Event Cards (removed from the event)

[Memorystick]

You can't justify taking matters into your own hands in this situation because it's not justifiable.

Ever read the United States of America's Declaration of Independence?  How about the Constitution?  There are two very well-known and powerful documents that pretty strictly disagree with you. 

I wonder how many of the members of the Legislative authority in the US would agree with you that it's appropriate to invoke these documents when you don't like the rules in an online video game.

If you believe your liberties as an American citizen apply in parallel here, you are wrong. This is a free-membership community which works exactly like a dictatorship and the only rights you have are the ones accorded to you. You might play football and believe that the NFL's rules against horse-collar tackles are extremely unfair against the defending team, but the Bill of Rights certainly has nothing to do with your "right" to boycott the rule whatsoever. Same thing with event cards in Elements War.

In Elements, "These ends" (from the Declaration) are clear.  We're all here to have FUN.  And when the structure or rules of an event make things NOT FUN, we are all perfectly within our rights to take matters into our own hands, and alter or abolish the event.

How delusional. I mean seriously -- you think if you're not having fun at a game it becomes your right to "take matters into your own hands?"

Um... I assume you missed this?

I realize that it's a bit of a stretch to say that these documents have authority here -- they don't -- but the notion that the communities collective actions are "not justifiable" is pretty much shot down when you stop and realize that the USA's Founding Fathers basically completely disagree with you on every conceivable level.  Even if you don't like America, you do have to give us a little credit.

He was using the Constitution and Declaration to make a counterpoint to something you said.

And really, there's nothing to be gained from continuing to argue, aside from venting and/or wasting time, so why not drop it?

EDIT: Quantum, that is just epicsauce

[Sir Valimont]

Guys at this point you've beaten the dead horse so much it's just a puddle on the ground. Also:


Alt text: What do you what me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!

LOL

XKCD for the win. Not to get off-topic but this deserved a response. Seriously LOL. 

[Kuross]

I move to have this thread locked... do I hear a second?

[Memorystick]

I move to have this thread locked... do I hear a second?

Seconded.

[TheCrazyMango]

I move to have this thread locked... do I hear a second?

YES
im also going to assume that you will get a third, and a fourth, and so on

[Sir Valimont]

Um... I assume you missed this?

I realize that it's a bit of a stretch to say that these documents have authority here -- they don't -- but the notion that the communities collective actions are "not justifiable" is pretty much shot down when you stop and realize that the USA's Founding Fathers basically completely disagree with you on every conceivable level.  Even if you don't like America, you do have to give us a little credit.

I didn't miss it.

Essence says in one breath that those documents don't apply and yet in the next says that my views on the issue are at odds with the Founding Fathers. Well, since the views of the Founding Fathers don't apply, obviously my stance on the issue can't be at odds with their general beliefs.

It is clear from Essence's posts that he believes that whenever he disagrees with something that it is appropriate for him to rebel. Such a viewpoint is a non-starter. There's not much more I can say about it.

[Memorystick]

Um... I assume you missed this?

I realize that it's a bit of a stretch to say that these documents have authority here -- they don't -- but the notion that the communities collective actions are "not justifiable" is pretty much shot down when you stop and realize that the USA's Founding Fathers basically completely disagree with you on every conceivable level.  Even if you don't like America, you do have to give us a little credit.

I didn't miss it.

Essence says in one breath that those documents don't apply and yet in the next says that my views on the issue are at odds with the Founding Fathers. Well, since the views of the Founding Fathers don't apply, obviously my stance on the issue can't be at odds with their general beliefs.

It is clear from Essence's posts that he believes that whenever he disagrees with something that it is appropriate for him to rebel. Such a viewpoint is a non-starter. There's not much more I can say about it.

Just to clarify, said documents simply REFLECT the ideas, i.e. documents != ideas. The ideas can still apply EVEN THOUGH the constitution and declaration DON'T.

I don't want to get any more involved in what should have died down yesterday, so if you want to consider this "won", fine. I'm getting mildly annoyed by this bull anyway.

[Sir Valimont]

Just to clarify, said documents simply REFLECT the ideas, i.e. documents != ideas. The ideas can still apply EVEN THOUGH the constitution and declaration DON'T.

You are quite right that ideas can apply in different situations. We could call those situations a matter of "principle."

This is a situation where the ideas of the US Founding Fathers do not apply. The concept of freedom of speech, for example, does not apply to the card game of Bridge: You can't tell your partner out loud which cards you have. Of course the basic principle that free speech is an inalienable right is true in and of itself in a democratic context, but to think that it guarantees you some rights that immunize you from the constraints of a game you are playing is just silly.

[Scaredgirl]

Not at all.  SG reacted the way any sane person was -- she was disappointed that all the work she put in wasn't accepted well by the community.  That's perfectly normal and predictable.  In fact, she did an excellent job of handling the situation, all told: she listened to the community, altered the rules, and then got out of the way when she realized that she wasn't emotionally capable of dealing with the situation in a calm and rational manner.  That's EXACTLY what she's supposed to do in this situation, and I've already privately applauded her for it.

I feel I need to clarify this thing a bit.

I don't get emotionally attached to cards. Age of Light could have been easily nerfed or even removed for the event. The card is not really the issue here.

Instead of handling this situation like it should have been handled, many participants of War #2 decided to take power into their own hands and start what can only be described as mutiny. "No matter what the event rules are, or what the organizers say, this is what we will do!".

There was no calm adult discussion with the organizers, but there was plenty of threats of quitting and a "boycott". I, as an organizer, feel like I should have control over the event I have used 100+ hours to build. If organizers don't have control over their events, why do we have organizers in the first place? Why not just do everything with a community-wide poll?

If the community wants to run these events instead of current organizers, please do. I have said repeatedly that I would love if people would step up and do some volunteer work so that I could concentrate on other things. But the problem is that most complainers don't want to do that. All they want to do is wait for others to to do all the work, and then start their threats and complaining if the event doesn't turn out to be as they expected.

That is what my issue is, and that is why I have removed myself from this event. I wasted 20 hours in making these Event Cards (having ideas, collecting ideas, sorting out ideas, finding royalty-free graphics, editing graphics, writing card text, making the cards, randomizing the order, starting the topic). First getting forced to remove them, and then getting comments like "good thing they got removed" (from people who have never contributed anything to War planning and preparation), is just totally unacceptable to me.

[kobisjeruk]

Age of Light could have been easily nerfed or even removed for the event. The card is not really the issue here.

but in my opinion that is EXACTLY the issue here
i believe nobody said the event cards idea as a whole is a failure
ask anybody after seeing 'Flawless Victory' and i think the response is "awesomesauce" or something similar
and i think we've seen similar responses to the initial idea (everyone can use 6 upgraded cards this round)
because, it felt like something powerful YET balance enough that it didnt tip the scale in favor of anyone
but then comes the Age of Light

that card...and the Age series in particular IS the issue

[Scaredgirl]

Age of Light could have been easily nerfed or even removed for the event. The card is not really the issue here.

but in my opinion that is EXACTLY the issue here
i believe nobody said the event cards idea as a whole is a failure
ask anybody after seeing 'Flawless Victory' and i think the response is "awesomesauce" or something similar
and i think we've seen similar responses to the initial idea (everyone can use 6 upgraded cards this round)
because, it felt like something powerful YET balance enough that it didnt tip the scale in favor of anyone
but then comes the Age of Light

that card...and the Age series in particular IS the issue

Did you stop reading after that paragraph?

[kobisjeruk]

oh my bad
your issue

and not the issue that started this whole thing