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Offline OldTrees

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg533558#msg533558
« Reply #24 on: August 16, 2012, 12:41:28 am »
The vrt quote works both ways however. Ultimately there are extremists on either side. ITs up to us to rise above them and acnkowledge that although there is a minority like that, there is a majority that is not.
To add onto this:
The existence of extremists on the other side is not a reason to be an extremist, rather it is a reason to not be an extremist.
(Be careful to not become what you hate.)
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Offline mildlyfrightenedboyTopic starter

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg533559#msg533559
« Reply #25 on: August 16, 2012, 12:41:55 am »
Religions don't always have a deity. Budhism for one.

^This.  Atheism isn't the absence of a religion, it's not believing in any god.  There are a lot of atheist Buddhists.
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Offline Smarty

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg534559#msg534559
« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2012, 03:32:05 pm »
Do to others as you would have them do to you. - Luke 6:31

This quote is about 2000 years old (written somewhere around 0 BC/0 AD [I am  not sure when exactly it was written]) and it still is true. The Bible does not lie and I believe that they should be treated equal and be given a chance. I am not saying that I believe in atheism, but I believe they have the right to believe whatever they want.

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive what is due him for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad. - 2 Corinthians 5:10

Offline siriosirio

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg534560#msg534560
« Reply #27 on: August 18, 2012, 03:40:32 pm »
i need religion as fisch need a bike

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg535296#msg535296
« Reply #28 on: August 21, 2012, 06:39:09 am »
Ive always had the attitude that God did not force us to do anything, including follow his laws. I take this very literally. The only laws I believe should be passed are ones such as do not murder. Social issues such as gay marriage, although I believe are wrong, I do not believe are something that God would want us to outlaw. Abortion on the other hand, directly effects another living being and therefor I feel should have a law enforced on it. If you are atheist, I dont care if you are or not. Its not my job to force you to do anything. Its just my job to be sure you understand what Gods law is. Not condemn you or to force you to do anything different.
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Offline AnonymousRevival

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg535319#msg535319
« Reply #29 on: August 21, 2012, 08:48:05 am »
Ive always had the attitude that God did not force us to do anything, including follow his laws. I take this very literally. The only laws I believe should be passed are ones such as do not murder. Social issues such as gay marriage, although I believe are wrong, I do not believe are something that God would want us to outlaw. Abortion on the other hand, directly effects another living being and therefor I feel should have a law enforced on it. If you are atheist, I dont care if you are or not. Its not my job to force you to do anything. Its just my job to be sure you understand what Gods law is. Not condemn you or to force you to do anything different.

On the contrary, homosexuality is anger in God's eyes. The reason why Sodom and Gomorrah became the modern day Dead Sea was because of their homosexual acts. This is where the abhorrent term 'sodomize' also originates from. I know it may seem unfair that God hates homosexuality, but it is because he coins it as 'unusual'. This also explains why some humans are really towards anti-gay.
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Offline OldTrees

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg535321#msg535321
« Reply #30 on: August 21, 2012, 09:10:37 am »
Ive always had the attitude that God did not force us to do anything, including follow his laws. I take this very literally. The only laws I believe should be passed are ones such as do not murder. Social issues such as gay marriage, although I believe are wrong, I do not believe are something that God would want us to outlaw. Abortion on the other hand, directly effects another living being and therefor I feel should have a law enforced on it. If you are atheist, I dont care if you are or not. Its not my job to force you to do anything. Its just my job to be sure you understand what Gods law is. Not condemn you or to force you to do anything different.

On the contrary, homosexuality is anger in God's eyes. The reason why Sodom and Gomorrah became the modern day Dead Sea was because of their homosexual acts. This is where the abhorrent term 'sodomize' also originates from. I know it may seem unfair that God hates homosexuality, but it is because he coins it as 'unusual'. This also explains why some humans are really towards anti-gay.
In the story God did not punish Sodom and Gomorrah for not outlawing sodomy. God punished them for preforming sodomy. Also note that God was punitive rather than preventive. This further supports the theory that God would want people to be free to choose to sin but be punished by God for sin.
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Offline AnonymousRevival

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg535323#msg535323
« Reply #31 on: August 21, 2012, 09:19:27 am »
Ive always had the attitude that God did not force us to do anything, including follow his laws. I take this very literally. The only laws I believe should be passed are ones such as do not murder. Social issues such as gay marriage, although I believe are wrong, I do not believe are something that God would want us to outlaw. Abortion on the other hand, directly effects another living being and therefor I feel should have a law enforced on it. If you are atheist, I dont care if you are or not. Its not my job to force you to do anything. Its just my job to be sure you understand what Gods law is. Not condemn you or to force you to do anything different.

On the contrary, homosexuality is anger in God's eyes. The reason why Sodom and Gomorrah became the modern day Dead Sea was because of their homosexual acts. This is where the abhorrent term 'sodomize' also originates from. I know it may seem unfair that God hates homosexuality, but it is because he coins it as 'unusual'. This also explains why some humans are really towards anti-gay.
In the story God did not punish Sodom and Gomorrah for not outlawing sodomy. God punished them for preforming sodomy. Also note that God was punitive rather than preventive. This further supports the theory that God would want people to be free to choose to sin but be punished by God for sin.

Exactly. God made us human and not 'divine beings' because he is trying to explain to us that life is harsh and difficult, and that we have the choice..........the choice to live or to die.
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Offline OldTrees

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg535327#msg535327
« Reply #32 on: August 21, 2012, 09:32:02 am »
Ive always had the attitude that God did not force us to do anything, including follow his laws. I take this very literally. The only laws I believe should be passed are ones such as do not murder. Social issues such as gay marriage, although I believe are wrong, I do not believe are something that God would want us to outlaw. Abortion on the other hand, directly effects another living being and therefor I feel should have a law enforced on it. If you are atheist, I dont care if you are or not. Its not my job to force you to do anything. Its just my job to be sure you understand what Gods law is. Not condemn you or to force you to do anything different.

On the contrary, homosexuality is anger in God's eyes. The reason why Sodom and Gomorrah became the modern day Dead Sea was because of their homosexual acts. This is where the abhorrent term 'sodomize' also originates from. I know it may seem unfair that God hates homosexuality, but it is because he coins it as 'unusual'. This also explains why some humans are really towards anti-gay.
In the story God did not punish Sodom and Gomorrah for not outlawing sodomy. God punished them for preforming sodomy. Also note that God was punitive rather than preventive. This further supports the theory that God would want people to be free to choose to sin but be punished by God for sin.
Exactly. God made us human and not 'divine beings' because he is trying to explain to us that life is harsh and difficult, and that we have the choice..........the choice to live or to die.
To tie this back to the topic,
Since the Christian God is giving a choice, then it is hubris for a mortal to try to choose for another mortal. Therefore this interpretation of the Christian God would be in favor of tolerance between mortals regardless of belief.
Or in other words
Its not my job to force you to do anything. Its just my job to be sure you understand what Gods law is. Not condemn you or to force you to do anything different.
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Offline siriosirio

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg535475#msg535475
« Reply #33 on: August 21, 2012, 09:28:02 pm »
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Offline mildlyfrightenedboyTopic starter

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg535730#msg535730
« Reply #34 on: August 22, 2012, 09:19:03 pm »
"ama e fai cio che vuoi" San Agostino
Courtesy of Google Translate, "love and do what you want" (Italian).
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Offline ElementalDearWatson

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Re: Tolerance of atheism. Discuss. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42540.msg1008200#msg1008200
« Reply #35 on: October 15, 2012, 11:36:47 pm »
In the story God did not punish Sodom and Gomorrah for not outlawing sodomy. God punished them for preforming sodomy. Also note that God was punitive rather than preventive. This further supports the theory that God would want people to be free to choose to sin but be punished by God for sin.

Weeeellll...actually, God punished them for attempting to gang rape 2 angels.   Lot told them not to and to instead gang rape his 2 virgin daughters, which God apparently thought was fine.  But the gang wanted to rape the 2 angels, so they destroyed the town.  Lot's wife looked back while that was happening, though, so God killed her by turning her into a pillar of salt.  Then Lot settled in the mountains with his two virgin daughters.  His daughters decided they wanted to have kids, so they got Lot so drunk he couldn't tell who they were and raped him, losing their virginities in the process, in order to bear his children.  Again, God seems to think that this is perfectly fine.

It's a very strange story, the main moral of which seems to be that it's okay to gang-rape young virgin girls, it's okay to offer your young virgin daughters up for gang rape and it's okay to rape your father in order to have kids, but it's not okay to gang rape angels, and it's not okay to look at a city being destroyed.  As I say, a very odd story.

Now, it's true that God was already planning to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah because he'd been getting complaints from people about how everybody in the place was a sinner, but the Bible is entirely non-specific about what the sin is.  I'd have thought that the fact that the gang wanted to rape people would have been a worse sin than the fact that the people they wanted to rape were male, but I suppose the endorsement of raping the daughters, and the daughters raping their father rather says that rape itself isn't a sin.  So I suppose homosexuality kind of becomes the sin in that specific instance by default, but it's a little tenuous.  And it does mean that anyone who is citing that story as a condemnation of homosexuality is also implicitly saying that rape is okay.  There's also nothing in the story to suggest that any of the other sins were anything to do with sex.  It reads more like general debauchery, like it was a party town which partied too much for God's taste. 

In truth, though, it doesn't read like a lesson in morality or a commandment at all.  It just reads like a story which people have then attached post-hoc meaning to.

 

blarg: