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Messages - Pyros for Porno (12)

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Game Suggestions and Feedback / Re: Is this farmville or what???
« on: April 08, 2010, 03:28:49 am »
Nice, negative karma for starting a thread about my dislike for grinding and my own opinions on whether or not is necessary.  Negative karma for constructive criticism and ideas to fix things...?
Anyways I'm done with the forum, no point in trying to express opinions to children with power/hostility issues.

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Game Suggestions and Feedback / Re: Is this farmville or what???
« on: April 07, 2010, 05:15:59 am »
Miniwally - any game that has a player vs player element, has at least a portion of the game that is not repetitive and not a grind.  The more you focus on that rather than the farming aspect, the more entertaining the game is. 
The dressed up grinds you describe are games that are designed to keep you paying and playing.  Warcraft is the perfect example.  Unfortunately, that game could be so much more than it is....but fortunately for blizzards pocketbooks, they created a system that keeps you grinding, so you keep paying.

Did you ever play mario kart, smash brothers or the like?  Those games are incredibly fun, you hardly ever play against the computer after a few go throughs, and no grinding at all is required to make the game fun, or to make multi player fun.  I really wish more games would copy Nintendos excellent multiplayer experiences.

Grinding was introduced in games as a way for the companies who make those games to make more money.  Considering we don't pay to play this game, outside of donations, whats the point.

Every player vs player experience is different.  Focus on making that the center of your game, the grind all but disappears, and the fun only increases.

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Game Suggestions and Feedback / Re: Is this farmville or what???
« on: April 07, 2010, 05:04:31 am »
Hey Icybraker, I seriously doubt you could bore me with an explanation of why I am wrong.  I bet it might even have the opposite effect of me laughing my @$$ off.   If you have one, please share.   Why did you even bother posting in this thread?  Do you have any constructive criticism, anything marginally intelligent to add to this discussion?  Or do you just like to express disagreement and pass insults?   Monkeys can do that.  Have you ever seen a monkey throw poo.  Do you notice any resemblance?

We don't need people who do nothing but complain and accuse.

Do us all a favor and kindly show yourself out.
Really I can leave, wow?  I had never thought of that!   Quitting a game I like because I find issue with certain aspects?...how....incredibly..un helpful.

I'm sorry but this is not a complaint, it's me pointing out what seems to me to be an obvious shortcoming in the game, because I do like it, I do want to help improve it, and I do want more players who play to stick around and add a stronger competition base to the game.  My own opinion is that players like you are the ones who should take a hike.

Akromat - I'm confused, do you want me to quit too, or do you want to hear me out?  Also I think the part where you said "At no point in any of this thread did you offer one piece of constructive advice" might sound a little bit silly after I finish.  Asking nicely also works really well, fyi.  I also do grasp the concept of end game thanks (not sure of how you deduced that I dont)...but I dont share your glee for farming, and have hardly ever thought it necessary, since I consider fighting other players the more entertaining aspects of the game, and fighting computer ai the less.   And farming players doesn't get old :)

I do have plenty of ideas, I don't mind sharing them.

The original intent of this thread was to see if other people shared similar thoughts first

All sarcasm aside...I don't mind sharing ideas, hopefully everyone else can add something positive to the debate, rather than flinging poo.
If you think I'm wrong, don't just say I'm wrong, explain yourself.

For now I will keep them simple, there really is no need to go further at the moment.  Also I do have a bias towards a dislike in fighting computer opponents.  They are too predictable and fighting them repeatedly is a bore.  I know that everyone doesn't necessarily share that same viewpoint.  Some of these ideas might be suggested as a way to decrease the amount of time playing vs the computer, in order to have more time for pvp.

-Lose the slot machine.  Incredibly frustrating method of reward dispersal. 

-Add variation to False God decks, switch some cards for other cards, creating a slightly different experience each time.  Players don't use the same deck all the time, why should the computer?

-Design in other ways to beat false gods, other than using the same basic rainbow decks.  There are many ways to tweak this, but would most likely take more new cards, or more card tweaking.  And I'm sure that's a big enough project already, and probably a discussion for a new thread.

-If the player you fight in a pvp match has upgraded cards, let you roll for them.

-Increase pvp rewards!

-The grind in this game really can be eliminated completely with increased reward rates, of course this would have to be much higher than it is now...but I mean really, when you start beating false gods regularly, why should it take so much time to get upgraded cards?  When you get a rainbow false god killing deck, most of your new upgraded cards aren't even used for fighting them,  but because you get them at a snails pace, you are forced to spend more time fighting AI, than playing against other players.

-Possibly let you choose the false god you want to play.  Give a broader range of cards to choose from when you win (Not SLOT Style)  Allowing you to have greater control over the cards you receive, therefore requiring less selling of cards you dont want, only to get partial card back.

I can keep going and going, ideas are a dime a dozen, that only took a couple minutes, but I will let you monkeys fling poo on those ones first before I add more.

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Game Suggestions and Feedback / Re: PvP is so Slow
« on: April 06, 2010, 02:46:08 am »
PVP is fast, have you ever noticed when you play an opponent who is actually quick on the draw?  I don't think its possible for anyone to make you play faster.

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Game Suggestions and Feedback / Re: Is this farmville or what???
« on: April 06, 2010, 02:02:39 am »
I have been killing false gods with a rainbow deck for quite a while.  Beating gods after reading this forum is not a difficult task.  And I disagree completely with PhantomFox and peopkish.  Peopkish, are you a game designer and a psychologist?  I don't need a lecture from you about game design, as I have obtained my own education in such quite a long time ago, and have been playing games for possibly longer than you have been alive.  And yes what I really want is LESS GRINDING.  The rewards to me are secondary compared with the nature of the grind in this game, but could use some improvement as well.  Grinding may be 'fairly effective' (interesting choice of words) but its a terrible way to keep players playing your game.  You are most definitely wrong about grinding being necessary for endless games.  I can assume the only reason you think so is because many many games use this 'feature' or lack thereof, to keep players playing.  There is absolutely no reason to make 'progress' as you call it boring and repetitive.   With a little bit of creativity there are many other options to a game designer.(no offense meant to Zanzarino)   I also seriously doubt that speeding up the progress in the game would have any adverse effect on the number of players.  If anything, more people might be attracted to the game due to the fact that repetitive grinding isn't the entire base for progression, as well as keeping players around longer who do have upgraded decks and want to continue playing, but don't want to continue fighting the same dumb AI again and again.

Why does end game = grind?  Only because it has been made to be so.
End game could just as easily be = player vs player competition. (which in my opinion is the much more entertaining aspect of the game)

Ive made my rainbow deck, Ive faced the same computer AI over and over and I cannot see how anyone can really have fun playing against the computer at this point, however if you want to upgrade more cards, its really the only option for doing so.

The gambling article you suggested has zero relevance to my point, I only mentioned the slot machine, because I think its a terrible method of card dispersion.  I also do not see how this game is akin to casino games, or set up in any way similar, other than the slot machine card allowance.
What game doesn't try to draw on human tendency towards addiction?  Are you suggesting that Elements was designed to rob people of their pocketbooks?  Are you suggesting this game is incredibly simple?  Elements is causing worldwide addiction problems????  Also I'm sure you were unaware, but gamboling means to skip and play and frolic about.  If in fact people worldwide were addicted to Gamboling, I bet this world would be a much better place.

The game design article describes perfectly whats going on in this game in the section titled  'How to make players Quit' so thanks for contradicting your own point.  Grinding will never attract players to a game, it will only cause them to leave.  How is this a benefit for the game as a whole?

"If they've just gone up a level and know that they have an hour of play before anything interesting happens, their motivation will be low relative to all the other activities they could be doing."

The other situation that can lead to quitting is the sharp drop in rate of reward which I discussed in the chimpanzee example. Just like motivation, reward is relative. The value of the current reward is compared to the value of the previous rewards. If the current reward is 10 times the last one, it will have a big impact on the participant. If the current reward is weaker than experience has led them to believe, the player will experience frustration and anger.

Hence my own current feelings.  I just love beating a false god, winning nothing, then fighting rainbow for 20 minutes, losing again, beating another false god, winning no cards, beating another and finally winning a card, only its not even worth the cost of a card I can actually use....WHEE!!   Oh the ups and downs of the slot machine.

I would also like to add that the pvp rewards are incredibly skewed towards being beneficial only to new players.  Once you have an upgraded deck and a high score, you rarely win more than 40 coins or so from a match, and if you beat a skilled player you still get unupgraded cards.





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Game Suggestions and Feedback / Is this farmville or what???
« on: April 05, 2010, 03:25:50 am »
The amount of farming you have to do in this game to make cash for upgrades is absolutely ridiculous.    Playing against a computer ai OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER just so you can compete against other upgraded decks is extremely mind numbingly BORING!!!  Not to mention with each patch, they become harder and harder, decreasing your chances for an already extremely limited reward.  Your slots are tighter than Vegas!  Please either increase the pvp rewards or increase the chance to win upgraded cards or SOMETHING.  This is SOOOOO LAME.   

I don't understand the concept of farming at all, from a game design standpoint.  Why choose to make a game more tedious and boring and imbalanced over more entertaining and competitive???  Fighting against other players is way more entertaining than grinding predictable computer AI, and Im guessing 90% of the people who play this game have no where near the time required to make a fully upgraded deck.  At least not within any reasonable time frame.

Oh yes and it would be great if you could fix the bug where actions become unavailable after clicking cancel.  Also incredibly annoying.

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Humor / Re: Holy COW!!! - New Card
« on: April 01, 2010, 06:22:40 am »
Moo regulate!   Is that what all those trophies are for?

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Humor / Re: Holy COW!!! - New Card
« on: April 01, 2010, 05:30:14 am »
The Moo is Super Loud, even louder than all the ridiculous popping noises.   I think a Fractal Moo would have blown my speakers!

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Rainbow Decks / Re: PuppyChow's FG Rainbow
« on: April 01, 2010, 05:17:58 am »
What do you think about switching out a Pulverizer for Butterfly Effect.  It can be very nice to have both Eternity and a destroying creature.
Its also a great card to cast on your second Otyugh if your first one survives.

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Humor / Holy COW!!! - New Card
« on: April 01, 2010, 03:48:09 am »


O cost click cast MOO!!!

Showed up as my oracle pet today!

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Duo-Decks / Re: Awesome T50 Grinder
« on: March 20, 2010, 07:43:49 am »
The earthquakes used with rain of fires and fireballs are all included in the stalling.  I don't think 3 would be a bad idea however.  You might even consider playing without fahrenheits or enchant artifact at all.  It is nice however to protect your quanta.  Without it this deck has no chance.  Thats what the increased pillar ratio is for.
This deck is quite speedy too, with 30 cards, I usually finish with somewhere around 10 cards left.

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Duo-Decks / Awesome T50 Grinder
« on: March 19, 2010, 05:19:21 am »
Hover over cards for details, click for permalink
Deck import code : [Select]
5f4 77i 77i 77j 77j 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dg 7dk 7dk 7dk 7dk 7dk 7dm 7dm 7dn 7dn 7do 7do 7do 8pm


This deck works awesome both up and unupgrayeddedd.  Just make sure to get at least one Fahrenheit up in there.  It takes about 12-15 turns to build up enough quanta to blast through 100 health in one shot, unless you lose some pillars or get a bad draw.  Enemy heals are pointless since you cant heal from a one shot.  Otyughs do nothing since you have no creatures.  The hardest decks to fight without upgrades are the devourer and life zerg decks.  False god farmers are a joke when played by the AI.  Bonewalls make the Fahrenheit useless, so just save the mana up for a single blast from your fireyballs.  Firebuckler can be a good replacement for the second Fahrenheit. 

3 fireballs will kill with 110+
4 fireballs will kill with 81+ quanta
5 fireballs will kill with 63+

The idea is to stall with earthquakes / rain of fires until you have enough to destroy with fireballs and fahrenheit.
Not having to play creatures makes this deck really fast as well. 

Ive found also that in instances of creature rush, its best to use fireballs on creatures and let the fahrenheit do most of the damage.

I dont keep track of my scores, but I would say I won well over 50% of the time without any upgrades, and now its probably somewhere in the 80 to 90 range.

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