Shame on the Rich

[Essence]

http://news.sciencemag.org/sciencenow/2012/02/shame-on-the-rich.html?ref=hp


tl;dr: Science proves rich people are more prone to lie, cheat, and steal -- as are poor people conditioned to "think rich".  This creates a vicious cycle as rich people abuse the system with their wealth and get rewarded for doing so.  Pretty much explains the entire non-religious side of the US Republican Party.

[Hyroen]

It doesn't seem like the people are to be completely blamed for this type of behaviour. There is evidence that feelings of superiority in general seem to make people think that they have more rights than others.

A more controversial explanation could posit that lying, cheating, and stealing are not inherently evil but are labelled as such in order to produce larger communities that would work together, that could acknowledge and flaunt the uniquely human quality.

Perhaps it's that lying, cheating and stealing are indeed the more intelligent options in a world of individuals fighting to stay on top, but as we live in a human world that emphasizes notions of frontal lobe decision making and overriding, people are not allowed to or not encouraged to use those methods.

Good read, thanks Essence, it'll be good material for an essay I have on morality.

[Kynthea]

Pretty much explains the entire non-religious side of the US Republican Party.

Now that seems like a fairly poor and highly biased generalization.

With that aside the survey and its results are quite interesting. Personally I find the candy jar and online die test more reliable than the real world driving test as there are other factors that come into play with the cars - How many of the older cheaper cars are driven by people who can't afford better insurance, and thus have more to lose from an accident? How many middle class people over extend their means for nicer cars? how many "richer" people drive older cars? Among other potential influencing factors,  although I did find the Prius part very believable as is.

What I find the most interesting is what the candy test showed. In my opinion the results showed it was the persons individual perception of themselves and their own status that caused the greedy result not the actual wealth itself.

[Essence]

the persons individual perception of themselves and their own status that caused the greedy result not the actual wealth itself.

Oh, there's no doubt about that -- but all that does is add "and powerful" to the list of things that make you lie, cheat, and steal. Making politicians, corporate executives, Wall Street financiers, and the other Republicans just that much more vulnerable to this kind of thing.

And yes, I'm grossly overgeneralizing and I know it. Cope.

[YoungSot]

Power corrupts. There's no denying it. Your jab at Republicans when this is something that clearly applies to all politicians, or really any who seek power in any form, is annoying.
Also, nice to have you back, if only for a little while! 

Edit: also been meaning to say, your current avatar is awesome.

[Aves]

mmm.... a bit off topic, but why only the secular Republicans? I'm sure that religious people can lie, cheat, and steal, too.

This is very interesting, but I believe statistical analysis of human behaviour to be unreliable by nature - There may be interesting effects observed, but I'm skeptical of measuring human nature through arbitrary instances and events. In addition, this article didn't reference the middle class, nor did it have designate exactly what determined 'upper class' or 'poor'.

[Belthus]

mmm.... a bit off topic, but why only the secular Republicans? I'm sure that religious people can lie, cheat, and steal, too.

Secular Republicans tend to be devotees of Ayn Rand or libertarian economists and philosophers. They lionize individualism, denigrate collective action, and believe that "greed is good." It's possible for the religious right to do those things, but there are major aspects of Christianity that have to be ignored. Not to say that that doesn't happen, but I do think that right-wing Christians are more community-minded (i.e., faith-based community) than secular right-wingers.

[Kynthea]

And yes, I'm grossly overgeneralizing and I know it. Cope.

Nope, not on this one

Let’s take a look at some prominent Democrats right now and compare them to Mitt Romney the “Big Bad Republican businessman” shall we?
Romney gave more than 16% of his total income to charity last year (and the year before that…), and when coupled with the amount he paid in taxes that year, 3.2 million, it was roughly 42% of his total income.
This would have covered:
-   Food stamps for about 24,000 people
-   Educating 302 elementary students
-   The salary of 178 army privates
-   636 Medicare dependents

In comparison though 200-2004 the Obama family did not even give 1% of their earnings to charity In 2005 and 2006 in preparation for the elections they raised their giving just enough to hit the 5% mark in order to gain a more favorable light.

How about Joe Biden, can he help restore the Democrats giving image for the Obama campaign? Sadly no, He and his wife average under $400 a year which amounts to under .5% of their total income. After becoming the VP the jumped it up to ~$5,000 a year placing their charitable donations at under 1.5% of their income

Well since this administration is out the window, let’s try the last Democratic Party in office, the Clinton. Oh Oh Oh we have a winner their donations average between 8% and 12% of their total income. While much higher than the current administration, I would like to point out that it still falls just a bit short of Romney’s yearly donation, and I thought republicans were supposed to be the heartless ones…

Now before you fly off the handle and state “well that’s only one republican” I’ll go ahead and throw out the numbers for Romney’s main competition in the primaries, Newt Gingrich. Gingrich donated a measly 2.6 %. However, that’s still higher than both Obama and Biden, and let’s face it Gingrich, unlike many democrats, has never once proclaimed to be a champion of the poor.

All in all, while democrats tend to be more generous with money it tends to be the tax payers money, yours and mine, and not their own.


* The numbers here have come from both Investors Business Daily and the Huffington Post.

[Hyroen]

I probably should've figured that if this was in Politics, it would take that perspective and not one of Psychology. :c

[Kynthea]

I probably should've figured that if this was in Politics, it would take that perspective and not one of Psychology. :c

I actually wouldn't mind discussing this topic (or a similar one) in the science section without the political spin on it. Honestly I'm quite interested in the "Prius" effect in the last experiment, I know that often times when doing something nice I've even said something along the lines of "well that’s my good deed for the insert proper amount of time here"
As far as the experiement as a whole I have a lot of unanswered questions, definitions, and distinctions I would like cleared up but alas without finding another article on this, or perhaps the study itself I'm not going to have any luck

This thread at least from my perspective started to get derailed by the initial jab at republicans as now that generalization is an issue in contention.

[Essence]

Let’s take a look at some prominent Democrats right now and compare them to Mitt Romney the “Big Bad Republican businessman” shall we?
Romney gave more than 16% of his total income to charity last year (and the year before that…), and when coupled with the amount he paid in taxes that year, 3.2 million, it was roughly 42% of his total income.

Straw man. Romney is Mormon.  Tithing + Fast Offerings account for the vast majority of his 'charitable donations', and they're required by law in his church.  Anything he gave past that, i'll be happy to grant you -- and not particularly care, because Romney is worth several times with Obama is worth. He has vastly more disposable income, so he SHOULD give vastly more in charity.

All in all, while democrats tend to be more generous with money it tends to be the tax payers money, yours and mine, and not their own.

Yep.  And you know what? I have no problem with that, because I'd rather have everyone contributing to the future good of my country than having a few people contributing to charities that don't do things like run public schools, maintain our infrastructure, or put out fires.

[BluePriest]

Wait... there aren't any rich democrats????