Entropybow with Lone Time Tower

[unionruler]

Yesterday on the chat some of us (ODST, markilleruk, Puppy and Terro) were semi-evaluating and semi-debating on the merits and demerits of compact generic anti FG entropybows, primarily in the areas of quanta flow smoothness and deckout tendency.  We were assessing mainly the original PuppyChow, Yala's butterfly angel and Terro's variation of the PuppyChow (and ODST's modification on that).

So I went to bed thinking about the problem of how to reconcile achieving the surgical precision of a compact rainbow strat while yet minimizing the risk of deckout. I came up with this idea of sacrificing a card for a time tower in an entropybow ie entropy mark rainbow, due to the necessity of time quanta post 1.21 hourglass and eternity nerfs. Allow me to furnish you with an example:

Hover over cards for details, click for permalink

Deck import code : [Select]

6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u8 71b 74b 74b 77i 7ba 7ba 7ba 7do 7gp 7k2 7n3 7q0 7q5 7q5 7q8 7t6 80h 80h 80h 8pj

This is a modified Yaladilae, with pest replacing the angel and a time tower replacing a quantum tower. I have been testing this for awhile today, but as is my practice, I will leave you to experiment and not collect statistics. What I want you to notice is that 7 quantum towers and 1 time tower mean that on average you will yield 2.75 time quanta/turn, and hence you will only lose 1 stockpiled time quantum every 4 turns of rewinding to avoid deckout assuming you have neutral luck. Furthermore, you would be able to stockpile more time quanta than in the standard Yaladilae given that the time tower would run for some turns, and hence there is no need to constantly make the decision of whether or not to draw a card unless you are really short of both time quanta and low on cards.

I would like to encourage the rest of you spearheading the anti FG research to look into this concept because I myself cannot do extensive testing on all the possible variations. And for those more casual players out there, maybe just give it a try and see if it works for you.

[Levgre]

the typical solution i've used for decking out is just making the deck a bit bigger, like adding 2 sundials can give you some more flex room.  Beyond that, I think compensating to avoid decking can result in more losses because your deck is not as tuned to other situations.

I do like the idea of throwing in towers of different kinds though, in one deck I threw in an air tower to use more FFQs.   But for the standard rainbow I think a time tower may not be the best way to avoid decking.  Although if you planned the deck around using eternity more(perhaps using mutate-> rewind for creature control), that could be a good use of a time tower.

[Qohelet]

Drop hourglasses AND time tower - oh well, maybe it's too big change and deck become something what it's not supposed to be. Maybe I test this one... just few words how I understand what 'compact deck' really is..

I played with 30 card deck <40 games, but win ratio was quite low. Still I managed beat FG's like Dream Catcher  Deck's main idea is use Alfatoxin your own side in every game, because it's only effective way to get enough healing.  When you can take down "every" shield with BE, even cells are "real killers". Before this deck I just get tired using typical FFQ/Fallen Druid/Boneyard/Fire Storm -mess (it's kind of complicated for my taste). Fallen Druid is latest add-on to this deck (my friends idea), cells low damage -> too long games.

My "micro rainbow":

Code: [Select]

6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u3 6u6 6u8 71c 74b 74b 77i 77i 77i 7am 7am 7am 7gp 7jp 7q4 7q8 80h 80h 80h
I really don't know is it possible to make GOOD 30 card anti-fg deck, but I like this idea.

And two pics from two lucky games with this 'too small' deck:

Dream Catcher (I just get very lucky in this game; I think Dream Catcher is very tough nut to break).

(http://www.screenshotdumpster.com/)

Elidnis (here you see what I mean healing)

(http://www.screenshotdumpster.com/)

I think this deck can win game against Divine Glory, just protect 2 bond and use alfatoxin, it's +48HP every turn.. BUT you have to be lucky (fast).

[Terroking]

Really, I almost never deck out with my variant, regardless of the fact that there isn't any eternity. The 3rd quint makes up for it by allowing me to have 2 immortal sources of damage, and your oty/pulvy have genrally beaten gods down to a manageable hp even if they come in late. The druid is such a huge source of damage, and butterfly effect requires 2 cards (3 if you count quint) to work at all, that it's very difficult to deck out unless both druid and queen are in the bottom 5 cards, your oty came out late, or they got incredibly lucky with Miracles (Again, druid can cover these if you stop drawing at around 10, depending on your current damage.)

Miracle, as I will say time and time again, is probably never going to see use in any FG deck of mine due to the fact that even when I lose, it's usually because I was rushed before an oty came out and didn't even have 12 light. The PA gets less important as well when you throw out eternity, since you have more than enough perms to suck up explosions/steals (DC gets harder, but that's more similar to a PA'd pulvy).

[yaladilae]

Awesome you changed 1 card to my deck !

Having said that, the lone time tower would reli help on deck out, but most games I played I never reli had to reverse over 5 times, and only once in a blue moon (apart from dark matter) I run out of quanta after I fought right to the end and die becuse of deck out...

@terro, since you dont use eternity, I agree druid is way better for your variant compare to mine, as I inititally used butterfly effect (ok mainly for its nice looking), but to have a 100% "mutant" with destory. Other that that, druid does put up huge source of damage. In fact, prehaps a quinted cell and 1 druid (Drawing the idea of Qohlet) wll provide a very stable source of damage too.

The main problem I see with druid however is TU, which can be very very painful...
Compare to my deck where on average run Gemini only gets to TU my fireflies which I can manage (and on the upper hand firestorm + bonewall)!

[Terroking]

Gemini is easy. Simply don't quint the druid (Unless lobo is out) and have a RoF ready in hand. Use the extra quint on any dangerous mutant that pops up, namely with momentum. Remember, he can only PU it up to 8 times, and generally only does 4-6. If you need to, eat the mutant with your oty. Once his hp starts to fall to the FFs/skeles, he'll get desperate and use all the TU on your druid. Then simply RoF, and take out all his clones (Not important enough for him to momentum).

Also, another deck-out fix, throw in a couple of precogs. The extra time quanta generally doesn't kill you, and they can be adapted to either just be a placeholder and give you an extra turn, or be used early for a quick glimpse at the FG's hand and nothing done to you except a negligible -1 , which you only would have used to draw anyways. That's saved me multiple times while testing it, letting me put out an oty/FFQ without waiting for a quint, letting be eat the lava golem/forest spectre that was about to get out of hand.

Also, on an unrelated note, some people knew that Hermes was in fact occupying 2 slots as a FG when you searched for one. One of his decks (Like seism with Stone Skin) was the original, while the other seemed to have a lot less lances in favor of more Heavy Armors and Rage potions. Now that we have the full 24 gods, is this still the case?

[unionruler]

The main problem I see with druid however is TU, which can be very very painful...
Compare to my deck where on average run Gemini only gets to TU my fireflies which I can manage (and on the upper hand firestorm + bonewall)!

Your deck would run better with an unupgraded fallen elf than a druid in my opinion Yala. Strictly for defensive mutations of course since you have no true mob source--need the elite ffs for damage. But one of the reasons why I disdain adding any cards at all to your deck is because it's already hard to draw shields it's possible to lose just because both are at the bottom of the deck even if you declare a miracle.

Miracle, as I will say time and time again, is probably never going to see use in any FG deck of mine due to the fact that even when I lose, it's usually because I was rushed before an oty came out and didn't even have 12 light.

That's because the supernova density in your deck is lower than in Yaladilae's. It does come into play significantly more often in a 33 card deck and it is recommended is becuase it packs one less sog and one less fire storm/bone wall pair.

[ODSTRookie]

If u dont appreciate the miracle thats fine. But my primary reason for throwing it in would because of almost no use for light quanta. I constantly finding myself having all this light quanta but it doesnt do anything for me! I threw in the miracle and suddenly it became useful. Besides the miracle is half the reason I beat scorpio most of the time.

[UsernameLife]

If u dont appreciate the miracle thats fine. But my primary reason for throwing it in would because of almost no use for light quanta. I constantly finding myself having all this light quanta but it doesnt do anything for me! I threw in the miracle and suddenly it became useful. Besides the miracle is half the reason I beat scorpio most of the time.

The reason I drop Miracle is the same reason everyone started dropping Steal. It's too situational. In cases where I'm losing (enemy has 15+ damage on the field already) I can't play it (12 quantums is a lot, even with 6 Supernovas), or it doesn't buy me enough time to set up a stall or kill the opponent's creatures and win.

I don't see the light quanta argument as valid because you're not using dark quanta either. I'd prefer to use sundials to give stalling turns as opposed to Miracle which is risky and hard to use.