Veens Vicious Viotech/ VVV (upgraded FG Killer, for score and electrum, 95% EM)

[gumbeh]

I made a couple of plays that probably would have made them game less close. I could have gotten EM if I had not played my stilletto and/or saved my antimatter. Then again I may have also died sooner without them. I also intended for the fractal condors to draw out Rewind, but drawing out Scarabs works in a different way. 

I think I'll run against Lionheart a few times In trainer and see how easily we could make a deckout strategy for him. PPE: Done. Writing up the guide now.

I'd like to add that this isn't the best thing in the world to do. If you're not stupid/unlucky like me, you could possibly get a 50% win rate against him. But the games will be relatively long, and most of the time you're going to wish you were playing someone else.

Here's what I would do with each card in an attempt to deckout Lionheart, with a very abnormal method. (note I've only used this a couple of times before today, so my knowledge on the deck is rusty):

Early game:
You have to have Permafrost, Shards/Sancs, and Hourglasses out early. These are the major reasons I survived at all. Jade Shield can be played before Permafrost shield for minor defense, but otherwise should be discarded. PA can be used on any permanent, or discarded if need be.

If you draw both Aflatoxins early, use them on Saders and attempt to fill his field and prevent incoming damage with healing and/or a shield (preferably the latter if not both). Otherwise you can try to save it for the first Scarabs. If you draw your Dagger before he gets Anubis or for the spell, play the Dagger as well.

Mid-game:
Assuming you survive the first few turns, you've likely got your defenses set up and plenty of hourglasses. If you played both Afla, his field will soon fill up and I believe you'll have the best chance to win in this scenario, and could possible execute The Combo if you're really lucky. This seems like it would be an anomaly though.

If you played Dagger, wait for him to Endow it, and then Antimatter them (or Anubis) for the most possible healing. Sky Blitz should be played as soon as you draw it or discarded, because it's useless if you try to deck him out. Play Purify as soon as you draw it, and Rain of Fire once he has three Scarabs.

EDIT: Facepalm. You can PA the Dagger if you can't pull a trick with Anti-Vaders.
EDIT 2: Putting Cells on his field is a poor move, he'll rewind it and keeping playing it, and he won't quint it. Discarding is a better option.
He also won't rewind anti-mattered creatures, so you want to antimatter one early to stay alive, re-antimatter it late so he quints it, and waste/discard the third.

Late game:
Stop drawing just before the time where he would deck out before you. Keep track of the amount of hourglasses he has every turn. By now you should only have Fractal, Condor, Heal, and possibly Chimera, Dagger, and Aflatoxin. If you saved your Dagger, play it once his field is basically full and all his Crusaders have endowed themselves.

If you didn't use or discard your Aflas and Chimera, you can try a trick where you create Cells on your own field. If you do this, make sure it's on the same turn you fractal the condors. If you can get yourself a set of Condors (and possibly Cells), you can allow them to be rewound/eaten, so Lionheart is less able to prevent deckout.

Once he has 0 or one cards left, play the Dagger (if you weren't able to work around Crusaders) and the Heal, and end your turn. You'll automatically win because Lionheart can't draw his required cards. If you succeed in doing all this, and have a good amount of luck as well, you can lulz and watch Lionheart helplessly deck himself out.

This has 2 or 3 semi-conflicting strategies in it...

[Veen]

I use this deck since one wekk an it was just awsome !

I modify it like that :

- 1 antimater
- 1 PA
- 1 Vampire dagger
- 1 Purify
- 1 Alfatoxin

+ 2 pulvy (for control)
+ 1 death nymph (good hp, can kill creature you don't have antimatter combo with soul catcher)
+ 1 Tower
+ 1 SoG
+ 1 Soul catcher (combo with death nymph to earn quantum)

To be honest with you, these are horrible modifications to the deck. Play the original deck and you will come up with much better results (that is if you have the cards)

[ddevans96]

This has 2 or 3 semi-conflicting strategies in it...

Would you mind pointing them out? I left in quite a few possible branches you could possibly take, I ironed out any actual 'conflicting strategies'.

[gumbeh]

This has 2 or 3 semi-conflicting strategies in it...

Would you mind pointing them out? I left in quite a few possible branches you could possibly take, I ironed out any actual 'conflicting strategies'.

Rereading it, I see that there were changes between when I had read it and when I finally replied to it. Now I'd say the only "conflict" is that you suggest allowing your dagger to be Endowed early-game, and only later do you mention the (safer) option of PAing it. Maybe write it more like "so, dagger! you have 2 choices!", and less like "btw also, in addition to gambling, you have the option to play carefully".

Veen, I have good news and bad news: I finally played enough games to normalize the stats! Unfortunately, the stats went down because I kept getting rushed, or finding myself with a hand full of end-game cards when I really needed early-game defenses. It may still be possible to hit a fairly high FGei with this deck. Don't be discouraged by the numbers going down a bit. "VVV" is still:

- a VERY fun deck - everyone who's tried it loves the feel of insane OTK massive chimeras and vultures. Some people enjoy "VVV" enough to regularly choose it over a boring deck with better numbers
- a deck that puts out strong, solid numbers for FG grinding - maybe not TOP-tier, but still VERY good

When the data gets adjusted for skips I think it'll pull ahead a bit. How far it pulls ahead depends on how much the other decks benefit from skipping. Here are the new stats. Even if they're not as pretty it's my duty to post them for SCIENCE!

deck	Veens Vicious Viotech
players	Gumbeh

version	1.283		win-rate	45.99%
$ track ?	enabled		win-rate (n)	44.82%
games	137		Score/h	500
win-loss-(EM)	63-74-(44)		Score/h (n)	482
time (h:m:s)	09:16:09		FGei[c]* (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,14626.0.html)	3198
min/game	04:04		FGei[cn]* (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,14626.0.html)	3140

      Statmasta™4000                                                                *assumed card-spin/win: 35%

score/h	FGei(c)	Statmasta™4000	wins	losses	skips	EM/Wins
-1077    643    566    705    1053    -13500    -395    799    262    640    99    805    338    -569       -818    1017    316    -81    912    1069    1282    353    755    264    1306    -508    635    992    87	-1077    3552    3630    3698    5124    -13500    -395    3889    2586    3819    1798    4436    2625    -569       -818    4952    2502    788    4760    5200    5619    2695    4376    2314    5725    -508    3712    4572    2608	Akebono Chaos Lord Dark Matter Decay Destiny Divine Glory Dream Catcher Elidnis Eternal Phoenix Ferox Fire Queen Gemini Graviton Hecate Hermes Incarnate Jezebel Lionheart Miracle Morte Neptune Obliterator Octane Osiris Paradox Rainbow Scorpio Seism Serket	3    2    3    2             2    2    3    1    2    1            2    2    1    6    4    4    3    4    3    4        4    4    1	4     1     3     1     1      3     3     1     4     3     2     2     2     4     4     1     3     4     2     2         5     3     4         6     3     1     2		1      2      2      2                  2      1      2            2      1                  2      1            3      4      4      2      2      1      4            2      4

Full spreadsheet avail here:
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,25609.msg408955#msg408955

[Veen]

Haha, thanks Gumbeh For science it is then Also may I compliment you on the work youve done for this thread.

[Gocubbies1212]

which version of this deck works the best so far?  I'm thinking about selling my CCYB  for it...

[Xenocidius]

which version of this deck works the best so far?  I'm thinking about selling my CCYB  for it...

Probably not a good idea - CCYB wins more and is faster.

[Gocubbies1212]

which version of this deck works the best so far?  I'm thinking about selling my CCYB  for it...

Probably not a good idea - CCYB wins more and is faster.

yes, but it is unbearably boring...  I havnt FG grinded once since arena came out simply because I'm playing fun decks against it.

[ddevans96]

This has 2 or 3 semi-conflicting strategies in it...

Would you mind pointing them out? I left in quite a few possible branches you could possibly take, I ironed out any actual 'conflicting strategies'.

Rereading it, I see that there were changes between when I had read it and when I finally replied to it. Now I'd say the only "conflict" is that you suggest allowing your dagger to be Endowed early-game, and only later do you mention the (safer) option of PAing it. Maybe write it more like "so, dagger! you have 2 choices!", and less like "btw also, in addition to gambling, you have the option to play carefully".

Ah, that makes sense. I'll edit that later then

[Jappert]

I've only played a few matches so  far and haven't won yet vs Hermes, FFQ and Neptune.

No shields in all of those matches before I could get my combo off is what killed me. I'll playtest some more before voicing my opinion though but I think I'd like some more shields in there!

[Veen]

Either bad luck or you playing it wrong You have to get a feel for when to play your aflatoxin, its obviously not smart if you have no shields and no big AM'd creatures and you let the cells kill you.

on a side note, hermes is pretty difficult

[ddevans96]

My original guide to decking out Lionheart needs major revamps, on further analysis. I would definitely not consider attempting to deckout Lionheart every time you play him, but depending on the early field, it could be a lot of fun (for me at least )