Elements RPG! Part 3

[Bloodshadow]

Hell was invaded afterwards during a conflict between the two realms during the First Golden Age, and at that time, the strength of Heaven was so mighty that it was victorious, and a Protectorate of Heaven was actually established in Hell, lasting until the end of the Age. Provided this historical background, I can understand why Bloodshadow would have grievances with Emparael.

During the First Golden Age, after conquering Hell and becoming the Supreme Archlord, Bloodshadow was appointed Master of Darkness by Zanzarino. According to my definition, Masters are gods, so Bloodshadow is no longer allowed to interfere in worldly affairs. Thus, he had no choice but to watch when Hell was invaded. He could have killed Emparael, but he was not allowed ("I should have snuffed you out like a candle when I had the chance"). I believe that this fits quite nicely with your proposed history, and it would explain Bloodshadow's enmity toward Heaven.

However, I don't think Heaven was victorious in that conflict. Remember, at that time Hell was ruled by the Ancient Ones, monstrously powerful uberdemons. I believe that the battle couldn't have ended in anything but heavy casualties on both sides.

Also, if Bloodshadow is approximately equivalent to Emparael's regular form presently, I do not think the true form of the Archangel will be warranted; I would rather use that when true warfare occurs.

Emparael should use his True Form of the Archangel when I start writing in this red text; that is, when Bloodshadow uses his second dragon form, at approximately 62.5% of his full maximum power as the God of Darkness.

Human Form (1%) -> Demonic Form (5%) -> Masked Form (12.5%) -> Archfiend Form (25%) -> Half-Dragon Form (37.5%) -> First Dragon Form (50%) -> Second Dragon Form (62.5%) -> Devilord Bloodshadow (75% - 87.5%) -> God of Darkness (100%)

Also, at 100% power Jonathan/Bloodshadow will take a humanoid form of the One Winged Devil, my avatar.

[Helios]

Hell was invaded afterwards during a conflict between the two realms during the First Golden Age, and at that time, the strength of Heaven was so mighty that it was victorious, and a Protectorate of Heaven was actually established in Hell, lasting until the end of the Age. Provided this historical background, I can understand why Bloodshadow would have grievances with Emparael.

According to my definition, Masters are gods, so Bloodshadow is no longer allowed to interfere in worldly affairs. Thus, he had no choice but to watch when Hell was invaded. He could have killed Emparael, but he was not allowed ("I should have snuffed you out like a candle when I had the chance").

This equals godmodding, without further explanation necessary. If Bloodshadow is actually a god who can kill Emparael on his slightest whim, then I think the duel between them is completely pointless.

Rather, I will simply create a "god" character, and then we can stage a fun little duel

Incidentally, though I do not underestimate the power of the Ancient Ones, the name of that time period is "Heaven's First Golden Age" for very good reasons; not even the Ancient Ones could have stood against Heaven, even though casaulties on both sides would have been horrendous by present standards.

[Bloodshadow]

Do not forget that currently Bloodshadow is not at his full power; power increases exponentially with percentage, so there is a HUGE difference between 62.5% and 100%. At full maximum power, a Master has one-twelfth of the power of Zanzarino, which would probably enable him/her to kill an Archangel, though not "on his slightest whim". Bloodshadow just said that to boost his own ego.

According to my definition (which Purity disagrees with), there are 13 gods: Zanz and the 12 Masters. Also according to my definition, "god" does not equal to "omnipotent"; "god" does not equal to "God".

Incidentally, though I do not underestimate the power of the Ancient Ones, the name of that time period is "Heaven's First Golden Age" for very good reasons; not even the Ancient Ones could have stood against Heaven, even though casaulties on both sides would have been horrendous by present standards.

Then Bloodshadow will blame the existence of this Protectorate as the cause of the Ancient Ones' extinction during the Iron Age, in which the Void began its attack.

[Purity_Riot]

Holy Godmodding Batman!

[Bloodshadow]

How the hell am I godmodding? I'm not even doing anything right now! As I've said before, Bloodshadow at 62.5% power should be slightly stronger than Emparael in his True Form of Archangel. As for the 100% power, that's meant to fight the Void, who is stronger than even Zanz; we'll probably need that level of power to take on the False Overgod.

As for the Bloodshadow-Emparael duel, I think it should end with the appearance of Morte. That way, neither of them need to win or lose; they will simply join forces against Morte.

[Helios]

Do not forget that currently Bloodshadow is not at his full power; power increases exponentially with percentage, so there is a HUGE difference between 62.5% and 100%. At full maximum power, a Master has one-twelfth of the power of Zanzarino, which would probably enable him/her to kill an Archangel, though not "on his slightest whim". Bloodshadow just said that to boost his own ego.

According to my definition (which Purity disagrees with), there are 13 gods: Zanz and the 12 Masters. Also according to my definition, "god" does not equal to "omnipotent"; "god" does not equal to "God".

Incidentally, though I do not underestimate the power of the Ancient Ones, the name of that time period is "Heaven's First Golden Age" for very good reasons; not even the Ancient Ones could have stood against Heaven, even though casaulties on both sides would have been horrendous by present standards.

Then Bloodshadow will blame the existence of this Protectorate as the cause of the Ancient Ones' extinction during the Iron Age, in which the Void began its attack.

I was always under the impression that Zanzarino = God.

If Zanzarino = God, then Zanzarino = Absolute Infinite (Concept created by Georg Cantor, father of set theory)

1/12 of the Absolute Infinite remains Absolute Infinite.

Therefore, Bloodshadow = Absolute Infinite = Absolute Godmodding.

On the other hand, if there is no God, and if Zanz and the Masters are just lesser "gods", then what you have stated about defeating a Greater Archangel with ease simply cannot be.

Further, Bloodshadow can blame anyone he wishes to for the Ancient Ones' extinction; the conflict against them led by Emparael was certainly disastrous, but we both know that he was not the sole or the chief cause.

[Bloodshadow]

I tend to think of power levels as numbers. Zanzarino, for example, could be 12000; very powerful, but not infinite. Nothing is infinite, because that beats the purpose of this game.

By that logic, a Master at maximum power would be 1000. An Archangel at maximum power could be 750-800. Solraegiel, the Chief Archangel, could be somewhere around 900 or 950ish. Anything above 999, or above three digits, is considered to be a "god". Power increases exponentially with number, so something at power level 1000 should be able to defeat something at power level 800, though not necessarily with ease. Again, Bloodshadow just said that "snuff you out like a candle" thing to boost his own ego.

What do you think about my proposed solution of the duel? Morte will show up, thinking that Emparael and Bloodshadow have exhausted each other, and he'll try to kill them both.

BTW, I have heard of Georg Cantor and transfinite numbers.

[Helios]

Personally, I am very much opposed to the quantification of power levels; by that system of classification, it all centres and focuses upon whether Character A's power number is greater than Character B's.

By that system, Middle Plane residents, regardless of the strength and virtue of their character, would stand no chance against anyone from Heaven or Hell on the sole basis that the latter was granted and assigned a higher power number, which completely defeats the purpose of RPing and storytelling in general.

For instance, the noblest and greatest hero on the Middle Plane you might evaluate as 400-500 at the maximum, which means that he would be obliterated within minutes by a "god", which is completely unfair and strips bare and conclusively kills any possibility of the finite and the humane, leaving space for nothing but competing detached divinities.

However, to suit your paradigm, I will propose the following to provide a comparative basis:

Regular Form of the Archangel - Slightly greater than 700

True Form of the Archangel - 870

Solraegiel - 990 (He would be the first to say that he is not actually a god, but for most, there is no difference)

Further, if you insist on maintaining these quantified power levels, then I will insist that they not be the sole, or even most important factor in determining the actual strength of the character.

Of course, to reiterate, I would rather that they not be implemented at all to begin with.

I approve of your solution to end the duel between Emparael and Bloodshadow though.

[jamesdyer680]

ugh,just start posting in char please?

[Bloodshadow]

By that system, Middle Plane residents, regardless of the strength and virtue of their character, would stand no chance against anyone from Heaven or Hell on the sole basis that the latter was granted and assigned a higher power number, which completely defeats the purpose of RPing and storytelling in general.

That's how it should be. No regular Middle Plane resident can defeat someone from a Higher Plane. However...

For instance, the noblest and greatest hero on the Middle Plane you might evaluate as 400-500 at the maximum, which means that he would be obliterated within minutes by a "god", which is completely unfair and strips bare and conclusively kills any possibility of the finite and the humane, leaving space for nothing but competing detached divinities.

If someone from the Middle Plane is truly destined to kill someone at "god" level, then this Middle Plane hero's true power level would not be 400-500. He would appear to be that much, but at the moment of truth when he comes face to face to his god-level nemesis, then one way or another the hero's power level would be raised to a level that surpasses his enemy's.

In my world, you can only defeat someone by being stronger than him/her. Power level is the only thing that matters. I understand that "love" or some other factor may enable the hero to defeat an antagonist much stronger than himself, but in fact "love" or some other factor gave the hero more power so that he would be stronger than his opponent.

Further, if you insist on maintaining these quantified power levels, then I will insist that they not be the sole, or even most important factor in determining the actual strength of the character.

As I said above, power level is not as absolute as you think. For example, love, hope, faith, empathy, and other positive emotions can raise one's power to a level that is utterly unreachable through normal means. You have seen the classic line of "I must beat him because everyone is counting on me", right? In that case, "hope" gave the hero enough power to defeat the villain.

[Purity_Riot]

If that's the case, than negative emotions and feelings should lower someone's power level

Greed, envy, egomania, all the things that Bloodshadow seems to embody. So I'd have to say of all the Master's, Bloodshadow would easily be the weakest, followed by Sekhor, with Sirenes probably coming out near the top.

If bad qualities make you weak, and good qualities make you strong, I'd have to say the Masters go, from most to least powerful:

1st. 
2nd. 
3rd. 
4th.  - - 
7th.
8th.
9th.
10th.
11th.
12th.

Derek - PurityxXxRiot - <{(Team WBTY)}> - . says: Sirenes is a pure innocent
 then you've got our entropy buddy
 who's only real fault is naturally the fault of entropy, not his own
 then the others, who have never shown any of those emotions, though likely have them
 the numbers are a little off, because 7th is almost equal to 4th
Sirenes says:
 lol
Derek - PurityxXxRiot - <{(Team WBTY)}> - . says:
 second is almost equal to 1st
 third almost equal to first as well
 7th and 8th are almost equal as well
 but 9th is far below 8th, barely above 10th
 with 11th being far below 10th
 and 12th being a fair bit below it
 and 12th being no where near 1st

[deathdealer2222]

at what power would my lich be? i only voted aye to restart because i don't want to read all of the 1000 some pages for this. but your choice is fair and mine was selfish. when will you fight morte?