War #7 - Suggestions and Feedback

[Jenkar]

It's a core component. It's part of what makes War "War", at least in many people's mind.
It's not just bad, too. The restrictions that it implies make a lot more creativity. There have been some very innovative decks each war, simply due to the lack of cards at one point or another. This would not be the same without vaults.
It also puts a lot of micromanaging into an event that is, well, supposed to be enormous. Which i find to be a good thing, because otherwise it would "Just be another event". This also adds layers of complexity, such as : what cards to convert, salvage, discard, hide, show, etc. (the last two having a big impact on prediction).

Note that this may be biased.

[SpikeSpiegel]

As someone said (and I totally agree), war has become something more like to "I want to not lose" rather than "I want to win".

IMHO this could be an effect of Vault.

Btw, let's see how this one will end, then we'll have enough time to improve our main event.

[serprex]

Vault doesn't inherently make a "don't lose" game. Consider this: one wins more salvage than losses require discarding. Every round every team must discard an additional flat amount. This'll make War not capable of lasting forever (as could happen if salvage overshadows discard) & win oriented

[Laxadarap]

For the record, I MUCH prefer a vault system than free deckbuilding, and any alternative I can think of.  Also, I feel like auction is the core component of war, not so much the vault (This is the only event with a player draft, most events have restrictive deckbuilding).

[~Napalm]

I'm not entirely sure that Salvage > Discard + Flat Fee will work really as Salvaging is inherently less important than Discarding. Discarding usually costs you cards of your own element, often a lot. Salvaging rarely makes up for that. Completely eliminating the sting of sending a deck to a bad matchup won't really work (discard too low), but otherwise you'll end up Salvaging a ridiculous amount of stuff you can't really use to throw at the Fee. I'm not sure, but that seems kinda silly to me.

[Odii Odsen]

Because of the circumstances of our community, we have to change some things for this PvP event.
First of all, the auction went badly, what no one could suspect. So I remember a post of jijo to make a more fair system:

Spoiler for jijo's post :

My suggestion is to have a slarial mass like in NHL. Let me explain.

Each player can be bid 14, but each team has a mximum amount they can spend, maybe something around 40. This way, you cant simply choose 5 players you want in your team.

Furthermore, inactivity is still a problem. Why teams can't be smaller like 3 or 4 player only? Better organisation in teams, more fun and faster rounds.

What about "open auction" during war? Generals can bid on player who are interested or have time for war after this event has started.
Subtract the height of cards was bidden from the current vault. I know, new rules always have new problems.

More event cards for creative strategies are always welcome. Maybe we can start a collection thread like the "Elements PvP Tournament - Your ideas!". That are nonbinding suggestions and WM's have a pool for ideas to pick from and modify if needed.

I'm always for more upgraded cards in war, maybe possible for the later rounds.

Team darkness had to play during this current war against two Generals and three Lt's in one round. I think there should be a limit and matches should be more balance!

Card changes! But that's another story.

[hainkarga]

Team darkness had to play during this current war against two Generals and three Lt's in one round. I think there should be a limit and matches should be more balance!

I liked the event card where you get to distribute upped cards as you like. We could embed this event card into the rules with a min 3 limit"

"Each player may use up to 3 upped cards for free."
"Each round every team can distribute 9(?) extra ups to any member they like."

So any member can be a general or Lt. Some elements/decks don't really need upped cards yet some elements/decks can't work without them. This would be a boost to weaker elements that crave for upped cards (anyone can use up to 12) and would make the general&lt matchups irrelevant.

[ddevans96]

Vault doesn't inherently make a "don't lose" game. Consider this: one wins more salvage than losses require discarding. Every round every team must discard an additional flat amount. This'll make War not capable of lasting forever (as could happen if salvage overshadows discard) & win oriented

I just realized I meant to support this post and never did - so here it is. Also, ji's proposal for a 'salary cap'-type system should be considered.

[Jen-i]

Toss the auction - throw it out the window.

Instead we hold a Draft!

Before each round of the draft the Generals will have 36 hours to pm their Bids on the 12 Draft Selections in that round to the War Masters. The General with the highest bid receives the first Bid. In the event of a tie, the General whose team finished lower in the standings in the previous war will be given the earlier Draft Selection. (i.e. if both Aether and Light bid 5 in round 2 then Light will Draft before Aether does). Any General that does not bid during the 36 hours is assumed to have bid nothing, and will be seeded into the auction after all players that placed a bid of 0.

The War Masters will post the draft order, after which the Generals have another 36 hours to pm their draft selections to the War Masters. Each player will pm a number of selections equal to their Draft Position. They will be given the first unselected player from their selection list.

Example:

Element	Draft Position	PM List	Draft Choice
	1st	Bob the Destroyer	Bob the Destroyer
	2nd	Doug the Invincible, Mike the Great	Doug the Invincible
	3rd	Doug the Invincible, Bob the Destroyer, George the Very Large	George the Very Large

At the end of each Draft round the cycle starts over again until all players have been selected

[ddevans96]

Just have a phase of 48 hours, in which every general submits a bid and 12 players. Then after that, do another 48 hours, and so on until teams are filled. And then set a maximum total bid, say 40, or something scaled to the number of players, and it would be a great system.

[mrpaper]

Toss the auction - throw it out the window.

Instead we hold a Draft!

Before each round of the draft the Generals will have 36 hours to pm their Bids on the 12 Draft Selections in that round to the War Masters. The General with the highest bid receives the first Bid. In the event of a tie, the General whose team finished lower in the standings in the previous war will be given the earlier Draft Selection. (i.e. if both Aether and Light bid 5 in round 2 then Light will Draft before Aether does). Any General that does not bid during the 36 hours is assumed to have bid nothing, and will be seeded into the auction after all players that placed a bid of 0.

The War Masters will post the draft order, after which the Generals have another 36 hours to pm their draft selections to the War Masters. Each player will pm a number of selections equal to their Draft Position. They will be given the first unselected player from their selection list.

Example:

Element	Draft Position	PM List	Draft Choice
	1st	Bob the Destroyer	Bob the Destroyer
	2nd	Doug the Invincible, Mike the Great	Doug the Invincible
	3rd	Doug the Invincible, Bob the Destroyer, George the Very Large	George the Very Large

At the end of each Draft round the cycle starts over again until all players have been selected

I don't know about you're idea, but if there is something to be thrown out the window during the auction it's gotta be the application form as it is.... it is wayyyy too heavy for nothing.  It is assumed everyone who joins war got every unnupped card or will be able to buy em if needed as it's so cheap.  It has been said for a few wars now and it's still not updated.

 As for you'r idea now,  I'm wondering on the effect on players since manydon't wanna play for element x.  So, say that  is unpopular and 2 persons are forced into this team and decide they rather quit or go MIA cause they don't enjoy it  (this is childish you might say but it will happen) there is no way that the team in question will be in good shape after that so it is bad for those people and the event in general.  My suggestion would be to allow a few bans (how about up to 3?) and maybe favorites for bonuses.  That being said, I think I prefer the thrill of auctions anyway.

[serprex]

Bumping a sticky thread? Pretty much

We WMs are reading (& rereading?) this thread, so if you've come up with anything else you'd like to say about how War should play out, this is where to post it for now