - kaempfer13
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EBWOP:
Submachine (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
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Probably no need to slowroll sharing the information; ian was the only one using any ability of my targets (been following torbs plan)
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Wow
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Probably no need to slowroll sharing the information; ian was the only one using any ability of my targets (been following torbs plan)
Pretty much the expected outcome, especially given how the night turned out.
@ian
Still love this outcome, btw.
As w3 would say, :thumbs-up:
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(https://i.imgur.com/mZrfjqh.jpg)
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I have solid internet back now and was laid off from my job very soon after getting it, so what's my time going to be spent on? yeah you guessed it
i will have to wait to tomorrow to make a comprehensive post but i wanted to throw out some numbers. there are 5 of us left, and the only scenario in which mafia can win through a single mislynch today is if they really have saved core of death for that entire time and use it tomorrow evening. ian is town, and no other abilities affect the game tomorrow night as long as ian holsters; this should be a scumhunt for the next two days. the game will be over by end of day tomorrow, so let's get to rereading the entire 150 pages of the game everybody :)
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Anyway, endgame should be between Kae, Coffee, and TorB. Gl hf.
I have a conditional request for Kaempfer.
You probably have about 40 minutes to post the request.
Looks like I have more time than that. I casually slept over the previous deadline. :-\
I do not know for sure who the last mafia is, so I decided to keep my low effort and just eat the bullet.~
However, ian might as well openly target himself and Coffee next night to speed up the game.
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Except the ability is EoR, so it's on cooldown.
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Oh. Well in that case, endgame will be between Kae, Coffee, and TorB.
I don't like your odds in that case, Coffee, so you should take the initiative in reading back those 150 pages.~ ;)
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Submachine (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13, iancudorinmarian
I knew Sub was the next lynch anyway, so I spared everyone some shit-posts :thumbs_up:
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I approve of that night action, by the way.~
Targeting www was just a bluff. In case ian was serious about not understanding what my role did, I didn't want to stop the plan from happening.
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What a peaceful day.~ Almost too peaceful, kind of boring. Maybe you assume the game will end? Hm, peculiar idea.
Let's say I am mafia. I am way behind on lolcatting, so I might as well do some. Arrrrgh, this could have worked out if it wasn't for the meddling kids and the talking dog! It was so brilliant: create two pieces of distraction and try to bury www as a target. Yet it was so infuriating when Durandal targeted into our N0 master plan. What a shame, son, what a shame.~
[insert breadpost.jpg]
But let's also say that I am town. I still have a request in this case for kaempfer, though it only stands if I flip town and he is also town.
@Kae: Are you open to grant me a dying wish if I am town and if you are also town? Something simple.~
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What, do you want me to lynch TorB? Depends on the request, im not signing a blankosheet.
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Well, I'm already thinking two steps ahead in that scenario, where the real question is why you think kaempfer13 is more likely to be mafia than Coffeeditto.
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What, do you want me to lynch TorB? Depends on the request, im not signing a blankosheet.
No, it really is something simple, more humble. I just hoped you would say Derpclear granted after I flip. But you don’t even have to do this if I am mafia, or if you are.
And re:TorB, I no longer know who I think is more likely to be mafia. I checked my early game notes and I confused myself. You see, kae was checking older mafia games for reference, which would be a huge method act, something I do not think mafia would do. But later I also saw DC check a mafia game - though that was his own one. I do not know what to make of this.
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Whatever, ok. Re effort with stuff that doesnt further scums agenda you already set the precedent for that last game, so atp noone can be cleared for that stuff anymore. Still i would like you to try and solve if you actually are town here.
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My further source of confusion comes from the Coffee vig. It was such a town move with a typical towny explanation that i townread him for it for a long time. Then he came out with his “Let’s all be friends and solve this together!†post, which reeks of roleplay for me.
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I decided to lean TorB as the towniest for his advancements with claiming role and targets. His tunneling also feels genuine, though I may die in peace knowing that he eased up on that for my last day.~
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Kae is big N. People explained to me already what his part was in finding mafia, but I still don’t get it. And his lashout on moe felt between crafted and genuine. And I don’t remember more than two kaevision posts, though I was away for a week.
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One should always listen to everything one has to say, unless people are being deliberately cryptic, from my point of view. Whether I actually do something with it, may take a lynch flip, however :silly:
Since nothing so far has shaken my belief that the course of action to most likely find mafia involves lynching Sub and Coffee, the way forward is already set.
kaempfer13 lynchvoting me would have been the easiest way to set me of that course, since lynching an unlikely mafia would still get my preference over lynching guaranteed town (myself from my point of view), hence my previous post.
Also, Coffee mentioned reading all 150 pages of mafia, but I've neither done that nor seen him do it (should you not take your own advice to heart?). At this point, the rest of the game course has already been decided.
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so many people in this game have remained in the "meh"-category for so long that doing kaevisions earlier than i started doing so would have been nearly indistinguishable from reposting lynchlog again other than greening dc (which was wrong too:-[)
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The keys might be the EoD1 lynchlog and overall ability uses. Can you both repeat targets and results on the same page please?
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Also, Coffee mentioned reading all 150 pages of mafia, but I've neither done that nor seen him do it (should you not take your own advice to heart?). At this point, the rest of the game course has already been decided.
Rome wasn't built in a day.
Similarly, I can't read them all at once but i will have it all up in the next hour or so.
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I can try updating my way outdated notes with all the information i remember:
mw: holstered alwayskiana
shock: rita, dead, forced me to see he wasnt using a honkai core n0
moehrpi: durandal (dc redirected onto oa, kdz)
sub: yae (always holster)
Torb: emma (found durandal+raidens)
Linkcat: theresa (no crumbs)
Playeroa: cocolia (ditto)
ian: kallan, (torb w3 n1; cal+w3 last night))
w3:bronya
timpa:raiden (notably claims to have switched torb and mw n2)
dc:seele raiden
d2d: role sharer (no crumbs)
coffee:cecilia killed d2d, eventually killed cal according to plan
cal: flash counter (used n3)
kdz: sin mal, probably holstered n2, redirected from timpa n3
naii: vig, holstered
rob: doc, targeted moe on the night n3 so was redirected without raidens crosstreaming
myself: n0 shock used 1 ability,
n1 alive people used 7,
n2 cal,kdz, coffee(used 1),sub, mw(torb?, but he also used 1 ability), ian; oh wow writing this i should have realized kdz wasnt lieserl sooner
n3 5 abilities total used
n4 -
n5 ian w3 cal, sub used 1
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actually i do wonder whether kdz really holstered n2 or was swapped with someone not using an action
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because if he really didnt target shock n0, who would he target? And delaying ability use another time doesnt make sense to do
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nvm, moe successfully targeted kdz at the time and didnt complain about being redirected again
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Well, Lieserl was the first possibility I thought it couldn't be with kdz not using it every night, but then he started making Lieserl implications on Coffee targeting andre (according to andre).
moe did not mention N2, kdz was targeted N2, so he likely did not use.
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I would not hard claim straight away if i was a cop and found mafia. Unless its in latter stages of mafia.
I guess it depends on how early one expects mafia to find out about the cop. If cop takes info to the grave, that would be a shame. Mafia Emma Planck could identify whom the cop is N0.
This is an interesting thing right for Emma to say right away, especially now that we know TorB is Emma. However, it clears him more than not because he's true in saying that he could have found moe's Dura way earlier than when he died. I doubt it's a wifom.
Raiden mei can make durandal semiimmortal while both live and raiden knows who durandal is (provided noone randomly kills the other person, raiden lives and of course this is only good if both exist and are town)
I could read this as baiting out an early dura claim (seeing as how maf!kae would have known that Raiden+Seele/Raiden are maf).
This plan falls apart fairly quickly even if all assumptions apply, when scum has chain lightning, so I wouldnt start with this plan earlier than necessary
..and then this right afterwards, either covering tracks or towny. I read it as more towny than not? I think?
Should be used whenever possible. Identify living power roles to help protect them. Durandal N0, Fu Hua N2.
Both can be Herrscher.
As I mentioned before, subtle things. Like not forcing Durandal to counterclaim if someone thinks a fake Durandal claim will save them from getting lynched, but having Emma Planck do it. If you need to choose between lynching one of two people of unknown alignment, of which one has a role that is really useful to town if they are town, you choose the other.
There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
That's basically what I was saying on Theresa. You do not even need Emma Planck for this. As long as people are truthful about their role claims, anyone that has claimed will be a viable target. That's one of the reasons I'm being so insistent on truthful role claims.
on Emma - I was wondering what made you change from this original plan of targetting Fu Hua n2. It seems kind of oddly specific that you might aim in Raiden, unless you had considered him the better doc role or something similar. It makes sense in saying that raiden is more useful for both alignments, but still worth hearing an explanation for.
on Theresa - I think this might have been a towny self-preservation, but it could also be encouraging others to out their true roles to weed out power roles. Townread more than not.
Core of Lightning
Raiden
Himeko
Yae
Lieserl
^ Mafia Cores/Roles that may potentially be a problem
- Yae can block it without making it easy to figure out it was Yae.
It seems odd to me that a mafia!submachine would out this about themselves.
We can’t rely on the honesty of others claiming their roles. Mafia have 5 roles to potentially hide in, and this method can confirm someone as mafia if their ability type differs from that of their role. There’s no reason not to
On phone to say that I disagree. 18 players, 20 roles, and I was recently reminded that roles are not duplicated. Two roles are unused in the game, and unless mafia knows what those two roles are, they will high chance claim an already existing role. It leads to a 50-50 where one is mafia and the other is town. I like those odds.
Mafia never needed to counterclaim here, and the possibility of either an early Theresa snipe, especially if Sub is holding the Core of Reason, was pretty great. However, between sub's take and TorB's, TorB's was more sound.
how could important power roles ever hide? if someone is forcing a player who rolled durandal to claim, how are we to hide them in other roles? also, am i understanding you correctly that you think we don’t need the emma confirmation? what happens in the event that theresa rolled maf and lies to get someone lynched? they could blame it on the person lying about their role.
It's not like everyone needs to claim. In fact, the reason people shouldn't claim too early is for this very purpose. You don't need to lie for this.
If someone gets lynched as the role they claimed (role is revealed on death), we have just outed a mafia Theresa, it's a major victory from my point of view.
Yes, but why would a mafia Theresa do that besides to get a 1:1 trade? Might have been baiting out Theresa here.
The mafia know 3 of their roles, and there’s a 2/17 chance that they claim a role not taken. It’s reasonably possible that they’ll claim a role already taken, but they could also roleswap in each other’s roles, and what if someone claims an important role like hua, durandal or emma? we lynch in ccs and possible mislynch a power role to the greater detriment of the town.
First of all, why would they ever swap their claimed roles? Mafia swapping claims with other mafia has zero benefit and hurts them more than anything else.
And if they claim an important role, it will still be a 50-50, and no role is so important that I wouldn't trade them in for a guaranteed mafia kill. Not to mention that if we lynch mafia from the 50-50, we not only kill a mafia but also soft-confirm a town.
Townread this, though.
By the way, the scenario I'm talking about is a late-game mass roleclaim. Nothing that is relevant right now.
Well, here we are.
Raiden Mei does not require coordination, quite the opposite. By targeting someone to be protected and an unwitting victim, all kill abilities will affect the unwitting victim instead of the one being protected. As soon as you coordinate whom the second target is, mafia can simply target them. Raiden Mei is an ER ability, too, so can indefinitely protect someone as long as there is a scapegoat, Raiden Mei lives and binding chains does not take effect. Whether or not Fu Hua helps out and protects the scapegoat (by targeting the power role) is irrelevant in saving the power role.
This seems like it's important but I can't put a read on it, because Raiden could just force nightkills through anyway. Might be WIFOM I guess? How do you feel about this quote now, TorB?
Frederica Tesla Radio Wave (ER) Target any number of players. You learn how many abilities those players used tonight, in total. You can’t target yourself. (Includes Honkai Core abilities. You don’t learn the ability name or target. Players can use more than one ability each night.)
rita did not use a honkai core tonight, if I am this role
It's kind of towny to out this like this, and not to just try and push on a town Rita for no reason knowing they were town. I think maf!kae would push harder to get rid of someone potentially messing with scum's ability usage.
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
based on potential slip.
i dont know how you can fuck up so bad, but i cant think of a reason for town!moe to say that either.
Weird reasoning, weird vote, weird.
Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
Rob, that was a scrubbed game that we played literally half a decade ago. Don't try to read off of it.
kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I soft counterclaim your soft confirm.
Wait a second. It's not important any more, but check out these breadcrumbs.
while it does sound like a move i would do, i did not target oa nor Kaempf.
This is basically hard claim not Rita or Durandal. There is no reason to look for Rita with info roles, since it's almost certainly shock at this point.
Looking back, I townread this. maf!TorB would have known the existence of a maf!Raiden and dura getting redirected N1.
I cant fathom how you cant see that moe essentially claimed to have knowledge on the scum team or being scum (which means he also has knowledge on the scumteam duh) with his slip.
Why would a mafia ever out having knowledge on who the mafia are? And since he did have knowledge on the team, why would you want to lynch him for it risking lynching a power role?
What happened to not insulting mafia's intelligence? Soft confirming yourself as mafia is the epitome of stupidity. How about we leave it at confirming the rolls themselves and not the implied meaning behind it?
@kae: What he said.
well that one is obviously a joke and linkcat is fairly well known to troll every now and then. i didnt really see moehrpi as joking there
???
EBWOP actually triggering core of reason is even better than i thought as rita, as they dont even learn who that ability belongs to
This is a fair point. If kae is the last mafia, and has core of reason, would he not have known who Rita was? Unless he didn't use it n1 (dumb) or wanted to dumbtell not knowing, which makes sense as well.
I disagree with Rita usage and think shock is just as "confirmed town" as rob was "confirmed mafia" last mafia, regardless of role. Just because a move is bad as scum, it does not mean it is good as/for town or that you are town. This does not mean I think Rita is scum for it, either. The people currently lynch voting shock do not seem to be voting him on the basis of believing he is scum either.
I'm still interested in lynching mafia, though. Low content posters are harder to read, so mafia likes hiding among them. shock's last post was anything but low content. Sticking with current lynch vote for now, but it's liable to change depending on how the rest of the day develops. kdz and Cal currently stand out as potential lynch targets for me.
Townread this.
I mean, if shock is rita and using his ability willynilly he will die sooner or later. Which means we dont have to lynch him now. It's kind of the perfect role for him :P. additionally a town!lieserl may be able to find out if he attracted a honkai core.
I townread this. Like I said earlier, kae would want a town!rita lynched.
I'd like to see more lynch votes, the current tally is asking for end of day madness.
Also, I mulled over this post last night and some things were bothering me.
Torb's "logical" plan for each role
It was never meant to be a dictate on what to do, but rather a starting point for a discussion. Speaking of:
hide behind Torb's plan and Rob/Linkcat's talking and get slight town reads from everyone?
Only agreeing with me is literally the least effort next to not posting one could put in. I appreciated the discussions with people disagreeing with me, and they're the actual town leans here from my point of view. I'm not omniscient, a saint or confirmed town, so only mafia has no reason to speak up against me when disagreeing with me. Simply disagreeing with me but staying silent about it N0 -like you did- is my least favorite response to that post.
This strikes me as odd somehow. Would love input. I can't wrap my head around why it feels odd right now.
Indeed ian, you havent said anything at all that either isnt just common sense (yh shock no lynch is bad, get that in your brain already) or scumreads based on stuff that isnt ai at all. I've come to get used to seeing that from you, but if we're going to lynch the most worthless player today it may well be you.
Except the consensus was that Calindu was getting lynched at that point. I townread this for trying to maneuver a vote off of the consensus at the time.
I haven't really managed to form a scumread about anyone yet, though there are some people I slightly townread, mainly kae, TorB, Oa and shock.
kae - Seems to be making constant plans and tries to read players, I don't think he would accuse moe that hard if he were mafia
TorB - I haven't seen him play as mafia yet, but his play seems consistent to the previous mafias
Oa - This is mainly because of the Durandal check on him, though it might be completely wrong, really
shock - I disagree with the no lynch plan, since I still believe in a lynch D1, but he argues it well and plays as usual
Fair post from Calindu. Sure, it doesn't give much, but I share his views on his four townreads, and putting out FOUR townreads is more solving than what the average player has done in this game.
So at the time, you believed that outing four reads based on nothing and that you agreed with wwas more towny than not? It seems like an unsubstantiated townread.
Oh right, Rita can't force a ability if it's on CD right?
Right.
You could still draw a kill role to yourself or an info role (though NAI, I guess, unless Theresa), while not drawing any ability is true for enough abilities to not be substantial evidence, so I think Rita N1 is not particularly good as scum. Better than N0, I suppose.
I townread this interaction, doesn't seem forced.
I interpreted a post that simply said "ok" as a slip once and raved about it all game and scum wouldnt let me lynch the dude (who was town while i was innocent child). I'm extremely sensitive when it comes to slips and I didnt see a jokey tone in moe's post. But yh, i'll drop the issue I should have learned from that experience after all.
While mature of you to back off, I don't believe that pushing that hard on a slip that is more likely to hit a power role than a scum was great. Even if it's not unusual for you to do, it's not towny.
andretimpa
I think he's posting much more than last time, even if much of it is quite short and rule questions. Maybe the tiniest townlean. n+
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Coffeeditto
He's posting. v
kae, explain this. Why did you heavily townread me for this and n+ read andre for it?
robs progression on coffee just doesnt make sense. First he scumreads him for activity (which is the opposite of basic logic and the phantom memory he had has no grounds in reality, which may or may not mean that its completely made up), then townreads him for it when his memory was jogged (as he puts him in townleans with no other reason given than his initial read being wrong and coffee-activity=good), then claims activity is not a tell for coffee at all, but then keeps his townread on him anyway, while buddying him.
Yes, i still havent gotten over this.
Other rob related things: - his mechanics-talk is fine (pretty good) really, but in case of rob i wouldnt expect anything else really.
as he noted himself, his readlist developed to fit the wagons that were forming. it is indeed too consensy and him wanting to vote with certain other people (oa) further drives this home, passing responsibility for a misslynch to someone else.
Kae, I just wanted to say you make some of the weirdest pushes for the weirdest reasonings.
I can find nothing unusual about dc either. he was voted with almost no reasons given at all, so his memeresponse was fitting for the situation, no?
I do like his thoughts about always lynching, but as I said before this should really just be common sense and its unfortunate that for certain other people its apparently not.
There was some explicit reasoning stated on multiple peoples' parts. Mine being his reaction and interaction with Link, and others about his breadposting.
moehrpi n+/w
This may come as a surprise, but in case his 'slip' was really just an overly dry delivered joke, i actually find his content consistently towny otherwise.
Flippy floppy reads, and if you thought he was so towny you shouldn't have pushed him so hard?
I can't be around any longer so I'm just going to say this. You all argue that no lynch is bad because lynching is how town wins, and even if you lynch a town you gain valuable information. Well everyone seems to be voting me just because. Tell me what info you get if I get lynched? Are you going to vote out one of the players who voted me next? Somehow I doubt that.
I'm not going to random vote and cause others to panic and random vote also when there's literally no mechanical information out there yet since no one has really revealed anything. So I'm going to keep voting no lynch, and hopefully in roughly 5 games, like I said, you're realize the power that no lynch actually holds for town.
Lastly, you may be surprised what little information you actually do learn when I flip. Hopefully you like surprises. I sure do.
Sincerely,
Mafia Rita
Shock, I'm taking the risk to believe that you are town. It seems there is only a set amount of players who are voting on you, and only as a scapegoat option. I heard at least one other people say too that he believed you would be town. Does that not give you some hope to make you stay and figure out a lynch target other than No Lynch?
Townread this for the same reason as I townread kae earlier: if Sub was maf, it would be in his best interest to get Rita gone asap.
@Kae: Why is dawn above 6 other people on the usefulness scale? He's still sitting on only 2 posts and he is the only person not voting.
This is taking into consideration that we dont need to lynch him to kill him, if we instead agree that that role (forgot the name) does the job instead
More town deaths for maf=easier to win?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
I don't see www happening, hmm. After all this, I really hope you are at least a Durandal, www. Switching to DC.
Lynching shock without an in-this-game reason seems bad.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
These last minute votes onto DC are pretty towny, more so to TorB for being willing to hammer his maf partner if they are a team.
Think about it. With shock in the game, there's effectively 4 mafia. If we lynch shock we're guaranteed to at least go down to 3. But if he actually is mafia, then we've effectively gone from 4 to 2, killing half the team with one lynch. That's pretty high EV, I see no flaw in my math.
(((And this was the point where Sub realized that this game only has 3 mafia in it.....)))
d e r p c l e a r
I'm open to move to a dawn wagon.
Maybe significant after seeing the DC train pick up traction?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
I can entertain some wagonomics at the very least, this doesn't change much, yet.
Same as above, but more towny than not.
welp, looks like my placeholdervote might end up the lynch. Oh well, i guess i prefer him over the other options rn.
hmm
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
Breaking ties.
Still townreading this.
w3 still defending dc at this point gives me a slight townlean on him
Townleaning w3 for defending your possible partner.
2mins hard limit!!!
You said this after Link had forced the tie, and didn't hammer on shock or DC even knowing there was a tie. This reeks to me.
I don’t like this lynch at all
Agreed.
Nice.
Okay, that's the first 50 which consisted of N0 and D1. I will be doing the next 50 and the last 50 before day ends, I believe. I would like to encourage someone to do the same for me and my posts, as commentating on my own posts seems kind of biased.
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You guys remember when I said I'll become more active during lategame? Now that was a good meme.
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There's also some theorycrafting I've done: if Emma Planck finds someone's role, and Theresa determines that person's ability type and it doesn't match with what their role is, they're confirmed Herrscher. It can't confirm someone as town, but it can confirm if they have a Honkai core.
That's basically what I was saying on Theresa. You do not even need Emma Planck for this. As long as people are truthful about their role claims, anyone that has claimed will be a viable target. That's one of the reasons I'm being so insistent on truthful role claims.
on Emma - I was wondering what made you change from this original plan of targetting Fu Hua n2. It seems kind of oddly specific that you might aim in Raiden, unless you had considered him the better doc role or something similar. It makes sense in saying that raiden is more useful for both alignments, but still worth hearing an explanation for.
I already knew whom Durandal was and felt their identity was at danger, but outing Durandal would still guarantee they would die in at least two nights. Only Raiden Mei had the potential to keep Durandal safe continuously. After finding out there were two, well, that smelled fishy.
how could important power roles ever hide? if someone is forcing a player who rolled durandal to claim, how are we to hide them in other roles? also, am i understanding you correctly that you think we don’t need the emma confirmation? what happens in the event that theresa rolled maf and lies to get someone lynched? they could blame it on the person lying about their role.
It's not like everyone needs to claim. In fact, the reason people shouldn't claim too early is for this very purpose. You don't need to lie for this.
If someone gets lynched as the role they claimed (role is revealed on death), we have just outed a mafia Theresa, it's a major victory from my point of view.
Yes, but why would a mafia Theresa do that besides to get a 1:1 trade? Might have been baiting out Theresa here.
Eh? My very point is that they would not, invalidating your point about mafia Theresa lying to get someone killed.
Raiden Mei does not require coordination, quite the opposite. By targeting someone to be protected and an unwitting victim, all kill abilities will affect the unwitting victim instead of the one being protected. As soon as you coordinate whom the second target is, mafia can simply target them. Raiden Mei is an ER ability, too, so can indefinitely protect someone as long as there is a scapegoat, Raiden Mei lives and binding chains does not take effect. Whether or not Fu Hua helps out and protects the scapegoat (by targeting the power role) is irrelevant in saving the power role.
This seems like it's important but I can't put a read on it, because Raiden could just force nightkills through anyway. Might be WIFOM I guess? How do you feel about this quote now, TorB?
It was a strategy on the assumption that there was one Raiden Mei that was town. Since they were not, this is irrelevant and not applicable. Though it follows the reason on why I felt like Raiden Mei could be more useful than Fu Hua.
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Raiden mei can make durandal semiimmortal while both live and raiden knows who durandal is (provided noone randomly kills the other person, raiden lives and of course this is only good if both exist and are town)
I could read this as baiting out an early dura claim (seeing as how maf!kae would have known that Raiden+Seele/Raiden are maf).
This plan falls apart fairly quickly even if all assumptions apply, when scum has chain lightning, so I wouldnt start with this plan earlier than necessary
..and then this right afterwards, either covering tracks or towny. I read it as more towny than not? I think?
I was just thinking aloud as I went, trying to figure out the optimal way how to use roles. i dont think id actively try to bait roleclaims as either alignement (except for when a massclaim actually brings insight, but thats not bait then), as its not in my interest as town obv and i prefer going deep as scum.
Core of Lightning
Raiden
Himeko
Yae
Lieserl
^ Mafia Cores/Roles that may potentially be a problem
- Yae can block it without making it easy to figure out it was Yae.
It seems odd to me that a mafia!submachine would out this about themselves.
Except he was mistaken anyway, as an ability failing without kiana notification automatically means yae was involved.
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
based on potential slip.
i dont know how you can fuck up so bad, but i cant think of a reason for town!moe to say that either.
Weird reasoning, weird vote, weird.
I cant fathom how you cant see that moe essentially claimed to have knowledge on the scum team or being scum (which means he also has knowledge on the scumteam duh) with his slip.
Why would a mafia ever out having knowledge on who the mafia are? And since he did have knowledge on the team, why would you want to lynch him for it risking lynching a power role?
What happened to not insulting mafia's intelligence? Soft confirming yourself as mafia is the epitome of stupidity. How about we leave it at confirming the rolls themselves and not the implied meaning behind it?
@kae: What he said.
well that one is obviously a joke and linkcat is fairly well known to troll every now and then. i didnt really see moehrpi as joking there
???
Obv I know now that this was dumb. But when i dont understand why someone is doing sth and cant think of a town reason to do so, i automatically assume scum. This is because scum has an underlying agenda that they dont want to talk about but which may spill into their posts, which can result in saying things that dont make sense.
Though in this case it was more of a thing where it looked like someone openly admitting to being scum and moe's sense of humour was to dry for me to identify it as such.
EBWOP actually triggering core of reason is even better than i thought as rita, as they dont even learn who that ability belongs to
This is a fair point. If kae is the last mafia, and has core of reason, would he not have known who Rita was? Unless he didn't use it n1 (dumb) or wanted to dumbtell not knowing, which makes sense as well.
On the contrary. Core of lightning only reveals what abilities(or was it people?doesnt matter for this, hardclaim not having core of lightning) targeted the target, but not who the target is.
I'd like to see more lynch votes, the current tally is asking for end of day madness.
Also, I mulled over this post last night and some things were bothering me.
Torb's "logical" plan for each role
It was never meant to be a dictate on what to do, but rather a starting point for a discussion. Speaking of:
hide behind Torb's plan and Rob/Linkcat's talking and get slight town reads from everyone?
Only agreeing with me is literally the least effort next to not posting one could put in. I appreciated the discussions with people disagreeing with me, and they're the actual town leans here from my point of view. I'm not omniscient, a saint or confirmed town, so only mafia has no reason to speak up against me when disagreeing with me. Simply disagreeing with me but staying silent about it N0 -like you did- is my least favorite response to that post.
This strikes me as odd somehow. Would love input. I can't wrap my head around why it feels odd right now.
I can't wrap my head around why it feels odd to you either
andretimpa
I think he's posting much more than last time, even if much of it is quite short and rule questions. Maybe the tiniest townlean. n+
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Coffeeditto
He's posting. v
kae, explain this. Why did you heavily townread me for this and n+ read andre for it?
Because the change was much more significant for you.
I can find nothing unusual about dc either. he was voted with almost no reasons given at all, so his memeresponse was fitting for the situation, no?
I do like his thoughts about always lynching, but as I said before this should really just be common sense and its unfortunate that for certain other people its apparently not.
There was some explicit reasoning stated on multiple peoples' parts. Mine being his reaction and interaction with Link, and others about his breadposting.
Honestly i still dont see those as legitimate reasons to push him, neither seemed weird to me.
moehrpi n+/w
This may come as a surprise, but in case his 'slip' was really just an overly dry delivered joke, i actually find his content consistently towny otherwise.
Flippy floppy reads, and if you thought he was so towny you shouldn't have pushed him so hard?
It was one thing that stuck out like a sore thump, that i wasnt sure if i was seeing it right (I wasnt). kinda like the killer bunny; seems pretty innocent overall except for that one time where he seems to have bitten someones head off; cant just ignore that.
I can't be around any longer so I'm just going to say this. You all argue that no lynch is bad because lynching is how town wins, and even if you lynch a town you gain valuable information. Well everyone seems to be voting me just because. Tell me what info you get if I get lynched? Are you going to vote out one of the players who voted me next? Somehow I doubt that.
I'm not going to random vote and cause others to panic and random vote also when there's literally no mechanical information out there yet since no one has really revealed anything. So I'm going to keep voting no lynch, and hopefully in roughly 5 games, like I said, you're realize the power that no lynch actually holds for town.
Lastly, you may be surprised what little information you actually do learn when I flip. Hopefully you like surprises. I sure do.
Sincerely,
Mafia Rita
Shock, I'm taking the risk to believe that you are town. It seems there is only a set amount of players who are voting on you, and only as a scapegoat option. I heard at least one other people say too that he believed you would be town. Does that not give you some hope to make you stay and figure out a lynch target other than No Lynch?
Townread this for the same reason as I townread kae earlier: if Sub was maf, it would be in his best interest to get Rita gone asap.
@Kae: Why is dawn above 6 other people on the usefulness scale? He's still sitting on only 2 posts and he is the only person not voting.
This is taking into consideration that we dont need to lynch him to kill him, if we instead agree that that role (forgot the name) does the job instead
More town deaths for maf=easier to win?
nah, just that if he ever got the votes to get lynched we could get an extra consensus lynch by just telling you to finish him off instead. If we knew he was town, obv we would neither lynch him nor take you killing him well.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (2) - PlayerOa, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
I don't see www happening, hmm. After all this, I really hope you are at least a Durandal, www. Switching to DC.
Lynching shock without an in-this-game reason seems bad.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (6) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (5) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, Linkcat, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
These last minute votes onto DC are pretty towny, more so to TorB for being willing to hammer his maf partner if they are a team.
Think about it. With shock in the game, there's effectively 4 mafia. If we lynch shock we're guaranteed to at least go down to 3. But if he actually is mafia, then we've effectively gone from 4 to 2, killing half the team with one lynch. That's pretty high EV, I see no flaw in my math.
(((And this was the point where Sub realized that this game only has 3 mafia in it.....)))
d e r p c l e a r
I'm open to move to a dawn wagon.
Maybe significant after seeing the DC train pick up traction?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, PlayerOa
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, TheonlyrealBeef
I can entertain some wagonomics at the very least, this doesn't change much, yet.
Same as above, but more towny than not.
welp, looks like my placeholdervote might end up the lynch. Oh well, i guess i prefer him over the other options rn.
hmm
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (2) - Linkcat, PlayerOa
Breaking ties.
Still townreading this.
w3 still defending dc at this point gives me a slight townlean on him
Townleaning w3 for defending your possible partner.
2mins hard limit!!!
You said this after Link had forced the tie, and didn't hammer on shock or DC even knowing there was a tie. This reeks to me.
I didnt feel very strong about either lynch at the time as you can take from my posts near eod. i would have preferred ian lynch at the time, but i would have panicvoted if torb didnt do it for me
Okay, that's the first 50 which consisted of N0 and D1. I will be doing the next 50 and the last 50 before day ends, I believe. I would like to encourage someone to do the same for me and my posts, as commentating on my own posts seems kind of biased.
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Day 6 has ended.
Submachine (3) - TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13, iancudorinmarian
Night 6 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Night 6
Submachine was lynched. He was Yae Sakura.
Night 6 has ended.
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ah shit its actually coffee. i was hoping this game would be over now.
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What I really dont understand is why sub recognized dc and andre were in a thunderdome and did not make a clear decision which one would be scum for sure, yet already put andre at n. It felt so much like he saw a lot of votes on dc already and wanted to bring andre through somehow.
I mean normally you sus both people in a thunderdome when you dont have an explicit reason to tr one.
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What, do you want me to lynch TorB? Depends on the request, im not signing a blankosheet.
No, it really is something simple, more humble. I just hoped you would say Derpclear granted after I flip. But you don’t even have to do this if I am mafia, or if you are.
And re:TorB, I no longer know who I think is more likely to be mafia. I checked my early game notes and I confused myself. You see, kae was checking older mafia games for reference, which would be a huge method act, something I do not think mafia would do. But later I also saw DC check a mafia game - though that was his own one. I do not know what to make of this.
Derpclear granted I suppose.
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I was more confused on why Sub was continuously looking for deep town (first rob77dp, then kaempfer13), seemingly neglecting Coffee and w3 in the process. It would have made perfect sense as a buildup for when you need a mislynch at the final three.
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I could have made a catalog on why i thought Sub was scum, but selfaffirming a tunnel at best achieves nothing
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Likely irrelevant rulequestion: The vote of a person targeted by core of death still counts towards the lynch, right?
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Likely irrelevant rulequestion: The vote of a person targeted by core of death still counts towards the lynch, right?
Core of Death will not prevent its target from voting or cancel the target's vote.
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If mafia read the rules and wanted to use cores without being detected, they should have used it during Core of Binding effect (Cores could still be used that night). I didn't mention this earlier to not tip them off, but I think we can safely eliminate the chance of Core of Death showing up by now. But as I suspected, it is too late to have any effect on the outcome, regardless.
4 more days... I wouldn't mind speeding these phases up :silly:
Unless I get nightkilled, the only person that could have stopped me from voting Coffee Day 7 just died.
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I'll let coffeeditto finish analyzing 100 more pages, but mostly lean back in the meantime. Dont expect me to put in effort when the answer is so clear fmpov (sub haunting me from the grave:"you said that about me already"). Alright perhaps I should try taking another look, but the chance is 1% or lower that i change my mind.
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I was mostly trying to save a Coffee scum the trouble of doing so... x)
The results of these searches remind me of scum Sub last game. Completely devoid of specific scum theories, we're just getting "alignment-relevant" posts on every possible scum candidate. One usually has a feel on the alignment of each person involved and then try to find the posts that best match why you feel this way, but I'm not getting the impression Coffee is feeling any alignments, because he already knows them.
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RIP me, I guess
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I was mostly trying to save a Coffee scum the trouble of doing so... x)
The results of these searches remind me of scum Sub last game. Completely devoid of specific scum theories, we're just getting "alignment-relevant" posts on every possible scum candidate. One usually has a feel on the alignment of each person involved and then try to find the posts that best match why you feel this way, but I'm not getting the impression Coffee is feeling any alignments, because he already knows them.
I didn't have an exact feel on any of you besides that kae is scummier than you and Sub. I also would like to say that I don't support speeding up the next 24 hours, as that lacks discussion and allowing ian and I and unknown third to find the last mafia hiding in the easy target territory. I would prefer that you guys address all of my points to either one of you as well, as you guys seem to have been only addressing the easier to rebutt ones. This is why I play less actively, because as I stated earlier, my posts with valid points in them get ignored to meet the agenda of each one of you.
About the tunneling, why would choose to ignore that which doesn't support my reads? That's ridiculous and a fallacy, and I'm playing to be better informed from each of the people alive (read: not Sub anymore :/) why they believe my reads to be or not to be aligning with their own personal reads. I would like to kindly ask you or kae to go back and read through the pages as I am doing and find interactions with players instead of just saying I'm mafia and that's it. I want to win this for us, not let one of you get assuaged by the other's claim of "okay he's maf and that's it."
I'll let coffeeditto finish analyzing 100 more pages, but mostly lean back in the meantime. Dont expect me to put in effort when the answer is so clear fmpov (sub haunting me from the grave:"you said that about me already"). Alright perhaps I should try taking another look, but the chance is 1% or lower that i change my mind.
Tell me about why it's so clear from your point of view instead of ISPing.
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RIP me, I guess
Can you at least provide some insight before you pass on?
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What do you mean easier to rebutt ones? the rest was giving me townreads or concerning other people
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I mean you are up against the person that made outing the scumrole's possible and the guy that confirmed that at least one of them was indeed lying rather than it being a huge coincidence that timpa sniped a seele (+ there's a confirmed town you have to kill). Of course we townread each other so the burden is on you.
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What do you mean easier to rebutt ones? the rest was giving me townreads or concerning other people
Why are you only addressing that which is a direct comment on you? I would love to hear your thoughts about my TorB reads or what I had to say about Sub before he left us.
I mean you are up against the person that made outing the scumrole's possible and the guy that confirmed that at least one of them was indeed lying rather than it being a huge coincidence that timpa sniped a seele (+ there's a confirmed town you have to kill). Of course we townread each other so the burden is on you.
Define bussing for me?
dawn to dusk (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
moehrpi(1) kaempfer13
based on potential slip.
i dont know how you can fuck up so bad, but i cant think of a reason for town!moe to say that either.
Weird reasoning, weird vote, weird.
I cant fathom how you cant see that moe essentially claimed to have knowledge on the scum team or being scum (which means he also has knowledge on the scumteam duh) with his slip.
Why would a mafia ever out having knowledge on who the mafia are? And since he did have knowledge on the team, why would you want to lynch him for it risking lynching a power role?
What happened to not insulting mafia's intelligence? Soft confirming yourself as mafia is the epitome of stupidity. How about we leave it at confirming the rolls themselves and not the implied meaning behind it?
@kae: What he said.
well that one is obviously a joke and linkcat is fairly well known to troll every now and then. i didnt really see moehrpi as joking there
???
Obv I know now that this was dumb. But when i dont understand why someone is doing sth and cant think of a town reason to do so, i automatically assume scum. This is because scum has an underlying agenda that they dont want to talk about but which may spill into their posts, which can result in saying things that dont make sense.
Though in this case it was more of a thing where it looked like someone openly admitting to being scum and moe's sense of humour was to dry for me to identify it as such.
Still doesn't add up to me. Scum wouldn't slip like that and it could have been a soft (read: maybe was?) of having an informational role. Maybe it's just a mistake but it won't sit right.
2mins hard limit!!!
You said this after Link had forced the tie, and didn't hammer on shock or DC even knowing there was a tie. This reeks to me.
I didnt feel very strong about either lynch at the time as you can take from my posts near eod. i would have preferred ian lynch at the time, but i would have panicvoted if torb didnt do it for me
You're telling me you would have voted for one of DC or Shock in the 56 seconds left after TorB had posted his vote? I say that time period because you didn't post it before TorB did. This just seems like a flimsy defense to me.
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I mean, you can post a whole wall of text if you want, but when you post something, you tend to post it for a reason. Having been active during the entire mafia, I still remember all the parts I need to know. The current reads I have are based on them. In the predicted event of ian getting nightkilled, that leaves just Coffee, kaempfer13 and me.
Since kaempfer13 already shares my opinion, writing an entire page of why I feel this way feels like a waste of time. What am I trying to achieve with it? Convince kaempfer13 that Coffee is mafia? There is no need for that. There is no new info I can bring to the table, nothing I know that is not already public knowledge.
I am fully aware that this means blindsiding kaempfer13, but any attack you make on kaempfer13 NOW, is simply too little, too late. They shall mostly be perceived as attempts to save your own skin, rather than actually locate mafia. This is one of the reasons kaempfer13 and I BOTH repeatedly asked people to elaborate their kaempfer13/TheonlyrealBeef is scum theories, but none would oblige.
It's no big deal for me to respond to everything asked, and if I supposedly missed out on anything, then you'll need to ask me a more concrete question than referring to something as "odd".
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I mean, you can post a whole wall of text if you want, but when you post something, you tend to post it for a reason. Having been active during the entire mafia, I still remember all the parts I need to know. The current reads I have are based on them. In the predicted event of ian getting nightkilled, that leaves just Coffee, kaempfer13 and me.
Since kaempfer13 already shares my opinion, writing an entire page of why I feel this way feels like a waste of time. What am I trying to achieve with it? Convince kaempfer13 that Coffee is mafia? There is no need for that. There is no new info I can bring to the table, nothing I know that is not already public knowledge.
I am fully aware that this means blindsiding kaempfer13, but any attack you make on kaempfer13 NOW, is simply too little, too late. They shall mostly be perceived as attempts to save your own skin, rather than actually locate mafia. This is one of the reasons kaempfer13 and I BOTH repeatedly asked people to elaborate their kaempfer13/TheonlyrealBeef is scum theories, but none would oblige.
It's no big deal for me to respond to everything asked, and if I supposedly missed out on anything, then you'll need to ask me a more concrete question than referring to something as "odd".
You don't need to convince kaempfer that I'm mafia because you're both blindsiding each other, that's true. I am not "attacking" or "fighting", I am trying to solve a game that I have been playing to win this entire time. I am frustrated right now because both of you are putting in minimalistic efforts and assuming this game is solved and it's going to cost us the game. I'm upset because you're basing this off of what? Also, of course I FoS kae, not that it matters because neither of you are going to flip off of me tomorrow. Actually talk and engage in the game instead of marking it in the books as S O L V E D.
kae refused to hammer d1 onto his partner. PLease don't ignore this too
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Coffee, do you realize that one of your critiques on me is me choosing to NOT vote to save dc when there was almost no time for 2 people to vote dc?
I dont address other points because I am lazy and at a quick skim i wasnt convinced.
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Coffee, do you realize that one of your critiques on me is me choosing to NOT vote to save dc when there was almost no time for 2 people to vote dc?
I dont address other points because I am lazy and at a quick skim i wasnt convinced.
what
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I am fully aware that this means blindsiding kaempfer13, but any attack you make on kaempfer13 NOW, is simply too little, too late. They shall mostly be perceived as attempts to save your own skin, rather than actually locate mafia.
I believed Sub to be the last scum, and now I need to address that he wasn't and isn't. Also, if you were the last town about to get mislynched because nobody wants to read into anyone else, would you also not try to convince the other town to at least give the effort?
Am I upset? A little. Should I step back from the game for a bit? Also yes.
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I am fully aware that this means blindsiding kaempfer13, but any attack you make on kaempfer13 NOW, is simply too little, too late. They shall mostly be perceived as attempts to save your own skin, rather than actually locate mafia.
I believed Sub to be the last scum, and now I need to address that he wasn't and isn't.
Is that so? Shouldn't that have come with a lynch vote? Seeing only three lynch votes felt bad. Sub not having any scum reads (??? he did not vote on any of them, at the very least) also felt :/
Also, if you were the last town about to get mislynched because nobody wants to read into anyone else, would you also not try to convince the other town to at least give the effort?
Am I upset? A little. Should I step back from the game for a bit? Also yes.
Sure, except there really isn't any new info for me to process. The things kaempfer13 and I have been replying to mostly feel like you lagging behind on the game. I'm practically immune to AtE, to boot.
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I am fully aware that this means blindsiding kaempfer13, but any attack you make on kaempfer13 NOW, is simply too little, too late. They shall mostly be perceived as attempts to save your own skin, rather than actually locate mafia.
I believed Sub to be the last scum, and now I need to address that he wasn't and isn't.
Is that so? Shouldn't that have come with a lynch vote? Seeing only three lynch votes felt bad. Sub not having any scum reads (??? he did not vote on any of them, at the very least) also felt :/
Also, if you were the last town about to get mislynched because nobody wants to read into anyone else, would you also not try to convince the other town to at least give the effort?
Am I upset? A little. Should I step back from the game for a bit? Also yes.
Sure, except there really isn't any new info for me to process. The things kaempfer13 and I have been replying to mostly feel like you lagging behind on the game. I'm practically immune to AtE, to boot.
I didn’t vote because of my internet being shoddy (see post before) and because the income wouldn’t have changed. Does it matter if I vote him or no one here? There’s only one mafia alive, and he couldn’t have blitzed. There is no benefit or detriment to my lack of voting.
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My further source of confusion comes from the Coffee vig. It was such a town move with a typical towny explanation that i townread him for it for a long time. Then he came out with his “Let’s all be friends and solve this together!†post, which reeks of roleplay for me.
I decided to lean TorB as the towniest for his advancements with claiming role and targets. His tunneling also feels genuine, though I may die in peace knowing that he eased up on that for my last day.~
Kae is big N. People explained to me already what his part was in finding mafia, but I still don’t get it. And his lashout on moe felt between crafted and genuine. And I don’t remember more than two kaevision posts, though I was away for a week.
Here are Sub’s reads on all three of us before he died. Evaluate please, he didn’t press any of us hard but he did out these.
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For one, this is the first mention I recall of you thinking of Sub to be scum. I actually considered hopping onto lynching you instead, since his last posts felt like town, but I did not want to create a tie or any other such nonsense.
Sub's read on you does not echo with me, I have different reasons. I don't town read the vig either, if anything, you seemed a bit too eager to copy rob. Whether it be regarding the vig or his voting patterns Day 1 and 2 iirc. Just like moehrpi couldn't stop talking about Durandal and me about Emma Planck, you wouldn't stop about mafia Raiden Mei. But I already adressed this earlier. In general, you do not seem to want to take responsibility for your actions, instead chalking it up to town consensus. This in stark contrast to, for example, worlwideweb3 and shockcannon.
My town lean on kaempfer13 is on making genuine (seeming?) attempts to solve throughout the entire game. As to how much success that brought about... eh, not relevant from my point of view. Trying to solve is more town credit than over half of now-confirmed town. The lash at moe felt stupid, which ironically is more of a town lean from my point of view. Surely mafia can think of something better to base their suspicions on, or just go with the flow or something...
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Additionally, you made a respektably sized wall near eod, when sub was pretty much already doomed. It didnt really feel like youd be sure he would flip scum at all.
Oh well, i dont think digging up more dirt on you is going to progress the game, so obv i'd have to look at TorB for completeness sake.
I understand your Frustration being written off 4 days before the deciding vote, but understand that you missed many chances to contribute by now, in addition to having the weakest remaining position from a mechanical standpoint as well.
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For one, this is the first mention I recall of you thinking of Sub to be scum. I actually considered hopping onto lynching you instead, since his last posts felt like town, but I did not want to create a tie or any other such nonsense.
Sub's read on you does not echo with me, I have different reasons. I don't town read the vig either, if anything, you seemed a bit too eager to copy rob. Whether it be regarding the vig or his voting patterns Day 1 and 2 iirc. Just like moehrpi couldn't stop talking about Durandal and me about Emma Planck, you wouldn't stop about mafia Raiden Mei. But I already adressed this earlier. In general, you do not seem to want to take responsibility for your actions, instead chalking it up to town consensus. This in stark contrast to, for example, worlwideweb3 and shockcannon.
My town lean on kaempfer13 is on making genuine (seeming?) attempts to solve throughout the entire game. As to how much success that brought about... eh, not relevant from my point of view. Trying to solve is more town credit than over half of now-confirmed town. The lash at moe felt stupid, which ironically is more of a town lean from my point of view. Surely mafia can think of something better to base their suspicions on, or just go with the flow or something...
I agree that I hadn’t distinctly scumread sub before, as we were not in a scenario that had us lynching out of the rest of the possible candidates. I was saying he was the scummiest out of you three; just as you are now saying I am the scummiest of kae and I.
If you were to read back through the game, you would see that rob followed my vote on dc and said he agreed to all that I was saying for the first part of the game and even slightly afterwards. Rob even says at one point that he is surprised by how much he vibed with my thought process. I was not echoing his thoughts and have been trying to solve, just not as vocal unless it was with lynches that I disagreed with. I tried to get the DC train rolling on more than one occasion. Every time we mislynched I vocalized that I would prefer DC or a scummy ian at the time.
You townread trying to lynch someone on a info role slip?
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Maybe I'll look into details of rob interaction and interactions from andre/DC again tomorrow or something, then. I town lean stupidity in general. Doesn't make me less inclined to lynch vote them, but does make me more inclined to believe they are town. worldwideweb3 was an excellent example. I had a feeling he was probably town, but this was not something I wanted to risk by giving him full control of the game.
I did state a DC/Coffee team did not seem particularly likely to me, but I'm running out of people to exclude. Going with the flow seemed like a good explanation in my mind, which means I need to reaffirm what the actual flow was.
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In the meantime, if you want a theory to work on: kaempfer13 never witnessed any cores being used. Binding and Void were not much use anyway, but the third is bound to at least be of some use. This would mean kaempfer13 freely used his own core, yes? Can you spot anywhere where this becomes apparent, perhaps through knowing too much? Core of Reason on Linkcat N0 would make his NK easy to explain. Except wait, shock targeted kaempfer13, so it cannot have been through him.
Him being mafia should also provide him insight in Raiden Meis actual targets and any confusion surrounding them should be fake. Give your analysis on kaempfer13's actions and reveals during N3. How does this all fit together with him as scum? This is the main reason I cannot currently see him as scum. Conversely, my N3 actions are why kaempfer13 is unlikely to see me as scum. I do not think you were particularly active around then, but it is a major reason for the mutual town read.
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So in order for TorB to be scum:
Scenario 1: He's emma planck and considered theresa the bigger threat for some reason. This explains why theresa got sniped immediately and he wouldnt be able to find durandal until n2. What doesnt really fit here is a)I think he made it quite clear that durandal was the far better role and b) he made several posts alluding to already knowing who durandal is.
In order to force this narrative we have to assume that he didnt actually know moe was durandal or purposely delayed killing moe, so that we would come to this exact conclusion that emma cant be scum.
Scenario 2: He's emma planck and did sth else. This is just ??? and strictly less likely than scenario 1 (in case he's scum obv, otherwise we can take what he says at face value).
Scenario 3: He was a different role all along. Due to uniqueness of roles this leaves himeko and lieserl. Lieserl is unlikely, because theres no reason to holster that ever. So that leaves himeko. Obv as scum he still knew who the raidens were and i suppose he never posted who durandal actually was until moe claimed. So it could have been an elaborate scheme to bait out durandal claim. Whats weird is how quickly he concluded that both raidens should be scum, while at most 1 was actually caught and just how quickly raiden found seele was suspicious. Considering he was widely townread throughout the game he probably could have afforded taking that slower.
Besides this whole thing seems way too fpsy for him.
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So I read up on Day 1 to see how the flow went and how Coffee fit into it. Here's some interesting highlights:
dumb idea I remembered from Town of Salem
Raiden can protect away cop-type roles from the nightkill if they are forced to claim
congrats ian, you're useful now
Extremely powerful for scum, but situational for town. Can be used to protect power roles, alternate with medic for best effect.
Just saw this. Did you not read his guide?
DC - Coffee interaction seems relevant with DC confirmed scum. Even more so with DC now confirmed to be Seele with Raidens ability at that point in time.
out of these 3, I would lynch DC for his scumdumbtells and info other than the filler, but otherwise, I would rather get ian. for now, my vote lies on dc
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (3) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
This is the post where Coffee actually started voting DC Day 1. There was a lead wagon with scum on it, so piling that further would probably be a bad idea. The idea that you pushed DC... just no, you did not hop onto the train until it was already a leading wagon.
I scumread ian a bit for just going afk after people stopped pushing him, but I see more of a lack in content from recent DC posts and I would rather him than MasterWalks; I see more potential output from MW and www3 in the future.
Also relevant.
dawn claimed he was hit once by the 2hit vig, so he is probably dead, but i townread him outing the vig hit. can't rule out the possibility he was lying about it to not get lynched, though.
If this is the case, I would like to see a counter-claim from Cecilia. I figured this was implied, but a counter-claim pretty much either proves dawn or the counter-claimer as scum. dawn can out the identity of Cecilia if the counter-claimer is lying.
lol, you trying to make town waste a mislynch or something?
Is there something you want to tell us w3?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (5) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, rob77dp, Naii_the_Baf
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
And here comes the full spread out mafia votes we've come to know and love.
Or maybe here instead, depending on your perspective:
It's ironic considering I'm not doing my due either and instead going for a walk, because i have a :life now, but I'm kinda pissed that ian just noped out of the thread even though I tried my darndest to provoke him to post actually usefull stuff in order to prove me wrong.
As such, while I'm out this is a simple pressure vote, it's not final.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - worldwideweb3, Calindu, Linkcat, Coffeeditto, rob77dp
kaempfer13 (1) - MasterWalks
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (3) - PlayerOa, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine, andretimpa
shockcannon (1) - Naii_the_Baf
iancudorinmarian(1) - kaempfer13
In the meantime what doyouguysthinkaboutanextension
Immediately followed by:
kae, could you instead find a scumread in the current three people instead of pushing on someone the vote will not flip onto? the same goes for shock, killsda, and naii. it only harms the town to split the vote unless you think all 3 of w3, dc and mw are town. I want to lynch ian too but we couldn't get the vote rolling right now.
I'm not sure what to make of this. There were two and a half hours left, so I'm honestly not sure why you did not go for ian at that point, or when his wagon gained traction? Going for bus credit?
i would want to have a reason too, but putting a meme after it is not the way I would go about portraying my nonchalance.
Well sorry I don't portray it like you then :/
that's valid, I try not to base my reads off of meta from past games. it doesn't change the fact that you're still not contributing to the town in a meaningful way. both scumtell and dumbtell, not mutually exclusive
I'm trying my best to, and if my best is not enough then perhaps you can give me some pointers after this game?
More Coffee - DC interaction.
Lmao, top level ninja.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (4) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (4) - kaempfer13, Linkcat, PlayerOa, TheonlyrealBeef
Relevant part where ian wagon gained traction.
Tell us what you know about DC, moe. There gotta be something.
This post is hilarious in retrospect.
I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be confirming these or not, but Cecilia went with TorB's plan. Just to confirm if Cecilia is found, that they did not actively go against what Town wanted/agreed upon, even though it would be rather stupid if they did at this stage (regarding targeting inactive users).
So regardless if Rita is mafia or not, the people who actively disagreed/targeted Kaempfer could be interesting to look at, and this becomes especially important if Rita is mafia.
The Cecilia part is important to note for who targeted who, but it sounds like it was aligned with how town asked, like you said. This could be important later. As far as the disagreeing with Kaempfer, the way he had repeatedly addressed his dissatisfaction with being targeted by her was kind of odd, but not out of character, and I could feasibly see a shock(rita) or town rita fun-using their ability just for the hell of it, even though it has many more potential negative outcomes than positive for town; we hadn't discussed such before the night ended, so someone who hadn't considered the possibilities could have just wasted it on a random town. We will need to see how rita or kaempfer flip.
By the way I am of the opinion that a Day 1 lynch has a 0% chance of hitting mafia without some extremely heavy misplays, but the information gained is likely worth the lynch
3/15 chance.
1.) I am Rita.
It may be suspicious to say this, but if I were anyone else I would basically take this to mean that shock is a confirmed town. No. I'm crazy, but I'm not that stupid and I do appreciate winning. Targeting a random town, even if I know their potential role due to my mafia teammates is still a bad play as mafia because the town would obviously call me out as kaempf has done, causing attention to be brought to myself when players already want to lynch me before the game starts. Not to mention, I would probably have mafia teammates telling me not to use my role, especially on someone who it would work on, and someone (kaempf) who will likely be vocal about the effect. The thing is, you could easily hide in other roles or not claim until investigated or lynched. There would be no need for you to go on the defense about Rita abilities like as such.
Sure, I guess both kaempf and I could both be mafia. If you truly believe that though, it would be better to lynch kaempf first, because lynching me and flipping town doesn't clear kaempf as town. On the other hand, if we assume the only real scenario where I'm mafia as Rita is if kaempf is also mafia, then lynching kaempf first will either clear me, or convict me (yes there's a scenario where I'm town and kaempf is mafia, but in that case we still kill a mafia). Ideally, we avoid lynching either of you, but a kaempf lynch wouldn't be awful as we know he isn't Durandal. The issue arises if he is Theresa, but he would out that if so.
Now, if I was Rita, why would I use my role N0? I've thought a lot about this, whether or not I am actually Rita. In my opinion, using Rita N0 has way more upside than downside despite you all bandwagoning Torb's "logical" plan for each role:
- Because everyone thinks using Rita is so scummy, and since using Rita as mafia doesn't actually have too much upside without knowing everyone's role, using Rita N0 is about as town of a move as it gets, which can basically confirm someone as town if it is successful enough for the recipient to confirm its use (since you all are so keen on getting reads day 1) That's absolutely not true. That doesn't confirm someone in either direction, and it would be dumb in either direction to claim because you would get scumread either way. It would just show as a ballsy or dumb maf.
- The only real info roles Rita could be interfering negatively with are Theresa and Durandal. HOWEVER, there are 3 potential mafia Rita could interfere with, which is a positive outcome, especially if the mafia hit has core of death. AND THEN, we have to factor in the fact that Theresa and Durandal could be roles given to mafia. The way I see it, it's roughly 50/50, so no net gain or loss compared to not using the ability as Rita. You forgot about driving the doc save away from someone and confirming a kill with a maf-sided vig role or the core of death.
- I personally don't believe in N0 reads being any what accurate in determining whether someone is a cop or not. If someone has hinted so obviously that they are cop, then they're just helping mafia anyways. With that said, Rita interfering with Fu Hua has no net gain or loss, because Fu Hua is essentially guessing between all 18 players anyways, so having it protect Rita N0 is not any worse than who Fu Hua was originally protecting. If anything, Fu Hua protects the most useless role on N0 while still maintaining the same probability of protecting a town and leaving all 17 other players open to protection that next night once there is more info. Again, a mafia Rita can take the doc off of someone and confirm a vig kill.
- The rest of the roles being interfered with really aren't a big deal in my opinion. Honestly, probably a win to hit Yae Sakura, because Yae probably shouldn't be roleblocking anyways, since Yae actually stops roles from working and 3 of them, whereas Rita only redirects 1. Some roles, its annoying the individual players to get redirected to Rita, but honestly shouldn't make a difference in the outcome of the game compared to potentially hitting the previously mentioned roles. Valid.
So basically if I rolled Rita, then yes, I would definitely use it N0 because I actually see the upside beyond the superficial "downside" that everyone else sees. You all need to think outside the box more. If you're so set on SOLVING THE GAME THROUGH LOGIC, then we should all just role reveal now and lynch anyone who doesn't follow it, including me. It's 15 town and 3 mafia, and there are more than enough useful roles to figure out who's mafia or who is lying about their actions before we all get NKed. If you all want to role reveal and solve the game now, I'll happily follow along. If we're expected to follow Torb's "initial thoughts" on role usage, then I might deviate according to my own opinions. Spouting about how we're playing wrong and we should listen to you or we're dumb is not making you look like a useful player.
I have also thought a lot about this scenario, regardless of if I'm Rita or not. One potential scenario involves mafia Rita and probably another mafia role that either allows them to block the Rita target or give them knowledge of the Rita target to ensure Rita doesn't die (which is actually pretty unlikely to happen). In this case, the mafia Rita gets the benefit of blocking kaempf while also knowing that myself and MW are the most likely players to be blamed. The upside:
- MW or shock are forced to role claim, giving mafia more info
- MW or shock are lynched, allowing for an easy town lynch day 1, that probably doesn't give many reads and creates voting patterns that are VERY EASY for mafia to hide in. I don't think anyone is getting town or mafia cred for voting me.
- We waste all day talking about Rita, which is probably not helpful at all for town (unless you're willing to stop casting my opinions aside because of my character and realize that the things I'm writing in both these spoilers are actually quite insightful and go much deeper into the game than any of you are doing) Come on, guy.
- Forces kaempf to soft claim or narrow his role range, as well as potentially getting other players to make claims or hints towards their roles, narrowing the potential field for cops and info roles,
Downsides:
- Depending on which roles town got, could be very easy to confirm who the actual Rita is the next night, and if it's not shock or MW, then it might lead to an insta lynch of the real Rita (HOWEVER, if they have Cocolia, have certain info roles themselves, or can role block, then they might be willing to go forth with this planning anyways, knowing they can get away with it while reaping the upside mentioned above.)
- If they actually just random used Rita, they're probably even crazier than me, and upon that realization may have to quit elements for life. what
- Everyone considers it scummy to use Rita and why draw attention to yourself when you can just hide behind Torb's plan and Rob/Linkcat's talking and get slight town reads from everyone?More kills from maf means easier win?
Now let's explore the last scenario in which Rita is not me and is also town. In this case, they either came to the same realization I did, in which using Rita N0 can actually have some upside, or they're an idiot and are lying, and their name is MasterWalks. Who knows? I'm sure we'll find out soon enough though.
Thoughts inside spoilers
Making a couple more posts, should be 3 total
In retrospect, this feels like a soft claim Cecilia.
This is going to look really bad for me if DC flips mafia lmao
Solved game, the third mafia was NK-ed N1.
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Wait, Ive spent the whole day with my grandparents and missed absolutely nothing?
Coffee if you're town you're in the unique position to know that mechanical reasons ( other than ian being modconfirmed ofc) dont weigh that much. So this at least gives you the ability to solve this game before sky announces it, while the 2 of us struggle to see a reason why it wouldnt be you by poe.
Granted if this were the case I would absolutely make the wrong ccall were I in your shoes. So if you want to try, pls do so asap, otherwise I suggest we do shorten this after all.
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Night 6 has ended. Notifications are currently being sent.
Day 7 will begin shortly. Please wait warmly.
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Day 7
iancudorinmarian was nightkilled. He was Kallen Kaslana.
Day 7 has ended.
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Coffeeditto (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
24 hour condension (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
At this pace, Coffee won't have enough time to read those 100 pages even with a 48 hour phase, would rather just cut this in half, at least. It's not like I will be persuaded to lynch vote for town.
Wait, Ive spent the whole day with my grandparents and missed absolutely nothing?
At least Coffee just stopped by to send in the NK. My post on Day 1 made me realize that reading through the past pages is simply fortifying my own tunnel, so that doesn't help anyone. I'll keep responding to points brought up, but what points could I want to bring up myself, if the expected lynch vote is everything I want?
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If a majority of the remaining players vote to shorten the phase before 24 hours have passed, the phase will be shortened by 24 hours.
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(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia1.tenor.com%2Fimages%2F175ec53297871574a7d6c1bc044d409a%2Ftenor.gif%3Fitemid%3D16797420&f=1&nofb=1)
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Coffeeditto (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
Will vote for condension unless coffee suddenly puts in great effort.
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Here is my reasoning, assuming kaempfer has core of reason. If he had any other cores, we would have seen the use by now.
Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
This is wifom trying to indicate that he doesn't have the core, but still voicing his annoyance because being redirected onto shock with his core doesn't yield positive results.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
I don't know how much I can stress that he wanted to try and 'flip a wagon' onto ian when there were 2 minutes left in the voting timer. He posted after link had forced a nl and chose not to break the tie, which he counters by saying that he was going to in the very short amount of time left. I can't trust that.
Wagonomics strongly suggest DC town. He was topwagon very frequently (competing with various different wagons) and the vote that decided he lives another day was torb, who i tr and who also had voted him with intend to kill afaik before, so doesnt look like any effort went into saving him.
To a lesser extend, I tr w3 for the same reason I tr timpa last game (that was wrong though, so maybe i shouldnt tr people for this anymore) as after he stopped memevoting dc he actually defended dc as early as when he was the competing topwagon.
this looking at DC being scum is not very sound reasoning. the effort that went into saving him was you not hammering on him or shock.
ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.
your vote on ian was a pressure vote even though you voted on him with 3 or so minutes left on the EoD extension timer?
@kae I feel dumb now, but it's good to know there was a reason behind your votes.
this interaction in passing
dumb read: if timpa is scum he didnt discuss roles of people with his scummates at all. (so basically this dumb read equates to a tr or scum doesnt give a fuck this game)
a weird semi-bus or trying to distance self.
yh I've read every post of link twice now and find zero reference to what I can find in the honkai wiki about theresa, the claims are all not serious aside from "ccing" moe, but none of dc,oa,moe has shared a role that link could confirm, so this was talking about durandal
I'll admit i missed it the first time around, but if you read Link's post twice again and didn't see his soft unconfirm of moe, but were so caught up on moe's perceived slip, that seems concerning to me.
DC is actually my biggest townread according to wagonomics. Unless you believe scum tried raising various different cws until sth sticks absolutely no effort went into saving DC.
again, you saved dc and forced TorB to either nl or lynch shock.
Tbh, i dont really see why Cecilia finishing dawn off is particularly scummy. I mean it does go against the consensus of vocal players, but very publicly so; similiar to how shock did, i dont exactly condon going against the grain without even speaking up about it, but as scum!cecilia you are just painting a target on your back. In fact as scum!Cecilia its best to mark many different people, denying us the flip and then finish them off one after the other, ending the game early.
you townread my cecilia vig on dawn here but are now using it as one of the main bases of your arguments, saying i'm the lest mechanically towny here.
yes, if coffee lives we can force ian to kill someone in addition to coffees kil (and coffee not using your ability after already outing is beyond dumb, as the first half has literally no drawback)
it actually would be beyond dumb at that point in time if you thought i could be mafia, as if i had used it multiple times (every night) the game would be over if i had maf majority with yesterday's lynching of sub. however, i'm wondering if you weren't concerned with that possibility as you already knew my alignment?
Cecilia+Kallan:
I decided that there isnt that big a rush to confirm ian, so he should use his ability on 2 people other than himself tonight. and get confirmed n4 at the earliest I guess (unless someone actually does die to it). This way he doesnt have to holster and has a small chance to confirm himself without outside help (obv he has to choose targets in secret, otherwise mafia just nks someone else).
Cecilia should definitely target someone to confirm/deny coffee. If raiden really wants to kill someone that was previously targeted, we have confirmed mafia interference.
Coffee, if you dont want to take responsibility for the likely missvig (remember you dont even have to finish them off), you can hold an unofficial lynchvote. Just make the deadline for it before nightdeadline, otherwise you cant submit it.
this is just you asking for more people to have the capacity to die. there's a little bit of a townread in that you wanted ian to use it (even though it was on cd) and you know he would be able to hit one of the maf, but otherwise this looks to me like 'more death=more win'
def use it; if you're gonna decide yourself anyway dont telegraph it beforehand, if you want to target a consensus target... well its kinda late for that, but say so asap
directly conflicts with the general interest of the town as voiced at that point. also, there were like 8 hours left before deadline, not too late for a consensus target, and this reads to me like you didn't want the target to land on one of your team.
for the 100th time that specific scenario instantly outs a scumrole so while there is a high chance the rolesearcher is town and alive that just wont happen
i think you're closer to the 2nd or maybe 3rd time
but valid point. any suggestions for targets? i might just go on dc or cal
I prefer cal out of those for obv reasons
again defending or steering the target away from his partner like i mentioned earlier.
I probably want my vote on someone that never had to feel threatened by the lynch except TorB and kdz. Considering my theory that all wagons so far were town, thats were the scum would have to be. Although the people coming to mind there are timpa and calindu, who i dont have particularly good reason to scumread outside that. And chances are that noone would hop on anyway, since people tend to hold onto old grudges here.
giving a non-commital slight townread to andre here
Oh missed w3s post.
I am Frederica Tesla.
Shock didnt have a honkai core and i was really pissed he significantly decreased the effectiveness of my ability.
Anyway 7 abilities other than my own were used n1.
Now the important part: N2 i targeted sub, kdz, coffee, mw, ian and cal n2. Only a single ability was used, coffees. However if andre and dc are truthfull I should have witnessed torb use an ability as well
this is where kae can use his ability to hide his core usage. notice how his ability usage does not include DC or andre, even though DC was scumread by many people by that point.
Btw, dc actually said that rate up was a lie, claiming that he didnt get any of the roles his friend suggested, though he did. Perhaps he wanted to disguise as real raiden from the start.+ I too thought that seele clarification came a bit early, making it seem planned. So yh I think both are wolves. Sorry I defended dc for so long.
this is backpedaling after DC was going to be one of the next lynches.
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
welp i did promise I would vote the one to post targets later (or not at all? please dont be like that). I see several questionable things from andre today as well though. he's in thunderdome with both dc and coffee simultaneously (unless coffee did use ability and was redirected by dc (wait for dc to claim before you say anything)), so even if we assume that both thunderdomes are v/w he's still likely scum.
this is just bussing again when we know that both of them are going to be lynched.
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
andretimpa (5) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13
be it because dc is town or has the honkai core thats worse, i prefer this lynch.
was the straw that pushed us to kill the person with core of binding. it didn't do much iirc, but still of note.
May dc never miss another eod. Unless its w3 or dc is innocent I think the game is pretty much mechanically solved now.
and here we are, where it's not mechanically solved.
As I said, the game took a set course as soon as we all agreed to follow TorB's plan. As last game showed, being aware of someone possibly being the mafia achieves nothing if we do not vote on them. We should make a concensus whether we suspect Kae or TorB to be mafia (strongly enough that we actually vote on them!), and if not, put them off the table. I think if we have a deep wolf, it is Kae and not TorB. TorB did too many things, but I can't remember if Kae actually helped find a mafia, or he doubled down on a mafia that TorB found without him. I want an answer to this too from people who have good memory of this, then I will make a final decision whether I will consider voting Kae or not - if I even live for the next day.
did kdz actually claim? i mean its obvious,but for some reason he wanted to keep it close to his chest
fishing for his role right before he was nightkilled; he died that night.
Tbh, I'm not sure whether you flipping town would actually make me reconsider my poe. Probably not (well, obv it wouldnt be you, but i would probably just continue with the least towny remaining person, w3 before coffee and everyone else is essentially confirmed town to me assuming the plan goes through). If I seem phoned in, its because so long as town doesnt do anything silly and there is no actual case on me other than " if it aint anyone else ot has be you duh" i think this is guaranteed to result in a town victory, so thats why im not really trying very hard anymore.
and this leads me to the end of my post; here, he's basically saying "i don't want to put in effort to solve as i think this is a free win for me." he assumed that everyone else alive universally scumread me more than him and so that was him coasting for the rest of the game.
as for lessening the game time, i obviously wouldn't want to do so if it lands on me but i assume that kae will lessen in an effort to try to get me lynched faster. i will not vote for the detraction of time as i don't want 14 people pissed at me for not trying harder.
throughout the game, kae has tried solving and all of his reads that were on his own volition were incorrect, along with saving dc multiple times and bussing when the maf were essentially already found. you say that he tried to solve more than me, but if your idea of solving is that he outed more reads, does that clear him more than me? with his ability, he could have purposefully omitted usages and hidden his core usages with core of reason. i assume that he just got multiple unlucky hits with it if that's what happened, as there is no correlation past the first nightkill with positive and important targets getting killed based off of nothing.
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also i just read all of the pages
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Coffeeditto (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (1) - Coffeeditto
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Coffee you bring up me insisting on ian day 1 a lot, but you realize I could have just voted shock at the end and noone would have dared tying the wagons again. So pretty much what Torb did . Just saying, not that I would scumread TorB, but if its not you it has to be him.
And dont tell me I couldnt justify voting shock. One can always justify voting shock.
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kaempfer13 not including DC in his targets was consistent with him not scumreading DC, however. If kaempfer13 had Core of Lightning, how would anyone other than kaempfer13 have seen its use? If kaempfer13 held onto the Core of Reason and mafia could guarantee nightkills with Raidens, why NK Link N1, instead of Oa? Depending on how fast andre noticed me being Emma, if he was even speaking the truth on that, mafia would have been much better of killing Oa N1 and me N2. I had been telling myself the delayed kill on Oa was to ensure Fu Hua did not become suspicious of Raiden, but I am not so sure anymore. There was also the interesting Link/Coffee interaction regarding cop, so if my theory is that Coffee used Core of Reason on Link N0, hmmm...
kaempfer13s ian vote there was one that he had temporarily removed when both me and Oa simultaneously swapped onto ian, suddenly making him a viable lynch target. He did agree that he must vote because of Bronya, so he put it back where it was when Oa and I switched away from ian. Voting on DC/shock instead would have been preferred, indeed.
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I did mention links "softcounterclaim", but what exactly is that supposed to crumb? He saw moe being EoR and assumrd durandal? He saw that oa was passive which doesnt prove anything?
He was obv talking about how durandal hasnt screamed that oa was scum at the time.
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Coffee, half your points are downright Nonsense. Quite frankly I dont feel like adressing them all. Also you swapped townread and scumread plenty of times, which is hell of a mistake to make.
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Softcounterclaim honestly felt like a joke that one shouldn't read anything onto, least of all from Link.
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Coffee you bring up me insisting on ian day 1 a lot, but you realize I could have just voted shock at the end and noone would have dared tying the wagons again. So pretty much what Torb did . Just saying, not that I would scumread TorB, but if its not you it has to be him.
And dont tell me I couldnt justify voting shock. One can always justify voting shock.
I’m not sure i understand the first part of this. As far as your comment on shock, you can say that retrospectively, sure, but your reasoning would have been him being on you and as mafia of course you would want to have reasoning. With core of reason, a nl is better than a lynch on an outed role or your partner, no? so you can get more information?
kaempfer13 not including DC in his targets was consistent with him not scumreading DC, however. If kaempfer13 had Core of Lightning, how would anyone other than kaempfer13 have seen its use? If kaempfer13 held onto the Core of Reason and mafia could guarantee nightkills with Raidens, why NK Link N1, instead of Oa? Depending on how fast andre noticed me being Emma, if he was even speaking the truth on that, mafia would have been much better of killing Oa N1 and me N2. I had been telling myself the delayed kill on Oa was to ensure Fu Hua did not become suspicious of Raiden, but I am not so sure anymore. There was also the interesting Link/Coffee interaction regarding cop, so if my theory is that Coffee used Core of Reason on Link N0, hmmm...
kaempfer13s ian vote there was one that he had temporarily removed when both me and Oa simultaneously swapped onto ian, suddenly making him a viable lynch target. He did agree that he must vote because of Bronya, so he put it back where it was when Oa and I switched away from ian. Voting on DC/shock instead would have been preferred, indeed.
i don’t have a response for the core of lightning usage, and as far as core of reason goes, i’m not sure how the mechanics would work in terms of mafia knowing to kill Link but he did soft twice, and although we missed the more subtle one the first time around, kae wouldn’t with his ‘hawk eye for slips’. Also, how do you mean interesting cop interaction? The me saying i would protect him? that’s just a roleswap that i thought we were both taking part in because i knew that my role as cecilia was less valuable than a doc. pattern of townreading dc until someone has reason against it and then buddying with them is clear here
I did mention links "softcounterclaim", but what exactly is that supposed to crumb? He saw moe being EoR and assumrd durandal? He saw that oa was passive which doesnt prove anything?
He was obv talking about how durandal hasnt screamed that oa was scum at the time.
it was a roll, right? a roll determining who was scum or not, and moe as dura confirmed that they were scum or at least one of them from his point of view, and link counter claimed that by softing his theresa report showing no cores meaning someone was vil.
Coffee, half your points are downright Nonsense. Quite frankly I dont feel like adressing them all. Also you swapped townread and scumread plenty of times, which is hell of a mistake to make.
dismissing my points like this is not a valid rebuttal.
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Now that I'm on laptop instead of phone, lets add my thoughts on each point (except for a few vague ones where I have nothing to add, or that I addressed earlier):
Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
This is wifom trying to indicate that he doesn't have the core, but still voicing his annoyance because being redirected onto shock with his core doesn't yield positive results.
This is just as true for his Frederica Tesla ability as town, which he has already stated at some point after his reveal.
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
I don't know how much I can stress that he wanted to try and 'flip a wagon' onto ian when there were 2 minutes left in the voting timer. He posted after link had forced a nl and chose not to break the tie, which he counters by saying that he was going to in the very short amount of time left. I can't trust that.
He literally removed his vote earlier when he became a viable wagon, invalid argument.
Wagonomics strongly suggest DC town. He was topwagon very frequently (competing with various different wagons) and the vote that decided he lives another day was torb, who i tr and who also had voted him with intend to kill afaik before, so doesnt look like any effort went into saving him.
To a lesser extend, I tr w3 for the same reason I tr timpa last game (that was wrong though, so maybe i shouldnt tr people for this anymore) as after he stopped memevoting dc he actually defended dc as early as when he was the competing topwagon.
this looking at DC being scum is not very sound reasoning. the effort that went into saving him was you not hammering on him or shock.
I think credit to saving him goes to Linkcat, though.
ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.
your vote on ian was a pressure vote even though you voted on him with 3 or so minutes left on the EoD extension timer?
He had already voted him earlier, before he was a competing wagon.
Tbh, i dont really see why Cecilia finishing dawn off is particularly scummy. I mean it does go against the consensus of vocal players, but very publicly so; similiar to how shock did, i dont exactly condon going against the grain without even speaking up about it, but as scum!cecilia you are just painting a target on your back. In fact as scum!Cecilia its best to mark many different people, denying us the flip and then finish them off one after the other, ending the game early.
you townread my cecilia vig on dawn here but are now using it as one of the main bases of your arguments, saying i'm the lest mechanically towny here.
That probably says more about how likely I am to be town, leaving you to be scum.
yes, if coffee lives we can force ian to kill someone in addition to coffees kil (and coffee not using your ability after already outing is beyond dumb, as the first half has literally no drawback)
it actually would be beyond dumb at that point in time if you thought i could be mafia, as if i had used it multiple times (every night) the game would be over if i had maf majority with yesterday's lynching of sub. however, i'm wondering if you weren't concerned with that possibility as you already knew my alignment?
This is consistent with kaempfer13s reasoning of vigging everyone as town being a good play.
for the 100th time that specific scenario instantly outs a scumrole so while there is a high chance the rolesearcher is town and alive that just wont happen
i think you're closer to the 2nd or maybe 3rd time
but valid point. any suggestions for targets? i might just go on dc or cal
I prefer cal out of those for obv reasons
again defending or steering the target away from his partner like i mentioned earlier.
Ironically, from the inverted perspective, it's like you are -again- shifting the responsibility of not targeting mafia onto someone else, knowing full well andre was being more town read at that point in time. It's practically a rhetorical question baiting for someone to blame in retrospect.
I probably want my vote on someone that never had to feel threatened by the lynch except TorB and kdz. Considering my theory that all wagons so far were town, thats were the scum would have to be. Although the people coming to mind there are timpa and calindu, who i dont have particularly good reason to scumread outside that. And chances are that noone would hop on anyway, since people tend to hold onto old grudges here.
giving a non-commital slight townread to andre here
I was town reading andre before N3, too.
Oh missed w3s post.
I am Frederica Tesla.
Shock didnt have a honkai core and i was really pissed he significantly decreased the effectiveness of my ability.
Anyway 7 abilities other than my own were used n1.
Now the important part: N2 i targeted sub, kdz, coffee, mw, ian and cal n2. Only a single ability was used, coffees. However if andre and dc are truthfull I should have witnessed torb use an ability as well
this is where kae can use his ability to hide his core usage. notice how his ability usage does not include DC or andre, even though DC was scumread by many people by that point.
But not by kaempfer13.
Btw, dc actually said that rate up was a lie, claiming that he didnt get any of the roles his friend suggested, though he did. Perhaps he wanted to disguise as real raiden from the start.+ I too thought that seele clarification came a bit early, making it seem planned. So yh I think both are wolves. Sorry I defended dc for so long.
this is backpedaling after DC was going to be one of the next lynches.
NAI
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
welp i did promise I would vote the one to post targets later (or not at all? please dont be like that). I see several questionable things from andre today as well though. he's in thunderdome with both dc and coffee simultaneously (unless coffee did use ability and was redirected by dc (wait for dc to claim before you say anything)), so even if we assume that both thunderdomes are v/w he's still likely scum.
this is just bussing again when we know that both of them are going to be lynched.
Not sure how this vote tells anything regarding alignment.
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
andretimpa (5) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13
be it because dc is town or has the honkai core thats worse, i prefer this lynch.
was the straw that pushed us to kill the person with core of binding. it didn't do much iirc, but still of note.
I found andre to be the scummiest of the two since his N0 action reveal. If he was already suspicious of Sub (maybe ian as well?) at that point in time, it made sense to join the wagon mafia wasn't bussing.
May dc never miss another eod. Unless its w3 or dc is innocent I think the game is pretty much mechanically solved now.
and here we are, where it's not mechanically solved.
It is from his perspective if he is town.
As I said, the game took a set course as soon as we all agreed to follow TorB's plan. As last game showed, being aware of someone possibly being the mafia achieves nothing if we do not vote on them. We should make a concensus whether we suspect Kae or TorB to be mafia (strongly enough that we actually vote on them!), and if not, put them off the table. I think if we have a deep wolf, it is Kae and not TorB. TorB did too many things, but I can't remember if Kae actually helped find a mafia, or he doubled down on a mafia that TorB found without him. I want an answer to this too from people who have good memory of this, then I will make a final decision whether I will consider voting Kae or not - if I even live for the next day.
He never voted, though. Even his final reads did not suggest kaempfer13 to be below N.
did kdz actually claim? i mean its obvious,but for some reason he wanted to keep it close to his chest
fishing for his role right before he was nightkilled; he died that night.
And? I shared his opinion that if he was going to die anyway, there was no reason left to hide it any longer. He did not die over his useless Sin Mal role, he died for being confirmed town.
Tbh, I'm not sure whether you flipping town would actually make me reconsider my poe. Probably not (well, obv it wouldnt be you, but i would probably just continue with the least towny remaining person, w3 before coffee and everyone else is essentially confirmed town to me assuming the plan goes through). If I seem phoned in, its because so long as town doesnt do anything silly and there is no actual case on me other than " if it aint anyone else ot has be you duh" i think this is guaranteed to result in a town victory, so thats why im not really trying very hard anymore.
and this leads me to the end of my post; here, he's basically saying "i don't want to put in effort to solve as i think this is a free win for me." he assumed that everyone else alive universally scumread me more than him and so that was him coasting for the rest of the game.
I feel like it's NAI, unless he wanted really badly to scum read me.
throughout the game, kae has tried solving and all of his reads that were on his own volition were incorrect, along with saving dc multiple times and bussing when the maf were essentially already found. you say that he tried to solve more than me, but if your idea of solving is that he outed more reads, does that clear him more than me? with his ability, he could have purposefully omitted usages and hidden his core usages with core of reason. i assume that he just got multiple unlucky hits with it if that's what happened, as there is no correlation past the first nightkill with positive and important targets getting killed based off of nothing.
DC Day 1 was barely even being scum read, half the wagon just joined a top wagon for a lynch. Town read on andre was shared with me and NAI. And the first nightkill was ironically confirmed not attributed to kaempfer13. I don't think he himself was ever even a target of his own ability, so he does not even need to hide anything in his reveals. The crucial part being the confusion on whom used abilities after claims due to Raiden Mei interfering. As mafia, he would not be confused or fake it.
Also, how do you mean interesting cop interaction? The me saying i would protect him? that’s just a roleswap that i thought we were both taking part in because i knew that my role as cecilia was less valuable than a doc.
It's interesting you read anything into it to begin with, or that you think there are two soft claims from Link. The role reveal came as a complete surprise to me.
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24 hour condension (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
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Now that I'm on laptop instead of phone, lets add my thoughts on each point (except for a few vague ones where I have nothing to add, or that I addressed earlier):
Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
This is wifom trying to indicate that he doesn't have the core, but still voicing his annoyance because being redirected onto shock with his core doesn't yield positive results.
This is just as true for his Frederica Tesla ability as town, which he has already stated at some point after his reveal.
Then it's valid for both directions, like my cecilia vig. That reminds me, what's the reason we all scumread me? PoE?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
I don't know how much I can stress that he wanted to try and 'flip a wagon' onto ian when there were 2 minutes left in the voting timer. He posted after link had forced a nl and chose not to break the tie, which he counters by saying that he was going to in the very short amount of time left. I can't trust that.
He literally removed his vote earlier when he became a viable wagon, invalid argument.
But the point is he chose not to hammer, and instead remained out of the two wagons when he could have accidentally forced a NL because of it. The bronya avoiding was fine and all, but the lack of a decision to push one of the wagons at day end is interesting and scummy to me.
Wagonomics strongly suggest DC town. He was topwagon very frequently (competing with various different wagons) and the vote that decided he lives another day was torb, who i tr and who also had voted him with intend to kill afaik before, so doesnt look like any effort went into saving him.
To a lesser extend, I tr w3 for the same reason I tr timpa last game (that was wrong though, so maybe i shouldnt tr people for this anymore) as after he stopped memevoting dc he actually defended dc as early as when he was the competing topwagon.
this looking at DC being scum is not very sound reasoning. the effort that went into saving him was you not hammering on him or shock.
I think credit to saving him goes to Linkcat, though.
In the long run, he was the person who pushed the counterwagon, yes, but there was no way that DC would have lived unless someone on the DC wagon flipped (you) or no one from outside the wagon flipped onto him. It looks to me like at that point our options were you, me, Link, Sub, and kae.
ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.
your vote on ian was a pressure vote even though you voted on him with 3 or so minutes left on the EoD extension timer?
He had already voted him earlier, before he was a competing wagon.
Fair enough.
Tbh, i dont really see why Cecilia finishing dawn off is particularly scummy. I mean it does go against the consensus of vocal players, but very publicly so; similiar to how shock did, i dont exactly condon going against the grain without even speaking up about it, but as scum!cecilia you are just painting a target on your back. In fact as scum!Cecilia its best to mark many different people, denying us the flip and then finish them off one after the other, ending the game early.
you townread my cecilia vig on dawn here but are now using it as one of the main bases of your arguments, saying i'm the lest mechanically towny here.
That probably says more about how likely I am to be town, leaving you to be scum.
what
yes, if coffee lives we can force ian to kill someone in addition to coffees kil (and coffee not using your ability after already outing is beyond dumb, as the first half has literally no drawback)
it actually would be beyond dumb at that point in time if you thought i could be mafia, as if i had used it multiple times (every night) the game would be over if i had maf majority with yesterday's lynching of sub. however, i'm wondering if you weren't concerned with that possibility as you already knew my alignment?
This is consistent with kaempfer13s reasoning of vigging everyone as town being a good play.
Consistency is an easy facade for scummy behavior.
for the 100th time that specific scenario instantly outs a scumrole so while there is a high chance the rolesearcher is town and alive that just wont happen
i think you're closer to the 2nd or maybe 3rd time
but valid point. any suggestions for targets? i might just go on dc or cal
I prefer cal out of those for obv reasons
again defending or steering the target away from his partner like i mentioned earlier.
Ironically, from the inverted perspective, it's like you are -again- shifting the responsibility of not targeting mafia onto someone else, knowing full well andre was being more town read at that point in time. It's practically a rhetorical question baiting for someone to blame in retrospect.
You are in fact right in thinking that at that point that long ago, I expected kae to be in a 3way with you and I and I would be forced to thunderdome with him and use that as one of my arguments. No, I'm pointing out the correlation here, and that out of the two kae chose cal over DC. It's consistent with his views, but does that make it less notable?
I probably want my vote on someone that never had to feel threatened by the lynch except TorB and kdz. Considering my theory that all wagons so far were town, thats were the scum would have to be. Although the people coming to mind there are timpa and calindu, who i dont have particularly good reason to scumread outside that. And chances are that noone would hop on anyway, since people tend to hold onto old grudges here.
giving a non-commital slight townread to andre here
I was town reading andre before N3, too.
Cool. Still an important relation to note.
Oh missed w3s post.
I am Frederica Tesla.
Shock didnt have a honkai core and i was really pissed he significantly decreased the effectiveness of my ability.
Anyway 7 abilities other than my own were used n1.
Now the important part: N2 i targeted sub, kdz, coffee, mw, ian and cal n2. Only a single ability was used, coffees. However if andre and dc are truthfull I should have witnessed torb use an ability as well
this is where kae can use his ability to hide his core usage. notice how his ability usage does not include DC or andre, even though DC was scumread by many people by that point.
But not by kaempfer13.
Consistency over all, right? I consistently scumread DC, but that doesn't hold up in a court of law I guess.
Btw, dc actually said that rate up was a lie, claiming that he didnt get any of the roles his friend suggested, though he did. Perhaps he wanted to disguise as real raiden from the start.+ I too thought that seele clarification came a bit early, making it seem planned. So yh I think both are wolves. Sorry I defended dc for so long.
this is backpedaling after DC was going to be one of the next lynches.
NAI
Fair enough, I guess.
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
welp i did promise I would vote the one to post targets later (or not at all? please dont be like that). I see several questionable things from andre today as well though. he's in thunderdome with both dc and coffee simultaneously (unless coffee did use ability and was redirected by dc (wait for dc to claim before you say anything)), so even if we assume that both thunderdomes are v/w he's still likely scum.
this is just bussing again when we know that both of them are going to be lynched.
Not sure how this vote tells anything regarding alignment.
SHows the progression of reads of kae onto the two people who filpped scum. Also sets up my next point, which is that out of the two kae voted the one with the better core to die with, contradicting what he says here.
DoubleCapitals (4) - iancudorinmarian, andretimpa, TheonlyrealBeef, Submachine
andretimpa (5) - worldwideweb3, DoubleCapitals, rob77dp, Calindu, kaempfer13
be it because dc is town or has the honkai core thats worse, i prefer this lynch.
was the straw that pushed us to kill the person with core of binding. it didn't do much iirc, but still of note.
I found andre to be the scummiest of the two since his N0 action reveal. If he was already suspicious of Sub (maybe ian as well?) at that point in time, it made sense to join the wagon mafia wasn't bussing.
fair enough, and his reasoning was that he believed andre to hold the less important core or that DC was not town, both of which could be just lying? but his scumreads do subscribe to that, yes.
May dc never miss another eod. Unless its w3 or dc is innocent I think the game is pretty much mechanically solved now.
and here we are, where it's not mechanically solved.
It is from his perspective if he is town.
Nothing in this game mechanically confirms any of the three of us as town or mafia. This is scumhunting, not auto win/loss. What about if he's mafia?
As I said, the game took a set course as soon as we all agreed to follow TorB's plan. As last game showed, being aware of someone possibly being the mafia achieves nothing if we do not vote on them. We should make a concensus whether we suspect Kae or TorB to be mafia (strongly enough that we actually vote on them!), and if not, put them off the table. I think if we have a deep wolf, it is Kae and not TorB. TorB did too many things, but I can't remember if Kae actually helped find a mafia, or he doubled down on a mafia that TorB found without him. I want an answer to this too from people who have good memory of this, then I will make a final decision whether I will consider voting Kae or not - if I even live for the next day.
He never voted, though. Even his final reads did not suggest kaempfer13 to be below N.
It's important to note Sub's stance here, no? Did we ever get the answer about kae helping to hunt for mafia? The most he did was benefit town after you pointed out the seele/raiden interactions. His ability usage is, again, not towny nor scummy. Just what needed to happen at the time when DC/Andre were already scumread.
did kdz actually claim? i mean its obvious,but for some reason he wanted to keep it close to his chest
fishing for his role right before he was nightkilled; he died that night.
And? I shared his opinion that if he was going to die anyway, there was no reason left to hide it any longer. He did not die over his useless Sin Mal role, he died for being confirmed town.
What if he had used it on one of the Raidens? That could present some issues, unless the Seele!Raiden doesn't carry over to Sin Mal.
Tbh, I'm not sure whether you flipping town would actually make me reconsider my poe. Probably not (well, obv it wouldnt be you, but i would probably just continue with the least towny remaining person, w3 before coffee and everyone else is essentially confirmed town to me assuming the plan goes through). If I seem phoned in, its because so long as town doesnt do anything silly and there is no actual case on me other than " if it aint anyone else ot has be you duh" i think this is guaranteed to result in a town victory, so thats why im not really trying very hard anymore.
and this leads me to the end of my post; here, he's basically saying "i don't want to put in effort to solve as i think this is a free win for me." he assumed that everyone else alive universally scumread me more than him and so that was him coasting for the rest of the game.
I feel like it's NAI, unless he wanted really badly to scum read me.
You don't think it's not remotely scummy to not try anymore, even if you both scumread me? It just reeks of a staunchy overconfidence that aligns with the hubris of a scum who thinks they've won. Is that not scummy to you?
throughout the game, kae has tried solving and all of his reads that were on his own volition were incorrect, along with saving dc multiple times and bussing when the maf were essentially already found. you say that he tried to solve more than me, but if your idea of solving is that he outed more reads, does that clear him more than me? with his ability, he could have purposefully omitted usages and hidden his core usages with core of reason. i assume that he just got multiple unlucky hits with it if that's what happened, as there is no correlation past the first nightkill with positive and important targets getting killed based off of nothing.
DC Day 1 was barely even being scum read, half the wagon just joined a top wagon for a lynch. Town read on andre was shared with me and NAI. And the first nightkill was ironically confirmed not attributed to kaempfer13. I don't think he himself was ever even a target of his own ability, so he does not even need to hide anything in his reveals. The crucial part being the confusion on whom used abilities after claims due to Raiden Mei interfering. As mafia, he would not be confused or fake it.
The idea behind the hiding core usage is that with his ability, it makes him much easier to not need to claim his more-than-one ability usage. Clearly he wouldn't want to falsely claim someone else using cores if he didn't need to, and his ability never revealed anyone specific using cores, let alone me if he is assuming I am mafia (he is). Is that a coincidence? Bad luck? Seems to be just about as bad of luck as a kill on Link might be. And why would he not fake confusion as mafia? That makes no sense to me. It's trying to derpclear if he's going that way, and is as valid a strategy as not.
Also, how do you mean interesting cop interaction? The me saying i would protect him? that’s just a roleswap that i thought we were both taking part in because i knew that my role as cecilia was less valuable than a doc.
It's interesting you read anything into it to begin with, or that you think there are two soft claims from Link. The role reveal came as a complete surprise to me.
It's important to note because of, as i mentioned earlier, kae's self proclaimed "affinity for slips". I want to repeat that if he was so vehement about moe's slip, AND link died as the first nightkill after these posts, the way kae found his role if shock redirected a core onto himself is through these softs:
Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
Rob, that was a scrubbed game that we played literally half a decade ago. Don't try to read off of it.
kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I soft counterclaim your soft confirm.
I'm in a bit of a bind here, I have this really ominous feeling I can already derive Durandals identity based on public information... I can only pray it's WIFOM from mafia's perspective, but if Durandal really is whom I suspect, they're doing a terrible job of keeping quiet about it.
My bad, I'll try to be more subtle next time.
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and now, upon seeing that he is having suspicion cast upon him, he chooses to condense and not address my desire for him to bring up counterpoints on me. here we have arrived.
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because you are wasting our time, I announced I would do this unless you put in major effort, but while you put a lot of text out i dont think you have your heart in it. I can easily poke at the weaknesses in your arguments, and I find your explannations for those points were I did so very weak. Anyway even if you're town you are voting the wrong person, so the chance is absolutely 0 that a scum that is not you is getting voted up today as we are tunneling each other, so obv I dont want to deal with this anymore.
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because you are wasting our time, I announced I would do this unless you put in major effort, but while you put a lot of text out i dont think you have your heart in it. I can easily poke at the weaknesses in your arguments, and I find your explannations for those points were I did so very weak. Anyway even if you're town you are voting the wrong person, so the chance is absolutely 0 that a scum that is not you is getting voted up today as we are tunneling each other, so obv I dont want to deal with this anymore.
okay. hold on. i'm not wasting anyone's time if the game wasn't going to go on longer than the minimum 6 more hours, so don't say that. can you point out why my points are weak, or point the weaknesses out instead of just giving no effort and saying that they exist? if you don't care about the game don't play it, and if you don't want to play don't complain about time being wasted.
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Now that I'm on laptop instead of phone, lets add my thoughts on each point (except for a few vague ones where I have nothing to add, or that I addressed earlier):
Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
This is wifom trying to indicate that he doesn't have the core, but still voicing his annoyance because being redirected onto shock with his core doesn't yield positive results.
This is just as true for his Frederica Tesla ability as town, which he has already stated at some point after his reveal.
Then it's valid for both directions, like my cecilia vig. That reminds me, what's the reason we all scumread me? PoE?
Yep, poe. Unlike you said, I didnt particularly scumread you until now as pretty much everyone other than torb ofc acted way scummier. But compared to torb who probably is the sole reason this wasnt a clean sweep for scum in the first place, its just impossible to tr the other remaining person. i really thought this game would end 5 days ago, but we're still here.
Anyway what does that even have to do with the quote?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
I don't know how much I can stress that he wanted to try and 'flip a wagon' onto ian when there were 2 minutes left in the voting timer. He posted after link had forced a nl and chose not to break the tie, which he counters by saying that he was going to in the very short amount of time left. I can't trust that.
He literally removed his vote earlier when he became a viable wagon, invalid argument.
But the point is he chose not to hammer, and instead remained out of the two wagons when he could have accidentally forced a NL because of it. The bronya avoiding was fine and all, but the lack of a decision to push one of the wagons at day end is interesting and scummy to me.
Sigh, you are both wrong about my reasoning here, which someone that read the thread recently should remmember. my unvote was to prevent a no lynch from happening and I scumread ian more than the others.
oops, got called for dinner, may continue this later, though id rather not (but probably will as you would just continue being wrong about me otherwise). be back in an hour or so probably.
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Now that I'm on laptop instead of phone, lets add my thoughts on each point (except for a few vague ones where I have nothing to add, or that I addressed earlier):
Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
This is wifom trying to indicate that he doesn't have the core, but still voicing his annoyance because being redirected onto shock with his core doesn't yield positive results.
This is just as true for his Frederica Tesla ability as town, which he has already stated at some point after his reveal.
Then it's valid for both directions, like my cecilia vig. That reminds me, what's the reason we all scumread me? PoE?
Yep, poe. Unlike you said, I didnt particularly scumread you until now as pretty much everyone other than torb ofc acted way scummier. But compared to torb who probably is the sole reason this wasnt a clean sweep for scum in the first place, its just impossible to tr the other remaining person. i really thought this game would end 5 days ago, but we're still here.
Anyway what does that even have to do with the quote?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
I don't know how much I can stress that he wanted to try and 'flip a wagon' onto ian when there were 2 minutes left in the voting timer. He posted after link had forced a nl and chose not to break the tie, which he counters by saying that he was going to in the very short amount of time left. I can't trust that.
He literally removed his vote earlier when he became a viable wagon, invalid argument.
But the point is he chose not to hammer, and instead remained out of the two wagons when he could have accidentally forced a NL because of it. The bronya avoiding was fine and all, but the lack of a decision to push one of the wagons at day end is interesting and scummy to me.
Sigh, you are both wrong about my reasoning here, which someone that read the thread recently should remmember. my unvote was to prevent a no lynch from happening and I scumread ian more than the others.
oops, got called for dinner, may continue this later, though id rather not (but probably will as you would just continue being wrong about me otherwise). be back in an hour or so probably.
The quote in the first part was just a place for me to toss in the question, and the tesla part was an admittal of that being NAI, like my cecilia vig.
I read the thread recently and your unvote was not in the last period of time where, yesterday or the day before, you said that you would have hammered to steer away from a no lynch. your reasoning right here contradicts what you said you would have done back then; you were active when link forced a no lynch and you obligated torb to hammer onto shock which took away from the DC train and added to the shock train, further strengthening the prevention of a town blitz onto your partner. Scumread ian or not, your removal of a vote earlier in that day is not preventing a NL from happening.
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Now that I'm on laptop instead of phone, lets add my thoughts on each point (except for a few vague ones where I have nothing to add, or that I addressed earlier):
Rita Rossweisse targeted me. I'm not sure what to make of it wrt ritas alignement, but i dont like it. I was a little surprised to learn that even though im forced to target her, i still have no idea who she is. Seems to be some kind of impressive mindcontrol ability.
This is wifom trying to indicate that he doesn't have the core, but still voicing his annoyance because being redirected onto shock with his core doesn't yield positive results.
This is just as true for his Frederica Tesla ability as town, which he has already stated at some point after his reveal.
Then it's valid for both directions, like my cecilia vig. That reminds me, what's the reason we all scumread me? PoE?
Yep, poe. Unlike you said, I didnt particularly scumread you until now as pretty much everyone other than torb ofc acted way scummier. But compared to torb who probably is the sole reason this wasnt a clean sweep for scum in the first place, its just impossible to tr the other remaining person. i really thought this game would end 5 days ago, but we're still here.
Anyway what does that even have to do with the quote?
dawn to dusk (1) - killsdazombies
DoubleCapitals (5) - Calindu, Coffeeditto, rob77dp, Submachine, TheonlyrealBeef
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
MasterWalks (1) - moehrpi
worldwideweb3 (1) - andretimpa
shockcannon (4) - Naii_the_Baf, DoubleCapitals, MasterWalks, iancudorinmarian
Submachine(1) - worldwideweb3
iancudorinmarian (3) - Linkcat, PlayerOa, kamepfer13
I don't know how much I can stress that he wanted to try and 'flip a wagon' onto ian when there were 2 minutes left in the voting timer. He posted after link had forced a nl and chose not to break the tie, which he counters by saying that he was going to in the very short amount of time left. I can't trust that.
He literally removed his vote earlier when he became a viable wagon, invalid argument.
But the point is he chose not to hammer, and instead remained out of the two wagons when he could have accidentally forced a NL because of it. The bronya avoiding was fine and all, but the lack of a decision to push one of the wagons at day end is interesting and scummy to me.
Sigh, you are both wrong about my reasoning here, which someone that read the thread recently should remmember. my unvote was to prevent a no lynch from happening and I scumread ian more than the others.
oops, got called for dinner, may continue this later, though id rather not (but probably will as you would just continue being wrong about me otherwise). be back in an hour or so probably.
The quote in the first part was just a place for me to toss in the question, and the tesla part was an admittal of that being NAI, like my cecilia vig.
I read the thread recently and your unvote was not in the last period of time where, yesterday or the day before, you said that you would have hammered to steer away from a no lynch. your reasoning right here contradicts what you said you would have done back then; you were active when link forced a no lynch and you obligated torb to hammer onto shock which took away from the DC train and added to the shock train, further strengthening the prevention of a town blitz onto your partner. Scumread ian or not, your removal of a vote earlier in that day is not preventing a NL from happening.
ebwop - fixed formatting
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I haven't read the last few posts, but this took a while to compose.
Then it's valid for both directions, like my cecilia vig. That reminds me, what's the reason we all scumread me? PoE?
There are several reasons that I have pointed out so far. If you want to sum it up in generic points:
- First and foremost: lack of conviction. Your actions should be based on YOUR belief on what YOU think is bets for town, as well as taking responsibility for those actions and explaining why you believe it was in town's best interests. I have completely missed this the entire game. That was also my point on Cal/andre that you pointed out. Same for targeting people in general after the dawn kill. You should do these things because you believe them to be the right thing, not because some vague concept of town consensus when there are only 2-3 people engaged in that discussion. That is NOT consensus. Lack of conviction was also when you vigged dawn: "that's what rob did as town, so it's okay" is a terrible reason. Unless you understand and agree with the underlying reason for this and use that to explain why you did it, it sounds more like a lame excuse to kill some town.
- Insistence on talking about scum Raidens early game, yet somehow never worried your targeting would be affected. All your ability uses hit their marks. I know the latter can simply be luck, or even strategy from scum since they have no reason to interfere with town dying, but it's still nagging my mind.
- Ironically, the reason people initially town read you, the very same reason Linkcat told people not to town read me for, is talking mechanics. It's why I considered rob a hypocrite for putting both of us as town reads. I never mentioned this before, since before N3, this could have had some major backfire to point out.
- I find kaempfer13 to be more likely town.
- There are several now-dead town that scum read you when my plan for confirming ian was set into motion, they all agreed with this plan knowing you could not escape being lynched as mafia as long as it was followed. Both me and kaempfer13 insisted that if someone wanted to make a case on us, they should do it then and there before the plan is set in motion to eliminate everyone else. You silently agreed with this plan by vigging Cal and made no attempts to scum read either of us until the very end. Deviating from lynching you, would feel like a betrayal to all the dead town that entrusted me to follow the laid out plan.
But the point is he chose not to hammer, and instead remained out of the two wagons when he could have accidentally forced a NL because of it. The bronya avoiding was fine and all, but the lack of a decision to push one of the wagons at day end is interesting and scummy to me.
it certainly wasn't the best vote, that's all I can say on it.
In the long run, he was the person who pushed the counterwagon, yes, but there was no way that DC would have lived unless someone on the DC wagon flipped (you) or no one from outside the wagon flipped onto him. It looks to me like at that point our options were you, me, Link, Sub, and kae.
Except kaempfer13 had no reason to prefer either lynch, it seems. That's all there really is to say on that from my perspective.
saying i'm the lest mechanically towny here.
That probably says more about how likely I am to be town, leaving you to be scum.
what
Does removing the rest of the quote better emphasize how that makes you less mechanically town than me?
Consistency is an easy facade for scummy behavior.
People being themselves is NAI from my point of view.
You are in fact right in thinking that at that point that long ago, I expected kae to be in a 3way with you and I and I would be forced to thunderdome with him and use that as one of my arguments. No, I'm pointing out the correlation here, and that out of the two kae chose cal over DC. It's consistent with his views, but does that make it less notable?
What. See first point on why I think you are scum, this is just you abandoning the responsibility of not targeting scum.
Nothing in this game mechanically confirms any of the three of us as town or mafia. This is scumhunting, not auto win/loss. What about if he's mafia?
Then he could still say this. "What about if he's mafia?" is a question we've heard all throughout the last few days. It's a risk we all accepted by accepting this course of action.
It's important to note Sub's stance here, no? Did we ever get the answer about kae helping to hunt for mafia? The most he did was benefit town after you pointed out the seele/raiden interactions. His ability usage is, again, not towny nor scummy. Just what needed to happen at the time when DC/Andre were already scumread.
My answer was that I would probably have ended up lynching both after moes reveal, regardless of kaempfer13s statements. Ironically, Subs earlier stance was that the person initiating a mass role-claim is almost always town (kaempfer13). Perhaps he saw it as me initiating a mass role claim, but my intention was only ever to hard claim my own role. It could even be that that was the point he was trying to drive across then all along, with me not intentionally initiating the role claim seeming even townier, who knows.
What if he had used it on one of the Raidens? That could present some issues, unless the Seele!Raiden doesn't carry over to Sin Mal.
kdz did in fact target andretimpa before he got lynched, but DC rerouted it to me. Core of binding made it impossible to use it before DC got lynched the day after. This was not clear at the time kaempfer13 posted this, however. But kdz would still have been defenseless, since Raiden cannot self-target.
You don't think it's not remotely scummy to not try anymore, even if you both scumread me? It just reeks of a staunchy overconfidence that aligns with the hubris of a scum who thinks they've won. Is that not scummy to you?
Make of it what you will, I guess.
And why would he not fake confusion as mafia? That makes no sense to me. It's trying to derpclear if he's going that way, and is as valid a strategy as not.
Right. So you gotta read the posts and see if the confusion makes sense and is genuine. For example, Subs "derpclear" on how many mafia were in the game? DENIED. That should have been super obvious.
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Unvoting is indeed a terrible way to break a 3-way tie, though.
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I haven't read the last few posts, but this took a while to compose.
Then it's valid for both directions, like my cecilia vig. That reminds me, what's the reason we all scumread me? PoE?
There are several reasons that I have pointed out so far. If you want to sum it up in generic points:
- First and foremost: lack of conviction. Your actions should be based on YOUR belief on what YOU think is bets for town, as well as taking responsibility for those actions and explaining why you believe it was in town's best interests. I have completely missed this the entire game. That was also my point on Cal/andre that you pointed out. Same for targeting people in general after the dawn kill. You should do these things because you believe them to be the right thing, not because some vague concept of town consensus when there are only 2-3 people engaged in that discussion. That is NOT consensus. Lack of conviction was also when you vigged dawn: "that's what rob did as town, so it's okay" is a terrible reason. Unless you understand and agree with the underlying reason for this and use that to explain why you did it, it sounds more like a lame excuse to kill some town.
If you read my post in on of my responses to moe (i think it was moe?), you'll see there was no lack of conviction about my dawn vig. i stated that i stood by my action, and refused to say it was a bad idea. moe even asked if i felt no remorse for it, and i responded that i clearly did but i wouldn't go back on my decision to do it. The reason i followed through with the dawn vig was stated by me multiple times when everyone scumread me for it: dawn had one of the lowest post counts, did not release any information to us, did not claim a power role and was more useful to the mafia than the town at that point in the game.
- Insistence on talking about scum Raidens early game, yet somehow never worried your targeting would be affected. All your ability uses hit their marks. I know the latter can simply be luck, or even strategy from scum since they have no reason to interfere with town dying, but it's still nagging my mind.
And all of kae's didn't get driven away besides from a town rita. I'm not sure how that interaction would work, but just as all of mine hit their marks, the same could be said about kae's targets, which would benefit the scum to drive away from far more than my vigs. Right?
- Ironically, the reason people initially town read you, the very same reason Linkcat told people not to town read me for, is talking mechanics. It's why I considered rob a hypocrite for putting both of us as town reads. I never mentioned this before, since before N3, this could have had some major backfire to point out.
Is this a point against me?
- I find kaempfer13 to be more likely town.
Okay. Fair.
- There are several now-dead town that scum read you when my plan for confirming ian was set into motion, they all agreed with this plan knowing you could not escape being lynched as mafia as long as it was followed. Both me and kaempfer13 insisted that if someone wanted to make a case on us, they should do it then and there before the plan is set in motion to eliminate everyone else. You silently agreed with this plan by vigging Cal and made no attempts to scum read either of us until the very end. Deviating from lynching you, would feel like a betrayal to all the dead town that entrusted me to follow the laid out plan.
Just as it's a betrayal from me on their part to let this game end early without making an effort to win for us all. If I was mafia, I would've resigned already, but as I stated earlier, I don't want 14 people pissed at me for not trying. If they all scumread me, they also all scumread the mislynches, right? And we see how our first 3 days and day 6 turned out. (and how day 7 will turn out) It's important to note the reads, sure, but equally as important to acknowledge the accuracy prior and the reasoning for scumreading me. It seems like those reasons don't align with your reasons entirely.
saying i'm the lest mechanically towny here.
That probably says more about how likely I am to be town, leaving you to be scum.
what
Does removing the rest of the quote better emphasize how that makes you less mechanically town than me?My point here was that mechanics are no longer important besides acknowledging i didn't use a honkai core n1.
Consistency is an easy facade for scummy behavior.
People being themselves is NAI from my point of view. Glad we agree?
You are in fact right in thinking that at that point that long ago, I expected kae to be in a 3way with you and I and I would be forced to thunderdome with him and use that as one of my arguments. No, I'm pointing out the correlation here, and that out of the two kae chose cal over DC. It's consistent with his views, but does that make it less notable?
What. See first point on why I think you are scum, this is just you abandoning the responsibility of not targeting scum. kae asked me to ask the town for a consensus and repeatedly called for a lynchvote for my vig on cal, which i obliged to because it was better than a randovig. my first semirandovig hit town, and i didn't want to fuck up again.
It's important to note Sub's stance here, no? Did we ever get the answer about kae helping to hunt for mafia? The most he did was benefit town after you pointed out the seele/raiden interactions. His ability usage is, again, not towny nor scummy. Just what needed to happen at the time when DC/Andre were already scumread.
My answer was that I would probably have ended up lynching both after moes reveal, regardless of kaempfer13s statements. Ironically, Subs earlier stance was that the person initiating a mass role-claim is almost always town (kaempfer13). Perhaps he saw it as me initiating a mass role claim, but my intention was only ever to hard claim my own role. It could even be that that was the point he was trying to drive across then all along, with me not intentionally initiating the role claim seeming even townier, who knows. But kae was safe to initiate a mass roleclaim at that point, especially considering the role he had and the discovery of dc having copied andre's raiden. the truth of the mafia would come out sooner than later and it's smarter to figure out who the cop is before shit hits the fan, right? dispose of the important roles that could mess you up later sooner. my guess is he didn't hit anyone noteworthy with core of reason or lightning, and needed to find the cop and doc before his ways to secure kills went.
What if he had used it on one of the Raidens? That could present some issues, unless the Seele!Raiden doesn't carry over to Sin Mal.
kdz did in fact target andretimpa before he got lynched, but DC rerouted it to me. Core of binding made it impossible to use it before DC got lynched the day after. This was not clear at the time kaempfer13 posted this, however. But kdz would still have been defenseless, since Raiden cannot self-target. It's still a potential doc role, and if for some reason kae decided that kdz wasn't the optimal kill, it could have presented issues with how the kill played out.
And why would he not fake confusion as mafia? That makes no sense to me. It's trying to derpclear if he's going that way, and is as valid a strategy as not.
Right. So you gotta read the posts and see if the confusion makes sense and is genuine. For example, Subs "derpclear" on how many mafia were in the game? DENIED. That should have been super obvious. How can you determine what is genuine or not in a game like this? It's based on lying and deceipt. Come on, man. Also, there was no way for it to be cleared through making sense or not; i think i understand what you're saying, and that qualifier doesn't apply to this.
[/list]
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Unvoting is indeed a terrible way to break a 3-way tie, though.
Mostly I was stalling for time as i didnt feel either of the lead wagons and thought it had been too long since the last votecount. then link clarified that reposting vc extended timer all the same, so it was unnecessary altogether.
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ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.
yh I've read every post of link twice now and find zero reference to what I can find in the honkai wiki about theresa, the claims are all not serious aside from "ccing" moe, but none of dc,oa,moe has shared a role that link could confirm, so this was talking about durandal
BTW these 2 quotes from ages ago address 2 of the very things that coffee is trying to scumread me based off. Him failing to read is one of the reasons why I dont actually want to engage with him atp.
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Also coffee, can you pls share your wisdom of what action exactly link crumbed? I can still not see how that crumb would help us learn anything. At most it could have made people think that he was some kind of powerrole 8which he actually was, but not the one he joked about), but he didnt seriously crumb his actual findings unless everyone but you overlooked sth.
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And all of kae's didn't get driven away besides from a town rita. I'm not sure how that interaction would work, but just as all of mine hit their marks, the same could be said about kae's targets, which would benefit the scum to drive away from far more than my vigs. Right?
Eh? The role results say nothing about which targets he hit N2, that's part of why he was confused about andres target claims and concluded they made no sense. And when you target everyone (N1) (except yourself), only a redirect to yourself can potentially screw up ability totals.
Is this a point against me?
On how easy it is for mafia to gain town credit with talking mechanics. I'm not sure what other points I'm supposed to town read you for. You certainly didn't seem particularly interested in solving until you became a serious lynch target.
Just as it's a betrayal from me on their part to let this game end early without making an effort to win for us all. If I was mafia, I would've resigned already, but as I stated earlier, I don't want 14 people pissed at me for not trying. If they all scumread me, they also all scumread the mislynches, right? And we see how our first 3 days and day 6 turned out. (and how day 7 will turn out) It's important to note the reads, sure, but equally as important to acknowledge the accuracy prior and the reasoning for scumreading me. It seems like those reasons don't align with your reasons entirely.
lol
My point here was that mechanics are no longer important besides acknowledging i didn't use a honkai core n1.
I'd say the mechanics applied to get to this situation and the people that applied them are rather relevant in assessing their alignment.
But kae was safe to initiate a mass roleclaim at that point, especially considering the role he had and the discovery of dc having copied andre's raiden. the truth of the mafia would come out sooner than later and it's smarter to figure out who the cop is before shit hits the fan, right? dispose of the important roles that could mess you up later sooner. my guess is he didn't hit anyone noteworthy with core of reason or lightning, and needed to find the cop and doc before his ways to secure kills went.
Pretty sure cop was already revealed by that point. Leaving only doc to worry about.
How can you determine what is genuine or not in a game like this? It's based on lying and deceipt. Come on, man. Also, there was no way for it to be cleared through making sense or not; i think i understand what you're saying, and that qualifier doesn't apply to this.
Tone reads and stuff. Some people are just really bad at faking things, or fake things they'd never actually do as town.
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Unvoting is indeed a terrible way to break a 3-way tie, though.
Mostly I was stalling for time as i didnt feel either of the lead wagons and thought it had been too long since the last votecount. then link clarified that reposting vc extended timer all the same, so it was unnecessary altogether.
but what about when link tied it up? was that to extend the timer past its 30-minute limit?
ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.
yh I've read every post of link twice now and find zero reference to what I can find in the honkai wiki about theresa, the claims are all not serious aside from "ccing" moe, but none of dc,oa,moe has shared a role that link could confirm, so this was talking about durandal
BTW these 2 quotes from ages ago address 2 of the very things that coffee is trying to scumread me based off. Him failing to read is one of the reasons why I dont actually want to engage with him atp.
I have repeated time and time again that you didn't break a tie and almost forced a NL when you had the ability to hammer onto either one of the bandwagons. did you think that in the minute and a half you had left before the timer ticked out that there was going to be a flip onto ian? and would you have rather had a nl than a lynch on dc or shock?
Also coffee, can you pls share your wisdom of what action exactly link crumbed? I can still not see how that crumb would help us learn anything. At most it could have made people think that he was some kind of powerrole 8which he actually was, but not the one he joked about), but he didnt seriously crumb his actual findings unless everyone but you overlooked sth.
Kae - elements mafia 49. Might have to dig it out, i don't remember if that lives in the usual place for old games here it not.
Rob, that was a scrubbed game that we played literally half a decade ago. Don't try to read off of it.
kae, I'd like you to explicitly rule out Raiden as rob mentioned the possibility. Obviously, we don't know the exact wording in your PM.
That confirms there is Rita who also likes to play ballsy. Maybe too ballsy for town? If we end up finding out a more cautious player is Rita it would hint at scum/scum with an information role such as Cocolia. But there's s big margin of error here.
We also know Durandal is in the game, yay, and this also confirms Oa for me, unless someone speaks up in the next few hours. Take good care of him next night.
EBWOP, soft-confirming www3's roll. :/
I soft counterclaim your soft confirm.
moe DC OA are mafia according to my rolls. Infact, as you can see, DC and OA came in both of my rolls :angry:
23:37:03] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 15 + 4 + 15 = 34 ...!!
[23:37:07] ‹worldwideweb3› ew
[23:37:10] ‹worldwideweb3› (3d18) 18 + 4 + 15 = 37 ...✗
This is the "www3 roll" that moe was referring to that Link soft counterclaimed moe's facetious "soft confirm"... Could it be Link crumbing that his N0 'spear' returned a non-Herscherr result on one of the players www3's rolls playfully identified - being moe / DC / Oa. Perhaps but seems a stretch, then again crumbs are supposed to be thin and veiled or not too obvious otherwise they are detected too soon??
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except the role doesnt do that. It tells the type of ability, preferring core over actual role. This is only relevant once people claim
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I already addressed what i did when link tied it up. if i were scum id always lynch shock then and noone would dare tying it again. However instead i had to think which one of 2 people i dont actually scumread i had to vote (and considering one of them was shock id probably have made the wrong call anyway and torb broke the tie in the end). also ian vote wasnt quite out of reach yet really.
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And all of kae's didn't get driven away besides from a town rita. I'm not sure how that interaction would work, but just as all of mine hit their marks, the same could be said about kae's targets, which would benefit the scum to drive away from far more than my vigs. Right?
Eh? The role results say nothing about which targets he hit N2, that's part of why he was confused about andres target claims and concluded they made no sense. And when you target everyone (N1) (except yourself), only a redirect to yourself can potentially screw up ability totals.
and he got redirected to himself, but what if raiden redirected onto kae also? still messes him up i would think. it's just not a valid point to say that me not being redirected is scummy when he wasn't either.
Is this a point against me?
On how easy it is for mafia to gain town credit with talking mechanics. I'm not sure what other points I'm supposed to town read you for. You certainly didn't seem particularly interested in solving until you became a serious lynch target.
at that point i have to solve, right? i don't want the game to end with me being lynched. i scumread dc and voted on him from the very beginning, and was trying to solve but not devoutly, and why would i not try to solve now?
My point here was that mechanics are no longer important besides acknowledging i didn't use a honkai core n1.
I'd say the mechanics applied to get to this situation and the people that applied them are rather relevant in assessing their alignment.
then i got shafted with rolling the roles because my role doesn't solve, only kills or not other than revealing my identity.
But kae was safe to initiate a mass roleclaim at that point, especially considering the role he had and the discovery of dc having copied andre's raiden. the truth of the mafia would come out sooner than later and it's smarter to figure out who the cop is before shit hits the fan, right? dispose of the important roles that could mess you up later sooner. my guess is he didn't hit anyone noteworthy with core of reason or lightning, and needed to find the cop and doc before his ways to secure kills went.
Pretty sure cop was already revealed by that point. Leaving only doc to worry about.
then doc it is.
How can you determine what is genuine or not in a game like this? It's based on lying and deceipt. Come on, man. Also, there was no way for it to be cleared through making sense or not; i think i understand what you're saying, and that qualifier doesn't apply to this.
Tone reads and stuff. Some people are just really bad at faking things, or fake things they'd never actually do as town.
and your tone read on kae is that he was being genuine?
I already addressed what i did when link tied it up. if i were scum id always lynch shock then and noone would dare tying it again. However instead i had to think which one of 2 people i dont actually scumread i had to vote (and considering one of them was shock id probably have made the wrong call anyway and torb broke the tie in the end). also ian vote wasnt quite out of reach yet really.
why would you want to be the person who mishammers into a town role that directly targetted you? that would look scummy as hell, and throw shade onto you. you chose not to raise suspicion AND not to hammer your partner. also, the ian vote was out of reach with link's devotion to lynching shock and the rest of the active people not scumreading ian over shock or dc.
except the role doesnt do that. It tells the type of ability, preferring core over actual role. This is only relevant once people claim
if you were so adamant on moe slipping, and assumed he was maf or investigative, then link probably guessed that too. then, upon checking moe and knowing he had to be dura because link was the only other alignment-investigative, he could have seen EoR and assumed he was town. it just seems like not something you would skip and you can say that link doesn't say stuff seriously like that, but it's still of note that you didn't even mention it in passing.
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also torb, can we talk about how you've done all of the defending for kae and he's raised the same points over and over without point out things he scumreads me for?
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ok this too dumb for me. I LITERALLY MENTIONED IT IN PASSING IN LITERALLY THE POST I DUG UP TO PROVE YOU'RE NOT LISTENING mere minutes ago. Seriously, just not worth discussing anymore at this point, you pay absolutely 0 attention.
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YOU EVEN QUOTED IT.
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ok this too dumb for me. I LITERALLY MENTIONED IT IN PASSING IN LITERALLY THE POST I DUG UP TO PROVE YOU'RE NOT LISTENING mere minutes ago. Seriously, just not worth discussing anymore at this point, you pay absolutely 0 attention.
YOU EVEN QUOTED IT.
can you just like
explain
what this is about
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btw you still dont get how theresa works. At most he could have seen eor on moe, which means he is any of the eor roles or holding core of reason; it doesnt prove anything.
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ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.
yh I've read every post of link twice now and find zero reference to what I can find in the honkai wiki about theresa, the claims are all not serious aside from
(https://media1.tenor.com/images/037b5389a3b1abe450dcec133eabd8c0/tenor.gif?itemid=14993722)
"ccing" moe, but none of dc,oa,moe has shared a role that link could confirm, so this was talking about durandal
(https://media1.tenor.com/images/037b5389a3b1abe450dcec133eabd8c0/tenor.gif?itemid=14993722)
BTW these 2 quotes from ages ago address 2 of the very things that coffee is trying to scumread me based off. Him failing to read is one of the reasons why I dont actually want to engage with him atp.
I have repeated time and time again that you didn't break a tie and almost forced a NL when you had the ability to hammer onto either one of the bandwagons. did you think that in the minute and a half you had left before the timer ticked out that there was going to be a flip onto ian? and would you have rather had a nl than a lynch on dc or shock?
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Ironically the sirens make it less noteable lol
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btw you still dont get how theresa works. At most he could have seen eor on moe, which means he is any of the eor roles or holding core of reason; it doesnt prove anything.
I get how it works. I don't know why you think I don't. I also see what you said, and although it doesn't hard prove anything, that doesn't explain why you didn't point it out. like i keep saying without getting addressed, you said yourself that you jump at the sight of a slip, and link pretty much had the same form of slip that you exclaimed moe had. did you claim to miss it or what
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also torb, can we talk about how you've done all of the defending for kae and he's raised the same points over and over without point out things he scumreads me for?
In order for me to vote kaempfer13, you need to convince me kaempfer13 is scum, what he thinks of it is irrelevant. He is free and encouraged to defend himself on the points raised, but in the end his opinion on the matter wouldn't change all that much, unless he's pointing out how you're blatantly wrong about something that I somehow missed.
He's free to point out the things he scum reads you for, but I see no reason for it. His only alternative is to vote for me, which I obviously discourage. It's definitely important for you if you intend to change his mind, but that does not interest me at all.
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also torb, can we talk about how you've done all of the defending for kae and he's raised the same points over and over without point out things he scumreads me for?
In order for me to vote kaempfer13, you need to convince me kaempfer13 is scum, what he thinks of it is irrelevant. He is free and encouraged to defend himself on the points raised, but in the end his opinion on the matter wouldn't change all that much, unless he's pointing out how you're blatantly wrong about something that I somehow missed.
He's free to point out the things he scum reads you for, but I see no reason for it. His only alternative is to vote for me, which I obviously discourage. It's definitely important for you if you intend to change his mind, but that does not interest me at all.
My reasoning for you has pretty much been stated. Repeatedly not hammering onto his partner, his interactions with dc and andre until it became abundantly clear that they were scum to us, forcing a mass roleclaim to find the doctor and look towny because he knew a copied seele onto raiden would look scummy anyway, his solving being pushing on people with power roles consistently which has no basis in mechanics but is sus (rob, moe), and not defending himself with sound evidence for his lack of a hammer d1. i’m not sure what else i can say to you besides me rereading again
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if kae were town, i would want him to offer explanation beyond poe of why i am scum. i know you say he doesn’t need to support his claims because you’re tunneling me torb but i still want to see it.
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Obv poe weighs the most, but now that i am no longer blinded by Sub acting ridiculously scummy I notice that you completely lost motivation the moment scum was starting to get lynched for realz at last, which is kind of the opposite of what a villager would feel like. then there is the way you decided to start posting barely before Subs inevitable lynch like you knew the game would go on while I assume torb felt just like me like "oof, do i really have to respond to that 2 hours from gameend?". Welp, turns out it wasnt over, but at that point your position in the poe had become pretty much indefensable anyway. Also the way you posted since the actual day started looks more like you are trying to find anything scummy you possibly can rather than actually solving. (forgetting that you have to convince torb, while it doesnt matter much what i say if you truly believed I was scum is another thing, but i realize that that is actually weird from a scumpov as well, if not more, so I'll put that as nai). I also see you completely refusing to believe anything that you can find no counterpoints for, even though its in black on white (ok dark theme, so grey on dark grey actually, but anyway dismissing the written word that anyone can look up won't get you anywhere)
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Also, the way you did reveal your role was actually really scummy. You completely ignored the issue and almost made TorB search your role out until you realized that at that point you would get lynched for sure, so had to claim. it would have been better to at least explain your position from a 3rd person perspective, before everyone got rallied up in a witchhunt. I let that slide at the time as i had 2 decent reasons to townread you and i wasnt as offended by the action itself as most people were, just the way you revealed.
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Please note that this phase will end 24 hours earlier than the listed time unless votes for shortening the phase are removed.
The shortened timer is provided below for convenience.
Time's up.
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Obv poe weighs the most, but now that i am no longer blinded by Sub acting ridiculously scummy I notice that you completely lost motivation the moment scum was starting to get lynched for realz at last, which is kind of the opposite of what a villager would feel like.
At that point it seemed to be an easy victory for us until Sub flipped town. I was hoping that it was just dc/andre/sub all in a row, so why wuold i continue to try to scumhunt and possibly muddy up the game?
then there is the way you decided to start posting barely before Subs inevitable lynch like you knew the game would go on while I assume torb felt just like me like "oof, do i really have to respond to that 2 hours from gameend?". Welp, turns out it wasnt over, but at that point your position in the poe had become pretty much indefensable anyway. Also the way you posted since the actual day started looks more like you are trying to find anything scummy you possibly can rather than actually solving. (forgetting that you have to convince torb, while it doesnt matter much what i say if you truly believed I was scum is another thing, but i realize that that is actually weird from a scumpov as well, if not more, so I'll put that as nai).
At that point, i was both able to contribute to the game more than the prior night as my availability has been spotty (which i have noted) and the scumhunting was to cover bases and make sure i wasn't missing any glaringly obvious slips from you or beef before we went through on a sub lynch.
I also see you completely refusing to believe anything that you can find no counterpoints for, even though its in black on white (ok dark theme, so grey on dark grey actually, but anyway dismissing the written word that anyone can look up won't get you anywhere)
what do you mean
Also, the way you did reveal your role was actually really scummy. You completely ignored the issue and almost made TorB search your role out until you realized that at that point you would get lynched for sure, so had to claim. it would have been better to at least explain your position from a 3rd person perspective, before everyone got rallied up in a witchhunt. I let that slide at the time as i had 2 decent reasons to townread you and i wasnt as offended by the action itself as most people were, just the way you revealed.
Similarly to how TorB mentioned, i was not completely in favor of having my role available to possibly be tampered with, and if the main townreads were maf that had info on someone laying low, they could use that to coerce me into hitting important things or outing roles. as far as my timing, what would a better timing have been? i admit i should have done it before it was outwardly received so negatively but even after no one suggesting how i use my role, i thought i wouldn't be forced to out as a. noninvestigative and b. nondoc
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also thank you for engaging me with reasons why you scumread me
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I mean, i dont hate your response, but it just doesnt move the needle enough for me.
You seem completely oblivious to some things and perhaps you are actually truthfull about not understanding at all. But anyway there is no way the 2 of us are going to come to a consensus with how we missunderstand each other and with how odd it would be if TorB were scum after all this.
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I mean, i dont hate your response, but it just doesnt move the needle enough for me.
You seem completely oblivious to some things and perhaps you are actually truthfull about not understanding at all. But anyway there is no way the 2 of us are going to come to a consensus with how we missunderstand each other and with how odd it would be if TorB were scum after all this.
if torb is maf, i'll eat my shorts.
i'm glad we could come to a mutual understanding here. no hard feelings after the game.
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Dammit, he actually might be XD
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Dammit, he actually might be XD
i'm not switching off of you
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No hard feelings.
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unless you can convince me in 5 minutes or less that torb is scum, i'm gonna be pulling a you d1 basically but you won the game for your team so gg and sorry i fucked up town
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Day 7 has ended.
Coffeeditto (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (1) - Coffeeditto
The game results will be determined shortly. Please wait warmly.
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usually only town acts like this near an eod of a lost game, and torb pulled that cheeky "its best for me if you guys crossvote" but other than that i have no reason to change.
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gg all, zilean won
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Game Over
Coffeeditto was lynched. He was Cecilia Shariac. He was holding the Core of Reason.
The Valkyries have won the game.
All Night Actions
Actions are listed in order of resolution, based on priority. (Actions with the same priority are listed in an arbitrary order.)
Host Commentary
First, some personal commentary on the events of the game, along with some trivia.
- With 18 players, resulting in a 3-15 split, this setup was rather favored for the Valkyries. Sorry!
- The Herrschers could have killed Emma Planck on Night 3, but opted to kill Durandal. They didn't use Core of Void at all.
- moehrpi targeted DoubleCapitals on Night 0 solely because they were the only person who visibly had Seele as one of their favored roles.
- If not for the timely mass roleclaim, Coffeeditto would have most likely died that night to Flash Counter.
- Linkcat forgot to breadcrumb, thought the mafia had Core of Lightning, and thought kaempfer13 was the last mafia on the final day. He isn't very good at the game.
With that out of the way... If you have the time, please do leave some feedback on the setup and my performance as a host.
Thanks for playing, everyone! I hope you all enjoyed Mafia 74 - Honkai Eruption as much as I did. See you next time~
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gg everybody.
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gg
Coffee, why kill iancu? Torb was the far better choice.
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Oof, glad that is over with. This level of activity was really exhausting for me, especially near the end I kind of just wanted it over with (having a headache from getting sick wasn't helping). Probably going to be significantly less active next mafia (you read it here first). In case people were offended I was calling them useless, that was just me breadcrumbing they had no power roles that I knew of. Knowledge of power roles also kind of made me more eager to lynch/vig random people this game, as long as they weren't me or Durandal :silly: "What if they have a power role?!" Naaah.
Thanks sky for hosting, was an interesting ruleset to think up plans with.
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link to deadpad pls.
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Knowledge of power roles also kind of made me more eager to lynch/vig random people this game, as long as they weren't me or Durandal :silly: "What if they have a power role?!" Naaah.
Thanks sky for hosting, was an interesting ruleset to think up plans with.
I second this. :D
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I got a little scared near the end, but mechanically this game was just too townsided. I'm not sure whether Im actually terrible at the game or people are just scummy here.
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Game went pretty well, don't think it's townsided, mafia just went for a risky play N0 and got caught. Thanks for hosting, Sky.
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gg
Coffee, why kill iancu? Torb was the far better choice.
i scumread ian day one and he expressed a scumread on me afterwards. i thought that between ian and torb, i could possibly sway the vote to torb with kae or at least allow myself the option, and 3way no clear is almost always better than 3way 1clear.
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I got a little scared near the end, but mechanically this game was just too townsided. I'm not sure whether Im actually terrible at the game or people are just scummy here.
They surely like their dice here.
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Game went pretty well, don't think it's townsided, mafia just went for a risky play N0 and got caught. Thanks for hosting, Sky.
hey I died on D4 instead of D1 I consider that a win
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Polls are up.
Based solely on the play seen in this game, if we ran 1000 games with the same players, who would have the highest winrate? This is what your votes should be based on.
Standard setup is the one used in 70, 71, and 73.
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should append that I did have fun flavour-wise (probably the one who enjoyed that the most perhaps?) even if it stressed me out in game and expounded the stress I had irl. Thanks sky, hope to cya around soon~!
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Before I go sleep, mafia pad. Sorry I couldn't send you the link rob, it ain't a pad.
https://discord.gg/UpbBQxH
Yeah I did stay up for way longer than I appeared in chat. Didn't expect y'all to scrutinise timing and Who's Online. 50% for this. 50% for college. Guess that idea's out the window next though and I shouldn't stay up at 5am regardless
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Forgot a poll.
Who's Online hasn't exactly come up as an issue yet, but it should still be discussed. Lurking Who's Online allows you to see when people are viewing the thread, when they are posting in the thread, and when they are sending or reading messages. This can be used as a way to read players based on things that occur outside of the thread itself. While it is fun and I have used it a lot, it has potential for abuse, especially to see if someone is sending an ability use or viewing a result from a PM right before or after deadline. I'm in favor of banning it but I'll put it up to a vote.
If anyone has an interest in hosting mafia, whether it be the standard setup, a new setup, an old setup, one of Sky's supposedly unlimited setups, or anything else, feel free to reach out to me and we can discuss it from there. Any potential setup must go through a balance check and be given my seal of approval, but I am generally open to most ideas. I think most people already understand this, but I guess it's not clearly stated anywhere. Below is a discussion from the DeadPad that led to this post and goes over possible hosts for the setups in the current poll.
Linkcat:15:48 Anyone have suggestions for more polls?
Sky:15:49 Why does your "next setup" poll suck
Sky:15:50 Look at this fascist, banning consecutive role madness games
Oa:15:50 "The standard setup" meaning the EtG themed mafia?
DC:15:52 I'd like to know the theme of the setup link
DC:15:52 if that is possible
Linkcat:15:53 There' no other role madness setup ready, Sky.
Linkcat:15:53 Standard setup is the elements themed one.
Linkcat:15:53 Theme for my setup is Dresden Files
Linkcat:15:54 If it's the standard one rob will probably host.
Sky:15:55 Link - of course there's another role madness setup ready, I have an infinite number of setups
Sky:15:55 Also, is your setup *not* role madness, Link?
Linkcat:15:55 It is
Linkcat:15:55 All the options are role madness
DC:15:56 wait it's all role madness?
Linkcat:15:56 I generally don't want people hosting twice in a row. I can put you in the poll for 76, Sky.
Sky:15:56 I wasn't volunteering. But I have setups.
Sky:15:59 By the way, Link, where is the host poll
Linkcat:16:02 The next setup poll is the host poll. Standard and all Fate Egg can be run by anyone, the silly game would be me.
DC:16:03 if it's in 1 week
Sky:16:03 What about the closed setup designed by Linkcat? Can I host that one?
DC:16:03 i think ill have to pass for my sanity no matter what
Linkcat:16:03 No
Sky:16:03 Fascist
Oa:16:05 well, polls for 1 week and signups for another makes it at least 14 days until next mafia
Sky:16:08 You should totally add an option for "A role madness setup designed by sky"
Sky:16:08 I bet someone will host it for me if I pay them enough
Sky:16:10 More seriously, you should probably include which setup can be hosted by which people.
Sky:16:11 I would never vote for a silly setup, but if I did want to, the fact that only Link can host would sway my vote to something else
Linkcat:16:12 I don't think the host is that important. If they're good then it shouldn't have any impact on the game.
Sky:16:12 I don't think the presidential candidate is that important. If they're good then they should perfectly represent the interests of their party
Sky:16:13 You're an idiot
Sky:16:13 I want to know precisely because a lot of hosts are not good
Sky:16:14 If everyone was good at hosting, then you would be right, but it is both naive and painfully inaccurate
Linkcat:16:14 That's not the same thing. A host is just someone who executes he rules as written. Ideally we would have an automated system. I wouldn't let someone host who I didn't trust to do a good job.
Sky:16:15 Your rules cannot possibly cover every situation that can arise, especially with the role madness setups that we tend to have
timpa:16:15 eats popcorn
Sky:16:15 Someone has to be the person to make judgement calls and clarify role interactions
Sky:16:15 That person is almost always the host
Linkcat:16:15 The reason I would want to host the silly setup is because Night actions would get pretty complicated, but there are a few others I would let run it.
www:16:17 oh i can make those calls
www:16:17 but someone else can host
Sky:16:17 At least put possible hosts in a post somewhere
Linkcat:16:17 Imagine w3 hosting.
Linkcat:16:17 Oh god
unnamed:16:17 LMAO
www:16:17 yh im not gonna host
www:16:17 but i am happy to make important calls
www:16:18 so you can have a nub host
Sky:16:18 You extending your arbitrary judgements over the entire community is probably why you're not a good FGO
www:16:18 this way, sky will join mafia even if youre a host
www:16:18 as the calls wont be made by you q.q
Sky:16:18 Let's try this from a different angle - what reason do you have for not listing which setups can be hosted by which people?
www:16:18 jk jk, idc who hosts or what the steup is
www:16:18 i just want mafia
Linkcat:16:18 I have not reached out to anyone about hosting the standard or fate egg setup yet.
Sky:16:19 Okay, so say that.
Sky:16:19 Needlessly concealing information is for mafia members.
www:16:19 tbh link would be happy for anyone to host if they want to
Linkcat:16:19 If I wanted to make arbitrary judgments I would just decide what's run by myself.
Sky:16:19 You already do that.
Linkcat:16:20 Okay, yes I'll block anything that I don't see as fit to run, but I let people choose from different options.
Sky:16:20 -People's Republic of China
Sky:16:21 Your polls exclude more setups than they actually contain
Linkcat:16:21 Nobody has actually reached out to me with a setup except for one person with a rough draft.
Linkcat:16:22 Anyone is free to volunteer with a new or old setup.
Sky:16:22 You should write that somewhere.
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If anyone had roles they liked that they would like to see in future setups, please do comment on them. I'll try my best to include them.
For legal reasons, I do not actually believe Linkcat is a fascist. (His overwhelming desire to "make things fair" suggests that he might, instead, be a communist.)
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Would like to see Cecilia, Sin Mal, and Emma again, and any roles that didn't get shown off this game.
Note the date.
(https://gyazo.com/0e9d2cdd0672d41b35ba8dfea9f09742.png)
(https://gyazo.com/affbf9c4bc8dbd55f7a6d7f560d8948e.png)
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Let me be clear... I was 90% in on it being kae by mid-day today... I missed all EOD and the closing posts until catching up just now --- and when I saw it end with Coffee getting lynched I thought to myself "awww nuts, lost two in a row now as town where the game went to f3". Then the lovely pink Honkai Core text in the post about Coffee's death!
8-)
Cool to be right on my final night alive in-game, and so wrong in deadpad! hehe
Also, good thing nobody saw me PM-ing because I tend to PM a lot about my role ... moreso as town even. I do it close-ish to deadlines some too. While sometimes seeing a /who ends up being a "right" lead I really think it is wrong just as often as it would be right, no? I have it open a lot near EOD's because I like to know who might be putting together posts etc. while I'm trying to keep up with rapid-posting rates at our EOD's.
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I was very paranoid of deep wolfs, because after the previous game, I'm living in a world of WIFOM. So if things are exactly like they seem, it throws me off.
On the topic of who I think played the best in this game, I think Coffee (because he played really well and only got found by PoE) and TorB (even though he tunneled a lot in this game, but other than that, solid plays).
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I figured I'd post this. The only new thing here would be everyone's preferred roles. (I was given access to this host sheet, and suggested minor things for the setup before it was initially sent for review.)
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/445771452248096771/740265673241919538/unknown.png)
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Thanks for getting me NKed N0.
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Alright, so here's the deal. The closed mafia by me won the vote, but the setup I'm working on has expanded in scope and grown more complicated than I first thought, and I need more time to develop and balance it. I don't want to host a game that I'm not sure will go well, so I'm postponing it to Mafia 76. That leaves us with two options tied at 7 votes. (https://gyazo.com/cb93d275d2b5e681179400eb87ffadd3) As you can see from the screenshot, I intentionally did not place a vote on any of the top options since I would participate regardless of which option won. The tie does have to be broken somehow, so I will place my vote on the Fate Egg setup, which will be hosted by rob. Signups will begin today.
As for Who's Online, it's split pretty evenly between those who want some sort of restriction and those who don't. Because it is a tool that can be used to gather information outside of the thread itself, and it's main function of seeing who is online can be done in the thread and on player profiles, Who's Online will be unrestricted during the more fun-oriented setups such as the Fate Egg mafia, but will be banned during more serious setups. Obviously this will be difficult to enforce, but I'll put my faith in the honor system.
The data in the timezone poll will not be used to force hosts to set the deadline within certain times, but it will be used as a helpful reference when making that decision.
And finally, congratulations to TheonlyrealBeef for winning the best player poll! You definitely deserve it for your performance this game.
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Only one smart voter :sigh: on to next one we go!
blarg: Linkcat,TheonlyrealBeef,shockcannon,PlayerOa,iancudorinmarian,worldwideweb3,MasterWalks,andretimpa,dawn to dusk,kaempfer13,Submachine,killsdazombies,Coffeeditto,rob77dp,DoubleCapitals,Calindu,Naii_the_Baf,moehrpi,iancudorianmarian