Elements PvP Tournament - Suggestions and Feedback

[majofa]

I actually did it a while a go and sent it to Higurashi. If someone wants to update it and format it better that would be appreciated.

DATE      1st      2nd      3rd      4th
01/23/10   lehomard2   Silkenfist   jmizzle7*   LordStriker   (no result for 3rd)
01/30/10   XxDevilxX   TheoCT      didia      Dart333
02/06/10   PuppyChow   leohomard2   Rubik87      haku86
02/13/10   XxDevilxX   PuppyChow   Wu_Li_Mammoth   bsurma
02/20/10   Irkalia      Ragnoros   lokiburn4   PuppyChow
02/27/10 E   cokeandaspirin   PuppyChow   Jumbalumba   wassd13
02/27/10   Irkalia      jmizzle7   Chrissy1988   XxDevilxX
03/06/10   Terroking   Jumbalumba   PuppyChow   vrt
03/13/10 E   metahater   Belthazar666   plastiqe   acelink
03/20/10 E   Amilir      aryxo      xdawnbydeath   acelink
03/20/10 W   plastiqe   Rastafla   acelink      Justoneguy   (test0290=Rastafla)
03/27/10 E   Jumbalumba   blu      CelestrialDre   jmizzle7   (CelestrialDreamer)
03/27/10 W   plastiqe   Philogos   Antagon      lokiburn4
04/03/10 W   icybraker   verity_blues   Terroking   Lord_Jadem
04/10/10 E   cokeandaspirin   mafiadufa   plastiqe   Antagon
04/10/10 W   Antagon      Zeru      plastiqe   PuppyChow   (ziom2150=Zeru)
04/17/10 E   mafiadufa   Zeru      Levgre      blu
04/17/10 W   Rastafla   Zeru      Lavgre      Sheno13
04/24/10 E   Justoneguy   Antagon      Zeru      Rastafla
04/25/10 W   mafiadufa   Justoneguy   Rastafla   xKelevra
05/01/10 E   Levgre      PuppyChow   Rastafla   acelink
05/01/10 W   Zeru      Justoneguy   The dictator   mafiadufa
05/08/10 E   Antagon      wassd13      Multisingular   Belthazar666   (Multisingularity)
05/08/10 W   Rastafla   Zeru      Guitarmankev1   icybraker
05/15/10 E   Rastafla   Levgre      Zeru      PuppyChow
05/15/10 W   Rastalfa   DKane      Zeru      loophole
05/22/10 E   icecoldbro   Rastafla   plastiqe   rotface      (crawling94=rotface)
05/22/10 W   Belthazar666   Azumi      Troh      Corrum
05/29/10 E   Anothebrother   Zeru      Antagon      Flare
05/29/10 W   Rastafla   jheamay      Corrum      bojengles77
06/05/10 E   plastiqe   Troh      Antagon      Demagog      (socrdawg=Demagog)
06/05/10 W   Svenningen   Rastafla   Antagon*   Troh      (no result for 3rd)
06/12/10 E   Jumbalumba   VeryBored   Zeru      loudog
06/12/10 W   Dm1321      Zeru      edunavas   plastiqe
06/19/10 E   Hyroen      1chase1997   Marvaddin   markilleruk
06/19/10 W   PuppyChow   Brion      Mntoothpick   v6LUR
06/26/10 E   kevkev60614   trozman      Zeru      Anothebrother
06/26/10 W   Rastafla   ytn2006      Brion      SunnyGreens
07/03/10 E   harakirinosaru   Dragoon1140   Demagog      Smokefree
07/03/10 W   Troh      Essence      Svenn      Zeru
07/10/10 E   Rastafla   icecoldbro   DeathDealer1   3D House of Beef
07/10/10 W   plastiqe   Troh      girlsgeneration   3D House of Beef
07/17/10 E   homoaddictus   Zeru      ytn2006      Jumbalumba
07/17/10 W   killsdazombies   plastiqe   xuru      Higurashi
07/25/10 E   xuru      implosion   thraexis11   RyanVal22
07/25/10 W   Antagon      the Sage   Mac      edunavas
07/28/10 E   homoaddictus   nilsieboy   xuru      Appawesome
07/28/10 W   Antagon      nilsieboy   Unholy Spirit   Dragoon
07/31/10 E   girlsgeneration   Bubbrubb   homoaddictus   Amilir
07/31/10 W   Smokefree   thekillergame   girlsgeneration   mutantkickass
08/07/10 E   Amilir      PuppyChow   Svenn      7_Deadly_Sins
08/07/10 W   Zeru      Unholy Spirit   xuru      Dragoon
08/14/10 E   Buubrubb   Dragoon1140   smiley56   Rastafla
08/14/10 W   Azumi      the Sage   Unholy Spirit   Bubbrubb
08/21/10 E   majofa      Darkslay   mrbzs      Zeru
08/21/10 W   nilsieboy   Poxupum      thraexis11   Mntoothpick
08/28/10 E   Belthazar666   5pla5h      3D House o Beef   Unholy Spirit   (3D House of Beef)
08/28/10 W   majofa      Alderaan   Wizardcat   The dictator
09/04/10 E   Napalm Grenade   Smokefree   kevkev60614   5pla5h
09/04/10 W   vagman13   3D House o Beef   kevkev60614   nilsieboy
09/11/10 E   naruto      lava golem   Bluesky      plastiqe
09/11/10 W   plastiqe   Alderaan   jippy99      vagman13
09/18/10 E   naruto      Dragoon1140   plastiqe   Belthazar666
09/18/10 W   plastiqe   Rastafla   naruto      Zeru
09/25/10 E   lokiburn4   Zeru      3D House o Beef   Malignant
09/25/10 W   Smokefree   vagman13   twinsbuster   Higurashi
10/02/10 E   Napalm Grenade   Rastafla   mrpaper      lava golem
10/02/10 W   Zeru      vagman13   willng3      mrpaper
10/09/10 E   asymmetry   3D House o Beef   kevkev60614   lokiburn4
10/09/10 W   lokiburn4   QuantumT   Higurashi   Zeru
10/16/10 E   QuantumT   ArcanisX   chum3      Toimu13
10/16/10 W   kobisjeruk   Zeru      willng3      QuantumT
10/23/10 E   Dragoon1140   bioglond   nilsieboy   mrpaper
10/23/10 W   girlsgeneration   TheonlyrealBeef   nilsieboy*   collimatrix   (no result for 3rd)
10/30/10 E   Napalm Grenade   nilsieboy   kevkev60614   DesertKnight
10/30/10 W   twinsbuster   Rastafla   vagman13   Nadrin
11/06/10 E   Napalm Grenade   Malignant   Troh      asymmetry
11/06/10 W   kevkev60164   majofa      SunnyGreens   QuantumT
11/13/10 E   lokiburn4   lava golem   Toimu13      Troh
11/13/10 W   Napalm Grenade   N/A*      willng3      Higurashi   (2nd place was a hacker)
11/20/10 E   kobisjeruk   Rastafla   Nyma      QuantumT
11/20/10 W   Zeru      Demut      twinsbuster   thenewguy
11/27/10 E   majofa*      N/A      kevkev60614   icecoldbro   (reburntion=fatcatbro Draw Hacker)
11/27/10 W   QuantumT   Salamence_747   vaskaktusz   yc999
12/04/10 E   Rastafla   triangular   nilsieboy   N/A*      (Metachaos was a hacker)
12/04/10 W   Smokefree   fenix2011   Kael Hate   nilsieboy
12/11/10 E   Malignant   yc999      nilsieboy   Mithcairion
12/11/10 W   yc999      Zuphix      twinsbuster   Ryan666
12/18/10 E   Jen-i      Shortbus30   Cless      H2Owned
12/18/10 W   Zeru      3D House o Beef   Troh      Rainchild
12/23/10 E   girlsgeneration   TheonlyrealBeef   Jen-i      majofa
12/23/10 W   RootRanger   chum3      RavingRabbid   killsdazombies
01/01/11 E   H2Owned      Higurashi      SpikeSpiegel   girlsgeneration
01/01/11 W   SpikeSpiegel   twinsbuster      RavingRabbid   Zeru
01/08/11 E   H2Owned      Dragon1140      Mithcairion      kevkev60614
01/08/11 W   TheonlyrealBeef   MXXE         The Mormegil   gavsword
01/15/11 E   Shantu      vagman13      Mark_Tran      Syoxis
01/15/11 W   radiant6      VampirII      Heavyweight      Rastafla
01/22/11 E   Jen-i         Mark_Tran      majofa      radiant6
01/22/11 W   TheIdioticIdiot   crafton      OleMAa      killsdazombies
01/29/11 E   kobisjeruk      warfiend      Heavyweight      nilsieboy
01/29/11 W   ji412jo      zupermannd      nilsieboy      masamainio
02/05/11 E   TombSimon      Tichan      Heavyweight      jippy99
02/05/11 W   twinsbuster      thenewguy      OleMAa      DeathPanda1          (TR15T3N=DeathPanda1)
02/12/11 E   majofa      Legit         Shadoy      DesertKnight
02/12/11 W   TheIdioticIdiot   plastiqe      triangular      jboyken3
02/19/11 E   bioglond      BatCountry      TheonlyrealBeef   Malignant
02/19/11 W   SteppingStone81   TheIdioticIdiot   TheonlyrealBeef   Higurashi
02/26/11 E   Noobiecakes   Nik_V         Malebolgia      randomu
02/26/11 W   TStar         Seraph      morningstar      Private_14
03/05/11 E   yc999         crimsonflippa   EvaRia      Mithcairion
03/05/11 W   TStar         yc999         Trench5      blacob
03/12/11 E   QuantumT      lava golem      drogana      DrunkDestroyer
03/12/11 W   TStar         Hisar         sunchew      deuce22
03/19/11 E   blacob      majofa      chum3      Jen-i
03/19/11 W   TheIdioticIdiot   Five in One      Danade      crystleyoshi
03/26/11 E   DSSCRA      phaedrus      agogo         majofa
03/26/11 W   RootRanger      girlsgeneration   TStar         Falcon4415
04/02/11 E   Gorthos      xn0ize      whitevo      DeathPanda1
04/02/11 W   TStar         Seraph      DeathPanda1   Svenningen
04/09/11 E   Kuroaitou      ddevans96      TStar         bjessee
04/09/11 W   Kakerlake      kevkev60614   pikachufan2164   Onizuka
04/16/11 E   Jen-i         DevilLoss      AnoverX      RootRanger
04/16/11 W   girlsgeneration   RootRanger      pikachufan2164   xn0ize
04/23/11 E   Zeru         TheonlyrealBeef   blacob      Kakerlake
04/23/11 W   Terroking      DevilLoss      b0uncer52      Kuroaitou
04/30/11 E   jippy99      DesertKnight      RootRanger      majofa
04/30/11 W   vagman13      TheonlyrealBeef   vinvick3714      Hisar
05/07/11 E   whitevo      Jen-i         Genuinous      TheonlyrealBeef
05/07/11 W   Shantu      jippy99      majofa      iCall_uHobo
05/14/11 E   majofa      tttt         TheonlyrealBeef   Kuroaitou
05/14/11 W   Higurashi      triangular      QuantumT      Kakerlake
05/21/11 E   QuantumT      majofa      bcassol      Jen-i
05/21/11 W   QuantumT      TheForbiddenOracle  Wizardcat      xn0ize
05/28/11 E   Sevs         Dwerg      TStar         DeathPanda1
05/28/11 W   QuantumT      mrpaper      Rastafla      bcassol
06/04/11 E   Minor Vampire   Eishi         kirchj33      yc999                  (Death Star=Eishi)
06/04/11 W   TheForbiddenOracle  willng3      scauduro221095   TStar
06/11/11 E   Rastafla      majofa      Dwerg      Jen-i
06/11/11 W   Rastafla      tttt         Vazrael      naruto
06/18/11 E   MatrimKK      Eishi         kohiwy      TheonlyrealBeef
06/18/11 W   vagman13      Gorthos      Wizardcat      TheonlyrealBeef
06/25/11 E   manaboy100   SpikeSpiegel   Djhopper       Flama
06/25/11 W   Wizardcat      TStar         Onizuka      dracomageat
07/02/11 E   DesertKnight      calindu221      Odii Odsen      Flama
07/02/11 W   mrpaper      QuantumT      MatrimKK      Rastafla
07/09/11 E   Sevs         Dwerg      YoungSot      majofa
07/09/11 W   RootRanger      Rastafla      Onizuka      Bonestorm
07/16/11 E   TStar         nilsieboy      jmdt         majofa
07/16/11 W   majofa      Gorthos      Shantu      kirchj33
07/23/11 E   MatrimKK      Odii Odsen      Flama         5pla5h
07/23/11 W   Shantu      DesertKnight      Onizuka      EarthForce       (Master Katie=EarthForce)
07/30/11 E   Dwerg      Jen-i         TStar         Dragoon
07/30/11 W   TStar         Dwerg      Higurashi      Onizuka
08/06/11 E  YoungSot  --  Rastafla  --  Gillero  --  girlsgeneration
08/06/11 W  TheForbiddenOracle  --  kevkev60614  --  ralouf  --  majofa
08/13/11 E  calindu221  --  bucky1andonly  --  MatrimKK  majofa
08/13/11 W  RootRanger  whitevo  Dwerg  MatrimKK
08/20/11 E  Dracomageat  EvaRia  BloodlinE213  Rastafla
08/20/11 W  vagman13  TStar  xn0ize  nerd1
08/27/11 E  ~Napalm  Masterfurry  Gorthos  Shantu
08/27/11 W  phaedrus  Bonestorm  MatrimKK  Rastafla
09/03/11 E  Jappert  Dwerg  calindu221  girlsgeneration
09/03/11 W  vagman13  Higurashi  dragonsdemesne  TheForbiddenOracle
09/10/11 E  TStar  ~Napalm  Kuroaitou  Rush6
09/10/11 W  PlayerOa  MatrimKK  kirchj33  vagman13
09/17/11 E  Dwerg  lokiburn4  MatrimKK  Rush6
09/17/11 W  RootRanger  deuce22  Gorthos  Jappert
09/24/11 E  vagman13  10 men  Vineroz  majofa
09/24/11 W  Zeru  Onizuka  RootRanger  majofa
10/01/11 E  bucky1andonly  MatrimKK  Onizuka  Jen-i
10/01/11 W  Onizuka  willng3  PoLdeR  Shantu
10/08/11 E  calindu221  Dwerg  Sevs  ralouf
10/08/11 W  Higurashi  mrpaper  Dwerg  bogtro
10/15/11 E  Dwerg  dragonsemesne  Sevs  calindu221
10/15/11 W  mrpaper  majofa  drogana  dragonsemesne
10/22/11 E  deuce22  Dwerg  Malignant  ji412jo
10/22/11 W  vagman13  Jenkar  PlayerOa  Dwerg
10/29/11 E  10 men  Xenocidius  YoungSot  Jen-i
10/29/11 W  YoungSot  Jen-i  vagman13  Vineroz
11/05/11 E  Jaymanfu  Odii Odsen  dragonsemesne  Jenkar
11/05/11 W  Jaymanfu  CCCombobreaker  dragonsemesne  mrpaper
11/12/11 E  mrpaper  Vineroz  TStar  majofa
11/12/11 W  majofa  phaedrus  deuce22  Jenkar

...also....
Needs updated as well...
(cokeandaspirin has 3 trophies, but I don't know where the 3rd came from)

10   Rastafla

7   majofa
7   TStar
7   vagman13
7   Zeru

6   plastiqe
6   QuantumT
6   ~Napalm

5   RootRanger

4   Antagon
4   girlsgeneration

3   Dwerg
3   Jen-i
3   kobisjeruk
3   lokiburn4
3   mrpaper
3   Shantu
3   Smokefree
3   TheIdioticIdiot

2   Amilir
2   Belthazar666
2      calindu221
2(3)   cokeandaspirin
2   Higurashi
2   homoaddictus
2   Irkalia
2      Jaymanfu
2   Jumbalumba
2   kevkev60614
2   mafiadufa
2   MatrimKK
2   naruto
2   PuppyChow
2   Sevs
2   Terroking
2   The ForbiddenOracle
2   twinsbuster
2   XxDevilxX
2   yc999
2      YoungSot

1      10 men
1   Anothebrother
1   asymmetry
1   Azumi
1   blacob
1   bioglond
1   Bubbrubb
1      bucky1andonly
1   DesertKnight
1   Dm1321
1      Dracomageat
1   Dragoon1140
1   DSSCRA
1      deuce22
1   Gorthos
1   jippy99
1      Jappert
1   Justoneguy
1   harakirinosaru
1   H2Owned
1   Hyroen
1   icecoldbro
1   icybraker
1   ji412jo
1   Kakerlake
1   killsdazombies
1   Kuroaitou
1   lehomard2
1   Levgre
1   Malignant
1   manaboy100
1   metahater
1   Minor Vampire
1   nilsieboy
1   Noobiecakes
1      Onizuka
1      phaedrus
1      PlayerOa
1   radiant6
1   SpikeSpiegel
1   SteppingStone81
1   Svenningen
1   TheonlyrealBeef
1   TombSimon
1   Troh
1   whitevo
1   Wizardcat
1   xuru

[jippy99]

That was the list that Higs forwarded to me.  If someone would like to help us complete this project, just shoot me a PM and I can get you started.

[dragonsdemesne]

Yeah, that's exactly the kind of thing I was looking for!  Thanks lots   Also, looking at that and the PMs I have from tourney codes (I saved them all but one) I just realized that the reward code starts with the number of your place, i.e. a 3rd place reward code starts with a 3, followed by a whole bunch of random letters.  Looks like I have five 2nds, five 3rds, and one 4th to my name so far   Gotta get some 'ones' now.

[Misfire]

I'm not sure where I should post this, as my post is a suggestion of a major change in the tournament system rather than discussion of the rule of 30 posts etc. I'm quite new to The Elements (just several months) and I've never posted before, yet I happened to have fallen in love with The Game and secondly, the topic of tournament organization is somewhat familiar to me.
After having read the tourney rules thread, two main problems hit me: a large number of players willing to participate almost every time and limited capability of knockout game system in dealing with such situations from statistical viewpoint. Moreover, as card games have some significant factors based on randomness (possibility of meeting a counterdeck, drawing sequence, etc.), elimination of a participant according to his performance against just one of the other 32 players can produce somewhat crooked overall results.
The soultion would be a Swiss tournament system preceding the knockout phase, applied widely in chess competition, where all participants play several games, one game per round (usually total of 7 to 9, it is calculated based on entrants number). Pairing in subsequent rounds is based on results from the previous one(s), precisely on number of wins (a player with 2 wins over two rounds will be most likely paired with another player that scored 2 wins, 0'er with another 0'er, etc.). As it tends to pair players of more and more similar strength (performance), after all needed rounds are played it produces highly credible results, and most tournaments see it as preliminary stage before the knockout part commences (which is usually held for the top 8 swiss participants).
For tournament hosts it's a bit harder to hold a swiss than a knockout, since it needs more games, yet it shouldn't take more time, as the number of rounds stays basically the same or alike, and furthermore, every round means just one game instead of a match, as the 7-9 rounds make the results more viable.
There is a lot of software (also freeware) handling swiss tourneys (pairing, scoring, 1-st round pairing (based on rating) etc.) and, of course, in case the organizers are interested I'll do my best to help any further.

[jippy99]

I'm not sure where I should post this, as my post is a suggestion of a major change in the tournament system rather than discussion of the rule of 30 posts etc. I'm quite new to The Elements (just several months) and I've never posted before, yet I happened to have fallen in love with The Game and secondly, the topic of tournament organization is somewhat familiar to me.
After having read the tourney rules thread, two main problems hit me: a large number of players willing to participate almost every time and limited capability of knockout game system in dealing with such situations from statistical viewpoint. Moreover, as card games have some significant factors based on randomness (possibility of meeting a counterdeck, drawing sequence, etc.), elimination of a participant according to his performance against just one of the other 32 players can produce somewhat crooked overall results.
The soultion would be a Swiss tournament system preceding the knockout phase, applied widely in chess competition, where all participants play several games, one game per round (usually total of 7 to 9, it is calculated based on entrants number). Pairing in subsequent rounds is based on results from the previous one(s), precisely on number of wins (a player with 2 wins over two rounds will be most likely paired with another player that scored 2 wins, 0'er with another 0'er, etc.). As it tends to pair players of more and more similar strength (performance), after all needed rounds are played it produces highly credible results, and most tournaments see it as preliminary stage before the knockout part commences (which is usually held for the top 8 swiss participants).
For tournament hosts it's a bit harder to hold a swiss than a knockout, since it needs more games, yet it shouldn't take more time, as the number of rounds stays basically the same or alike, and furthermore, every round means just one game instead of a match, as the 7-9 rounds make the results more viable.
There is a lot of software (also freeware) handling swiss tourneys (pairing, scoring, 1-st round pairing (based on rating) etc.) and, of course, in case the organizers are interested I'll do my best to help any further.

While you idea is quite a good idea, it does pose a couple of big problems.  First, such a big scaled switch is highly unlikely since we have had this system since we started tourneys and we haven't had many problems with it since.  Second, this would actually take longer than a tourney as we have it now. 7-9 games is anywhere in between 2-4 matches.  So, by the time you could have had 3 rounds done, you would have just completed this preliminary round.  Say we have 32 participants (which we never come close to).  By the time we would have played 7 swiss rounds, we would have already completed 2 regular tourney rounds and would be in the middle of a third.  This is just game wise, not including the extra time needed for brackets and recording results for the TO each round whereas that is not needed for a knockout tourney.  Those two plus rounds with 32 participants will have put gotten us 8 or less participants left with much less work for the TO (less is much much better, trust me).  Third, this would be a much more chaotic just because so many more games are being played.  Fourth, this is too many games for a tourney.  Tourneys are supposed to be short and with few games.  This system might be a bit better fit for PvP Events.  Although I do appreciate your offer and the thought you put into it, it is very unlikely that this will happen.

[RootRanger]

People want tournaments to be quick. 7-9 different opponents to even reach the final 8 is going to take far too long. If each Best of 1 game takes 20 minutes to set up and play, including time spent exchanging IGNs and waiting for an opponent, it could likely take up to 3 hours before the final 8. This ends up being twice as long as the current tournaments, and the average player has to play far more matches. I think tournaments would decrease in popularity because players will have to spend much more time playing and stay up later.

One of the main problems is that players tend to drop out or stop trying when they no longer have any chance to win. Swiss tournaments could actually introduce more luck because some players will receive many more free wins than others, and the TOs will have a harder time dealing with more drop-outs.

It looks like your system switches from Best of 3 to Best of 1, and this has consequences that you might not have noticed. A lot of the skill in tournaments involves having good decks ready for many different opposing decks and predicting how your opponent will react to the decks used. With a Best of 1 system, some skills no longer become useful. For example, a Best of 1 situation would destroy players with strong prediction and game understanding but weak deckbuilding skills.

Swiss works well in some places, but Elements tournaments are more common and less significant than tournaments that use Swiss, such as chess tournaments. I think the current system is better.

[Misfire]

Well, I see your point. There is definitely more work with holding a swiss than a knockout, I'm not questioning that in any way (in fact you need one more person to do the work smoothly). Actually, 32 participants would be a 5-rounder, and less than this probably justifies a knockout at all  (you hardly hold swisses for a handful of people). Also high repeatedness of the tournaments makes for some score inaccuracy of a single knockout event.
Also you got a point with, and I haven't put my mind to the fact some guys just hightail out of tourney when things start to crumble, it of course makes swiss results inadeqaute at all.
I can't argue or agree with the rest of reasons, as judging by my forum acc stats, I'm hardly near the tourney admission threshold. I try to avoid spam so it will take me a bit to cope with that, yet it's great you guys repeated so fast, thanks for this.

[benthewolf1]

I think the Prizes should be increased aswell. Spend about 2-3hours in the tourny and come second. You could just spend that time farming fgs or gold or something and gaining more money.

[Jenkar]

I think the Prizes should be increased aswell. Spend about 2-3hours in the tourny and come second. You could just spend that time farming fgs or gold or something and gaining more money.

The main importance of tournys is gathering experience in pvp, as well as having fun. Also, keep in mind that a code  is money that you can actually give to anybody, allowing you to build a mini event if you wish to.

[Djhopper :)]

I think the Prizes should be increased aswell. Spend about 2-3hours in the tourny and come second. You could just spend that time farming fgs or gold or something and gaining more money.

I agree with this. I think that second and third should get rares (not ultrarares) as reward alongside the cash. It is rather disheartening to do what you consider amazingly in a tournament only to get a measly 3000 electrum.

[Onizuka]

Anything other than first place is a horrible placing.

[plastiqe]

A code for a rare card (Shard or a Weapon) reward would be a great addition for 2nd place.