War #10 - Rules

[mrpaper]

If we were to make an underworld team, the sub pool would be dry and we always need à few.  That said if we want to have them  come joining In round 4-5 most sub needed are taken so I guess its fine. And yeah its à great way to expand the community.

For shards... Some are clearly op and  its the reason many people didnt wanted em in war at all.  Giving air unlimited sofree  for exemple is à récipe for disaster!  Of course skeleton isnt as good as firebolts.... But why would death team pick that card??? They will pick bonewalls/poison/arsenic or whatever they need.

[Jenkar]

For shards... Some are clearly op and  its the reason many people didnt wanted em in war at all.  Giving air unlimited sofree  for exemple is à récipe for disaster!  Of course skeleton isnt as good as firebolts.... But why would death team pick that card??? They will pick bonewalls/poison/arsenic or whatever they need.

I feel like you're totally missing torb's point?..

[mrpaper]

For shards... Some are clearly op and  its the reason many people didnt wanted em in war at all.  Giving air unlimited sofree  for exemple is à récipe for disaster!  Of course skeleton isnt as good as firebolts.... But why would death team pick that card??? They will pick bonewalls/poison/arsenic or whatever they need.

I feel like you're totally missing torb's point?..

I don't... More shards in war = war of shards even if they cost more then 2:1 ... We wanted to stop having war of grabbow... Lets not make it as worse... Also how fun is it to be in team earth for exemple looking at shard decks...
Lastly, converting at à high cost for high cost  cards is à lot of trouble for very little... Fire will likely have 24 fire bolts and keep most of them until they are about to be out (if ever).  So its not à card they will convert... If they need to do it early it means they are going to be out fast anyway.  It also means teams like life who never gets good in element salvage would pay more when they need à key card.

[serprex]

If Life's market prices are low, their transmutation could therefore be more efficient than 2:1

If it's too complex to compare prices, just ban transmutation of a set of cards which cost above a certain amount

[mrpaper]

If Life's market prices are low, their transmutation could therefore be more efficient than 2:1

Not so cheap on all of em... Frogs are good for one.. and coulnt be at à 1-1 ratio.

[TheonlyrealBeef]

But the overpoweredness of a card is proportional with its price, if not, the market prices are off. Fractal > Shard of Freedom according to market prices and there is no reason to allow transmutation to Fractal but disallow it for Shard of Freedom. You said yourself that "some" shards are overpowered, why the blank ban of transmutation of all? I suspect it is a rule from before there were shards or something, because using the same logic as you have for Fire's Fire Bolts, Air would also simply keep their shards with no need for Shards of Freedom, no?

Transmutation should in no way be needed ever and you still have the 12 in-element card limit for applying it. But if your team had a very rough patch then this can most certainly help. The Skeleton was simple a 10-cost card example.

[mrpaper]

But the overpoweredness of a card is proportional with its price, if not, the market prices are off. Fractal > Shard of Freedom according to market prices and there is no reason to allow transmutation to Fractal but disallow it for Shard of Freedom. You said yourself that "some" shards are overpowered, why the blank ban of transmutation of all? I suspect it is a rule from before there were shards or something, because using the same logic as you have for Fire's Fire Bolts, Air would also simply keep their shards with no need for Shards of Freedom, no?

Transmutation should in no way be needed ever and you still have the 12 in-element card limit for applying it. But if your team had a very rough patch then this can most certainly help. The Skeleton was simple a 10-cost card example.

Trans mutation was Put to prevent suicide decks giving you more in element cards in case you get à terrible round somewhere and work as is.  We see very little suicide decks now.  Banning all shards from transmutation is easier then deciding where to draw the line.... Sopa and sofree sure are... How about the time/gravy/death/light ones?  Id be mad to be In team light being told no but seeing time tell yes...

[serprex]

It isn't only 2:1 or 1:1. Can be 3:2 or 4:3 or 5:3 depending on input & output. Take it as a set of cards being transmuted into some other set, not a set of unrelated transmutations

As a member of team light, if the cutoff was decided as 80, then I'd be fine having SoR transmutable & SoD not

[mrpaper]

It isn't only 2:1 or 1:1. Can be 3:2 or 4:3 or 5:3 depending on input & output. Take it as a set of cards being transmuted into some other set, not a set of unrelated transmutations

As a member of team light, if the cutoff was decided as 80, then I'd be fine having SoR transmutable & SoD not

Can be done... But remember team s are penalised heavy for having good cards in element... So not only would light vault be slim from sanctuary/miracles costing à lot... You are in bigger problems if you ever need em. 
Market price was Put in place to even things up.... This would only frustrate whoever has à terrible round.  If you want to help weaker teams I did made many suggestions before!

[ddevans96]

I don't see anything wrong with the inclusion of an Underworld right now...

Assuming it was done roughly the same way as before:

-unplanned work for organizers
-lack of proven activity, so probably lots of byes in the tournament
-balance issues, where do you set the starting vault for them, when do you add them
-reduces number of strong sub choices
-major event/rule change added hastily midway, would have likely affected signups/auction strategy
-time/logistics issues making several of the above worse

Not the worst idea in the world but there's a lot of things to consider.

[mrpaper]

I don't see anything wrong with the inclusion of an Underworld right now...

Assuming it was done roughly the same way as before:

-unplanned work for organizers
-lack of proven activity, so probably lots of byes in the tournament
-balance issues, where do you set the starting vault for them, when do you add them
-reduces number of strong sub choices
-major event/rule change added hastily midway, would have likely affected signups/auction strategy
-time/logistics issues making several of the above worse

Not the worst idea in the world but there's a lot of things to consider.

Basiccly I have the same concerns... But I'd be thrilled if Wms can make it work well.

[iancudorinmarian]

Can marks be replaced with pillars of the same element when subbing?