Poll

How do you think this card should be nerfed?

Just remove the card
3 (3.4%)
Should be normal poison, and he should cost less
1 (1.1%)
Should be normal poison, and he should start with one attack
3 (3.4%)
I have my own idea how to nerf him
2 (2.3%)
The card is fine! Stop acting like it's overpowered!
78 (89.7%)

Total Members Voted: 87

Poll

How do you think this card should be nerfed?

The card is perfect. It should NOT be nerfed
The effect should be removed when it dies
Give it  1|2 1|3 attack|HP and remove its affect when it dies
It Should be like other Scorpions
others (please specify)

Poll

what should be done

keep it as is
28 (93.3%)
change it to the normal poison
1 (3.3%)
Get rid of it
1 (3.3%)
Other (Specify in post)
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 30

*Author

Offline BeefSupreme

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087503#msg1087503
« Reply #36 on: July 17, 2013, 11:01:30 am »
If a scorpion stings you and you kill it with a broomstick, does the "effect" of the poison go away?

Same logic applies here. The only difference is that in here, the "poison" will continue to rack up as you play cards. And that's totally fine because that's t
Wrong analogy.
If a scorpion stings you and you kill it with a broomstick, does it keep injecting venom into you?
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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087506#msg1087506
« Reply #37 on: July 17, 2013, 11:21:18 am »
If a scorpion stings you and you kill it with a broomstick, does the "effect" of the poison go away?

Same logic applies here. The only difference is that in here, the "poison" will continue to rack up as you play cards. And that's totally fine because that's t
Wrong analogy.
If a scorpion stings you and you kill it with a broomstick, does it keep injecting venom into you?

The idea is that the venom spreads the more you move, and get your blood pumping, hence Neurotoxin. To play a card, you would have to move your arm, spreading it faster. The idea is how much of your body has been envenomed, not necessarily the volume primarily injected, though subsequent stings would add to the mix.
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Offline BeefSupreme

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087510#msg1087510
« Reply #38 on: July 17, 2013, 11:29:05 am »
If a scorpion stings you and you kill it with a broomstick, does the "effect" of the poison go away?

Same logic applies here. The only difference is that in here, the "poison" will continue to rack up as you play cards. And that's totally fine because that's t
Wrong analogy.
If a scorpion stings you and you kill it with a broomstick, does it keep injecting venom into you?

The idea is that the venom spreads the more you move, and get your blood pumping, hence Neurotoxin. To play a card, you would have to move your arm, spreading it faster. The idea is how much of your body has been envenomed, not necessarily the volume primarily injected, though subsequent stings would add to the mix.
First of all, if I got stung by a scorpion, the LAST thing I'd be doing is playing cards.

Secondly, if you get stung by a scorpion, moving doesn't ADD venom, so it doesn't make sense for a dead scorpion to be adding venom to you.
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Offline Dm

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087515#msg1087515
« Reply #39 on: July 17, 2013, 11:57:32 am »
This is a special venom that adds in quantity as you move.

I dun see anything wrong with that.

It's a fantasy game.

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087537#msg1087537
« Reply #40 on: July 17, 2013, 01:14:00 pm »
If you're stung by a Scorpion that has a type of venom that is a kind of neurotoxin, at any movement, it propagates in your body through your blood. If you decide to stop moving at all, you won't propagate the neurotoxin and it stays as it is, doing little damage to your body. If you try to move (=play cards) and struggle against death, going toward an hospital or calling an ambulance and stuff (=try to win the game) the Neurotoxin will propagate more, but, if you're fast enough and the ambulance/hospital good enough (=good cards played without activating more than necessary) you could succeed to exterminate the poison inside of you (=win).

Offline Rutarete

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087565#msg1087565
« Reply #41 on: July 17, 2013, 05:45:02 pm »
Secondly, if you get stung by a scorpion, moving doesn't ADD venom, so it doesn't make sense for a dead scorpion to be adding venom to you.
That's because there is no dead scorpion adding poison. Otherwise we would have a card like Scorpion's Ghost: Poisons opponent 2 on death :P

Maybe think of the Neurotoxin poison counter as representative of the effect on your body, or how much pain you're in, or something similar. The more actions taken create more pain, like trying to move a broken arm.
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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087573#msg1087573
« Reply #42 on: July 17, 2013, 06:25:39 pm »
I definitely voted leave it as is.  It is a unique card, but has a very limited set of uses. 

You can often outrush the Neurotoxin effect, or heal to offset it. 

It also makes you play smarter once you are infected...do you really need to keep setting down pillars later in the game?  Does playing a creature that will damage my opponent (for example) 5 every turn make it worthwhile to play and take one more poison?  Etc.

Getting a Dune Scorpion, powered up, early in the game can spell disaster for slow-moving decks, but all decks have their weaknesses. 

Offline Marsu

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1087582#msg1087582
« Reply #43 on: July 17, 2013, 07:09:50 pm »
The fact that this is actually discussed...

Does a creature regain its initial health when the purple Nymph that antimattered it dies?

Otherwise /sign @ Dm.

Offline IreCreeper

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1091143#msg1091143
« Reply #44 on: August 07, 2013, 01:54:57 am »
If a scorpion stings you and you kill it with a broomstick, does the "effect" of the poison go away?

Same logic applies here. The only difference is that in here, the "poison" will continue to rack up as you play cards. And that's totally fine because that's.. (message ends suddenly)
As much as I hate this card, the above quote makes perfect sense.
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Offline Pyrodinium

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1091148#msg1091148
« Reply #45 on: August 07, 2013, 03:06:07 am »
Leave it as is.

There's a lot of cards that can counter Dune Scorpion. Purify can totally counter its effects. Besides, it needs to use another card to deliver it's sting.

I like the discussion on the effects of the poison but I really think the Elements world has different laws than ours. For starters we have the Fire Nymph who can kill monsters by making them REALLY angry and the Otyugh who can eat Ruby Dragons with ease but will choke on small Voodoo Dolls. Oh, and don't get me started on  :entropy

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1091149#msg1091149
« Reply #46 on: August 07, 2013, 03:20:44 am »
I like the discussion on the effects of the poison but I really think the Elements world has different laws than ours. For starters we have the Fire Nymph who can kill monsters by making them REALLY angry and the Otyugh who can eat Ruby Dragons with ease but will choke on small Voodoo Dolls. Oh, and don't get me started on  :entropy

This point is completely valid. In reality, though, I feel that Dune Scorpion is actually one of the most thematically solid cards in the game when compared to the real world (as Dm and others implied).
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Offline Pyrodinium

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Re: Dune Scorpion| Dune Scorpion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=41429.msg1091150#msg1091150
« Reply #47 on: August 07, 2013, 03:33:15 am »
I like the discussion on the effects of the poison but I really think the Elements world has different laws than ours. For starters we have the Fire Nymph who can kill monsters by making them REALLY angry and the Otyugh who can eat Ruby Dragons with ease but will choke on small Voodoo Dolls. Oh, and don't get me started on  :entropy

This point is completely valid. In reality, though, I feel that Dune Scorpion is actually one of the most thematically solid cards in the game when compared to the real world (as Dm and others implied).

I don't want to be the party pooper so just for fun, I'll give my 2  :electrum on the venom.

Yes, the toxin can kill you even if the animal in question is already dead. It's its own entity once it's in your bloodstream.

 :death or "vanilla" toxin is like nature's hemotoxic venom. The venom breaks down its victim's tissues and blood vessels but the damage is localized. If some vital organs gets digested or blood loss is too much, then you're good as dead.

 :time toxin on the other hand is like neurotoxic venom. The venom attacks the nerves and cause paralysis so the damaged is systemic. If your respiratory system is paralyzed, then you're good as dead.

Now why does cards like Deadly Poison enhances Dune Scorps toxin? My theory is that by weakening the blood vessels, the hemotoxic venom prevents the body from raising antibodies to fight the more deadly neurotoxin.

 

anything
blarg: