[Official] Toadfish | Puffer Fish

[Rod Whiler]

First of all:

I know that many will say... yeah, this creature got stronger but its not overpowered since it still is pretty expensive at 5 .
Even though it still is not very popular in PVP we must consider that many FGs use this card.

First this creature got the buff: "poisoned if ingested" ---> anti-oty buff, which is ok i think...
but then it got another HP (4 --> 5)... so a freshly played Elite Otyugh doesn't even have the chance to ingest a puffer-fish. 

The worst thing, however, is the AP-increase since a simple (unbuffed) "puffer fish" now breaks through most of the shields.
Especially this makes some of the harder FGs even worse than they are already.

The problem about this card is: It is not really overpowered for player use... but it is a little bit overpowered for FG-use now.

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So here are my suggestions (including buff + debuff) - it's all about nerving the creature for FGs, not for players...

Suggestion 1:
Cost: 3
2AP/3HP - Add 1 Poison to each attack. Puff* 2 : Cause poisoning if ingested. +1/+4

or

Suggenstion 2:
Cost: 3 
3AP/4HP - Chance to add 1 poison to each attack. 

or

Suggestion 3:
Cost: 3 
2AP/7HP -  1 Puff*: Add 1 Poison to each attack and cause poisoning if ingested.


(*"Puff" is supposed to be just like "Deja Vu" or "Lycantrophy" - a single-use ability)

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My suggestions simply aim at the goal of nerving the creature for FGs without harming (maybe even improving) it for player use...

[Glitch]

*Sigh*

See what you did there?  You assumed it would be easier to change an entire card than it would be to edit the FGs deck.  And look what happened.  You discussed AI level in a thread where only card discussion is allowed.

[paraphrase author=zanzarino]
I don't get it.  People see Scoprion, poisonous 2|2 creature for three, and say it's underpowered, and yet people see the pufferfish, a 3|5 poisonous creature for five, and say it's overpowered.  And the only conceivable reason I can see is that the FGs use it.
[/paraphrase]

It's the same card no matter who uses it.  It's the same card no matter what deck it's in.  The only thing you can balance cards against are other cards, and right now, it's balanced.

[RavingRabbid]

So, nerf quantum tower because Rainbow is too strong!
Nerf every single tower!

[Rastafla]

You nerf a card because they make an imbalance somewhere.

Scorpio accelerate poison counters on the brink of op just fine with physalias, poison spells, arsenic, puffers alone even if most upgraded shields was in play.
Here comes the puffer dmg increase and suddenly it tips the scale from the edge into OP.

Im not gonna argue about what change i want.

All im saying is that 5 for 2dmg is just as worthless as 5 3 dmg in the upped format among players. Upped is all about speed and slow poison counters that is applied AFTER attack do nothing when you have physalias at  1 for 2 dmg plus the poison.
And I'm not gonna bring in the options for healing that payers have.

And in FG/player that is all about drawn out fights where the FG accelerate too fast the puffer is now OP.

[Rod Whiler]

*Sigh*

See what you did there?  You assumed it would be easier to change an entire card than it would be to edit the FGs deck.  And look what happened.  You discussed AI level in a thread where only card discussion is allowed.

First of all... the discussion about Puffer Fish doesn't work without taking the AI into consideration because there is no comparable card I would know of, that is that OP for FGs, yet, still underpowered for player use....
Did you look at the suggestions i made?

Those aim to make the Puffer Fish more competitive to Scorpions...
In "Suggestion 3" Puffer Fish would become a 2/7 creature for 3  + active ability ... this would actually be a buff (maybe even a little bit too much but i dont think so*)... still for the FGs it would be a "nerv".


*epinephrined Scorpions cost 6  (3 + 3 ): 9 dmg + 2 poison counters per turn

[Glitch]

The problem isn't the changes you made, it's the basis for why you changed the card.

You don't want your opponent to play one.

Your otyugh based rainbow can't kill them, your permafrost shield can't block them, and your SoGs can't keep up with the cumulative damage.  Both your (and rastafla's) argument centers around scorpio being too difficult.

That is not a good reason to nerf a card.  When a god is out of balance with the rest, change the god, not the card.  It's like editing the bottom of a pyramid because the top looks crooked.  It doesn't end well.

So instead of proposing Puffer-fish nerfs, why not propose scorpio nerfs.  It fixes the problem while maintaining game balance.

[Amilir]

I believe the thought process goes something like:  Well, it's still totally useless, so I'm never going to use it, making it a FG only card.  I want FGs to be easier.  NERFNERFNERFNERFNERF

[jmdt]

The problem isn't the changes you made, it's the basis for why you changed the card.

You don't want your opponent to play one.

Your otyugh based rainbow can't kill them, your permafrost shield can't block them, and your SoGs can't keep up with the cumulative damage.  Both your (and rastafla's) argument centers around scorpio being too difficult.

That is not a good reason to nerf a card.  When a god is out of balance with the rest, change the god, not the card.  It's like editing the bottom of a pyramid because the top looks crooked.  It doesn't end well.

So instead of proposing Puffer-fish nerfs, why not propose scorpio nerfs.  It fixes the problem while maintaining game balance.

I completely agree with Gl1tch this time.  I honestly think pufferfish could still use a small buff in its current form if anything.

So scorpio is tougher. Pack a purify, more healing, more CC, suggest a nerf to scorpio.  Scorpio still isn't the toughest fg out there, he's just harder and the community doesn't like it. 

[MrBlonde]

Scorpio still isn't the toughest fg out there, he's just harder and the community doesn't like it.

I really don't like it but guess what? You move on and adjust like i did (add a diamond shield, and lose a little more). Pufferfish is not OP and shouldn't be nerfed.

[smuglapse]

the community doesn't like it.

Communities can't hold opinions, i.e. please don't make generalizations.

[Demagog]

As promised, Rod receives a kick to the face.

This card should be left as is.

[smuglapse]

As promised, Rod receives a kick to the face.

I had to wait 2 weeks, but you delivered.