Demonic Pact | Demonic Covenant

[rickerd]

I think it's a bad idea because if you use one you'll never deck because you play it and it wil be at the bottom of your deck.

That's the idea, really.

Looks really OP to me, maybe it can go back to the hand

[The_Mormegil]

I think it's a bad idea because if you use one you'll never deck because you play it and it wil be at the bottom of your deck.

That's the idea, really.

Looks really OP to me, maybe it can go back to the hand

Do you also think Eternity + Photon is OP? Read the rest of the thread, there are a few intresting posts that might change your idea.

[mildlyfrightenedboy]

I think it's a bad idea because if you use one you'll never deck because you play it and it wil be at the bottom of your deck.

That's the idea, really.

Looks really OP to me, maybe it can go back to the hand

...
So you would basically be playing a reusable pillar, but you also take a huge amount of damage, along with being unable to remove the card from your hand?  Thanks, but no thanks.  It is an anti-deckout card and that isn't changing.

The anti-deckout part was not only intentional, but basically the main aspect of the card.  It would probably be even MORE broken if it returned to your hand (paying HP for as many pillars you want in an element with FOUR healing cards) and it would completely destroy how I intended it to be used.

The fact that it prevents you from decking isn't some great realization that was stumbled upon.  Let's read the quote from the post TWO posts before yours:

Mmm...nice anti-deck out. Best of all, it is elementless and free! I could definitely see one of these in a sanctuary stall deck. Obviously that's problematic, so maybe change the 5 and 8 damage to gaining 5 and 8 poison counters.

[rickerd]

I think it's a bad idea because if you use one you'll never deck because you play it and it wil be at the bottom of your deck.

That's the idea, really.

Looks really OP to me, maybe it can go back to the hand

Do you also think Eternity + Photon is OP? Read the rest of the thread, there are a few intresting posts that might change your idea.

No not really because erernity is destroyable!

I think it's a bad idea because if you use one you'll never deck because you play it and it wil be at the bottom of your deck.

That's the idea, really.

Looks really OP to me, maybe it can go back to the hand

...
So you would basically be playing a reusable pillar, but you also take a huge amount of damage, along with being unable to remove the card from your hand?  Thanks, but no thanks.  It is an anti-deckout card and that isn't changing.

The anti-deckout part was not only intentional, but basically the main aspect of the card.  It would probably be even MORE broken if it returned to your hand (paying HP for as many pillars you want in an element with FOUR healing cards) and it would completely destroy how I intended it to be used.

The fact that it prevents you from decking isn't some great realization that was stumbled upon.  Let's read the quote from the post TWO posts before yours:

Mmm...nice anti-deck out. Best of all, it is elementless and free! I could definitely see one of these in a sanctuary stall deck. Obviously that's problematic, so maybe change the 5 and 8 damage to gaining 5 and 8 poison counters.

I understand your Idea but with a huge amount of vampires, the deck would be really good because vamps heal the dammage and you can't deck out.

[TheManuz]

I seriously cannot undestand why it's not a permanent.
I know that even shard of sacrifice is a spell that has an effect that spans over 2 turns, but... i don't like it!
I really dislike uncounterable things.
Make it a permanent, make it with an activated ability that can be used multiple times, so you can spend all excess quanta you want, and even if your opponent destroys it, you still gained a lot of turns.
Also, Darkness often has excess thanks to Devourers, and since the new quanta cap, most of it is unused.

Something like:

: Demonic Pact
Lose X HP. Put an Obsidian Pillar on the bottom of the deck. Can be used multiple times per turn.

[rickerd]

I seriously cannot undestand why it's not a permanent.
I know that even shard of sacrifice is a spell that has an effect that spans over 2 turns, but... i don't like it!
I really dislike uncounterable things.
Make it a permanent, make it with an activated ability that can be used multiple times, so you can spend all excess quanta you want, and even if your opponent destroys it, you still gained a lot of turns.
Also, Darkness often has excess thanks to Devourers, and since the new quanta cap, most of it is unused.

Something like:

: Demonic Pact
Lose X HP. Put an Obsidian Pillar on the bottom of the deck. Can be used multiple times per turn.

I agree

[The_Mormegil]

Destroy methods of healing through CC and PC, or kill it without decking him. If you dislike uncounterable things what about Quinted Elite Charger? Or Protected Eternity? What about using Shard of Void to counter this anti/deckout method? Guess what, it works...

[TheManuz]

Destroy methods of healing through CC and PC, or kill it without decking him. If you dislike uncounterable things what about Quinted Elite Charger? Or Protected Eternity? What about using Shard of Void to counter this anti/deckout method? Guess what, it works...

Quinted Elite Charger and Protected Eternity are 2 cards combo.
This is a single uncounterable card, not a combo.

EDIT: i know that Shard of Void can kill an opponent that uses this card. Even simple damage can kill an opponent that uses this card. By this logic, even a full field of momentumed immortal creatures is counterable by killing the opponent. But these are indirect counters. I was trying to say that this card cannot be directly countered.

However, that was only my opinion, it's not law. I don't like it being a spell for the reasons i told, that's all.

[The_Mormegil]

Destroy methods of healing through CC and PC, or kill it without decking him. If you dislike uncounterable things what about Quinted Elite Charger? Or Protected Eternity? What about using Shard of Void to counter this anti/deckout method? Guess what, it works...

Quinted Elite Charger and Protected Eternity are 2 cards combo.
This is a single uncounterable card, not a combo.

EDIT: i know that Shard of Void can kill an opponent that uses this card. Even simple damage can kill an opponent that uses this card. By this logic, even a full field of momentumed immortal creatures is counterable by killing the opponent. But these are indirect counters. I was trying to say that this card cannot be directly countered.

However, that was only my opinion, it's not law. I don't like it being a spell for the reasons i told, that's all.

Well, this is a two card combo too by your parameters, since you need reliable healing or you will "deck out" once you are forced to use this too many times. Of course, that's damage, but the concept is the same, is it not?

[TheManuz]

Well, this is a two card combo too by your parameters, since you need reliable healing or you will "deck out" once you are forced to use this too many times. Of course, that's damage, but the concept is the same, is it not?

Not really. Even if i play it without healing, you cannot counter it. Then i will die after some turns (or maybe i kill my opponent before), but you cannot counter it.
The "counterability" doesn't depend from the second card, like for Quintessence + Elite Charger and Eternity + Protect artifact.

Eternity alone = a direct counter exists (Quintessence or PC)
Elite charger alone = a direct counter exists (Lobotomizer or CC)
This card alone = no direct counter (of course there are indirect counters).
So, no, it's not a 2 cards combo.

Anyway, it's an opinion of mine, and these things are matter of personal tastes.

[OldTrees]

Counters not direct counters are the minimum criteria. People need to learn to recognize indirect counters like SoV in this case.

[omegareaper7]

I seriously cannot undestand why it's not a permanent.
I know that even shard of sacrifice is a spell that has an effect that spans over 2 turns, but... i don't like it!
I really dislike uncounterable things.
Make it a permanent, make it with an activated ability that can be used multiple times, so you can spend all excess quanta you want, and even if your opponent destroys it, you still gained a lot of turns.
Also, Darkness often has excess thanks to Devourers, and since the new quanta cap, most of it is unused.

Something like:

: Demonic Pact
Lose X HP. Put an Obsidian Pillar on the bottom of the deck. Can be used multiple times per turn.

I agree

Pa'd eternity + 3 time pillars and photon, never deck. 7 hp is fine for a price, and not all dark decks use vampires.