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Offline OdinVanguardTopic starter

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Splinterling Hive | Elite Splinterling Hive https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003244#msg1003244
« on: September 27, 2012, 07:40:01 pm »
NAME:
Splinterling Hive
ELEMENT:
Other
COST:
3
TYPE:
Permanent
ATK|HP:

TEXT:
Hive: Create an egg of the appropriate type when a non-other type permanent you own is destroyed.
NAME:
Elite Splinterling Hive
ELEMENT:
Other
COST:
3
TYPE:
Permanent
ATK|HP:

TEXT:
Hive: Create an elite egg of the appropriate type when a non-other type permanent you own is destroyed.

ART:
-Will make art soon
IDEA:
OdinVanguard
-Special thanks to "whatifidogetcaught" and "ARATHINOSIS" for their feedback in pre-smithy
NOTES:
Generates Splinterling Eggs or Elite Splinterling Eggs based on what type of permanent is destroyed.

The goal is to add a soft anti-Permanent and anti-Pillar control card, with a focus on being anti-Pillar control

There are 3 egg types:
-Schism ( :earth :fire :darkness :death )
-Aurora ( :air :water :light :life )
-Nexus ( :gravity :aether :entropy :time )

Each egg hatches into a splintering of the appropriate type
Spoiler for Schism Splinterling:

Spoiler for Schism Egg:

others will be added once they are finished
Spoiler for Aurora Splintering:

Spoiler for Aurora Egg:

Spoiler for Nexus Splinterling:

SERIES:






There will be a formal series once all are finished. For now they will be put below

Spoiler for Schism Splinterling:
NAME:
Schism Splinterling
ELEMENT:
Earth
COST:
2 :earth
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
2|1
TEXT:
Splinter: Spawn 2 eggs if killed.
Schism: Produces 2 :earth , :fire , :darkness , or :death each turn.
NAME:
Elite Schism Splinterling
ELEMENT:
Earth
COST:
2 :earth
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
3|1
TEXT:
Splinter: Spawn 2 eggs if killed.
Schism: Produces 2 :earth , :fire , :darkness , or :death each turn.

ART:
OdinVanguard
IDEA:
OdinVanguard
-Special thanks to "whatifidogetcaught" and "ARATHINOSIS" for pre-smithy feedback
NOTES:
The idea behind this creature itself is to provide a creature that:

1) is resistant to CC

and...

2) acts as a form of multi-color quanta production that is more focused than Q. Pillar and nova and produces slightly more than a standard pillar or single production source.

This creature evolves from the egg of the same type.
Spoiler for Schism Egg:

Spoiler for Splinterling Hive:


It could be created for bazar as a standalone, but the primary goal is to have it evolve from eggs created by Splinterling Hives, as a form of soft anti-PC

There are 3 types of splintering and splintering eggs:
-Schism ( :earth :fire :darkness :death )
-Aurora ( :air :water :light :life )
-Nexus ( :gravity :aether :entropy :time )

SERIES:







Spoiler for Schism Egg:
NAME:
Splinterling Egg
ELEMENT:
Earth
COST:
1 :earth
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
0|1
TEXT:
1, Hatch:
Become a Schism Splinterling
NAME:
Elite Schism Egg
ELEMENT:
Earth
COST:
1 :earth
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
0|1
TEXT:
1, Hatch:
Become an Elite Schism Splinterling

ART:
OdinVanguard
IDEA:
OdinVanguard
-Special thanks to "whatifidogetcaught" and "ARATHINOSIS" for help in pre-smithy stage
NOTES:
This egg is spawned by either a Schism Splinterling or a splintering hive. Not available for sale / collection on its own.
One of 3 egg types:
-Schism ( :earth :fire :darkness :death )
-Aurora ( :air :water :light :life )
-Nexus ( :gravity :aether :entropy :time )
Art for others will follow later.
SERIES:






Spoiler for Aurora Splinterling:
NAME:
Schism Splinterling
ELEMENT:
Air
COST:
2 :air
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
1|1
TEXT:
Splinter: Spawn 2 eggs if killed.
Schism: Produces 2 randomly seected :air , :water , :light , or :life each turn.
NAME:
Elite Aurora Splinterling
ELEMENT:
Earth
COST:
2 :air
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
1|2
TEXT:
Splinter: Spawn 2 eggs if killed.
Schism: Produces 2 randomly seected :air , :water , :light , or :life each turn.

ART:
OdinVanguard
IDEA:
OdinVanguard
-Special thanks to "whatifidogetcaught" and "ARATHINOSIS" for pre-smithy feedback
NOTES:
The idea behind this creature itself is to provide a creature that:

1) is resistant to CC

and...

2) acts as a form of multi-color quanta production that is more focused than Q. Pillar and nova and produces slightly more than a standard pillar or single production source.

This creature evolves from the egg of the same type.

It could be created for bazar as a standalone, but the primary goal is to have it evolve from eggs created by Splinterling Hives, as a form of soft anti-PC

There are 3 types of splintering and splintering eggs:
-Schism ( :earth :fire :darkness :death )
-Aurora ( :air :water :light :life )
-Nexus ( :gravity :aether :entropy :time )

SERIES:







Spoiler for Aurora Egg:
NAME:
Aurora Egg
ELEMENT:
Life
COST:
:life
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
0|1
TEXT:
1, Hatch:
Become an Aurora Splinterling
NAME:
Elite Aurora Egg
ELEMENT:
Life
COST:
:life
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
0|1
TEXT:
1, Hatch:
Become an Elite Aurora Splinterling

ART:
OdinVanguard
IDEA:
OdinVanguard,
-Thanks to ARATHINOSIS and whatifidogetcaught for pre-smithy balancing and design input
NOTES:
One of the three quartet based Splinterling eggs.
-Schism :earth :fire :darkness :death
-Aurora :air :water :light :life
-Nexus :gravity :time :entropy :aether
SERIES:







Spoiler for Nexus Splinterling:
NAME:
Nexus Splinterling
ELEMENT:
Gravity
COST:
3 :gravity
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
0|3
TEXT:
Splinter: Spawn 2 eggs if killed.
Nexus: Produce 2 randomly selected :gravity , :time , :aether , or :entropy each turn
NAME:
Elite Nexus SPlinterling
ELEMENT:
Gravity
COST:
3 :gravity
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
0|5
TEXT:
Splinter: Spawn 2 eggs if killed.
Nexus: Produce 2 randomly selected :gravity , :time , :aether , or :entropy each turn

ART:
OdinVanguard
IDEA:
OdinVanguard
-Special thanks to ARATHINOSIS and whatifidoget caught for feedback in pre-smithy phase
NOTES:
One of the 3 splintering types
-Schism: :earth :fire :darkness :death
-Aurora: :air :water :light :life
-Nexus: :gravity :time :aether :entropy

A deviation from the other two types, this splinterling has not attack to start with but has a relatively high hp. Coupled with the splitting, this should make them extremely difficult to kill.
May need extra balancing.

SERIES:



« Last Edit: October 03, 2012, 06:01:59 am by OdinVanguard »
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
kill -9 `ps l | awk '{print $2" "$3" "$9}' | grep "Z" | awk '{printf("%s ",$2)}'`
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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003272#msg1003272
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2012, 10:02:10 pm »
-Schism ( :earth :fire :darkness :death )
-Aurora ( :air :water :light :life )
-Nexus ( :gravity :aether :entropy :time )
Why this division rather than any of the other possible divisions?
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Offline OdinVanguardTopic starter

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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003286#msg1003286
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2012, 11:11:45 pm »
-Schism ( :earth :fire :darkness :death )
-Aurora ( :air :water :light :life )
-Nexus ( :gravity :aether :entropy :time )
Why this division rather than any of the other possible divisions?
Schism was the first one I created and it fit the artworks mood best thematics wise, partly at the suggestion of "whatifidogetcaught". The aurora was chosen to be its polar opposite. Nexus filled in the remaining types...

I admit its somewhat arbitrary but I needed to start dividing somewhere.
Although allowing for a full range of combinations would be nice in principle, that would require 12-Choose-4 combinations (495 total)... short of suggesting a card code spawning algorithm and corresponding color shading generator with generic art, this just didn't seem feasible.

Game wise, I expect nexus will actually be the most useful of the triad though since it encompasses the four elements that currently lack creature based quanta generation.

In any event, all 3 variants are accessible if the Splinterling Hive is used.
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
kill -9 `ps l | awk '{print $2" "$3" "$9}' | grep "Z" | awk '{printf("%s ",$2)}'`
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Offline Elite arbiter

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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003289#msg1003289
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2012, 11:29:27 pm »
Well lets start with the most immediate effects on the meta, and not ones I think you're intending.

Schism Splintering: The new Minor Phoenix in Immorush decks. It eats up the other quanta if you've played so much as a single other immolate, and produces an average of 1 earth or fire quanta per turn.

Thinking about the consequences of the card, it would improve that archetype tremendously. Now instead of just replacing itself, the "Schism Phoenix" triples itself upon death. Oh, and it also generates 2 quanta per turn as a bonus, and in the quanta sources these decks love most. Any deck that would run Minor Phoenix would swap this card in for what is effectively an Other version of the card. And plus, you start getting quanta and damage multiplication through most elements. (Ex: Using Oty to eat this card, then next turn letting three more crop up, and utilizing the pseudo  :rainbow it generates itself to hatch the eggs.)


Thinking about it, this card is strictly better than Minor Phoenix in almost every feasible way. (It even costs less, because it refunds 2  :rainbow on the turn you play it, making it effectively a 2  :rainbow v a 2  :fire )

Maybe find a way to alter the card so it doesn't utterly overshadow our resident mythical bird of flame. But I imagine you want it to remain a damaging creature that is resistant to CC. The idea that comes to my mind right now is to change the "eggs" to having 1|1 stats, removing their hatch ability, and giving them the ability to generate 1 quanta of the chosen set (Ex:  :fire  :earth  :darkness  :death ). This way it is resistant but not terribly cost invulnerable to CC without mass CC, you keep the quanta generation, and you don't get pseudo-mitosis along with the other effects.

Offline whatifidogetcaught?

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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003296#msg1003296
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2012, 12:00:29 am »
I contributed. WOOT!

I would like to see Aurora and Nexus later on. Shouldn't this be a "Splinter" series?

I suggest Aurora should be in a nature, forest, lake setting.
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Offline OdinVanguardTopic starter

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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003316#msg1003316
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2012, 12:55:43 am »
Well lets start with the most immediate effects on the meta, and not ones I think you're intending.

Schism Splintering: The new Minor Phoenix in Immorush decks. It eats up the other quanta if you've played so much as a single other immolate, and produces an average of 1 earth or fire quanta per turn.

Thinking about the consequences of the card, it would improve that archetype tremendously. Now instead of just replacing itself, the "Schism Phoenix" triples itself upon death. Oh, and it also generates 2 quanta per turn as a bonus, and in the quanta sources these decks love most. Any deck that would run Minor Phoenix would swap this card in for what is effectively an Other version of the card. And plus, you start getting quanta and damage multiplication through most elements. (Ex: Using Oty to eat this card, then next turn letting three more crop up, and utilizing the pseudo  :rainbow it generates itself to hatch the eggs.)


Thinking about it, this card is strictly better than Minor Phoenix in almost every feasible way. (It even costs less, because it refunds 2  :rainbow on the turn you play it, making it effectively a 2  :rainbow v a 2  :fire )

Maybe find a way to alter the card so it doesn't utterly overshadow our resident mythical bird of flame. But I imagine you want it to remain a damaging creature that is resistant to CC. The idea that comes to my mind right now is to change the "eggs" to having 1|1 stats, removing their hatch ability, and giving them the ability to generate 1 quanta of the chosen set (Ex:  :fire  :earth  :darkness  :death ). This way it is resistant but not terribly cost invulnerable to CC without mass CC, you keep the quanta generation, and you don't get pseudo-mitosis along with the other effects.
If these can only be obtained from a hive though, you have to wait for the opponent to destroy one of your permanents... would that work out? It just means that only the hive itself would get added to the bazar / be collectible...

I could also drop the attack to 2 unupped and 3 upped.

Also, these are not "Strictly" better than pheonix since the eggs only have 1 hp as opposed to the 5 hp for ash. The eggs will thus be markedly more susceptible to CC (which I was hoping would help keep them from overshadowing pheonix... though you may be right that its still not quite enough).

Short of lightning and lobo, nothing can 1 shot ash. Even an elite oty needs a buff or a small snack before its ready to do so.

Eggs, on the other hand, will die if you look at em funny.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2012, 02:30:41 am by OdinVanguard »
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
kill -9 `ps l | awk '{print $2" "$3" "$9}' | grep "Z" | awk '{printf("%s ",$2)}'`
You might be a unix junky

Offline furballdn

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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003349#msg1003349
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2012, 03:27:17 am »
This scares me in terms of balance. 4 :rainbow for 4|1? You already saw how much people cried OP when Stolas merely had 2 atk, so now here is a creature that has a 1:1 ratio of attack/ :rainbow. Add to that it gives 2 quanta per turn, twice the amount (yes, I know that the quanta given might not be the one you want) that damsel gives. And, when it dies, it creates 3 eggs. In a single turn one of these provides quanta for 2 of the eggs and 8 more damage. Other creatures are extremely hard to balance for a reason.

Just consider this:
Hover over cards for details, click for permalink
Deck import code : [Select]
808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 808 80i 80i 80i 80i 80i 80i 8pu

Offline ZephyrPhantom

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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1003352#msg1003352
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2012, 03:32:21 am »
See Lizardman. Considering this has anti-CC and quantum generation>1 in addition to a base attack of three | four, this card is probably worth at least 7 or 8 quanta.

Offline OdinVanguardTopic starter

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Re: Splinterling Hive | Elite Splinterling Hive https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1004000#msg1004000
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2012, 03:22:38 pm »
Okay, reworked:
Splinterlings and eggs no longer have rainbow costs.
Schism Splinterling now 2|1 and 3|1 (down from 3|1 and 4|1) with 2 :earth cost for both.
Added Aurora Splinterling.
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
kill -9 `ps l | awk '{print $2" "$3" "$9}' | grep "Z" | awk '{printf("%s ",$2)}'`
You might be a unix junky

Offline Elite arbiter

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Re: Schism Splinterling | Elite Schism Splinterling https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1004032#msg1004032
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2012, 04:36:53 pm »
Snip
Also, these are not "Strictly" better than pheonix since the eggs only have 1 hp as opposed to the 5 hp for ash. The eggs will thus be markedly more susceptible to CC (which I was hoping would help keep them from overshadowing pheonix... though you may be right that its still not quite enough).

Short of lightning and lobo, nothing can 1 shot ash. Even an elite oty needs a buff or a small snack before its ready to do so.

Eggs, on the other hand, will die if you look at em funny.

That is a deceiving statement, because Lightning will 1-shot Ash, but since there are 3 separate eggs, you would need 3 lightning bolts to take out the 3 eggs. And if you do not take out 2 of them, you wind up with your opponent having more of them on the field than before.

We can simply look at 3 eggs on the field versus 1 ash, and see what is required to kill both. Lobotimize, a 6+ def oty, a Fire Bolt with over 10  :fire quanta, all get rid of ash in 1 hit, but require 3 to get rid of the eggs. Even the things that do not get rid of it in 1 hit like shockwave or owls eye, get rid of it in two. But you still need 3 of them to get rid of the 3 eggs. The only cc where this becomes an even trade is under 10 quanta frozen bolt and drain life. Which is unlikely at best.

There is literally no single target creature control in the game that will kill three eggs, even at 1 hp, more cost efficiently than 1 ash. Granted for some niche mass CC cards, it is more effective (notable examples being Firestorm and Thunderstorm). But this is hardly enough, triply so because this defense actually serves as a pseudo-mitosis if you fail to kill it rather than just regenerating itself up.

I know you changed it, just illustrating my point that despite the low hp they are actually less vulnerable to CC.

The changed version however looks far better in terms of balance. Ideally you'd have a death schism, a dark schism, and a fire schism, if you were planning to run this like pillars/pendulums. However of the types of quanta generating creatures already in the game aren't totally universal, so this would run along with the idea of not everything gets the same if any creature based quanta generation.

Generally I don't see any issues with balance of the card. It might even be UP in its current state, but it is to fuel trios and quads, so that would have to be looked at. The only thing of note to say is that the unupped is essentially strictly better than Antlion, and upped is almost in the same boat. However, this is Antlion we're talking about. The unupped version is the posterchild of UP.

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Re: Splinterling Hive | Elite Splinterling Hive https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=43732.msg1004574#msg1004574
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2012, 08:57:05 pm »
Nexus splinterling added. Once egg is finished I will move everything to separate threads and post a series.
Nexus version has no attack but relatively high hp (3 unupped, 5 upped) which will make them a good deal more difficult to kill.

This was largely a thematic choice since 3 of the 4 represented elements are known for having creatures with high hp or that are difficult to kill. Thus it made sense that the corresponding splinterling would also be the most difficult to kill.
-gravity has very high hp,
-aether has innate immaterial
-time has relatively high hp on many creatures, a creature that splits and a the ability to return creatures to hand if debuffed
« Last Edit: October 03, 2012, 06:07:33 am by OdinVanguard »
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
kill -9 `ps l | awk '{print $2" "$3" "$9}' | grep "Z" | awk '{printf("%s ",$2)}'`
You might be a unix junky

 

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