Elements 1.31

[RRQJ]

I like Blue buff, it makes the damsel in distress deck worth it even without Quint. And Quint slows that deck down to nothingness. Using her alongside other Air creatures is fine IMO.

Auburn buff is a bit too much, perhaps.

As for Queen, it's simple: FFQ costs 6 quanta and for 2 off-element quanta produces a 3 atk critter. Nymph Queen would cost the same through in-element NT but has 3 more attack, and for 2 more quanta and one quanta producer she doesn't just create another creature, but a copy of herself. So double the punch of Firefly Queen, spawning way faster, and in a mono to boot. I think it's a bit too much. I agree it doesn't solve Water's problems, but it is a bit unbalanced. Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much.

I think testing is the only way to determine how good the queen is now.  Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much, but we're talking about losing a lot of quanta producers (for a lot of queens, yes).  Unless you can say for certain that the impact is linearly related, you can't say for certain that the queen is now OP compared to firefly queen (or pharaoh, which by the way, seems easier to compare to since it is also a mono card).

[Poker Alho]

I like Blue buff, it makes the damsel in distress deck worth it even without Quint. And Quint slows that deck down to nothingness. Using her alongside other Air creatures is fine IMO.

Auburn buff is a bit too much, perhaps.

As for Queen, it's simple: FFQ costs 6 quanta and for 2 off-element quanta produces a 3 atk critter. Nymph Queen would cost the same through in-element NT but has 3 more attack, and for 2 more quanta and one quanta producer she doesn't just create another creature, but a copy of herself. So double the punch of Firefly Queen, spawning way faster, and in a mono to boot. I think it's a bit too much. I agree it doesn't solve Water's problems, but it is a bit unbalanced. Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much.

I think testing is the only way to determine how good the queen is now.  Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much, but we're talking about losing a lot of quanta producers (for a lot of queens, yes).  Unless you can say for certain that the impact is linearly related, you can't say for certain that the queen is now OP compared to firefly queen (or pharaoh, which by the way, seems easier to compare to since it is also a mono card).

also take in account the only reliable  producers are pillars, pendulums and your mark, so after you blow some pillars up, you may start having trouble producing  for the rest of your deck

[RootRanger]

..and another thing: how the hell all this could do *any* harm to PvP?!

These nymph buffs are pretty ridiculous. I now highly doubt that zanz prioritizes PvP over AI and Arena.

I don't follow the logic.

5 Nymphs received huge buffs. Nymphs are won primarily through luck, which means lucky players have larger advantages than before. This makes a much bigger difference in PvP, where small advantages have a much bigger impact.

Basically, zanz is rewarding lucky players much more than before, which damages PvP. The only reason I see he would do this is to make people that spin Nymphs enjoy playing the AI more because their Nymphs are stronger.

Honestly, these are huge buffs.

Auburn, Grey, Queen, and Blue Nymphs stats increased to 6/8 - 7/9 if upgraded
White nymph stats increased to 6/9 -  7/9 if upgraded

Grey and White arguably won't be OP with them, but the other 3 will. Not only are these cards OP, but they are won primarily through pure luck. That makes PvP more luck based, which is not good for it.

Buffing the nymphs gives "lucky" players more options.  That is true.  However, unless one of the buffed nymphs forms a game-breaking deck, I don't follow how that makes PvP more luck based.

Oh, please. If a deck using nymphs is even competitively viable, PvP becomes more luck based than if that deck is not competitively viable. The stronger that deck is, the more luck-based PvP becomes. Zanz is making Nymphs far stronger, which makes PvP more luck based, even if those decks aren't "game-breaking."

Maybe I should start quoting my entire argument whenever I post something to prevent people from askingthese kinds of questions as often.

[RRQJ]

there's no point.  The fact that he posted that probably meant he didn't understand your argument.  And the reason is probably the different opinions of what constitutes "luck that is harmful to PvP."

[The_Mormegil]

I like Blue buff, it makes the damsel in distress deck worth it even without Quint. And Quint slows that deck down to nothingness. Using her alongside other Air creatures is fine IMO.

Auburn buff is a bit too much, perhaps.

As for Queen, it's simple: FFQ costs 6 quanta and for 2 off-element quanta produces a 3 atk critter. Nymph Queen would cost the same through in-element NT but has 3 more attack, and for 2 more quanta and one quanta producer she doesn't just create another creature, but a copy of herself. So double the punch of Firefly Queen, spawning way faster, and in a mono to boot. I think it's a bit too much. I agree it doesn't solve Water's problems, but it is a bit unbalanced. Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much.

I think testing is the only way to determine how good the queen is now.  Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much, but we're talking about losing a lot of quanta producers (for a lot of queens, yes).  Unless you can say for certain that the impact is linearly related, you can't say for certain that the queen is now OP compared to firefly queen (or pharaoh, which by the way, seems easier to compare to since it is also a mono card).

Which makes it a card that is good to be splashed and works as a finisher, stall breaker and similar. Just like Pharaoh, but better. If losing too many pillars is a problem, create four queens (they hit like a truck regardless), stall for a bit, then double them in a turn for the finish. Really, it's an AWESOME card on multiple levels, not as a whole deck but as an addition to other, normal decks.

[ralouf]

Wow nymph are becoming playable that's a good new

[RRQJ]

I like Blue buff, it makes the damsel in distress deck worth it even without Quint. And Quint slows that deck down to nothingness. Using her alongside other Air creatures is fine IMO.

Auburn buff is a bit too much, perhaps.

As for Queen, it's simple: FFQ costs 6 quanta and for 2 off-element quanta produces a 3 atk critter. Nymph Queen would cost the same through in-element NT but has 3 more attack, and for 2 more quanta and one quanta producer she doesn't just create another creature, but a copy of herself. So double the punch of Firefly Queen, spawning way faster, and in a mono to boot. I think it's a bit too much. I agree it doesn't solve Water's problems, but it is a bit unbalanced. Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much.

I think testing is the only way to determine how good the queen is now.  Losing a quanta producer is not worth that much, but we're talking about losing a lot of quanta producers (for a lot of queens, yes).  Unless you can say for certain that the impact is linearly related, you can't say for certain that the queen is now OP compared to firefly queen (or pharaoh, which by the way, seems easier to compare to since it is also a mono card).

Which makes it a card that is good to be splashed and works as a finisher, stall breaker and similar. Just like Pharaoh, but better. If losing too many pillars is a problem, create four queens (they hit like a truck regardless), stall for a bit, then double them in a turn for the finish. Really, it's an AWESOME card on multiple levels, not as a whole deck but as an addition to other, normal decks.

4 queens.  Doubling them requires four towers and 16 quanta.  And I'm going to assume that at least 2 of the 4 initial nymphs also come from towers.  So 6 towers, lots of quanta.  Chances are, you're probably going mono water then.  In that case, you're also probably not playing much of anything else.

In the meantime, the opponent will play his cards.  Damage, shields, cc, whatever.

I'm not saying that the queen isn't OP now.  I'm just saying it's not obvious whether it is or not.  In your particular example, I don't even think pharaoh/firefly queen are good comparisons.  A better comparison would be with something like fire/life rush, since that is the deck style.

[Atico]

For me Queen Nymph and Grey are still poor when we compare it with Purple or Gravity.
Problem with Queen is in skill which isn't so useful. Now it can generate creature with 7 attack for 4 + pillar, so cost is high but now it looks much better than creating 1|4 creature.

Probably only Auburn Nymph shouldn't get this change. It is CC card, so Player should have a chance to avoid this effect. Nymphs with skill using against opponent have a low stats (like Purple or Gravity). The same should be with Auburn. Problem is then with Grey, but here I think that problem is in skill, not in stats. Grey Nymph has got poor effect. It is much better and faster to use Aflatoxin than Nymph. GreyNymph should have Poison effect.

[Higurashi]

That's actually a proposed buff for Afla/Grey Nymph. Allow targeting HP for 2 Poison. It'd be expensive use of Afla, but that's not the point. The idea is that you could actually put the unnecessary extra copies of Afla to use if you plan on using that strategy. 'Course, Grey Nymph would need an ability cost increase if that happened. Considering its high HP, I'd say 3 . If its HP was lowered, 2 would be fine.

[The_Mormegil]

4 queens.  Doubling them requires four towers and 16 quanta.  And I'm going to assume that at least 2 of the 4 initial nymphs also come from towers.  So 6 towers, lots of quanta.  Chances are, you're probably going mono water then.  In that case, you're also probably not playing much of anything else.

In the meantime, the opponent will play his cards.  Damage, shields, cc, whatever.

I'm not saying that the queen isn't OP now.  I'm just saying it's not obvious whether it is or not.  In your particular example, I don't even think pharaoh/firefly queen are good comparisons.  A better comparison would be with something like fire/life rush, since that is the deck style.

Take any Water-based deck. War decks in particular. They have lots of Water Pillars and Pendulums. Splash in two NTs. Now you have a reliable offensive that can either work as a standalone mid-range hitter or multiply itself late game for heavy damage (and late game quanta is not an issue. More a liability)

[Higurashi]

Good. They need it.

[inspector]

I always liked the fact nymphs were somewhat underpowered, it made a lot of sense with them being so rare they all also had a niche but very special unique ability and had some narrow uses. Now many of them will be quite the powerhouses.
Now I'd really really love a way to trade nymphs, either between players or even do something as simple as letting us exchange 2 identical nymphs for 1 of choice.

Testing a mono  in trainer now, got 4 wins and 2 losses vs FGs so far. I'd never expect a swarm of 7|8 nymphs to be that good!