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Offline ArumTopic starter

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...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529203#msg529203
« on: August 05, 2012, 08:08:50 am »
Yeah, I used to be christian, but now I'm atheist.

The only problem is that the overly religious zealots in this world keep shoving christianity down my throat, and this guy managed to turn me away for good.



Sigh. And it's just not him.
People on facebook/youtube are being extremely ignorant to actual science. There are countless adults who believe god pulls everything to the ground, and not the sky, but could pull to the sky, when we know that won't happen cause of gravity. Some people don't even believe in the theory of evoloution, even though any sane person would believe in them.

No, I'm not hating on christians who are normal, I'm hating on the stupid, ignorant, dumb christian zealots who will proceed to shove their religion down my throat while being the extremely narrow minded people they are.

I am  ashamed of them.

(Insert "I DON'T WANT TO LIVE ON THIS PLANET ANYMORE." meme)
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Offline Bloodshadow

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529207#msg529207
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2012, 08:15:18 am »
Welcome to the club.
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Offline Naesala

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529212#msg529212
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2012, 08:32:44 am »
The existence of zealots should not turn you away from christianity.

Being christian is about whether or not you believe in god and by extension jesus. Did zealots make you cease to believe in god/jesus? Why?

If anything, you should continue to be a christian to try and show people that there are more normal christians than extremists. You should challenge and look at their beliefs, their biblical interpretations, and compare them to yours. If you cease to be christian for a reason other than you've ceased to believe in god, then you weren't really that much of a christian before.

IMPORTANT: I have nothing against atheism, i'm just criticizing Arum's reasons so (s)he can think before making a large life change.

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529213#msg529213
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2012, 08:33:48 am »
As someone who's been on both sides and is now not on either, I've come to the belief that there are both complete assholes and genuinely nice people in both theism and atheism.

The problem is that many religions, especially Christianity, have a 'join us or you're doomed to eternal suffering' mentality that does not have a counterpart in atheism, thus making theist stupidity, for lack of a better term a lot more harsh than atheist stupidity.
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Offline ArumTopic starter

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529214#msg529214
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2012, 08:38:06 am »
As someone who's been on both sides and is now not on either, I've come to the belief that there are both complete assholes and genuinely nice people in both theism and atheism.

The problem is that many religions, especially Christianity, have a 'join us or you're doomed to eternal suffering' mentality that does not have a counterpart in atheism, thus making theist stupidity, for lack of a better term a lot more harsh than atheist stupidity.
This is more of my reasoning to leave.
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Offline Cheesy111

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529215#msg529215
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2012, 08:38:48 am »
The existence of zealots should not turn you away from christianity.

Being christian is about whether or not you believe in god and by extension jesus. Did zealots make you cease to believe in god/jesus? Why?

If anything, you should continue to be a christian to try and show people that there are more normal christians than extremists. You should challenge and look at their beliefs, their biblical interpretations, and compare them to yours. If you cease to be christian for a reason other than you've ceased to believe in god, then you weren't really that much of a christian before.

IMPORTANT: I have nothing against atheism, i'm just criticizing Arum's reasons so (s)he can think before making a large life change.

Seconded.  Being atheist is about not believing in a god or gods.  Zealots are irrelevant.  Look critically at an argument instead of the person/people behind it. 

Relevant: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HitlerAteSugar

Offline Pineapple

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529249#msg529249
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2012, 10:37:17 am »
People on facebook/youtube are being extremely ignorant to actual science. There are countless adults who believe god pulls everything to the ground, and not the sky, but could pull to the sky, when we know that won't happen cause of gravity. Some people don't even believe in the theory of evoloution, even though any sane person would believe in them.

I'm sorry, but what?

Yes, there are misinformed people everywhere.
There are Americans who don't know who Tony Blair is, there are people who don't know which state KFC is from, and there are people who don't know how many sides there are on a triangle (props to those who get the ref). Does that mean that we should not associate with Americans?
There are indigenous tribes in the heavily wooded areas of Africa. Some of these people can never see the horizon because it is always obscured by tree trunks. If a subset of those were to leave the forest and see a rhinoceros from far away, they may assume it is merely a small bug. Some may even declare it as witchcraft when they realize how things can so drastically change size in their field of vision.

These people are misinformed. However, if you associate with them, will you be misinformed? No.
These people are misinformed. However, does that mean they are ignorant or mentally unstable? No.
These people are misinformed. Will this cause a dramatic impact on their lives? Maybe not.

Do you think that, by turning away from religion, you can become a better person? Will you achieve this goal because becoming atheist makes you more open-minded?
Do you achieve this goal by believing in the theory of gravitation to explain why things fall? Do you achieve this goal by believing evidence on evolution without observing and verifying fossils first-hand? Do you achieve this goal by believing in CERN's data on the Higgs-Boson particle?
Do you undermine this goal by believing an entity who transcends time can create the universe as described in a certain written text? Do you undermine this goal by believing that something exists after death? Do you undermine this goal by believing that something out there has the willingness and ability to help you when you are alone?

IMPORTANT: I have nothing against atheism, i'm just criticizing Arum's reasons so (s)he can think before making a large life change.

Offline ArumTopic starter

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529250#msg529250
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2012, 11:00:01 am »
No, it is not that they are misinformed, it is that they actually believe that evoloutin is a lie. I believe it because I have seen and have proof of it.
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Offline Absol

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529256#msg529256
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2012, 11:45:36 am »
Oh.
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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529267#msg529267
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2012, 01:24:17 pm »
No, it is not that they are misinformed, it is that they actually believe that evoloutin is a lie. I believe it because I have seen and have proof of it.

I fail to see the difference. You can't possibly have directly experienced conclusive evidence for the theory of evolution, because that would require being able to observe the lives and deaths of entire species. If you would like to prove me wrong, just tell us what evidence you have. Until then, I'll assume you only have enough evidence for the theory of evolution as I have evidence for the existence of miracles.

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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529270#msg529270
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2012, 01:38:05 pm »
No, it is not that they are misinformed, it is that they actually believe that evoloutin is a lie. I believe it because I have seen and have proof of it.

I fail to see the difference. You can't possibly have directly experienced conclusive evidence for the theory of evolution, because that would require being able to observe the lives and deaths of entire species. If you would like to prove me wrong, just tell us what evidence you have. Until then, I'll assume you only have enough evidence for the theory of evolution as I have evidence for the existence of miracles.

Such evidence exists.

@Arum: major life changes require some heavy thought, if they are to be meaningful.  Are you sure that changing your outlook, based on the poor judgement of others, is the right way to go?  After all, the more moderate Christian churches don't deny evolution (United, Catholic, Anglican all come to mind immediately) - perhaps you've just fallen in with the wrong crowd?

For the record, I am an atheist as well - after many years of sifting the evidence (or lack thereof) for various religious outlooks.  As a teenager, my life goal was the Priesthood; for my own reasons I lost all faith in Scripture.  Though I support your personal growth, I sincerely hope that you're changing based on your own reasoning, rather than as a reactionary measure to some Youtube trolls.
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Re: ...I am now atheist. https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=42488.msg529271#msg529271
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2012, 01:49:42 pm »
No, it is not that they are misinformed, it is that they actually believe that evoloutin is a lie. I believe it because I have seen and have proof of it.

I fail to see the difference. You can't possibly have directly experienced conclusive evidence for the theory of evolution, because that would require being able to observe the lives and deaths of entire species. If you would like to prove me wrong, just tell us what evidence you have. Until then, I'll assume you only have enough evidence for the theory of evolution as I have evidence for the existence of miracles.

Such evidence exists.

@Arum: major life changes require some heavy thought, if they are to be meaningful.  Are you sure that changing your outlook, based on the poor judgement of others, is the right way to go?  After all, the more moderate Christian churches don't deny evolution (United, Catholic, Anglican all come to mind immediately) - perhaps you've just fallen in with the wrong crowd?

For the record, I am an atheist as well - after many years of sifting the evidence (or lack thereof) for various religious outlooks.  As a teenager, my life goal was the Priesthood; for my own reasons I lost all faith in Scripture.  Though I support your personal growth, I sincerely hope that you're changing based on your own reasoning, rather than as a reactionary measure to some Youtube trolls.
No. It is not because of the youtube trolls, but because it's been happening too long. BE CHRISTIAN BE CHRISTIAN BECHRISTIAN is all the bible says, and frankly, I've just had enough that I up and went atheist.
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