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Offline EmeraldTigerTopic starter

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Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg281527#msg281527
« on: March 02, 2011, 06:25:47 am »
NAME:
Essence Charm
ELEMENT:
Water
COST:
4 :water
TYPE:
Permanent
ATK|HP:
TEXT:
Every creature in your possession genererates 1 quanta of its element each turn.  Asorb :water :water each turn.
NAME:
Essence Charm
ELEMENT:
Water
COST:
4 :water
TYPE:
Permanent
ATK|HP:
TEXT:
Every creature in your possession genererates 1 quanta of its element each turn.  Asorb  :water each turn
ART:
EmeraldTiger
IDEA:
The CCC Team
NOTES:
Malignant cells generate 0 quanta. This generates quanta at the end of the turn, based on what creatures are on the field at the time of the artefact's turn. Frozen/delayed creatures will still generate quanta.     Adrenaline-ed creatures will only produce quanta once per turn. This is purely based on number of creatures, NOT based on when creatures attack.    Delay, frozen, adrenaline etc. do not affect the quanta generation from this.
SERIES:
Artifacts http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,22082.0.html
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Offline Ekki

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg281995#msg281995
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2011, 10:57:05 pm »
Like how it looks, but I would like to know a bit of the theme behind this card... Why it doesn't affect water creatures? Why it absorbs  :water? What's an Essence Charm? (I'm pretty short on vocabulary  :-[)
I'm still looking for a way to exploit it (if it is OP) or to use it effectively (if it is a balanced idea). If you can give me any clue, it will be easier :D

Offline EmeraldTigerTopic starter

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282037#msg282037
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2011, 12:05:09 am »
OldTrees and doublecross can answer these questions.
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Offline doublecross

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282047#msg282047
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2011, 12:17:41 am »
Well, first of all, this is an artefact that deals with the essence or aura of creatures.

This taps into both the spiritual power of water and the essence of individual creatures to generate quanta. It is powered by water, and thus it would not make sense for it to generate water.


This card is not OP, because it essentially is an entropic bond of quanta generation, but with an associated upkeep cost.

1 HP is considered more valuable than 1 quanta, and where 5 creatures with a bond would be 5 HP, 5 creatures with this card would be 5 quanta - 2 :water, obviously a much less valuable result.

This card fills a gap, allowing creatures to generate quanta, without creating an ash-eater clone within each element.

[This card was originally my idea, and OldTrees and EmeraldTiger helped me balance it and make it a card].

Additional Notes: [EmeraldTiger, please add these]

This generates quanta at the end of the turn, based on what creatures are on the field at the time of the artefact's turn. Frozen/delayed creatures will still generate quanta.     Adrenaline-ed creatures will only produce quanta once per turn.
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Offline EmeraldTigerTopic starter

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282180#msg282180
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2011, 03:08:27 am »
@OldTrees and doublecross, If we don't get any more feedback when do want me to submit this?
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Offline doublecross

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282185#msg282185
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2011, 03:15:07 am »
Whenever you want to. However, are we convinced that it might be too UP?

If so, we could drop the non-water requirement...
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Offline Ekki

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282189#msg282189
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2011, 03:16:54 am »
Whenever you want to. However, are we convinced that it might be too UP?

If so, we could drop the non-water requirement...
I see it as UP.
What strategy would make this accesible? Or useful? Would it be OP without the drain?
I'm pretty much clueless, as this seem to need some thought for a good deck based off it to appear. Maybe I'm just looking inside the box and need some help to look outside.

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282192#msg282192
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2011, 03:18:14 am »
Fate eggs with mitosis comes to mind.

Also, skeletons powering a mitosis bone-dragon farm.


Actually, this just goes really, really well with mitosis.
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Offline EmeraldTigerTopic starter

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282197#msg282197
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2011, 03:31:03 am »
Maybe we should allow this to affect water too.

Side note: Can we make this the 2nd card in a series of artifacts?
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Offline Ekki

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282200#msg282200
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2011, 03:36:30 am »
Fate eggs with mitosis comes to mind.
Well, that's a Trio, and maybe too slow, specially if you have to keep up the  :water production.

Also, skeletons powering a mitosis bone-dragon farm.
Sounds good, but again, a trio.

Actually, this just goes really, really well with mitosis.
That sounds better.
So a  :water/ :life duo with  :water mark and Mitosis'd Frogs/Dragons comes to mind. But if you have to be worried about keeping up the quanta cost of the Charm, you'll have problems... You'll need Water Pillars/Pendulums to keep it up, and then you'll clog up your deck, and make it too slow. You'll need :life for the early-game, so you'll have to add too many  :life pillars/pends. Not to mention that mitosis is slow...

Actually, the problem behind this card is that it needs a good niche.
Mono-water won't work. Well, it's written in the card.
Any other Mono with water splash won't work. Upkeep.
Balanced duo. You'll need some spawning to make it worth, and  :life is the only good auto-spawner (Fractal sucks in mono-aether), not to mention you won't be able to add more  :water creatures, just this.
Going Trio/Quartet is too unstable, and we all know that, but it's the best niche for this card.
Rainbows don't use lots of creatures from the same element, unless you are being based over Fractal (I doubt that). Rainbows also generally don't have a constant  :water quanta production, as to keep more than 2-3 of this at the same time in the mid-late game (early game, keeping 1 is too much).

Well, I think the upkeep would enlarge the niche to some balanced duos and duos with splash... Maybe it would even be workable in some rainbows...
Just my 2 :electrum

EDIT:
Maybe we should allow this to affect water too.

Side note: Can we make this the 2nd card in a series of artifacts?
Sounds good, and also solve most of its problems.

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282203#msg282203
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2011, 03:39:39 am »
I hate how it affects the opponent. After all, you paid the price, and even the upkeep, while they get more rewards.
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Offline doublecross

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Re: Essence Charm | Essence Charm https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21959.msg282204#msg282204
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2011, 03:41:52 am »
Ok, assuming we drop the no-water rule (which I am skeptical about for thematic reasons), what cost/absorb would make it not too UP?

Same question assuming we keep the no-water rule.


Finally, I would like to re-state my belief that cards do not need to be very strong to be added. Not every new card needs to lead to EPIC NEW STRATEGIES. In fact, I would like it if 50% or so of new cards were in the weaker 50% of cards, but almost every new card appears to be in the top 50%.    We could stand some new UP cards, and the beauty of this is that it doesn't destabilize the game if we do it wrong.  Worst case scenario-only stupid people (and AI) use it.


EDIT: This only helps you. Sorry that wasn't clear.

It is like an empathetic bond that gives quanta not healing.
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anything
blarg: