*Author

Offline OldTreesTopic starter

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10297
  • Reputation Power: 114
  • OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.
  • I was available for questions.
  • Awards: Brawl #2 Winner - Team FireTeam Card Design Winner
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg502140#msg502140
« Reply #492 on: May 22, 2012, 03:13:36 am »
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,40504.0.html

I need your opinion on this
Anger: If a creature on your side dies, Mother Bear attacks one more time per death on its next attack

I have 2 concerns with this mechanic.
1) It can act like "All sparks gain +5|+0" (Too much effect for the cost)
2) I am not sure anger channeled into retribution is a Life theme.

I would modify the effect so the Mother Bear will not notice natural or sacrificial deaths (Spark, Virus, Catapult, Immolation). Perhaps by requiring the opponent to have killed the creature.

Since this is a threat it will be balanced when the opponent is ambivalent about whether to trigger or avoid the threat. An extra attack per Mother Bear is potent. I think it is close enough for now (assuming the above change). Playtesting would be required to double check.
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

Offline NonexistentFlower

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Country: sg
  • Reputation Power: 1
  • NonexistentFlower is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • Oh, and, I'm a boy.
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg502207#msg502207
« Reply #493 on: May 22, 2012, 09:28:34 am »
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,40463.0.html

What is your opinion on this (Regarding its balance etc.)?
Group hug. It has become one word, grouphug, and we are pronouncing it groo-fug. Because there's a bloody pee aitch in the middle of it.

Offline waterzx

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 730
  • Reputation Power: 11
  • waterzx is taking their first peeks out of the Antlion's burrow.waterzx is taking their first peeks out of the Antlion's burrow.
  • New to Elements
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 3rd Birthday Cake
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg502287#msg502287
« Reply #494 on: May 22, 2012, 03:12:08 pm »
What are your thoughts on combining physical and spell damage in one card ?

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,40367.0.html

Offline OldTreesTopic starter

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10297
  • Reputation Power: 114
  • OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.
  • I was available for questions.
  • Awards: Brawl #2 Winner - Team FireTeam Card Design Winner
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg502329#msg502329
« Reply #495 on: May 22, 2012, 05:07:07 pm »
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,40463.0.html

What is your opinion on this (Regarding its balance etc.)?
1) Elite Immortal gains +1 attack, +1 hp tier for +1 cost. +2 comes with a similar cost increase (See Phase Dragon).
2) A 5|4 Elite Immortal is worth around 6 :aether + 1 upgrade + 1 card (I always forget which immaterial creature is the UP one)
~= 7.5 :underworld + 1 card unupped.
3) Ghostly flame costs 2 :aether + Duo + delayed 1 turn + 1 card + 1 :fire per turn.
~= 4 :underworld + 1 card + 1 :underworld per turn
It is probably balanced considering it is a rush card and such decks lose if the game goes on too long.
4) This card cannot be used without paying the activation cost. This is suboptimal. Ideally a duo creature could be played either as a mono vanilla creature or as a duo skilled creature.
5) Are you sure the name fits? I usually think Will o Wisps as creatures with weak natural attacks that lure strangers into dangerous areas. Nothing like the Charger stats of this creature.
6) What benefit do you see this providing for Elements?

What are your thoughts on combining physical and spell damage in one card ?

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,40367.0.html
My initial thoughts were it sounded like a clunky mechanic for partial partial momentum. However the use of Ice Bolt surprised me. In some ways this is a better design for Fahrenheit.

3 :fire + Weapon + 1 card + Stock  :fire -> 4 + Physical 2/3 Firebolt
6 :fire + 1 card + Stock Fire -> 4 + Physical 2/3 Firebolt
2 :fire + 1 card + Stock Fire -> Physical 2/3 Firebolt
4 :fire + 1 card + Stock Fire -> Physical Firebolt
A)[Here I estimated physical to spell damage as +17-33% of the non stock quanta cost. The new estimate of 1 card = 2 quanta was used.]
5-6 :fire + 1 card + Stock Fire -> Firebolt
5-6 :water + 1 card + Stock Water -> Ice Bolt
8-9 :water + 1 card + Stock Water -> 3 Physical + Ice Bolt
5-6 :water + Weapon + 1 card + Stock Water -> 3 Physical + Ice Bolt

I would recommend the attack not chage when upgraded but rather the cost drop. 5-6 :water | 3-5 :water
« Last Edit: May 22, 2012, 07:23:19 pm by OldTrees »
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

Offline The_Mormegil

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 2262
  • Country: it
  • Reputation Power: 32
  • The_Mormegil is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.The_Mormegil is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.The_Mormegil is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.The_Mormegil is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.The_Mormegil is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.The_Mormegil is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.
  • Intelligence is overrated.
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 10th Birthday CakeWar #5 Winner - Team AetherTeam PvP WinnerNew Slot Winner - FamiliarDeadly Sin Winner - GluttonyFirst Budosei of BudokanWinner of Revive the Archive
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg502345#msg502345
« Reply #496 on: May 22, 2012, 05:56:41 pm »
(I always forget which immaterial creature is the UP one)

Immortal is UP. Think of it this way: immaterial is good if you're going to stall - it's not worth the cost increase if you want to rush. Stalls need card space more than they need fast creatures. Phase Dragon packs double the punch for the same card space. Phase Dragon >> Immortal, which is barely usable even if dragon is banned.
[18:21:43] jmdt: elements is just math over top of a GUI
Kakerlake: I believe that there is no God as in something that can think by itself and does stuff that sounds way OP.

Offline Rutarete

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6505
  • Country: us
  • Reputation Power: 72
  • Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Rutarete frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.
  • Creativity should be nurtured.
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 6th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 5th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 4th Birthday CakeRuby Shard of DeckbuildingSlice of Elements 3rd Birthday Cake
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg503648#msg503648
« Reply #497 on: May 25, 2012, 01:58:35 pm »
Do you think a small amount (say, about 5) of specialized cards would benefit ETG? A medium amount? What's the limit before it would be detrimental?
It is the greatest mystery of all...
Rutarete: Roo tah reh teh
[22:50] <Jyi> meaning gets lost in translation... even in the same language.
My Decks

Offline OldTreesTopic starter

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10297
  • Reputation Power: 114
  • OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.
  • I was available for questions.
  • Awards: Brawl #2 Winner - Team FireTeam Card Design Winner
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg503750#msg503750
« Reply #498 on: May 25, 2012, 05:26:30 pm »
Do you think a small amount (say, about 5) of specialized cards would benefit ETG? A medium amount? What's the limit before it would be detrimental?
Imagine a card pool of 10 cards. We can use lines to represent the synergies and combos the cards create. The more lines exist, the more opportunities exist for decks. Specialized cards are cards with fewer connections than average. In this manner being specialized is a con in design proportional to the degree of specialization. Since specialized is relative to the average, no more than 50% of cards can be specialized. The metagame is benefited more by higher average connections per card. Adding cards with fewer connections lowers the average and thus reduces this benefit.

However the specialization is not the only factor that provides benefit. There are other beneficial factors that a card can have that compensate for this detriment. This can lead to specialized cards that are a net benefit.

As a general guideline: A card should either be able to be used by itself or ( have at least 3 distinct/separate combos and have a benefit worth the degree of specialization ) .
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

Offline Zaealix

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 524
  • Reputation Power: 6
  • Zaealix is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • Former Gravity apprentice-currently Water aligned.
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 4th Birthday Cake
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg504314#msg504314
« Reply #499 on: May 26, 2012, 06:00:50 pm »
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned before...But something I thought of was the idea of a  :life creature with stats of X|X, where X was the number of creatures on your side of the field.
However, in attempts to balance it, I didn't like what I saw...Basically, it starts out a 1|1, since it counts itself, but the cost wouldn't be balanced well with the effect. I'd like to have balanced it at 4 :life or maybe 5 :life, but the fact that it's ability is an unreliable booster, makes it hard to know just how to balance the thing...Any ideas?
*Water Guild*

Offline furballdn

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 7573
  • Reputation Power: 86
  • furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.furballdn is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.
  • Facetious trollnotmod
  • Awards: Epic 3 Card Winner - Clockwork GolemBest Recruiter of FriendsBest JournalistBest Chat PainterBattle - Slayer of The Great ChimeraBest Crafted Relic of Other
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg504345#msg504345
« Reply #500 on: May 26, 2012, 08:11:20 pm »
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned before...But something I thought of was the idea of a  :life creature with stats of X|X, where X was the number of creatures on your side of the field.
However, in attempts to balance it, I didn't like what I saw...Basically, it starts out a 1|1, since it counts itself, but the cost wouldn't be balanced well with the effect. I'd like to have balanced it at 4 :life or maybe 5 :life, but the fact that it's ability is an unreliable booster, makes it hard to know just how to balance the thing...Any ideas?
Fractal, mitosis, and aflatoxin will make that very hard to balance.

Offline OldTreesTopic starter

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10297
  • Reputation Power: 114
  • OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.
  • I was available for questions.
  • Awards: Brawl #2 Winner - Team FireTeam Card Design Winner
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg504366#msg504366
« Reply #501 on: May 26, 2012, 09:52:13 pm »
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned before...But something I thought of was the idea of a  :life creature with stats of X|X, where X was the number of creatures on your side of the field.
However, in attempts to balance it, I didn't like what I saw...Basically, it starts out a 1|1, since it counts itself, but the cost wouldn't be balanced well with the effect. I'd like to have balanced it at 4 :life or maybe 5 :life, but the fact that it's ability is an unreliable booster, makes it hard to know just how to balance the thing...Any ideas?
This has been suggested before a few times. (usually as an Aether creature strangely enough)

In its current form it would always be used with either Mitosis, Fractal, Alfatoxin or another spawner.

However it would be balanced based on the average stats over the course of a game. (Playtesting should be done to double check my estimates)
I would assume that it would quickly get to at least a 7|7 in most games. 7 :life +/- 2 :life might be a reasonable cost.

A playtest with it and fractal photon | damselflies would be wise.
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

Offline russianspy1234

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1842
  • Country: ru
  • Reputation Power: 26
  • russianspy1234 is a proud Wyrm taking wing for the first time.russianspy1234 is a proud Wyrm taking wing for the first time.russianspy1234 is a proud Wyrm taking wing for the first time.russianspy1234 is a proud Wyrm taking wing for the first time.russianspy1234 is a proud Wyrm taking wing for the first time.
  • Crucible Bombarder
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 14th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 12th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 11th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 9th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 8th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 7th Birthday CakeArt Competition - Meta Master Card Design Competition: New Year's ResolutionsSlice of Elements 6th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 5th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 4th Birthday CakeSlice of Elementshifted 3rd Birthday Cake -Fire-DIAC Ray of SunshineSlice of Elements 3rd Birthday Cake
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg505843#msg505843
« Reply #502 on: May 30, 2012, 04:26:47 pm »
What do you think would be a good balance for using HP instead of quanta for an ability activation (in this case growth)  I valued it at 5 HP for an activation, thus making 5 HP equal to 1  :life/ :earth 
card in question
My Portfolio
Brawl 7 is occurring.  Come follow along.

Offline OldTreesTopic starter

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10297
  • Reputation Power: 114
  • OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.
  • I was available for questions.
  • Awards: Brawl #2 Winner - Team FireTeam Card Design Winner
Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg505850#msg505850
« Reply #503 on: May 30, 2012, 04:53:09 pm »
What do you think would be a good balance for using HP instead of quanta for an ability activation (in this case growth)  I valued it at 5 HP for an activation, thus making 5 HP equal to 1  :life/ :earth 
card in question
Usually a crude approximation can be made by reversing an existing effect. Heal is 3 :life + 1 card for 20 hp. If 1 card is worth ~2 quanta then 1 elemental quanta -> 4hp healing (assuming linear value for healing). However this is a crude estimate. 5hp is close enough.

The next test is ambivalence. Would informed players be ambivalent about using this card compared to its peer?
4 :death for 2|2  :death:Growth
vs
4 :death for 2|2 5hp:Growth
Saves quanta, gains resistance to denial but also gains a vulnerability to rush. I am ambivalent.

So it appears that the 5hp activation cost is equivalent to 1quanta mono activation cost. (Note that Lava Golem has a duo activation cost.)
Ghoul could probably get an additional +1 attack on its base stats.
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

 

anything
blarg: