What do you believe?

[OldTrees]

@Bloodshadow: What about selfishness and greed make them evil?

[QuantumT]

My ethics are based on selfishness and greed. I believe that those two traits make humans evil.

And who says that selfishness and greed are the only things that drive humans?

[Bloodshadow]

@Bloodshadow: What about selfishness and greed make them evil?

Some people kidnap and sell children. The greed makes them want money, and the selfishness makes them not care about the children and their families. Other than psychopathy, I believe that selfishness and greed are the two main factors that drive people to do deeds most of us consider evil.

And who says that selfishness and greed are the only things that drive humans?

Humans, and all living organisms in general, are driven by the three factors below:

1. Preserve your own existence. (selfishness)
2. Always acquire more and better resources. (greed)
3. Preserve your species as a whole. (love)

This is a simple generalization, but most human emotions eventually boil down to one or more of the above factors. After all, humans are nothing but animals.

[theloconate]

^ except we are a pack animal, this is only true of lone animals (like bears). sure in extream circumstances this may apply but in a properly functioning society it just doesn't happen as often as you portray

[Bloodshadow]

^ except we are a pack animal, this is only true of lone animals (like bears).

For pack animals, rule #3 tend to take higher priority. I believe that all positive human emotions are stemmed from the urge to sustain our species as a whole (e.g. sexual attraction was originally meant to produce physically fit offsprings, parental love ensures that the younger generation survives, friendship increases our chances of survival by compelling us to work together). The conflicts between rules #1 and #3 make up the majority of human moral conflicts.

[theloconate]

^ except we are a pack animal, this is only true of lone animals (like bears).

For pack animals, rule #3 tend to take higher priority. I believe that all positive human emotions are stemmed from the urge to sustain our species as a whole (e.g. sexual attraction was originally meant to produce physically fit offsprings, parental love ensures that the younger generation survives, friendship increases our chances of survival by compelling us to work together). The conflicts between rules #1 and #3 make up the majority of human moral conflicts.

Wait dude. This is all evolution mechanics. How does this help your statement that we are all evil

[Bloodshadow]

Your speech patterns irk me. Do you find my beliefs so utterly ludicrous that you have to respond to every single one with vehement disapproval? You were like "Dude, seriously, what the hell is wrong with you?!" every single time.

I traced my ideas of evil (selfishness and greed) and goodness (altruism and love) back to their evolutionary origins. Humans have evolved to be selfish and greedy in order to survive. I happen to think that selfishness and greed are evil, so I drew the conclusion that humans have evolved to be evil.

[QuantumT]

I'm not sure why you keep dropping off your third rule when you're talking about humans.

And by the way you defined them, 1 & 2 apply to basically all living organisms. So it's not so much that humans are evil but more that living things are evil.

[OldTrees]

@Bloodshadow: What about selfishness and greed make them evil?

Some people kidnap and sell children. The greed makes them want money, and the selfishness makes them not care about the children and their families. Other than psychopathy, I believe that selfishness and greed are the two main factors that drive people to do deeds most of us consider evil.

Humans, and all living organisms in general, are driven by the three factors below:

1. Preserve your own existence. (selfishness)
2. Always acquire more and better resources. (greed)
3. Preserve your species as a whole. (love)

This is a simple generalization, but most human emotions eventually boil down to one or more of the above factors. After all, humans are nothing but animals.

My previous question was what do you think makes selfishness and greed evil. Not do people consider the consequences of some selfish or greedy actions evil.

So
1. What makes preserving your existence evil?
2. What makes acquiring more and better resources evil?
or
Are selfishness and greed not inherently evil but just tend to correlate with evil?
In which case what is your definition of evil?

[Bloodshadow]

Selfishness and greed are not evil by themselves, but they are the causes of the behaviors most people think of as evil. I think I worded my statement a bit wrong in my last post.

I'm not sure why you keep dropping off your third rule when you're talking about humans.

Comparatively rule #3 is the least important rule. Also, as we develop our civilization, the chance of humans as a species not surviving is becoming less and less. I think rule #3 is becoming weaker, and it is often not strong enough to hold back the "evil" behaviors caused by rules #1 and #2. Animals never sold their children for material gain, did they?

And by the way you defined them, 1 & 2 apply to basically all living organisms. So it's not so much that humans are evil but more that living things are evil.

As I said above, the rules themselves are not evil, but they cause evil behaviors in humans. I suppose it's because humans are too intelligent.

Sigh... I'm tired of arguing about this. It's not likely that we'll be able to convince each other, and I don't want to waste that much time arguing. It would only make my mood worse, since everything seems to irritate me these days.

[KorabanVII]

I'm Roman Catholic

[Uppercut]

Anyone else find Bloodshadow's stance pretty contradictory? I mean he basically defines necessary levels of greed and selfishness as evil and by proxy says all living things are evil. He is alive and is evil by his own admission. Why would someone who admits hes evil think he has any say on what is or isn't moral or good?