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PuppyChow

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Can Haz Moar Drawz? (FG Rainbow Reloaded - 1.24-1.25) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136143#msg136143
« on: August 11, 2010, 08:56:50 pm »
Deck Helper comment: 
This deck was posted before the 1.32 game update and as a result may work very differently now.  Use at your own risk.

Alright. So I got to thinking... do we really need supernova? Time mark has its advantages, namely card drawing. I made this deck, and it did great for what testing I did in 1.24. I can also see this doing just as well in 1.25 since the puffer fish buff affects it the least.

I'll add more to the topic later. For now, the link to 1.24 statistics: http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=315122899 (http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=315122899)

Indevelopment (lol):
--FG Break-down (actually with specific tips this time!)
--General Strategy
--Disclaimers
--Statistics page for everyone else
--Deck Break-down

And the deck:
Hover over cards for details, click for permalink
Deck import code : [Select]
52n 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6qq 6u6 6u7 71b 74b 74b 77f 77i 7ba 7ba 7ba 7ba 7ba 7do 7do 7n0 7q5 7q5 7q5 7q5 7q5 7q8 7q9 7q9 7q9 80h 80h 8ps



General Strategy

Basically, this deck can be a little bit more complicated to play due to only having one copy of a few cards. Some general rules:
    Play other cards before sogs (sogs could take quanta needed for them)Spam hourglasses as much as possible. If you have 5 time and already have one out, use it to draw and play another. Who cares if you're left with 0 since you've got a time mark?Unless specified in the God-by-God breakdown, hold on to sundials for as long as possible.Um, I'll add more when I think of them.
Now, the you generally can follow two tacts to win. One way generally wins a bit faster, the other slower. It depends on the FG's draws and your draws to determine which to go with.

1. Stall and Bomb
If you draw tons of hourglasses and sogs/dials and your shield (be it fog or permafrost), plus the FG has a bunch of 1-6 hp creatures, go ahead and wait. Even if you get that quinted oty out, wait as much as possible. Don't drop a fire storm just to clear the board, even if you have a bone wall. Wait for the bone yard. Once you DO get the bone yard, rip your fire storms and start devouring with otys. You should have plenty of skeletons now primed for mutating/killing. We do this because without the bone yard, you won't be dealing much damage and if you kill all their creatures your damage buildup will be much slower since then you need to rely on the FG continuing to play them. Keep in mind, though, that using this strategy doesn't preclude you from using the oty as needed to clear troublesome creatures.

2. Rush and Destroy
This is more what you use when you don't get enough stalling or the FG gets some early trouble. With this, you don't stall and wait for the bone yard. Instead, you fire storm when there's sufficient creatures you can kill with it (preferably you'll have at least one of the death cards) and eat with your oty as much as possible. In this way you're using a more aggressive attack. Instead of sucking the enemy army in so you can surround them and annihilate them, you're leading a charge into their camp ;) (okay, I LOVE that analogy).  Though you'll take control a bit earlier with this strategy and it's less risky in a way, it will take longer to win because you may not be generating skeletons, and mutants are your main damage.


Deck Breakdown

In this section I'll only focus on some of the more odd cards in the deck; I'll leave out the stuff like otyugh and towers and quints since those function in a rather obvious way.

Sundial
A staple of decks pre 1.15, this deck also uses them. I mostly use them to stall after playing an oty to clean up the field a bit, and you always want to save them for as long as possible. They are especially helpful when you're searching for a single card in your deck; if you have 3 hourglasses out, it's an extra 5 cards you can draw since they function as a drawing power too.

However, at the end of the turn if you're going to have to discard unless you play something and you need all the cards in your hand, don't hesitate to play a dial early.

Electrum Hourglass... Times 5?
Yeah. Five is quite a lot for a forty card deck, but it also speeds up the deck A LOT. Generally you play one as soon as possible, and then draw with it every turn. Play a second as soon as you can (but only play it if you can play it after using the current one). Same goes for the third and depending on the situation fourth if you get the quanta. But you usually only play 3 max. If you don't have much time quanta endgame, I stop drawing with 5 cards or so left to guarantee enough time quanta for eternity.

The theory behind having five is that it allows you to them earlier and get more of them, thus speeding up the deck and game. Which is a good thing.

Fog Shield
This is a good stall card, and since it's so cheap, it comes out very early. Here's the reasoning behind using it instead of permafrost:

Mostly speed. It comes out a lot faster, and 7 water is rather sketchy to get early without snovas. With snovas, you can sometimes get it really fast. Without them, you still can get it fast, but not AS fast. Even if you do get 3-4 towers on the draw, you still may not get 7 water for awhile since QTs are random. Plus fog shield does fine and can save you immediately. If you play permafrost the turn before you lose, you generally lose. If you play fog shield, you have a good chance of staying alive. And permafrost won't be nearly as effective in 1.25 due to the puffer fish nerf.

That said, it is certainly a viable option. It makes osiris an auto win basically, and makes Eternal Phoenix more viable, and would probably be better against paradox (though I see paradox as being easy anyway), and would basically shut down dream catcher.

BONEyard
People always ask why it's unupped. It's unupped because ideally you're going to mutate them anyway or use them as bait so one more attack isn't a big deal, and the boneyard costs two less death. And, more importantly, the AI doesn't target it as high up as graveyard. Since it's your only mass creature generation, you REALLY don't want it destroyed (in some games I even choose to PA it if I don't think I'll need eternity). That's another reason you want 5 hourglasses: late game perm control won't really matter since the AI will target your hourglasses even late game when you don't really need them, saving your boneyard which you do need.


You Can Give Stats, Too!
Warning: Take these statistics with a grain of salt.

Link: http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=2880858497 (http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/getstatistics.php?dv=2880858497)
(Note: Currently, it's still V1.24. Just ignore that part, but it'll be reset when the statistics website switches over too.)

So the basic idea here, is that this statistics page is for anyone else using the version of the deck shown in this original post. Only this version. If you're using a variation, you can't use this. Nor may you use this if your whole deck isn't upgraded (sans boneyard). Also keep in mind that anybody can edit the statistics, so be forewarned that a new person using this deck may ruin the statistics for everyone else by not playing it right, or someone may just be a moron and go screw it up for kicks and giggles (note that this won't make anyone else kick and giggle).

I'll check it periodically to make sure that nothing out of place is going on. If I see, for instance, a 60% win rate against neptune, I'll probably reset it.

Again, the rules:
    If you're using a variation, you can't use this.Nor may you use this if your whole deck isn't upgraded (sans boneyard).Don't just screw with it for laughs.Make sure you're confident you can play the deck without screwups.
Alright. So, now here's the username:
Test12345

And the password:
    If you're using a variation, you can't use this.Nor may you use this if your whole deck isn't upgraded (sans boneyard).Don't just screw with it for laughs.Make sure you're confident you can play the deck without screwups.
Password: laksjdhfg
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 09:25:07 pm by willng3 »

PuppyChow

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136159#msg136159
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2010, 09:10:49 pm »
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PuppyChow

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136160#msg136160
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2010, 09:11:27 pm »
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Offline BluePriest

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136162#msg136162
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2010, 09:12:42 pm »
Its definitly effective, and a lot faster than others because of how fast it can draw. I havent decided if I think a permafrost would be worth putting in with the other shields. I love the speed of the fog shield, and the bone walls a great lockdown one for later game.. I may add in a perma for midgame.

Statistics +1 Permafrost leaving everything else in
http://elementsstatistics.comxa.com/statistics.php
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CB!

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136165#msg136165
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2010, 09:13:21 pm »
Nice looking deck... I love the title... :)

hermantheowl

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136180#msg136180
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2010, 09:21:26 pm »
Do the sundials have to be upped?

kobisjeruk

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136187#msg136187
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2010, 09:26:27 pm »
are you sure 13 towers enough to fuel a 40-card deck?
i've tested and tweaked a lot on getting a workable 40-card TimeBow (i could show you the long list of card by card tweaks) and even 15 towers have problem generating sufficient quanta for your spell in the early turns...and the early turns are critical for TimeBow because you dont have the help of Supernovas to cast your spells faster

with that said, i will try this variant (who knows, maybe the answer is less instead of more) and maybe my initial thoughts which is what this is could be proven wrong

PuppyChow

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136192#msg136192
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2010, 09:33:57 pm »
Do the sundials have to be upped?
No, but it's better if they are since they don't use time quanta.
are you sure 13 towers enough to fuel a 40-card deck?
i've tested and tweaked a lot on getting a workable 40-card TimeBow (i could show you the long list of card by card tweaks) and even 15 towers have problem generating sufficient quanta for your spell in the early turns...and the early turns are critical for TimeBow because you dont have the help of Supernovas to cast your spells faster

with that said, i will try this variant (who knows, maybe the answer is less instead of more) and maybe my initial thoughts which is what this is could be proven wrong
The 5 hourglasses speed it up. Even getting 1-2 towers on the draw is fine, since you'll still get an hourglass out by turn 2-3 usually. After that you start drawing towers like a demon.

Offline BluePriest

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136198#msg136198
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2010, 09:40:35 pm »
The amount of quanta generated never seems to be a problem for me. I always seem to have plpenty to play my creatures which is rather surprising
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Offline jmdt

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136202#msg136202
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2010, 09:42:03 pm »
I'll have to give this a try.

guolin

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136217#msg136217
« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2010, 09:53:47 pm »
This reminds me of a SG rainbow. :D

I'm debating whether to go for No CC or No SN (I'm going to call this No SN from now on).

Offline BluePriest

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Re: Supernova? Why Bother??? (FG Rainbow Reloaded) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=11062.msg136261#msg136261
« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2010, 10:31:20 pm »
on my first post Im going tos tart keeping scores for +1 permafrost
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anything
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