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Offline EmeraldTigerTopic starter

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311438#msg311438
« Reply #12 on: April 14, 2011, 01:02:34 am »
Let me say, some fiction portrays dragons as monstrous beast. And many others depict them as Wise Magical beings.
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Offline Nepycros

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311439#msg311439
« Reply #13 on: April 14, 2011, 01:03:49 am »
Let me say, some fiction portrays dragons as monstrous beast. And many others depict them as Wise Magical beings.
All were started by people that either wanted others to fear or respect the dragon myth. It's how the story-tellers thought the dragons were. The dragons are symbols, but the symbols are arguable thrown everywhere, and made to be very obscure.
Perception is the source of misunderstanding.

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Offline ZephyrPhantom

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311441#msg311441
« Reply #14 on: April 14, 2011, 01:05:17 am »
Ninja'd, I was going to say it depends on the fiction you refer to.

Elements really isn't very clear with it's dragons intelligence, since there is no flavor text or any true backstory. Based on fanfiction from the old wiki I think dragons are considered sentient and intelligent in elements.

Offline Monox D. I-Fly

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311492#msg311492
« Reply #15 on: April 14, 2011, 02:05:08 am »
Ninja'd, I was going to say it depends on the fiction you refer to.

Elements really isn't very clear with it's dragons intelligence, since there is no flavor text or any true backstory. Based on fanfiction from the old wiki I think dragons are considered sentient and intelligent in elements.
Is there any "official" story about creatures in this game? Or maybe we can suggest someone to write their "official profile" in the cards, just as Magic the Gathering, Duel Masters, and Digimon Trading Card Game did.
My idealized elements cycle:
Water -> Fire -> Air -> Earth -> Lightning -> Metal -> Light -> Darkness -> Wood -> Water

Offline Nepycros

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311493#msg311493
« Reply #16 on: April 14, 2011, 02:05:53 am »
Ninja'd, I was going to say it depends on the fiction you refer to.

Elements really isn't very clear with it's dragons intelligence, since there is no flavor text or any true backstory. Based on fanfiction from the old wiki I think dragons are considered sentient and intelligent in elements.
Is there any "official" story about creatures in this game? Or maybe we can suggest someone to write their "official profile" in the cards, just as Magic the Gathering, Duel Masters, and Digimon Trading Card Game did.
Someone's bound to get offended. You won't please too many people if you do this.
Perception is the source of misunderstanding.

Why, yes. I do have a Mindgate necklace. It's how I ninja everyone.

Offline Cel

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311495#msg311495
« Reply #17 on: April 14, 2011, 02:16:41 am »
I don't believe in evolution, but as to being sentient, I don't think they are.
I imagine them as very smart and tricky but not actually self aware, fighting side by side with their master, maybe even having a small amount of emotions, like parrots, but not human level or anything.
This is all my random opinion.  :P
Sentient = Ability to recognize yourself from a visually identical copy.
Sapient = Human

You think they are sentient but not sapient.
Perhaps you misunderstood? I said I don't think their sentient. And this isn't my opinion for all dragons by the way, its my interpretation of the elements dragons.
Very smart and tricky but unable to identify themselves in a mirror? That is not how consciousness works. If you would characterize them a similar to a cat or a dog in intellect then the correct term is sentient. You might be mistaking sentient for sapient. (Or you might think a non sentient could be "smart" or "tricky" in which case please explain.)
Here is my dictionarys description of sentient:
Adjective:
1: Conscious or aware.
2: (Primarily in Science Fiction) Possessing human-like intelligence.


To be even more clear here is the definition of conscious:
Aware of one's own existence; aware of one's own awareness
Only highly intelligent beings can be fully conscious.


I don't think they are conscious seeing as in the game they are just tamed beasts fighting under your Elementalist, thus I they do not fit number 1, and for them same reasons I do not see them as humanly intelligent, so they do not fit number 2.
So no, I do not see them as sentient, but I do think they are smart and tricky. Just like how animals are not self aware but some can out smart humans.

Offline EmeraldTigerTopic starter

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311540#msg311540
« Reply #18 on: April 14, 2011, 03:27:36 am »
So the Dragons in Elements are not, but in some fiction they are, correct?
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Offline ZephyrPhantom

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311554#msg311554
« Reply #19 on: April 14, 2011, 03:45:39 am »
So the Dragons in Elements are not, but in some fiction they are, correct?
It's up to self-interpretation I think, since Zanz hasn't said much himself.

Offline Jangoo

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311632#msg311632
« Reply #20 on: April 14, 2011, 09:15:15 am »


Ninja'd, I was going to say it depends on the fiction you refer to.
Jep. Also, within a fictional system there are often differences between different kinds of dragons.

Similar to "dogs" not just being dogs but having different qualitities depending on race,
you will find animal like "lesser" dragons that may just spew a bit of fire
and stone-old "greater" dragons with an IQ of 220, a spell-repertoire well exceding Gandalfs
and the experience of many generations.

In Elements, I would consider the Bone-dragon to just be a mindless necroed golem, the
Ruby-dragon to be a savage beast and the Emerald dragon to be an extension to the
noble and sentient/sapient beastiarium of the woods.
The light- and phase-dragon have outerwordly qualitities so things such as "recognizing oneself"
or "logic" are either a mere joke for them or simply incomprehendable for they are not part of
the way their world works.
And so on ...


Offline EmeraldTigerTopic starter

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Re: Are Dragons Sentient? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=24348.msg311679#msg311679
« Reply #21 on: April 14, 2011, 01:20:50 pm »
If Nowhere is Somewhere, and Somewhere is Over there, How can we be Anywhere?
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anything
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