[Official] Shard of Wisdom | Shard of Wisdom

[SnoWeb]

What if immaterial creatures could target other immaterial creatures? Wouldn't it make sense?

[jawdirk]

^
Reflective Shield, yes.
Mirror/Emerald/Jade Shield, no.
Even without reflective characteristic, these are undestroyable good DR shield.
For example, Ragequit Factory uses Jade Shield because it's immaterial, not because it is reflective.

I'll agree with that. I think Jade Shield could use a little rebalancing, but you are right that it is on the right track.

What if immaterial creatures could target other immaterial creatures? Wouldn't it make sense?

I like that idea. It would be awesome to quint your Maxwell's Demon and start popping phase dragons.

[Farin44]

Shard of Wisdom only needs to be nerfed a tiny bit. Perhaps only +3 boost in attack? Or a cost of 4 instead of 3? This would tie into the same as upgraded SoFo which did well to have its nerf.

[Dm]

Shard of Wisdom only needs to be nerfed a tiny bit. Perhaps only +3 boost in attack? Or a cost of 4 instead of 3? This would tie into the same as upgraded SoFo which did well to have its nerf.

.... Did you read the poll? o.O

[OldTrees]

Shard of Wisdom only needs to be nerfed a tiny bit. Perhaps only +3 boost in attack? Or a cost of 4 instead of 3? This would tie into the same as upgraded SoFo which did well to have its nerf.

.... Did you read the poll? o.O

I do not understand this comment.
Is it a reference to the 23% that said no nerf was needed?
Is it in reference to the 31% that were in favor of reducing the attack?
Is it in reference to the 18% that were in favor of raising the cost?

[Dm]

If the comment you did not understand was mine, then:

It is a reference to the poll, that contains all the options he/she said with almost the same words he/she said.

[boboexe]

I would like to mention the following despite some repetitions.
I don't see the point, why a spell mechanic for creatures  needed to be introduced, when there is already a similar skill called momentum (well it serves the exactly same purpose). Instead of enriching the metagame it encouraged even more players to use these  monoaether  0815 decks.
As regards the arguments:
-the shard is only strong when combined with aether creatures==> means it only dumps down the metagame,   has nearly no synergy with 98% of all other cards.   Instead of convincing players to combine different elements to achieve better results in the long term,we have a card reserved for monoaether only.
-it is slow ==> A straight forward 3x marked monoaether which consists of  pillars, dragons, and this shard can play the first dragon rather quickly. Afterwards its just a matter of stacking shards and ocassionally a shield.
-aether creatures are weaker than their counterparts==> well they have reduced stats.  If we exclude hp boost which doesnt matter at this point, momentum grants+1 Ap, while this shard increases Ap by 4   This kinda nullifies the reduced basic attack issue of aether counterparts.
-it justifies the existence of those 2 shields==> those shields are rather pointless  in 99% of  all other situations, since other elements have better all round shields. It doesnt matter that they are immaterial. Permafrost, phase, boneshield but also dusk, gravity, chaosshield etc.are far superior in nearly every aspect.
-rush though it==>I like to play control.  I dont see why I have to become a rusher just to deal with this mechanic ?
-currently the gravity shards has earned most negative responses. If u compare shard of wisdom  and the  so called overpowered gravity shard. On its first turn it is a 0/1 creature for 4-6 mana, which can be killed by everything. Its loss would also slow down the players buildup speed due to the high cost. Even at 15 hp u can lobomize, mutate, reversetime it. Besides using those shields which are just  not viable (within an KI arena deck they suck even more) how exactly are u supposed to counter that shard?

[OldTrees]

@boboexe
No comment about whether the  costing Shard of Wisdom is balanced/imbalanced with Immaterial creatures in the MonoAether deck. I understand this was the major topic of your post.

Some answers in order of importance:
Different control decks are situationally stronger or weaker than the other. Usually the situationally weaker control deck changes their in-match strategy in order to equalize the battle. A common change is to rush to victory before the situationally stronger control deck has the time (stronger control takes longer) to setup.

The Shards were all more powerful when they cost  .  has weird balance interactions at higher costs. The Gravity Shard earned its negative reviews during that period.

Shard of Wisdom can be used outside of Aether for a similar purpose as Blessing is used outside of Light. It is balanced (relative to Blessing) when used for this purpose. The same holds true when used for non Immaterial Aether creatures (relative to Blessed Light creatures).

Wisdom was made given the existence of Reflection. Problems created by Reflection are not problems created by Wisdom.

[boboexe]

Shard of Wisdom can be used outside of Aether for a similar purpose as Blessing is used outside of Light. It is balanced (relative to Blessing) when used for this purpose. The same holds true when used for non Immaterial Aether creatures (relative to Blessed Light creatures).

Indeed apparently I overlooked the circumstance, that the 4Ap bonus can be granted to regular creeps.. Sorry for that.
Nevertheless in the course of the few months I have been playing elements I never came across a deck which uses SoW outside the issue I described in my previous post (standard monoaether). Unless u want to splash some other aether cards very badly, I dont see the point using this card outside of monoaether for its Ap boost,since there are much better options within the other elements. As a consequence, while theoretically anything is possible in reality not the card text, but the current metagame determines if a card is reserved for a monoelement  or not. (Honestly I believe it may work in a Divine glory,animatewep, sundial deck although i have never met that.) So well ur theory (which is not wrong) and my experience facing this shard (which I have a strong feeling corresponds with the reality) drift away.

Different control decks are situationally stronger or weaker than the other. Usually the situationally weaker control deck changes their in-match strategy in order to equalize the battle. A common change is to rush to victory before the situationally stronger control deck has the time (stronger control takes longer) to setup.

Sorry but I think this is simply wrong. Outrushing a 200hp aether deck with countless shields (I have itemcontrol but even despite that) is rather difficult.
 Most monoaether arena decks(silver league+) have a great life and even greater ressource advantage which allows them to build up 21+ damage very quickly and continue spamming shields. They are not "a situationally stronger control deck", where outrush may be an option, but rather direct damage ones, whose whole  setup consists of 2 cards. For a triplled marked monoaether with tons of pillars, its not a  difficult task to get them out asap. And afterwards he just needs to spamm shards in order  to cummulate damage.

Wisdom was made given the existence of Reflection. Problems created by Reflection are not problems created by Wisdom.

Sorry this was not what I wanted to emphasize.  Lets put it that way : due to the overall superiority of the other shields, which prove themselves useful outside facing Shard of wisdom, the current 2 shields possessing reflection arent worth much, despite immaterial ability.
 All the same which deck I played, creature spamm, bigger creeps etc I completely ignored them and they didnt even slightly influence the outcome. I wasnt refering to any kind of problems created by reflection. I just tried to point out that the current counters for Shard of wisdom are very marginal, not viable, and need a general revision.

My suggestion: (just a thought) -make one of them counter momentum in addition to reflection and absorb
                                                   2 damage instead of 1 for a slightly higher cost (light seems like a heal+counter element anyways)
                                                   -give the other one some useful ability instead of reflection
                                                      (for example life gain from damage for the green shield)
This will make both cards viable and versatile without the need for Shard of wisdom. just saying.
                                                   
   
                                                                                                             

[OldTrees]

Shard of Wisdom can be used outside of Aether for a similar purpose as Blessing is used outside of Light. It is balanced (relative to Blessing) when used for this purpose. The same holds true when used for non Immaterial Aether creatures (relative to Blessed Light creatures).

-snip-
So well ur theory (which is not wrong) and my experience facing this shard (which I have a strong feeling corresponds with the reality) drift away.

The card recently changed. Theory usually changes faster than experiences. However theories can be wrong.

Different control decks are situationally stronger or weaker than the other. Usually the situationally weaker control deck changes their in-match strategy in order to equalize the battle. A common change is to rush to victory before the situationally stronger control deck has the time (stronger control takes longer) to setup.

Sorry but I think this is simply wrong. Outrushing a 200hp aether deck with countless shields (I have itemcontrol but even despite that) is rather difficult.
 Most monoaether arena decks(silver league+) have a great life and even greater ressource advantage which allows them to build up 21+ damage very quickly and continue spamming shields. They are not "a situationally stronger control deck", where outrush may be an option, but rather direct damage ones, whose whole  setup consists of 2 cards. For a triplled marked monoaether with tons of pillars, its not a  difficult task to get them out asap. And afterwards he just needs to spam shards in order  to cumulate damage.

Certain cards have different balance in Arena vs in normal PvP. MonoAether before SoW was a good example of a deck that gained abnormal advantage from Arena.
How do your normal PvP experiences relate to my theory about control vs control in normal PvP?


Before Wisdom, the Reflection shields only were effective against Bolt decks. Wisdom was added in part to give Reflection shields another threat to be effective against. The idea was that by raising the frequency that Reflection was useful, then the Reflection shields would become less marginalized. This was the rational. We agree it is not an ideal solution.

[pulli23]

In light of making reflection more "useful": well it would be much easier if the shield had a "bonus" of giving "reflection" - not that the shield's main point is reflecting. In that case you could use reflection shields also decently against non-spell-based decks.

[OldTrees]

In light of making reflection more "useful": well it would be much easier if the shield had a "bonus" of giving "reflection" - not that the shield's main point is reflecting. In that case you could use reflection shields also decently against non-spell-based decks.

Are you suggesting:

A) A card balanced as if it did not have reflection but with reflection added to it?
Then the card is more powerful that its cost. Aka Imbalanced

B) A card with a non reflection effect but balanced understanding it has the reflection ability?
Might not work. See Emerald Shield.