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Offline Xinef

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg235230#msg235230
« Reply #36 on: December 29, 2010, 02:05:05 am »
wow, This is incredibly well thought out and looks like it will work flawlessly. The only problem is, we won't have that many organizers with specific jobs like "hex ownership organizer" and "alliance organizer". IIRC, there are only 3 categories of organizers with jobs that specific: lore, movers, and map coder. Unfortunately, the character managers will be in charge of every job listed up there, excluding the moving part.
Yes, I noticed that one of the major problems of WoE will be the things that need to be done in the correct order by different organizer, since it's quite impossible to make sure that in 24 hours all of the organizers will do their job, and in correct order.

That's why I guess those are in fact tasks that might have to be performed by the same organizer, and because he will be overloaded with a lot of work we need to design really simple, quick-to-do, and error prone rules.

It would be best if some of these tasks can be automated with either a spreadsheet or some script operating on the map. For example only the first and last step cannot be easily automated, since the first one requires input from players, while the last one is about informing players. The fourth step requires information about alliances as input. All the remaining steps can be easily automated, as long as the map is available in some computer-friendly format too (for example an XML representation of the map, with information who owns each hex, which players are there and what their element is).
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Offline TimerClock14

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg235249#msg235249
« Reply #37 on: December 29, 2010, 02:41:43 am »
*snip*

That's why I guess those are in fact tasks that might have to be performed by the same organizer, and because he will be overloaded with a lot of work we need to design really simple, quick-to-do, and error prone rules.
indeed

Quote
It would be best if some of these tasks can be automated with either a spreadsheet or some script operating on the map. For example only the first and last step cannot be easily automated, since the first one requires input from players, while the last one is about informing players. The fourth step requires information about alliances as input. All the remaining steps can be easily automated, as long as the map is available in some computer-friendly format too (for example an XML representation of the map, with information who owns each hex, which players are there and what their element is).
This would be nice, but it all boils down to what planplan can and can't do (or has the time for, for that matter)
As for the XML representation, I think you are misunderstanding what XML is. In a nutshell, XML doesn't actually do anything it just stores data. XML only becomes useful when an HTML document accesses it externally. It basically has the same value as a bbc table that you can't see.
But I understand the concept of what you mean. With this in mind, a spreadsheet would be more suitable.
PS: i'm in full support of the spreadsheet.
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Offline Xinef

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg235305#msg235305
« Reply #38 on: December 29, 2010, 04:45:51 am »
Yes, error proof :P

As for XML, I know quite a bit about it. In this case I suggested it simply because it is both human-readable and machine-readable.

For example, if planplan's map is only available as a graphic file generated by his software, it would be hard to automate anything, and some rule changes might require the map software to be modified.

On the other hand, if planplan's map software was able to generate both a graphic file and eg. an XML file, it would be possible to write simple scripts or programs that take such an XML file and for example find all the hexes where there are only players from one element, or calculate the number of hexes controlled by each element, or do anything else you want. A script could for example find all the hexes that need to change ownership and generate a new XML file with these changes applied.

Of course it doesn't have to be XML, it could be a spreadsheet data file or a custom format, as long as it is easy to generate and process.
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Offline TimerClock14

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg235315#msg235315
« Reply #39 on: December 29, 2010, 04:59:38 am »
Yes, error proof :P

As for XML, I know quite a bit about it. In this case I suggested it simply because it is both human-readable and machine-readable.

For example, if planplan's map is only available as a graphic file generated by his software, it would be hard to automate anything, and some rule changes might require the map software to be modified.

On the other hand, if planplan's map software was able to generate both a graphic file and eg. an XML file, it would be possible to write simple scripts or programs that take such an XML file and for example find all the hexes where there are only players from one element, or calculate the number of hexes controlled by each element, or do anything else you want. A script could for example find all the hexes that need to change ownership and generate a new XML file with these changes applied.

Of course it doesn't have to be XML, it could be a spreadsheet data file or a custom format, as long as it is easy to generate and process.
:O I never knew about this "XSLT" you speak of. I should look into it... But all in all, the ones with the final say in these kinds of decisions are Planplan and Scaredgirl.

On a side note, I feel like we are getting off topic here. We kind of went from hexes to map coding to XML. :P
We might want to continue this in the map coding topic.
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Offline Planplan

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg236933#msg236933
« Reply #40 on: December 31, 2010, 09:38:09 am »
SVG files are XML based. I'm aware of the XSLT solution, but, being more competent with PHP, I prefer to stick to it for the moment for generating.
That's just for clarification, but, as TimerClock14 said, better continue this in the dedicated area.

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Re: Capturing and controlling hexes https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17090.msg238774#msg238774
« Reply #41 on: January 02, 2011, 04:58:53 pm »
wow, This is incredibly well thought out and looks like it will work flawlessly. The only problem is, we won't have that many organizers with specific jobs like "hex ownership organizer" and "alliance organizer". IIRC, there are only 3 categories of organizers with jobs that specific: lore, movers, and map coder. Unfortunately, the character managers will be in charge of every job listed up there, excluding the moving part.
Yes, I noticed that one of the major problems of WoE will be the things that need to be done in the correct order by different organizer, since it's quite impossible to make sure that in 24 hours all of the organizers will do their job, and in correct order.
Gratz, you just found the #1 issue I have been trying to figure out. :)

Yes, that 24 hours updating period is the real challenge of WoE. Like you said, there are different steps we must do, and they must be done in correct order. It's going to be really painful.

Luckily Google Docs and it's collaborative features might have a pretty good solution for this. But we do probably need a system with plan B and plan C. If person A doesn't do his or her job in time, person B will do it. If both A and B are away, C will do it.

It's going to require perfect timing and lots of organizing, but I like the challenge :)

 

anything
blarg: