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Scaredgirl

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Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg217820#msg217820
« on: December 06, 2010, 04:12:18 am »
Our map has 160 hexes. Each of these hexes is either:

A) Controlled by one of the teams
B) Neutral

Teams start the event controlling a fixed number of hexes like their capital city, towns and Wonder. They can expand their Kingdom by moving around the map and capturing more hexes.

- If a player moves to a neutral hex, that hex becomes controlled by the element (or team) of that player.
- Even if the player leaves that hex, control stays.
- If a player from another team (non-ally) moves to that same hex, control goes to that team instead. In other words, they captured the hex from the other team.
- If that other team has a player in that hex, that player can defend the hex from attackers.


Rule of thumb:
If a hex has players from only one element, that hex is captured by that element.


Please post comments and ideas.

homoaddictus

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg217941#msg217941
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2010, 09:05:20 am »
How about making the player sit on the hex and defend it for a round before claiming that hex?

Offline Kuroaitou

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg217948#msg217948
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2010, 09:18:50 am »
How about making the player sit on the hex and defend it for a round before claiming that hex?
Not to deflate the concept addictus, but I don't like the idea of 'sit and conquer'. I say that more aggressive (or assertive) elements reap more hexagons by traveling all over the world, but also risk the chance of other elements from waltzing behind them and taking the hexagons (if you think about it, if a hexagon is neutral, who is there to really 'defend' it to begin with?).

The idea of defending a hex before claiming it (even when no one is on it) may also increase the # of turns before a true 'winner' is announced, which could make the first WoE a bit longer than needed...

Scaredgirl

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg217953#msg217953
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2010, 09:41:02 am »
How about making the player sit on the hex and defend it for a round before claiming that hex?
This was actually suggested earlier (maybe by you?). It's not a bad idea, but I don't think it's needed, mostly because of the reason explained by Kuro.

The way I see it, if you go to an area with an army, and there is nobody there, that area just became yours. I don't see why you would need to spend time to somehow "claim" it. The fact that your army is the only army there, is enough claiming imo.

But the number one reason against having people to spend a round to claim a hex is that it would make things more complex.

Daxx

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg217970#msg217970
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2010, 10:13:40 am »
I don't think "spending a round" in a place is strictly necessary, but I would like to see a "claim hex" action.

That allows people to capture hexes just as quickly as moving into them (as you can claim and then move in a single round), but it makes things easier on the organisers since they can see who is taking hexes just by looking at the list of actions rather than having to double check against the map. It would also mean that there would be measurably slightly fewer hexes switching sides each round, which would again reduce the workload for organisers.

It sort of makes sense from a flavour perspective, as it is the army consolidating its power in the area rather than marching straight through and it being like they weren't there at all.

Scaredgirl

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg217986#msg217986
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2010, 10:42:05 am »
I don't think "spending a round" in a place is strictly necessary, but I would like to see a "claim hex" action.

That allows people to capture hexes just as quickly as moving into them (as you can claim and then move in a single round), but it makes things easier on the organisers since they can see who is taking hexes just by looking at the list of actions rather than having to double check against the map. It would also mean that there would be measurably slightly fewer hexes switching sides each round, which would again reduce the workload for organisers.

It sort of makes sense from a flavour perspective, as it is the army consolidating its power in the area rather than marching straight through and it being like they weren't there at all.
Problem is, what happens if you use the action "claim hex", while I enter that same hex and attack you?

Updating the map might be more simple than you think. I'm not sure about how the final version of the map will be, but it would be relatively easy to have the map automatically change the "owner" depending on who is on the hex. It would be kind of a "smart" map. If the map sees a :darkness player on a neutral hex, that hex becomes :darkness controlled.

Daxx

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg217990#msg217990
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2010, 10:54:22 am »
Well, based on the way you have written the rules, that's actually impossible because movement always comes after other actions. So you claim the hex, and then someone else moves into it. There's no fight.

Offline Glitch

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg218050#msg218050
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2010, 02:14:00 pm »
Maybe I'm just a weirdo, but I always thought neutral hexes should remain neutral... permanently.

I mean, I imagine "capturing a hex" to be akin to building a city there in game, and that'd be a significant investment of time.

Scaredgirl

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg218121#msg218121
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2010, 05:25:58 pm »
Well, based on the way you have written the rules, that's actually impossible because movement always comes after other actions. So you claim the hex, and then someone else moves into it. There's no fight.
Yes, I guess you are right about that. Movement comes later, so it could in theory work so that you claim it before you get attacked. However that doesn't remove the problem of how to do this thing.

Our goal should be to let the players do as much work as possible. For example if something needs to be edited in a player Character Sheet, players themselves do that instead of having a dedicated WoE staff member do those tedious minor edits.

Problem with things like claiming a hex, is that players cannot do it by themselves. If we have that kind of action, we also need someone (staff member) to make that edit manually. This might not sound like a big deal, but when we have these happen multiple times each round, it's going to be very tedious work, and we might see organizers quit because of that. If we can get a system that is either..

A) Automatic
B) Players do it themselves

.. we should always use those. In this case, while I do think that  "army consolidating its power in the area" sounds very logical, it's also painful to organize. If you have a solution that uses either A or B, I'm interested in hearing it.


Maybe I'm just a weirdo, but I always thought neutral hexes should remain neutral... permanently.

I mean, I imagine "capturing a hex" to be akin to building a city there in game, and that'd be a significant investment of time.
Capturing a hex is a mechanic used in many many games. If you wanted to make it sense, you could think of it as sending peasants of your element to take control of the area and harvest resources (hexes generate revenue in WoE). And when someone else enters the hex, that someone else kills your peasants and sends in his own.

I don't know.. but that's how I think of it.

Malduk

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg218142#msg218142
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2010, 05:46:30 pm »
Well, territory can be tied to towns/forts (say 2-3 hexes per). Capture a fort, gain connected hexes. Thats your "automatic" way or capturing territory.
IMO, its weird someone can just walk around and claim random hex, then go away with all his army, and still "own" that hex.

Scaredgirl

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg218151#msg218151
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2010, 05:56:10 pm »
Well, territory can be tied to towns/forts (say 2-3 hexes per). Capture a fort, gain connected hexes. Thats your "automatic" way or capturing territory.
IMO, its weird someone can just walk around and claim random hex, then go away with all his army, and still "own" that hex.
I though about that a long time ago but discarded it. It's actually the system used by Civilization, where I stole lots of mechanics. Civilization also has is so that if an enemy army is occupying a square where you would get resources, you don't get those resources. What I love about that, is that it makes the siege more realistic. When you surround a city, it loses resources and starts to die.

I agree that it makes lot of sense, but the problem is that I think we would need a lot more cities to do it like that, and I'm not sure if I want to keep adding that many cities. I'll have to think about it.

Thanks for the idea. This could very well be the solution we are looking for.

Malduk

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg218155#msg218155
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2010, 06:01:13 pm »
Yes, too many cities is a problem. Thats why we have - forts;D

Say they are a bit easier to siege then actual towns (wall easier to break, NPC garrison is easier etc). Gives some practice for attackers before they go for the real thing.
As for placing them on the map, they dont have to have special buildings inside. They can as well be treated as Flag-points on the map.

 

blarg: