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bobcamel

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10707#msg10707
« on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

Bonds are a permanent. Permanent effects aren't spells and ass such they don't even fall under ze description.

bobcamel

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10708#msg10708
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

I would like to repeat this thing.

Quote
Those spells aren't untargeted, they TARGET EVERYTHING ON ENEMY'S SIDE. Except for the ones who are immaterial, for they can't.
And I'd like this to become common knowledge, too.

bobcamel

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10709#msg10709
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

Reflective shields should reflect poison
Poison is a spell, and it hits a player. Reflective shields reflect spells that hit players. So.

Untargeted/AoE spells (like Rain of Fire) should NOT hit immaterial creatures
Those spells aren't untargeted, they TARGET EVERYTHING ON ENEMY'S SIDE. Except for the ones who are immaterial, for they can't.

Bone Walls should stack
Well, Pillar stacks don't replace themselves.

Canceling a creature's skill should give you quantums back
We understand Zanzarino wants us to think ten times before we decide to do each click, but most of players won't. Also, creature cant resue ability should stay as a punishment.

All abilities should be available to mutants (including Sniper, Queen, ...)
Chances of getting those would be slim anyway, so why not?

chriskang

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10710#msg10710
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

No trolling in the discussion please.

cipher_nemo

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10711#msg10711
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

I voted the following, and here's my reasoning...

  • Reflective shields should NOT reflect poison
    This would change the balance of reflective shields and would be seen much more frequently in end-game farming and PvP decks.
  • Untargeted/AoE spells (like Rain of Fire) should NOT hit immaterial creatures
    There's a reason why the ability to make creatures "immaterial" is called "immortal". If AoE spells could hit immaterial creatures, then the terminology needs to be changed for this ability and buff. If this was true, the Annubis would be seriously diminished in terms of power. Not a horrible change, but it would throw off the way we play Elements and make AoE spells a little too powerful.
  • Bone Walls should stack
    For Bone Walls, putting another 7 on an existing Bone Wall isn't going to make much difference when I typically have 30-50 near the end of a match. But stealing Bone Walls should steal the entire stack, not just one. And targeting Bone Walls to destroy it should kill the whole stack. It's overpowered when we can only destroy one at a time.
  • Canceling a creature's skill should give you quantums back
    This should be a no-brainer. We get the quanta back when we cancel a spell, why not an ability? The biggest problem with this is creatures with abilities that are in the top row. We can't see their ability, so we have to use it before we know what it is. On the top row, the ability name is covered up by other cards.
  • All abilities should be available to mutants (including Sniper, Queen, ...)
    As much as this sort of makes me cringe in terms of making farming much more difficult against decks like Chaos Lord, I know it's the right thing to do. Mutation should be random, not limited to a specific set of abilities. But mutation should be a weaker set of abilities compared to improved mutation. An improved mutation should never give a cruddy little skeleton with no abilities.

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10712#msg10712
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

PURELY for game balance:

Reflective shields should reflect poison:
Reflective shields are weak sauce; poison is very powerful.  Ta-dah!


Untargeted/AoE spells (like Rain of Fire) should hit immaterial creatures:
I'm going with M:tG logic in this one.  I don't care about the 'flavor' of the "immaterial" ability -- the wording is "cannot be targeted", and RoF doesn't "target".  Also, Immaterial creatures are a little strong; this would help.


Bone Walls should NOT stack:
Overpowered.  Plain and simple.


Canceling a creature's skill should give you quantums back:
This is just a bug, straight up.


Some abilities should NOT be available to mutants (like Sniper, Queen, ...):
Being able to randomly Queen -- or worse, Tsunami -- for 1 quantum -- is just hideous.  I also think that Graboid and Devourer should be taken off of the list of available mutants, as they have passive abilities that stack with their mutant power, and that's bad.  Having a mutant Graboid that is untargetable and can Steal for 1 Earth is painful.  Furthermore, having a mutant Graboid with Burrow is retarded. :)
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Evil Hamster

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10713#msg10713
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

Reflective shields should reflect poison
I see Poison as a spell that directly affects your opponent, therefore Reflective Shield should reflect poison.

All abilities should be available to mutants (including Sniper, Queen, ...)
Powerful mutants are cool.
Reflective shields reflect damage. Poison does not directly damage your opponent, it adds an effect that later damages. If the shields reflect poison, then they should reflect miracle and others also.

Also- powerful mutants might be cool, but I don't see any gameplay benefit from this.

Evil Hamster

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10714#msg10714
« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

Reflective shields reflect damage. Poison does not directly damage your opponent, it adds an effect that later damages. If the shields reflect poison, then they should reflect miracle and others also.

Yes, I know how poison works but it doesn't make sense to me.

Reflective shield should reflect all SPELLS. It should be like this "Anti-Magic Shield" because how does the shield know what spell damages you instantly, and what spell damages you next turn? It should counter spells not damage.

I'm not talking about what it says on the card. I'm talking about what sounds logical.

Simple things are always the best. Reflective Shield: Reflects all spells. Period.
That would make the shield type useless for one of the two elements that has them- Light. If you have a reflective shield up you would help your opponent by casting miracle. And if you had ANY poison at all before playing it, you could not even cast purify on yourself. Would that include blocking bonds also? That's a spell effect that gives you life.

Scaredgirl

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10715#msg10715
« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

PURELY for game balance:
Personally I think all design decisions should be made according to what makes sense. Game balance is easy to fix afterwards by upping card costs etc.


That would make the shield type useless for one of the two elements that has them- Light. If you have a reflective shield up you would help your opponent by casting miracle. And if you had ANY poison at all before playing it, you could not even cast purify on yourself. Would that include blocking bonds also? That's a spell effect that gives you life.
I wouldn't say useless, but yes, if you had a Reflective Shield, then Miracle would probably not be a good choice.

If you had poison on you (and Purify in your deck), it might not be a good idea to play that Shield. All you need to do is wait for Purify, play the shield, and bye bye poison.

It wouldn't block Feral Bonds because they are a permanents, not spells.

Scaredgirl

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10716#msg10716
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

Reflective shields reflect damage. Poison does not directly damage your opponent, it adds an effect that later damages. If the shields reflect poison, then they should reflect miracle and others also.

Yes, I know how poison works but it doesn't make sense to me.

Reflective shield should reflect all SPELLS. It should be like this "Anti-Magic Shield" because how does the shield know what spell damages you instantly, and what spell damages you next turn? It should counter spells not damage.

I'm not talking about what it says on the card. I'm talking about what sounds logical.

Simple things are always the best. Reflective Shield: Reflects all spells. Period.


Also- powerful mutants might be cool, but I don't see any gameplay benefit from this.
Benefit would simply be more variation. It's not like mutation decks are super-powerful at the moment. Adding all abilities would not make a big difference as far as balance goes but it would make the game more fun. We already have mutants with Steal-ability which is much better than any missing abilities but I don't hear people complaining about that.

Scaredgirl

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10717#msg10717
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

Reflective shields should reflect poison
I see Poison as a spell that directly affects your opponent, therefore Reflective Shield should reflect poison.

Untargeted/AoE spells (like Rain of Fire) should NOT hit immaterial creatures

Easy. If the target is immaterial, how can anything hit it? It's like trying to punch a ghost.

Bone Walls should stack

Makes sense. I see Bone Walls as a pile of individual permanents that logically should stack if you play more than one.

Canceling a creature's skill should give you quantums back

You can cancel cards and get the quantum back (or reuse that same card during the same turn), why not creature abilities? This would also make gameplay faster because you don't have to be so careful when clicking abilities.

All abilities should be available to mutants (including Sniper, Queen, ...)
Powerful mutants are cool.

xunling

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What the game mechanics should be https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=1136.msg10718#msg10718
« Reply #11 on: December 15, 2009, 10:10:20 pm »

Disclaimer: I am pretty new to the game and probably haven't explored in full enough detail the different decks and strategies :)  

Reflective shields should NOT reflect poison:
I think there should be some way through these shields. However this does make poison decks quite powerful if you don't pack a purify in a deck.

Untargeted/AoE spells (like Rain of Fire) should hit immaterial creatures:
Again my only argument is that there should be some counter to these creatures.

Bone Walls should stack:
Scaredgirl comment on this I totally agree with. Although would it be too powerful? I've only started using bone shields in the last couple of days, being able to strengthen the shield from you deck would be a nice addition tactics wise.

Canceling a creature's skill should give you quantums back:
Indeed, I don't think being punished for mis clicks is necessary.

Some abilities should NOT be available to mutants (like Sniper, Queen, ...):
I believe that having certain abilities for mutant creatures would make them overpowered, this I guess could be balanced by changing the cost of the card?





 

anything
blarg: