Poll

Which Teries cards do you feel best represent Earth and Air combined?

Destructive Wings
0 (0%)
Airborne Weapon
0 (0%)
Jump
1 (10%)
Dormant Stone Demon
2 (20%)
Skyforge Scrap-Golem
4 (40%)
Duststorm Shield
1 (10%)
Skyiron Gauntlets
2 (20%)

Total Members Voted: 6

Voting closed: November 28, 2015, 04:55:22 pm

*Author

Offline ZephyrPhantomTopic starter

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1210633#msg1210633
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2015, 11:53:36 am »
Judging from the overall idea output it seems there's a strong emphasis on having Duality cards be one of the following:

A) capable of having two distinct functions (one :light , one :darkness )
B) changing its form/function manually (e.g. by a :light or :darkness triggered ability)
C) changing its form/function relative to life or quanta gain (something both :light and :darkness have)

Which implementations do you guys feel are viable? I personally feel all three are plausible if done right, though C appears to be a bit more graceful than A or B.

Here's another design I've whipped up based on continued discussion. Any thoughts on this one?
Quote
Bat Breeder 4 | 3
Whenever you generate :light or :darkness for the first time each turn, put a 1/1 Bat with Vampire into play.
, Sacrifice a Bat: Heal 5 HP.
1/2

Offline EmeraldTiger

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1210667#msg1210667
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2015, 03:27:03 pm »
Spoiler for My take on pendulum mechanic:
NAME:
Dual Shade
ELEMENT:
Duality
COST:
3
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
2 | 5
TEXT:
If your :light is greater than your :darkness , generate :darkness , otherwise generate :light . Swap stats when quanta changes.
NAME:
Dual Shade
ELEMENT:
Duality
COST:
4
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
2 | 6
TEXT:
If your :light is greater than your :darkness, generate :darkness, otherwise generate :light . Swap stats when quanta changes.

ART:

IDEA:
EmeraldTiger
NOTES:

SERIES:

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Offline OdinVanguard

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1210713#msg1210713
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2015, 09:13:04 pm »
The idea of flipping can also extend to on play / on death effects.
E.g. The card has a :light like effect on play and a :darkness like effect on death. Thematically this is like having a light turn on when the card is played / in play, and leaving behind a void / darkness when it leaves play / is destroyed / dies.

A similar mechanical theme could also extend nicely in the :life / :death hybrid as well.
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Offline ZephyrPhantomTopic starter

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1210754#msg1210754
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2015, 07:30:59 am »
To be honest I don't think Transform resonates as strongly as a mechanic with :life / :death as it does with :light / :darkness , unless an "on death" effect is involved. Life and Death also intersect at different points than Light and Darkness do (Poison and creature geneartion vs Quanta/Life gain benefits).

Offline Zawadx

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1210870#msg1210870
« Reply #16 on: October 17, 2015, 04:45:36 pm »
On play/On death sounds like a good theme for :life/ :death hybrid. But that's beside the point, let's focus on Duality for now.

As for Z's questions:

Light and Darkness have in common the ability to disregard their opponent's strategy, at least thematically. Darkness steals all their opponent has and makes their plans futile (exemplified by Devourer, Vampires, Steal, nightmare), while Light simply develops its own powerful plan and has all the tools to stop his opponent from mattering too much (Hope and Miracle along with powerhouse creatures are what I'm thinking). Max HP manipulation, buffs, quanta generation and healing are also strong overlaps.

Together they boast a huge number of duos (Siphonary, VDagger, Dark Domin) which all feature the style I mentioned above of not caring what the opponent has since their base is so strong. So I'd say that the facet of Domination is what they do best together.

Light and Darkness's common strengths actually feature directly opposite mechanics with same underlying implications. See SoV against SoD, Devourer vs Solar Shield (One prevents opponent's offense for quanta, other uses offense for quanta), VDagger vs Miracle (steady cheap healing vs expensive burst healing). So Conflict seems like a proper theme.
One can also take inspiration from the art for the Duality mark, which kind of looks like a hand of darkness taking over the sigil of darkness. A card representing this Grip would be a good idea.

What about: Grip of Blood | Grip of Vice (Cost 4/3 Duality, cost is so low due to the temporary nature of the effect)
Target creature gains Vampire and switches sides for 2 turns

Has the giving nature of light if used on own creatures, and the stealing mischief of darkness when used on opponent's creatures. Might make a potent stall strategy where you steal opponent's attackers to heal up, and then send them back with antimatter. Or maybe it can be used just standalone in darkness/light monos to further help their strategy of being above the opponent's strategy.

If we don't go with the conflict/grip theme, periodic/pendulum like might also be a good theme. But that's a difficult theme since light/darkness have no cards of their own which emphasize time. To me they feel to embody the inevitable instead.
Other ideas are Light and Shadow (maybe play on Wave Interference which is characteristic of EtG's style) and Moonshine/Twilight as a misture of Light and Darkness. Phases of the moon might also be a good theme to represent their cycle. Although cycle might be a better concept for life/death or time/aether
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Offline EmeraldTiger

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1210876#msg1210876
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2015, 04:57:48 pm »
Spoiler for Ideas so far:
Spoiler for Night & Day:
If Nowhere is Somewhere, and Somewhere is Over there, How can we be Anywhere?
:life :aether

Offline ZephyrPhantomTopic starter

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1210893#msg1210893
« Reply #18 on: October 17, 2015, 06:23:30 pm »
@ ET - You missed text-only cards like Eclipse Essence,Bat Breeder, and Vampire Grip. (May also want to include Noctilucence assuming Espithel wanted that converted to Duality.)

Grip of Blood reminds me of MtG's Mark of Mutiny. I like it, though it feels like it could easily be a just a :darkness card - seems too easily to treat it as subterfuge if used on your own creature, especially if said creature is a Singularity or Antimatter'd.

Re: Transform, it's worth noting that Light and Darkness also dabble in augmentation of creatures (Blessing, Crusader, Liquid Shadow, Eclipse).

Perhaps a "stifling" card like would be a good implementation of pro-domination? Something like:
Quote
Penumbra Edict 6 | 5
When your opponent plays a creature, they take damage equal to its ATK.
Whe you play a creature, heal HP equal to its HP.

Offline EmeraldTiger

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1211202#msg1211202
« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2015, 03:12:03 am »
We should probably move on to the next one.
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Offline ZephyrPhantomTopic starter

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1211238#msg1211238
« Reply #20 on: October 19, 2015, 11:56:38 am »
We should probably move on to the next one.
It's worth considering, as we've drawn up a fairly detailed outline of Duality for future use:

Quote from: Duality Cards are typically one of the following:
A) capable of having two distinct functions (one :light , one :darkness )
B) changing form/function manually (e.g. by a :light or :darkness triggered ability) or relative to HP or quanta gain (something both :light and :darkness have). This can be relative to itself or other creatures/permanents/players.
C) Effective at manipulating a player's state of quanta/HP.
D) Supportive of domination-type strategies.
E) Disregarding the opponent's strategy while empowering their own.

If there are no objections to this outline, I'll be putting up a poll thread for the cards within the next 24-48 hours.

Offline Espithel

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 1/6 - Light/Darkness] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1211316#msg1211316
« Reply #21 on: October 20, 2015, 03:42:08 am »
(May also want to include Noctilucence assuming Espithel wanted that converted to Duality.)

I do not. I merely brought it to everyone's attention to see if they can gain use from it.

Offline ZephyrPhantomTopic starter

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 2/6 - Entropy/Gravity] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1211724#msg1211724
« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2015, 04:09:41 am »
Voting has begun for Duality! [:light and :darkness] Vote for the cards that you feel are the best representative of the combination between :light and :darkness .

Spoiler for Compiled Card List:
Quote
Shades of Grey 5 | 4
Permanent
For 2 turns, opponent's quanta pools cannot have a greater quantity than any of your quanta pools.

Quote
Blinding Light | Glory 4 | 4
Permanent
Unupped Text: Your :darkness creatures become invisible as long as there is a :light creature in an adjacent slot to their left or right.
Upped Text: Your :light creatures gain +2|+2 for each :darkness reature in an adjacent slot to their left or right.

Quote
Eclipse Essence 4 | 3
Permanent
Whenever a creature generates :light , heal 1 HP.
Whenever a creature generates :darkness , your opponent loses 1 HP.

Quote
Draining Purge 3 | 2
Spell
Drain 5 hp and remove all status effects from target creature.

Quote
Night | Night 4 | 4
Permanents
Unupped Text:
:darkness :darkness :darkness: Target gains Siphon: it can take 2 HP from target creature to heal self.
 :light: Flip to Day
Upgraded Text:
:darkness :darkness :darkness: Target gains Siphon: it can take 2 HP from target creature to heal self.
0: Flip to Day

Day | Day 4 | 4
Permanents
Unupped Text:
:light :light :light: Target gains Share: it can give 2 HP from self to heal target creature
:darkness : Flip to Night
Upgraded Text:
:light :light :light: Target gains Share: it can give 2 HP from self to heal target creature
0: Flip to Night

Quote
Living Shadows 2 | 2
Creature
0 | 2
Unupped Text:
Emerging:
Whenever you gain life, Living Shadows gains a third of that in ATK.
Upgraded Text:
Emerging:
Whenever you gain life, Living Shadows gains half of that in ATK.

Quote
Bat Breeder 4 | 3
Creature
1 | 2
Whenever you generate :light or :darkness for the first time each turn, put a 1 | 1 Bat with Vampire into play.
, Sacrifice a Bat: Heal 5 HP.

Quote
Dual Shade 3 | 4
Creature
2 | 5 / 2 | 6
If your :light is greater than your :darkness , generate :darkness , otherwise generate :light . Swap stats when quanta changes.

Quote
Grip of Blood | Grip of Vice 4 | 3
Spell
Target creature gains Vampire and switches sides for 2 turns.

Quote
Penumbra Edict 6 | 5
Permanent
When your opponent plays a creature, they take damage equal to its ATK.
Whe you play a creature, heal HP equal to its HP.

In the meantime,Week 2 begins now with DISSA!

Discussion/Submission Phase will last:
Time's up!
Remember to consider the following questions!
- What do :entropy and :gravity have in common in terms of mechanics?
- What can :entropy and :gravity do together that neither element can do on their own?
- What do :entropy and :gravity not share? How could someone put both together on a card?

Offline EmeraldTiger

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Re: [Project] Designing Opposite Hybrids for Cygnia [Week 2/6 - Entropy/Gravity] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=60036.msg1211725#msg1211725
« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2015, 04:33:39 am »
or

I was thinking since and are spells, and is a creature.
An Event Horizon idea would need to fall into :gravity or a Hybrid, but as a Permanent.
The only thing is, I have no idea what it should do.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Event_horizon

A shared theme can be found in the cards I mentioned here. The 1st 2 are quanta generation/destruction.
other than this I don't see much similarities in the ETG meta.
I'm sure there are sciences that bring  :entropy and :gravity together but that would require some bit of research.
If Nowhere is Somewhere, and Somewhere is Over there, How can we be Anywhere?
:life :aether

 

blarg: