Mark of Other

[stinky472]

This is an old idea I had when pendulums were introduced, and since then I haven't played the game so much. I doubt it's a very original idea but I haven't been able to find it in the forums including the thread for new ways to generate quantums in the card ideas section.

Anyway, the idea is very simple: a Mark of Other that generates 3 random quanta per turn (equivalent to a quantum pillar). I think this would synergize very well with pendulums which can then allow for new types of decks based on "lopsided" rainbows; rainbows which are predominantly focused on one particular element, even though both the mark and pendulums (on every other turn) generates some random quanta as well.

For example, one might choose this Mark of Other combined with Light Pendulums to create a deck that's predominantly a light deck but allows crusaders to effectively use weapons abilities and to allow Pegasus to do the occasional dive.

Of course, as with any other change like this, there is a potential for new type of OP decks to be created. Still the idea is very interesting, I think, particular when considering how this would interact with pendulums.

If we look at elements like water, chrysaora needs death for poison, toadfish needs air for inflate, mindflayer needs aether for lobotomize, steam machine needs fire to gain charges, trident needs earth for tsunami.. already a lot of deck ideas making use of various water cards will have no choice but to become duo/trio/rainbow decks... But this Mark of Other, combined with water pendulums, could allow one to make use of a lot of water elements while still predominantly generating water quanta.

[dragonsdemesne]

I think this is a cool idea.  It would help a few decks out, and I don't think it would be all that overpowered (since it compares directly with quantum pillar), though if it turned out it was, it could be reduced to 2 random quanta.  Also, as you say, it would make more decks possible via pendulums, an d having more deck possibilities is always a good thing, as it helps the game grow, and this is an awfully simple way to make it happen.

[pikachufan2164]

I don't think that will be happening ever because the Quantum Towers/Pillars are elementals. The reason you have a mark is because it represents you as your Element, since we all play as Elementals in the game. Just three random quantum isn't an element.

[OldTrees]

No. It would be against the theme of Marks. Marks represent the elemental nature of the Elemental the player is representing. Elementals have 1 nature not 12.

A Quantum Pendulum suggestion is currently in the Armory. A Quantum Pendulum with a Water mark would work almost identical to a Water Pendulum and an Other "Mark".

Yes, a Quantum Pendulum instead of an Other "Mark" is a more appropriate change.

[stinky472]

A quantum pendulum is a very interesting idea. I'm sorry, I missed that one. I suppose that definitely does go better with the theme of elementals, though 'Other' could be like 'Multi' if the wording better fits the theme. I do like the idea of a quantum pendulum from the standpoint that upgrading it would provide a much more general-purpose card than pendulums of a specific element combined with like a 'Multi' or 'Other' mark and therefore much cheaper overall to get everything upgraded for a particular deck of that type.

As a counterargument though, having a mark which has the same effect as a quantum pillar might also help produce interesting ideas for balanced rainbows: rainbows that really don't favor one specific element over the other. Choosing a mark in those cases often ends up favoring entropy for the supernovas or time for the hourglasses, but a 'rainbow mark' might yield some fresh deck ideas for rainbows that don't need to favor one specific elemental mark over another. I think it's also interesting in the sense that even if all pendulums or pillars/towers are destroyed, then the mark will still have the effect of generating 3 random quanta per turn.

One might even explore pillarless deck ideas based on super cheap elemental cards that don't require any quantum pillars, but need a steady supply of quanta for skills (not enough to work just on novas or supernovas alone). It has some interesting potentials I think that a quantum pendulum might not provide, though I really like both ideas.

[OldTrees]

As a counterargument though, having a mark which has the same effect as a quantum pillar might also help produce interesting ideas for balanced rainbows: rainbows that really don't favor one specific element over the other. Choosing a mark in those cases often ends up favoring entropy for the supernovas or time for the hourglasses, but a 'rainbow mark' might yield some fresh deck ideas for rainbows that don't need to favor one specific elemental mark over another. I think it's also interesting in the sense that even if all pendulums or pillars/towers are destroyed, then the mark will still have the effect of generating 3 random quanta per turn.

Rainbows are the decks that are the least likely to benefit from changing their mark to a random quanta generator. They already have a sufficient supply of  that they can dip into an element like  or  to gain an additional advantage.

One might even explore pillarless deck ideas based on super cheap elemental cards that don't require any quantum pillars, but need a steady supply of quanta for skills (not enough to work just on novas or supernovas alone). It has some interesting potentials I think that a quantum pendulum might not provide, though I really like both ideas.

Creature only decks exist. You might want to try one in the trainer.

[stinky472]

Pillarless decks like certain speedbows tend to favor racking out damage quickly, not continuous control since they tend to rely on novas/supernovas/immolation/cremation: they have no steady source of random quanta so they make up for it by  not needing much and making good and balanced use of all elements.

A rainbow kind of mark could encourage pillarless decks to be designed which can assume a small but steady supply of random quanta. It has a bit more potential I think in opening up doors for new deck designs and that's really the whole point of the idea: to open up ideas for new kinds of decks.

Take your standard pillarless immolation deck. Obviously that's going to be using fire more than anything, but the quanta given by various elements is a bit too small to do anything but have a few one-shot cards (cheap spells/creatures/perms), certainly not cards using other elements that requires a continuous stream of quanta. If we include golems in the equation, we might choose earth. But what if we had a random quanta mark? Suddenly we might have more interesting routes to explore like, say, parasite, which is maybe a bit iffy if we can't steadily stream death quanta as would be the case for a pillarless deck.

Or just put it this way: why do pillarless decks have to generally be designed to be speed decks? What prevents the effectiveness of designs of a pillarless, slow, stalling, control-oriented rainbow that makes continuous but sparse use of various elements? I think at least a big part for this is that they're pillarless and there's no other way to generate random quanta of various elements other than by including pillars or pendulums into the design.

[OldTrees]

Or just put it this way: why do pillarless decks have to generally be designed to be speed decks? What prevents the effectiveness of designs of a pillarless, slow, stalling, control-oriented rainbow that makes continuous but sparse use of various elements? I think at least a big part for this is that they're pillarless and there's no other way to generate random quanta of various elements other than by including pillars or pendulums into the design.

Balance. If you do not invest in quanta production then you will not obtain enough quanta to sustain a stall deck. It is not about the variety but rather about the quantity that is prohibitive of such an archetype.

1 Quantum Tower cannot sustain a stallbow. A pillarless deck with an other "mark" would have less quanta than that.
Supernova and Immolation produce quanta quickly but are balanced by providing too little for a sustained fight.

To make a competent pillarless stallbow you would need a non pillar quanta producer that was slower initially but faster in the long run than Quantum Towers.

[stinky472]

Fair enough! All right, cheers to the quantum pendulums idea. 

[Shylderidh]

Or just put it this way: why do pillarless decks have to generally be designed to be speed decks? What prevents the effectiveness of designs of a pillarless, slow, stalling, control-oriented rainbow that makes continuous but sparse use of various elements?

It's actually possible to make pilarless bone wall stales that work very well in unupgraded pvp. But you need another source of quantum than immo/nova (soul catchers).

(for example 3 novas, 6 immo, 5 photon, 4 soul catchers, 3 bone wall, 2 rain of fire, 2 arsenic, 2 lycanthrope, 1 forest scorpion, 1 graboid, 1 phoenix, 2 chrysaora, 1 lightning)