VAULT: Water

[Belligerence]

Welcome to your Vault team Water.

> LINK TO VAULT <

Do not give this link to anyone outside your team!

[ddevans96]

Reserved for important stuff regarding the vault.

[treebeard xiii]

guys when is vault work actually going to begin? time is of the essence

[ddevans96]

It would have started days ago if I didn't have a badly timed real life issue to take care of for the past three days. We'll have to work quickly, but we still have more than 24 hours, so we'll be fine.

[ddevans96]

Spoiler for Obsoleted Post:

Current Vault:

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5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i8 5i8 5i8 5i8 5ie 5ie 5ie 5ie 5ie 5ie 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5ol 5ol 5ol 5oo 5oo 5oo 5oo 8pr

Base: Air Duo [easy mod]

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4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 5c1 5c1 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i5 5i5 5ib 5ib 5ic 5ic 5ie 5ie 5ie 5ie 5if 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 8pp

Base: Waterbow [easy mod]

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52q 52q 52r 52r 52r 52r 8pp

Base: Death Duo

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5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i9 5i9 5ie 5ie 5ig 5ig 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5jm 5up 5up 5up 5ur 5ur 5v1 5v1 5v1 7gm 7gm 7gm 8pt

Base: Darkness Domin [medium mod]

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Deck 5

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Deck 6

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590 590 590 590 5f6 5f6 5io 5io 5og 5og 5on 5on 5on 5on 5on 5v1 61q 61q 61q 61q 61q 61q 8pp

Extras: 22/52
- Nymph Queen [All Decks]
- Graboid [Waterbow]
- Deflag [Waterbow]
- Fog, Shockwave [Air Duo, Waterbow]
- Nightmare [Darkness Domin, Waterbow]
- Lightning [Easy Splash, Waterbow]
[/quote]

[ddevans96]

Our Air duos are insanely good, so I'm locking that in, as well as a waterbow. Both are powerful and versatile, which are both crucial for War. What Death duo we use is still undecided, but either a poison build or a death nymph build will be good, so that's also locked in.

For the other decks, we need to make sure we have a solid stall (probably light or fire), and a dominator with heavy PC (either fire or darkness domin, unless we want to risk slipping BE into Nymphcord). Those are both essential to us. Our 6th deck will likely be one of an Aether Duo, an Earth Duo, or Nymphcord. We'll also have the cards to assemble a mono or a splash if need be (lightning, BB if we choose an earth duo, shockwave with no other air cards), so we should have 7 actual deck types to choose from at the start.

We need discussion on this ASAP. All discussion about the vault should be posted here now, to keep it in one place.

[Drake_XIV]

For Stall, I'd opt for Water | Earth instead, actually.  Trident really would help inhibit decks and we could have access to two stall-worthy shields, Titanium or Permafrost.  Along side that, we could pack a lot of control with Squid, Auburn Nymph, and maybe Warden.  All while being able to pack some healing with Stone Skins.

e.g.

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58o 58o 58o 58o 58o 58o 58o 58o 594 594 594 594 594 594 5aa 5aa 5aa 5aa 5aa 5aa 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i4 5i9 5i9 5i9 5ia 5ia 5ib 5ib 5ib 5ib 5ic 5ic 5ig 5ig 5ig 8pp

Still needs some balancing, but it's something, I guess.

As for domination, I go for Water | Darkness, as seen in the Deck thread.

[ddevans96]

Yeah, we'll almost certainly have either a darkness or fire domin in the vault, because we need PC. I'm leaning towards darkness, and then taking a firestall, while also taking dims to support Eva's deck, so we actually have two PC decks and two stalls, even though they overlap. Also considering we might bring Poison or Soras, and we'll definitely have Ice Bolts, we should be well off as far as shield evasion goes.

Our other options for stalls are a Sanc and Miracle build, and a Stone Skin build, similar to Drake's. My preference is Fire > Light > Aether > Earth, and there's of course other options for stalls, but I'd consider those our four most reliable.

I have added a darkness domin to the vault - if the rest of the team besides myself and Drake comes to a different decision regarding PC, let me know and I'll change it, because both darkness and fire create powerful and useful decks.


At this point, we have to decide what build we want to use for our death duo, if in fact we want one at all, two other decks, and the extra cards we'll have to fill out the vault. Right now, we have three of our best decks in the vault, but at this point there's many options we can choose. My preference is a Sora-based death build, a Aether duo similar to Eva's post, with Dims on the side if we want more stall from it, and a Fire or Light stall.

Also, if there's heavy disagreement on the types of decks and cards we already have in the vault, they can still be changed, but know that the cards we have in the vault right now allow for some of the most potent things we can do.

The base decks I have posted in this thread are just that - bases. Every round, we can, and need to, tailor these decks to a specific matchup. I'm tagging them as [easy mod] and [medium mod] to show the amount of flexibility we have.

Our waterbow can be modded by changing all the Pendulums to Pillars, changing the mark to a selected element, and then tweaking the other cards in the deck to work based off the mark. For example, we can change it to Earth to support Grabbies and Tridents, Death for Soras and Arsenics, Air for Shockwaves and Toads, and so on. Or we can choose not to change the mark and run it closer to the base build, which also works. It's an insanely versatile deck.

In the air deck, we can choose between Shockwaves and OE for direct control, three different shields, and Ice Bolt or Squids for freezing. It doesn't seem like much, but that's a lot of room for adaptation as well.

The darkness domin isn't quite as flexible - if we had more vault space, I'd take Dusk and Black Dragon to swap out, but I don't know if we'll have room for something like that. We can choose between our Water creatures, use more or less Nightmare, and that's basically it. But it's still an excellent deck.

[treebeard xiii]

personally i have always preferred firestall to light stall, but i also prefer fire usage in a domin particularly with water steamies tank hard if not stopped quickly and if I can choose pc defrags would win any day if pulvy is unavailable which it clearly is.

[EvaRia]

Going minimal here -

off colour deck skeletons analysis:

  Entropy (Nymphcord):

4x Discord (Required).
5-6 Pill/Pends
3-4 Antimatter
0-2 BE

12 card minimum investment for a very potentially powerful deck. I'd say it's very worth it.

  Death (Speed Poison)

3x Arsenic
4x Bonewall
6x Chrysaora
0-6x Poison

~13 card minimum investment for the best core. The issue with this is that it's not so powerful and the other cards are hard to splash, excluding arsenic. Going the full poison route only increases this investment. I'm hesitant to run this deck, since we don't have the hard CC to make bonewall actually as strong as it can be and it can take a lot of card slots.

  Gravity (Momentum)

5-6x Momentum
0-4x BH

Yeah, that's about it. We can go cute by snagging black holes etc. but with only 5 cards to secure ourselves a Dimbreaker deck I don't see why we shouldn't invest in the core. Momentum is also a fine splash in novabows so having 5-6 should never go wrong here.

  Earth (Trident)

A quick look at this shows me that any route we go here is really card heavy. It's going to be a 50/50 split either way and as far as denial decks go Nymphcord is just stronger. Our stall option isn't much better, with the Pill/Pend requirement taking up an insane amount of card slots. I don't like it, it's not even one of our strongest decks.

  (Spirit/Adrenaline)

I don't like this. The investment is for subpar cards and we can easily get better cards elsewhere. Our minimalistic approach maybe does this:

4-6 Forest Spirit
4-6 Pill/Pends

I do like at least 2 Spirits for the waterbow but the full duo doesn't seem great to me.

  Fire (SteamFlaggers)

This is awesome.

4x Deflagration
4-5x Steam Machine
2-5x Rage Potion
0-2x Fire Buckler
0-2x Rain of Fire

Throwing like 12 cards into this gives us a great domin. We can easily take two. I like this for one of our core options.

Light (Sancstall)

6x Sanctuary
2-4x Miracle
6x Icebolt

8 cards is a pretty light investment for a core potential light stall, especially compared to our earth duos. We can go deeper into it by taking pill/pends and NTing nymphs but we don't need to. The Icebolts are meh but they go well in this deck and are borderline in a lot of our other decks. It'll at least be always on colour and access to hard cc.

  (Misc. Air duos)

So much for so little.

3-4x Wings
2-3x Fog Shield
0-2x Longbow
2-6x Shockwave
0-3x Owl Eyes

We can literally make an air duo with 3 wings. And we have no reason not to. Awesome, and I would go fairly deep here.

  Time (Reverse Time)
4-6x Reverse Time
0-3x Eternity

Only reason to duo with time is to pick up RT. The synergy is not strong, but 4 is enough to maybe make a splash duo and can be thrown into our novabows. It's a very good metagame card so I can see us taking it. 4 cards is very little investment.

  Darkness (Nightmare)
4x Nightmare
2-4x Steal
0-2x Stiletto

This is another really cheap and potentially strong deck. I'd take at least one, and we can afford two.

  Aether (All the things)

I'm biased but I'd like to go deep into aether. They're just such a strong element and synergizes really well with water actually. This duo gives us so many power cards and versatility I don't see why we shouldn't take this as our main secondary.

Nymph's Tear Rush

12x Pend (Are we allowed this many?)
0-3x Quint

Pends will work in any aether duo so there's no reason not to go deep here. The quints would mainly be for this deck but they are really good on squids.

Lightning PUgon

4-6x Parallel Universe
4-6x Lightning

Parallel universe is the main investment here but PUgons is worth it IMO. It breaks a lot of stalls and our dragons don't die to opposing Lightnings. 4 is a good number for a lighter investment, but lightning is a deck on its own and can be used anywhere so there's no reason not to take 6.

Dim stalls

4-6x Dimensional shield

My favourite use of dim shield is to throw in 2-3 into a deck. It's just light enough of a card investment that running into opposing PC won't destroy you, but enough to win games against the decks it's relevant against.

Fractal decks

1-4x Fractal

I wouldn't mind having a couple of random fractals in the vault even without a dedicated fractal deck. It helps a lot of slower decks maintain advantage late game and breaks stalls wide open.

Other random utility cards I like to have:

0-3x Holy Flash
This card just rips death and darkness to shreds, which is plenty enough reason to run it. It's kind of a dick move, but I like having 3 in the vault.

That's my two cents.

[EvaRia]

Here's my specific recommendations for now:

Additions:

+4 Parallel Universe
+3 Dimensional Shield
+3 Quintessence
+2 Fractal
+12 Aether Pendulum

+2 Maxwell's Demon
+4 Discord
+3 Antimatter
+6 Entropy Pendulum

+4 Deflagration
+6 Rage Potion

+5 Momentum

+6 Sanctuary
+3 Miracle

+2 Ice Bolt
+8 Nymph's Tears
+10 Ice Dragon
+6 Arctic Squid
+8 Steam Machine

We'll see how that stacks up for now?

EDIT: Additions made.

[treebeard xiii]

Spoiler for Hidden:

Here's my specific recommendations for now:

Additions:

+4 Parallel Universe
+3 Dimensional Shield
+3 Quintessence
+2 Fractal
+12 Aether Pendulum

+2 Maxwell's Demon
+4 Discord
+3 Antimatter
+6 Entropy Pendulum

+4 Deflagration
+6 Rage Potion

+5 Momentum

+6 Sanctuary
+3 Miracle

+2 Ice Bolt
+8 Nymph's Tears
+10 Ice Dragon
+6 Arctic Squid
+8 Steam Machine

We'll see how that stacks up for now?

EDIT: Additions made.

I agree with some of these additions and disagree with others a quick run through of the cards i like:

• pu for obvious reasons nothing better than a copy of a beast to get you ahead of a faster deck
• dims i'm torn between have never liked the things but they are powerful
• fractal i like we can make some strong use of this beauty mass flayers and mass crawlers are great and with a slightly more complex poison deck mass soaras can really stack poison on someone
• ofc pends go hand in hand with fractal but without serious figures i can't tell whether this is too many or too little
• Discord is good in bows anytime but unless we're making entro water stall we don't have sufficient cover cards
• matter is another one i'm torn between yes its powerful if timed right but 3 just isn't enough if we wat to keep using them but i also don't feel its a card we need to invest in
• going with my opinion on matters pends are also debatable if we take matter then we have to take pends
• Deflag I have to say is a water must have goes well with steamies and can be played in bows best single use pc by far in my opinion
• rage pots not a choice pc unless fire duoing for me but another nice companion for steamies and can make crawlers a heavy but fragile hitter so taking these depends on our deck choices
• Momentum is another mixed opinion handy in bows and as a splash for shield breaking but is 5 a worthwhile investment? depends on the decks we want to use them in if only bows then 3 is probably enough if splash then we will need more
• sanc and miracle are shared if we chose water lightstall then they are must haves without a shadow of a doubt but if we choose a different stall only a couple of sancs are needed nice additions to bows to provide bh protection
• Squids are a must have for water it is one of our strogest cards we really should have 12 due to the number of decks that benfit from it
• drags ten is too many 8 should be enough i know it has lightning resillience but water nymphs may have less power but i rate them stronger than drags by far

theres my opinions on the additions any ones i don't comment on i agree with tham fully

for my disagreements:

• quints i have never seen the pull for them they don't have enough relevent uses in my opinion they are niche uses prolly just a bit better than eas but ea has one very strong bonus it can instantly shut down rival tear decks as there will be some but predicting them is hard
• maxwells i have to disagree on yes they are strong but only if supported by sufficient cc they are dead against earth, light, gravy, air has some resistence to them also partcularly unupped wyrms and the inevitable air nymphs, plus most airbornes weapons are also unaffected but maxwells unless there is the sufficient cc which water cannot provide if we want to keep the maxwells we ought to invest in a few cs

enough about the additions now onto what we ought to add in my opinion

• firstly we ought to take maybe 4 eqs if we choose earth duos as it can help to have a couple of eqs to makee up with tridents slow start and it just wreck monos and duos even with the split
• we really should take a few rts as well as they are a deck breaking cc more powerful than it is given credit for
• we simply have to take purifies it is a death killer for a start even if it is only 4 or 3 and it allows us to defend against adrenascorps from life and dunes from time
• freeze is another card we should take at least 6 of it is a rush counter and it makes nymph rushes even stronger not to mention the fact that it makes some nice light cc to cover squids or just to add in.
• we should take a few more soaras as well yes speed poison may not be the best but bows use it and with the right balance speed poiso can be reasonable and a nice surprise for throw out
• why no dry spell yes it is poor for cc but the boost of water it can provide late game can knock a turn off of a deck we need a quick boost to get a couple of creatures out to finish the opponent bang out dry spell suddenly you can get another 10 water quanta maybe more against certain decks not to mention it kills rol hope which we can expect from both aether and light
• we need a couple more flayers 1 is not enough why are we only taking 1 dis is madness

Enough from me lets just see what we come up with.