ivalmian's Rainbow SpeedDeck (kills almost all FG with elem master for v1.17+)

[Vreely]

Left unsaid is that this deck can recover quite well even with 0 towers drawn.  Sure, sometimes you have to waste a sundial, or discard a card not needed (PA/quint against the non-control gods), or even an hourglass especially if you have another in hand, but that does not kill the deck.  You just have to play it carefully.  About 9 pages back, Jangoo said it best.   This deck plays on the edge all the time.  Its always on the verge of losing, yet often manages to pull itself back to vitality.   That does not make it bad, it just means you need to play it perfectly.

I have played many many games with it now, and can safely say that it does recover well from lack of early towers.  That being said, it still does feel a bit light, which is why I am now testing the 12 QT/3 SD variant.   After 55 games so far, it is not working better for me even though I get towers earlier.   The reduced early game defense is too much of a cost for the increased tower ratio.

[ivalmian]

Huh? we got 29 non-tower and 11 tower, a total of 40cards
P(no tower with 7 card) = 29x28x27x26x25x24x23/40/39/38/37/36/35/34=0.0837

sorry, I guess i calculated for 12 towers in 41 cards by accident (this is what i am trying now)

but yes, vreely's point is also quite accurate, the deck plays WELL with one tower in starting hand. With 0... it's a little hard.. but still you get may be 40% wins

[ivalmian]

hm..finally a section just for fg grinding! thank you ScaredGirl!

[Vreely]

I completed my 100 game test with only 3 Sundials.   It is my version from the first post minus a SD with a 12th QT added.  I'm not even going to show it here because it is much, much worse.

Statistically over 100 games, it did not even come close, clocking in at a win rate of 0.47.  Here are the  detailed stats.  (http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=3028838437)

Conclusion:
If you do not use the Improved Miracle, you had better play with at least 4 Sundials.   I died to many more early rushes than I did with my 4 SD version.  I was quite surprised to see how important it is when the Miracle is not in the deck.

[ivalmian]

I completed my 100 game test with only 3 Sundials.   It is my version from the first post minus a SD with a 12th QT added.  I'm not even going to show it here because it is much, much worse.

Statistically over 100 games, it did not even come close, clocking in at a win rate of 0.47.  Here are the  detailed stats.  (http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=3028838437)

Conclusion:
If you do not use the Improved Miracle, you had better play with at least 4 Sundials.   I died to many more early rushes than I did with my 4 SD version.  I was quite surprised to see how important it is when the Miracle is not in the deck.

ok.. i've been trying a 41 card version with 12 qt and I don't think THAT gave an improvement either... the 4sd no miracle version seems to be by far the best...

[Clathius]

What ever came from the tests with permafrost shield?   What about replacing one sundial with a permafrost?   

I'd test it out but my deck is only half upgraded. 

[ivalmian]

What ever came from the tests with permafrost shield?   What about replacing one sundial with a permafrost?   

I'd test it out but my deck is only half upgraded.

my original 40 card deck with permafrost instead of one of the sundials didn't get much improvement since the high cost of permafrost made it unplayable till mid-game by which time I already have good shielding... I think the sundials are critical as they are what allows your to GET to mid game

Something I'm very interested in is how my deck works half-upgraded.. if you could post your deck and play some test games (and post stats) I'd greatly appreciate it. I think as long as you have upped hourglasses, otys, and druid you might do OK

[Vreely]

Ditto on what Ivalmian said.   The key is GETTING to the mid game.  Once there, you typically win.

Sundial's are critical.  If you read back, I tested a 3 SD variant and it was bad.  Logically, following that, I am now trying a 5 SD variant, and it seems to be better even than the 4 SD one on the top post.   I will post results when I get enough games to have enough of a statistical sample, but the early feeling is good (only 65 games at the time of this posting).

To those of you who played this game before the SDs were "nerfed", you are darn lucky.   I consider this card critical to the rainbow deck even now.  I can only imagine what it was like when it protected for 2 turns and gave 2 draws.

[Clathius]

(http://www.screenshotdumpster.com/view/m7Gbd46923/rainbowV2)

Hopefully the deck is attached.   It is similar to SG unupgraded deck but I removed 2 dials for 2 quants.   I also completely dropped enchant artifact because I can't beat Sesim (spelled right?) anyway.   Please remember it is a work in progress and changes daily through upgrades.    I started 1 week ago and already have 19 upgrades...not too bad, eh?   

I highly doubt it would work as your version.  I'm running 15 pillar/towers and I still have very serious troubles with quantum early.  Particularly with  .   Nearly every game I am sitting there begging for that 5th  round after round.   Then when I finally play my Oty I sit there for 2-3 rounds waiting for  just to use him once.    I swear the Devs are nerfing rainbow decks by making  not appear....    Anyway, this deck just simply fails if I only get 0-1 towers on the initial draw.   

In fact, I highly regret upgrading my towers.   I wished I had upgraded all the cards in the deck that result in a reduced casting cost and perhaps added a Supernova.   I just won a card so now I can upgrade 1 more...I think its going to be a Supernova and replace 1 Pillar with that.   

I think I am going to consider a 5th Dial as well but I have no idea what to remove.  Vreely, what did you remove to add your dial?

[Jangoo]

To those of you who played this game before the SDs were "nerfed", you are darn lucky.   I consider this card critical to the rainbow deck even now.  I can only imagine what it was like when it protected for 2 turns and gave 2 draws.

Lol, yes you are right.
A typical answer from those who played back then would be something like:

"There have always been changes to the game and there always will be. If you keep throwing down cards like a total idiot you will never make it to the top, so really you are just too stupid to play the game. Posts like yours have been flooding my nice forum forever now and I am asking you to either shut up and play or to get the f*** out of here."
(random Pro-gamer in response to a whine-post about the sundial nerf and how easy it was to get rich back in the days)


However, the sundial doesn't neccessarily have to be as essential for any deck as it seems for this deck. When trying Puppys deck for example it didn't seem to help as much for me. Here, it really just destroyed the whole supernova-based speed aspect and caused crappy draws.

I was playing ivals deck with 3 sundials recently and that seemed to be just fine because having those phase shields already is quite comfy. 5 SDs sounds a bit overstressed no?

[Vreely]

I completed 100 games of testing on my 5 Sundial variant.  It performed the best yet for me of any variation, but I still think it can be tweaked even higher (notes below).
Win Rate:  0.63
Normalized Win Rate: (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,2237.msg31191#msg31191)  0.65
Detailed Statistics (http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=694112412)

First disclaimer:  This is not just a 5 SD variant.  I tried 2 other things alongside it.  More below.
Second disclaimer:  I believe I was lucky on Seism win rate.  I cannot imagine it will hold up to 45% against him.

General Note:
You have to tailor to your play style.  As I play this game more, I am finding this to be true.   For instance, Puppy Chow's deck has an unbelievable win rate for him of 69% or something, but when I played a couple hundred games with it, I was not even close.  I was not even over 50%.

Key Point:
The most important thing about beating False Gods is staying alive.

You cannot outrace them, you cannot outdraw them.  Its not about having massive damage, its about staying alive in the early game.   If you can do this, you will win.   This is not necessarily the "fastest" way to win, but it is certainly the best way to an increased win percentage.  With this as my primary principal, I modified the deck to be even more defensive to put my theory to the test.   

Base deck is my 4 SD version that is on the lead post.
Change #1:  Replace Improved Steal with a 5th Sundial.   

This makes it the 5 SD variant, but at a cost.   Here is how I was using steal:
Chaos Lord:  Dissipation field in the late game to speed up his demise.
Destiny:  Hourglass or an Eternity
Elidnis & Ferox:  Feral Bond
Fire Queen:  Eagle's Eye, or Feral Bond
Gemini:  Phase Shield
Gravitron:  Grav Shield
Hermes:  Fire Buckler (only when I either was forced to, or did not have my shield setup)
Incarnate & Morte:  Graveyard
Miracle:  Emerald Tower
Obliterator:  Pulvy (when he doesn't protect it right away)
Rainbow:  Hourglass
Scorpio:  Permafrost (only when I did not have my own setup)
Seism:  Diamond Shield or Pulvy

If not listed, I didn't use it.  Of all these uses the only critical ones are to block Obliterator, get the Grav Shield, or slow down Rainbow's draw.  Everything else is surely useful, but I viewed as not required to win.  So yes, giving up Improved Steal does hurt a bit, but it is not a deck critical card.

On the 5th Sundial, I did find it to be useful.  Again, I have the light quanta to use, and every turn of delayed attack is another turn I have to setup the Bone Wall engine.  Furthermore, they help me get Elemental Mastery in the late game if I need a few more turns with the Bonds.

Change #2:  Replace Fallen Druid with the Arctic Octopus.

Sticking with the theme of defense, this fits the bill.  It also gives something to do with all the wasted water quanta.  I found the Octopus extremely useful.  It holds momentum guys from Gemini, Gravitron, and Obliterator.  It also generally will help save your butt while you are slowly getting your firefly damage going.

Giving up the Fallen Druid hurts for sure.  I decided to take it out so I did not have to spread my quints too thin.   Generally, 1 for an Oty, 1 for the Queen, and 1 for the Octopus.  The druid helps get powerful creatures, but it did not help keep me alive.  So I made the tough choice to remove it.   This made a few matchups take an extra 5 minutes to complete (Chaos Lord, Elidnis, Miracle, etc).   This choice also cost me a couple wins against Elidnis.   He gets 6 immortal guys out, 6 bonds, and a Jade shield, and its nearly impossible to crack through with just fireflies and a big Oty.

Change #3:  Replace a Protect Artifact with a Quantum Tower.

The reason I did this is because I still think 11 QTs and 2 SNs is a bit too thin.  The deck does recover well from being short early towers, but I could trace back a handful of losses directly to having too little early game quanta.  Increasing the ratio to 12 QTs seems like a better fit.  Its hard to say if this change helped the deck or not.  It certainly helped get better quantum generation for the first 10 turns, and it felt right, however taking out the PA will directly impact your win percentage against Seism.  I feel I was lucky to get a 45% win rate against him with only 1 PA.

Extra Notes:

• The extra SDs clearly helped me against Gravitron, Gemini, and Obliterator.   Halting those momentum guys was huge.
• I found the Octupus to be very useful.  I was happy with this being in the deck, as it often was used in the close games that matter for increasing win percentage.
• The deck is slower.  It takes forever to crack through Elidnis & Miracle's jade shield.  Similarly you are in for a long wait against Chaos Lord as you slowly reduce his dissipation shield.
• I think the deck would be better if I could fit a Pulvy in there somehow.  The problem is that it would also require an Animate Weapon so you can make room for the Eternity.  The draw through on the deck is so quick that I rarely would get the required turns with it to destroy FBs, shields, graveyards, hourglasses, etc.   Its first on my wishlist to fit in somehow.

I'm still working on it, but this is my best hit yet over a 100 game span.  Deck is attached.

Here are the detailed stats. (http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=694112412)

[Silkenfist]

You have removed all permanent control from the deck? That's brave... but I really think there should be at least one card (Steal, Pulverizer, Druid) that can deal with a permanent. Even if it doesn't affect your win rate that much, it will allow you to win matches much quicker and create greater revenue.