Post by: Essence on June 28, 2011, 01:15:55 am
The beauty should be immediately apparent to all observers. Full credit to jmizzle, I think I modified one or twos card to make it perfect for Silver League.
Edit: after winning 3 rarespins in Gold League out of 20 games, I added the [Gold League] tag to this as well because I figure anything speedbow-y that has a 50%+ winrate in Gold League is probably doing pretty well.
[edit]Update: Works 150% better for Gold with -1 Graboid, -1 Archangel, +1 Pulverizer, +1 Crusader. Very worthwhile changeup.[/edit]
Post by: TheCrazyMango on June 28, 2011, 01:17:54 am
i would also use a morning star over archangel
Post by: Camoninja on June 28, 2011, 02:03:01 am
It sort of reminds me of one of the silver NPCs. I think it was Eve Silver.
Post by: ralouf on June 28, 2011, 04:47:53 am
Post by: Essence on June 28, 2011, 05:04:13 am
Post by: The_Mormegil on June 28, 2011, 09:00:53 am
It's an answer to the same problems and MORE (you can use it to bypass Bonewalls exactly as you do with Adren, and you can beat stalls - aether stalls in particular - thanks to that + Steals). Also, it has the same weaknesses, just 1 more cost and produces more damage, generally.
Post by: ralouf on June 28, 2011, 09:37:11 am
We can put an arsenic as a weapon ? or it is too slow ?
Post by: TheCrazyMango on June 28, 2011, 02:52:52 pm
Post by: Essence on June 28, 2011, 05:55:41 pm
Post by: ddevans96 on June 28, 2011, 06:03:38 pm
On a side note...I guess we'll be having an Arena archive eventually as well? :)
Post by: Essence on June 28, 2011, 07:01:32 pm
Post by: ralouf on June 28, 2011, 07:14:01 pm
Post by: Essence on June 28, 2011, 07:31:13 pm
Post by: Camoninja on June 28, 2011, 08:59:40 pm
Post by: TheForbiddenOracle on June 29, 2011, 02:48:10 pm
Post by: kirchj33 on June 30, 2011, 04:33:08 am
Post by: wavedash on June 30, 2011, 04:41:59 am
Post by: ralouf on June 30, 2011, 04:50:16 am
Great deck. Stamp of approval. I wouldn't change a thing, particularly adding a weapon. Those seem to be the main steal targets. Won two upped cards from gold in an hour with it.How do you win upped cards in gold ?
Post by: willng3 on June 30, 2011, 04:56:44 am
It's been changed. Check the T500 thread for the latest details: Both Gold and Platinum offer upped cards from the special spins now.Great deck. Stamp of approval. I wouldn't change a thing, particularly adding a weapon. Those seem to be the main steal targets. Won two upped cards from gold in an hour with it.How do you win upped cards in gold ?
Tried this deck myself, lots of fun and it definitely works. Nice work.
Post by: TheCrazyMango on June 30, 2011, 07:05:58 pm
Post by: phaedrus on July 01, 2011, 04:37:20 am
Will keep trying.
Post by: wavedash on July 01, 2011, 04:50:42 am
Post by: RavingRabbid on July 03, 2011, 01:18:15 pm
Also, -Angel +Glory?
Post by: Pwnator on July 03, 2011, 01:51:29 pm
Post by: Calindu on July 04, 2011, 05:44:48 pm
Post by: Genuinous on July 04, 2011, 10:45:12 pm
Running -1 Graboid, -1 Archangel, -1 Epi, +1 Heal, +1 Pulvy & +1 Crusader and it works wonders. Getting quite lucky in Gold (5 special spins out of 7 attempts).I've been using this variant and worked great :)
Pulvy is really needed and Crusader can get great abilities and higher attack than the Archangel.
Also healing sometimes crucial so the heal is a great bonus.
Only problem: I tend to run really low on :gravity, especially in longer games when I'm forced to take out many perms..
Post by: Thiefboy109 on July 06, 2011, 12:01:14 am
Post by: ralouf on July 06, 2011, 06:19:44 am
However I use a speedbow but not this one at all.
Post by: Malao on July 07, 2011, 02:55:57 am
Post by: bongoz on July 07, 2011, 03:02:52 am
Post by: Malao on July 07, 2011, 04:47:31 am
Post by: Hodari on July 07, 2011, 05:12:18 am
Also had a fun game earlier where I stole someone's mindgate...next turn used it and found their top card was...nightmare. kept them locked that way for the next 5 or so turns for the win. First time I ever pulled that combo off
Post by: omegareaper7 on July 07, 2011, 05:13:18 am
which better for score silver or gold?I don't know for sure, but i would say gold. Can't go wrong with 280+ score for a single EM.
Post by: Malao on July 07, 2011, 05:22:24 am
Post by: omegareaper7 on July 07, 2011, 05:27:49 am
wait a sec would gold be better then ai3 or not??Once again, hard to say. I would be willing to bet with a decent win rate/Em rate it very well could be.
Post by: Malao on July 07, 2011, 05:34:34 am
Post by: omegareaper7 on July 07, 2011, 05:46:14 am
Post by: Malao on July 07, 2011, 05:56:01 am
Post by: Hodari on July 07, 2011, 06:19:57 am
hmm how bout a fractal for the lava destroyer ( or anything cheap) for if your in a longer game and u have firefly queen out generating the fireflies = lots of spare fire quantaI'd think if a game is going that long with this deck, you're in trouble anyway
Post by: Calindu on July 07, 2011, 07:30:49 am
Usually i finish a game in like 11 turns(i managed a 6 turns win with a good draw,TU-ed adrenalined chargers in turn 3 or 4)(or i got finished in 6-7 turns),and if a game takes long you have a good advantage of the field.hmm how bout a fractal for the lava destroyer ( or anything cheap) for if your in a longer game and u have firefly queen out generating the fireflies = lots of spare fire quantaI'd think if a game is going that long with this deck, you're in trouble anyway
Example:You have fire shield and maxwell,you have flayer against flying weapons or FFQ/oty,you have adrenalined chargers against mono-aether.
Post by: Malao on July 07, 2011, 09:12:09 am
Post by: Calindu on July 07, 2011, 09:30:37 am
hmmm at the moment in gold im failing cant win a special spin only once been at 3/4 any ideas on what i might be doing wrong?First,adrenaline charger then TU,it is my hard hitter.
2.Against fire rushes a fire shield before they can receive creatures is important.Then you can just play maxwell and a bone wall.
3.Against mono-aether you steal the shield after you can OTK them.
4.Against rainbows you need to play that BH in 1st or 2nd turn.
5.Quit against mono-gravity.
Post by: funplay on July 07, 2011, 10:38:44 am
My experiences:
- the deck sacrifices some speed damage for mid to late game control (e.g. fire shield, elite queen are more useful the longer the game lasts)
-> i lost some games without the chance of playing more expensive cards
- the deck lacks a bit PC, so annoying stuff like shields slow you down enough to allow stall decks to set up their defenses
-> quite a number of stall decks feature a number of steals themselves, reducing the value of your own shields
- against other speedbows the deck lacks early defenses
-> bone wall + maxwell is great, but maxwell is the only way to kill creatures, thus not really reliable
Still, i think it is an interesting approach and a nice deck... but i personally think something like this might be a bit better (though i havent done enough testing to prove my opinion)...well, at least thats the I personally prefer atm. Wings plus spiders just works great ;):
Code: [Select]
6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u3 713 713 745 77g 77g 7ah 7dm 7dm 7dq 7gv 7ju 7n8 7n8 7q5 7t9 7tb 80a 80a 80g
Post by: Calindu on July 07, 2011, 10:48:08 am
Post by: usux on July 07, 2011, 12:44:55 pm
hmmm at the moment in gold im failing cant win a special spin only once been at 3/4 any ideas on what i might be doing wrong?Nothing. There are some nasty gold decks out there- you can get killed in 4-5 turns and have absolutely no response for it, you can get quanta locked with quicksand/ black holes, poison/ firelance stall, mass creature and/ or permanent control can all absolutely crush you too.
I've played a lot of games with this deck and small variants recently, gained a lot of score and had some upgraded spins but not that many- farming FGs is much more efficient in terms of winning upgraded cards but the state of the gold rewards means the straight up electrum gains have been pretty good and being able to take a break from FG farming and try out all the other player- made decks is just fun.
The deck is competitive- occasionally you can get the upgraded spin, sometimes you'll get to beat decks with absolutely sick win/ loss records but often you'll win 3 games then lose the fourth and miss out on an upgraded spin.
I think that the crusader/ pulverizer combo over archangel/ second grabboid/ morning glory has worked best for me.
Post by: Essence on July 07, 2011, 05:19:40 pm
I think that the crusader/ pulverizer combo over archangel/ second grabboid/ morning glory has worked best for me.
Word. I'm liking that change so much that I'm about to go update the OP with it. :)
Post by: Malao on July 08, 2011, 01:05:44 am
Post by: wavedash on July 08, 2011, 02:21:40 am
wow the new varient works wonders for me first game 5 turn win :)Your incredibly valid and extensive statistical analysis is very helpful.
Post by: Essence on July 09, 2011, 12:10:30 am
Post by: Svenningen on July 10, 2011, 01:06:15 pm
This deck is great fun aswell as being very versatile!
Post by: Thiefboy109 on July 10, 2011, 06:01:33 pm
Post by: Addicted on July 11, 2011, 01:22:17 am
Post by: Essence on July 11, 2011, 01:44:10 am
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 11, 2011, 03:01:16 am
1) adrenaline is a great damage booster, and it can take care of opponent creatures (if you have fire buckler), however, I find that it's often useless, and I think either another heal, a jade staff (decent heal), or a cockatrice might be better
2) two hourglasses are way too excessive, I know that they are there to help draw out PC, but I still feel just one is enough, replacing an hourglass with another QT seems to help more
3) fire buckler + maxwell's demon = evil, fire buckler ---> bone wall + maxwell's demon = evil x 9001, however, the combo is rarely pulled off, and often times, the fact that fire buckler doesn't block damage, and kills creatures slower than one would want, I think wings would be better, this does, however, upset the quanta balance quite a bit, but I think it's quite worth it
just something I gathered
Post by: Hodari on July 11, 2011, 03:28:33 am
1) adrenaline is a great damage booster, and it can take care of opponent creatures (if you have fire buckler), however, I find that it's often useless, and I think either another heal, a jade staff (decent heal), or a cockatrice might be betterNot sure how you can possibly say it's useless...it can be used on nearly any creature to add a lot of extra damage(especially if you TU that creatures as well) and often that extra damage can be the difference between winning or not with this deck.
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 11, 2011, 03:46:26 am
usually, when I use it, I would win without it, and it has never saved me in any tough spots, while the heal for example has saved my sry butt countless of times, that's why I consider it inferior to another heal1) adrenaline is a great damage booster, and it can take care of opponent creatures (if you have fire buckler), however, I find that it's often useless, and I think either another heal, a jade staff (decent heal), or a cockatrice might be betterNot sure how you can possibly say it's useless...it can be used on nearly any creature to add a lot of extra damage(especially if you TU that creatures as well) and often that extra damage can be the difference between winning or not with this deck.
Post by: Hodari on July 11, 2011, 04:32:21 am
usually, when I use it, I would win without it, and it has never saved me in any tough spots, while the heal for example has saved my sry butt countless of times, that's why I consider it inferior to another healConsidering this deck has very limited defensive capability and relies more on killing the opponent quickly, I find it hard to imagine that a card which can easily add 50 or more damage in a game would not make a difference for you. I've certainly had plenty of games where I'm one turn away from dying and the extra damage from adrenaline is enough to win(not to mention the additional damage it did on previous turns as well). If anything, I'd say heal is less likely to save you as towards the later part of the game, many decks will easily be doing more than 20 damage per turn.
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 11, 2011, 04:33:28 am
as I understand, this deck is much more focused on defense than just about most speed bows out there...usually, when I use it, I would win without it, and it has never saved me in any tough spots, while the heal for example has saved my sry butt countless of times, that's why I consider it inferior to another healConsidering this deck has very limited defensive capability and relies more on killing the opponent quickly, I find it hard to imagine that a card which can easily add 50 or more damage in a game would not make a difference for you. I've certainly had plenty of games where I'm one turn away from dying and the extra damage from adrenaline is enough to win(not to mention the additional damage it did on previous turns as well). If anything, I'd say heal is less likely to save you as towards the later part of the game, many decks will easily be doing more than 20 damage per turn.
Post by: Hodari on July 11, 2011, 05:02:38 am
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 11, 2011, 05:25:14 am
compared to a speedbow maybe, compared to false god decks, no. You have one shield which can absorb maybe 7-10 attacks(couple rounds at best if they have time to set up and get their deck working in many cases), one which slowly kills their creatures but doesn't protect you at all, one creature(2 if you TU it) that can kill SOME of the stronger creatures they might play, 1 per turn, and a couple heals...not much if they have time to set up any real offense...again, you really need to win quickly. Many of my games are over in 5-7 turns, even on gold/platinum with their higher hp. Adrenaline can add as much as 18 damage per turn which is hardly insignificant.my games last up to 15-20 turns, maybe my bad luck, but I am almost always matched against stalls, and adrenaline is useless
the few games that lasted less than 10 turns resulted in me losing
Post by: Hodari on July 11, 2011, 05:37:47 am
my games last up to 15-20 turns, maybe my bad luck, but I am almost always matched against stalls, and adrenaline is uselessNot if you use it on the charger then...or steal/destroy their shield and SoGs
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 11, 2011, 05:47:41 am
I am not a noob, I know what I should target with steals, as for my adrenaline target, I choose whatever is most beneficial, and if I can, I do choose chargermy games last up to 15-20 turns, maybe my bad luck, but I am almost always matched against stalls, and adrenaline is uselessNot if you use it on the charger then...or steal/destroy their shield and SoGs
Post by: kirchj33 on July 11, 2011, 11:04:01 pm
Post by: Thiefboy109 on July 11, 2011, 11:07:50 pm
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/97/takethatplatinum.png/
EDIT: WOW, fail draw for Immo Rush, he got 1 destroyer out the whole game and maxwell killed it, EM easily. 3 wins in my first try, should add Plat to the title =0
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/4/takethatplatinum2.png/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/69/takethatplatinum3.png/
My version isn't even fully upped yet...
But then... NOOOOOOOOOO!!! I need a SoG!
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/713/noooooov.png/
Post by: shasd on July 12, 2011, 05:12:28 pm
This is my current deck for Arena. Not my farming deck, but the one it auto plays. Seems to have a pretty solid win rate. My Oracle card is pandemonium.
I think I'm gonna put 2 SoG in it.
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 12, 2011, 05:25:13 pm
(http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/1753/silverqz.png)this deck is not for arena defense deck....
This is my current deck for Arena. Not my farming deck, but the one it auto plays. Seems to have a pretty solid win rate. My Oracle card is pandemonium.
*facepalm*
Post by: shasd on July 12, 2011, 05:41:00 pm
Post by: Essence on July 12, 2011, 05:45:43 pm
Post by: Calindu on July 12, 2011, 05:52:13 pm
Shasd's point, I think, is that his deck is JMZ + 5 Panda. WHich is funny as hell. :)But very very heavy on entropy quanta(w/o triple mark i don't know how u can power it.
Post by: shasd on July 12, 2011, 07:12:18 pm
@Essence: Yes, I got Panda as my Oracle card and was like hmm why not try it.Shasd's point, I think, is that his deck is JMZ + 5 Panda. WHich is funny as hell. :)But very very heavy on entropy quanta(w/o triple mark i don't know how u can power it.
@calindu221: My bad 3 of the Supernovas are actually Novas. I don't even have double mark. All the skills the deck has is the 60 upped cards.
*Edit* 6/2 in Silver right now and it's only been up for a few hours.
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 12, 2011, 07:25:46 pm
no offense, but that deck has 6/2 in silver?
why are ppl failing playing against silver..
Post by: shasd on July 12, 2011, 07:57:52 pm
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 12, 2011, 11:55:06 pm
Post by: shasd on July 13, 2011, 12:02:22 am
(http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/1898/silverwins.png)
@gocubbies1212: Yes, that seems to be the general consensus. From my personal experience it is a very good change.
Post by: Essence on July 13, 2011, 12:06:39 am
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 13, 2011, 09:56:58 pm
Post by: TheForbiddenOracle on July 13, 2011, 10:16:17 pm
why do you use hourglasses instead of precogs?I'm guessing PC targets and it's reusable
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 13, 2011, 10:27:43 pm
yeah... ive been playing it for a bit and already realized hourglasses are better, desipte the small deck. thanks :Dwhy do you use hourglasses instead of precogs?I'm guessing PC targets and it's reusable
Post by: shasd on July 13, 2011, 10:32:12 pm
-1 Angel, -1 Graboid,-1 Heal, +1 Pulv, +1 Crusader, +2 SoG. Getting fairly decent EM rate.
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 13, 2011, 10:38:41 pm
Oddly enough, I've found farming AI4 with this deck is much better for score. It's kind of a toss up between AI4 and Gold for me for Electrum/upped cards.if you have to take something out for the SoGs, i would take out the black hole because im facing a lot of mono decks and not getting much hp with the bh.
-1 Angel, -1 Graboid,-1 Heal, +1 Pulv, +1 Crusader, +2 SoG. Getting fairly decent EM rate.
Post by: shasd on July 13, 2011, 10:42:43 pm
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 13, 2011, 10:49:11 pm
The BH is amazing. Most decks in Silver and Gold are running Novas or SNovas, IF you get off an early BH they get shut down for 3-4 turns.well just not my lucky day then. :/
Post by: shasd on July 13, 2011, 11:23:19 pm
Post by: parasite99 on July 14, 2011, 12:13:33 am
There are a lot of decks in the tiers. As soon as you switch something out to deal with what you're getting it'll give you decks you need what you switched lol. Such is life.say wat??
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 14, 2011, 12:21:49 am
Post by: parasite99 on July 14, 2011, 12:23:29 am
Post by: shasd on July 14, 2011, 12:40:48 am
Post by: Bhlewos on July 17, 2011, 09:11:00 pm
Post by: thatnewguy on July 19, 2011, 07:30:02 pm
Although, I am debating on switching out a steal for a nightmare for heals and GotP synergy. The GotP is always unupped just because I haven't upped it yet :p
Post by: wavedash on July 19, 2011, 07:40:07 pm
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 19, 2011, 08:07:18 pm
Post by: The_Mormegil on July 19, 2011, 09:30:40 pm
Post by: Bhlewos on July 20, 2011, 02:59:36 am
Post by: funplay on July 20, 2011, 12:02:00 pm
Considering the increased number of Fire and Life rushes in Gold, I'm wondering if replacing Lava Destroyer with a Firestorm might be a good idea. I'll test and see how well that works.The card I am mostly thinking about changing is Firebuckler...atm I keep the buckler and take a closer look if Firestorm would be more useful...any other ideas for exchange? Or the ohter way round: how often has fire buckler actually won your game?
Post by: Pwnator on July 20, 2011, 12:15:00 pm
how often has fire buckler actually won your game?Thrice against RoL/Hope, twice against Nightmare/GotP, 4+ times against :life rushes, and once against CCYB. The buckler seems quite useless on its own but that's what the Demon's for. It's even nastier once you've stolen/endowed an Eagle's Eye.
Then again, Fire Storm works wonders with Bone Wall, but I have yet to test that.
Post by: ralouf on July 20, 2011, 12:39:16 pm
I agree too for ultiharid > abyss crawler, the specter is the best life creature, I like to play one epipherine though. But with wings I use a phase recluse.
And I think BH I very good.. I'll post my list when I have some time in an other topic.
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 20, 2011, 04:27:36 pm
Post by: MeetJSquared on July 20, 2011, 06:48:39 pm
ive been thinking about exchanging fire buckler for a permafrost shield since you only use 2 :water in the whole deck.tried it, but the high cost really hurts its usefulness
Post by: Genuinous on July 21, 2011, 01:49:25 pm
-3 cost for the fire buckler is a great advantageive been thinking about exchanging fire buckler for a permafrost shield since you only use 2 :water in the whole deck.tried it, but the high cost really hurts its usefulness
fire buckler often helps maxwell to kill opponents creatures or just kill them by itself
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 21, 2011, 02:16:06 pm
true, but I'm having a hard time beating stall decks with growth creatures and dune scorpions in arena... I think the permafrost could help buy my some time against those. plus, it blocks damage.-3 cost for the fire buckler is a great advantageive been thinking about exchanging fire buckler for a permafrost shield since you only use 2 :water in the whole deck.tried it, but the high cost really hurts its usefulness
fire buckler often helps maxwell to kill opponents creatures or just kill them by itself
Post by: MeetJSquared on July 21, 2011, 10:49:59 pm
in those cases, i just hope to draw my ulitharid. by the time you could get perma shield out, it would probably be too late anyway, especially with dune, since they can come out within the first 3 turns with momentumtrue, but I'm having a hard time beating stall decks with growth creatures and dune scorpions in arena... I think the permafrost could help buy my some time against those. plus, it blocks damage.-3 cost for the fire buckler is a great advantageive been thinking about exchanging fire buckler for a permafrost shield since you only use 2 :water in the whole deck.tried it, but the high cost really hurts its usefulness
fire buckler often helps maxwell to kill opponents creatures or just kill them by itself
Post by: nilsieboy on July 22, 2011, 09:25:29 am
ive been thinking about exchanging fire buckler for a permafrost shield since you only use 2 :water in the whole deck.you have a point there but it's very expensive and the fire buckler is great.
you might wanna try a version with squid instead? 2 cost for freeze can save your life against heavy damage opponents.
Post by: Barragor on July 22, 2011, 01:32:17 pm
But then again, Pulvy is a beast ^^
Looks good ^^
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 22, 2011, 07:25:50 pm
hmm good idea... I always tend to only use squids for showing off... I forget how useful they can be. ;Dive been thinking about exchanging fire buckler for a permafrost shield since you only use 2 :water in the whole deck.you have a point there but it's very expensive and the fire buckler is great.
you might wanna try a version with squid instead? 2 cost for freeze can save your life against heavy damage opponents.
Post by: HorooIchigo on July 23, 2011, 02:14:32 pm
6 Towers
6 SN
1 Maxwell Demon
1 Bone Wall
1 Elite Charger
1 Black Hole
1 Elite Graboid
1 Pulverizer
1 Improved Heal
1 Epinefrine
1 Fire Buckler
1 Lava Destroyer
1 Ulitharid
1 Crusader
1 Elite Queen
2 E. Hourglass
2 Imp Steal
1 TU
(Sorry for the written list, don't have all cards yet to make a deck image)
Post by: Essence on July 23, 2011, 02:18:37 pm
Post by: HorooIchigo on July 23, 2011, 02:20:01 pm
Post by: Hodari on July 23, 2011, 02:41:15 pm
(Sorry for the written list, don't have all cards yet to make a deck image)You can always use the trainer to make them.
Post by: ffun on July 23, 2011, 09:00:17 pm
Or this (http://elements.alanbeam.net/code_generator.php) very handy tool.(Sorry for the written list, don't have all cards yet to make a deck image)You can always use the trainer to make them.
Post by: HorooIchigo on July 27, 2011, 12:43:59 pm
Post by: Jappert on July 27, 2011, 03:47:45 pm
And for the rest, play what you can. You might wanna save up the steals if your expecting game changing permanents from the opponent (certain shields or weapons for example). You can use your blackhole to either deny the opponent quanta at the start of a match or for max healing in later stages.
Personally I'd make some changes like adding Forest spectre/wings shields and removing the heal/FFQ (counters alot of the current arena decks). In my opinion Gold League is quite tough with this deck, but Silver should be grindable.
I hope that helped!
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on July 28, 2011, 06:21:52 am
play my arena deck to find what I mean, my deck type in gold league will stay the same for I don't know how long, I am evil like that
the well-known deck arch-type is actually very easy to make with a lot of different possible oracle cards
dammit, I am not good on keeping secrets...
Post by: Barragor on July 28, 2011, 03:09:52 pm
Also, I ran this deck with squid and it worked pretty well...
I currently run this deck with some modifications and it's a very solid deck vs halfbloods
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 28, 2011, 04:30:11 pm
Post by: ralouf on July 28, 2011, 04:52:24 pm
You need to TU a creature with 7 attack to do 30 damage
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on July 28, 2011, 05:30:34 pm
If you TU an ffq with pi you will get (3*4)*2=24 damage not 30.oops! fixed. :p
You need to TU a creature with 7 attack to do 30 damage
Post by: baneon on July 29, 2011, 10:02:29 am
Post by: Mainiak on August 02, 2011, 03:45:18 pm
I guess it will be Towers and Novas? This would be nice as it'd have synergies with the CCYB.
I could soon manage something like this:
Or are there other cards which have to be upped?
Post by: ralouf on August 02, 2011, 04:05:25 pm
Post by: Calindu on August 02, 2011, 04:12:47 pm
Does it work semi-upgraded? Or which cards do I have to have upped to play this deck with a moderate win rate?First,change the graviton in a BH,there are a lot of rainbow's.Then i recommend upping the charger and the FFQ.
I guess it will be Towers and Novas? This would be nice as it'd have synergies with the CCYB.
I could soon manage something like this:
Or are there other cards which have to be upped?
Post by: Mainiak on August 02, 2011, 05:57:53 pm
The Gravition was a mistake in in the Trainer deckbuild... should have been a BH.
Post by: TheForbiddenOracle on August 02, 2011, 09:33:51 pm
Does it work semi-upgraded? Or which cards do I have to have upped to play this deck with a moderate win rate?Like Calindu said, Charger (with adrenaline it can create 15 damage per turn and it has a +3 increase in attack), Firefly Queen (The Fireflies have a +1 bonus and it grants :fire quanta, which gets the quanta for the Lava Destroyer and the Fire Shield/Buckler. I guess Crusader (Increased attack and defense, and decreased ability cost for the same play cost)/Pulverizer (Gravity is already heavily used with the Black Hole and Charger)/Graboid (+2 Damage is important)/Fire Buckler (-2 cost is necessary since :fire is really strained even with upped FFQ) next. Then Bonewall (-2 cost), Maxwell's Demon (+3 defense makes CC less effective on it, and it avoids accidentally paradoxing itself :P, then whatever is left I suppose
I guess it will be Towers and Novas? This would be nice as it'd have synergies with the CCYB.
I could soon manage something like this:
Or are there other cards which have to be upped?
Post by: Mainiak on August 04, 2011, 01:53:09 pm
Still not balanced, but runs solid, about 50% win after +50 games with 2 Spins. Equals easily electrum/score per min. compared to Grabbix fast AI3 grinding.
But I went easily 17-1 in Bronze with two spins and with very unlucky bad-draw-loss - 90-95% in Bronze isn't bad for rare farming. ;D
I'll upgrade the deck as you all suggested, so thanks for the advice. The game now starts to get smoothy with this semi-upped JMZ in Arena and the same ups in my CCYB for FGs.
Post by: DeathAngelx on August 22, 2011, 10:43:53 pm
Looks like :electrum for me!! ;D
Post by: Gocubbies1212 on August 23, 2011, 03:14:39 am
but charger isn't always the best thing to use adrenaline on... It's good when facing multiple shields because then there is no damage reduction, but really, it's attack is only increased by 8 (15-7=8). whereas if you adrenaline an FFQ or something with 3 attack, then that creature gets +9 attack (12-3=9) (not including shields).Does it work semi-upgraded? Or which cards do I have to have upped to play this deck with a moderate win rate?Like Calindu said, Charger (with adrenaline it can create 15 damage per turn and it has a +3 increase in attack), Firefly Queen (The Fireflies have a +1 bonus and it grants :fire quanta, which gets the quanta for the Lava Destroyer and the Fire Shield/Buckler. I guess Crusader (Increased attack and defense, and decreased ability cost for the same play cost)/Pulverizer (Gravity is already heavily used with the Black Hole and Charger)/Graboid (+2 Damage is important)/Fire Buckler (-2 cost is necessary since :fire is really strained even with upped FFQ) next. Then Bonewall (-2 cost), Maxwell's Demon (+3 defense makes CC less effective on it, and it avoids accidentally paradoxing itself :P, then whatever is left I suppose
I guess it will be Towers and Novas? This would be nice as it'd have synergies with the CCYB.
I could soon manage something like this:
Or are there other cards which have to be upped?
Post by: Calindu on August 23, 2011, 06:13:10 am
There are way to many shields(fog/fire shield) to worth using charger unupped.but charger isn't always the best thing to use adrenaline on... It's good when facing multiple shields because then there is no damage reduction, but really, it's attack is only increased by 8 (15-7=8). whereas if you adrenaline an FFQ or something with 3 attack, then that creature gets +9 attack (12-3=9) (not including shields).Does it work semi-upgraded? Or which cards do I have to have upped to play this deck with a moderate win rate?Like Calindu said, Charger (with adrenaline it can create 15 damage per turn and it has a +3 increase in attack), Firefly Queen (The Fireflies have a +1 bonus and it grants :fire quanta, which gets the quanta for the Lava Destroyer and the Fire Shield/Buckler. I guess Crusader (Increased attack and defense, and decreased ability cost for the same play cost)/Pulverizer (Gravity is already heavily used with the Black Hole and Charger)/Graboid (+2 Damage is important)/Fire Buckler (-2 cost is necessary since :fire is really strained even with upped FFQ) next. Then Bonewall (-2 cost), Maxwell's Demon (+3 defense makes CC less effective on it, and it avoids accidentally paradoxing itself :P, then whatever is left I suppose
I guess it will be Towers and Novas? This would be nice as it'd have synergies with the CCYB.
I could soon manage something like this:
Or are there other cards which have to be upped?
Post by: zamre on August 25, 2011, 10:27:17 am
I'm going to upgrade in order Golden Hourglass, Bone Wall, Graboid, Sapphire Charger, Lava golem, Parallel Universe, Fire Shield, Mind flayer, Adrenaline, Black Hole, Crusader, steal and heal.
Post by: Astrocyte on August 26, 2011, 07:30:48 pm
So don't hold back from trying this deck if you don't have it fully upped! Use whatever you've got and go make some money!
(Ups: Crusader, Elite Queen, Lava Destroyer, the 2 Hourglasses, and 4 Supernovas (just running plain Novas for the other 2). It'd be smarter to have QTs upped, of course -- but I don't have a lot of ups, this is just what I had lying around.)
Post by: zamre on August 28, 2011, 10:08:07 am
I am trying to use 31 cards, just 16 upgraded. I use -arcangel +crusader ( cause I don't have moneys for upgrade ) and a eagle's eye.So I have to change the weapon cause there's the problem of FQ that's need 7 air quanta to be played and so with the Eagle's eye there's too much consumption of air quanta. I was thinking for an arsenic or a pulverizer ( this one just if you change it for a graboid cause there's golem that need's 1 quanta per turn ) or a morning star at the place of the crusader.
I'm going to upgrade in order Golden Hourglass, Bone Wall, Graboid, Sapphire Charger, Lava golem, Parallel Universe, Fire Shield, Mind flayer, Adrenaline, Black Hole, Crusader, steal and heal.
Post by: manaboy100 on September 10, 2011, 09:06:22 am
Post by: Sewdri on September 12, 2011, 09:38:38 pm
Post by: Gandora on September 13, 2011, 06:23:32 am
and so begins the endless grinding to try and get this deck upped and then after a week after playing it i will become bored and grind endlessly for another deck... the cycle continues :(if you do it right, you'll always upgrade some new cards until you got every card upgraded. at that stage you can build whatever deck you like ;)
Post by: ralouf on September 13, 2011, 07:44:55 am
Post by: kirchj33 on September 14, 2011, 05:01:16 pm
Trust me if you want all upped cards you will upp cards totally useless (holy flash 9000 electrum, skeleton, 9000 electrum ... ) ^^/offtopic
Upping 6 floodings was one of the most painful experiences of my life!
Post by: Rember on September 14, 2011, 05:06:43 pm
Inundations aren't a problem thanks to our friendly water/air card donation 'god'. :PTrust me if you want all upped cards you will upp cards totally useless (holy flash 9000 electrum, skeleton, 9000 electrum ... ) ^^/offtopic
Upping 6 floodings was one of the most painful experiences of my life!
Post by: Calindu on September 14, 2011, 05:43:43 pm
Jmz beat neptune easy.Inundations aren't a problem thanks to our friendly water/air card donation 'god'. :PTrust me if you want all upped cards you will upp cards totally useless (holy flash 9000 electrum, skeleton, 9000 electrum ... ) ^^/offtopic
Upping 6 floodings was one of the most painful experiences of my life!
Post by: zamre on September 16, 2011, 12:49:52 pm
With the 4 SoG you can easily do EM and with the 2 sanctuary you can protect yourself from Black Hole.
Post by: TheForbiddenOracle on September 16, 2011, 11:40:53 pm
Actually i'm using those cards:That looks waay too fat to be honest. It looks like your deck is closer to CCYB (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,25878.0.html), so try it out.
With the 4 SoG you can easily do EM and with the 2 sanctuary you can protect yourself from Black Hole.
Post by: Solyk on October 24, 2011, 03:16:42 pm
Post by: Rutarete on October 25, 2011, 01:10:46 am
Post by: furballdn on October 25, 2011, 01:19:10 am
Would you say that a Vamp. Dagger is then next best weapon if you don't have Pulvy?Pulvy is for the permanent control.
Post by: Rutarete on October 25, 2011, 01:21:43 am
I realize that; I don't have the Pulvy :( What's the next best thing to replace it with?Would you say that a Vamp. Dagger is then next best weapon if you don't have Pulvy?Pulvy is for the permanent control.
Post by: furballdn on October 25, 2011, 01:23:32 am
Err, now that I think about it, the deck in the OP doesn't have a pulvy. If you don't have a pulvy you could always grind AI3/bronze.I realize that; I don't have the Pulvy :( What's the next best thing to replace it with?Would you say that a Vamp. Dagger is then next best weapon if you don't have Pulvy?Pulvy is for the permanent control.
Post by: Rutarete on October 25, 2011, 01:25:27 am
There's an edit at the bottom saying to add a Pulvy (among other changes)Err, now that I think about it, the deck in the OP doesn't have a pulvy. If you don't have a pulvy you could always grind AI3/bronze.I realize that; I don't have the Pulvy :( What's the next best thing to replace it with?Would you say that a Vamp. Dagger is then next best weapon if you don't have Pulvy?Pulvy is for the permanent control.
Post by: Brontos on October 25, 2011, 01:56:48 am
The point is to have a good pool of PC. Against Firestall, mono-aether etc, you will need 2/3 PC. In this JMZ, you have Pulv, Steal, Crusader-Pulv.
You also need to respect the balance of quanta usage. If you don't play Pulveriser and add a Vampire dagger, you have to wonder if you won't have too much Earth and not enough Darkness.
I play a Vampire dagger with Crusader in my rainbow, it's strong. But I have enough PC aside of it. :)
Post by: Essence on October 25, 2011, 08:51:04 pm
Post by: FuryGhost on October 25, 2011, 10:31:06 pm
Code: [Select]
5ia 5iaTo counter it all. Otherwise it's no fun.
Post by: Brontos on October 26, 2011, 01:47:12 am
Too much poison.
Post by: ninetyfools on October 26, 2011, 01:48:53 am
Lately arena is brutal with poison.... I am running an extra twoThat us a huge deck. 2 cards. Teehee.Code: [Select]5ia 5ia
To counter it all. Otherwise it's no fun.
Post by: furballdn on October 26, 2011, 02:00:31 am
Sure you don't need hourglasses bro?Lately arena is brutal with poison.... I am running an extra twoThat us a huge deck. 2 cards. Teehee.Code: [Select]5ia 5ia
To counter it all. Otherwise it's no fun.
Post by: FuryGhost on October 26, 2011, 04:14:17 am
Post by: omegareaper7 on October 26, 2011, 07:20:04 pm
Lol, you don't need hourglasses if you have enough purities.You do if you always want to reliably draw one.
Post by: Phaser on October 27, 2011, 03:27:08 am
more cards.Please?
Post by: Filly678 on October 27, 2011, 03:31:34 am
Can you PLEASE make an unupped version of this while only having 1 supernova? And then I could get more money and upgradeNo. Pretty much all speedbows HAVE to use SN's to play their cards quickly. 2 quanta per element is pretty brutal.
more cards.Please?
Post by: furballdn on October 27, 2011, 04:27:35 am
Can you PLEASE make an unupped version of this while only having 1 supernova? And then I could get more money and upgradeIf you want an unupped version of this, you're going to need 6 supernovas at LEAST. 6 supernovas give you 12 of each quanta which is enough to power this deck. 1 supernova and 5 novas doesn't generate the quanta amount, nor does it generate quanta quickly enough.
more cards.Please?
Post by: FuryGhost on October 27, 2011, 09:22:30 am
It was sarcasm buddy.Lol, you don't need hourglasses if you have enough purities.You do if you always want to reliably draw one.
Post by: Plantifant on October 27, 2011, 10:04:37 am
Some people can't reconize sarcasm on the internet.......Cause you can'tIt was sarcasm buddy.Lol, you don't need hourglasses if you have enough purities.You do if you always want to reliably draw one.
Post by: MrMojo on November 14, 2011, 07:46:29 am
Im guessing Pillars+SN > Archangel > Fire Buckler > Bone Wall > Queen > Hourglasses > Charger > Everything else
Post by: FuryGhost on November 14, 2011, 10:47:59 pm
Upgrade priority?Don't do AA. The -AA -Graboid + Pulverizer +Crusader increases the effectiveness of the deck by A LOT.
Im guessing Pillars+SN > Archangel > Fire Buckler > Bone Wall > Queen > Hourglasses > Charger > Everything else
Post by: MrMojo on November 15, 2011, 05:42:30 am
Roger that.Upgrade priority?Don't do AA. The -AA -Graboid + Pulverizer +Crusader increases the effectiveness of the deck by A LOT.
Im guessing Pillars+SN > Archangel > Fire Buckler > Bone Wall > Queen > Hourglasses > Charger > Everything else
Im going Hourglasses > Buckler > Bone wall > everything else
Post by: Essence on November 15, 2011, 07:19:46 pm
Having that 7-attack charger available to Epi+PU is a lifesaver against lots of tough shield decks.
Post by: Gandora on November 20, 2011, 09:49:39 pm
So this are just some ideas which may be worth trying :)
I thought that the deck may be too slow against arena because they often have too much HP.
Thats why I changed Fire Buckler with spine carpace, which kills faster and blocks one damage.
But because of its cost I had to take out Epi and FFQ. This gave me the possibility to add Wings and Toadfish
to have more CC. Also the loss of Fire buckler let me add Rage elixier which can be used to kill the enemy
or on your steel golem or the crusader after he used endow. shard of divinity replaced heal. Also the golem
doesn't use your time quanta for the hourglass. And I changed BH with Nightmare, just because it also heals and can clock your enemy.
And I think if you have a speedbow against you in the arena, they get their quanta no matter what you do...
Post by: Brontos on November 20, 2011, 11:58:40 pm
- bone wall is not optimized in this deck as you have no CC machine like Oty. Maxwell won't be enough imo.
- crusader is not opti either. It's not a strong synergy with pulv as you won't have enough targets or :gravity most of the time.
- epi was great with the charger
- you play wings, but without spiders, it's sad :)
- a single nightmare is not a very good idea imo
- shard of divinity has nothing to do here
- it's a bit heavy on :earth
- ffq > spine carapace to use :life
Post by: Gandora on November 21, 2011, 09:48:25 pm
My comments:hm... but then I don't understand why crusader and pulverizer were recommended so much? because in this version
- bone wall is not optimized in this deck as you have no CC machine like Oty. Maxwell won't be enough imo.
- crusader is not opti either. It's not a strong synergy with pulv as you won't have enough targets or :gravity most of the time.
- epi was great with the charger
- you play wings, but without spiders, it's sad :)
- a single nightmare is not a very good idea imo
- shard of divinity has nothing to do here
- it's a bit heavy on :earth
- ffq > spine carapace to use :life
the black hole's missing so you got at least a little more :gravity quanta.
also, the toadfish supports the CC of maxwell, doesn't it?
I agree that wings, nightmare and shard of divinity are replaceable.
But why is FFQ better than spine carpace?
Thanks for your comment :) I always appreciate to learn something more :D
Post by: Brontos on November 21, 2011, 10:10:15 pm
FFQ is hard to kill, and propose a very good agressive way to use both air and green quantas while helping with fire.
Crusader and pulv is appreciated by some players, not me. :) As I said, too heavy on quantas, too fragile, too situational. But having a pulvy-crusader can be good against rainbow-control decks.
Archangel is way stronger in your deck imo. Heal is really good against firestall and diseases.
Fish+Maxwell is ok. But it's faaar less good than a single upped oty to supply a bone wall. Maybe some spiders could be better in death, and it would help your wings (if you keep it).
I'm scared to make you build one of my rainbows if we continue. :p
Post by: Essence on November 21, 2011, 10:57:16 pm
I agree about finding space for a Spider or two, though. Without them, Wings will simply fail in a surprising number of games (damn Phoenix/Ruby Dragon spam!)
Post by: Brontos on November 22, 2011, 02:35:14 am
I'm open minded and I can change my mind! 8)
But so far, in my rainbows, I need my :gravity to pay the Oty, I need my crusader to endow vampiric, and Deflags/Steals are doing a great job to clean up permanents because they are 100% reliable.
It's deckbuilding, Gandora can play Archange/Deflagl or Crusader/Pulvy if he wants. :)
Post by: ralouf on November 22, 2011, 01:19:36 pm
Just my thoughts.
Post by: shasd on November 22, 2011, 09:23:13 pm
(http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/9755/arenabow.png) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/710/arenabow.png/)
Other than the normal -1 grab, -1 angel, +1 pulv, +1 crusader, I have done -1 heal, -1 grab, +1 golem, +1 purify, +2 SoG
I've been considering trying to fit an Eagle's Eye and animate in here for more crusader and bone wall synergy.
Post by: ralouf on November 22, 2011, 09:35:25 pm
Post by: shasd on November 22, 2011, 09:37:59 pm
Post by: Gandora on November 22, 2011, 09:49:20 pm
Post by: furballdn on November 22, 2011, 11:03:35 pm
Post by: Colossus on November 22, 2011, 11:09:12 pm
SoGs generally aren't that useful unless you have a :life mark. Maybe use sanctuaries as they heal more and protect from BH?The light quantum would be very tight if you did it that way though. I've thought of doing the same thing, with Dark decks becoming overly used in Arena anymore. Yet, after the 5 (Summoning) + 2 (endow) the sanctuary may not get played in most games.
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on November 22, 2011, 11:16:49 pm
so maybe don't use crusader? :PSoGs generally aren't that useful unless you have a :life mark. Maybe use sanctuaries as they heal more and protect from BH?The light quantum would be very tight if you did it that way though. I've thought of doing the same thing, with Dark decks becoming overly used in Arena anymore. Yet, after the 5 (Summoning) + 2 (endow) the sanctuary may not get played in most games.
so far, I haven't found him to be too useful most of the time
Post by: furballdn on November 22, 2011, 11:19:56 pm
Post by: TheIdioticIdiot on November 22, 2011, 11:22:18 pm
-crusader +sanctuary?yeah, I think it can help
Post by: shasd on November 23, 2011, 12:21:01 am
Post by: MrMojo on November 23, 2011, 10:04:16 am
So I have this after a couple of weeks of grinding
First I'd just like to say it sure as heck beats FG grinding.
I like the feeling of actually winning a majority of my games :P
Does wonders for my score and the electrum gain isn't too ad either.
But now I'm stuck at at a fork in the road
I know you said to upgrade the charger but I'm wondering if I should upgrade the pulvy first. The deck is pretty tight on gravity quanta (and sometimes life/time)
Post by: shasd on November 23, 2011, 08:02:31 pm
Post by: furballdn on November 23, 2011, 11:45:01 pm
BH, charger, and pulvy will be tight on your :gravity. I usually wouldn't use BH unless you have discord or something. Chargers are much better upped since they gain 3 atk for the same cost.
So I have this after a couple of weeks of grinding
First I'd just like to say it sure as heck beats FG grinding.
I like the feeling of actually winning a majority of my games :P
Does wonders for my score and the electrum gain isn't too ad either.
But now I'm stuck at at a fork in the road
I know you said to upgrade the charger but I'm wondering if I should upgrade the pulvy first. The deck is pretty tight on gravity quanta (and sometimes life/time)
Post by: oblivion1212 on December 06, 2011, 09:52:55 am
i almost never get to pull off maxwell's demon + bonewall, so another CC maybe?
Post by: shasd on December 08, 2011, 09:22:09 am
anyone ever tried slipping in an otyugh in place of the other HG/BH ??I've tried it with an oty, but oty + pulv costs keeps you out of gravity and hurting to use either one more often than not I've found.
i almost never get to pull off maxwell's demon + bonewall, so another CC maybe?
Post by: hell7fire1 on January 07, 2012, 04:07:59 pm
I've been running this since I posted on it forever ago. This is the current version I am using.-2 SoGs +1 Eagle's Eye +1 animate weapon
(http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/9755/arenabow.png) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/710/arenabow.png/)
Other than the normal -1 grab, -1 angel, +1 pulv, +1 crusader, I have done -1 heal, -1 grab, +1 golem, +1 purify, +2 SoG
I've been considering trying to fit an Eagle's Eye and animate in here for more crusader and bone wall synergy.
Post by: r2krebirth on January 12, 2012, 02:29:12 pm
currently using limitless OTK deck
Post by: FuryGhost on January 12, 2012, 10:30:48 pm
just want to ask if this deck still works for farming in silver and gold arena since having hard time earning those shards...Yes, this deck SLAYS Bronze and Silver, even though I personally have limited success in gold, it seems to go better for me with +3 SoSe (33 cards total) in all 3 pre-plat leagues.
currently using limitless OTK deck
Post by: Phaser on January 14, 2012, 04:11:41 am
just want to ask if this deck still works for farming in silver and gold arena since having hard time earning those shards...The Arena rapidly changes so sometimes this works well, sometimes not.
currently using limitless OTK deck
Post by: Icedrackon on January 14, 2012, 09:06:11 pm
Post by: Rutarete on January 14, 2012, 09:13:17 pm
Just won my first, nerve-racking game against Gold with this deck. EM'd too, but I was wondering: is -BH +Purify a worthwhile change, or does BH's quanta drain and healing trump Purify's anti-poison?You'll have to decide on that. At one point a while ago there were a bunch of poison decks in gold, so I added a purify, and took it out a bit later. Since the arena keeps changing, you have to go with it.
Post by: furballdn on January 14, 2012, 09:13:47 pm
Just won my first, nerve-racking game against Gold with this deck. EM'd too, but I was wondering: is -BH +Purify a worthwhile change, or does BH's quanta drain and healing trump Purify's anti-poison?Up to you, but I'd probably go with BH since there's more rainbows in gold than there are poisons in gold.
Post by: zupermannd on January 16, 2012, 07:05:53 pm
Change compared to the one in the up:
| -1 Elite Graboid | +1 Pulverizer | said so in the up |
| -1 Fire Shield | +1 Fire Storm | bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times |
| -1 Archangel | +1 Crusader | said so in the up |
| -1 Ulitharid | +1 Arctic Octopus | pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine |
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
Post by: Gandora on January 16, 2012, 07:46:22 pm
I just wonder if Fire Storm could be replaced by plague or retrovirus.
It also affects all creatures, though maybe not killing them immediately.
A retrovirus can support bone wall, and sooner or later, even creatures with high
hp will die or be a target for maxwell.
Also, less :fire is needed but more :death
In the end, I guess that both works :)
Post by: furballdn on January 16, 2012, 08:07:52 pm
My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
Post by: zupermannd on January 17, 2012, 08:52:12 pm
Alright.My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
I do not find Black Hole much useful, so let us say I take Black Hole out, Which card should I put in instead (without disturbing the quantum balance too much, and without letting garbage in)?
Post by: UnderneathTheLens on January 17, 2012, 10:04:45 pm
Hmmm... how about an ultharid?Alright.My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
I do not find Black Hole much useful, so let us say I take Black Hole out, Which card should I put in instead (without disturbing the quantum balance too much, and without letting garbage in)?
Post by: furballdn on January 18, 2012, 01:08:13 am
Ulitharid and octopus conflict. Both are water creatures that are used for control. What you replace the BH with is really up to you. What card of a rainbow would you like to put in?Hmmm... how about an ultharid?Alright.My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
I do not find Black Hole much useful, so let us say I take Black Hole out, Which card should I put in instead (without disturbing the quantum balance too much, and without letting garbage in)?
Post by: mwaetht on January 18, 2012, 06:04:26 am
Post by: r2krebirth on January 18, 2012, 01:25:49 pm
or replace the black hole with shard of gratitude...
sadly this deck loses to the lousy ghost pf the past/nightmare combo.. and also stall decks like Dim shield
Post by: furballdn on January 19, 2012, 12:17:03 am
idk if boneyard will be good to put in together with fallen elf... the first post is kinda outdated..Boneyard? Not really any need to stick that in this. This deck is a quick rainbow. Not a long drawn out match of mutating skeletons. SoG is not really a good choice, since it only heals 3hp per turn. Sanctuary would probably be better since it protects from BH and heals 4hp per turn, though that means you'll need to remove the crusader. And how does it lose to dim shield? You have two steals, a charger and a pulvy. That's more than enough PC.
or replace the black hole with shard of gratitude...
sadly this deck loses to the lousy ghost pf the past/nightmare combo.. and also stall decks like Dim shield
Post by: zhangvict on January 23, 2012, 11:00:15 am
I tried this, and when u do get all 3, it rocks. You pretty much have a no-cost reusable PC that will harm the opponent if they try to damage/poison it away. PU it to get 2.
I tried not using the voodoo, but all the other less than 3 dmg creatures (mind flayer, elite queen etc) all have necessary functions that I can't afford to lobotomize and replace with butterfly.
Post by: Calindu on January 23, 2012, 03:08:07 pm
Another heal.Alright.My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
I do not find Black Hole much useful, so let us say I take Black Hole out, Which card should I put in instead (without disturbing the quantum balance too much, and without letting garbage in)?
Post by: zhangvict on February 08, 2012, 03:02:53 pm
I would actually add a momentum. More useful than heal IMO, esp if used on lava destroyers or adrenized creatures.Another heal.Alright.My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
I do not find Black Hole much useful, so let us say I take Black Hole out, Which card should I put in instead (without disturbing the quantum balance too much, and without letting garbage in)?
Post by: duskiller on March 04, 2012, 05:30:54 am
Personally I use a Nightmare. It can be quite useful sometimes for the extra healing and draw denialAlright.My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
I do not find Black Hole much useful, so let us say I take Black Hole out, Which card should I put in instead (without disturbing the quantum balance too much, and without letting garbage in)?
Post by: kimham8a on March 04, 2012, 08:50:12 am
Post by: delasoul on March 11, 2012, 09:42:35 am
My version:Looks starved on gravity and perhaps earth and fire if you ask me.
Change compared to the one in the up:
-1 Elite Graboid +1 Pulverizer said so in the up
-1 Fire Shield +1 Fire Storm bacause FS deal 3 instand damagde to all, while FS let yor opponent's creature attackt several times
-1 Archangel +1 Crusader said so in the up
-1 Ulitharid +1 Arctic Octopus pro= Bacause it is better creature control, can stop every non-immateriel creature while psionic wave only removed the ability + first time I ever use that creature cons=less damagede, more vulneralbe, and one less combo with Epineprine
What do you think about this version? Could you believe it will be better? and Why?
i hope you saw how great fireshield + maxwell demon works together... played this deck for a while.. personally like the fireshield.. maxwell demon is a game changer paired with the shield
Post by: XVoidwalkerX on April 06, 2012, 05:30:43 pm
Post by: furballdn on April 06, 2012, 06:40:09 pm
For Silver, Are there cards that MUST be upped? Or can it be completely unupped to farm Silver?Supernovas have to be upped. QTs don't, but would help. Bonewall is very expensive unupped, Charger is not worth it unupped, and pulvy is also much more expensive unupped. Graboid could be unupped, as could heal and adrenaline (though that'd make it more expensive), fire storm is too pricey unupped, lava golem, squid, and queen are probably fine unupped, steals may be fine, hourglasses are too expensive to work unupped, TU should be replaced if unupped, and crusader as well.
Post by: MystiK_ on April 08, 2012, 09:05:58 am
Is this deck good enough to be worth this much time or FG battles?
Post by: TribalTrouble on August 04, 2012, 05:11:16 pm
edit: Realized I have ALL the cards for this upped and ready to go, 0 exceptions. And I just went from 2244 electrum to 11010electrum in a little over 1 hour. Score went up too. Plus I got some rares. I'm lovin' it.
edit: AND it also has counters to almost every single shard there is. Reeeeeeeeally nice deck. Only thing is if opponent uses a lot of Pandemonium it can screw you up. (I lost a game to Pandemonium >:()
Post by: furballdn on August 05, 2012, 03:29:57 am
Post by: TribalTrouble on August 06, 2012, 12:06:25 am
Post by: eaglgenes101 on August 06, 2012, 12:43:12 am
Post by: willng3 on August 06, 2012, 02:45:59 am
Should I submit it to the community-recommended decks?Considering
edit: Realized I have ALL the cards for this upped and ready to go, 0 exceptions. And I just went from 2244 electrum to 11010electrum in a little over 1 hour. Score went up too. Plus I got some rares. I'm lovin' it.^that, I'd say that's prime grounds for anyone being able to submit it.
edit: AND it also has counters to almost every single shard there is. Reeeeeeeeally nice deck. Only thing is if opponent uses a lot of Pandemonium it can screw you up. (I lost a game to Pandemonium >:()
@TribalTrouble: Although I am curious; what League(s) did you face that gave you such a nice grinding session?
Post by: eaglgenes101 on August 06, 2012, 05:08:25 am
Post by: wasilias on August 06, 2012, 04:31:35 pm
Post by: ItzSean on August 14, 2012, 04:45:00 pm
i believe this deck dont belong in gold arena recommended decks i am not even talking about platinum i am sure it will have 10% win. dont judge my low forum posts i am playing more than 200 games/day in gold/plat arena with more than 10 diffferent decks and from my experience this deck isnt a recommendation for gold
Agreed. You have to be awfully lucky to win in gold. Still trying to finding someway to tie in purify and a reflective shield of a sorts to counter SoW and SoSa/Poison stalls.. Any help? This is the best thing I can come up with. Took out the Bone Wall because why would you need 3 shields?
..Imagine everything upgraded.
Post by: TribalTrouble on August 29, 2012, 04:18:07 am
Faced Gold and Silver. It is best Silver now though.Should I submit it to the community-recommended decks?Consideringedit: Realized I have ALL the cards for this upped and ready to go, 0 exceptions. And I just went from 2244 electrum to 11010electrum in a little over 1 hour. Score went up too. Plus I got some rares. I'm lovin' it.^that, I'd say that's prime grounds for anyone being able to submit it.
edit: AND it also has counters to almost every single shard there is. Reeeeeeeeally nice deck. Only thing is if opponent uses a lot of Pandemonium it can screw you up. (I lost a game to Pandemonium >:()
@TribalTrouble: Although I am curious; what League(s) did you face that gave you such a nice grinding session?
Post by: Tiscooler on September 03, 2012, 12:17:53 am
Post by: YellowfLash on September 27, 2012, 08:14:59 am
Also the cheap mirror shield will seal away all the newlly found psion and phase dragon with shards of wisdom decks.
I also threw in some shards of serendipity cause since i always have quanta left, random cards are welcome..
I Think thats about all..
you can also throw in a bone wall but thats your choise..
Post by: Luciferin on April 14, 2013, 09:20:29 pm
That has been my only problem (other than the occasional bad draw)
Post by: eaglgenes101 on April 14, 2013, 09:24:19 pm
For Mono Aether, how do you counter SoW?Try to power straight through defenses before the SoW gets going. That's all I can think of.
That has been my only problem (other than the occasional bad draw)
Post by: TribalTrouble on April 14, 2013, 09:42:00 pm
Post by: CactusKing on July 17, 2016, 02:01:19 am
Post by: Manuel on July 17, 2016, 03:57:36 am
Would RoF be a good addition?
if u want to increase your winrate against any :air deck rof yes (sofree didn't exist when this deck come out)
Post by: CactusKing on July 23, 2016, 01:25:30 am
1. :aether Phase Dragon + SoW
2. :air Wyrm/Damselfly/SkyDragon + SoFre
Solution: RoF as mentioned before, and Mirror shield instead of Fire Bucker.
This balances what would otherwise be a :fire heavy deck, and eliminates pretty much all of its weaknesses. :) ;)
Post by: Manuel on July 23, 2016, 02:31:32 am
There are two main kinds of deck this will consistently lose to.
1. :aether Phase Dragon + SoW
2. :air Wyrm/Damselfly/SkyDragon + SoFre
Solution: RoF as mentioned before, and Mirror shield instead of Fire Bucker.
This balances what would otherwise be a :fire heavy deck, and eliminates pretty much all of its weaknesses. :) ;)
keep in mind that this deck is old, both shards didn't exist at the time and snova was nerfed; air rush and mono aether are two of the best decks to submit in arena, is normal losing against them
having 1 card in a 30 cards deck doesn't mean eliminate the weakness: JMZ classic is really, really slow with his damage output, air rush can still win after a RoF (if u are decently lucky to draw it before dying), same against mono aether, mirror shield can make u win if drawed in the initial hand, it doesn't make u instatly win because the AI will always target the same creature with SoW, so u will still keep getting damages
still the deck autolose against DBH, can easily deckout against any :light or SoG stall if u don't draw the queen early (and hopefully no one will lobo or kill her) and rush decks with a decent amount of HP; in elements every deck is weak against other decks
in my opinion u should try [http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/tha-gold-league-killer-v2-0/]the gold league killer[/url], another rainbow deck with a lot more control than this, it still have the same problems against :air and :aether, but overall can perform better against any other deck in the game.
check the last posts for the mods used in the current metagame
Post by: CactusKing on July 23, 2016, 05:38:57 am
This is the deck I am using now (About to upgrade RoF and reflective shield)There are two main kinds of deck this will consistently lose to.
1. :aether Phase Dragon + SoW
2. :air Wyrm/Damselfly/SkyDragon + SoFre
Solution: RoF as mentioned before, and Mirror shield instead of Fire Bucker.
This balances what would otherwise be a :fire heavy deck, and eliminates pretty much all of its weaknesses. :) ;)
keep in mind that this deck is old, both shards didn't exist at the time and snova was nerfed; air rush and mono aether are two of the best decks to submit in arena, is normal losing against them
having 1 card in a 30 cards deck doesn't mean eliminate the weakness: JMZ classic is really, really slow with his damage output, air rush can still win after a RoF (if u are decently lucky to draw it before dying), same against mono aether, mirror shield can make u win if drawed in the initial hand, it doesn't make u instatly win because the AI will always target the same creature with SoW, so u will still keep getting damages
still the deck autolose against DBH, can easily deckout against any :light or SoG stall if u don't draw the queen early (and hopefully no one will lobo or kill her) and rush decks with a decent amount of HP; in elements every deck is weak against other decks
in my opinion u should try [http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/tha-gold-league-killer-v2-0/]the gold league killer[/url], another rainbow deck with a lot more control than this, it still have the same problems against :air and :aether, but overall can perform better against any other deck in the game.
check the last posts for the mods used in the current metagame
Also, mirror shield should NOT be played immediately vs a mono-aether deck, otherwise the CPU won't play SoW and the phase dragons will still kill you within 5 turns.(playing bone wall to block them will cause the opponent to play the SoW because you can't reflect it anymore).
When I said the firestorm and mirror shield eliminated all of its weaknesses, I meant all of the weaknesses you were likely to encounter in the gold arena. I have only battled one or two light stalls in gold and didn't think such an uncommon deck was worth countering, but if you have an idea of how to beat them i would like to hear it!
Post by: Manuel on July 23, 2016, 04:47:09 pm
Quote
otherwise the CPU won't play SoW
the AI can't see reflective shield lol, even with sosac up the AI will play sow if he has enough electrums and a target, no matter what, always on the same creature, the AI doesn't think (just read the AI improvement thread for all the flaws)
(http://i.imgur.com/b8pGqRm.png)
i get no damage this turn, i will reflect 20 damages, but the game still registrer that i will take 20 damage at the end of the turn, something similar to what happen with sosac, the AI still registrer the damage, but with a sosac active the AI will not play creatures from the hand (but it will generate creature with pharaoh/ffq) because zanzarino programmed the AI in this way, while he never make something for sow+ reflective shield
i get no damage this turn, i will reflect 20 damages, but the game still registrer that i will take 20 damage at the end of the turn, something similar to what happen with sosac, the AI still registrer the damage, but with a sosac active the AI will not play creatures from the hand (but it will generate creature with pharaoh/ffq) because zanzarino programmed the AI in this way, while he never make something for sow+ reflective shield
Quote
I have only battled one or two light stalls
light stall is a really easy concept, it's doesn't require any knowledge of the game to be builded, so is pretty much a case that u don't encounter it; early pulvy with lava destroyer enough to beat it
Post by: CactusKing on July 25, 2016, 07:10:29 am
the AI can't see reflective shield lol...he never make something for sow+ reflective shieldI don't know much about the coding for the AI, but when I was battling one such mono :aether deck in gold last week I played the reflective shield on the second turn, before the opponent used SoW. once he had a few phase dragons out, i was taking lots of damage, and they didn't play SoW. On the last turn before I was going to lose i played a bonewall to block the dragons, and sure enough, the next turn the CPU immediately played THREE SoWs and went right through the bone shield.
The only explanation I can see is that he was programmed to not play SoW when reflective is in play.
Post by: Manuel on July 25, 2016, 07:58:38 am
the AI can't see reflective shield lol...he never make something for sow+ reflective shieldI don't know much about the coding for the AI, but when I was battling one such mono :aether deck in gold last week I played the reflective shield on the second turn, before the opponent used SoW. once he had a few phase dragons out, i was taking lots of damage, and they didn't play SoW. On the last turn before I was going to lose i played a bonewall to block the dragons, and sure enough, the next turn the CPU immediately played THREE SoWs and went right through the bone shield.
The only explanation I can see is that he was programmed to not play SoW when reflective is in play.
Knowing how the ai works is important, some deck are based on the ai's flaws (in part vdb and the balls that cold, 2 fg farmers) the more u play, the more things u discover about his smartness (specially if u test your own arena deck), even if some things are still obscure for the community because sometimes is really hard to understand
That was a case, probably he drawed 2 shards and the turn before didn' t have the quanta for sow, or he prefered to play dim/dragon over the sow, but sometimes the ai simply don't wanna play cards, this happen often with abilities or particular some cards
Post by: CactusKing on July 28, 2016, 08:56:04 am
Post by: CactusKing on July 28, 2016, 10:16:25 am
vdb and the balls that cold, 2 fg farmerswhere can i find those decks?
Post by: Manuel on July 28, 2016, 05:06:14 pm
vdb and the balls that cold, 2 fg farmerswhere can i find those decks?
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/voodoo-bravery-(fg)(arena)(fast)(focused)/ (it has many variations, be sure to read the thread for AI tweaks and the strategy of the deck)
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/the-brave-malignant-ball-that-could-(otk)(fg)(plat)(gold)(63wr)(49em)/msg1054944/#msg1054944 (same here, aflo your ball, grow with sopa, don't die with sosac, make some practice in the trainer before buying any of the decks)
other farmers here http://elementscommunity.org/forum/community-recommended-decks/false-gods/
Post by: CactusKing on July 29, 2016, 07:11:19 am
I already use those, i just didn't know the abbreviations. :Dvdb and the balls that cold, 2 fg farmerswhere can i find those decks?
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/voodoo-bravery-(fg)(arena)(fast)(focused)/ (it has many variations, be sure to read the thread for AI tweaks and the strategy of the deck)
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/the-brave-malignant-ball-that-could-(otk)(fg)(plat)(gold)(63wr)(49em)/msg1054944/#msg1054944 (same here, aflo your ball, grow with sopa, don't die with sosac, make some practice in the trainer before buying any of the decks)
other farmers here http://elementscommunity.org/forum/community-recommended-decks/false-gods/
Good decks, but they have their own problems, and are kinda weak to PC compared with this...