War #10 - Round 7

[rob77dp]

Transmutation happens during deckbuilding

Is this mentioned within the War rules?

Btw, Backroom Deals wording is the following: "Conspiring with other teams is forbidden". We have not conspired with anyone in here, let alone an other War team. We discussed stuff with the WMs.

There is no other phase during which Transmutation could conceivably occur. This is similar to the rules not needing to specifically dictate that bids only happen during Auction. It is easily inherently required that way because bids outside of Auction simply does not make sense - similar to transmutation not being conceivable outside of deckbuilding.

Transmutation is mentioned in the rules as directly tied to salvaging -- good luck finding any allowance of salvage outside of deckbuilding phase.
Rules 4.1:

When salvaging cards into your Vault, you may choose to transmute them into cards of your own element instead. Salvaged cards may be transmuted at a two to one (2:1) ratio into any in-element card which you do not already have 12 copies of in your Vault.

[ARTHANASIOS]

Arth, you cannot transmute stuff in advance for next round. If you are allowed, then ill like to do our discards at the end of war pls, once we have won. Kthnx.

Yes, but I can transmute in my "salvage phase", am I right? For obvious reasons, a salvage occurs after the "duel phase" where the battle results are revealed, am I right?

From War rules:
When salvaging cards into your Vault, you may choose to transmute them into cards of your own element instead. Salvaged cards may be transmuted at a two to one (2:1) ratio into any in-element card which you do not already have 12 copies of in your Vault.

[worldwideweb3]

Arth, you cannot transmute stuff in advance for next round. If you are allowed, then ill like to do our discards at the end of war pls, once we have won. Kthnx.

Yes, but I can transmute in my "salvage phase", am I right? For obvious reasons, a salvage occurs after the "duel phase" where the battle results are revealed, am I right?

From War rules:
When salvaging cards into your Vault, you may choose to transmute them into cards of your own element instead. Salvaged cards may be transmuted at a two to one (2:1) ratio into any in-element card which you do not already have 12 copies of in your Vault.

Salvage happens after the matchups are revealed. Stop bending rules. In fact, You did the transmutation of wins in R6 during R6 duel phase. Check timer of R7 post to confirm. Now what?

[majofa]

Worms. Can. Opened.

[ARTHANASIOS]

Salvage happens after the matchups are revealed.

That's the answer I was waiting for. Things are much clearer for me too, thanks.

[TheonlyrealBeef]

Any deal made non-publicly is a backroom deal. Indeed, making them with wms breaks no rules in itself, but allowing a team to break rules without letting other teams know... All teams deserve to know this kind of stuff. Cause then more people should be allowed to break the rules this way. Thus is the basic principle of fair play: treating all teams equally in equal circumstances.

[Physsion]

Hey everyone,

mathman and I were both pressed for time this round, and I believe we both made a mistake with this ruling. Allowing cards to be deducted from the vault via transmutation in a future round is unfair, and we should not have allowed this to pass in the first place.

Know that Light hasn't done this maliciously to gain an unfair advantage through bending the rules - they had asked us if this was okay, and in our haste this round, we confirmed that the transmutation from 76 -> 74 cards was legal. In the interest of keeping the event fair for all teams, we've decided to revert this decision, and Light will play 3 matches this round instead of 2.

Air will receive a bye this round - via chat dice, we determined that Basman-1453 will receive the bye, and his match vs. Jenkar of Earth will be changed to fight Silver Emerald of Light.



Sorry to everyone, especially team Light, for the miscommunication here. We hate to have to give you this news, but in the interest of the event, we think this is the only fair decision.

Best of luck to everyone this round.

WMs

[deuce22]

Oh, and where's Death's penalty for changing their mark vs Water last round? We're not allowed to but they get away with it unpenalized by not asking wms in advance? Do wms hate Fire/me so much as to make an exception for everyone but Fire?
Consistent ruling dammit.
You should just remove my matchup and me from war at this point, it's not like I can build decks for 5 matches regardless (only half serious, but this is starting to get old).

Bah.

Never noticed this. Seems like mistake was caught before match was started, so changing mark is fine as long as a penalty is assessed. A penalty should be applied to this match, not sure if WMs just haven't noticed yet...


As for 's transmutations to drop a duel, a team has never been allowed to apply transmutations from current round to prior round card count in order to change their number of duels. This needs to be corrected. I get that WMs "approved" this before the round was posted, but it's not too late to make a change.

WMing is hard, I get it, I've been there. It's impossible to be perfect. It's impossible to have everyone agree with your decisions. The biggest thing as a WM is enforcing the rules fairly, equally, and consistently.  This is a lot tougher than it sounds at times. Mistakes will inevitably be made, but recognizing them and correcting them in a timely manner is all you can do.

EDIT: ninja'd by a WM. Thanks for recognizing the mistake and correcting it. Any update on the death/water issue?

[JonathanCrazyJ]

I think we should praise the WMs for their humble and fairly timely reverting of this mistake.
Mistakes happen, it takes good management to revert them fairly as has been done here.

Excellent, goodbye drama

[MyNameIsJoey]

gj and ty wm

[dragonsdemesne]

Hmm.. well, so people whine about Serprex's girlfriend... 20 card penalty.  (I notice nobody penalized us for my cat, at least, so we've got that going for us)

People whine about Light strategizing transmutation... decision reversed.

I had no idea that the other 11 teams were so scared of team Light that they had to go and make these backroom deals to try and avoid us; they're far more so-called 'backroom' than anything Light's done.  Team Light hasn't done anything wrong, and to say otherwise is a misunderstanding.

Fortunately, I have far more important things to worry about than imaginary points in a virtual card game with people I've never met.  You may all continue to rant and rave about this as much as you want.  I'll be in the real world.

If anyone actually has anything intelligent to say on the matter, feel free to PM it.  If it's not more of the same drivel I'm seeing here, I'll respond; otherwise I'll block sender.

[deuce22]

@dragons, it has nothing to do with being afraid of team light. There are a few things at play here.

1. the decision to allow this would therefore be applicable to every team going forward, which will affect the matches almost every round going forward, including byes. This is why this sort of thing has never been allowed in previous wars.

2. light playing 1 less match may directly affect the outcome of last round's EC. I have no doubt that a number of teams bet on light dying round 7. Light would only need 1 win as opposed to 2 in order to survive.