Elite Momentum (Rainbow)

[Dm]

I'll never be able to play the fourth epi, that's true. But I'd rather have an extra epi + 1 deja than 2 dejas and no Epi in hand. Of course this is just one scenario. The Epinephrine arriving early feels best to me, which is why I did what I did.

The basilisk blood is true, there is no sense in using congeal instead of it - I simply stacked Congeal because I originally thought of adding purify and already was in the water element when doing so.
Now for Silence over Cloak, I'm unsure. Cloak will give you 3 turns of single CC protection, while silence will give you one. By single CC don't understand one copy of a card that could kill deja-vu, but X copies of a card that targets a single creature. True, after you use your Ability a single single CC card will not do any good, but it is not rare for the opponent to have two shockwaves, or two lightnings, or two firebolts, or so on. Thus, I find cloak to be a bit more reliable in that sense. (Specially because, in PVP2, I seem to find Otyughs / Reverse Times quite often; at least I did today.)

Please explain why 5:1 is better than 6:0 (Not doubting you, I just want evidence; because I hate the 5:1 ratio and if I'm being told it's better I want at least to know why). As for the ending, I do know that it would be better if A=B=C=D (you'll potentially have more or less the same chance of getting any said card in deck, since they'll be on a similar number and thus drawing the combo could feel easier); and that if A>B or A>C I'll have a higher chance of A. That's exactly why I did 4 of Epi. Because for me, A is more important than B or C and warrants a higher number.

Also, please notice you don't run A=B=C=D. You run A=B and A>C B>C. I'll give the 5 SoBra a try, with the silence twist.

And please don't misunderstand me. I do know 3 deja is inconsistent (Which explains my sixth bravery) and I truly do not know which of the amount is optimal. Apart from the cloak, which is one of the things I do plan on keeping, anything else is experimental. Between comparing a 4 deja  3 epi to a 4 epi 3 deja, I like both, but I do prefer 4 epi 3 deja. If I were to run 4 deja then I would, at least, run a silence and one less unstoppable to get it on pair with epinephrine.

[CrockettRocket]

Plz don't be so closed minded as to not take into consideration other cards could be better then cloak. silence vs cloak may be preference though as silence is easier to get out so it doesnt clog your hand as much as cloak. You need at least 3 novas to power it. For the ratio thing I'm not the greatest person to say hard cold evidence. But after doing 1000 games with this deck even each comparing every nova:supernova ratio I have observed that 5:1 is best, with entropy mark ive found 2:4 best. Idk what you would have if you included QT's or entropy pendalums or both however. I don't have that kind of patience. Also silence helps you from being out rushed. Its better for both playing rushes and stalls. If your vsing a pure rush deck like Chapuz' deck which is the fastest then silence can give you the edge, and has gave me the win 4 times in pvp. (Always a fun match) I would recomend -1 bravery to +1 elite deja. #Consistancy. I used A=B=C. D<A. D was epi. I used 4 elite 4 unstoppable 4 sofree but only 3 epi because its tight on quanta, all about just piling out your hand. You can use bravery wisely against nightmare so thats why i like dumping my hand. But your true match up is vsing anyone with sanct. (Could try a explosion. Or improved steal.) If you can get rid of that 1st sanct you might have enough burst speed to win.

[Dm]

I never said I wouldn't take it into consideration, I said I was unsure. That's just insulting, calling me close-minded, you know? :/

Now, let's go over the whole thing slowly.

. silence vs cloak may be preference though as silence is easier to get out so it doesnt clog your hand as much as cloak. You need at least 3 novas to power it.

I agree with you on this one, Cloak is a hard one to pull off. But the point is that I manage to pull it off once I've drawn enough (Which I usually do with the SoBra's), but of course that's very RNG - ridden. But unlike Silence, Cloak gives us a 3 turn protection (Assuming no PC, and even then, you just made opponent waste PC on Cloak instead of on SoFree - Bonus bonus!) while Silence will only give us a 1 turn protection (Which is only blocked by Sanctuary.) The pros of Cloak is that it lasts longer; in the Con side, it has more counters. The Pro of silence is the lack of effective counters to it, and the Con is that it is only one turn of protection, which may or may not be enough.

I'd also like to go a bit deeper and say that, in this case where I attempt to get most Dejas out steadily, Silence would be a double-edge because it would lock the hand of the opponent, sadly locking my SoBra. Of course, if I time it well, that isn't a problem, but you might want to consider that as well.

For the ratio thing I'm not the greatest person to say hard cold evidence. But after doing 1000 games with this deck even each comparing every nova:supernova ratio I have observed that 5:1 is best, with entropy mark ive found 2:4 best. Idk what you would have if you included QT's or entropy pendalums or both however. I don't have that kind of patience.

Well then, please don't say hard cold evidence if there's really none to give. I was expecting something. Personally, I find that the six nova is better because there are many times when I end up with 1 nova and 1 supernova - And if that supernova were a nova, then I'd be able to play what's on my hand more effectively and even power the deja-vu ability by the next turn. But, this may be completely preference - I don't really mind which one is picked, but I -do- prefer the 6 nova better. I don't have the patience for Entropy or QT either.

Also silence helps you from being out rushed. Its better for both playing rushes and stalls. If your vsing a pure rush deck like Chapuz' deck which is the fastest then silence can give you the edge, and has gave me the win 4 times in pvp. (Always a fun match)

It's one turn. Also, please, what is Chapuz' deck? I have no idea which one it is, given he has made a few dozens while he was around. Silence can give you an edge, true, but against stalls I think that Cloak would be giving you the edge more. I may be wrong. Cloak has saved me just as much as Silence has (I tested a Silence version after my post for a while.) By the way, I mixed both the use of Cloak AND Silence and it does pretty well. It's interesting how they synergize.

I would recomend -1 bravery to +1 elite deja. #Consistancy. I used A=B=C. D<A. D was epi. I used 4 elite 4 unstoppable 4 sofree but only 3 epi because its tight on quanta, all about just piling out your hand. You can use bravery wisely against nightmare so thats why i like dumping my hand. But your true match up is vsing anyone with sanct. (Could try a explosion. Or improved steal)

Allow me to ignore the end of your sentence which didn't make much sense to me, about nightmares and sanctuary. It is true Sanctuary would counter SoBra. Nothing needs to be said on that subject.

On the subject of -1 Bravery to +1 Elite Deja, I may try that. True, 6 SoBras feels overkill at times; 4 deja may be better just for the sake of Consistency and nothing else.

Now on the topic of A=B=C=D, assuming A = Unstoppable, B = Deja-Vu, C = Epinephrine, and D = SoFree, I completely disregarded D. Whatever numbers you used for A, B, and C for their consistency, the number of D would be unchangeable simply because 4 SoFree is the number you need to get the 100% critical.

On a side note, I wish that SoFree gave Protection to Dejas, too. =P

Spoiler for I may try this in the soon future, because it looks good.:

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TL;DR - I do find 6 SoBra to be a lot sometimes, but it also helps me draw the novas sooner in a sense, so I am unsure whether to change it or not. 4 Dejas are interesting to run, but I'm not sure if I want to sacrifice an Epinephrine for that (This is just my luck speaking - I almost never find these damn Epinephrines when I need them, so I might run 4 deja 4 epi if I manage to squeeze them in.) Cloak > Silence, in my honest opinion and shy preference.

And since I get this a lot.. =P

Disclaimer: I did not mean to be rude or to insult you in any form or way and I apologize if it came across as so. I'm really interested in the deck and in the minor modifications which is why I have replied as I did.

[CrockettRocket]

Apart from the cloak, which is one of the things I do plan on keeping, anything else is experimental./quote]

This is what made me say my comment about being closed minded. As for your deck, I would recomend -1bb OR -1silence OR -1cloak OR (which I am not so inclined for you to try this) -1 bravery for +1 unstoppable. This will give the 4/4/4/3 which I feel is the skelition of the deck.

P.S. I said D was Epi... and you quoted me XD. 

P.S.S. The number of freedom is changeable as stated before you started replying to this topic, but I would not recomend going below 4 because the critical rate is 100% then.

Anger insert here: GAHHHHHHH! THIS FOURM JUST SEEMS TO GET MORE AND MORE COMPLICATED TO ME.

[Dm]

Apart from the cloak, which is one of the things I do plan on keeping, anything else is experimental.

This is what made me say my comment about being closed minded. As for your deck, I would recomend -1bb OR -1silence OR -1cloak OR (which I am not so inclined for you to try this) -1 bravery for +1 unstoppable. This will give the 4/4/4/3 which I feel is the skelition of the deck.

P.S. I said D was Epi... and you quoted me XD. 

P.S.S. The number of freedom is changeable as stated before you started replying to this topic, but I would not recomend going below 4 because the critical rate is 100% then.

Anger insert here: GAHHHHHHH! THIS FOURM JUST SEEMS TO GET MORE AND MORE COMPLICATED TO ME.

Fixing it for you - There is an open quote at the second line. Just close it with a [ .
I don't find unstoppable that needed, it's not as much of a boost as Epi is. It's not that important IMO.
I might try -1 something for +1 Epi. Let us see the other side of 4/4/4/3. =P

As for your P.S, it doesn't matter what we call "D" or "A" because if it is explained correctly it is only a change of what we're calling it.
It should be P.P.S, not P.S.S, I believe (Post Post Scriptum, and not Post Scriptum Scriptum?) but yes, I do know that changing SoFr is possible, but like I said (And you said yourself again, repeating me, which makes me believe you didn't read my post completely) 100% is the go-to, and 4 covers that nicely.

[antiaverage]

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Dropping the SN has helped a lot more with my opening hands. And I was surprised how often the Cloak and Congeal were the difference between a loss and a win. This feels a lot more consistent, possibly at the expense of those super crazy fast wins, but I prefer the consistency.

[CrockettRocket]

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Dropping the SN has helped a lot more with my opening hands. And I was surprised how often the Cloak and Congeal were the difference between a loss and a win. This feels a lot more consistent, possibly at the expense of those super crazy fast wins, but I prefer the consistency.

Wish you would have looked at his later deck after me and DM picked out all the quirks and stuff.

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I believe the skeleiton is my deck but without the 2 damselflies. You can put cloak, silence,baslisk blood,congeal,explosion,improved steal, the only reason I don't have any of these is because I've tested them, against ai4 damselflies are the best, they make sure you can get the sofree out asap and if the ai4 has lots of CC these things protect you. But you can modify the deck for pvp2, it just has a large skeleton so it can work not-modified. For more consistancy's sake (which is obviously what he was going for) I would have 4 unstoppable. I suggested -1BB OR -1cloak OR -1 silence. (Since there was originally no CC I suggest cloak be removed because its more expensive. Or for both PC and CC change cloak to improved steal and get rid of silence.) The main cards I liked when testing all these options out were silence,explosion,baslisk blood. I didn't care too much for cloak or improved steal because of a cost of 3. I've found you can't really use cloak to its full power most times because the game is usually already over by the time you get 3 novas and 3 more turns from cloak. For improved steal it really helped in arena, but the things worth stealing don't have too much of an effect with how fast the game is going. If I stole long sword, Oweles eye, fharenhite, long bow, an early lobo, discord, (the other other weapon that does 6 damage), and depending how good the shield is against the opponent it might be worth stealing.. who would steal a fire shield against a fire/light stall using pillars and dragons? You already have momemtum, wait it out for that weapon and hope he uses the  weapon instead of  Me and DM both feel that congeal is just a slip of the mind, you should be using BB instead.

[antiaverage]

Those are really useful thoughts and easily round out the concept of your skeleton. I'm going to give the deck you just posted run of 25 and see how it compares with my current experience. I'm really enjoying this thread.

[CrockettRocket]

25 runs against ai4? Sure thats enough?

[antiaverage]

25 runs against ai4? Sure thats enough?

Enough for a taste, not for stats

[CrockettRocket]

25 runs against ai4? Sure thats enough?

Enough for a taste, not for stats

you havnt run it before?! This thing slaughters ai4. It does pretty well in pvp2 as well (Ik a couple tricks to winning my own deck, easier if you go 2nd though) Dm's is fixated on pvp2

[Keeps]

I'll stick with my SoSa varient...
I've tried 10 games against AI4, and lost 80%, mostly because I'm only able to do 100 damage before it does 100 back, it out paces by about 1 turn, and that's about it...  without a little control or healing, it dies out.  It crushes AI3, but seriously a full upped deck with shards isn't doing much better than an unupped mono darkness or death deck is pretty lame.