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Offline DemagogTopic starter

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Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47068#msg47068
« on: April 02, 2010, 04:34:22 am »
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So I wanted to figure out a way to use the control provided via aflatoxin with another element's (or more) alchemy ability to see how well it would work. That's what I have so far, but I haven't gotten it to work well yet. The main problem is keeping your nymphs alive. I think this might be solved by removing one of each tower and putting in four or five aether towers. And if you hadn't figured it out, once you fill their board with aflatoxin, you save up your air quanta until you can kill them with unstable gas.

My original intent was to use aflatoxin with vultures and the unupgraded thorn shield (the upgraded version doesn't poison one damage creatures). I figured the 75% poison rate would allow some to live, while killing only some at a time. That didn't work too well because they usually all died.

So I settled on unstable gas because that's only other option I could think of to deal damage using nymphs. If anyone can think of a different combination (it doesn't have to be only nymphs), that would be useful. Or if you can think of a way to tweak this version (such as adding aether towers), that would be equally useful. Oh, and I was testing it on AI 5.

Have fun :-p

Offline jmizzle7

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Re: Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47081#msg47081
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2010, 05:32:09 am »
Sorry for the off-topicness, but is there something wrong with Planplan's deck list app? None of the pictures generated from it have shown for me today.

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Re: Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47091#msg47091
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2010, 06:37:20 am »
Sorry for the off-topicness, but is there something wrong with Planplan's deck list app? None of the pictures generated from it have shown for me today.
Staying offtopic for a min... I believe SG said she took them off to test someting.  Not entirely sure what it was/is but hopefully they'll be back soon.

Offline jmizzle7

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Re: Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47094#msg47094
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2010, 06:57:32 am »
So it seems. Oh well... I like the idea for Aflatoxin/Gas/Condor, but it sounds a bit too slow.

Offline Jangoo

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Re: Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47159#msg47159
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2010, 11:59:08 am »

Hey Demagog, have you tried to achieve your deck with the Nymphomania-build yet?

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,2630.0.html

I fiddled with Nymph-decks against FGs (and some pvp) for quite a while and my general conclusions for genuine Nymph-decks are so far, that

1. They are pretty slow.
One should really only count on bringing out max. 3 Nymphs in the course of the game. A clear choice about the main focus of the deck has to be made, which will result in trying to cast a specific nymph first at all times while the 2nd and maybe 3rd nymph are just support for the mid and late game.
I suppose you wanted to go down the Tears -> N.Queen -> countless Death/Wind-Nymphs route here? For me, this looked good on paper but once again was just too slow mostly, and counting on direct Nymph-cast always proved much better.
(Made me really wonder about N.Queens place in the game since unless she is just planned as a fun but uncritical addition to a stall deck maybe, she is just one instance too far away from real action ...)

2. They are pretty fragile.
A genuine Nymph-deck has only Nymphs and while at times they are quite sturdy (light + time) hardly any deck will have problems countering that single critter of yours. Like you said, with no dragons e.g. around to divert the attention away from the Nymph, it will mostly die/mutate/rewind the instant it comes into play. This is a loss you just cannot afford since even recasting it after rewind is too expensive in terms of quants and turns ... You only have so many chances to cast a Nymph and if you do, it better be working out for (almost) sure.

3. They are pretty ascetic.
You need quite a bit of stuff to make those Nymph-casts happen in a reliable way and there is hardly any room in the deck for additional extras and luxury such as weapons, shields, additional critters etc.
Building the basic Nymph-strat has to be more or less all the deck needs to work. Using only few extras is a must. Also, more than two types of Nymphs is just unrealistic.


I find, the Nymphomania-build answers pretty well (as well as it gets?) to all those demands by which I dont mean the specific Nymph-combo but more the speed, the included protection for those two Nymphs you will cast and of course extra quants (for exploding gas e.g.) ... Supernovas make it happen and give you a nice 3 applications for both Nymphs from scratch as well as the option to choose freely from your list of extras.

Swapping out the Ameth.- and Obsi. Towers for any Towers you want (Bone and Wind e.g.) will make the bigger number of Towers your prime focus and the smaller number your support.

The Quantum.Ts, the 5th Nymphtears and maybe the 4th Quint isn't really needed for the deck to work well, so that would give you about 4-6 cards to bring in those Permafrosts and anything else you may want. However, increasing the number of each non-water Tower by one has proven pretty nice to make it run more smoothly for me ... water quants will be superfluous after the first nymph-cast, so your Perma is almost guaranteed to be payed for.



Offline DemagogTopic starter

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Re: Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47259#msg47259
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2010, 04:04:54 pm »
Actually the problem with this deck wasn't speed, I could usually get a cell on their side by the time I had lost 1/4 of my life, and permafrost usually keeps the damage to a minimum. The only problem was keeping the nymphs alive.

And I never make nymph queens. They aren't too useful. It only takes one gray nymph to fill their side, and I think two or three wind nymphs would be all you need, and you don't really need them until late in the game.

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Re: Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47482#msg47482
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2010, 11:28:37 pm »
Throw in some condors to go with the aflatoxin + unstable gas combo.
I don't recommend nymph decks, they are fun to play but they require the perfect draw.

Offline DemagogTopic starter

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Re: Theoretical Deck: Toxic Gas https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4768.msg47498#msg47498
« Reply #7 on: April 03, 2010, 12:31:49 am »
Condors slow it down. And it only takes five gases to kill (usually).

 

blarg: