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Offline TribalTrouble

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059378#msg1059378
« Reply #48 on: April 13, 2013, 02:04:17 am »
I will try to make it simple for you too, Marsu. What you are saying is:
1. Game is bad. [...]

Lol. If you do not understand my posts, please refrain from trying to sum them up.
This.

You need to consider his points, rather than just go 'yeah... no.'

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059412#msg1059412
« Reply #49 on: April 13, 2013, 04:50:43 am »
This thread makes me sad and angry.
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Offline eaglgenes101

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059417#msg1059417
« Reply #50 on: April 13, 2013, 05:06:10 am »
I'd rather just convince Zanz to release the source code.
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Offline Marvaddin

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059433#msg1059433
« Reply #51 on: April 13, 2013, 08:04:29 am »
I will try to make it simple for you too, Marsu. What you are saying is:
1. Game is bad. [...]

Lol. If you do not understand my posts, please refrain from trying to sum them up.
This.

You need to consider his points, rather than just go 'yeah... no.'

Sure I will. Maybe you can clarify his points to me. Because this is what I understood:

1. 90% of the players can barely beat AI3 with their crap decks, and their motivation to farm is "meh". > So, game is bad for these people.

2. If these people hear about how its possible to buy electrum, their motivation will change to "ok, f*** this" and they quit. > the game changed nothing for them, they will quit because... some people use real money to enjoy the game instead of grinding. This makes no sense to me.

Seriously, what did I miss? People that really dont enjoy the game will quit because other people pay to have fun. If theres something else which is relevant, please, lets talk about it.

Offline BlazeTopic starter

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059510#msg1059510
« Reply #52 on: April 13, 2013, 05:25:36 pm »
Hey all! Loving watching the discussion, although I don't have a lot to say on it right now.

Something I've been noticing within the thread that I would rather avoid is people talking about their personal feelings. So, I request that you don't talk about how you feel about what's going on. If changes actually start occurring there will be polls for you to say what you like and don't like, and even discussions for that. But right now is a time for brainstorming, and trying to make the game better. If you don't like something, say why you don't like it, not simply that you don't like it. We need debatable points from you so that you can actually change something! Thank you!!!

I also still have not gotten in touch with Zanz, in my understanding the elements the game email doesn't actually go to him, but to an admin on the forums. Please help! Thank you!

Offline TribalTrouble

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059517#msg1059517
« Reply #53 on: April 13, 2013, 05:49:32 pm »
Quote
Something I've been noticing within the thread that I would rather avoid is people talking about their personal feelings. So, I request that you don't talk about how you feel about what's going on
Quote
If you don't like something, say why you don't like it
Conflicting much?

And honestly, nothing is going on, except that you are throwing out bad ideas that have been shot down before. We have told you that we don't like this because it makes the game have something that veterans don't like. Giving people that have yet to grind their way through the game a bonus, an easier way to grind, or even making it so that they don't have to grind, while there are lots of people that worked their butts off grinding to where they are now. Is that fair? No. Do people want that? Not really. Do noobs want that? Probably. Do people that play the game actively right now want that? Nope. 3 No's 1 Maybe. You do the math. Thanks.

Offline BlazeTopic starter

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059526#msg1059526
« Reply #54 on: April 13, 2013, 06:29:16 pm »
The vets who have 12 of every card, I.E. the people for whom a bonus would not help, are very few. There are about thirty five of them as I recall. So that's thirty five people out of probably 20,000 players who wouldn't benefit from it...

Quote
Something I've been noticing within the thread that I would rather avoid is people talking about their personal feelings. So, I request that you don't talk about how you feel about what's going on
Quote
If you don't like something, say why you don't like it
Conflicting much?

And honestly, nothing is going on, except that you are throwing out bad ideas that have been shot down before. We have told you that we don't like this because it makes the game have something that veterans don't like. Giving people that have yet to grind their way through the game a bonus, an easier way to grind, or even making it so that they don't have to grind, while there are lots of people that worked their butts off grinding to where they are now. Is that fair? No. Do people want that? Not really. Do noobs want that? Probably. Do people that play the game actively right now want that? Nope. 3 No's 1 Maybe. You do the math. Thanks.

Offline TribalTrouble

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059545#msg1059545
« Reply #55 on: April 13, 2013, 06:51:08 pm »
Personally, I might be able to benefit from it, but very minimally as I have almost every card that I want. And you fail to consider that if you speed up the pace of people getting the cards then what goal is there for people? What is the purpose of rewards from pvp tournies after you have them all? Electrum will be no suitable reward for those that buy their cards with money. The point at which the player has no reason to continue playing is  reached far faster through your proposal than through the current way of things. The community dies off faster with your proposal. As of right now the community stays about the same in terms of the # of players.

Also, I personally am not sure whether you aren't just trying to troll us or if you are actually serious considering how you don't fully address a reply with anything more than 2-3 lines. And when you do reply with more, it seems very much like a troll to me.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2013, 06:52:57 pm by TribalTrouble »

Offline Marvaddin

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059720#msg1059720
« Reply #56 on: April 14, 2013, 04:03:57 am »
Giving people that have yet to grind their way through the game a bonus, an easier way to grind, or even making it so that they don't have to grind, while there are lots of people that worked their butts off grinding to where they are now. Is that fair? No. Do people want that? Not really. Do noobs want that? Probably. Do people that play the game actively right now want that? Nope. 3 No's 1 Maybe. You do the math. Thanks.

Mate, whats the difference between "Do people want that?" and "Do people that play the game actively right now want that?"? These seem a bit redundant to me. And if you say no, you are answering it with your opinion. Im one of these veterans, and if this helps the game to get more content, I really want it to become real.

And you fail to consider that if you speed up the pace of people getting the cards then what goal is there for people? (...) The point at which the player has no reason to continue playing is reached far faster through your proposal than through the current way of things. The community dies off faster with your proposal. As of right now the community stays about the same in terms of the # of players.

1st, I would like to point that, if there is a 20% discount to buy / upgrade cards, which is what Blaze suggested, you would still have 80% of the current amount of grinding, which IS A LOT of grinding (in fact, this is a reason to me dislike his suggestion). Like I said, I play EtG for like 3 years, and even if I use 500K electrum I have stored, I would still have 68% of the trainer collection upgraded.

2nd, I would like to say that, if premium content is added, OBVIOUSLY we will have more content added frequently. More cards for upgrading, if you really love ginding, at least (this also means more sinergies, and more decks to try). And possibly more quests, more AI levels, guild quests, etc, so (I hope) grinding wouldnt to be needed as a goal.

3rd, if more content is added, if there are more things to do, and if people can use good decks easily (instead of farm AI3 using a crap deck that barely can defeat them, get 9k and upgrade 6 photons to still be destroyed for most FGs), I think a lot of people could ENJOY and STICK with the game.

Sincerely, I dont understand why you guys think this would "kill the game". Its already dead. What can be worse than 1 update per year? Oh, surely, 1 update each 2 years, probably our next step to  :death



Blaze, I really dont see you as a troll. And I dont remember all these ideas being shot down. But I have seen a poll that was later removed, about a feature that gives a 20% discount to buy and upgraded cards. If I remember correctly, you were also talking about a bonus of 50k electrum when the feature is bought for the 1st time. This really looks a bad idea. People would buy the feature 1 month, upgraded a good grinder deck, grind for 1 month, do a massive upgrade before it expires, and them buy again months later, for another massive upgrade. I will never say theres little grind left to do, but this product is just... not good enough. I still prefer a total trainer collection, which is much more interesting to keep, and I think that offering a complete product is more, hmm, elegant.

About contacting Zanzarino, lol, looks stupid to say, but... did you try sending him a PM? Or did you ask in Elements forum on Kongregate if someone knows his e-mail? I also did a small google search. There is a website, zanzarino.net, where there is an email option (dunno if its updated, because elements link there goes to 1.0 version, which doesnt load, with old forum and wiki links. You can also check facebook. Curiously, I thought EtG was hosted just by kongregate, but its also hosted by a poor site called kanogames.com.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2013, 05:31:04 am by Marvaddin »

Offline TribalTrouble

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059727#msg1059727
« Reply #57 on: April 14, 2013, 04:19:39 am »
he can't be sent PMs.

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059804#msg1059804
« Reply #58 on: April 14, 2013, 01:49:14 pm »
2nd, I would like to say that, if premium content is added, OBVIOUSLY we will have more content added frequently. More cards for upgrading, if you really love ginding, at least (this also means more sinergies, and more decks to try). And possibly more quests, more AI levels, guild quests, etc, so (I hope) grinding wouldnt to be needed as a goal.
I do not consider that obvious. EtG is Zanz's hobby and portfolio. Zanz works on EtG when he wants to. It is not a job such that we could raise the revenue and demand more hours.

I see some benefits to an alternate reality where EtG had a premium content option. However I reiterate that we need to be in the mindset of "it is Zanz's to do as he wants and we are our's to do as we want".

I would also add that I would not trust a commercial interest to be in charge of balancing and improving a game. MtG does an acceptably poor job at creating a card game. EtG has exceeded that quality so far (measuring relatively).
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Offline Marvaddin

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Re: More money for Zanz and more updates for us! https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=48416.msg1059831#msg1059831
« Reply #59 on: April 14, 2013, 04:02:26 pm »
Well, this is what we are talking about, read the thread title. How to increase revenue to the point EtG becomes main project for Zanz, or a regular staff can be hired.

Of course, I agree that commercial interest is not related to balancing  / improving. I used to play MtG some years ago, and I think they do a good work, but of course 80% of new cards launched are just to fill the booster packs people buy looking for the good ones, exactly like online games (Tyrant, for example). But there is no way to compare MtG and EtG. They create a new 200+ card set every 3 months, while we could have like 3-4 cards per month? Balancing is always an issue here, even more because of our limited card base.

 

anything
blarg: