[Official] Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus

[Elbirn]

[snip]

Your idea isn't entirely made clear, but I think this is it?

1. SoFo is played
2. SoFo uses skill, "Accretion"
3. SoFo loses skill, becomes gravity pulled
4. If another creature on your side of the field is gravity pulled, SoFo regains "Accretion" skill
5. Repeat steps 2 through 4.

If this is the case: I get your idea, it's just that it doesn't...really work. Accretion is a skill, whereas gravity pull is a status. Accretion isn't lobotomized by gravity pull. I suppose a potential nerf to SoFo could be making that the case, where gravity pull is a lobotomizer in addition to it's current effect. As for it regaining a lost skill, I'm not saying it's undoable, but there's nothing at all like that currently in game.

I'm not saying your idea is bad, wrong, or impossible. But with the current mechanics or "rules" of this game, as they've been established, that idea is completely contrary to them.

[OldTrees]

Only a problem in unupped play, and even then only an issue when the SoFo player goes first. This is an altogether different issue, which can be easily remedied by rendering you unable to play the card if there are no permanents on the opponents field. Which would guarantee that your opponent would have had a turn to play towers and gather quanta for whatever solution they may possess.

Ideally any fix would fix all problems. Your fix is a good one except for this one area.

[furballdn]

Seems my last post offended some of you  Here's a more constructive idea about what a gravity shard should be:



It has a similar feel to Shard of Serendipity and Shard of Bravery, is usable in any mono or bow and may be the best thing to happen to duo/trio.

Definitely feeling some SoBe vibes here, the OP SoBe, not the current SoBe. Let's just assume I used a mono gravy deck. I pay 3 to instantly gain 3 back, three towers for next turn, AND it thins my deck by 3 cards. So this is now like three free precognitions packed into one card.

[Dhanzig]

Seems my last post offended some of you  Here's a more constructive idea about what a gravity shard should be:



It has a similar feel to Shard of Serendipity and Shard of Bravery, is usable in any mono or bow and may be the best thing to happen to duo/trio.

Definitely feeling some SoBe vibes here, the OP SoBe, not the current SoBe. Let's just assume I used a mono gravy deck. I pay 3 to instantly gain 3 back, three towers for next turn, AND it thins my deck by 3 cards. So this is now like three free precognitions packed into one card.

As opposed by ... say ... 3 free deflags and a bonus BH?

How about 1 and 2 if mark ... or up the cost?  I have no choice but to look outside the focus box because SoFo is stupid as it is right now. NO other shard is as useful because NO other shard does even 1/3 of what sofo does.

At the very least ... this idea helps EVERY deck out while not hosing every opposing deck!

[ZephyrPhantom]

Definitely feeling some SoBe vibes here, the OP SoBe, not the current SoBe. Let's just assume I used a mono gravy deck. I pay 3 to instantly gain 3 back, three towers for next turn, AND it thins my deck by 3 cards. So this is now like three free precognitions packed into one card.

As opposed by ... say ... 3 free deflags and a bonus BH?

I guess you could make the argument that this version of SoFo is 3-in-1 as opposed to 4-in-1, but said argument is negated pretty quickly by the fact it still has way too good card advantage -and- is now a speed booster that steps into SoBe's niche in pillar/pend-based decks.  (And thematically, why does Gravity deserve instant quanta acceleration?)

How about 1 and 2 if mark ... or up the cost?  I have no choice but to look outside the focus box because SoFo is stupid as it is right now. NO other shard is as useful because NO other shard does even 1/3 of what sofo does.

I'd argue SoSe, SoBe, and SoSac are also pretty versatile for what they do, except their effects happen to be more digestible/balanced out. (Worth noting SoSe and SoBe can also become 3-in-1 cards if used correctly, but do not play the 'three cards' they give for free as opposed to SoFo.)

At the very least ... this idea helps EVERY deck out while not hosing every opposing deck!

IMHO, you overshot that goal a bit, because now every rush-based player would include SoFo not for the PC but for the rush acceleration - I can picture an especially annoying Nova/QT bow based on using these to get out pillars (which in turn fixes the main weakness of Novabows, spread out quantum management because you have a much better chance to deploy your pillars rather than wait for the 4-6 QTs you've packed in your deck). It seems SoFo would not only remain overused with this change but would also bump up the power of rushbows again.
My thoughts : how much discussion has there been on a nerf that replaces Destroy with Delay? I remember having an idea (slightly retooled below) along the lines of:

5 | 3
0 | 1
3 : Pressure : Delay target permanent for 1 turn and gain +0 | +5. Turns into a Black Hole if HP>15.

[Dhanzig]

These are all awesome arguments ... so why wasn't anyone arguing against the sofo we have now?  The first time I saw I knew it was stupid broken! But it was already in the game at that point ... and furthermore ... why doesn't every other shard produce the card it's element's nymph is based on?  SoFo needs to LOSE that part.

[choongmyoung]

These are all awesome arguments ... so why wasn't anyone arguing against the sofo we have now?  The first time I saw I knew it was stupid broken! But it was already in the game at that point ... and furthermore ... why doesn't every other shard produce the card it's element's nymph is based on?  SoFo needs to LOSE that part.

Totttttaly agreed.
/
Actually SoSe also "forces" to make the specific element's card. But SoSe is more reasonable anyway.

[ddevans96]

These are all awesome arguments ... so why wasn't anyone arguing against the sofo we have now?

What.

[OldTrees]

These are all awesome arguments ... so why wasn't anyone arguing against the sofo we have now?

This entire thread is arguing against the existing SoFo.

[OdinVanguard]

Before I begin, let me define how I am using the word 'counter'. I mean counter to mean something like "Purify counters Deadly Poison, because Purify nullifies the 4 deadly poisons you put onto the field, giving you both quanta and card advantage". Not something such as "Liquid Shadow counters Ray of Light, because it kills the creature and only heals them for 1". Because you invested more into your 'counter' than they did their RoL


The problem with Shard of Focus isn't what it does, it is how effectively it does this job and just how hard it is to stop from doing this job. It is also the fact that it is almost literally impossible to come out on the worse end of a turn 1-2 SoFo play.

Unlike what you may think, SoFo does not have the job of selective permanent destruction. SoFo is in the business of immense card advantage. Similar to SoSe, but a lot more powerful. Thinking about this in terms of card advantage, a first turn SoFo has almost literally no way of being taken out cost effectively. All the CCs in the world also take up a card to vanquish the shard, so you have to fall to repeatable card destruction or nerfing, like Owls Eye, or Mind Flayer. However, these take time to get onto the field, and if you go second, and your opponent goes first and gets a SoFo out, you have literally no cost effective way to deal with it.


I point this out because there is almost no way for SoFo to not at least break even. And if allowed any say in the matter it will balloon up to 3 explosions + Gravity pull target / Black Hole. There are literally NO first turn counters, because all of the 'first turn counters' required you to spend a card to stop it, and probably more quanta after considering SoFo is  costed.

What SoFo needs is a counter, something that actually can stop it on the first turn that it is played while maintaining card advantage. The whole prospect of having 4 cards in 1 (explosion x3 + black hole) is a separate issue, but I feel like the bigger issue is the sheer inability to be countered effectively. Especially early game.

(aka, the vast majority of the cards on that list are not counters to SoFo, merely ways to stop it from snowballing out of control. Breaking even should not be considered a counter.)

That's a really good point! But with this insight, do you have any suggestions for what to do about it?

Maybe something like this would be a feasible counter:

So a first turn SoFo could be countered by this.
The enemy pays 7 / 6
You spend 3 / 1 and 2 HP
No card advantage on either side (both players have the card they used put at bottom of their deck). You spend less quanta but lose a nominal amount of health... which is negligible early on.

The issue is though, is it possible to introduce a card that:
1) Stops SoFo with an equal or lower "cost" investment (cost theory would help here)
2) Is useable early game (low cost)
3) Broadly available. I.e. since SoFo itself can be placed in any deck, a viable counter would need to be likewise viable.
4) Will not itself be imbalanced

If the above 4 can be met, then one viable solution is to propose a new card(s) to fill a CC / counter niche.

If the above criteria can not be met,
(e.g. any card would either be imbalanced / OP itself, too narrowly available to counter SoFo's broad usage, to expensive to help cope with SoFo's first round combos, or requires a greater "cost" investment than SoFo)
Then the only solution is a major nerf to SoFo.

[kimham8a]

I think the card advantage elite arbiter meant was HAND advantage, not DECK SIZE advantage. Returning the card to your deck wouldn't give any hand advantage at all.

[Dhanzig]

Sometimes I think that instead of nerfing SoFo we should be breaking the game more. Shards!



Of COURSE ... he flies.

Meh ... I'm beating SoFo now ....

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I can't believe this sat here all weekend with NO comments o.O