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Messages - atomi (30)

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1
Game Suggestions and Feedback / Re: PVP farming [exploit]
« on: October 28, 2011, 06:42:17 pm »
No spins in pvp is absurd....

You should be ashamed for suggesting such an absurd idea.
Is that any easier than farming using a stolen deck?

2
Rainbow Decks / Re: retiring my pillarless 9/10 win rate on pvp2
« on: October 09, 2011, 06:21:44 pm »
Explosion nerf was quite annoying for nova decks... pretty much all my upped nova powered decks feature two+ explosions. Nice deck, I have something similar as well.
I agree about the nerf. I had a a lot fun with it, thanks.

3
Rainbow Decks / Re: retiring my pillarless 9/10 win rate on pvp2
« on: October 09, 2011, 05:43:17 pm »
Instead of retiring the deck, just drop an explosion for another nightmare, it mostly solves the problem.
Not a bad idea. You would hope that you get a nightmare before or momentum before the opponent has a chance to spam shields.
But for instance an aether dim shield or bone shield deck will still cause problems.

4
Rainbow Decks / retiring my pillarless 9/10 win rate on pvp2
« on: October 09, 2011, 02:30:49 pm »
This deck did me well until deflag/explosion got nerfed (whoever suggested this, boohooohoo pal).

So now, if an opponent heavily uses permanents it hoses this deck.
The strategy is to hopefully get a dune scorpion and unstoppable out as fast as you can, then drop elite de ja vus, buff them using the chaos powers and double them up. If antimatter is used just rewind the deja vu, the nightmare is there in case of immo rushes and it comes in handy in other situations as well especially with rewinds.

There are definitely other possibilities with the deja vus, but again the explosions are nearly useless now in this deck.  >:(

Edit: okay maybe not 9/10 I never did measure statistical win rate, but it was up there for sure.
Hover over cards for details, click for permalink
Deck import code : [Select]
4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 6u2 6u2 6u2 6u2 74a 74a 74a 7dm 7dm 7dm 7q1 7q1 7q1 7q1 7q4 7q4 7q4 7qd 7qd 7qd 7th 80a 80a 80a 8ps


5
Fire / Re: Deflagration | Explosion
« on: October 08, 2011, 08:33:26 pm »
Okay everybody I appreciate the discussion/input.

Maybe some policy improvements can come out of this, maybe not.
But, I think I got out most of my concerns so that at the least they are on print.

Sure, pillarless decks that don't use immolation have to pack less, but those decks remaining powerful is not part of the basic mechanics of the meta-game.
This was my gripe. I'm sure the meta-game has some unique decks but I loved my pillarless deck so much that it being made nearly useless by this small change was extremely upsetting.

6
Fire / Re: Deflagration | Explosion
« on: October 08, 2011, 07:17:55 pm »
Let's not any of us forget the maximum number of deflags/explosions you get in your deck is 6.
Yet it's possible to have 60 (sixty) permanents in a single deck.
 Not sure what you're trying to imply here.  It doesn't even seem like it's responding to my post.
Sorry that wasn't the reply I meant for your post.

If we were to look at creature counter/control for guidance we would see there are a lot of ways to introduce new forms of PC.
We can do something like a 1 fire quanta cost deflag for permanents that costs less than 5 quanta for example.
Or how about a rewind for permanents. Or a freeze/basalisk blood type spell. But we need more PC that much should be clear.
The main thing here is this all should have been ironed out before introducing the nerfed deflag/explosion.


7
Fire / Re: Deflagration | Explosion
« on: October 08, 2011, 06:55:41 pm »
Did you consider the possibility that this change was done so that new forms of PC can be introduced?  As long as there is no revival of cards from the discard pile, destruction of a permanent is one of the strongest forms of PC. The only stronger form of PC would be steal, and PC-destruction-on-a-stick.  Any future PC idea will be weaker, so if explosion costs 1, how do you make a PC card that's not completely inferior but still balanced and useful?
Let's not any of us forget the maximum number of deflags/explosions you get in your deck is 6.
Yet it's possible to have 60 (sixty) permanents in a single deck.

8
Fire / Re: Deflagration | Explosion
« on: October 08, 2011, 06:52:48 pm »
IMO, Deflagration | Explosion deserved this nerf because it's a terrible card. When you splash two or three Deflags in a deck, you are aiming to kill the opponent before the opponent can get enough permanents out to garner field advantage. It's silly how Deflagration | Explosion and Steal is the only form of permanent control that cannot be countered. Repeatable permanent control is balanced in that the source can be destroyed (Butterfly Effect, Pulverizer) before it is used, but, as for direct spells, you can only hope the the opponent didn't bring them.
This isn't too bad with steals, you only have to keep your important permanents in hand while the opponent has more than 3 darkness quanta.
However, when the opponent always has more than one fire quanta left over, you really can't do anything to strategically hinder Deflagration | Explosion. I see no way to balance a spell that completely destroys a permanent, which was once a card that was put into and drawn from a person's deck, but increasing its cost is a step in the right direction.
I agree with a lot of what you say with respect to the lack of counter for PC spells. The problem is we don't have instants or a stack.
There is no way to counter a spell without having a stack. What we do have are protect artifact spells and quints - maybe these ought to be buffed in lieu of another PC card. This is after all a discussion. I'm completely open to sharing ideas.

What bothers me is that this was done without discussion or warning that I'm aware of. And seemingly without much thought as to the obvious consequences to the basic mechanics of the game. It takes so much discussion and voting for a new card to be added yet something like this was just shoved down my throat...

9
Fire / Re: Deflagration | Explosion
« on: October 08, 2011, 06:41:39 pm »
Nova decks were already way too strong. A small nerf for them isn't a problem.
okay.

Um, and how is this a problem? Creatures are still used way more than non-pillar/pendulum permanents. Why not close the gap?
This divide in game play between permanent users and creature users is making matches too predictable.
I have no clue what you're even trying to say here. Most decks use both, and that doesn't even change predictability.
I think the idea is that creating a schism between these two modes of play will level statistical averages of wins/losses, which it does.
Schism between two modes of play? Seriously? Using permanents and creatures in the same deck is totally acceptable.
There really aren't many high level strategies to building decks on Elements.
You have
a. immo/nova/shrieker rushes  which are heavily creature based
b. quanta draining decks pests/black holes
c. heavy permanent use decks usually time that use hourglasses and sundials or SoG + Shield spam
d. misc gimmicky decks
 1. like sundials till you get your dragons and parrallel uni at last turn
 2. buffed wyrms/deja vus
 3. voodo doll decks

What happens is that if you have an A deck competing against a C deck without PC the match will be predictable (ie. A will lose most of the time)
D vs D decks will be good fun. B vs A decks will be over quickly but still interesting and mostly fair I suppose.
B vs C without PC will also be predictable (ie B will almost always lose)

I'm surprised that wasn't more obvious.

Eternity costs 6 quanta, Deflag costs 3. Who comes out on top? The deflag user.
And a pure damage deck can usually outdamage a stall.
And a 6 Eternity Deck wouldn't be very good and would lose to a lot of decks that aren't just immo or nova rush.
The problem is you only need one eternity to dominate an immo/nova rush deck


Fire has been the strongest Element for months. It still is. Nerfing Deflag and Explosion was a great change to bring Fire closer to the strength of the other Elements. If you don't want a balanced game, go somewhere else.
There are certainly many more ways to lower Fire's strength. Many of which don't require nerfing an important PC card.

10
Fire / Re: Deflagration | Explosion
« on: October 08, 2011, 06:08:40 pm »
And hence forth, the Sun Dial wars began...

 >:(

11
Fire / Re: Deflagration | Explosion
« on: October 08, 2011, 05:48:47 pm »
With how many powerful perms there are in the game and continue growing, its sad that limited PC control like deflag/explosion is being nerf'd. Lets just hope new PC control is on the way, but who are we kidding
I agree with you and I'd like to have someone with authority come in and definitely say whether there will be something comparable to deflag/explosion for permanent control for use with nova decks for example.

What I'm seeing is a gradual move from creature based deck building to permanent decks, especially now with this Shard of Void I've been seeing. This divide in game play between permanent users and creature users is making matches too predictable.

I think the idea is that creating a schism between these two modes of play will level statistical averages of wins/losses, which it does.
But at the same time, If I see a deck with 6 Eternities and 6 SoG, I don't care how many creatures/buffs you have, you're going to lose bad.
Now add to that shield spammers...

I'm disgusted at this change and the lack of foresight that was displayed when implementing this.

12
General Discussion / Card Cost discussion (Explosion)
« on: October 08, 2011, 04:24:43 pm »
Okay let's try this again. If this is in the wrong forum, feel free to move the thread or of course let me know.

I'd like to have a discussion as to why the Explosion card's cost was raised to 2 fire quanta from 1 fire quanta.
I'm not sure when this was proposed as I've searched the forums and haven't found any other discussion related to this change.

Understand! I don't want to ruffle feathers.
I just want to add my experienced opinion as a long time player and get input from the rest of the community.
If you are interested in moving forward with a petition to lower the cost back to it's original (and more sensible) value please reply.
If you are afraid of moderators please PM me, I'll keep a list on hand of how many people are in agreement - and I'll keep your anonymous.

I look forward to presenting this to Zanz directly in the near future.

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blarg: atomi