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SniperElit

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg278443#msg278443
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2011, 04:38:36 pm »
Lets add this on the list with the Cloacking animation idea. Good idea!

Offline Bieber4Ever98

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg280241#msg280241
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2011, 08:07:06 am »
Obviously, this should be at top priority for visual fixes for zanzarino. It is a really huge improvement for elements if it has a more simple and reliable interface.
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Offline Ekki

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg280243#msg280243
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2011, 08:24:35 am »
Wait. If you implement this, then Miracle would be unbeatable with Liquid Antimatter  :'(

Just a thought, this may be troubling even after the "fix". With Antimatter you would see the yellow bar as if you would survive, and then you're killed because the -15|2 Crismon Dragon was the last card to attack. I guess that's why AM was never fixed.

Now that I think it, I would take off the yellow bar, or maybe leave it the way it is since I0m so used to see it :D

Offline NewbiecakeTopic starter

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg280374#msg280374
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2011, 05:27:45 pm »
Wait. If you implement this, then Miracle would be unbeatable with Liquid Antimatter  :'(

Just a thought, this may be troubling even after the "fix". With Antimatter you would see the yellow bar as if you would survive, and then you're killed because the -15|2 Crismon Dragon was the last card to attack. I guess that's why AM was never fixed.

Now that I think it, I would take off the yellow bar, or maybe leave it the way it is since I0m so used to see it :D
Keep in mind, this is a VISUALS fix. AI can still be made to think that Antimatter + Liquid Shadow is harmless to them. That goes for Momentum as well. This visuals fix won't affect AI.
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Offline Ekki

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg280426#msg280426
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2011, 08:03:43 pm »
Keep in mind, this is a VISUALS fix. AI can still be made to think that Antimatter + Liquid Shadow is harmless to them. That goes for Momentum as well. This visuals fix won't affect AI.
Yeah, you're right, but I don't think making that is the way to go. The AI should be improved one way or another, and skipping an improvement just for easier FG's is bad. Even though if this is fixed the AI can be reworked to be a tad bit easier...

Whatever, I still think this will be hard to fix, specially the antimatter stuff.

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg280487#msg280487
« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2011, 10:03:20 pm »
It'd be cool if the damage bar turned red when the damage would be lethal.

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg280500#msg280500
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2011, 10:19:33 pm »
It'd be cool if the damage bar turned red when the damage would be lethal.
Yes, after how certain shields, Momentum, Antimatter, etc are fixed, that would be a cool idea. If it's not fixed and that is added that, then players will go WTF if they die when the damage potential bar has not yet turned red.
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Offline Chemist

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg282039#msg282039
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2011, 12:09:00 am »
I've given a bit of thought to how exactly a damage bar would look when "done right".

I say that instead of the current, single, yellow damage indicator there would need to be several. A yellow colored part of the bar to display minimum damage expected to be dealt next turn with what's out on the field (that's zero versus dusk mantle * ), along with an orange colored part which showed the maximum possible damage with what's on the field (this would show damage dealt if the dusk mantle let everything through). On your own bar (and not the opponent's) the orange part would also assume that all your defenses are going to be deflagrated next turn (because I *like* seeing how much damage I'll take if my phase shield gets destroyed). If the next turn's attacks would score a kill (at any point of the attack *) in the orange scenario, then the orange part of the bar would turn red. If they'd also suffice in the yellow scenario, then the entire remaining health would turn red. Finally there'd need to be two more colors (perhaps orange->pink , yellow ->white) for the cases where a side would or could end up with more health than they have now.

Now, let me also explain why I think this is never going to happen. The only way to do these estimates properly would be to simulate the next two entire attacks in advance. There's simply no better way of telling whether those antimattered creatures will keep someone alive or not (it comes down to turn order), as well as correctly account for, say, voodoo doll poison counters. And with simulation there comes great CPU usage... and it'd have to be done over every time something happens to a creature on the field. Zanz is taking care to have the code working fast, so a perfect damage potential bar can't really be made for this game.

I for one say that if it can't be made to work "as it should" anyway, then what's wrong with what we have?

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg282072#msg282072
« Reply #20 on: March 03, 2011, 12:42:07 am »
Maybe this would be too laggy, but maybe the AI could quickly calculate the damage that would go through, without sending the damage through? E.G, there is a yellow bar that represents your current health.  On top of it, there is a green bar that represents the health you would have if your turn ended right then.  When your turn starts, the AI quickly calculates damage.  As new creatures are played, the green bar shrinks.

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg282075#msg282075
« Reply #21 on: March 03, 2011, 12:45:08 am »
No no no. I think it is great the way it is. I would not want to add up the damages to figure out if I need to place another phase shield. That is just one example. There are many other reasons to keep it as is too.

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg282113#msg282113
« Reply #22 on: March 03, 2011, 01:48:54 am »
I would prefer it if there was just a simple yellow bar showing nonlethal damage and it turned all red for lethal damage there was an option for simple yellow and red, and an option for in-depth damage analysis with different colors for poison, antimatter, creatures, healing permanents, and untouched health.

Nothing that has to do with hands, though, like PU and miracle possibilities. That would be unfair.

The complex damage would have to have some explanation, so maybe this isn't the best idea...

Edit: The calculation would count a 0 counter sundial or dmensional shield as nonexistent.

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Re: Damage potential bar https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=21503.msg282137#msg282137
« Reply #23 on: March 03, 2011, 02:17:10 am »
Nothing that has to do with hands, though, like PU and miracle possibilities. That would be unfair.
That would be TOO complicated, and not even neccesary.

I think it should have an UI option of toggling "complex damage potential bar", with red/orange/blue/light blue and that stuff showing whatever could happen and with timer (?), and the other one, the simple one, like now, but with Antimatter, Adrenaline and taking in account Shielding and Momentumed creatures.

Edit: The calculation would count a 0 counter sundial or dmensional shield as nonexistent.
If the shield can blocks, it won't show the damage, if it blocks, it shows the damage, that simple. Maybe the Dimmensional shield should be destroyed after your enemie's last attack, but that's a minor tweak.

 

blarg: