Nymph Metamorphosis

[willng3]

I'm still hearing the same argument that this idea would make nymphs less special, but I don't understand that logic when the following has already been stated (and well worded I might add):

Let's all just be clear on one point: rarity =/= power.

Nymphs are not uber. Nymphs are not game breakers. Yes they can be strong. But they are subject to CC just like any other creature. Most of the sentiment against making them more fluid is that people will make some uber deck that no one can beat if they don't the have nymphs to counter them. That is not true simply because the game is balanced enough to be able to counter any new deck theme that comes from being able to shift nymphs.

Yes, some people have multiple nypmhs of the same element. Any one here actually fear those people as a direct result of their nymphs? No. It's because those nymphs are not as powerful as many are making them out to be. I agree, nymphs have power. But are they so uber that having multiple of one in a deck makes that deck too powerful? No.

I honestly don't see what is so wrong about allowing shifting of nymphs. It would only open up the metagame and that is only going to lead to better things. There was mention of longevity for the game. By allowing more deck choices you allow for longevity as a result. Anyone with CCG experience knows that the more choices in deck construction people have the more likely those people are to stick around.

I always hear about grinding and how it sucks. The pinnacle of grinding in this game isn't Elder or False Gods. It's logging in every morning to see if you're lucky enough to merit a nymph. I promise you it is easier to grind 2,000,000 score than it is to get 20% of the nymphs.

Again, I'll say it. the nymphs are not so uber that they can't be beaten. Not once has anyone in this thread said there should be more nymphs, only that people that have actually won one should be able to change their nymphs to something they can use. Thus their rarity stays intact, but their useful increases. I see nothing wrong with this in any way shape or form and I hope people opposed to this idea, or similar, see the positive aspects this can bring to the game.

A Nymph is a Nymph, most people with any common sense are ecstatic when they receive a nymph from the Oracle especially when they go (a) month(s) without having received one regardless of what type it is.  So, for someone to say that because I can change any of my nymphs into a different one of my choosing, my nymph is less valuable doesn't make sense to me.  If someone pulls out a nymph in a duel, my first reaction is, "wow, how lucky this player is," not that the card they just played is overpowered, not that they are a better player, and that the nymph is special regardless of what element it is simply because it is a nymph.  As Kuross has already stated, adding nymphs to a deck can give you an advantage in a duel, yes, but in no circumstances does this seal the duel as your win and as such does not change the value of a nymph simply because you can change its element at will.

[Kurohami]

I don't know how people cannot understand how changing the elements of nymphs ruins its value. If this idea is implemented, the max number of nymph people needs would be somewhere around 10, even the craziest duo that operates exclusively on nymph abilities would only need that much. So after you get around 10 nymphs, you can make any nymph deck you want. Any more nymphs you get would just be saving money/rare for the metamorphosis. At that point, a nymph is no longer a nymph, it's just a pile of electrum. As someone said a few pages back, nymph is something that Zanz wanted to be equal for everyone. If you can change nymphs elements with a high cost, that would mean new players has less control over their nymphs than veteran players, if that cost is not high however, you will get the problem I stated above, any nymphs beyond 10 becomes insignificant because you can't get it by transforming others into it. Kuross' argument is of course true, nymphs do not imbalance the game, but they are something designed for us to only be able to hope for but cannot work towards (except in tournaments). Here's an anecdote to express my point in a more dynamic manner:

There is a kind of rare butterfly that flies really high and really fast, people can get a glimpse of it at most, if they are lucky. People were bewildered by their beauty and set out to the forest every week in hope of merely getting a look at it. After a while, some people invented a trap that could lure the butterfly over and traps it. In this fashion, many such butterfly is captured. At first people are overjoyed by the sight of them, but in a very short time all become insensitized and lost interest in it.

The people who are supporting this idea right now are like the people who set the traps, they of course desired the butterfly (nymph) and made the move to grasp for it. What they really did is they destroyed beauty. Some beauty should only be seen from a distance and never truly grasped. Nymphs are designed so we can get a taste of it but cannot easily exploit its full potentials so we will keep hoping and keep exploring (which means going to the oracle). I think I made myself understood better now. So, either one change per account or no change at all. Sir Valimont's suggestion is entirely valid. Since the mark change is free, you don't really need to always use the mark that you want your nymph to be. You just need to change it before going to the oracle. Of course, I'm only saying that his suggestion is valid I'm not saying that I agree with it, in my opinion it doesn't matter really. As for Teffy's argument that people would choose the wrong nymph, well that's up to them. If they decided they want something else the next day they will have to hope that oracle would heed to his plead someday. If their desires are all fulfilled easily, they would get bored quite quick. 1 change per account is a great compromise, it satisfies part of our desires but not once and for all. You don't have to agree with me, I know it's hard to get someone to agree to something they don't believe in even if they do see sense in it. This is just my opinion and I hope it's making sense to all of you.

[willng3]

I don't know how people cannot understand how changing the elements of nymphs ruins its value. If this idea is implemented, the max number of nymph people needs would be somewhere around 10, even the craziest duo that operates exclusively on nymph abilities would only need that much. So after you get around 10 nymphs, you can make any nymph deck you want. Any more nymphs you get would just be saving money/rare for the metamorphosis. At that point, a nymph is no longer a nymph, it's just a pile of electrum. As someone said a few pages back, nymph is something that Zanz wanted to be equal for everyone. If you can change nymphs elements with a high cost, that would mean new players has less control over their nymphs than veteran players, if that cost is not high however, you will get the problem I stated above, any nymphs beyond 10 becomes insignificant because you can't get it by transforming others into it. Kuross' argument is of course true, nymphs do not imbalance the game, but they are something designed for us to only be able to hope for but cannot work towards (except in tournaments). Here's an anecdote to express my point in a more dynamic manner:

There is a kind of rare butterfly that flies really high and really fast, people can get a glimpse of it at most, if they are lucky. People were bewildered by their beauty and set out to the forest every week in hope of merely getting a look at it. After a while, some people invented a trap that could lure the butterfly over and traps it. In this fashion, many such butterfly is captured. At first people are overjoyed by the sight of them, but in a very short time all become insensitized and lost interest in it.

The people who are supporting this idea right now are like the people who set the traps, they of course desired the butterfly (nymph) and made the move to grasp for it. What they really did is they destroyed beauty. Some beauty should only be seen from a distance and never truly grasped. Nymphs are designed so we can get a taste of it but cannot easily exploit its full potentials so we will keep hoping and keep exploring (which means going to the oracle). I think I made myself understood better now. So, either one change per account or no change at all. Sir Valimont's suggestion is entirely valid. Since the mark change is free, you don't really need to always use the mark that you want your nymph to be. You just need to change it before going to the oracle. Of course, I'm only saying that his suggestion is valid I'm not saying that I agree with it, in my opinion it doesn't matter really. As for Teffy's argument that people would choose the wrong nymph, well that's up to them. If they decided they want something else the next day they will have to hope that oracle would heed to his plead someday. If their desires are all fulfilled easily, they would get bored quite quick. 1 change per account is a great compromise, it satisfies part of our desires but not once and for all. You don't have to agree with me, I know it's hard to get someone to agree to something they don't believe in even if they do see sense in it. This is just my opinion and I hope it's making sense to all of you.

It does indeed.  I can't say I've ever been so greatly swayed by an argument before.  I understood all of this beforehand, but didn't consider it that great of an impact because I did not fully understand the equality instilled by the system set up at the moment.  Perhaps it was your butterfly example, it hit home for my own personal reasons and I now realize the gap this could create between new and veteran players.  While the metamorphosis is an interesting idea, yes, the restrictions for enabling such an action should be higher.

[EmeraldTiger]

I chose other because I would like to stay neutral to this debate
IMO they are all very useful;
  strong attack ability cost same as upped quint(pricey but useful)

  best in  deck but u can set UGs out wait for the right moment then bam! WIN!

  use the infection effect or vampire effect to your advantage or both

  works good in life/death decks preferably use ability on skeleton have e-bond out, EM possible

  Use to stall or strengthen. can also used with rage potion or with gravity shield
 
  We All know causing our opponent to heal us is a great thing

  the ability here can be a weapon or a tool

  "mmm tasty quantums I feel better"  enough said

  "Wow, that was fast" 

  strong and works well mono light, light/life, light/life/air

  strong plus the advantage of knowing your opponents hand and drawing a card
 
  the ability to create any of the others in the right deck is very powerful

[Ryli]

I strongly disagree with the ability to change nymphs.
I don't think I need to say anymore as my opinion has already been given in other posts.