Poll

How should the shard be nerfed?

The shard is balanced already
25 (31.6%)
Make attack boost part of the status effect
6 (7.6%)
Reduce the damage increase
25 (31.6%)
Increase the cost
9 (11.4%)
Other (please suggest)
14 (17.7%)

Total Members Voted: 79

*Author

Offline freemod1espilon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 330
  • Reputation Power: 4
  • freemod1espilon is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • Antlion needs some love
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg500878#msg500878
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2012, 03:26:55 pm »
unless it is immortal and wisdom was used
If I have something to say I'll keep it to my self then let it out at the worst possible moment and then I will walk away laughing

Offline Aneninen

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 185
  • Reputation Power: 5
  • Aneninen is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • ^_^
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 3rd Birthday Cake
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg500921#msg500921
« Reply #13 on: May 19, 2012, 05:04:36 pm »
i have come to believe a card shouldnt be nerfed unless it has consistantly been a game changer. or the sole game decider (frequently)

I think this is the case as it comes to the Shard of Wisdom.

Another thing: Shard of Focus was nerfed because it was hard to do anything against a 15 HP creature, even it was (and is) usable 3 times (unless it gets damage). A creature targetted with Shard of Wisdom has unlimited use and unless you have a counter in your deck (which is not really effective in most cases but the Shard of Wisdom) you can't do anything against it.
Once you enter you'll never escape.
http://ebony.extra.hu
E.B.O.N.Y. – The Weirdest Riddle Game on the Internet

Offline Absol

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 2383
  • Country: id
  • Reputation Power: 35
  • Absol is a Gargoyle, dangerous and everlasting.Absol is a Gargoyle, dangerous and everlasting.Absol is a Gargoyle, dangerous and everlasting.Absol is a Gargoyle, dangerous and everlasting.Absol is a Gargoyle, dangerous and everlasting.Absol is a Gargoyle, dangerous and everlasting.Absol is a Gargoyle, dangerous and everlasting.
  • Consectetur Adipiscing Elit
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 4th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 3rd Birthday Cake
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg500928#msg500928
« Reply #14 on: May 19, 2012, 05:18:08 pm »
i have come to believe a card shouldnt be nerfed unless it has consistantly been a game changer. or the sole game decider (frequently)

I think this is the case as it comes to the Shard of Wisdom.

Another thing: Shard of Focus was nerfed because it was hard to do anything against a 15 HP creature, even it was (and is) usable 3 times (unless it gets damage). A creature targetted with Shard of Wisdom has unlimited use and unless you have a counter in your deck (which is not really effective in most cases but the Shard of Wisdom) you can't do anything against it.
Which is the same with Momentum. Though you can RT momentumed creatures.
"Neque porro quisquam est, qui dolorem ipsum, quia dolor sit amet, consectetur, adipisci velit."
"There is no one who loves pain itself, who seeks after it and wants to have it, simply because it is pain."

Offline tyranim

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 2877
  • Reputation Power: 34
  • tyranim is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.tyranim is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.tyranim is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.tyranim is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.tyranim is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.tyranim is a Ghost, obsessed with their Elemental pursuits.
  • formerly unit
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg500930#msg500930
« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2012, 05:33:44 pm »
i feel this card was made to give reflective shields more use
my milkshake brings all the boys to the yard and they're like "its better than yours" damn right, its better than yours! i can teach you but i'd have to charge!

Offline freemod1espilon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 330
  • Reputation Power: 4
  • freemod1espilon is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • Antlion needs some love
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg500956#msg500956
« Reply #16 on: May 19, 2012, 06:36:47 pm »
It kinda was and it filled the space of ways to do some thing to immortals
If I have something to say I'll keep it to my self then let it out at the worst possible moment and then I will walk away laughing

Offline Fayceless

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 28
  • Reputation Power: 1
  • Fayceless is a Spark waiting for a buff.
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg502045#msg502045
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2012, 10:33:55 pm »
I think Shard of Wisdom is a really fun card.  I don't, however, think it should act as another momentum - currently only 2 shields affect these creatures.  While many shields reduce physical damage in some way, I think Fog and Dusk at the least should apply to Wisdom creatures.  Maybe Procrastination and Fire.  Probably not Thorn/Spike or Ice as they reduce physical damage.

Offline freemod1espilon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 330
  • Reputation Power: 4
  • freemod1espilon is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • Antlion needs some love
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg502082#msg502082
« Reply #18 on: May 22, 2012, 12:14:38 am »
remember only 2 cards have momentum and theres only 1 way to apply momentum and it only costs 1 or 2  :gravity and it gives a bonus to health but wisdom which costs 3 or 1  :rainbow does not
If I have something to say I'll keep it to my self then let it out at the worst possible moment and then I will walk away laughing

Offline Pwnator

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 186
  • Country: ph
  • Reputation Power: 3
  • Pwnator is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • :3
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg503541#msg503541
« Reply #19 on: May 25, 2012, 08:03:48 am »
remember only 2 cards have momentum and theres only 1 way to apply momentum and it only costs 1 or 2  :gravity and it gives a bonus to health but wisdom which costs 3 or 1  :rainbow does not

If you consider both cards solely as a means to bypass shields, SoW is still overpowered:
Elite Charger + Quint =  :gravity :gravity :gravity :gravity :gravity :aether :aether :aether -> 7 unreflectable damage
Elite Immortal + SoW =  :aether :aether :aether :aether :aether :aether :aether :rainbow -> 9 damage that can only be reflected by highly situational cards

Offline jawdirk

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 367
  • Reputation Power: 7
  • jawdirk is a Spark waiting for a buff.
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg503913#msg503913
« Reply #20 on: May 26, 2012, 12:45:04 am »
If you consider both cards solely as a means to bypass shields, SoW is still overpowered:
Elite Charger + Quint =  :gravity :gravity :gravity :gravity :gravity :aether :aether :aether -> 7 unreflectable damage
Elite Immortal + SoW =  :aether :aether :aether :aether :aether :aether :aether :rainbow -> 9 damage that can only be reflected by highly situational cards

SoW does have an important drawback. It can only target immortal creatures. SoW often ends up being a dead card if you try to put non-immortal creatures in your deck. Quint can be played on any non-immortal creature, and is useful with most of them. I think SoW would be better balanced at +3/0, but shards in general tend to err on the OP side.

Theoretically, you should be able to outpace 4 damage per turn but SoW adds to an already brutally unforgiving deck. It is so easy to get a bad draw and lose to phase shield or immortal creatures. You want to put just enough PC in your deck to deal with the phase shields, and just enough damage in your deck to outpace immortal creatures, but its hard to do both without sometimes getting a bad draw and losing to one or the other. Now with SoW, its hard to even beat the deck with stall. Obviously, mirror shield et. al. are not really a viable strategy. I've tried SoW + mirror shield decks, and they are just not quite reliable enough against the typical decks.



Offline Aneninen

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 185
  • Reputation Power: 5
  • Aneninen is a Spark waiting for a buff.
  • ^_^
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 3rd Birthday Cake
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg504216#msg504216
« Reply #21 on: May 26, 2012, 12:45:37 pm »
Theoretically, you should be able to outpace 4 damage per turn but SoW adds to an already brutally unforgiving deck...

That is the crux of the problem. Shard of Wisdom empowers an already working, but - let's be frank - uninspired deck. Against Mono-Ether, the basic problem is to get rid of the Dimensional Shields and outdo the damage made by the un-controllable creatures. Now, you still have to cope with the original problems, plus Mono-Ether does even more damage which can't be reduced by most of the normal shields...

Put it in another way: who would hurray for a card which makes the life of a Ghostmare deck even easier? (Like, a Shard of Boredom, which turns an already played Time creature into Ghost of the Past...?) <--- same situation with Shard of Wisdom, I think.
Once you enter you'll never escape.
http://ebony.extra.hu
E.B.O.N.Y. – The Weirdest Riddle Game on the Internet

Offline Chapuz

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6081
  • Country: ar
  • Reputation Power: 72
  • Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.Chapuz frolics as one of the Phase Dragons, timeless and superior, gargantuan beasts of peerless wisdom.
  • The weird Voodoo guy
  • Awards: Slice of Elements 11th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 10th Birthday CakeDeckbuilding Competition - Tower Defense WinnerSlice of Elements 9th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 8th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 6th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 5th Birthday CakeSlice of Elements 4th Birthday CakeBrawl #1 Winner - Team Nyan Sharks
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg504235#msg504235
« Reply #22 on: May 26, 2012, 02:24:02 pm »
SoW = creature isn't affected by CC (excluding reflective shields).

If you have a deck that doesn't rely on CC, you can win.
My Decks, Tutorial and Guides <~~~~~ Click Here ! ! !

Offline OldTrees

  • Legendary Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10297
  • Reputation Power: 114
  • OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.OldTrees is a mythical and divine giver of immortality, one of the Turquoise Nymphs.
  • I was available for questions.
  • Awards: Brawl #2 Winner - Team FireTeam Card Design Winner
Re: Shard of Wisdom https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=40392.msg504248#msg504248
« Reply #23 on: May 26, 2012, 02:57:25 pm »
Please recognize that there are 6 ways to deal with creatures, 5 ways to deal with immortal and 4 ways to deal with immortal wisdom.

That said, the attack buff is probably too high.
"It is common sense to listen to the wisdom of the wise. The wise are marked by their readiness to listen to the wisdom of the fool."
"Nothing exists that cannot be countered." -OldTrees on indirect counters
Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

 

blarg: