Is Sexual and Sexist University Orientation Camp acceptable?

[foxrain4]

  http://singaporeseen.stomp.com.sg/this-urban-jungle/is-such-a-sexually-suggestive-game-allowed-guy-pushes-crotch-against-girls-face

University orientation is basically just new students gather together and have fun and bonding together.
But my google search on my country shows otherwise.
Somehow because of the seniors organizing university orientation, and therefore, some seniors attempted to change the orientation games
and pressure new students to participate sexual and sexist activities.

Its totally alright for guys here to get excited about sexual and sexist activities, and maybe even girls.
But is it the right place, the right time to do so?
Yes university orientation is optional, but does sexual and sexist activities makes the university orientation an orientation?
Are the students going to universities for learning lewd and lascivious behaviours? (hint: no)

How about we look at this in a better perspective, perhaps the sexual and sexist activities is for the age 21,23 youngsters
to get into relationships? To get to learn more about the opposite sex of the taboo topics?


  foxrain4 googling kinking stuffs

“The camp facilitators were making the girls … lick (whipped) cream off his neck, his nipples and also rub (their) hands on his thigh, trying to sexually stimulate him,” wrote the author, who identified herself as “Ms. Ng”.

Most students who were interviewed had either seen or heard of similar activities.

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Psychology Camp organizer Lau Boon Yen described a similarly sexual-themed activity called Secret Pals.

“They wake the participants up at 3 a.m. and blindfold them, and make the girl sit on the guy’s lap,” Lau said.

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Some of the activities involved hugging, passing of coin-sized objects from mouth to mouth, lying on top of each other, or even taking up sexually suggestive positions, all with members of the opposite sex.

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 It would probably be alright if freshmen were mutually agreeable and sporting enough to participate in games distinguishable from an orgy only by the wearing of clothes, though such arousing physical tasks may develop into something else post-orientation.

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The ragging trend spilled into Singapore Polytechnic as well, with victims forced to stand on chairs, belted with verbal abuse and forced to walk around campus topless.

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‘Taupoking’ was the planking of varsity games in 2005, which involved freshmen piling one of top of another like how footballers celebrate a goal except less enjoyable and you’re likely to emerge from the bottom of the pack unable to move your bowels for the next couple of days.

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In a phone interview with Stomp, he said that the camp was held off-campus and male students had to take off their shirts when they entered this "zone".

At the chalet, there was a sign put up that said "No shirts allowed beyond this point!" and the students cannot say no.

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Although games often involve forfeits, I do not see how a forfeit of a female partner stripping the swimming trunks off her male partner has anything to do with promoting sports. And what about having girls sit on guys' laps on the bus from NTU to Sentosa?

In fact, the sports camp was littered with embarrassing game rules and forfeits involving excessive and unnecessary physical contact between male and female participants.

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Try having a forfeit to grind a guy :/

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oh yah!
i rber got one orientation......got this stupid game.....
everyone mus stand on a bench (those canteen bench) and points are awarded according to how many ppl u can squeeze within the limited space and eberyone mus balance.....and i dunno which cock organiser's idea, say mus be guy-ger alternating......

so my br3asts (a-cup) are pressing on the back of the guy in front of me, and i can feel the bazhang of the guy behind me pressing against my butt......wah piangz........i dun think this is how u "get to know your schoolmates" .......
 
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Walau ey! So young doing the 69 position. This happened because the institution management never look into the organising team and the activities. Last time in one orientation programme, the guys were made to rub with their wet bodies across the many wet girls who laid down on the floor. Then last time during my orientation, I heard from some other freshmen that some chio girls were asked to follow the seniors to a corner or into a classroom...don't ask me what they did.


  Im guessing google have your location data and other details so searching stuffs on my country might be harder than it should be,
so i will just post the direct links here.

Spoiler for Hidden:

http://singaporeseen.stomp.com.sg/this-urban-jungle/is-such-a-sexually-suggestive-game-allowed-guy-pushes-crotch-against-girls-face
https://blog.nus.edu.sg/nm3211/2014/10/18/sexual-activities-feature-highly-in-nus-orientation-games/
http://thewatchmennus.weebly.com/have-university-orientation-games-gone-too-far.html
http://everythingalsocomplain.com/2011/09/18/freshmen-doing-push-ups-on-top-of-girls/
http://singaporeseen.stomp.com.sg/this-urban-jungle/inappropriate-orientation-games-becoming-a-trend-at-local-universities
http://news.asiaone.com/News/Education/Story/A1Story20080901-85336.html
http://sgforums.com/forums/8/topics/88253
http://www.mrbrown.com/blog/2004/07/hot_and_steamy_.html
http://forums.vr-zone.com/chit-chatting/321640-news-uni-orientations-too-naughty-3.html
http://sgforums.com/forums/8/topics/88502
fake http://newnation.sg/2014/08/sporean-student-gets-pregnant-playing-universitys-freshmen-orientation-camp-games/

[OldTrees]

Consent is required for any and all sexual activities.
Consent is explicit, it is not assumed.
Consent is continuous, it can be withdrawn at any time.
Consent is informed. While a sub-dom relationship can develop enough trust that the sub trusts the dom's understanding of their limits without explicit communication, such a level of trust is usually not present between strangers or acquaintances.


While these activities could be perfectly fine* if they followed consent, it is structured so initial consent is dubious at best and the normal orientation peer pressure makes continual consent dubious.


PS: I did not read carefully, but I am not sure there was anything sexist there. Lots of sexual stuff with dubious consent but not sexist as far as I saw.


*Orientation is mostly about getting to know each other and creating connections. The actual social activity used to create that sense of community is dependent on on the individuals in question. But consent is REQUIRED for all sexual activities!

[foxrain4]

Consent is required for any and all sexual activities.
Consent is explicit, it is not assumed.
Consent is continuous, it can be withdrawn at any time.
Consent is informed. While a sub-dom relationship can develop enough trust that the sub trusts the dom's understanding of their limits without explicit communication, such a level of trust is usually not present between strangers or acquaintances.


While these activities could be perfectly fine* if they followed consent, it is structured so initial consent is dubious at best and the normal orientation peer pressure makes continual consent dubious.


PS: I did not read carefully, but I am not sure there was anything sexist there. Lots of sexual stuff with dubious consent but not sexist as far as I saw.


*Orientation is mostly about getting to know each other and creating connections. The actual social activity used to create that sense of community is dependent on on the individuals in question. But consent is REQUIRED for all sexual activities!

Asian countries are more conservatives of their females,
girls dun greet someone by hugging or kissing them, girls dun touch a guy like a friend,
girls dun go to some male friend's house alone and they dun wear short pants so short everyone can see their butt, although the last one is changing to a new fashion trend with criticism by the elderly.

That said, after all the conservative nature and behaviour of girls taught in schools, at home, at public, suddenly when they enter higher education in University, they went for the, like you said, "dubious" orientation camp and suddenly have to deal with all the guys which gets all touchy and feely as the guys just finished their 2 years in mandatory military with their vent up sexual frustration. I call these orientation games sexist because girls in my country isn't treated like this in the everyday life, guys dun just get close to girls and gets touchy, horny and do perverted actions and jokes. In the normal event of a guy liking a girl, he would ask for her number, ask her out for date, then anything can proceed on from there.

Consent is required for all sexual activities.

They dun call it sexual activities, they call it doing pushups on girls,
a forfeit, a punishment for failing to complete an objective in their orientation games.

So they do not really ask you for consent, you fail the game,
naturally you have to make up for it by doing the punishments,
even though some senior lecturers commented that universities students should be
smart enough to opt out for forfeit games, but if everyone was following the rules
and doing the forfeit games, it would be really uncomfortable and unfair for you to quit out of the forfeit.

some quotes showing that girls and woman in my country are socially conservative.

You know what is upsetting about such lewd games?

1. Most of the games would portray women in a degrading way.

2. It's quite humiliating because most of these games are forfeits. Which means that when two person are performing this forfeit, the entire camp or group are watching and cheering them on!

Honestly, what has become of Orientation? Isn't it supposed to be one where you make a lot of friends, build rapport and teamwork and get adjusted to campus life? Since when has sexual connotative games been a way to achieve these objectives? I strongly believe we can still have fun and building relationships the 'clean' way!

She's someone daughter or sister - brought up in a conservative family - go to school to study - and end playing such a dirty game . This is definitely not acceptable - and the teaches involved should be taken to task too - clear case of OM - outrage of modesty !

This is a ASEAN country, we might not be ready for such extreme western culture, we respect western culture, but, u pls respect ours too

[Aves]

I apologize if I'm coming across as overly aggressive in the comments below, and this may merely be a translation/language barrier issue. Your original point seems to be basically asking "Is systemic sexual harassment/abuse acceptable?" And the obvious answer to that should be a resounding NO. In the same way, similar questions such as "Is killing people randomly okay?" or "Is corruption a positive force?" would have equally knee-jerk reactions. In addition, I do not see how conservatism or its lack is related to the article(s) described.

Asian countries are more conservatives of their females, Stereotype. The societies in question as a whole may or may not be more conservative, but blanket statements like this generally don't work. There is no validity in labeling entire nations being more or less 'conservative' in my opinion. All countries have cultural values that may be labeled on a larger relative scale as conservative or liberal, but such terms rarely encompass the actual values.
girls dun greet someone by hugging or kissing them, girls dun touch a guy like a friend,
girls dun go to some male friend's house alone and they dun wear short pants so short everyone can see their butt, although the last one is changing to a new fashion trend with criticism by the elderly. What is the point of these statements? How do they support your argument? Is this is a way of defining what is not conservative? It would be helpful if you had an example of what actually IS conservative, then.

That said, after all the conservative nature and behaviour of girls taught in schools, at home, at public, suddenly when they enter higher education in University, they went for the, like you said, "dubious" orientation camp and suddenly have to deal with all the guys which gets all touchy and feely as the guys just finished their 2 years in mandatory military with their vent up sexual frustration. I call these orientation games sexist because girls in my country isn't treated like this in the everyday life, guys dun just get close to girls and gets touchy, horny and do perverted actions and jokes. In the normal event of a guy liking a girl, he would ask for her number, ask her out for date, then anything can proceed on from there. Sexual harassment is sexual harassment. Sure. The negative impact of such should be self evident. Disgust towards this should be universally felt. However, it may be prudent to assess whether or not this is actually the sign of weakening conservative cultural values, or merely an assault against dignity and decency. Is this a crime? Probably. But what link does said crime have to conservatism?

Consent is required for all sexual activities.

They dun call it sexual activities, they call it doing pushups on girls,
a forfeit, a punishment for failing to complete an objective in their orientation games.

So they do not really ask you for consent, you fail the game,
naturally you have to make up for it by doing the punishments,
even though some senior lecturers commented that universities students should be
smart enough to opt out for forfeit games, but if everyone was following the rules
and doing the forfeit games, it would be really uncomfortable and unfair for you to quit out of the forfeit.
Sexual harassment is sexual harassment. From what you are saying, consent is not given. Thus, it is now sexual assault, and presumably illegal (if sexual harassment is somehow not illegal). What OT says is not invalidated by the act in question's setup. A rose by any other name is just as sweet; a murder by any other name just as heinous. In this case, the 'games' are also sexual acts, and consent is still in consideration.
some quotes showing that girls and woman in my country are socially conservative.

You know what is upsetting about such lewd games?

1. Most of the games would portray women in a degrading way.

2. It's quite humiliating because most of these games are forfeits. Which means that when two person are performing this forfeit, the entire camp or group are watching and cheering them on!

Honestly, what has become of Orientation? Isn't it supposed to be one where you make a lot of friends, build rapport and teamwork and get adjusted to campus life? Since when has sexual connotative games been a way to achieve these objectives? I strongly believe we can still have fun and building relationships the 'clean' way!

She's someone daughter or sister - brought up in a conservative family - go to school to study - and end playing such a dirty game . This is definitely not acceptable - and the teaches involved should be taken to task too - clear case of OM - outrage of modesty !

This is a ASEAN country, we might not be ready for such extreme western culture, we respect western culture, but, u pls respect ours too

In short, I do not see how conservatism (or liberalism) is linked to the crime you are deploring.

[Hyroen]

None of this conversation will lead to anything productive. Furthermore, this topic leads to grey areas regarding the discussion of sexuality, a precedent I'm certain the forums do not want to set. Discussions of sexuality have difficulties faring well on any online game forums, and though there's a when and where, there is also a how.

What anyone researches on their own time is their own business and though the Philosophy section is bound to be polemic, our viewpoints of the present topic are better discussed in a different venue, if at all.

Were the forums an +18 zone my perspective would be different, however, considering the context of Elements the Game, I ask that this thread be locked.

[foxrain4]

I think i have gotten my answer from the above posts that the improper behaviours of orientation camps is wrong,
and is ok that this thread be locked of its 18+ content.

I am just frustrated this is still going on in my country nevertheless with zero intervention...