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Offline furballdn

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg505271#msg505271
« Reply #228 on: May 29, 2012, 02:19:32 am »
Just make it so that it doesn't gain hp, but counters. If it stays at 1hp, then it's a pretty good nerf.

Offline Naesala

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg505333#msg505333
« Reply #229 on: May 29, 2012, 07:00:35 am »
An idea occurred to me of a fun and thematic way to nerf SoF...

Make it so that the SoF can be targeted both by CC and also by PC.  It would be a lot less OP if a Deflag could instakill it or, even better, a Steal could steal it.

This would partially alleviate the problem with the shard being practically immune to damage-based CC once it's eaten its first two victims...
Pretty neat idea, i think.
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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg505362#msg505362
« Reply #230 on: May 29, 2012, 08:54:35 am »
An idea occurred to me of a fun and thematic way to nerf SoF...

Make it so that the SoF can be targeted both by CC and also by PC.  It would be a lot less OP if a Deflag could instakill it or, even better, a Steal could steal it.

This would partially alleviate the problem with the shard being practically immune to damage-based CC once it's eaten its first two victims...
Pretty neat idea, i think.
Excellent. Now games are won by whoever gets the first SoFo out!

Just make it so that it doesn't gain hp, but counters. If it stays at 1hp, then it's a pretty good nerf.
Not a bad idea, though it would require introducing a new mechanism to the game. And, of course, it defeats most of the point of having it be the Gravity shard - Gravity is supposed to benefit from it having high HP through Gravity Pull, Catapult, etc.
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Offline rosutosefi

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg505401#msg505401
« Reply #231 on: May 29, 2012, 12:26:02 pm »
What's the problem with SoFo? The neutral cost. Personally, I think that the shards' costs don't matter that much, it's just that smaller costs are usable in mono decks and cards with larger costs fit well into a rainbow. As a consequence, you cannot balance a shard by increasing it's neutral cost, because this will only make people use it with novas and rainbows, which is silly. Shards should be paid with a low cost, enough to give it a "cost"  and still become good in monos. The main problem here is that SoFo does too much as a shard: it's effects mean that it should have a very high cost, but this cannot be done because increasing the cost will only make it favor rainbows and become unusable in mono-gravity decks. This should be the same with the other shards.

TL;DR: We cannot make a powerful shard with a high cost. SoFo completely disobeys this.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2012, 12:28:18 pm by rosutosefi »
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Offline AP579

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg505629#msg505629
« Reply #232 on: May 30, 2012, 01:27:49 am »
Here's a brilliant idea: Make it 0|4, and have it last 2 turns and a 3 :rainbow PC cost with no HP gain, so it isn't physically impossible to stop it completely slaughtering your permanents. Have it last 3 turns if mark is :gravity.
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Offline umgrego2

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg520193#msg520193
« Reply #233 on: July 10, 2012, 05:28:15 pm »
With the nerf, it's still OP.

What this card lacks is the duality that all of the other shards have with respect to the element that it represents. Here's my suggestion:
Starts with stats 0/3. Stats change 0/-1 or 0/+15 if mark of gravity. Turns into a BH if HP>45.

That way, in a deck with a mark other than gravity, the shard remains vulnerable to CC.

Offline Calindu

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg520194#msg520194
« Reply #234 on: July 10, 2012, 05:34:25 pm »
With the nerf, it's still OP.

What this card lacks is the duality that all of the other shards have with respect to the element that it represents. Here's my suggestion:
Starts with stats 0/3. Stats change 0/-1 or 0/+15 if mark of gravity. Turns into a BH if HP>45.

That way, in a deck with a mark other than gravity, the shard remains vulnerable to CC.

Best idea I've seen till now, finally a way to make this actually help gravity more than it helps a rainbow.
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Offline hell7fire1

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg520199#msg520199
« Reply #235 on: July 10, 2012, 05:47:48 pm »
i think its fine,its starts with 1hp so basically any damage doing spell/effect could kill it

Offline Calindu

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg520201#msg520201
« Reply #236 on: July 10, 2012, 05:51:01 pm »
i think its fine,its starts with 1hp so basically any damage doing spell/effect could kill it

Too bad that after 1 use this simply becomes too big to be stopped. Also, you often see a first turn SoFo unupped, but you rarely see a first turn CC unupped.
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Offline rosutosefi

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg520299#msg520299
« Reply #237 on: July 10, 2012, 10:08:52 pm »
With the nerf, it's still OP.

What this card lacks is the duality that all of the other shards have with respect to the element that it represents. Here's my suggestion:
Starts with stats 0/3. Stats change 0/-1 or 0/+15 if mark of gravity. Turns into a BH if HP>45.

That way, in a deck with a mark other than gravity, the shard remains vulnerable to CC.

I'll still run gravity mark novabows with it. First turn SoFo will still exist.
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Offline umgrego2

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg520580#msg520580
« Reply #238 on: July 11, 2012, 02:06:52 pm »
With the nerf, it's still OP.

What this card lacks is the duality that all of the other shards have with respect to the element that it represents. Here's my suggestion:
Starts with stats 0/3. Stats change 0/-1 or 0/+15 if mark of gravity. Turns into a BH if HP>45.

That way, in a deck with a mark other than gravity, the shard remains vulnerable to CC.

I'll still run gravity mark novabows with it. First turn SoFo will still exist.

That's fine. When SoG was altered, you started to see mark of life rainbows, too. But if a deck-builder wants to take full advantage of the SoFo in a rainbow, they shouldn't also be able to take advantage of a traditional mark like Entropy or Time.

Offline rosutosefi

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Re: Shard of Focus | Shard of Focus https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=35191.msg520588#msg520588
« Reply #239 on: July 11, 2012, 02:21:50 pm »
With the nerf, it's still OP.

What this card lacks is the duality that all of the other shards have with respect to the element that it represents. Here's my suggestion:
Starts with stats 0/3. Stats change 0/-1 or 0/+15 if mark of gravity. Turns into a BH if HP>45.
That way, in a deck with a mark other than gravity, the shard remains vulnerable to CC.
I'll still run gravity mark novabows with it. First turn SoFo will still exist.
That's fine. When SoG was altered, you started to see mark of life rainbows, too. But if a deck-builder wants to take full advantage of the SoFo in a rainbow, they shouldn't also be able to take advantage of a traditional mark like Entropy or Time.

The problem is that it's still better when run with rainbows instead of mono gravity. That's a bad mechanic. Very bad. I have explained everything in my previous post that this problem is due to its large random cost. It's a bad mechanic because it's only balanced with elemental pillars and pendulums but OP with rainbow or quantum pillars.

And regarding the mark, it's a novabow. You just adjust the quanta balance. First turn SoFo is still there, will always be there and will be peeking at your window preparing to emotionally harass you every time you play a PVP game. Yes, look at your window.
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