Rogue Mage | Rogue Archmage

[Flayne]

NAME: Rogue mage ELEMENT: Light COST: 3 TYPE: Creature ATK|HP: 1 | 1 TEXT: Imbibe: Steal +1|+1 from target creature. If target is of , then instead, Convert:  is changed to .	NAME: Rogue Archmage ELEMENT: Light COST: 4 TYPE: Creature ATK|HP: 1 | 1 TEXT:   Imbibe: Steal +2|+1 from target creature. If target is of , then instead, Convert:  it is changed to .

ART: Flayne IDEA: Flayne NOTES: Theme: "Why this hatred towards such a magnificent presence? How can we judge what is good or evil when in the end, it is from our own folly that we decide? I will not be part of this indoctrination, I will delve into the realm of the unknown, I choose knowledge instead of prejudice..." ~ Rogue Mage Basically can be used in any deck with a source of and , however it has special synergy with darkness (apart from the ability cost) and with itself. *Cough* Eclipse *Cough* and is a temporarily fragile CC on field. My reasoning for it being perhaps cheap is 1: Its stats are incredibly low since light has access to "blessing" 2: It is duo element cost 3: Upgraded costs 1 more because of its stat buff that is now closer to "growth" standards Personal note: I am considering increasing the cost of the upgraded by one since the skill may seem strong for its cost and because of the fact that it can target another Rogue mage and cause it to recieve the Eclipse buff. IMPORTANT - If target creature has only 1hp then Rogue Mage steals the stats and the creature dies.   - It will not cause creatures to go into "negative attacks" the creatures attack just stays at zero and Rogue mage cannot gain attack points from them anymore. - If target creature is Anti-matter'd say Creature with -10|5, Mathematically speaking, Rogue mage can make the attack become more negative but receives no attack points. (upped ability) used on creature: -10|5  - 2|-1 = -12|4 - If  creature is converted to  , its abilities element cost remains the same  (Pegasus becomes  but still requires  for dive) also EDIT: Rogue mage does not steal any stats from pegasus, it simply changes its element "instead" ^ SERIES:

[Zyardran]

Awesome card maybe make the active ability cost 1

[JonathanCrazyJ]

That.
Art.

[Treldon]

*grumble grumble* I hereby ban you from all future art conmpetitions and Brawls 

And the card is nice too

[Flayne]

Awesome card maybe make the active ability cost 1

Thanks! I considered making the upgraded cost 1 less however since this has such synergy with , I don't think it would be too hard for to gather up its own quanta (pest) in order to use the ability constantly. That and granted the strength of the upgraded card I thought perhaps it'd be too cheap. (there is also Nova decks to consider as well)

I will see if other people share the same opinion

That.
Art.

Cheers!  It was an old acrylic painting I had a long while ago, I decided to give it a touch up, color balancing and a made from scratch back ground in photoshop, Glad you like it

*grumble grumble* I hereby ban you from all future art competitions and Brawls 

And the card is nice too

Aww but I like competitions 
Thanks!


Sooo no issues with balance?

[ZephyrPhantom]

Well, unupped gets about the same net value as Forest Spirit (+2 | +2 'change' in stats each turn) cc but can CC/kill enemy creatures, the increased cost seems justified. Upped turns this net change into +4 | +2 so it's probably accurate to make it more expensive instead of less.

Add Nightfall/Eclipse synergy and you get a solid design. I think it's worth a Crucible submission.

[Aves]

Mm, I feel that the word "drain" would fit better than steal. Otherwise, looks good!

[Flayne]

Well, unupped gets about the same net value as Forest Spirit (+2 | +2 'change' in stats each turn) cc but can CC/kill enemy creatures, the increased cost seems justified. Upped turns this net change into +4 | +2 so it's probably accurate to make it more expensive instead of less.

Add Nightfall/Eclipse synergy and you get a solid design. I think it's worth a Crucible submission.

Thanks! I thought it as an indirect buff to while at the same time it gives more creature options

Mm, I feel that the word "drain" would fit better than steal. Otherwise, looks good!

Thank you!   
Funny thing is this is almost a reversal of the ability name issue when I made my heretic|zealot card,
There is a card named drain life, while it does become siphon life, there are pests and vampires that do the same
thing thematically.

So the reasons I chose Imbibe over words such as "drain" or "absorb" were because:

1: While it has the aspect of draining something, the action is less vampiric and more magical (mage)

2: Imbibe not only means the absorption of liquids and moisture,
it can also mean to absorb, take in and acknowledge ideas/ideals such as "To imbibe a Sermon" which fits perfectly
with rogue mage as it symbolizes the exploration of the new, which may be seen as blasphemy against a doctrine.

[OdinVanguard]

The creature seems a little out of place in ... stealing energy / life force from another being just doesn't fit thematically, as does converting a creature to ...

I like the mechanic in and of itself, I'm just a little iffy on this thing being a card. Other than that I think its a very nice card...

And kudos on the art. That is definitely a very nice piece.

[Flayne]

I like the mechanic in and of itself, I think its a very nice card...

And kudos on the art. That is definitely a very nice piece.

Thanks!

The creature seems a little out of place in ... stealing energy / life force from another being just doesn't fit thematically, as does converting a creature to ...
I like the mechanic in and of itself, I'm just a little iffy on this thing being a card.

I can understand where you are coming from, and honestly this card could have been with a ability
(that was the original idea),
however:   (WARNING wall of text, for TL;DR scroll down)

1: Game play-wise, if it had ended up being a creature with a ability,
 it would be harder to balance because of its already strong synergy with itself being with Eclipse and the fact that all you would need would be Rays of Light + mark (and maybe nova) to produce in order for it to use the ability and convert the Rays of Light into creatures for more damage from the RoLs or immediately (turn after summoning) be able to cc/damage other creatures and steal stats.

In other words there would be no need to incorporate much cards in order for it to abuse the ability (on top of immediately being slightly harder to kill with eclipse and having more attack on its first entry)

However being the reverse, it is more balanced because it is harder to abuse the ability without incorporating more based cards
to justify the need for quanta, you need to use blessing in order to protect it from cheap cc damage spells while at the same time needing quanta for it to use the ability and on top of that if you want to use Eclipse combo and use the ability on another Rogue mage to convert to for it to grab the eclipse benefit you need WAY more investment into which further promotes the investment into cards to justify the need for quanta for the ability use.


2: Thematically speaking I understand your feelings, however, tied to point 1, it is more likely that a Good mage would fall into what is considered evil or taboo than the opposite (evil into good)

Also with all due respect to the game itself, it has its own "thematic discrepancies".

The two best examples I can think of atm are

1: Seraph which is a  card when it is thematically closer to although I understand why they made it fire due to the name which has significant related themes to it, however since it is a secondary trait, why not seraph being and having ability?

It requires   in order to temporarily become immaterial, of which immateriality before Seraph's existence was considered to be more of an theme (Quintessence, Anubis with immortality, immortal, phase-dragon, Shard of wisdom which is and especially benefits immaterial creatures, etc.)
despite it being for one turn only.

2: the Phase and Flesh Recluse has "Web" which ironically requires in order to take away the borne status of another creature when thematically it could have easily been or even at least which is the opposite.

And there are others, but the post is getting too long 

TL;DR:
-- Game play-wise it is more balanced as is instead of reverse elements because it promotes more card investment to justify quanta
--  Thematically there are worse "theme discrepancies" in the game than "Good mage becomes evil mage cliche" and the card more cleanly
(not perfectly mind you) ties two opposing Elements closer in some way.

Honestly, I am not saying the card is perfect and I think I may have complicated myself with the overall thematic vs game mechanic design of the card, though this is all my thinking process when making the card
However when considering the above and currently existing discrepancies, (not to toot my own horn) the overall theme of this card is achieved in a better and cleaner way (in my personal opinion) and ties two "opposite elements" without being too aloof or nonsensical.

[OdinVanguard]

On the seraph example
-It fits in as an angel of wrath (rage and berserk already being present under )
-The ability fits better (bringing out an angelic essence)
--The element already had immaterial worked into it under morning start and hope. Both of which had tie ins with divinity so this made thematic sense with pre-existing core theme mechanics

Mechanic and balance wise, given that this is a 1|1, I see very little issue with it being OP in conjunction with nightfall or eclipse. With those out it is a 2|2 or 3|2 at best. Given its cost this is not in danger of being OP.

As for the RoL combo, even with RoL changed to it is still only a 2|2 or 3|2 at best.

I think you are slightly over valueing the drain ability on this creature. Even with the conversion added in to make a neat twist on a RoL based deck I don't see this as being a game breaking card.
For RoL hope to really shine it needs a way to mass produce the RoLs. That would require adding in either or bringing the quanta req. up to a trio (or at least a duo).

As for the "good mage gone evil" I still think that fits in with this being a card. I.e. it is a mage that started out and hence retained the familiarity with and ability to manipulate but it has become corrupted and is now under the sway of ...
It is literally sucking the out of things... thats about as dark as it gets I think.

One interesting twist I could see that might get around that... What about having it simply invert the element so that it can turn to darkness or to ... or for that matter it could toggle the element of any creature it targets to the inverse element
- , - , - , - , - , -
That would seem to be a little more of a "edge" case rather than pure evil. It simply inverts whatever it touches by sucking out the excess of the current element.
Sucking the good out of something is definitely still evil, but it can use the same 'talent' to suck the evil out of something and make it good. I could certainly get behind that as a 'twisted' light creature.

It would still fit the same utility w.r.t. nightfall interactions, but it gains a more strength when fighting other players.

[Flayne]

 - Although I think it's getting off topic (despite me being the one to bring it up), strictly speaking, while it is commonly misinterpreted as such due to its nature and status,
a Seraph is certainly not an angel of wrath.
- From what I can gather and understand, the thematic reason for which they put it in is because of its namesake which implies not only charity but "Excess charity" which is also coincidentally the connotation of fire or heat that thematically has more to do with "cleansing by the heat of their light"
as well as the "enlightening" of others by their .

Honestly I am somewhat in between agreeing and disagreeing with their decision of putting it in but I still think the fire aspect is a secondary characteristic to its primary origin and status as a being of divinity and light.
(personally I think needed the seraph more than did but I'm far from being the game expert and that is another topic)

I will grant you your mechanic vs thematic argument of the card though, as the immateriality is temporary divine protection as and not permanent immateriality as , I went a little too far with that one.
However I am sure that you could grant me the Recluse argument (in exchange) which proves (with all due respect to the game) that there really are discrepancies in the game that cannot really be helped (for now).


Back to Rogue mage:

- The RoL thing was only an off the mill example, the intent was to bring to attention 's ability to extract quanta fairly easily via pest and the investment options would be cut clean if it were a creature of .
- Put simply:
Why would I invest in cards to justify ability cost when I can just use Nova, Light mark or RoL and already have the cards and quanta (Eclipse) to bring about the full potential of the creature?
VS having more access to Blessing and other cards while needing quanta to use its ability, ah if I invest into cards, can make this even more powerful by turning my  creatures into and using Eclipse (maybe mark?), AAs being of dark, gaining +2|+1 and using their ability to heal Liquid Shadow'd ally creatures, etc. the possible synergies go on.

Thematically:
While what you say makes sense about the primary state of becoming (good into evil),
my intention (though perhaps I wasn't clear) was to make somewhat of a "corrupt" mage that still works in the vicinity of but secretly uses the banned and supposedly "blasphemous" power of to create and bring about change, in an attempt at influencing the end of the traditionalist, dogmatic and close-minded indoctrinating principles that ironically brings more arrogance and discriminatory acts than justice and equality, questioning 's belief that it is doing right.
This is all in his perspective.
(Sorry I'm bad at summarizing/being brief)

However, your proposal on the mechanic of "Elemental Inverting" is very interesting indeed because as you mentioned, it enables it to fight other users as well as duo users, can soft counter Shard of Freedom and Readiness
only problem is thats all I can think of really, vs , , and , (maybe missed one)

I am being fairly adamant about keeping its element the way it is if only just for the sake of a very "specific" theme rather than a generalized simplistic (though in all fairness I was the first to use the term) complete metamorphosis from"good into evil".