Elements 1.4

[Rutarete]

Yeah, Life is more of a growth element.

Because of what, two cards that actually are/cause growth?

[Drake_XIV]

In terms of growth, Fire is probably a more plausible candidate.

But we're straying quite a bit, aren't we?

[rob77dp]

Spoiler for So large I spoiler'ed out of kindness:

There have been many debates on the quantity and effects of cards for a while....
Honestly, I would like to see more cards in general, by more as in double or triple the current count. 
1.) I personally think each element needs it own personal spin on each core area of the game that many still have missing areas:
1x perm defense (salvanger, protect artifact)
1x perm control (steal, defrag, etc)
1x alternative damage (poison, spell, SoV, etc)
1x counter to alternative damage (purify, reflect, etc)
1x creature quanta gain (pests, flies, ray of light, etc)
1x spell quanta gain (nova)
1x spell damage source (explosive gas, fire bolt, etc)
1x AOE creature control (thunderstorm, pandora, etc)
1x target creature control (chaos seed, reverse time, etc)
1x heal form (heal, divinity, purify, etc)
2x shield types (life, light, death element examples)
1x multi-use spell (purify, acceleration, reverse time)
1x cross cross synergy card for each element combination, be it active ability or obvious synergy (Sundial, GoP + Nightmare, leaf dragon)

Until this is addressed, a big part of random encounters is simply what elements were selected, especially in mono or dual combos.  I've posted in past accounts, many examples of mono decks that were simply unable to be beat (except by rng) by any mono deck of a specific element.  Until then this game remains completely unbalanced.  These core areas need addressed.

The examples above don't have to individual cards, for example, purify meets the heal, multiuse, and the counter to poison. 

Each element's card respective cards should stay true to the element.  Life, should remain the master of heal, no one should have any question the best element for healing is life.  No one should have bigger damaging cards out of the gate than Fire.  A good spell for fire, might be fuel, in which sacrificing a creature to a fire might offer some healing effect, similar to cremation.   Respect to certain cards by ability should remain, for example, protect artifact is in effect the ultimate protection for perms, however lots of creative and less effective perm control can exist for example, time might do a time seal where the perm card has no effect but can't be targeted or removed from play for 2 turns.

The natural meta game radically shifts, and I know some people in the forums would threaten to quit but many, many more have already quit over this issues.

(Refer to yellow within spoiler)
Completely unbalanced is WAY WAY over the top, Keeps.  'Incomplete' could accurately be applied and debated but "completely unbalanced" is 100% wrong.

Somewhere in this giant string of 1.4 comments zanz mentions cards are likely coming too.  I'm hanging my hat on that for the time being in regards to this aspect of Elements.

[Raptor6789]

This debate about new cards first v. upgrading the old system reminds me of Pokemon. I'm sure we can all agree that both changes would be nice, but our opinions vary on where and when the changes should be made. Well, Pokemon has a bunch of new Pokemon each generation, though its focus still is on the tried and true Pokemon battling. Sure, there have been a few major changes to the actual battling system as well (new steel and dark types, physical/special split, double battles, etc.), but the sheer number of Pokemon is one of the main things I like about the series. As competitive Pokemon shows, the addition of new cards in EtG may be beneficial - each card will find its special niche, and new cards may actually increase the number of effective synergies that exist, some of which may bring new life to outdated cards. I think bringing the card count up to a more healthy number should alleviate several of the problems that exist with the current system. For example, low card usage is in part because of the limited number of synergies and viable cards that actually exist.

Spoiler for Hidden:

Possibly some vanilla cards get abilities, but you only get that ability randomly- for example, cockatrice gets a 1/10 chance to gain "petrification" whenever it's played, and there are "levels" of upgrades to increase the chances of the creature getting that ability, but paid for with something other than electrum.

For example, for every 25 levels an AI has rounded down, you gain a 50% chance to gain a "token" when you defeat it (so a level 25 AI would give you a 50% chance to get a token, a level 50 AI would give you a token automatically, and a level 75 AI would give you a token and a 50% chance to get a token.) Tokens can be spent giving minor upgrades to individual cards with a level system (1, 2, or 3 tokens to raise a level, depending on the card and level) and the higher the level of a card, the higher the chance of that creature getting an additional effect (for example, paying one electrum to raise cockatrice one level adds a 10% chance for it to gain the petrification ability, for a 1/5 chance of gaining petrification when the card is played.)

Additional effects could be stuff that doesn't take a lot of time to program (like simple attack buffs or chances to evade targeting) but it would give people another reason to keep playing, and if additional effects are restricted to un-activatable effects, the time investment for zanzarino (hopefully) wouldn't be as big a deal.

This idea is pretty interesting and possibly a good alternative or supplement to adding new cards. Allowing people to add small changes to their cards creates attachment and specialization. Even with the existing size of the card pool, the possibilities seem to increase substantially when one considers all of the new variations of single cards and synergies that come along. Additionally, a system that unlocks cards only once the player has met certain criteria is also a good idea.

Well most, if not all of us here have been playing Elements for a while, and we probably have extensive card pools. That might be we some of us are asking for a change to the fundamentals. Now, imagine what it might seem like for a new player. In my opinion, adding more cards or variations to existing cards deepens the discovery process - newer information is introduced over a longer period of time, and people may end up becoming more attached to the game.

[Marsu]

Raptor got it right. New cards are the way to go, not only because the new cards themselves add new deck options, new counters, a different meta, and so on, but also because they add synergies that will make some underused cards suddenly become viable and some overused cards become counterable more easily.

There is also one more advantage of adding new cards instead of buffing underused (or even actually UP) cards: UP cards actually increase a player's enjoyment here. Limited deck building rules can force players to build decks around them which they are not used to and thus face a new challenge. NPC's that include those cards are way more fun to play against, even if they make up for the weakness of a certain UP card in another way. Players will sometimes chose to play UP cards simply for fun! "Beat the Highscore" might not have existed if all cards and synergies were perfectly balanced and equally strong.

Don't make the same mistake Blizzard did with WoW addons and Diablo 3. Having options is one thing that makes games fun. Don't remove options because you don't see a reason to chose them, let the players chose for themselves, and you might be in for a surprise.

Add a new card instead.

[shileka]

3 months of not playing elements and i come back to see this news

i love it, as long as there's no lame energy system atached like so many other card games with a map

[dragonsdemesne]

I agree with Marsu and Raptor.  Underused or underpowered cards aren't necessarily a bad thing, and they won't always remain so; sometimes, the meta shifts to favour those cards. 

As an example, I'll use Magic: the Gathering.  There was a card released back in about 1995 called 'Flash'.  It was a terrible card.  It let you play a creature on your opponent's turn, for basically (somewhat simplified) the same cost, and if you didn't pay, the creature just immediately died.

Nobody used the card.  It was useless in tournament play.  It was useless in casual play.  It had no theme.  It had absolutely nothing going for it.  It was one of the most worthless rares in the set.  If you opened a pack and got it for your rare, you swore.  Then, years later, another card was printed.  It was a creature called 'Protean Hulk'.  It wasn't that great on its own either, though it did have some use in casual play, just by virtue of being a large creature.  It was somewhat overcosted for its attack/defense (wel, power/toughness, but analogous to att/def in elements) but it had the ability that if it died, you could go search your deck for some cheap creatures and put them into play.  (totaling cost <=6)

Suddenly, people remembered Flash.  They used Flash on Protean Hulk.  They didn't bother paying the rest of the cost; they just let it die.  Then they got to search their decks for a bunch of cheap creatures and put them into play right away, on like turn 2, instead of turn 7 or more.  (hulk cost 7, so would normally take at least that long, barring nova/immolation equivalents)  They would pick a bunch of creatures that in combination, could instantly win the game, right then and there.  Then they filled the rest of their deck with draw power, mana acceleration (Magic's equivalent of nova, upped towers, etc), and the like, to increase the odds of getting the combo.

Flash was the star of the tournament scene.  People were literally building decks with TTWs of like 1.5, and nothing else could compete.  Everyone used the Hulk Flash deck.  They ended up putting Flash on the restricted list, which meant you could only use one of it in your deck.  It was now in an elite list of a few dozen cards out of over ten thousand ingame cards as one of the most broken cards of all time.

Moral of the story; today's utter crap could be tomorrow's meta mvp.

Of course, this also doesn't preclude the fact that sometimes underpowered cards can simply be fun.  Who hasn't had fun with a bone wall/schrodinger cat deck, or pandemonium voodoo dolls, or made some ridiculous trio or quartet that relies on getting a 3 or 4 card combo that only happens like 1% of the time, but when it does, it's absolutely hilarious.  I once made a CATapult deck, for example, where I used auburn nymphs to buff a schrodinger's cat until it had enough hp to catapult and kill the opponent in one turn.  It took something like 15 games in pvp2 before I finally got a win, but man was it awesome when it finally won :p

[Higurashi]

Bit of an issue with the current map: I built a Grabbow straight from my Darkness starter and went to beat a Seraph deck that had 50 HP. I won a Rage Elixir as my first card. Yeah, the upgraded one. I think if decks have upgrades, they need to be hard enough to warrant the chance to win one. 50 HP is way too little no matter the deck or other stats.

Another problem connected to this is that decks like these often have many copies of one card and are smaller than 30 cards. That means very high chance of spinning those cards (i.e. Rage Elixir in this case). I could farm that AI and essentially never lose.

[Gandora]

Bit of an issue with the current map: I built a Grabbow straight from my Darkness starter and went to beat a Seraph deck that had 50 HP. I won a Rage Elixir as my first card. Yeah, the upgraded one. I think if decks have upgrades, they need to be hard enough to warrant the chance to win one. 50 HP is way too little no matter the deck or other stats.

Another problem connected to this is that decks like these often have many copies of one card and are smaller than 30 cards. That means very high chance of spinning those cards (i.e. Rage Elixir in this case). I could farm that AI and essentially never lose.

I have to agree with this. I also won some upped cards, starting with a darkness deck. I went around the different elements and searched some my deck was good against and give a special spin. I think upped cards should be (much) harder to obtain.

[Drake_XIV]

Maybe for these decks, just have it automatically downgrade for the spin?

[Raptor6789]

Or maybe only unlock the chance to win an upgraded version of a certain card once the player has spent money to upgrade that card him/herself. Allowing the chance for upgrades on very high level opponents should still exist, though.

[TheAccuso]

Heya zanz, i was hoping to get the chance to navigate through the map freely(jumping areas) in the trainer, of course not in the actual game, will this be considered? Ty