Discussion/Study of Elements of Nature

[Nepycros]

Nepy, I disagree with you. I believe that Darkness is the physical manifestation of selfishness and greed. Darkness does not destroy; it takes, it hides, it manipulates, it corrupts. Darkness is not evil by itself, but its intrinsic nature is detrimental to the order and structure of society, which is why it is often perceived as evil. Darkness is much more complex than Void.

Meanwhile, this is Void:

Sure, the metaphorical definition of Darkness fits this. But this is the natural form of Darkness. DARKNESS HAS NO PHYSICAL PRESENCE. This is the fact of it. In reality, Darkness has no form. It's not a blob, it is not a mystical gas permeating the universe, it is not in any way, a sentient being. It is blank, empty, and lacking of any characteristics aside from the labels given to it. Scientifically, the only presence it carries is its name.

Now, in metaphorical terms, I hate the idea that Darkness automatically means that you are manipulating someone, stealing, hurting, etc. I believe that between Darkness and Light, Darkness is the softer of the two. It keeps your secrets safe, and assures that if you can move with the ebb and flow, you will blend in. Light on the other hand, is the essence of revealing. All your secrets, regrets, wrongdoings, and whatnot are exposed. It may guide the way for several people, but too much of it will blind you, even hurting you.

People often see Darkness as the intruder in a world of light (true from people I have listened to in my area, not sure about other areas) and how it is the embodiment of corruption. Tell me, how can something that doesn't exist corrupt? If anything, Light is the corruption. There was once a world of absolute darkness, and then there was suddenly and element that seemed like its sole purpose was to overwhelm and conquer the Darkness, the 'native' element.

[Wonder]

Whoaa everyone has such solid arguments...
It's true that if you look at Darkness as a personality, it means "bad" in all it's forms.
But the question is, what the heck is Darkness as an Element? I thought it was just when there's absolutely no light or when there's more darkness then there is light.

[Ekki]

Nepy, I disagree with you. I believe that Darkness is the physical manifestation of selfishness and greed. Darkness does not destroy; it takes, it hides, it manipulates, it corrupts. Darkness is not evil by itself, but its intrinsic nature is detrimental to the order and structure of society, which is why it is often perceived as evil. Darkness is much more complex than Void.

Meanwhile, this is Void:

Sure, the metaphorical definition of Darkness fits this. But this is the natural form of Darkness. DARKNESS HAS NO PHYSICAL PRESENCE. This is the fact of it. In reality, Darkness has no form. It's not a blob, it is not a mystical gas permeating the universe, it is not in any way, a sentient being. It is blank, empty, and lacking of any characteristics aside from the labels given to it. Scientifically, the only presence it carries is its name.

Now, in metaphorical terms, I hate the idea that Darkness automatically means that you are manipulating someone, stealing, hurting, etc. I believe that between Darkness and Light, Darkness is the softer of the two. It keeps your secrets safe, and assures that if you can move with the ebb and flow, you will blend in. Light on the other hand, is the essence of revealing. All your secrets, regrets, wrongdoings, and whatnot are exposed. It may guide the way for several people, but too much of it will blind you, even hurting you.

People often see Darkness as the intruder in a world of light (true from people I have listened to in my area, not sure about other areas) and how it is the embodiment of corruption. Tell me, how can something that doesn't exist corrupt? If anything, Light is the corruption. There was once a world of absolute darkness, and then there was suddenly and element that seemed like its sole purpose was to overwhelm and conquer the Darkness, the 'native' element.

Wow, is this getting off topic? It still has something to do with the theme...

Whatever. I guess there are two sides of each element: Good and Evil (they can go in the soul realm along with con and sub*).

Every element can be used with evil purposes or good ones, and they are equally good at both points. The ones that can be better in one of this points are the elementals, but it doesn't mean the element is good or evil.

Just my 2 

*only intended for nepy and BS to understand

EDIT: I recommend starting a thread to discuss this stuff. It's very interesting.

[Wonder]

So how come "Time" is considered an Element?
Isn't time the only sure thing in life? You can't manipulate it (yet).

[Ekki]

So how come "Time" is considered an Element?
Isn't time the only sure thing in life? You can't manipulate it (yet).

Time is a perception. There isn't any place in the universe (apart from the human brain) where what happened in the past is "stored". The future isn't written anywhere, although it can be predicted.
You cannot manipulate it because it only exist as a way of understanding the energy (movement, changes and that stuff).
The universe is what it is now, nothing else (like past/future).

[Nepycros]

Light must have a source. It cannot exist without something to feed it and resonate it within the absolute range that lights can bear.

Darkness is different. It does not need a source. The only way to remove darkness is with either substance or light. However, in this form, you are simply "covering" the darkness with a substantial form. It is still there. When the cover of substance and light is removed, all that is left is darkness. You can't physically take Darkness out of the universe, but it is possible to remove light from the universe. This goes to show that Darkness does not need Light to exist.

So how come "Time" is considered an Element?
Isn't time the only sure thing in life? You can't manipulate it (yet).

Time is duration. Duration meaning the state of an object over a period of existence.

[Bloodshadow]

You're thinking in physical terms, I'm not. I classify Light and Darkness as Spiritual elements instead of Cardinal or Material, because Darkness and Light are born from the sentience and thoughts of living beings. Light symbolizes altruism, while Darkness symbolizes selfishness. Physically Darkness doesn't exist and thus cannot be an element, so I have to think metaphorically.

If I were to think in purely physical terms, then the scientist within me threatens to take over and tells me that Light is a form of electromagnetic radiation, that Fire is simply a chemical reaction, etc. Then I will be painfully reminded that Elements is fantasy, and it cannot possibly exist in the real world. I usually think that Elements is a fantasy setting where the rules are different, so that the logical side of me won't intrude.

[Wonder]

Yeah but there is a continuation of events that happens in everyday life. We just named it "Time". Like for example, if I picked up a water bottle and then put it down. That event happened, and can never be changed. We can't do anything to change it, because it's already in the past. This continuation of events that we call "Time" definitely does exist.

[Nepycros]

You're thinking in physical terms, I'm not. I classify Light and Darkness as Spiritual elements instead of Cardinal or Material, because Darkness and Light are born from the sentience and thoughts of living beings. Light symbolizes altruism, while Darkness symbolizes selfishness. Physically Darkness doesn't exist and thus cannot be an element, so I have to think metaphorically.

If I were to think in purely physical terms, then the scientist within me threatens to take over and tells me that Light is a form of electromagnetic radiation, that Fire is simply a chemical reaction, etc. Then I will be painfully reminded that Elements is fantasy, and it cannot possibly exist in the real world. I usually think that Elements is a fantasy setting where the rules are different, so that the logical side of me won't intrude.

However, this metaphor is only true because our ancestors said it was true. I for one do not see darkness as selfishness. I simply see it as 'lack,' in both terms of science and in personality.

Good and evil, right and wrong, light and darkness, respectively. That is how we see the world. I do not see it this way. Light intruded in the world long ago. It entered a world where it didn't belong, and yet we have the gall to say that it is a form of salvation, guidance, etc, etc. Too much of any one thing is bad. That is true for ALL elements, not just Darkness. Light is the same. In the metaphor, selfishness exists in each element, and is not solely classified to Darkness. If I could, I would rewrite the metaphor. I despise the way we've decided to see the world, and force that perspective on others.

[Ekki]

Yeah but there is a continuation of events that happens in everyday life. We just named it "Time". Like for example, if I picked up a water bottle and then put it down. That event happened, and can never be changed. We can't do anything to change it, because it's already in the past. This continuation of events that we call "Time" definitely does exist.

You know that thing of the tree falling in the woods? Did it make noise if no one heard it? That's the point. We the humans store the past in our memories, but it doesn't remain anywhere else. There is one "time". The bottle is down. If that person forgets about that, how will you be able to know if the bottle has been placed there or it was just there. There are phisical laws, thus we can make predictions, but the future and past don't exist, physically speaking.

[Bloodshadow]

Think about it this way. You have been given the same amount of Light and Darkness. You can hide in that amount of Darkness and do your questionable deeds without being discovered, but that amount of Light will reveal your deed to the world. Sure, Light can blind others if you have too much, but it reveals more than it blinds. There is a reason why people do not usually commit crimes in broad daylight.

@Wonder: If we're discussing Time in purely physical terms, read a bit into quantum theory. Nothing in this universe is truly certain.

[Wonder]

Oh a PHYSICAL representation of Time... right.
Ok I'll see if I can find anything on it Bloodshadow, thanks [: