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Offline Essence

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg49952#msg49952
« Reply #36 on: April 07, 2010, 11:34:06 pm »
madikowen: +Karma for the best use of super/subscript on the forums.

HobNob: +Karma for "happy quitting!".  Best line of the thread.

Jangoo: +Karma for suggesting -Karma on the OP.  That's what it's for.

Pyros For Porno: -Karma for everything that Jangoo mentioned.

SG: +Karma for being right.


My commentary:

I think PvP is the solution to grinding, and it's actually pretty easy to accomplish -- but it takes a single radical step that will be hard to talk Zanz into taking. :)

PvP ought to have rewards that rise as your skill level rises -- the easiest way to do that is to allow upgraded cards to appear in PvP slots.  That immediately causes a huge theoretical problem: people who get into PvP and deliberately lose in order to give their opponents upgraded cards.  But so long as the score changes dramatically when a high-caliber player is beaten by a nooby opponent, I think it's going to be OK.  People who are getting close to the t50 guard their score jealously, and they won't want to fall out of the t50 by giving away massive score points along with upgraded cards.

"But that would completely alter the balance of the endgame!" -- Yes, yes it would.  FGs would become places for sufficiently skilled players to grind away to win upgraded cards 66%+ of the time, which would be significantly more than PvP, because 70% of PvP players would be unupgraded mid-range players looking to win upgraded cards off of non-FG but skilled players.  The FGs would still totally be the endgame, but PvP would become a valuable activity for all levels of gameplay. (Moreso if there is an option to 'narrow the field' and only play other players with your score +/- 1000 points or something.)
If something happens and you think it deserves my attention, feel free to PM me. Other than that, I'm probably here if you want to shoot the breeze.

PuppyChow

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg49964#msg49964
« Reply #37 on: April 07, 2010, 11:58:53 pm »
Quote
Jangoo: +Karma for suggesting -Karma on the OP.  That's what it's for.

Pyros For Porno: -Karma for everything that Jangoo mentioned.
Jangoo was pretty much taking Pyros's side, I think. Unless I missed something. He was being sarcastic. Unless I missed something.

Anyway, I want some karma. Pyros, you suck. Can I have karma now?

Offline killsdazombies

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg49980#msg49980
« Reply #38 on: April 08, 2010, 12:22:20 am »
sure
but -1 karma for being greedy!!!

Offline Jangoo

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50036#msg50036
« Reply #39 on: April 08, 2010, 02:06:09 am »

Quote from: Essence
Jangoo: +Karma for suggesting -Karma on the OP.  That's what it's for.

Pyros For Porno: -Karma for everything that Jangoo mentioned.
Jangoo was pretty much taking Pyros's side, I think. Unless I missed something. He was being sarcastic. Unless I missed something.
True that ... but from how I perceive Essence he got all that and still hands out Karma ... probably because he works on multiple levels here. :))

Anyways, the Karma-system blows majorly, hence for Pyros:

+ [as much Karma as needed to bring you up to 0 again over the next couple days]
for stating an honest and well deserved opinion even if this may be totally contrary to that of a dominating elite of posters in this forum and even if your expression of that opinion may seem a bit too blunt in the eyes of the abovementioned elite.  :P


Offline killsdazombies

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50038#msg50038
« Reply #40 on: April 08, 2010, 02:12:00 am »
 :o + karma for a rant? idk i dont really like how hes saying it, i agree on grinding but as they say in south park
"If you dont like it then you can giiiieeeetttt out"

Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50067#msg50067
« Reply #41 on: April 08, 2010, 03:28:49 am »
Nice, negative karma for starting a thread about my dislike for grinding and my own opinions on whether or not is necessary.  Negative karma for constructive criticism and ideas to fix things...?
Anyways I'm done with the forum, no point in trying to express opinions to children with power/hostility issues.

Offline killsdazombies

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50070#msg50070
« Reply #42 on: April 08, 2010, 03:33:05 am »
OOOOOKKKKK i didnt give - karma because of anything but idc if you want to be a quiter go ahead

Offline Kamietsu

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50071#msg50071
« Reply #43 on: April 08, 2010, 03:33:12 am »
Nice, negative karma for starting a thread about my dislike for grinding and my own opinions on whether or not is necessary.  Negative karma for constructive criticism and ideas to fix things...?
Anyways I'm done with the forum, no point in trying to express opinions to children with power/hostility issues.
Well you sank to name calling, makes you no better than anyone else in this forum. Bye ^_^
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PuppyChow

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50090#msg50090
« Reply #44 on: April 08, 2010, 04:21:59 am »
I didn't like your name anyway  8).

No really, don't go. I agree. Grind = Too long for newbies. Once you get an upgraded rainbow, it isn't, but to get there is way too long. AKA, make it easier for newbies.

Hobnob5000

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50208#msg50208
« Reply #45 on: April 08, 2010, 01:06:27 pm »
Has this turned into a Karma-fest? There's so much Karma flying everywhere now :L

Seravy

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50212#msg50212
« Reply #46 on: April 08, 2010, 01:43:37 pm »
Quote
You complain about grinding, how it takes too long, and then you complain about how easy it is to get rares. Who's side are you on?
No one's side, I want this game to be better. Winning 7 Discords/Eternities/whatever in a single night and calling them rare is ridiculous, having to spend 1-2 hours for getting a single upgraded card is too. Both should be fixed.

Quote
If you auto-quit every FG that has some decent challenge in it, you're missing out on half the game.
That's exactly the problem with grinding. You DON"T have time to have fun, because that would mean becoming even less efficient and delaying the point when you have your deck ready even further. Same with PVP. You are forced to chose between grinding or having fun, you can't do both. If you could, I wouldn't complain.
It already takes like 20-30 hours to make a new deck, if you waste time on games where you have a 10% chance to win, that would go up to like 50-100 hours or more.
(And yes, I've beaten Rainbow with my rainbow deck, I've even beaten Dark Matter. However, winning against them isn't a "Challenge" it's purely about luck. A real challenge means fighting against a better player, not against a brain dead one that only knows how to cheat by drawing twice the normal amount of cards.  It's about as reasonable as participating in Forma 1 using a bicycle and calling it "challenging".
I have no problem with losing due to playing mistakes, but losing because the opponent doesn't play fair IS A PROBLEM, even if it is just the AI.

Quote
Switching deck marks may be quite a hefty cost, but if you grind for more than 5-10 minutes, you should already be able to afford the new mark. Grinding level 3s should take 1 minute per game, and you'll get on average 18-19 quantum per game, depending on how well you do and how good the deck is. Thats not too long is it?
Let's say I want to have fun and play a few PVP games for 10-20-30 minutes. I have to switch decks to do so. Compared to that, having to farm another 20 minutes to get back the cost IS TOO LONG. As I don't get money from PVP, keeping my PVP deck on for a long period of time isn't really possible...because I can't get cards without money.
(I don't grind lv3s, I only grind false gods. Lv3s are even slower....)

Quote
Sorry, but the games hardest difficulty isn't exactly meant to be easy.
Is there any other game where the ONLY reasonable source of money is playing the HARDEST difficulty? No there isn't. Hardest difficulty is meant as a challenge, which you only take every once in the while, not the main, and only way of playing the game.
And no, endgame doesn't equal hardest difficulty. The difficulty level isn't supposed to increase as the game progresses, it should be the same, with OPTIONAL, harder modes and the like. False gods are not optional, they are the only good source of income in the game.

Quote
PvP ought to have rewards that rise as your skill level rises -- the easiest way to do that is to allow upgraded cards to appear in PvP slots.
That's the key. Do that and people already having a decent deck can just play PVP and build their new decks that way. Don't do that and people will keep grinding instead of having fun, and will quit sooner or later.

Scaredgirl

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Re: Is this farmville or what??? https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4911.msg50215#msg50215
« Reply #47 on: April 08, 2010, 01:49:37 pm »
Here's a free tip for anyone who wants to discuss about grinding in Elements:

Try to make your point in a constructive and adult way.

When we start seeing unnecessary nerd rage and name calling, it only leads to flaming and threads being closed.



Thread closed.

 

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