Spin nerf?

[Essence]

Actually, it's only four cards per spin -- the code picks five cards from the deck, but the fifth never appears in the slots.

Source?

[Rastafla]

I think he means that each spin, 5 cards are picked. Lets say you beat an FG, you get 3 spins. 5 cards are picked for each of the 3 spins. So effectively, you could have 15 different cards on there. Thats the way I interpret it. I guess more cards means less chance of getting a certain one.

Allowing for Ashebrethafe's correction of only 4 out of 5 cards appearing in each spin, this still doesn't sound right.

Let's say you win a T50 match against an opponent with 30 cards (so three spins).  Have you ever noticed that if cards like Boneyard pop up in one spin, it will probably make an appearance in the second or third as well?  You know there can't be more than 2 of those in the deck.  Assume 12 pillars.

So you're saying it picked 5 cards out of 18 (not counting pillars), displayed 4, and Boneyard was one.  Then it picks 5 NEW cards, displays 4, and picks Boneyard AGAIN?  And possibly a third time?

One the one hand, more than 5 cards appear in spins.  On the other hand, the SAME cards appear in different spins enough that it doesn't seem that 5 new cards are pulled for each individual spin.

This! This is what spins looks like to me, spins looks very much like each other with small change.
Lets say that the code picks cards (a)(b)(c)(d) and (e)
Then my spins may look like [a,b,c] [d,c,c] [e,e,a] or [c,b,c] [b,b,b] [e,e,a]. I cant recall a single time when i have seen more than 5 cards and I've been playings almost daily since February.

About the nerf thingie. Ive had bad spins since Saturday til today but then FGs had a spinspree and gave me 2 cards each a few times yet another few singles so I don't know.

[Evil Combat]

i been on winning 1 card every 2-3 god these days it just luck

[PuppyChow]

This! This is what spins looks like to me, spins looks very much like each other with small change.
Lets say that the code picks cards (a)(b)(c)(d) and (e)
Then my spins may look like [a,b,c] [d,c,c] [e,e,a] or [c,b,c] [b,b,b] [e,e,a]. I cant recall a single time when i have seen more than 5 cards and I've been playings almost daily since February.

About the nerf thingie. Ive had bad spins since Saturday til today but then FGs had a spinspree and gave me 2 cards each a few times yet another few singles so I don't know.

Again, this isn't how it works, as far as I know. This is what it would do:

code picks cards (a)(b)(c)(d) and (e)
you spin [c,c,d]
code picks cards (a)(c)(b)(f) and (b)
you spin [f,b,b]
code picks cards (f)(f)(f)(p) and (u)
you spin [f,f,f]

[DietSnapple135]

This! This is what spins looks like to me, spins looks very much like each other with small change.
Lets say that the code picks cards (a)(b)(c)(d) and (e)
Then my spins may look like [a,b,c] [d,c,c] [e,e,a] or [c,b,c] [b,b,b] [e,e,a]. I cant recall a single time when i have seen more than 5 cards and I've been playings almost daily since February.

About the nerf thingie. Ive had bad spins since Saturday til today but then FGs had a spinspree and gave me 2 cards each a few times yet another few singles so I don't know.

Again, this isn't how it works, as far as I know. This is what it would do:

code picks cards (a)(b)(c)(d) and (e)
you spin [c,c,d]
code picks cards (a)(c)(b)(f) and (b)
you spin [f,b,b]
code picks cards (f)(f)(f)(p) and (u)
you spin [f,f,f]

Very interesting. Does this increase the user's chances of winning a card by a ton like it seems it would. In comparison to, say, a legitimate roll of every card in the opponent's hand?

[Jangoo]

.

I took some stats:

Starting from v.1.20 through 1.21 (until today)/ FG-battles:

96 games won
30 cards won

-> 31,25 card-win-rate

This is quite close to Zanzs statistical 32-33% overall card-win-rate.


I should probably make a cut here and start anew?

[PhuzzY LogiK]

Again, this isn't how it works, as far as I know. This is what it would do:

code picks cards (a)(b)(c)(d) and (e)
you spin [c,c,d]
code picks cards (a)(c)(b)(f) and (b)
you spin [f,b,b]
code picks cards (f)(f)(f)(p) and (u)
you spin [f,f,f]

I think what you show is an accurate possibility for the results of a set of spins.

My question is this: how likely is it that a few cards would be chosen over and over?  For example, take your rainbow deck (not counting pillars): 1 Boneyard (a), 4SoG (b), 6 Supernovas (c), 1 Druid (d), 2 Bonewalls (e), 2 Otys (f), 1 Pulvy (g), 2 Fire Storms (h), 1 Permafrost (i), 1 Queen (j), 2 Hourglasses (k), 1 Eternity (l), 1 Steal (m), 2 Quints (n)

So the pool to pull from would be:
(a)(b)(b)(b)(b)(c)(c)(c)(c)(c)(c)(d)(e)(e)(f)(f)(g)(h)(h)(i)(j)(k)(l)(m)(n)(n)

Let's say I play this deck and win (hypothetical, I can never beat your freaking decks. ), and so I spin.  The possibility of Bonewall showing in more than one spin is low, but that's the observed behavior of the game.  The same few cards show up throughout all three spins.  If your description were right, we would expect to see three radically different sets of cards more often.  That is to say, I agree with your outcome, but I don't agree with how you got there.

[edit: But at the same time, it can't just pick 5 cards for all three spins, because more than 5 cards can be seen over three spins.  Neither description accurately produces the observed outcome.]

[PuppyChow]

we would expect to see three radically different sets of cards more often.

This is exactly what happens . It's called confirmation bias: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

You see bone wall twice in one set of spins, and your brain is automatically making that stick out and you're forgetting all those times that that doesn't happen.

Either that or it's just the inept flash random doing its thing again.

Oh, and I just played some games vs. AI 5:

Spin 1: Upgraded Vamp Dagger, unupped Vamp Dagger, unupped Vamp Dagger
Spin 2: Black Dragon, Dusk Shield, unupped Vamp Dagger
Spin 3: Liquid Shadow, Devourer, Parasite

Spin 1: Plague, Plague, Boneyard
Spin 2: Graviton Mercenary, Momentum, Graviton Mercenary
Spin 3: Graviton Mercenary, Aflatoxin, Colossal Dragon

Spin 1: Upped Aflatoxin, Aflatoxin, Upped Aflatoxin
Spin 2: Plague, Upped Quintessence, Plague
Spin 3: Virus, Dim Shield, Virus

Spin 1: Black Hole, Black Hole, Black Hole
Spin 2: Upped Momentum, Upped G-Force, Cockatrice
Spin 3: Black Hole, Black Hole, Black Hole

(Poison AI3 - Keep in mind it has a much smaller card pool)
Spin 1: Blue Crawler, Blue Crawler, Poison
Spin 2: Freeze, Arctic Squid, Arctic Squid
Spin 3: Ice Shield, Poison, Ice Shield

In effect, these prove nothing . The fourth game looks odd, but when you consider black hole need only be 1-3 of those slots, it may not be. Also note that we aren't sure of the AI5's exact deck make up so the statistics could go either way anyway.

But I'm almost certain that I'm right.

[PhuzzY LogiK]

Hmmm...you may have a point.  Now that I think about it, I guess I've only been grinding FGs and T50 for a while.  FGs would have absurd numbers of some cards, and T50 are normally lean and focused, so I guess there could be a good chance of it pulling the same card for multiple spins.

Here's a few games I played (T50):
jmizzle7:
1: [can't read my writing--starts with a G]. Earthquake, Earthquake
2: Devourer, Devourer, Devourer
3: Devourer, Fractal, Devourer

CB! had a farm up, so that's not quite fair to put here.

Jangoo:
1: Lobotomizer, Phase Shield, Twin Universe
2: Lobotomizer, Lobotomizer, Phase Shield
3: Phase Shield, Phase Shield, Twin Universe

mightyhat:
1: Nova, Nova, Frost Shield
2: Nova, [Eternity?--another one I can't read], Druid
3: Sundial, Sundial, Oty

Viralsetl:
1: Cockatrice, Fractal, Fractal
2: Cockatrice, Cockatrice, Cockatrice
3: Aether Pillar, Fractal, Aether Pillar

I guess considering the number of cards in the decks and that there are most likely 6 copies of a lot of cards, then 5 new cards could be picked for each spin.  It just felt a little off to me because I see spins like the ones I got for Jangoo's deck a lot (each card in at least two spins).  Anyway, the problem is solved in my mind.  You were correct.

[Chemist]

Actually, it's only four cards per spin -- the code picks five cards from the deck, but the fifth never appears in the slots.

Source?

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,590.0.html

[Kael Hate]

Actually, it's only four cards per spin -- the code picks five cards from the deck, but the fifth never appears in the slots.

Source?

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,590.0.html

Actual step by step walkthrough:

1. Pick a random card in your opponent's deck
2. If it's a pillar, go back to 1
3. Security mechanism (for builds that are composed of pillars only) : if, after 10 random picks, you still get a pillar then keep it
4. Store card in variable card1.
5. Repeat steps 1 to 4, until you have filled 4 variables
6. Now the spinning starts for 3 rounds but you only pick cards in [card1, card2, card3, card4]. This ways, the chances to pick 3 times the same one are much higher.

From this information from the link above it says that it finds the cards then does the spins and nothing about re-choosing cards. Is ChrisKang or the information he is refering to Wrong?

[Chemist]

Actually, it's only four cards per spin -- the code picks five cards from the deck, but the fifth never appears in the slots.

Source?

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,590.0.html

Actual step by step walkthrough:

1. Pick a random card in your opponent's deck
2. If it's a pillar, go back to 1
3. Security mechanism (for builds that are composed of pillars only) : if, after 10 random picks, you still get a pillar then keep it
4. Store card in variable card1.
5. Repeat steps 1 to 4, until you have filled 4 variables
6. Now the spinning starts for 3 rounds but you only pick cards in [card1, card2, card3, card4]. This ways, the chances to pick 3 times the same one are much higher.

From this information from the link above it says that it finds the cards then does the spins and nothing about re-choosing cards. Is ChrisKang or the information he is refering to Wrong?

No. It's a step by step walkthrough of a single spin.